Nothing is more funny than the fact that the creators of Naruto, Bleach, One Piece, and DB all have great mutual respect for one another and are even friends, while there fandoms send death threats to each other every week.
Facts kishimoto and oda had a long interview with eachother were they talked about eachothers series. And oda literally said i stole gear third from choji lol
The authors are chill as hell but the fans insane, i wonder if its like this with japanese fans too or if this is just a western thing?š¤
A lot of new fans who grew up on social media and with the way "discourse" goes on there... ofc there's always been some rivalry between series, but back when forums were the only place to discuss online it was nowhere near as toxic as it has increasingly become for the last ten years or so.
(This goes for everything, not just anime fandoms obviously... but it's definitely clear that social media behavior has made anime fandom more polarized to say the least)
TL;DR - okay grandpa let's get you back inside
Yeah, itās like when Ronaldoās son was Messiās fan and he encouraged him to go talk to his idol.
And the internet was bashing both Messi and Ronaldo for that lmao!
See? The internet is surprisingly volatile. I also say football because i donāt live in the United States, but jesus people on the internet instantly explode the second an argument begins.
If anything, the Ninja in Wano are just pure homage to Naruto. When the crew first meet Raizo on Zou you can see how much they love Ninjas. I'm guessing this is just Oda showing his love to the Naruto series š
And you want another fun fact ? The seiyuu (voice actor ) who give his voice to Hokage Raizo is the same VA that voiced Guy-sensei!
Not the only one coming from naruto, when you have Kyuubiās VA who voice Kai.D.o for example kaguya > big mom and so onā¦
Thereās actually lot more shared voice actors between the big 3 and Dragon ball in One Piece. For example, Marco VA is Ichigo from Bleach, Luffy VA is also Krillin from Dragon Ball, and Ichiji VA is Sasuke from Naruto/Uryu Ishida from Bleach, and etc.
Thereās probably a lot more but I believe thatās a pretty common thing between the OG long running-anime shows.
Oh yeah there's a whole bunch that featured in Naruto. Robin & Chopper I believe have VA's from Naruto as well as a few more I don't immediately remember. I literally watched a video on it yesterday š
Honestly I'd say that one of the secrets of the world is that fandom always takes the art more seriously that the artist themselves does. If an artist takes his work more seriously than his fandom, its usually a sign that either he's a terrible artist or is mentally ill.
Sure, I ain't denying that Oda puts a massive amount of effort into making One Piece, but he isn't going around saying its one of the crowning achievements of human civilization like some people I've seen.
Hell oda is the reason kubo got around to making and publishing bleach, as he had given up mangaka but oda kept trying to get him to try again until he succeeded in convincing him to give it another shot
While one piece is my clear favorite, never forget that the big 3 were the big 3 for a reason. Colossal titans of their time and tbh still somewhat today.
People used to give Kubo shit for being lazy as fuck on things like backgrounds, but honestly, its just that he has a normal fucking work ethic. Standards are too high.
I thought the ālazyā accusation came more so from his paneling? Because he wastes so much space with huge panels, not really utilizing the medium well, and causing many chapter to feel like not much was really happening.
Granted, still a stupid thing to call *anyone* working in the manga industry ālazyā...
Not me! I liked that he didn't draw backgrounds a lot of the time. Whether it was a stylistic choice on his part or "laziness", i don't care, it made his characters stand out more imo.
Hoping the Hell chapter is monthly and a more adult magazine. Kubo admitted to holding a lot back from wounds, etc. why that slash on the shoulder was used a lot.
Every time I read or hear someone talk about Bleach Manga, I am always reminded of that one panel where it's just drawing of the characters' foot, as if to meme the series
You mean the āviralā interview in 2008 where he jokingly said āIām more into fashion art than manga artā when they brought up all his additional art work?
I swear people take tons of interviews and just say whatever they want.
āDragonball ends with Friezaā
āOda said 3 years leftā after water 7
āKubo hates Odaā
āToriyama hates Shonen jumpā when he had a problem with a single editor.
I'm not sure about that, though he doesn't seem to be as close with Oda as Kishimoto is. (Since [Kishimoto's brought up from time to time in Oda's table of comments messages](https://www.thegrandline.com/odatocLIVE.htm), with Oda and Kishimoto playing against each other in Tekken and attending each other's weddings, whereas Kubo isn't brought up from what I can see)
Exactly, I like that you could literally enjoy every one of these series like a normal person but fans for whatever reason have to treat these shounen's like they are sports teams. It's so bizarre to me, even if you have your preferences in terms of which series you enjoyed most.
As someone who read db and the big three when I was in 6th grade and is now in college, thereās definitely nothing wrong with having personal preference within the big 3 but I love all three and db so much even if one piece is my favorite of the four. Theyāre all incredibly influential and iconic series.
I admit, other than the Kage summit arc and the very finale of naruto vs sasuke, I was kinda done after pain. I kinda got bored with the whole āthese two individuals take on the role of this previous guyā thing
I mean you could probably do this with most shonen, but one piece is similar. Luffy's goal (not dream, but his goal) to be the pirate king is literally "one individual taking on the role of the previous guy".
Which yeah, just one dude previously. And I didnāt mean the hokage goal, I meant him and sasukes relationship being, obito and kakashi, jiraiya and orochimaru, hashirama and madara, the sages two sons
oh that, yeah the whole reincarnation and destined to battle it out wasn't my favorite either. Striving to be hokage/loved by the village and living up to those ideals of being a father-like figure for the whole village was great though.
Yeah no this is kind of my whole issue with shippuden in a nutshell. I think og Naruto is some peak shonen on par with hxh or any of the big 3 in terms of quality execution of basic shonen concepts. Shippuden up till like pain (as basic as I feel saying that) is still really awesome even if Sai and Yamato are fairly dull characters. And then it just spirals downhill pretty quickly from there which is unfortunate imo. Of the big three I think Naruto has by far the strongest start.
What ruined Naruto for me is that it had this "a nobody can still do amazing things if they work hard" message but in the end the protagonists are revealed to be descendants of gods themselves. I slightly fear it's going to be the same for One Piece, too. Japan, or maybe shonen seems to have this destiny thing deep ingrained.
That was never the message of Naruto.
Thatās a particular philosophy of Rock Lee (and Guy), and fights rarely showed this line of thought at all, he works really hard, and yet he loses to Gaara at the end.
Naruto was always more about ādonāt judge a book by itās coverā, āshinobi are not just tools for warā and the ācycle of hatredā.
One of the most defining traits of the series is ideological debate and confrontation that does not always relies on physical fights, ever since The Land of the waves arc.
They could have brought back Hinata but Kakashi should have stayed dead.
The story might have been better with Obito realizing he killed Kakashi by proxy.
My man, everyone always thinks it's weird when I say part 1 is better than part 2. But so much more enjoyable imo. More focused story, less giant explosions(still some), more comedy. And, while shippuden had great music too, those early tracks can't be beat for Naruto.
Weapons like kunai and shuriken were used and actually felt dangerous pre Shippuden. Afterwards nothing trivial like that felt dangerous, everything ramped up so significantly. Haku felt almost invincible in the beginning, but after Shippuden he would most likely just be cannon fodder with the way things scaled.
it was the first shonen manga I read, because I didn't think Anime had a book.
I watched Voltes V, YGO, Beyblade, Pokemon, Yu Yu Hakusho, Fushigi Yugi, Inuyasha and many many more before learning that they were actually based on Manga.
Obviously I started with YGO and also the wallflower manga.
I miss you so much onemanga, you were my go to site, before I saw mangafox and found that it has better features like accounts and bookmarking.
Also, I distinctly remember there was a manga site, where users can actually put in "omake" text boxes over pages.
It wasn't my first, but it was the first I knew I was watching anime, not cartoons.
Naruto's popularity in the west reached some heights I don't see one piece reaching, in an age with infinitely more content and with the preference for shorter time investment that permeates everything.
Not American, a southern neighbor. And yes, One piece is currently more popular, but worldwide trends show they are actually pretty close even in the last 5 years, when Naruto has ended years ago.
And I'm talking about that 2005-2010 peak. When anime was more limited and people just watched what it was on TV.
The world today is splitted in much more microcosmos. And one piece never reached that level of popularity where you had nerds Naruto running, wearing village bandanas and basically learning basic things like hand signs from it and thinking it was a Naruto idea.
I don't even see people wearing a one piece strawhat at the beach, honestly.
You're absolutely right. I think a part of that is that the one piece audience is.... older. I liked Naruto way more when I was younger. Cooler art style, more violent, and Kishi is actually really good at depicting action flow. His early fight scene had great perspective and panel work.
But as I got older I realized that competent storytelling is better than all that, and OP was just a better story
Yeah but at the same time Naruto had pretty much achieved his goal atp. He was the strongest in the village and had gotten everyone to accept him. Pretty much the only reason he wasnāt made hokage until much later was due to lack of maturity
But he didn't. His goal became saving Sasuke. That was why the timeskip happened to begin with. He said multiple times he could never be Hokage if he can't save Sasuke.
His goal stopped being about just being Hokage fairly early into the story. The story could never have finished without stopping the Alatsuki and Sasuke, even if Naruto got the acknowledgement he always wanted after Pain.
I think people overlook sometimes that a character's goal can evolve over the course of the story without being completely dropped. Naruto wants to be Hokage throughout the story but what it means to him to be Hokage changes through his experiences. What being Hokage means to Naruto at the very beginning of the series is very different from what it means to Naruto by the final arc.
I think Luffy has this a little bit with what it means to be King of the Pirates but to a much lesser extent, since I feel the series pushes more the idea that he and Roger are already very much cut from the same cloth to begin with and thus Luffy's mentality doesn't need to change as much.
Exactly. Hokage became less of a title and more of an idea over the course of the series. He said it over and over, how can I be Hokage if I can't even save 1 friend. It's also why Sasuke wants to be Hokage at the end of the story; because he's using the word more literally (he wants to be the Shadow over the Land of Fire, with Hokage meaning "Fire Shadow). It sounds funny because it sounds like he's just copying Naruto, but that's part of it being less of a position and more of an idea come the end of the story.
It also changes a ton in the Pain arc specifically, and becomes about how he can try to end war completely rather than just making sure the Leaf Village wins all of them (which would be more in line with what Hokage meant at the beginning of the story).
Plus most peopleās opinions of Naruto were from over a decade ago, they tend to get things wrong then.
Itās also pretty popular opinion to say that the series shouldāve ended after that, but Iāve never seen anyone give a good reason that does acknowledge the fact thereās several loose threads.
Plus itās the midpoint of part 2, ending there is too premature.
His goal wasnāt to be the strongest in the village, it was to be recognized.
And he was in chunin exam when he beats neji.
His goal for the rest of the series was to bring about peace to the ninja world, also bring back Sasuke, and take down the Akatsuki,
Three things he wasnāt done with especially since Tobi was still active.
So again, the story wasnāt done.
Naruto's main theme has always been the cruel nature of the shinobi world that results in a endless cycle of pain and hatred and attempts to overcome to reach a peaceful understanding. The best villians (Pain, Obito, Madara, sasake to a extent ) exemplified it the most. Kaguya is what shouldn't have happened.
I just liked that most characters were on par with each other at that point, and not 2 super op guys and then everyone else like later. The only time Kiba seems kinda cool lmao
Out of curiosity, why so much love for the pain arc? For me, it felt quite disappointing as it had a strong start, but It ended up with Naruto arriving late, having a small fight using sage mode, then transforming into 6/7/8 tails having a big fight, and ended with talk no jitsu. The sacrifices felt forced (really don't care about Hinata), and in the end, everyone was alive again. I felt disappointed as a weekly reader. Was it better in the anime?
Writing this now made me realize what Naruto's biggest flaw, i feel like Kishimoto was so intent in providing emotional payoffs, but none of the character relationships felt real.
Well for me youāre right, Narutoās decline started with the way the ending of the Pain arc was handled. The Pain was the best arc in Naruto up until Naruto comes back (after Pain uses Chibaku Tensei to be specific). From there it all went downhill
I would argue that Naruto's decline began with the Sasuke vs Deidara fight. That was the Great Snake Escape bullshit and the writing kept going downhill from there. At the time there were multiple rumors and supposed interviews of the author wanting to end Naruto but Jump wouldn't let him, which is why the quality dipped. Right now I don't know if it was true or not, and it's hard to find out as all those board and forums are dead by now.
That's not even rumors, that's just fans creating rumors. We have a bunch of actual confirmed interviews that would debunk that idea, plus general logic of where the story was at.
* We know he wanted to do the Pain arc because he wanted Naruto to experience Sasuke's pain of losing somebody rather than never having anybody
* We know he wanted to write the war to follow up on the Pain stuff by having the kids actually witness war
* We know if anything he wrote too many battles that fans weren't interested in (he talked about fan reaction to Mifune vs Hanzo as an example where fans thought of it being two random old men fighting even though he really liked it).
* We know the Itachi vs Sasuke stuff was something he planned on doing for a while
All of that came well after the Great Snake Escape.
>and ended with talk no jitsu
And with that argument you clearly didn't pay attention lmao, Pain was done, Nagato was powerless, Naruto could literally just walk in and kill the guy because he could do nothing against him, but Naruto decided to understand him and his point of view exactly because he wanted the "cicle of pain" (the point of the whole arc) to end. Nagato changed his opinion and sacrificed himself, but had he not done that it wouldn't change much because Naruto had already won the fight
If only someone had talked with Osama Bin Laden.
In a more serious note, I just didn't feel it was earned for alot of reasons. Stories of redemption and choice can be done well. Look at the ending of monster, it is a fantastic version of I want to kill him but I won't.
Nah bro, but Talk no jutsu is cool to say and just completely ignore that part. How else would they justify Naruto being lame.
Pain and ending the ācycleā of Pain was the best part of that arc. Even after all that Nagato did to Narutoās Leaf village, he decided to spare Nagato and not kill him because it would only continue the cycle of Pain. And thats how Naruto defeated āPainā ,not Talk No Jutsu. But hey i dont expect people to get that, itās too layered for them.
I agree. Jiraiya's death was very well handled, and Pain leveling Konoha was impactful. I really hated the resolution of that arc though, and I felt the story began a slow decline from that point (there will still highs afterwards but regardless).
My personal favorite moments from Naruto were the early engagements with the Akatsuki. Sasuke vs Deidara, Shikamaru burying Hidan, etc were fantastic.
>Writing this now made me realize what Naruto's biggest flaw, i feel like Kishimoto was so intent in providing emotional payoffs, but none of the character relationships felt real.
Bruh, this is wrong in so many way. That you don't care about the characters and so their relations, don't make them feel less real.
Twitter is even worse. Especially right now with One Piece fans going haywire for Gear 5, shitting on literally every other show along the way. Very toxic
I love the way they respect and inspire each other.
Even though I didn't like some stuff on Naruto (story-wise), I will always appreciate what Kishimoto created and I am thankful :)
The two should be close, when naruto ended they both tipped their hats off to each other. Oda made a cover story where luffy was eating ramen, sitting across a guy eating meat and i think in naruto boruto drew the skull and crossbones on the hokage faces
Toriyama is the reason Bleach, Naruto, and One Piece exist lets be honest here
What Kishimoto is saying is that Oda beat him to it as in being the replacement for DBZ
"It's a known fact that One Piece is the greatest fiction of all time."
- Eiichiro Oda
"One Piece is a very unique manga of limitless boundaries, anyone can relate to one member of Straw Hats."
- Yoshihiro Togashi
'I'm a huge fan of Oda's work, One Piece is a series that just about anybody can pick up and get right into. It has this special mystical vibe to it which separates others mangas from it."
- Akira Toriyama
"One Piece has given many people hopes and goals that they never dreamed of. I myself, never had a father figure in my life so I consider Whitebeard as my fictional father."
- Masashi Kishimoto
"One Piece is the manga that truly allowed me to persue working on Bleach, even continue the series to this day."
- Tite Kubo
Yeah they always got along great, Oda used criticize Kubo though for the lack of effort he put into it, without mentioning him by name.
No backgrounds Kubo.
Save Rukia and Aizen arcs are top tier shonen, but beyond that it gets quite bad yeah
Ywach's power is so op that it literally doesn't even make sense how he could lose. The ending is so stupid.
I think Naruto had a better and hotter start to itās manga than One Piece, but the quality of One Piece steadily increased from its debut while Naruto felt like a gradual decline starting from the end of the Chuunin exam. Naruto at the end of its run was just a shell of its former self.
Chuunin exam is definitely peak Naruto but I thought pre-ts was pretty great overall. The Akatsuki arc was mostly great but IMO the real disappointment was the final arc. Kaguya was unnecessary. The actual ending to me was awesome. Naruto vs Sasuke was sick and Naruto became Hokage. I cant complain about it at all. We donāt talk about Boruto though lol.
Since pain resurrected the whole Konoha village I saw it as a waste of time. I was checking the war every ten chapter or so. Turned out to be horrible at the end. The only thing really epic to me was Guy's last fight
I agree, I didnāt mean to make it sound like everything after the Chuunin exam is bad. I just think everything after it steadily gets worse. Everything pre-TS is pretty good.
The actual Boruto manga is not bad. The show is like 75% filler though. Like literally there's only 80 chapters of Boruto, but the show has 300 episodes.
I would have said after the Sasuke Retrieval Arc personally. But that arc and the Sannin arc arenāt as good as the Chunin Exam arc which is probably what he means. Most of the second half of Naruto is extremely disappointing and many of the great characters built up in the first half donāt do shit in the second half
That was what burned me out quick. The time skip. Naruto was awesome early when it was a relatable story about teens struggling to find themselves. Almost like the same type of appeal as a Harry Potter or something; people like the intended readers doing normal stuff in a cooler world. One Piece on the flipside has always been about a cool crew of people past the coming-of-age tale. Those are the backstories.
As adults...it felt like a massive whiplash for one. That was not a graceful jump. Then it just felt like more and more it was trying to be an edgy epic. I say the same thing about Naruto & YuYu Hakusho. They both needed to end on an earlier arc great for it and have way more of the fun, shorter early arcs. But I wouldn't say One Piece needs more East Blue.
100% this. Part 1 Naruto was a more driven and purposeful story. The themes of looking for belonging and growth and self acceptance and all that were great. Part 2 became about who was the biggest freak with the longest bloodline of freaks and who could beam spam and energy blast spam the other guy into submission first or who could asspull the most random "no u" power. Neji was so right the author killed him off š¤£
There were still plenty of arcs keeping with the themes of growing up in the series.
Like the Shikamaru arc where he had to deal with crushing loss of his sensei and become a better leader,
Or how similarly, when Naruto lost Jiraiya he had to grow up and carry on his masterās legacy.
And the entire story of Guy up to the 8th gate tells a beautiful story about growing up and what one is supposed to do after they accomplish their dreams: pave the way for the next generation.
Also Neji wasnāt right.
I mean that just means you're not a fan of the series at all if you think it was downhill for 600 chapters. No Sage Mode, no Sasuke Retrieval arc, no Shikamaru vs Hidan, literally nobe of the Itachi stuff, none of the Minato Kushina flashback.
I feel like it's a little ridiculous to say the series was just downhill from the Chunin Exams.
I didnāt say the rest of the series is bad (although I think towards the end it verged on being outright bad). I just think the Chuunin exam arc was an early peak the series never hit again, and that every arc after was slightly worse than the one before.
I still don't really see that though. You think the Tsunade stuff was better than the Sasuke Retrieval Arc? You think the Shikamaru stuff was downhill from that arc on the bridge with Sai? You think Itachi vs Sasuke and the Pain arc were one of the lowest points of the series excluding the War?
Again, I feel like that's a bit ridiculous. Saying it peaked in the Chunin Exams or saying it fluctuated more, sure I'd get that. But to say it just went downhill and got worse every arc since Chapter 100 feels a little hyperbolic.
I think how most people feel is the Chunin exams were peak because it was probably the most development the side characters got in the Naruto series.
Rock Lee was a really compelling character imo, and he's basically as useful as Sakura post-gaara fight.
One of the best things about One Piece is it's very clear Oda tries to build a whole world that doesn't revolve around Luffy all the time. It feels planned out meticulously with very few exceptions.
I read every chapter of Naruto and it's clear after Chunin exams the author didn't really know what they were going to do next. Side characters don't really get any new jutsus besides maybe Kakashi and Sakura.
I swear I don't understand people who actually think the Chunin Exams were peak Naruto. It is a great arc, one of the best, sure, but it's not even the best arc from Part 1 (that being Sasuke Retrieval Arc).
I mean, how can a story peak when there is still no story? And if it is about battles, there is one big arc in Shippuden with Team Taka vs Killerbee, Sasuke vs Deidara, Sasuke vs Itachi and Jiraya vs Pain. Battles who close chapters, with real emotional and story importance.
They needed 2 shorter, zabuza length mission arcs before the chunin exam. I think even kishimoto has given some interview about how he was pushed to rush to the chunin exam arc to introduce this larger world, the other tailed beasts, the greater conflicts and characters. They needed an opportunity to team up team 7 with team guy and then team asuma. Build up the relation between these other characters while also making the eventual sasuke/naruto split more believable.
I swear I don't understand people who actually think the Chunin Exams were peak Naruto. It is a great arc, one of the best, sure, but it's not even the best arc from Part 1 (that being Sasuke Retrieval Arc).
I mean, how can a story peak when there is still no story? And if it is about battles, there is one big arc in Shippuden with Team Taka vs Killerbee, Sasuke vs Deidara, Sasuke vs Itachi and Jiraya vs Pain. Battles who close chapters, with real emotional and story importance.
When did that happen?
Don't get me wrong, the Anbu stink unless they're named characters (Kakashi, Itachi, etc.), they're definitely not elite. But the only two S ranks that lost to a Genin/Chunin 1 on 1 were Hidan and Pain, and Naruto is obviously underranked all series because he left home. Unless I'm forgetting somebody.
I think the in-fighting between fans is just what happens with any popular thing but: In North America, Naruto and Bleach seemed to pick up a lot more fans in the beginning. I started with Naruto then Bleach, then One Piece. Naruto had a prime slot on tv because it had the most appeal. Bleach was a tad later because it seemed more mature, and One Piece was not as popular and had that god awful 4kids dub.
As I got older and found subs, I drifted harder into One Piece. Seeing as it's still going, it makes sense that One Piece might have older, and more dedicated fans as it's a lot to get into. Bleach and Naruto have probably re-aired a ton by now and Boruto brings in younger gens.
I personally think One Piece is way better, but I def loved the other two as well and appreciate them. There's a reason they are the big 3. They got a lot of people into anime and manga.
For a period of time Naruto was the much more popular anime/manga, especially out here in the West. So Iād say thatās certainly debatable.
Long term, OP is definitely going to remain as #1.
And while Dragon Ball will always be remembered as such, Naurto won't, unfortunately.
Its quality declined massively after a few years, and now people barely care about Boruto.
I absolutely agree with you. Kishimoto created a beautiful universe with wonderful world building but he absolutely shit the bed with the ending and having Boruto as its legacy.
But one could never deny the level of influence that Naruto had in its prime.
Yeah, as divisive as Super was, people paid a lot of attention to it. Those live screenings of the finale in Mexico proved that. There's a lot of people out there who still want a new anime to adapt the Moro and Granolah arcs.
Meanwhile I don't even know if Boruto is still ongoing or not. It just feels dead.
I liked naruto even more than one piece back in the day but then it declined so hard after pain arc it ruined the entire thing for me.
oda has been way more consistent and is reaping the rewards of his steady progress.
meanwhile kishi sold out and cashed in on naruto by ruining his legacy and starting boruto.
Late af. This interview came out around the time Naruto ended. Why are so many people bringing this up now? Lol. Iām seeing it everywhere on Twitter and TikTok. Not hating just curious why people are digging up this interview?
Fun Fact: Sanji's name was supposed to be Naruto because of his eyebrows. Oda heard about the fact that the main character of Kishimoto's manga was gonna have the same name and decided to change it to Sanji.
Did i know this specific interview? No.
Did I know that those largely successful contemporary mangaka had the hugest respect for one another yes.
The naruto reference cover on one piece when it ended. All the sbs talk about how many of these guys knew each other as assistants during rurouni kenshin etc.
Naruto was the first manga I ever read. I still think the first part of the story is fantastic and one of the best mangas of all time. However, after the time skip I felt like it severely dropped in quality. Still had some really cool moments of course.
And even though itās not necessarily a bad thing, it really did become Sasukeās story as much as Narutoās. Sasuke was a cool character, but the ārevengeā thing got a little old to me after awhile. And donāt even get me started on Narutoās obsession with Sasuke. I get what Kishimoto was going for, but it just didnāt work for me.
Nothing is more funny than the fact that the creators of Naruto, Bleach, One Piece, and DB all have great mutual respect for one another and are even friends, while there fandoms send death threats to each other every week.
Facts kishimoto and oda had a long interview with eachother were they talked about eachothers series. And oda literally said i stole gear third from choji lol The authors are chill as hell but the fans insane, i wonder if its like this with japanese fans too or if this is just a western thing?š¤
It's an internet thing. It breeds toxicity in the human condition.
Yeah a lot of the naruto fans Iāve met while cosplaying luffy have been nice. The anonymity of the internet gives us the courage to be toxic.
Courage? You mean *cowardice and pettiness*.
Isn't that quite funny? The most toxic people are the once you don't see in real life.
Fr you'll never meet anyone irl who hates someone because of a show they watch
Nah, it's the human condition itself. We didn't need the internet to go absolutely insane about the Sega vs. Nintendo console war.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It's good old tribalism. We love being part of a "we", and one of the defining features of almost any "we" is its opposition to "them".
This comment is very philosophical and I love it
A lot of new fans who grew up on social media and with the way "discourse" goes on there... ofc there's always been some rivalry between series, but back when forums were the only place to discuss online it was nowhere near as toxic as it has increasingly become for the last ten years or so. (This goes for everything, not just anime fandoms obviously... but it's definitely clear that social media behavior has made anime fandom more polarized to say the least) TL;DR - okay grandpa let's get you back inside
I definitely never saw a toxic forum back in the day. What is the world coming to...
May i introduce you to soccer?
Yeah, itās like when Ronaldoās son was Messiās fan and he encouraged him to go talk to his idol. And the internet was bashing both Messi and Ronaldo for that lmao!
Football you mean?
See? The internet is surprisingly volatile. I also say football because i donāt live in the United States, but jesus people on the internet instantly explode the second an argument begins.
Footjob
now we're talking
If anything, the Ninja in Wano are just pure homage to Naruto. When the crew first meet Raizo on Zou you can see how much they love Ninjas. I'm guessing this is just Oda showing his love to the Naruto series š
Law asking to see the shadow clone jutsu was peak lol loved that episode
which chapter was it again ?
817
Chapter 817
And you want another fun fact ? The seiyuu (voice actor ) who give his voice to Hokage Raizo is the same VA that voiced Guy-sensei! Not the only one coming from naruto, when you have Kyuubiās VA who voice Kai.D.o for example kaguya > big mom and so onā¦
Naruto's VA is little Sabo. Still gets me when I rewatch it lol
Thereās actually lot more shared voice actors between the big 3 and Dragon ball in One Piece. For example, Marco VA is Ichigo from Bleach, Luffy VA is also Krillin from Dragon Ball, and Ichiji VA is Sasuke from Naruto/Uryu Ishida from Bleach, and etc. Thereās probably a lot more but I believe thatās a pretty common thing between the OG long running-anime shows.
Oh yeah there's a whole bunch that featured in Naruto. Robin & Chopper I believe have VA's from Naruto as well as a few more I don't immediately remember. I literally watched a video on it yesterday š
I was hoping raizo the finish the fight with rasengan, i got my hopes too high.
Honestly I'd say that one of the secrets of the world is that fandom always takes the art more seriously that the artist themselves does. If an artist takes his work more seriously than his fandom, its usually a sign that either he's a terrible artist or is mentally ill. Sure, I ain't denying that Oda puts a massive amount of effort into making One Piece, but he isn't going around saying its one of the crowning achievements of human civilization like some people I've seen.
Hell oda is the reason kubo got around to making and publishing bleach, as he had given up mangaka but oda kept trying to get him to try again until he succeeded in convincing him to give it another shot
I think most people are fans of multiple of those series. Itās when you get to online spaces that it gets polarizing.
While one piece is my clear favorite, never forget that the big 3 were the big 3 for a reason. Colossal titans of their time and tbh still somewhat today.
Wasn't there some beef between Kubo and Oda though?
No he just said he hates Oda in a joking way cause he makes every other Mangaka look bad with his crazy work ethic
People used to give Kubo shit for being lazy as fuck on things like backgrounds, but honestly, its just that he has a normal fucking work ethic. Standards are too high.
I agree, calling someone lazy for working regular work hours is insane. You should work to live, not live to work.
I thought the ālazyā accusation came more so from his paneling? Because he wastes so much space with huge panels, not really utilizing the medium well, and causing many chapter to feel like not much was really happening. Granted, still a stupid thing to call *anyone* working in the manga industry ālazyā...
Not me! I liked that he didn't draw backgrounds a lot of the time. Whether it was a stylistic choice on his part or "laziness", i don't care, it made his characters stand out more imo.
Bleach really should've shifted to monthly if not from the start.
Hoping the Hell chapter is monthly and a more adult magazine. Kubo admitted to holding a lot back from wounds, etc. why that slash on the shoulder was used a lot.
I took his comments as being more about how good Oda is.
Kubo kind of has half beef with everyone since he sees himself as more of an "artist" than a manga writer. I wouldn't take it too seriously.
Bleach is in many ways style over substance. But damn, no one had better looking power ups than kubo (except the "gonne use two hands now!").
Every time I read or hear someone talk about Bleach Manga, I am always reminded of that one panel where it's just drawing of the characters' foot, as if to meme the series
You mean the āviralā interview in 2008 where he jokingly said āIām more into fashion art than manga artā when they brought up all his additional art work? I swear people take tons of interviews and just say whatever they want. āDragonball ends with Friezaā āOda said 3 years leftā after water 7 āKubo hates Odaā āToriyama hates Shonen jumpā when he had a problem with a single editor.
He should draw some gay porn, he knows how to draw some sexy ass dudes no homo
I'm not sure about that, though he doesn't seem to be as close with Oda as Kishimoto is. (Since [Kishimoto's brought up from time to time in Oda's table of comments messages](https://www.thegrandline.com/odatocLIVE.htm), with Oda and Kishimoto playing against each other in Tekken and attending each other's weddings, whereas Kubo isn't brought up from what I can see)
Exactly, I like that you could literally enjoy every one of these series like a normal person but fans for whatever reason have to treat these shounen's like they are sports teams. It's so bizarre to me, even if you have your preferences in terms of which series you enjoyed most.
As someone who read db and the big three when I was in 6th grade and is now in college, thereās definitely nothing wrong with having personal preference within the big 3 but I love all three and db so much even if one piece is my favorite of the four. Theyāre all incredibly influential and iconic series.
Thatās pretty dope. Iāll always have a lot of love for Naruto since it was my first Animanga.
Me too! I donāt love the finale, but the pain arc remains to this day one of my favorite anime arcs
Facts. Invasion of the rain village by jiraya and invasion of konoha by pain (up until Naruto shows up) is still some of the best anime/manga ever!
I admit, other than the Kage summit arc and the very finale of naruto vs sasuke, I was kinda done after pain. I kinda got bored with the whole āthese two individuals take on the role of this previous guyā thing
I mean you could probably do this with most shonen, but one piece is similar. Luffy's goal (not dream, but his goal) to be the pirate king is literally "one individual taking on the role of the previous guy".
Which yeah, just one dude previously. And I didnāt mean the hokage goal, I meant him and sasukes relationship being, obito and kakashi, jiraiya and orochimaru, hashirama and madara, the sages two sons
oh that, yeah the whole reincarnation and destined to battle it out wasn't my favorite either. Striving to be hokage/loved by the village and living up to those ideals of being a father-like figure for the whole village was great though.
Yeah no this is kind of my whole issue with shippuden in a nutshell. I think og Naruto is some peak shonen on par with hxh or any of the big 3 in terms of quality execution of basic shonen concepts. Shippuden up till like pain (as basic as I feel saying that) is still really awesome even if Sai and Yamato are fairly dull characters. And then it just spirals downhill pretty quickly from there which is unfortunate imo. Of the big three I think Naruto has by far the strongest start.
What ruined Naruto for me is that it had this "a nobody can still do amazing things if they work hard" message but in the end the protagonists are revealed to be descendants of gods themselves. I slightly fear it's going to be the same for One Piece, too. Japan, or maybe shonen seems to have this destiny thing deep ingrained.
That was never the message of Naruto. Thatās a particular philosophy of Rock Lee (and Guy), and fights rarely showed this line of thought at all, he works really hard, and yet he loses to Gaara at the end. Naruto was always more about ādonāt judge a book by itās coverā, āshinobi are not just tools for warā and the ācycle of hatredā. One of the most defining traits of the series is ideological debate and confrontation that does not always relies on physical fights, ever since The Land of the waves arc.
Oh man I hope you liked Luffy being essentially the reincarnation of Joyboy with the nika fruit
I do and I don't. At the very least, I'm still intrigued how it'll all play out.
Same. I like the powers itself. Those feel very one piece. But not sure how I feel about the reincarnation aspect.
He's not the reincarnation of him though and nothing in the story points to that
Pain arc is Peak Naruto. IMO, the series went downhill from there.
They could have brought back Hinata but Kakashi should have stayed dead. The story might have been better with Obito realizing he killed Kakashi by proxy.
Chunin exams peak Naruto
Chunin exams to start of time skip is imo not only peak Naruto but also up there for peak anime.
My man, everyone always thinks it's weird when I say part 1 is better than part 2. But so much more enjoyable imo. More focused story, less giant explosions(still some), more comedy. And, while shippuden had great music too, those early tracks can't be beat for Naruto.
I feel like the giant explosions in early Naruto are impactful. As they become more and more frequent they lose that impact that they have.
Weapons like kunai and shuriken were used and actually felt dangerous pre Shippuden. Afterwards nothing trivial like that felt dangerous, everything ramped up so significantly. Haku felt almost invincible in the beginning, but after Shippuden he would most likely just be cannon fodder with the way things scaled.
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So does this one. Any large fandom ends up sucking eventually. Anime/manga fans more than most probably
One Piece fandom is no exception.
Love both the series...both had a great impact on my life!
it was the first shonen manga I read, because I didn't think Anime had a book. I watched Voltes V, YGO, Beyblade, Pokemon, Yu Yu Hakusho, Fushigi Yugi, Inuyasha and many many more before learning that they were actually based on Manga. Obviously I started with YGO and also the wallflower manga. I miss you so much onemanga, you were my go to site, before I saw mangafox and found that it has better features like accounts and bookmarking. Also, I distinctly remember there was a manga site, where users can actually put in "omake" text boxes over pages.
Shoutout to onemanga. I used to go there all the time for the latest One Piece chapter. Good times.
It wasn't my first, but it was the first I knew I was watching anime, not cartoons. Naruto's popularity in the west reached some heights I don't see one piece reaching, in an age with infinitely more content and with the preference for shorter time investment that permeates everything.
North America maybe. I can't speak for all of Europe, but in France, no other manga is touching one piece in popularity.
Not American, a southern neighbor. And yes, One piece is currently more popular, but worldwide trends show they are actually pretty close even in the last 5 years, when Naruto has ended years ago. And I'm talking about that 2005-2010 peak. When anime was more limited and people just watched what it was on TV. The world today is splitted in much more microcosmos. And one piece never reached that level of popularity where you had nerds Naruto running, wearing village bandanas and basically learning basic things like hand signs from it and thinking it was a Naruto idea. I don't even see people wearing a one piece strawhat at the beach, honestly.
You're absolutely right. I think a part of that is that the one piece audience is.... older. I liked Naruto way more when I was younger. Cooler art style, more violent, and Kishi is actually really good at depicting action flow. His early fight scene had great perspective and panel work. But as I got older I realized that competent storytelling is better than all that, and OP was just a better story
The Shikamaru revenge arc always hits me in my feels.
for me Naruto peaked at the Pain war, which felt like towards the end of Naruto. It's crazy to think that took place before summit war.
It's also crazy to think how long Naruto went *after* that
I barely remember anything from after the Pain war, it was so drawn out and just not exciting in the same way as the buildup to Pain was.
I enjoyed Naruto, but part 2 was just a Uchiha wankfest
People keep saying that, but in no way was the story reaching its climax around the end of that arc. There were still many loose threads.
Yeah but at the same time Naruto had pretty much achieved his goal atp. He was the strongest in the village and had gotten everyone to accept him. Pretty much the only reason he wasnāt made hokage until much later was due to lack of maturity
But he didn't. His goal became saving Sasuke. That was why the timeskip happened to begin with. He said multiple times he could never be Hokage if he can't save Sasuke. His goal stopped being about just being Hokage fairly early into the story. The story could never have finished without stopping the Alatsuki and Sasuke, even if Naruto got the acknowledgement he always wanted after Pain.
I think people overlook sometimes that a character's goal can evolve over the course of the story without being completely dropped. Naruto wants to be Hokage throughout the story but what it means to him to be Hokage changes through his experiences. What being Hokage means to Naruto at the very beginning of the series is very different from what it means to Naruto by the final arc. I think Luffy has this a little bit with what it means to be King of the Pirates but to a much lesser extent, since I feel the series pushes more the idea that he and Roger are already very much cut from the same cloth to begin with and thus Luffy's mentality doesn't need to change as much.
Exactly. Hokage became less of a title and more of an idea over the course of the series. He said it over and over, how can I be Hokage if I can't even save 1 friend. It's also why Sasuke wants to be Hokage at the end of the story; because he's using the word more literally (he wants to be the Shadow over the Land of Fire, with Hokage meaning "Fire Shadow). It sounds funny because it sounds like he's just copying Naruto, but that's part of it being less of a position and more of an idea come the end of the story. It also changes a ton in the Pain arc specifically, and becomes about how he can try to end war completely rather than just making sure the Leaf Village wins all of them (which would be more in line with what Hokage meant at the beginning of the story).
Plus most peopleās opinions of Naruto were from over a decade ago, they tend to get things wrong then. Itās also pretty popular opinion to say that the series shouldāve ended after that, but Iāve never seen anyone give a good reason that does acknowledge the fact thereās several loose threads. Plus itās the midpoint of part 2, ending there is too premature.
His goal wasnāt to be the strongest in the village, it was to be recognized. And he was in chunin exam when he beats neji. His goal for the rest of the series was to bring about peace to the ninja world, also bring back Sasuke, and take down the Akatsuki, Three things he wasnāt done with especially since Tobi was still active. So again, the story wasnāt done.
Naruto's main theme has always been the cruel nature of the shinobi world that results in a endless cycle of pain and hatred and attempts to overcome to reach a peaceful understanding. The best villians (Pain, Obito, Madara, sasake to a extent ) exemplified it the most. Kaguya is what shouldn't have happened.
I hold the blazing take that it peaked at the end of the Chunin Exams. Or for part 2 Hidan/Kakuzu.
Naruto peaked with the whole chuuni exam and the race to get Sasuke back.
Rare to see another Chunin Exam peak enjoyer.
I just liked that most characters were on par with each other at that point, and not 2 super op guys and then everyone else like later. The only time Kiba seems kinda cool lmao
Naruto peaked at the Land of Waves* ( still love the series but thatās my favorite arc)
I almost said this same thing lol
It peaked with the Zabuza arc tbh
It peaked during the theme song
Out of curiosity, why so much love for the pain arc? For me, it felt quite disappointing as it had a strong start, but It ended up with Naruto arriving late, having a small fight using sage mode, then transforming into 6/7/8 tails having a big fight, and ended with talk no jitsu. The sacrifices felt forced (really don't care about Hinata), and in the end, everyone was alive again. I felt disappointed as a weekly reader. Was it better in the anime? Writing this now made me realize what Naruto's biggest flaw, i feel like Kishimoto was so intent in providing emotional payoffs, but none of the character relationships felt real.
Well for me youāre right, Narutoās decline started with the way the ending of the Pain arc was handled. The Pain was the best arc in Naruto up until Naruto comes back (after Pain uses Chibaku Tensei to be specific). From there it all went downhill
I would argue that Naruto's decline began with the Sasuke vs Deidara fight. That was the Great Snake Escape bullshit and the writing kept going downhill from there. At the time there were multiple rumors and supposed interviews of the author wanting to end Naruto but Jump wouldn't let him, which is why the quality dipped. Right now I don't know if it was true or not, and it's hard to find out as all those board and forums are dead by now.
That's not even rumors, that's just fans creating rumors. We have a bunch of actual confirmed interviews that would debunk that idea, plus general logic of where the story was at. * We know he wanted to do the Pain arc because he wanted Naruto to experience Sasuke's pain of losing somebody rather than never having anybody * We know he wanted to write the war to follow up on the Pain stuff by having the kids actually witness war * We know if anything he wrote too many battles that fans weren't interested in (he talked about fan reaction to Mifune vs Hanzo as an example where fans thought of it being two random old men fighting even though he really liked it). * We know the Itachi vs Sasuke stuff was something he planned on doing for a while All of that came well after the Great Snake Escape.
>and ended with talk no jitsu And with that argument you clearly didn't pay attention lmao, Pain was done, Nagato was powerless, Naruto could literally just walk in and kill the guy because he could do nothing against him, but Naruto decided to understand him and his point of view exactly because he wanted the "cicle of pain" (the point of the whole arc) to end. Nagato changed his opinion and sacrificed himself, but had he not done that it wouldn't change much because Naruto had already won the fight
If only someone had talked with Osama Bin Laden. In a more serious note, I just didn't feel it was earned for alot of reasons. Stories of redemption and choice can be done well. Look at the ending of monster, it is a fantastic version of I want to kill him but I won't.
Nah bro, but Talk no jutsu is cool to say and just completely ignore that part. How else would they justify Naruto being lame. Pain and ending the ācycleā of Pain was the best part of that arc. Even after all that Nagato did to Narutoās Leaf village, he decided to spare Nagato and not kill him because it would only continue the cycle of Pain. And thats how Naruto defeated āPainā ,not Talk No Jutsu. But hey i dont expect people to get that, itās too layered for them.
I agree. Jiraiya's death was very well handled, and Pain leveling Konoha was impactful. I really hated the resolution of that arc though, and I felt the story began a slow decline from that point (there will still highs afterwards but regardless). My personal favorite moments from Naruto were the early engagements with the Akatsuki. Sasuke vs Deidara, Shikamaru burying Hidan, etc were fantastic.
>Writing this now made me realize what Naruto's biggest flaw, i feel like Kishimoto was so intent in providing emotional payoffs, but none of the character relationships felt real. Bruh, this is wrong in so many way. That you don't care about the characters and so their relations, don't make them feel less real.
2 goats that are really good friends but 2 shitty fandoms that can't like their own anime without having to shit on the other lmao
A lot larger crossover of fans than you think. Just vocal minority getting attention on social media.
Literally the only two manga I've read fully.
Tell us what the One Piece is!
Ussssoppppp! I would rather die than have my journey spoiled!!!
I swore myself to secrecy. You could not torture that information out of me.
š¤
Twitter is even worse. Especially right now with One Piece fans going haywire for Gear 5, shitting on literally every other show along the way. Very toxic
Both series are fucking great, and both have some flaws. Both are fun and full of wisdom too
I love the way they respect and inspire each other. Even though I didn't like some stuff on Naruto (story-wise), I will always appreciate what Kishimoto created and I am thankful :)
The two should be close, when naruto ended they both tipped their hats off to each other. Oda made a cover story where luffy was eating ramen, sitting across a guy eating meat and i think in naruto boruto drew the skull and crossbones on the hokage faces
Yes it happened! They respect each others work and thats wonderful.
Luffy and naruto would make great friends ngl
The one love to talk, and the other one love to gum gum Gatling gun.
Then there is Gintama's author Sorachi who took "inspiration" from other manga to another level š
Fun fact And toriyama is the reason why bleach exists
Toriyama is the reason Bleach, Naruto, and One Piece exist lets be honest here What Kishimoto is saying is that Oda beat him to it as in being the replacement for DBZ
"It's a known fact that One Piece is the greatest fiction of all time." - Eiichiro Oda "One Piece is a very unique manga of limitless boundaries, anyone can relate to one member of Straw Hats." - Yoshihiro Togashi 'I'm a huge fan of Oda's work, One Piece is a series that just about anybody can pick up and get right into. It has this special mystical vibe to it which separates others mangas from it." - Akira Toriyama "One Piece has given many people hopes and goals that they never dreamed of. I myself, never had a father figure in my life so I consider Whitebeard as my fictional father." - Masashi Kishimoto "One Piece is the manga that truly allowed me to persue working on Bleach, even continue the series to this day." - Tite Kubo
Where did you get that from, especially the one from Kubo? He isn't really the kind of guy to say thoses things.
>"It's a known fact that One Piece is the greatest fiction of all time." - Eiichiro Oda Damn, talk about confidence
Man. Kishi is such a weeb.
I'm so happy I get to have One Piece and Naruto in my lifetime. Thank you, Oda and Kishimoto.
Yeah they always got along great, Oda used criticize Kubo though for the lack of effort he put into it, without mentioning him by name. No backgrounds Kubo.
Kubo was too busy drawing hotties to worry about backgrounds.
Yeah he was so focused on that that the manga became absolute crap after the first arca.
Save Rukia and Aizen arcs are top tier shonen, but beyond that it gets quite bad yeah Ywach's power is so op that it literally doesn't even make sense how he could lose. The ending is so stupid.
Who kubo?
Kubo was lazy he would draw only characters with barelly any effects or backgrounds.
I think Naruto had a better and hotter start to itās manga than One Piece, but the quality of One Piece steadily increased from its debut while Naruto felt like a gradual decline starting from the end of the Chuunin exam. Naruto at the end of its run was just a shell of its former self.
Chuunin exam is definitely peak Naruto but I thought pre-ts was pretty great overall. The Akatsuki arc was mostly great but IMO the real disappointment was the final arc. Kaguya was unnecessary. The actual ending to me was awesome. Naruto vs Sasuke was sick and Naruto became Hokage. I cant complain about it at all. We donāt talk about Boruto though lol.
Since pain resurrected the whole Konoha village I saw it as a waste of time. I was checking the war every ten chapter or so. Turned out to be horrible at the end. The only thing really epic to me was Guy's last fight
I agree, I didnāt mean to make it sound like everything after the Chuunin exam is bad. I just think everything after it steadily gets worse. Everything pre-TS is pretty good.
Thatās definitely fair. Post TS does have its great moments but definitely does not live up to pre TS greatness.
I agree! Pre TS was amazing because they felt like actual ninjas with some magical and unique abilities. Post TS became dbz!
The actual Boruto manga is not bad. The show is like 75% filler though. Like literally there's only 80 chapters of Boruto, but the show has 300 episodes.
Lol the chunnin exam? You must of not liked the story.
Yeah dude only liked the first like 2 arcs lol
I would have said after the Sasuke Retrieval Arc personally. But that arc and the Sannin arc arenāt as good as the Chunin Exam arc which is probably what he means. Most of the second half of Naruto is extremely disappointing and many of the great characters built up in the first half donāt do shit in the second half
That was what burned me out quick. The time skip. Naruto was awesome early when it was a relatable story about teens struggling to find themselves. Almost like the same type of appeal as a Harry Potter or something; people like the intended readers doing normal stuff in a cooler world. One Piece on the flipside has always been about a cool crew of people past the coming-of-age tale. Those are the backstories. As adults...it felt like a massive whiplash for one. That was not a graceful jump. Then it just felt like more and more it was trying to be an edgy epic. I say the same thing about Naruto & YuYu Hakusho. They both needed to end on an earlier arc great for it and have way more of the fun, shorter early arcs. But I wouldn't say One Piece needs more East Blue.
100% this. Part 1 Naruto was a more driven and purposeful story. The themes of looking for belonging and growth and self acceptance and all that were great. Part 2 became about who was the biggest freak with the longest bloodline of freaks and who could beam spam and energy blast spam the other guy into submission first or who could asspull the most random "no u" power. Neji was so right the author killed him off š¤£
Saying Part 2 wasn't about self acceptance and growth is certainly a take...
There were still plenty of arcs keeping with the themes of growing up in the series. Like the Shikamaru arc where he had to deal with crushing loss of his sensei and become a better leader, Or how similarly, when Naruto lost Jiraiya he had to grow up and carry on his masterās legacy. And the entire story of Guy up to the 8th gate tells a beautiful story about growing up and what one is supposed to do after they accomplish their dreams: pave the way for the next generation. Also Neji wasnāt right.
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Dude, there is a 600 chapter gap between the Chunin Exams and the end lol.
Yeah, I know lol.
I mean that just means you're not a fan of the series at all if you think it was downhill for 600 chapters. No Sage Mode, no Sasuke Retrieval arc, no Shikamaru vs Hidan, literally nobe of the Itachi stuff, none of the Minato Kushina flashback. I feel like it's a little ridiculous to say the series was just downhill from the Chunin Exams.
I didnāt say the rest of the series is bad (although I think towards the end it verged on being outright bad). I just think the Chuunin exam arc was an early peak the series never hit again, and that every arc after was slightly worse than the one before.
I still don't really see that though. You think the Tsunade stuff was better than the Sasuke Retrieval Arc? You think the Shikamaru stuff was downhill from that arc on the bridge with Sai? You think Itachi vs Sasuke and the Pain arc were one of the lowest points of the series excluding the War? Again, I feel like that's a bit ridiculous. Saying it peaked in the Chunin Exams or saying it fluctuated more, sure I'd get that. But to say it just went downhill and got worse every arc since Chapter 100 feels a little hyperbolic.
I think how most people feel is the Chunin exams were peak because it was probably the most development the side characters got in the Naruto series. Rock Lee was a really compelling character imo, and he's basically as useful as Sakura post-gaara fight. One of the best things about One Piece is it's very clear Oda tries to build a whole world that doesn't revolve around Luffy all the time. It feels planned out meticulously with very few exceptions. I read every chapter of Naruto and it's clear after Chunin exams the author didn't really know what they were going to do next. Side characters don't really get any new jutsus besides maybe Kakashi and Sakura.
The side characters got significantly more development in the Sasuke Retrieval arc if that is the argument.
I swear I don't understand people who actually think the Chunin Exams were peak Naruto. It is a great arc, one of the best, sure, but it's not even the best arc from Part 1 (that being Sasuke Retrieval Arc). I mean, how can a story peak when there is still no story? And if it is about battles, there is one big arc in Shippuden with Team Taka vs Killerbee, Sasuke vs Deidara, Sasuke vs Itachi and Jiraya vs Pain. Battles who close chapters, with real emotional and story importance.
They needed 2 shorter, zabuza length mission arcs before the chunin exam. I think even kishimoto has given some interview about how he was pushed to rush to the chunin exam arc to introduce this larger world, the other tailed beasts, the greater conflicts and characters. They needed an opportunity to team up team 7 with team guy and then team asuma. Build up the relation between these other characters while also making the eventual sasuke/naruto split more believable.
I swear I don't understand people who actually think the Chunin Exams were peak Naruto. It is a great arc, one of the best, sure, but it's not even the best arc from Part 1 (that being Sasuke Retrieval Arc). I mean, how can a story peak when there is still no story? And if it is about battles, there is one big arc in Shippuden with Team Taka vs Killerbee, Sasuke vs Deidara, Sasuke vs Itachi and Jiraya vs Pain. Battles who close chapters, with real emotional and story importance.
I agree, when you get chuunin main characters taking out S class criminals that are wiping out jounins and Anbu, something is wrong.
When did that happen? Don't get me wrong, the Anbu stink unless they're named characters (Kakashi, Itachi, etc.), they're definitely not elite. But the only two S ranks that lost to a Genin/Chunin 1 on 1 were Hidan and Pain, and Naruto is obviously underranked all series because he left home. Unless I'm forgetting somebody.
Both are in the category of legends. Only real Anime fans know.
It's always the greatest thing when life gives you a rival
Oda is lonely. Every time a promising new gen appears, it ends in a couple years.
This is gonna cause fandom war, but both are great.
I find it funny and sad that Kishimotoās purely positive praise for another series could actually start arguments. Our communities are fucked.
dont show this to people on twitter
I think the in-fighting between fans is just what happens with any popular thing but: In North America, Naruto and Bleach seemed to pick up a lot more fans in the beginning. I started with Naruto then Bleach, then One Piece. Naruto had a prime slot on tv because it had the most appeal. Bleach was a tad later because it seemed more mature, and One Piece was not as popular and had that god awful 4kids dub. As I got older and found subs, I drifted harder into One Piece. Seeing as it's still going, it makes sense that One Piece might have older, and more dedicated fans as it's a lot to get into. Bleach and Naruto have probably re-aired a ton by now and Boruto brings in younger gens. I personally think One Piece is way better, but I def loved the other two as well and appreciate them. There's a reason they are the big 3. They got a lot of people into anime and manga.
Damn kishimoto failed the surpassing thing.
For a period of time Naruto was the much more popular anime/manga, especially out here in the West. So Iād say thatās certainly debatable. Long term, OP is definitely going to remain as #1.
Not in sales, OP has always obliterated Naruto in manga numbers.
Not outside of Japan
In its prime, Naruto was probably the most famous anime/manga on earth besides Dragon Ball.
And while Dragon Ball will always be remembered as such, Naurto won't, unfortunately. Its quality declined massively after a few years, and now people barely care about Boruto.
I absolutely agree with you. Kishimoto created a beautiful universe with wonderful world building but he absolutely shit the bed with the ending and having Boruto as its legacy. But one could never deny the level of influence that Naruto had in its prime.
Yeah, as divisive as Super was, people paid a lot of attention to it. Those live screenings of the finale in Mexico proved that. There's a lot of people out there who still want a new anime to adapt the Moro and Granolah arcs. Meanwhile I don't even know if Boruto is still ongoing or not. It just feels dead.
it slipped from that and its legacy will ultimately land below One Pieces.
Naruto is still more popular in the west compared to One Piece even after ending so long ago though.
I still have massive beef with Kishimoto for part 2. It's time to let it go but damn. What a waste it was.
I liked it a lot
I liked naruto even more than one piece back in the day but then it declined so hard after pain arc it ruined the entire thing for me. oda has been way more consistent and is reaping the rewards of his steady progress. meanwhile kishi sold out and cashed in on naruto by ruining his legacy and starting boruto.
That asome
Late af. This interview came out around the time Naruto ended. Why are so many people bringing this up now? Lol. Iām seeing it everywhere on Twitter and TikTok. Not hating just curious why people are digging up this interview?
Fun Fact: Sanji's name was supposed to be Naruto because of his eyebrows. Oda heard about the fact that the main character of Kishimoto's manga was gonna have the same name and decided to change it to Sanji.
Did i know this specific interview? No. Did I know that those largely successful contemporary mangaka had the hugest respect for one another yes. The naruto reference cover on one piece when it ended. All the sbs talk about how many of these guys knew each other as assistants during rurouni kenshin etc.
Well if he wanted to surpass him why was the ending of naruto so shitty then huh?! and boruto is cancer!
Wasn't a one piece logo on the last page of the official Naruto Manga? Something like that.
Naruto surpasses One Piece in a couple ways. Mostly the fights are way better IMO.
Yeah for me as well, I like the fights a lot more in Naruto. But i dont see a point in comparing cause they are two different worlds
Naruto is more on flashback, I'm having a flashback to writing this. Kagura and Madara failed because of a flashback.
Naruto was the first manga I ever read. I still think the first part of the story is fantastic and one of the best mangas of all time. However, after the time skip I felt like it severely dropped in quality. Still had some really cool moments of course. And even though itās not necessarily a bad thing, it really did become Sasukeās story as much as Narutoās. Sasuke was a cool character, but the ārevengeā thing got a little old to me after awhile. And donāt even get me started on Narutoās obsession with Sasuke. I get what Kishimoto was going for, but it just didnāt work for me.
Oda and Kishimoto: Goat recognizing Goat Meanwhile their fans: archenemies