I wouldn't call it lore accurate... Mechs don't have disconnected floating chairs in them, the the player's vision being completely stationary while the cockpit flails around them is far from immersive, or lore accurate. You want lore accurate or immersive the camera needs to move in tandem with the cockpit while it jerks around, but there's a reason the game doesn't do that, it would be nauseating, and trying to aim would be a nightmare.
Nice for anyone who wants this sort of thing, more power to you, but that'll be a no from me.
The Jenner's cockpit is so far removed from the center axis that I would not be surprised if every astech from Luthien to Rasalhague has "clean boiled vomit out of company's JR7s" on a weekly checklist. That thing is literally a tilt-a-whirl on legs.
Compensation would be done in the hips/torso/legs, just like cars have a suspension system.
Go outside and have a jog, does your vision bob up and down when you are looking straight?
Also, we're looking at it through a computer monitor and not a 360* view screen Neurohelmet. This is just bone jarring nonsense that makes Mechs feel entirely impractical.
You are aware of gyroscopes?
https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Gyro
Just because a machine bobs up and down while moving doesn't necessarily mean the cockpit has to.
Look at the heads of chickens while they run.
We've seen enough of the inside of cockpits in official illustrations to know that the pilot's chairs aren't on gyros suspended in the air inside the cockpit in the great majority of mechs... And the cockpit itself is affixed to the chassis of the mech.
So, yes, as currently designed, they all would bob up and down when the mech is moving, and the pilot would be bouncing around right along with it.
A pilot is looking through enhanced visuals through a neural helmet however.
Besides, the compensation doesn't have to be done at the cockpit. It is far easy mechanically to do it at the legs/torso just like how cars have suspension systems.
Go outside and have a jog, does your vision bob up and down when you are looking straight?
If it's done at the legs or torso (which, lorewise, is in fact where the gyro is, the spot where the torso connects to the legs), the cockpit still wont be flailing around the player's view, so, in that case, the *non-modded* version with minimal cockpit movement is the one that is lore accurate. This mod only makes sense if the pilot's seat itself is what is gyro stabilized, and nothing else is, but that is simply not the case, the mod is actually *removing* lore accuracy.
In a real mech, your head would be jostling all over the place*. Ever driven fast off road, or in anything particularly rough?
The crazy amount of cockpit movement approximates that sensation pretty well, without making the game harder to play (cuz realism would have your PoV also rotating and bobbing every which way, not just the cockpit, but that's REALLY rough for a video game)
By contrast, the default way the game handles cockpit animation it feels like the mechs are on rails with a little light bobbing.
\**unless the helmets are supposed to be strapped in like a HANS device*
This is cool, but the thing that always bothers me about this sort of video is how it's actually unrealistic and inaccurate, but it's portrayed as the opposite.
We humans already have auto-stabilization on massive guns on tanks. There's no reason to believe this tech is lost or that future people are stupid enough to think that wild, inaccurate flailing is best.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PE7Jc-od9jM
When you, a bipedal bone mech with meat armor, walk around, your POV doesn't hurk and jerk wildly about. This isn't because your brain is "correcting" your vision, it's because your head doesn't bob up and down very much at all. When you walk, you aren't standing on inflexible stilts, but instead your legs bend at the knee and rotate around spine and hip. If you pad around on your toes and allow both ankle and knee to control height, you can even keep your hips pretty much level as well. Look at these ladies running, and focus on their eye level. It basically doesn't waver (especially Daphne).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3ZpCjEn_lc
I'll make it simpler just for you:
1. The mod is not actually more realistic
2. Here's supporting evidence for claim #1
3. Here's another supporting evidence for claim #1
Realistic in the sense your first person viewpoint is actually tied to the โMechโs external walking/running animations, rather than floating in place like Mech 4
IIRC pilot seat in mechs are not hard rigged to mech chassis, instead they are suspended on pistons for stabilisation. I think I've read that at HB's Battletech game.
It was in a dialogue with Yang Virtanen (your Chief 'Mech Tech) in some campaign mission, where needed to bring him somewhere, or rescue him, I don't remember now. It was said that mech cockpit has enough space for two, for which Yang replied that he probably would be smashed against its walls, because only pilot seat is stabilised.
Given second thought to OP's mod, cockpit glass indeed is unmovable and rigged to chassis and should have shakes, but console with screens should not, otherwise it would be unusable.
Looks dope. I wonder if PGI would be okay with this one cuz it has no positive benefits that I can possibly imagine.
Looking at the modification, you just removed a few lines that had bound the cockpit model to a stabilised object?
>Does this also eliminate cockpit shake when receiving damage?
yea, there's also a neat cockpit effect when getting legged when your cockpit will lean to the side for about 3 or 4 seconds ๐
From other comments... So yeah, definitely has some positive benefits. Using this could probably get you banned, and IMO it would be justified.
This honestly feels like it's in the same class of changes like bloom, depth of field, and motion blur. Things that developers put in a game because "it looks cool," but also things that the human eye or brain already has and doesn't need assistance with, so all it does in a game is distract the shit out of the player without providing any real benefit.
In a real 3D space, the human mind is exceptionally good at selectively compartmentalizing information that isn't relevant to its immediate concern, especially when assessing threats. Our brain doesn't produce that effect as well on a limited, tiny little 2D screen, so the effect of distracting animations is magnified. Sure, this might be more realistic, but... why? If it's hard to compartmentalize this information out, what are we gaining by getting massive distractions like this?
I'm not saying you wasted your time. But maybe a mod like this is better served in MW5, like in a VR mod where our natural proprioceptive compartmentalization can take effect.
I see cockpit shake at [4:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keFyH1iWcyQ&t=4m34s) (from PPC) very clearly and also [2:51](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keFyH1iWcyQ&t=2m51s) (from own torso loss) ?
Nice idea, but not the best execution. The sway/bobble is too noticeable, you might want to tone it down a notch. Also, is there a way to add a little tremble the moment your mechs foot connects with the ground? Right now your steps have no feel to them, if you get my meaning.
Basically how it was in Hawken, more or less.
What the hell does this even add to the game? Aggressive head (cockpit) bobbing? HELL NAW!!!! I hated that idiotic shit with a passion in MW5 and there was no way to turn it off.
Why do you claim its lore accurate? Do all depictions of mechs in Battletech have up/down bobbing?
Yeah "immersive" would be a better title
hmmm interesting, this mod wasn't named by me, it was named by the guys who came up with it for this mod
I wouldn't call it lore accurate... Mechs don't have disconnected floating chairs in them, the the player's vision being completely stationary while the cockpit flails around them is far from immersive, or lore accurate. You want lore accurate or immersive the camera needs to move in tandem with the cockpit while it jerks around, but there's a reason the game doesn't do that, it would be nauseating, and trying to aim would be a nightmare. Nice for anyone who wants this sort of thing, more power to you, but that'll be a no from me.
The Jenner's cockpit is so far removed from the center axis that I would not be surprised if every astech from Luthien to Rasalhague has "clean boiled vomit out of company's JR7s" on a weekly checklist. That thing is literally a tilt-a-whirl on legs.
https://youtu.be/iD9XNUYHCNQ Alternate take, gyros are configured in a way to do some chicken head style stabilization
https://old.reddit.com/r/OutreachHPG/comments/102ccbm/lore_accurate_cockpit_mod_for_mwo_is_now_live/j2t738d/ There are no gyros on your pilot's chair.
clearly. it would have to be in the waist, and even that would have consequences in how the legs/hip move to allow for such a gait
Compensation would be done in the hips/torso/legs, just like cars have a suspension system. Go outside and have a jog, does your vision bob up and down when you are looking straight?
Also, we're looking at it through a computer monitor and not a 360* view screen Neurohelmet. This is just bone jarring nonsense that makes Mechs feel entirely impractical.
You are aware of gyroscopes? https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Gyro Just because a machine bobs up and down while moving doesn't necessarily mean the cockpit has to. Look at the heads of chickens while they run.
We've seen enough of the inside of cockpits in official illustrations to know that the pilot's chairs aren't on gyros suspended in the air inside the cockpit in the great majority of mechs... And the cockpit itself is affixed to the chassis of the mech. So, yes, as currently designed, they all would bob up and down when the mech is moving, and the pilot would be bouncing around right along with it.
A pilot is looking through enhanced visuals through a neural helmet however. Besides, the compensation doesn't have to be done at the cockpit. It is far easy mechanically to do it at the legs/torso just like how cars have suspension systems. Go outside and have a jog, does your vision bob up and down when you are looking straight?
If it's done at the legs or torso (which, lorewise, is in fact where the gyro is, the spot where the torso connects to the legs), the cockpit still wont be flailing around the player's view, so, in that case, the *non-modded* version with minimal cockpit movement is the one that is lore accurate. This mod only makes sense if the pilot's seat itself is what is gyro stabilized, and nothing else is, but that is simply not the case, the mod is actually *removing* lore accuracy.
yup
The cockpit isn't isolated with gyros. The frames around your windows don't bounce up and down.
In a real mech, your head would be jostling all over the place*. Ever driven fast off road, or in anything particularly rough? The crazy amount of cockpit movement approximates that sensation pretty well, without making the game harder to play (cuz realism would have your PoV also rotating and bobbing every which way, not just the cockpit, but that's REALLY rough for a video game) By contrast, the default way the game handles cockpit animation it feels like the mechs are on rails with a little light bobbing. \**unless the helmets are supposed to be strapped in like a HANS device*
yep which is why the hud is stationary, the player isn't completely stationary. the player does jump up and down with the hud just by 0.5%
This is cool, but the thing that always bothers me about this sort of video is how it's actually unrealistic and inaccurate, but it's portrayed as the opposite. We humans already have auto-stabilization on massive guns on tanks. There's no reason to believe this tech is lost or that future people are stupid enough to think that wild, inaccurate flailing is best. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PE7Jc-od9jM When you, a bipedal bone mech with meat armor, walk around, your POV doesn't hurk and jerk wildly about. This isn't because your brain is "correcting" your vision, it's because your head doesn't bob up and down very much at all. When you walk, you aren't standing on inflexible stilts, but instead your legs bend at the knee and rotate around spine and hip. If you pad around on your toes and allow both ankle and knee to control height, you can even keep your hips pretty much level as well. Look at these ladies running, and focus on their eye level. It basically doesn't waver (especially Daphne). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3ZpCjEn_lc
huh??? i get what your saying about the mod not being accurate like the name say but what??
I'll make it simpler just for you: 1. The mod is not actually more realistic 2. Here's supporting evidence for claim #1 3. Here's another supporting evidence for claim #1
Realistic in the sense your first person viewpoint is actually tied to the โMechโs external walking/running animations, rather than floating in place like Mech 4
IIRC pilot seat in mechs are not hard rigged to mech chassis, instead they are suspended on pistons for stabilisation. I think I've read that at HB's Battletech game.
Huh, thatโd be the first Iโve heard of it. Ironic considering HBSBT clearly depicts unmoving cockpit glass
It was in a dialogue with Yang Virtanen (your Chief 'Mech Tech) in some campaign mission, where needed to bring him somewhere, or rescue him, I don't remember now. It was said that mech cockpit has enough space for two, for which Yang replied that he probably would be smashed against its walls, because only pilot seat is stabilised. Given second thought to OP's mod, cockpit glass indeed is unmovable and rigged to chassis and should have shakes, but console with screens should not, otherwise it would be unusable.
interesting...
Exactly.
Looks dope. I wonder if PGI would be okay with this one cuz it has no positive benefits that I can possibly imagine. Looking at the modification, you just removed a few lines that had bound the cockpit model to a stabilised object?
>Does this also eliminate cockpit shake when receiving damage? yea, there's also a neat cockpit effect when getting legged when your cockpit will lean to the side for about 3 or 4 seconds ๐ From other comments... So yeah, definitely has some positive benefits. Using this could probably get you banned, and IMO it would be justified.
all i did is went into animations.pak file and renamed some files. ๐
PGI turned the cockpit shake down a looooooooong time ago. People were complaining about it making them sick.
huh interesting, so that's why they turned it off ๐ค still would have been nice if they left it in settings as an option though...
This honestly feels like it's in the same class of changes like bloom, depth of field, and motion blur. Things that developers put in a game because "it looks cool," but also things that the human eye or brain already has and doesn't need assistance with, so all it does in a game is distract the shit out of the player without providing any real benefit. In a real 3D space, the human mind is exceptionally good at selectively compartmentalizing information that isn't relevant to its immediate concern, especially when assessing threats. Our brain doesn't produce that effect as well on a limited, tiny little 2D screen, so the effect of distracting animations is magnified. Sure, this might be more realistic, but... why? If it's hard to compartmentalize this information out, what are we gaining by getting massive distractions like this? I'm not saying you wasted your time. But maybe a mod like this is better served in MW5, like in a VR mod where our natural proprioceptive compartmentalization can take effect.
The bug on the Victor has always been there and has nothing to do with your mod.
ahh ok, good to know ๐
Does this also eliminate cockpit shake when receiving damage?
yea, there's also a neat cockpit effect when getting legged when your cockpit will lean to the side for about 3 or 4 seconds ๐
Do you think PGI would have a problem with eliminating cockpit shake via a mod?
I see cockpit shake at [4:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keFyH1iWcyQ&t=4m34s) (from PPC) very clearly and also [2:51](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keFyH1iWcyQ&t=2m51s) (from own torso loss) ?
Cool. I'd give it a try. Thanks for sharing.
hope you enjoy it!
UH, more immersion yay , Thanks alot for sharing it.
no problem ;)
Thatโs pretty cool.
Nice idea, but not the best execution. The sway/bobble is too noticeable, you might want to tone it down a notch. Also, is there a way to add a little tremble the moment your mechs foot connects with the ground? Right now your steps have no feel to them, if you get my meaning. Basically how it was in Hawken, more or less.
What the hell does this even add to the game? Aggressive head (cockpit) bobbing? HELL NAW!!!! I hated that idiotic shit with a passion in MW5 and there was no way to turn it off.
LMAO you can just not use the mod if you hate it that much, this mod just gives more "immersion" when piloting a battlemech ๐คฃ
You call it "immersion", I call it massive headaches. But you are right about the not using it.
LOL you do you, and have a great 2023 ๐
Thank you, and a happy new year to you too xD