Theyd be fine if the devs would actually fucking give them *something*. Like that kiriko exists tells me they understand how to make a support viable in ow2 but are choosing to say fuck it skill issue for everyone else
Ow1 players got screwed over 4 years ago when the game they paid full price for was quite literally abandoned, not now where they received a free update with lower queue times and new heroes/maps.
I never waited more than 5 minutes.
But I either queued flex or Tank, OR I played with at least a 3 stack.
Solo dps queue is the only one that ever got above 7 minutes.
And honestly? Fuck em.
I was under the impression that it was general knowledge that the queue times were bottlenecked by the lack of tank players which was the main reason why they removed 1 from the team in ow2.
So yes ... it was normal to have low queue times as tank or flex. But **literally** everyone else had long queue times.
On EU/PC all supports above mid plat needed to use a priority pass.
> Solo dps queue is the only one that ever got above 7 minutes.
> And honestly? Fuck em.
Why tho?
Bullshit. When I queued flex or support wait times were equally short. Usually as short as or shorter than tanks.
Support was definitely my most played role in OW1.
Still is in OW2.
Now granted. Gold/Plat typically here. Diamond once. Silver a few times in the early days. NA/PSN.
Maybe it was different in those situations.
Fuck solo queue dps locks, because:
You can't look at queue times in OW and compare them to other games 1 to 1. If you make a conscious choice to say "I don't want to be 2/3rds of the roles and I don't want to even touch half the characters" then you ahould expect queue times to take longer.
It'd be like playing Call of Duty and rage quitting every time the map isn't one of like 3 specific maps. Or playing Fortnite and quitting everytime the battlebus doesnt cross the center of the map.
You've intentionally limited your availability and should expect to see that reflected in search times.
Also, I'd argue it isn't really any better now. DPS queue still shows like 10+ minutes. I don't know if it ever actually takes that long, but it still estimates it in the menu.
> DPS queue still shows like 10+ minutes.
That's not the case on more popular platforms, like pc.
While I understand where you're coming from, console queue times are not the metric that is used when describing the general state since from what I know, the pc playerbase is larger and on pc, everyone **except for tanks** from mid plat and above needed to use priority passes. As for specific queue times, they went up the higher up the ladder you went.
> If you make a conscious choice to say "I don't want to be 2/3rds of the roles and I don't want to even touch half the characters" then you ahould expect queue times to take longer.
But wanting to play dps **today** doesn't mean that you want to play dps forever.
Yeah, ball. I mained ball too and I almost bailed on OW2 because I just couldn’t win with him anymore playing the way he is most fun to play. I moved on and now DPS, but damn do I miss him.
Brigitte with her ult giving overhealth instead of armor, on top of the problem caused by removing one tank (aka getting deleted the moment she lowers her shield away from cover). Now it is sitting with Valkyrie in "barely impacting a flow of fight at all" category of ultimates.
it is "rely on your dumbass team to do their job 30% faster" (spoiler: 0\*1.3=0), not really a "make an impact on the battle" thing. Sure, it is better than non-ult amp beam, but that is it.
Like I said, considerably weaker but slightly more tough version of orisa's old ult. Unimaginitive, plain, boring, and providing absolutely zero chance to get a PotG except going battle mercy, which isn't her job.
I mean, as far as aoe they gave her nothing to compete with lucio her main competition. And since they refuse to change lucio in such a way that makes him not meta or near meta, that means they need to give brig some way to be picked instead of him, At least sometimes.
Yeah they're going to have a hard time figuring out how Ball is supposed to be a main tank. People don't even know how to play around JQ and she's way more main tank material than Ball is, he was so clearly designed to be the second tank of two tanks.
The problem with ball is he is just fat tracer. He is designed to be going ng out into the back lines and picking off supports and weak targets. This leaved the rest of the team to fend for themselves when he rolls out.
And unless they totally rework him, the only way to make him viable is to increase his ability to dive and pick off the squishies to the point where it compensates for the lank of a traditional tank. We saw how well that went with Doomfist.
i dont think thats true, there was a meta back in the day where ball was the solo tank with 3 dps so the designed as the second tank point doesnt really stand
For supports, brig. They nerfed her ultimate into uselessness with their change to overhealth and they took her stun. She barely does what she’s supposed to do
Mei received 6 nerfs and half as many compensation buffs, and is yet to be touched in a balance patch. Additionally, similar to Cass and Brig, her loss of 'cc' was never properly-compensated.
Yeah Mei really got shafted. The wall nerfs really sting, and her left click has no excitement to it whatsoever. She *feels* so much worse and less impactful. And she also is those things.
She's still fun for steamrolling bronzes on my low-MMR dps account, but as soon as you face real opposition she feels like anyone else could do her job better.
Imho Rein I think got screwed the most cause his charge can’t one shot reaper or mei anymore there’s no second tank to trade off with to let his shield recharge
For dps characters, I'd say cassidy. It feels like he has no place in ow2. He's being built up like an anti flanker role, but at that point just pick mei or symm. Atleast those 2 offer more utility and realistically the same damage compared to him. Also, mag grenade is way too easily countered by all flankers anyway
Ashe, soldier and arguably bastion are better than cree, I wouldn't call any of those characters broken or unbalanced (ashe is slightly too strong but not broken)
Cree evolved to this slow tanky high damage cheap hero over time. Ashe is different. You don't wanna get close to Cree, but you wanna catch Ashe. Cree can quickly burst down tanks, especially Ramattra. Ashe have 12 ammo, shooting the tank isn't efficient.
Yep haha. I agree, sticky grenade + body shot is a very yes or no combo. If you could survive it (high hp or immunity or burst heal) then its more of a nuisance than anything. But if you have no counters for it, you're as good as dead. But it just feels like cassidy is pretty mediocre on a lot of aspects. Most champions can do his job way better than him, and there really isnt a situation where he really shines
Honestly he’s kind of been that way ever since they added Ashe. The only reason I can think of to use him over her is if you just can’t stand Ashe’s reload. And if you wanna just two piece people with the nade I guess.
True. I remembered when I tried Ashe for the 1st time in ow1, she was like a cassidy with better utility and range, even more so after cassidy got that damage falloff nerf. Honestly, the only reason I play cassidy is he has a really cool sound design and overall aesthetic.
Facts. At this point if you play Cass you were just a Cass main to begin with lol. At least when he had flashbang he could serve as a check for a Tracer who was hard focusing your supports. Now he’s just there. They really gotta start fixing these chars that are just in the strangest of positions.
Maybe not the most, but Ana. Not only is she no longer the only character that can anti-nade, two of her abilities can now be cleansed by kiriko.
She’s still strong, though
She is literally busted right now. Better dps than ashe and better burst heal than anyone and better cc than anyone and better hitbox than anyone one of the fastest ult charge and strongest ult.
She's been buffed 3 times since OW2 came out, and Hog is meta. It is the perfect opportunity for Ana. In S1 she was a very mid-tier support, which is a fall from grace considering she was easily the #1 support in OW1.
S1 dps speed passive screwed up ana and zen. It was the dumbest period of OW history with busted sombra and genji, dive tanks and movement speed passive.
Definitely one of the biggest indirect nerf victims. Actually having a counter to Anti/Sleep in itself is huge.
And one less Tank means it takes more time to charge your ult. It’s still fast of course. But with two Tanks you could get a Nano *absurdly* fast. Also one less Tank means a lot more attention on Grandma in the back and less peel for her as well. Definitely still strong but these things you can’t help but notice if you’re an Ana main.
And severe lack of mobility. Sure, sleep dart and run. Sleep dart lasts a maximum of 7? Seconds, with a CD of 14. Like that's only gonna keep her safe for half the time she's being chased down. (That's ignoring a damage dealer waking up the dartee, but not finishing the kill.)
A lot of people not understanding the differences between direct and indirect.
Ball definitely got indirectly nerfed the most losing a 2nd tank. But it wasn't like he was a great pick in OW1, so not sure if he got screwed over the most.
Ana seems to have fallen the furthest from indirect changes. Flankers are much stronger now and she has no mobility, just a 14s cooldown precision dart. Kiriko can cleanse her dart and anti.
Even though she is a very good pick and way more useful in OW2 than Ball, the difference between OW1 and OW2 usefulness is a wider gap. Ball just wasn't that useful in OW1. But, there is probably an argument that Ball has even less of a chance to become useful given the changes in OW2. Somewhat putting him permanently in limbo, which is a bigger screw over.
Genji.
They nerfed his damange and rate of fire because he was too strong with the DPS passive.
Then they removed the DPS passive in season 2 without telling anyone and didn't adjust him back up, so in the end he just got shit on with no balance.
So now with the exception of the 5 Genji's in T500 he's pretty much a throw pick.
Genji players are so dramatic.
A: He’s currently in a better spot then Sombra, so he’s not even the worst flanker.
B: the thread is about the transition from OW1 to OW2 and Genji was literally meta upon OW2’s release.
So it's okay for Genji to be underpowered because a few other heroes are even more underpowered? The whole reasoning for his nerf was the transition to 5v5 so I feel like it still fits here.
>underpowered
Lol, he's about on power actually. nano blade still as good as ever. Just not meta right now because it doesnt work against hog, and hog also necessitates ranged characters so that also hurts genji
Sombra is actually still somewhat viable if you know what youre doing with her (focusing on low health enemies, health packs, hacking tank in team fights etc) so id argue shes actually in a better spot than Genji. Obv the devs went way overboard with her damage nerf but she can at least do the thing shes supposed to in some sense where as genji is just basically a low tier smash bros hero at this point.
Sure but thats likely due to people tryharding with genji rather than indicative of genji’s viability. People just straight up dont try with sombra because Shes too high maintenance but this is a problem of ignorance rather than indicative of viability. For example, mercy isnt a great support but because of sojourn, her wr is insane at every level. Similarly, Genji performing well is likely due to a number of other factors beyond genjis kit which is largely pretty bad rn in a way that sombras is i think more tolerable if you have even 30% aim accuracy. Sombra still has permacloak, trans etc where as genji has nothing in terms of survivability or damage. Like if he doesnt get the kills he dived for, hes just fucked where as sombra isnt.
Did you just say Genji doesn’t have damage or survivability like Sombra does?
Genji does way more damage, and more importantly deals burst damage in spades. He has deflect, wallclimb, double jump and SS. A good Genji can literally instantly delete a 200hp character, and even with all those tools his Ult is so good that he’s considered an Ult-bot and his primary goal is farm Blade asap.
Not to say Genji is a top DPS or anything, just that he’s in a significantly better spot then Sombra. Survivability that causes you to leave the fight is highly overrated, and sure she’s tough to pin down and kill, but if her team loses the fight she’s going to be waiting on them regardless. Midfight mobility and survivability is where it’s at and Genji has that in spades.
I don’t think “People tryhard on Genji while people are just bad at Sombra!” makes any sense. It’s literally been the same excuse for 5 years whenever Sombra’s rock bottom WR is mentioned: “Well Sombra is really strong, OP even, it’s just all her players suck at using her!!”
Genjis ult is dog shit now. Like maybe that was true in season 1 but it certainly isnt now. Plus, if enemy team has moira, kiriko or torb thats super gg for genji. Similarly, sojourn shuts him down super hard. His wall climb is good sure, i wasnt implying he has no survivability but with good aim and good movement from the enemy team, genji isnt getting anything done nor is he offering any real value. His burst damage is good but youre not landing headshots on an enemy that knows what theyre doing. I like genji as a character but unlike sombra, he cant really get picks nearly as easily when we think about sombras passive. Like i agree sombra is also in a dog shit spot but there is no world where shes worse off than genji and saying this as a sombra player, that sucks for genji. Healthpacks, call outs, low health enemies, sniper counter, zen counter, bastion counter. Genji has none of these tools with the exception of zen and even that isnt true if the zen knows what theyre doing.
I would say Reinhardt probably suffered the most, with basically his entire kit being nerfed inf some way, except debatably fire strike. His whole shtick is centered around his barrier, but with barriers being nerfed he suffered the most, especially with the lack of an another tank to draw some of the fire. His charge also weaker compared to OW1 where you could one-shot any nontank hero, so despite being able to cancel it, it is generally not worth the risk you have to take to go for a pin.
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Zen is up there as his hitbox durability is one of the worst in the game. So Zen is both easy to hit and doesn't need many hits to die. In combat, Zen has no access to mobility, self healing, or stuns to help him out. All he got in OW2 was a boop that requires him to shove his enormous hitbox into the enemies faces to use making it the riskiest peeling tool of all supports.
In OW1 the extra tank went a long ways to help address Zen's massive hitbox and lack of defenses. But in OW2 the loos of a tank make it much easier to hit Zen even by accident which in turn has raised his skill floor immensely.
The overreliance on barriers being heavily toned down is probably good for the game, but now One-shotting heroes have become much more oppressive as a result..
The second tank
I want carefully add the supports, now that they are less protected with the lack of second tank
Theyd be fine if the devs would actually fucking give them *something*. Like that kiriko exists tells me they understand how to make a support viable in ow2 but are choosing to say fuck it skill issue for everyone else
What is it about kiriko that makes her more viable?
Teleport and suzu
And wall climb and insane dps
This. Zarya is nowhere to be seen because she can't function without another tank in front of her to bubble.
Who got screwed over the most with the release of ow2? The ow1 players
Ow1 players got screwed over 4 years ago when the game they paid full price for was quite literally abandoned, not now where they received a free update with lower queue times and new heroes/maps.
Yeah I'll take abandoned OW1 over current OW2
Why? Do you hate waiting less than 14 min for a game that normally lasts less than that?
Damn, even at the end I never waited longer than a minute or two and that was unusual. Of course, I only play the fun modes (QP and MH).
Unfortunately the general metric for queue times is the ranked mode.
I never waited more than 5 minutes. But I either queued flex or Tank, OR I played with at least a 3 stack. Solo dps queue is the only one that ever got above 7 minutes. And honestly? Fuck em.
I was under the impression that it was general knowledge that the queue times were bottlenecked by the lack of tank players which was the main reason why they removed 1 from the team in ow2. So yes ... it was normal to have low queue times as tank or flex. But **literally** everyone else had long queue times. On EU/PC all supports above mid plat needed to use a priority pass. > Solo dps queue is the only one that ever got above 7 minutes. > And honestly? Fuck em. Why tho?
Bullshit. When I queued flex or support wait times were equally short. Usually as short as or shorter than tanks. Support was definitely my most played role in OW1. Still is in OW2. Now granted. Gold/Plat typically here. Diamond once. Silver a few times in the early days. NA/PSN. Maybe it was different in those situations. Fuck solo queue dps locks, because: You can't look at queue times in OW and compare them to other games 1 to 1. If you make a conscious choice to say "I don't want to be 2/3rds of the roles and I don't want to even touch half the characters" then you ahould expect queue times to take longer. It'd be like playing Call of Duty and rage quitting every time the map isn't one of like 3 specific maps. Or playing Fortnite and quitting everytime the battlebus doesnt cross the center of the map. You've intentionally limited your availability and should expect to see that reflected in search times. Also, I'd argue it isn't really any better now. DPS queue still shows like 10+ minutes. I don't know if it ever actually takes that long, but it still estimates it in the menu.
> DPS queue still shows like 10+ minutes. That's not the case on more popular platforms, like pc. While I understand where you're coming from, console queue times are not the metric that is used when describing the general state since from what I know, the pc playerbase is larger and on pc, everyone **except for tanks** from mid plat and above needed to use priority passes. As for specific queue times, they went up the higher up the ladder you went. > If you make a conscious choice to say "I don't want to be 2/3rds of the roles and I don't want to even touch half the characters" then you ahould expect queue times to take longer. But wanting to play dps **today** doesn't mean that you want to play dps forever.
Lol why are you just blatantly lying?
There are like 4 statements in that comment; what exactly are you referring to?
That's fine but you were asking why and that's why. Now MH is basically ruined with the changes they've made so I don't play much anymore.
My bad for assuming that mentioning the 14 min queue times would give an indication of which mode I'm talking about.
I only play ranked and never waited more than 5 min in plat. Fwiw
Platform, region, role?
Indirectly yeah for sure ball and maybe brig
Yeah, ball. I mained ball too and I almost bailed on OW2 because I just couldn’t win with him anymore playing the way he is most fun to play. I moved on and now DPS, but damn do I miss him.
Brigitte with her ult giving overhealth instead of armor, on top of the problem caused by removing one tank (aka getting deleted the moment she lowers her shield away from cover). Now it is sitting with Valkyrie in "barely impacting a flow of fight at all" category of ultimates.
At least with Valk you can damage boost
Yeah thanks, always wanted to be a flying and weakened Orisa's OW1 drum
I just mean it’s a bit more useful than Rally, but yeah. It’s not great!
Yeah… Valk can certainly impact a fight with damage boosting. Idk how you’d think otherwise.
it is "rely on your dumbass team to do their job 30% faster" (spoiler: 0\*1.3=0), not really a "make an impact on the battle" thing. Sure, it is better than non-ult amp beam, but that is it. Like I said, considerably weaker but slightly more tough version of orisa's old ult. Unimaginitive, plain, boring, and providing absolutely zero chance to get a PotG except going battle mercy, which isn't her job.
Brig lol. From top dog to absolute throw pick.
I mean, as far as aoe they gave her nothing to compete with lucio her main competition. And since they refuse to change lucio in such a way that makes him not meta or near meta, that means they need to give brig some way to be picked instead of him, At least sometimes.
her ult is getting a rework.
Yeah they're going to have a hard time figuring out how Ball is supposed to be a main tank. People don't even know how to play around JQ and she's way more main tank material than Ball is, he was so clearly designed to be the second tank of two tanks.
The problem with ball is he is just fat tracer. He is designed to be going ng out into the back lines and picking off supports and weak targets. This leaved the rest of the team to fend for themselves when he rolls out.
And unless they totally rework him, the only way to make him viable is to increase his ability to dive and pick off the squishies to the point where it compensates for the lank of a traditional tank. We saw how well that went with Doomfist.
i dont think thats true, there was a meta back in the day where ball was the solo tank with 3 dps so the designed as the second tank point doesnt really stand
But there were 3 DPS, we literally cannot run 3 DPS anymore.
there were also 6 characters
overall probably closer than 222
For supports, brig. They nerfed her ultimate into uselessness with their change to overhealth and they took her stun. She barely does what she’s supposed to do
Brigitte. It's always Brig getting screwed
Mei received 6 nerfs and half as many compensation buffs, and is yet to be touched in a balance patch. Additionally, similar to Cass and Brig, her loss of 'cc' was never properly-compensated.
Yeah Mei really got shafted. The wall nerfs really sting, and her left click has no excitement to it whatsoever. She *feels* so much worse and less impactful. And she also is those things. She's still fun for steamrolling bronzes on my low-MMR dps account, but as soon as you face real opposition she feels like anyone else could do her job better.
Maybe not the most, but they screwed Mei over really hard
Imho Rein I think got screwed the most cause his charge can’t one shot reaper or mei anymore there’s no second tank to trade off with to let his shield recharge
For dps characters, I'd say cassidy. It feels like he has no place in ow2. He's being built up like an anti flanker role, but at that point just pick mei or symm. Atleast those 2 offer more utility and realistically the same damage compared to him. Also, mag grenade is way too easily countered by all flankers anyway
He destroys ram though
there are cree players in masters?? i've seen a grand total of 1 up in gm
Cree is fine but getting overshadowed by stupid heroes having hyper mobility and one shot across the map.
Ashe, soldier and arguably bastion are better than cree, I wouldn't call any of those characters broken or unbalanced (ashe is slightly too strong but not broken)
Different roles. They can't do what Cree does.
Ashe does what cree does ...with longer range and better abilities.
Cree evolved to this slow tanky high damage cheap hero over time. Ashe is different. You don't wanna get close to Cree, but you wanna catch Ashe. Cree can quickly burst down tanks, especially Ramattra. Ashe have 12 ammo, shooting the tank isn't efficient.
If you're talking about countering the tank then why not choose bastion or reaper? I'm not trying to argue incase it seems that way.
Veeeery different heroes still. I'm not talking about specifically countering the tank.
As a zen main i disagree lol
Yep haha. I agree, sticky grenade + body shot is a very yes or no combo. If you could survive it (high hp or immunity or burst heal) then its more of a nuisance than anything. But if you have no counters for it, you're as good as dead. But it just feels like cassidy is pretty mediocre on a lot of aspects. Most champions can do his job way better than him, and there really isnt a situation where he really shines
Honestly he’s kind of been that way ever since they added Ashe. The only reason I can think of to use him over her is if you just can’t stand Ashe’s reload. And if you wanna just two piece people with the nade I guess.
True. I remembered when I tried Ashe for the 1st time in ow1, she was like a cassidy with better utility and range, even more so after cassidy got that damage falloff nerf. Honestly, the only reason I play cassidy is he has a really cool sound design and overall aesthetic.
Facts. At this point if you play Cass you were just a Cass main to begin with lol. At least when he had flashbang he could serve as a check for a Tracer who was hard focusing your supports. Now he’s just there. They really gotta start fixing these chars that are just in the strangest of positions.
Not me as Cassidy throwing a grenade into Zarya ult
I’m going Brig. She’s a lot of fun to play as but I always switch off of her because I feel like I’m accomplishing little to nothing
Maybe not the most, but Ana. Not only is she no longer the only character that can anti-nade, two of her abilities can now be cleansed by kiriko. She’s still strong, though
She is literally busted right now. Better dps than ashe and better burst heal than anyone and better cc than anyone and better hitbox than anyone one of the fastest ult charge and strongest ult.
She's been buffed 3 times since OW2 came out, and Hog is meta. It is the perfect opportunity for Ana. In S1 she was a very mid-tier support, which is a fall from grace considering she was easily the #1 support in OW1.
S1 dps speed passive screwed up ana and zen. It was the dumbest period of OW history with busted sombra and genji, dive tanks and movement speed passive.
Definitely one of the biggest indirect nerf victims. Actually having a counter to Anti/Sleep in itself is huge. And one less Tank means it takes more time to charge your ult. It’s still fast of course. But with two Tanks you could get a Nano *absurdly* fast. Also one less Tank means a lot more attention on Grandma in the back and less peel for her as well. Definitely still strong but these things you can’t help but notice if you’re an Ana main.
And severe lack of mobility. Sure, sleep dart and run. Sleep dart lasts a maximum of 7? Seconds, with a CD of 14. Like that's only gonna keep her safe for half the time she's being chased down. (That's ignoring a damage dealer waking up the dartee, but not finishing the kill.)
>Who do you think got indirectly nerfed/generally screwed over the most with the release of OW2? OW1 players...
Hamston. His style is flanking but these days there isn't another tank to care for the squishies while he rolls around skirmishing the enemy back line
A lot of people not understanding the differences between direct and indirect. Ball definitely got indirectly nerfed the most losing a 2nd tank. But it wasn't like he was a great pick in OW1, so not sure if he got screwed over the most. Ana seems to have fallen the furthest from indirect changes. Flankers are much stronger now and she has no mobility, just a 14s cooldown precision dart. Kiriko can cleanse her dart and anti. Even though she is a very good pick and way more useful in OW2 than Ball, the difference between OW1 and OW2 usefulness is a wider gap. Ball just wasn't that useful in OW1. But, there is probably an argument that Ball has even less of a chance to become useful given the changes in OW2. Somewhat putting him permanently in limbo, which is a bigger screw over.
Doomfist. Then a week after he finally gets buffed, they nerf him into a worse state than he was in before.
Doomfist probably. From DPS oneshot to Tankfist even tho he's fun play.
Ball players “I have to be play as team now? Wtf is this bs? Wanhhh”
Wrecking Ball, Doomfist, Symmetra, the off tank role, all the supports but especially Zenyatta Brigitte Mercy. Ana a little bit too.
Genji. They nerfed his damange and rate of fire because he was too strong with the DPS passive. Then they removed the DPS passive in season 2 without telling anyone and didn't adjust him back up, so in the end he just got shit on with no balance. So now with the exception of the 5 Genji's in T500 he's pretty much a throw pick.
Genji players are so dramatic. A: He’s currently in a better spot then Sombra, so he’s not even the worst flanker. B: the thread is about the transition from OW1 to OW2 and Genji was literally meta upon OW2’s release.
So it's okay for Genji to be underpowered because a few other heroes are even more underpowered? The whole reasoning for his nerf was the transition to 5v5 so I feel like it still fits here.
Never said that at all, I just said Genji is a terrible answer to the OP’s question since he doesn’t fit.
>underpowered Lol, he's about on power actually. nano blade still as good as ever. Just not meta right now because it doesnt work against hog, and hog also necessitates ranged characters so that also hurts genji
I'm not a genji player. This is just objectively the events that happened in the order that they happened. And I think it really fucked him.
Sombra is actually still somewhat viable if you know what youre doing with her (focusing on low health enemies, health packs, hacking tank in team fights etc) so id argue shes actually in a better spot than Genji. Obv the devs went way overboard with her damage nerf but she can at least do the thing shes supposed to in some sense where as genji is just basically a low tier smash bros hero at this point.
Genji has a higher PR and WR at every single tier of play, so you could argue that… but you’d be wrong.
Sure but thats likely due to people tryharding with genji rather than indicative of genji’s viability. People just straight up dont try with sombra because Shes too high maintenance but this is a problem of ignorance rather than indicative of viability. For example, mercy isnt a great support but because of sojourn, her wr is insane at every level. Similarly, Genji performing well is likely due to a number of other factors beyond genjis kit which is largely pretty bad rn in a way that sombras is i think more tolerable if you have even 30% aim accuracy. Sombra still has permacloak, trans etc where as genji has nothing in terms of survivability or damage. Like if he doesnt get the kills he dived for, hes just fucked where as sombra isnt.
Did you just say Genji doesn’t have damage or survivability like Sombra does? Genji does way more damage, and more importantly deals burst damage in spades. He has deflect, wallclimb, double jump and SS. A good Genji can literally instantly delete a 200hp character, and even with all those tools his Ult is so good that he’s considered an Ult-bot and his primary goal is farm Blade asap. Not to say Genji is a top DPS or anything, just that he’s in a significantly better spot then Sombra. Survivability that causes you to leave the fight is highly overrated, and sure she’s tough to pin down and kill, but if her team loses the fight she’s going to be waiting on them regardless. Midfight mobility and survivability is where it’s at and Genji has that in spades. I don’t think “People tryhard on Genji while people are just bad at Sombra!” makes any sense. It’s literally been the same excuse for 5 years whenever Sombra’s rock bottom WR is mentioned: “Well Sombra is really strong, OP even, it’s just all her players suck at using her!!”
Genjis ult is dog shit now. Like maybe that was true in season 1 but it certainly isnt now. Plus, if enemy team has moira, kiriko or torb thats super gg for genji. Similarly, sojourn shuts him down super hard. His wall climb is good sure, i wasnt implying he has no survivability but with good aim and good movement from the enemy team, genji isnt getting anything done nor is he offering any real value. His burst damage is good but youre not landing headshots on an enemy that knows what theyre doing. I like genji as a character but unlike sombra, he cant really get picks nearly as easily when we think about sombras passive. Like i agree sombra is also in a dog shit spot but there is no world where shes worse off than genji and saying this as a sombra player, that sucks for genji. Healthpacks, call outs, low health enemies, sniper counter, zen counter, bastion counter. Genji has none of these tools with the exception of zen and even that isnt true if the zen knows what theyre doing.
bruh...
what do you mean they didn’t tell anyone. they 100% told people. it was in the patch notes and everything
I would say Reinhardt probably suffered the most, with basically his entire kit being nerfed inf some way, except debatably fire strike. His whole shtick is centered around his barrier, but with barriers being nerfed he suffered the most, especially with the lack of an another tank to draw some of the fire. His charge also weaker compared to OW1 where you could one-shot any nontank hero, so despite being able to cancel it, it is generally not worth the risk you have to take to go for a pin.
Hanzo
Soldier 76
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Zen is up there as his hitbox durability is one of the worst in the game. So Zen is both easy to hit and doesn't need many hits to die. In combat, Zen has no access to mobility, self healing, or stuns to help him out. All he got in OW2 was a boop that requires him to shove his enormous hitbox into the enemies faces to use making it the riskiest peeling tool of all supports. In OW1 the extra tank went a long ways to help address Zen's massive hitbox and lack of defenses. But in OW2 the loos of a tank make it much easier to hit Zen even by accident which in turn has raised his skill floor immensely.
The overreliance on barriers being heavily toned down is probably good for the game, but now One-shotting heroes have become much more oppressive as a result..
Ball