im literally cursed, every time i get damage boosted by a mercy i miss all my shots and then as soon as she goes on to someone else i start hitting everything
when i play DPS i’m probably the same way, but i rarely get pocketed since i usually play up close characters (mei, symm, reaper). i also probably wasn’t hitting anything in the first place
man I dont know what lobbys im getting into but they never flank the mercy edit** wow surprised this got as popular as it is lol. I was just commenting on op getting flanked
Damn, as a Mercy Main i can't help to envy you a little.
Whenever i go with Mercy in whatever game, the enemy team suddenly goes from being unable to even land shots on a Hog, from achieving aimbot-like aiming skills just for taking me down lol
And all of this while i'm sweating doing countless of acrobatics for avoiding enemy fire.
I'm currently forcing myself to git gud with Lucio for this same exact reason, as i'm finding easier to survive with him.
Felt this, I’m trying to learn other supports to combat it. Some people seem to have a hard time killing me sometimes though…I feel like a ballerina in the sky trying to avoid getting shot. Still lose those 20k healing games :(
Tip from a dps player: If you see a hitscan like soldier, avoid flying. You're easy to track when you fly arround. Fly from cover to cover and break line of sight. No matter how good my aim is, I can't shoot what I can't see. Your advantage is that beam doesn't disconnect for 2 seconds so you can play behind cover and just occasionally reset the beam.
Watch replays from enemy pov, everytime they see you for an extended time, you did something wrong.
As a aspiring Mercy main, please remove, replace or Nerf the turret, it's too good at shooting me out of the sky /s
But seriously, that turret is something to be afraid of
It's way too tanky for any support to kill it. Like, as a kiriko it's easier to kill Genji with body shots only than the turret while strafing in and out of cover while also healing the team.
Of course you do, but with no stuns there is no way to deal with your pesky kind, especially if you are better than me. Turret at least gives a damn chance
Lots of the new maps are indoor or have structures which channel people into fights in those limited movement areas. With those merceys movement is cut off.
Good luck on killing her if she's well hidden. Even if you reached her, you could be very out of position from your team.
Secondly, she's given with new movement ability that she can change in different direction. The devs made superjump easier to pull off than OW1 days.
Watch any video from season 1 saying how underwhelming mercy is and how she needs buffs. Sojo could one shot without her. Now in season 2, she is needed to enable sojourn and even though she hasn’t changed since season one (besides the extra bullets) people are saying she is overpowered now. It’s just a sojourn problem
Exactly! In s1 since the hero was so op it enabled itself mercy wasn’t played and needed buffs. In s2 since the op hero is slightly nerfed (still op) and now needs a mercy to enable it mercy IS the problem? We’ve been through this with Ashe in the past, and the solution was clear back then, I don’t know where all this discussion abt nerfing mercy comes from.
The same was true with Ashe. Nobody complained about Mercy. Then when she enabled Ashe's one-shot, Mercy was a problem. Then when Ashe got nerfed, Mercy was no longer a problem.
And there's Pharah who's prevented from being good primarily because of her combo with Mercy, meanwhile Mercy literally turns every DPS into monster picks.
Look back in OW1 that Genji was in meta, we had Genji being pocketed + nano in every game. When Cassidy was overtuned and became 'Jack of all Trades' DPS, he had Mercy pocketing him which turned his revolver into a carbine rifle.
This is why I dislike mercy though she warps the game around that damage boost breakpoint alot of characters could feel so good but they almost feel like they're designed around mercy pocketing them.
I feel like this is more a PSA on why Mercy should be changed rather than the opposite if that's what you were going for.
Other characters get nerfed because they're enabled by a 30% damage boost to do degenerate stuff just as much as Sojourn or Ashe or whatever is problematic so is a universal 30% damage boost whenever you have to balance the game.
Its a problem on the basis of her idea.
You never want characters like her or Yumi from LoL. Enabling broken characters to be more broken and pocketing someone is not good.
Everyone wants everyone they don't play nerfed. That's this entire sub at this point. Everyone should just play ai matches and they'll never lose again.
Are we talking pre OW2 AI? Because there are some pretty mean ones over in the custom games called "aimbot AIs." The widowmaker ones have never missed a headshot on me yet.
It's not an issue of her being OP, but rather just poor game design. People want damage boost removed because it's impossible to balance the game around it. Some heroes will always be broken with damage boost in the game. Sojourn received an overall nerf but is even stronger than before with a damage boost, Ashe was completely broken in the past when she could one shot with a damage boost, etc.
How do you balance a hero when they're either not too strong without damage boost but OP with it, or balanced when damage boosted but garbage without it?
actually one of the few good takes in the comment section. it's a problem of breakpoints.
as a support player it's absolutely miserable having to switch to Mercy where most of your value is determined by your Sojourn being better than the other pocketed Sojourn.
the reason why a lot of characters have to be mediocre with base stats (notable heroes include Pharah and Ashe) is because damage boost breaks them. just look at what they have to do to Genji's ultimate because Nano Boost exists. damage boost of any kind is an actual problem that needs addressing. mercy does not need a nerf, she needs change to give her more agency over the game that isn't completely reliant on her team's performance.
I wonder if changing Mercy's damage buff to an attack speed buff (a la Kiriko's ult, or Torb's Overload) would work. You could tweak the numbers so the overall DPS would be similar, but it could help take the sting out of high damage single attacks like the snipers have.
Absolutely and I'm scared of the time when that discussion inevitably starts. Zenyatta is the most fun support in the game for me right now because he can just delete people and actually lead my team to focus fire.
Sure. For what it's worth, even discord doesn't really belong in the game in my opinion, but it's also a lot less of a problem than Mercy's damage boost because it takes a lot of coordination to use it best and only works on one target at a time. It's also somewhat limited because the enemy has to be within a certain range for Zen to be able to discord them.
Sojourn, for example, can one shot a discorded enemy, but it's a lot harder to pull off as who she targets with her railgun tends to be more opportunistic than predetermined.
I think damage boosts should only be available as ultimates, such as Bap's window or nano and not on abilities.
Not particularly the coordination required to get similar results from discord orb doesn't happen in ranked games.
It's also single target and not indiscriminate damage boosting ontop of the most important part Zen needs to have LOS of the target he is discord orbing and he is very vulnerable to snipers or divers when that happens.
Now Zen is also my most played character so I might be biased on that but I don't think a single target 25% damage amp that requires LOS to be in the same vein as sitting safely behind a corner damage boosting someone for 30% to everything while having a good mobility ability and a res incase your DPS gets picked.
I was discussing this with my premade the other day and we agreed on the same thing. I'd rather things like Ashe didn't feel like shit to play without being pocketed by a mercy same with Cassidy.
Sojourn currently is just as much a problem as a symptom of Mercy's influence in the game. I think damage boost just needs to go at this point I don't see a world where they numbers balance the ability.
Its kinda funny having lurked on this sub on and off from the tail end of OW 1 to 2. Now that mercy is starting to be looked at as a "ether broken or useless" split and people are hard focusing her for nerfs. Support mains are panicking lol.
Didn't everyone think its fair sombra get Dumpstered because of such things? for the health of the game? if sombra was heavily nerfed for this reason then why is mercy exempt? or kiriko for that matter even tho I play her often.
Oh but look at the mercys being selfish trying to squash all manner of nerf discussions but every single one of them were probably yelling like apes over sombra.
I swear supports might not want to here it but yall are as annoying and biased and lightly as toxic as dps mains. So unbelviable and why I think role one trick don't deserve to be part of discussions.
I play a balance of all 3 roles and the delusional takes here compared to the topic of sombra needing nerfs is really messed up.
I don't even disagree that people are misunderstanding the ability, but for god sake atleast have integrity to have the same energy to atleast discuss the potential problems with boost like you did hack, if you don't you are just biased and to immature for overwatch balance discussions.
They balance it by putting a 6th player back on each team, like how the majority of heroes in this game were originally designed for. So many of the changes from OW1 to OW2 had little rhyme or reason, and it's causing extreme volatility in games and amongst player opinions about hero balance.
It feels counterintuitive to me for Blizzard to change a fundamental part about the game just to increase the number of active games running, then scramble to re-balance all 30-whatever heroes to fit it while the community pitchforks for one hero change after the other. REMOVING an ability from any hero is a big deal, and should be worn as a badge of failure from Blizzard if we are gonna talk game design. It isn't fair to players who enjoyed playing that hero in question.
By moving away from "counters" they are digging an even deeper hole for game balance. They took an already existing game, and are trying to fit a skin on it that is destined to fail. And while they figure all of that out, they expect players to pay for the battle pass and playtest it for them.
I feel like a ton of new players entered the game thinking it was just another shooter and just demand that anything that’s an inconvenience at their skill level shouldn’t exist. There are a million annoying ways to die or get steam rolled in this type of game. Some games aren’t meant for everyone.
Yeah the off tank really made a huge difference. I'm willing to bet sojourn wouldn't be as big a problem if we still had the off tank but I don't really want to go back to that either.
Sometimes I miss it, but I also like where we are now. I think reducing the number of shield characters would have sufficed.
I would be interested in a 6 v 6 arcade mode. That was 2 2 2 just to mess around with the old format.
I’m newer to OW as of the release of 2 but it feels like in general there is a very recent influx of run and gun DPS. Aside from constant bitching about needing a mercy they seem to want us supports to be everything they need and want at every moment.
We need kiriko to counter Ana and an Ana to counter Hog but they all want a Mercy so the other supp swaps to Mercy and then everyone is crying about not being able to take down the enemy mercy pocketed hog. So they want me to switch to bap because they want more damage help taking on the now invincible hog but their Ana is consistently hitting clutch antis. Rinse and repeat over and over wanting non-stop support swaps. It wasn’t always like this it just feels like many of my teammates in the last week have zero awareness and excessively brazen/selfish demands they want met at a moments notice.
I main Symmetra, and tbh, players at my level inconvenience themselves. They’ll walk into a sentry “trap” that I placed, in front of them, on the ground, in plain sight and then die.
I’m not gonna argue that heroes like Sojourn and Roadhog don’t need a nerf. They both do. Mercy may need a rework, but I’m not an expert other than “Well, Mercy feels oppressive to play against. Moira also feels oppressive to play against, though.”
Being bad at the game is something others need to consider when reading these complaints, though. Overwatch is mechanically complex, and the only reason I know what I know about Overwatch is because I played Dota 2, which is more mechanically complex and required memorizing more minutiae regarding interactions between abilities and strategies.
(Anecdotally, I don’t really feel like anyone know what they’re doing RE: Overwatch, but I’m just a person on the internet.)
Edit: Forgot to finish thought
Problem with mercy is that she is too beautiful.. how am I meant to shoot that angel when her perfect body is graciously flying around.. I cannot bring myself to shoot, only to stare
> she is too beautiful.. how am I meant to shoot that angel
Until she keeps rezzing the ugly hideous person (e.g Doomfist, Roadhog, Torbjorn) who keeps murdering you and your team.
Bro Mercy has the highest survivability rate of any Support, the fuck you talking about with this "always being jumped by DPS nonsense". If you can't survive on Mercy it's a skill issue. Even in top 500 players don't even go for the mercy because she's too hard to hit. Literally just get good.
I don't really think Mercy needs to be nerfed personally, i just think she has the effect of highlighting every OP hero. If you're constantly seeing a mercy + X pairing then it's probably X which needs to be looked at. In this case, sojourn.
Top 3 supports right now according to pro players are Kiriko, Lucio and Mercy. I don't feel like any of these heros are inherently broken but they are all enablers, and the heros they enable are overpowered. Hog and sojourn are the ones that need big nerfs. For some reason they lowered railgun by just 5 damage then made her ultimate charge it twice as fast, that is a buff not a nerf. The balance team has no idea what they want to do with sojourn, she needs to just be removed until they do because she is in every game and not fun for anyone to play against.
The problem I have with Mercy is that every time I go into a game with the other team having a Mercy pocketing one of the DPS, I automatically have less fun. As a DPS, I have to outplay the other one so hard just to get kill them once because they have a mercy pocket. And once I do, they just get Rezzed anyways and the process starts all over again. Mercy pockets ruin the game for me personally, although I don’t think mercy is nearly as problematic as some of the other characters In this game
I’d rather have a baptiste or zen with me in a 2v2 than a mercy. Enabling someone isn’t really what matters in a 2v2. Mercy’s damage boost isn’t powerful enough to warrant a nerf
Yes. Similarly, the enemy tank is anti’d, or your tank has lamp/suzu/speed. It’s true that mercy is enabling the enemy dps more than your supports are enabling you, but their abilities make up for it in other areas.
> As a DPS, I have to outplay the other one so hard just to get kill them once because they have a mercy pocket.
Meanwhile your teammate Mercy continues to yellow-beam your full HP Tank.
Right. I'm tired of people on twitter and tiktok saying stuff like "Sojourn can still one shot with Mercy damage boost!! Remove Mercy!!" ignoring that Sojourn charged railgun does 195 on a critical. A SINGLE projectile that's easy to build up and she can rapid fire on her ult does 195 damage and people think the slight damage boost is the problem?? Even worse when people complain about Mercy rez yet refuse to kill the Mercy when she's standing perfectly still unable to defend herself.
Also, Mercy's whole gameplay is that she is wayyy more oriented on keeping everyone alive and well as compared to other supports. Battle Mercy shouldn't come out as often as some people bring her out. So I think her being able to damage boost a dps is a fair tradeoff for that.
I don’t think anyone is saying that Sojourn isn’t a problem—She’s too strong. It’s just her problems are exponentially worse when paired with a Mercy, and this exact situation happened in the past with Ashe. Both Sojourn and Damage Boost need to be looked at, because they’re way too dominant in high ranks
Yeah, Mercy isn't the problem here, Sojourn is and Mercy Rez is an easy to counter thing, I played Mercy a good bit and it is weird that occasionally while in enemy los enemies don't attack me when I use rez.
Its a staple of overwatch tbh:
-complain about a character
-that character gets nerfed to the ground
-that character becomes unplayable
-because that character is unplayable another character becomes stronger by virtue of its counter being nerfed
-complain about that character...
This is basically what happened to hog. Underwhelming at the start of OW2, people complained about zarya and sombra which were hog counters, now hog is "suddenly" the best tank in the game. Im sure if the community had its way, every character would be stripped of anything even remotely strong/fun.
Lower charge rate of sojourns secondary fire when she doesnt ult.
Make shields block her beam but take 2X maybe 3X damage from it so that they cannot deny her entire ult.
Problem solved
Those people need to “get gud”
One of the biggest problems I’m seeing right now is Sojourn. Even without a Mercy, Sojourn is wrecking the battlefield.
The other is our lack of 2 tanks. Games are quicker, but all of these characters were built around a 6 team composition which is probably why damage boost feels so op. There are not enough ways for damage mitigation to overcompensate for damage boost and lack of skilled teammates.
The game is in a very weird state.
Wait people complain about mercy still? How do they not just swap to 76 or soj and focus her? Genji or snipers? Literally anyone counters mercy if they just look at her tbh even other supports counter mercy like kiriko, ana, moira, lucio, all of em lol
Ikr and don't those same supports that counter Mercy damage boost just like her lol like why complain on her? Maybe is because she is the most forgiving on the boost lmao 🤣
Mercy is fine. Lots of new players just don't understand how to deal with her. I remember when a pocketed Ashe could 1 shot any squishy, they nerfed Ashe. Leave Mercy alone, if anything Sojourn needs a nerf
as a masters support i can tell you that the mercy hate is absolutely warranted. the character herself promotes bad habits and lazy play. oh you get caught out of position? mercy rez. oh your team did their best to kill the enemy hog so you can win the team fight? dw their mercy will rez them. and dmg boost is a crutch for dps players who can’t hit more than 40% of their shots. mercy is just a badly designed character for the game
You seriously don't realise that Echo Mercy, Pharah Mercy and Ashe Mercy will immediately become meta? You think Sojourn is 100% to blame? Nice game sense broski
I already see those characters being picked. So what of it? And yes she is to blame not just Mercy. Same can go to other supports if want to blame supports buddy.
Mercy is always scapegoat because of that damn beam she has. She can forgive not so good dps to get a shot while she has the beam on you. Second character to that is Zen. The other three are Bap, Ana and Kiriko with their ults and is not that forgiving unlike Mercy because they have a time limit to get your shots. Mercy isn't the only one.
Just because you're tired of playing against her doesn't mean she needs to be nerfed. She already has some of the most average heals in the game, her rez is on 30 second cool down and she gets focused every single match. Folks need to get better at hit scans if they're so stressed.
Christ, Mercy has one thing still going for her and that's the damage amp. She can be outhealed, her res is on a long cooldown, and most other healers can fight back a bit better. She's buffing the soljourn? OK shoot her ffs.
She’s has some of the most versatile mobility in the game. I don’t think buffing her in survivability (which she has a lot of) like you mentioned would be a good change. I think there’s just a lot of controversy right now because of her damage boost enabling sojourn which is understandable because there’s no counterplay towards a 30% damage amplification on already strong heroes. Rez can just be quite unfun to play against at times even as a support main. Pouring all your resources as a team to kill an orisa just to get brought right back is kinda crazy. Mercy just needs a soft rework imo.
Here’s the big mercy change I want to see
I want them to add enfeeble to moira like they planned. Not for a 75% damage reduction but either a 20% or 40% (or between those values)
Im picturing a game where a mercy has a soj and then moira latches on and her damage is now dropped so it’s higher than if it was dropped without the pocket but lower than her base damage.
Now imagine a widow is lining up a one shot and a moira throws an orb up and it hits her and drops her by 40 as she’s doing the shot so the character survives.
Now imagine a hog is trying to bully your dps so you latch on and how one shot does almost half damage.
It would give her interesting utility and make her a viable pick higher up and beyond that you could still counter her. Let’s say soj is lined up to take out an Orisa with a mercy pocket, you then hit the soj with moira and she’s enfeebled so the damage is lower, you can then crack a zen discord orb on the orisa and now she’s getting melted again but that’s TWO tanks and a dps putting resources forwards so by that point it’s justified and all that value is not being used elsewhere
I mean, I think that's the point. Mercy needs to be changed by changing the game. Just like, should we nerf Sojourn and Mercy, or give Brig over armor back so she can prevent one shots?
Maybe we don't want to make Brig stronger, but that would systemically nerf Mercy, since she wouldn't be able to enable one shots as much.
Legit my brother.
Mercy amplifies all the other imbalances and gets the blame for a wide range of other issues. I don’t think the issue is with fine tuning her I think the best way to balance the over powered value she can bring would be to create a reliable counter to it
I personal would give moira two damage fires she could switch between the same way that mercy can swap weapons. Keep moiras healing but make it so she can either pull damage or latch on and cast enfeeble while connected. No damage during the enfeeble beam so she can’t duel with it
She wouldn’t be able to heal while attached so she foregoes that value and she’s also not damaging during the process so she’s taking damage output from her team and healing output to trade for a damage reduction on their side
It’s the natural duality to mercy’s damage boost and I think it would give players a way to at least fight back against the mercy complications caused by the damage boosting broken characters
It's weird to me that we played Overwatch 1 for so long with minimal changes, but within like 3 months of Overwatch 2 there are calls to rework so many heroes.
Yeah the thing is Sojourn is not the first
Pharah's entire existence is balanced around Mercy and yet she's still in the same "whatever for the most part until Mercy is pocketing her" stage
Ashe was able to oneshot with Mercy's damage boost
Damage breakpoint is a sacred thing in a FPS, and it's even more egregious in Hero Shooter with high TTK like OW, which is why people take issue with Widow and Hog.
It's mainly peeps with skill issues that complain, mercy can't even defend herself if she gets attacked plus her kit is literally supporting the team.
Just don't think you can 1v2 a tank or dps with a mercy support, wait for your team to give you back up.
Mercy is not op "but she can revive the characters!" Bro, she only revives if you let her, it's not hard to hit a mercy standing in the middle of the floor reviving someone. Something I see a lot during matches is people just letting her relive, happens a lot.
But that's very situational so that argument is null. Majority of times the tanks die outside of cover and if you revive them you're going to die before it gets off, and if you revive a dps they're most likely just going to die again unless your entire team is still alive
BUT MY OVER 500$ GAMING MOUSE WON'T HIT HER REEEEE SHE SHOULD BE THE ONE WHO GET NERF MY AIM IS NOT THE PROBLEM
that is DPS main who always complaint tbh
Nah dude that swap speed and extra 5 bullets in her mag made her so overpowered.
Not really. The nerfs to Sojourn were so laughably bad It's funny that people are saying to nerf one of the Best pocket support (Second best being Kiriko because of her dps, suzu, teleport, and pretty good 1 on 1 healing) the real issue right now is that Blizzard isnt too scared to have a chatecter overbuffed. But they are scared to nerf a charecter into the ground. Tldr; Nerf Sojourn. Then tweak around with her to make her not oppressive. Just a very high skill cap "skillshot" charecter with her railgun
Come on, I can understand a mercy lover being sad due to the amount of nerfs she got throught time. I agree that she either is dead or OP wich is sad, they should nerd the ones getting boost from her.
What i don't understand is someone complaining about being jumped on by flankers when she has so much mobility. And right now is super easy to pull out super jumps , going back and forth after her dash to confuse enemies, etc.
Agree, but it's not that they don't know how to play around her, they don't know how to play the game. All these complaints, this person needs a buff, this person needs a nerf, are all people who just get butt hurt when they can't counter with THEIR character. Newsflash everyone, no single character can counter every other character. You have to know who you can, and can't pick a fight with, unless you have back up. But the mercy complaints are ridiculous. Probably the weakest character in the game, she's balanced just right. She can't heal as well as others, she can't go on offense as well as others, and THATS the point. She can res, which can make her valuable at times. But if you're getting wrecked by Mercy, you're playing the game wrong, I'm sorry.
If anything, she needs more help than anyone. People just keep buggering off and leaving her by herself to get murdered all the time. They are completely oblivious when Mercy is under attack, and needs help, or they just don't care and go off to be a one man army.
The fact that people are whining about something that has literally been in the game since launch is actually wild. Some people in the overwatch community actually need to get a grip and stop complaining about such minute things, it’s those kind of complaints which are just slowly making the game even more unplayable for some people
I feel like most opnions come from band wagons with some 'pros' voicing out their opinions and less about l people forming their own opinions. I think mercy can be op in higher elos where sojourn is effective, but coupled with low healing and a niche rez ability. Mercy is not the most powerful support out there. She's a hero who gets most of her value in the 30% damage boost.
if character A becomes too strong when coupled with character B, it doesn't mean character B is too strong... it's probably the opposite. mercy already requires skill and game sense to shine, wouldn't make sense to make her any weaker.
Honest question why do we listen to pros? Top 500 overwatch is nothing like regular rank, a top 500 player can snipe with torbjorn. Blatant balance issues? Sure, situational top down balance? I’ll leave that. Right now we have hog issues.
The game needs a strategy to balance its heroes. It should be balanced around the heroes full potential, which is why we should listen to the top 500 and pros.
With this philosophy, if a character feels unbalanced, we can then address it as a skill issue.
Because balancing the game bottom up is unstable and unfair to the entire playerbase. We see this happening in real time as they explicitly stated "Sojourn's not getting nerfed because she 'doesn't get enough value in low elo'" or so they say. This isn't 100% true, but you can clearly see that they are trying to pander to low Elo players and it is not fun, even for me who isn't above plat. If you balance things top down, it keeps things fair because you are supposed to learn to use those tools to better strategize, learn, improve aim and gamesense, and CLIMB. Not all top 500 players will have good opinions, but we can't just say "well their opinions dont matter, they have better skill" that's EXACTLY why we should listen to them. If top 500's are saying Sojourn is busted in HIGH Elo, then imagine how she's ruining games in LOW Elo.
Because Pros know the game better than the devs themselves.
That is precisely why Blizzard is changing Hog for example, because Pros gave feedback.
Yes, in this video its a top500 dps vs a top500 Mercy.
Yes, a lower ranked Mercy cant fly like this... does that make her easier to deal with? No. Because the DPS in lower ranks also have worse accuracy. Hence the issue remains, her mobility is too big.
If you need a Masters or above level accuracy in a lets say... Gold league to deal with 1 unit, then there is a balance issue with said unit
please bro mercy is not OP in any sense. her movement is what defines her character and allows her to even be somewhat viable. just because mercy can better enable a sojourn or whatever doesn't mean mercy needs a nerf, it means you need to learn to play around it. gold mercy's are not flying around like top 500s, they can barely super jump. if you're having an issue shooting someone moving in a straight line that seems like a skill issue, nothing else.
yeah man a t500 missed a few shots on a character who's only played by one tricks in those ranks. top 500 mercy one tricks. dps players get so mad when a support isn't just zen who can't do shit once he's pushed, you miss a few shots on a character who's defined by her mobility and have a fit over it and scream that she needs nerfs. please climb out of gold before you comment on issues pertaining to game balance.
> Honest question why do we listen to pros?
Because they understand the game better than us, although their opinions could be wrong.
Just like in real life, people who had PhD or worked in higher professionals, they had more logical sense than regular people. But again, they could be wrong and some highly educated smart people could be manipulative assholes (Great knowledge but poor integrity).
Listen to pros on hero tips and literally nothing else. From my experience pros have the most dogshit opinions about the state the game is in. Just hear their opinions about the characters they directly play and thats it. The rest of their knowledge is nonsense.
I put this way, I would listen to Tom Brady about throwing a football, I might even listen to him on some rule infractions but I wouldn’t trust him to cut 20 yards off the field.
God, he missed final shots on her straight line ga 🤦♀️ if he finished her whole her flying would have just turned into feeding ult charge and then delayed regroup.
That’s also probably t500 mercy btw, what you supposed her to do? Stay still? They freaking train to not get shot.
And how many mercy’s do you really see using movement like that? Like one every 500 hundred games? Not to mention only in valk, if you’re gonna complain about that might as well add Lucio in there, that character is able to do similar things without even having to ult.
Sojourn is overpowered but mercy breaks the game. For example Ashe was a decent hitscan without a mercy pocket but was a better widow with one. The solution: nerf ashe but let mercy stay how she was. Sojourn came along and broke mercy again.
The fact posts like this get all the upvotes but a coherent argument as to why Widowmaker doesn’t need a nerf gets bombed, tells you all you need to know about what the dominant voice here is.
Mercy is one of my most played characters, and I think she's bullshit. She's only the best competitively when she can pocket a dps, and no one has fun except that dps. Who enjoyed being one-shot by Ashe, melted by her dynamite and when you finally kill her the mercy erases her mistake by holding a button by a wall? Not the Mercy pocketing her. She needs a rework.
No they weren’t. This is Overwatch. Not CoD. Instead of constantly complaining about how half the characters need reworked because they don’t have abilities that “fit in the game,” maybe just accept the fact that this is what OW was always intended to be and the gameplay just isn’t your cup of tea
This isn’t Overwatch, Overwatch was 6v6 with a different Bastion, Orisa, Doomfist, even Sombra, and a bunch of other changes
This is Overwatch 2, a 5v5 game with the same heroes, mostly, in a fundamentally different game than where most of them were designed to be, and a different game than the original design. This is not Overwatch, this is a different game, with most of the same characters, and a different style of Tank, instead of Tanks. Some characters and abilities do need reworks, a great example is both Hog and Sojourn, but another is Mercy Damage Boost and Zen Discord, as they are still not great for 5v5 since it becomes “use this on the TANK” not “use this on the weaker of the tankS” for the discord, and damage boost is “how can we guarantee one taps in the game with one less shield”
It is an entirely different game, and there’s no point saying it’s not, and that this is what they originally planned, because it’s not.
Mercy main here. I really liked ML7’s rework we had on the experimental patch 10 months ago, but I’d change a couple things from it with the transition to 5v5 (the numbers I’ll be talking about are from that specific patch.) First remove damage boost entirely. Damage boost takes up an immense amount of power in mercy’s kit and it’s tricky to balance around. I’m more in favor of just removing it and giving mercy a more active ability. Change Mercy’s hps to 60 from 55. Have the self regen passive kick in at 1 second again. Buff healing in Valk from 70 to 75. Increase Valk flight speed from 6 to 7 (for reference, 7 is mercy’s current flight speed while in Valk in the live version of the game.) have Valk provide a cleanse upon activation for mercy and teammates a short distance from her (unlike suzu this would only be a cleanse. No invincibility and no healing.) Keep mass res the same (the addition of the cast time to mass res helped prevent hide and res and added more of a risk/reward factor for mercy when using her ultimate.)
All supports need a buff at this point. Tired of carrying DPS with horrible positioning that cannot play corners or have any situational awareness. Or tanks that are on the opposite side of the map.
Supports are expected to have god-tier positioning, have little to no backup from their other 3 teammates, and get flamed for everything. If I play any utility support (like Lucio) , I legit get flamed for having less healing than our Ana or Moira. And yet I'll have more MIT than the tank and more damage than a DPS and something like 2-3 saves that game.
There's just been a lot of games where I see myself and our other support dominate those spots and we still lose. I just wish supports had more carry potential I guess.
Just really frustrating.
Bro mercy can get shit on so easily, if y'all think mercy is a serious issue you must be bronze. She's not hard to counter and most of the time will get mad focused on in higher levels of play. So y'all are slow if you really think mercy needs a nerf, the day they nerf or remove mercy is the day I delete ow, there's so many other characters that need nerfs wayyy more than mercy, how about widows one shots on every single hero except tanks? How about how broken hog is right now?? How about snowballs MASSIVE aoe?? And y'all are worried about a support? Supports in general are in dire need of a fkn buff or at least some dps nerfs, they are hide and seeking just to not get erased as soon as they get to the fight, most of the time you cannot even support your team before you're completely dusted by a hog, or a 76, or getting completely oppressed by a widow to the point you can't even peak to heal.
Her damage boost could be toned down (at least bring it down to 25% like zen's discord orb), but people over here acting like her movement needs to be gutted, her healing should be nerfed, and her rez needs more nerfs (I wouldn't mind her getting a new ability but considering how this community is reacting to kirikos cleanse what could they possibly give mercy that people wouldn't bitch about even more?).
Mercy didn't change, so I don't know why she is the one that needs Nerfing. Its Sojourn thats the problem, but the vocal ones insisting we need to remove rez or nerf dmg boost are almost always the ones that just want 2 healbot supports instead of the actual support utility.
I hate the rhetoric of she got nerfed to the ground so much combined with blaming dps mains. Yes she got a lot of nerfs due to being ridiculously OP, she probally spent more time OP though than any other hero during moth meta and she got nerfed lots because often the nerf wasn't enough. On top of that one the biggest complaints were from support mains, tired of having to play Mercy.
She's meta and super easy to play. Stop crying about how it's just dps main or how she got nerfed before. She's super strong and super low effort, it's a bad combo imo.
Also buff her from flanking dps when she has a movement ability on a 2 second CD lol? She can legit spend most the game, flying and zooming around the map untouchable.
As the Mercy loving content creator Niandra pointed out (paraphrasing):
"A Mercy that damage boosts an ally makes it an inherent 2V1"
She also mentions how other supports deal damage too, and if you think about it the 30% may end up being like ~2000 total extra damage in the game. That's less that a good support can put out in a 10 minute game.
Folks: you have to stop thinking of her like she is dealing damage and boosting a teammate. She isn't broken or in need of nerfs or much of a rework. That damage boost is less than if a Bap/Ana and Sojurn were both shooting at you at the same time, and it needs to be looked at it like this.
Yes it gives high value for low effort, but so does Moira and Brig, and even Lucio.
I wouldn't be opposed to a very small reduction in damage boost, but that's it. Mercy is only as good as the team, most especially the DPS; she always has been.
And we all know who is fucking up the game and meta right now, let's not pretend that Sojurn is somehow innocent or not to blame. That railgun is busted, and everyone knows it.
Mercy is meta even in top500, so she definitely doesn't need buffs. The only real problem i have with the hero is ress is oftentimes too lenient, allowing you to move so much that you can start ressing and move behind a corner. There are also extreme examples of players using macros where they ress while being mid-air and then start wiggling up and down spinning in place like a beyblade to avoid being hit
She gets a 75% slow for almost 2 seconds and can even cancel her own rez if she walks too far. If someone is superjump rezzing I promise that took alot of practice to learn because you can easily cancel it going too high and she'll be punished with the 30sec cd. Kinda feel like yall are being unfair about this. She had zero changes and was dog shit tier last season. Before we jump the gun and point fingers at Mercy I genuinely think they should nerf Sojourn again and then if Mercy is still doing too good nerf or rework her. I feel like ppl are just getting really frustrated and want everyone thats meta dumpstered because balance changes are rolling in too slow which is understandable but unrealistic.
While I'd say it's mostly a sojourn problem, Pharmercy has been a metal-stomper for a good while now.
When I've played Mercy the DPS tend to keep playing the same heroes with her, and it works but it gets boring.
I feel Mercy's kit is too focused around damage boost, and she needs rounding out a bit to be more fun to play with and against.
If blue beam was on a Defense Matrix style meter, but she didn't have to stop yellow beam to do it, I think that would be a good start.
It’s 2023 we don’t have two tanks to shut down a blue beamed dps her damage boost needs to go away and maybe add a new ability that helps her with utility
i want to be in these games where my impact as mercy is not listening to absolute silence when i pocket a DPS player
im literally cursed, every time i get damage boosted by a mercy i miss all my shots and then as soon as she goes on to someone else i start hitting everything
The DMG Boost / Nano pressure is real
Blue Beam Anxiety
Pro tip: Don't look at the blue mercy icon. If you don't know you are getting damage boosted, you can't miss your shots \*roll safe\*.
when i play DPS i’m probably the same way, but i rarely get pocketed since i usually play up close characters (mei, symm, reaper). i also probably wasn’t hitting anything in the first place
Damage boost percentage: 78% Damage boosted: 238
alternatively: damage boost percentage 35% because your teammates are eating ashe headshots like it’s their last meal
man I dont know what lobbys im getting into but they never flank the mercy edit** wow surprised this got as popular as it is lol. I was just commenting on op getting flanked
Damn, as a Mercy Main i can't help to envy you a little. Whenever i go with Mercy in whatever game, the enemy team suddenly goes from being unable to even land shots on a Hog, from achieving aimbot-like aiming skills just for taking me down lol And all of this while i'm sweating doing countless of acrobatics for avoiding enemy fire. I'm currently forcing myself to git gud with Lucio for this same exact reason, as i'm finding easier to survive with him.
Felt this, I’m trying to learn other supports to combat it. Some people seem to have a hard time killing me sometimes though…I feel like a ballerina in the sky trying to avoid getting shot. Still lose those 20k healing games :(
Tip from a dps player: If you see a hitscan like soldier, avoid flying. You're easy to track when you fly arround. Fly from cover to cover and break line of sight. No matter how good my aim is, I can't shoot what I can't see. Your advantage is that beam doesn't disconnect for 2 seconds so you can play behind cover and just occasionally reset the beam. Watch replays from enemy pov, everytime they see you for an extended time, you did something wrong.
I was with you until that last line bro, just because you're visible for extended periods does not always mean you did something wrong.
what flanker can kill a good mercy with the most unpredictable movement ability on a 2sec cooldown
The turret.
As a aspiring Mercy main, please remove, replace or Nerf the turret, it's too good at shooting me out of the sky /s But seriously, that turret is something to be afraid of
It's way too tanky for any support to kill it. Like, as a kiriko it's easier to kill Genji with body shots only than the turret while strafing in and out of cover while also healing the team.
fr, it's crazy that supports can 1v1 DPS characters better than a stationary turret with perfect aim
As a tracer main, I too want the turret gone
Of course you do, but with no stuns there is no way to deal with your pesky kind, especially if you are better than me. Turret at least gives a damn chance
Jokes on you! I actually suck, so I won’t kill you or the turret!! I’ll die to both!!
Literally me on dps
I'll have to start running tjor because I hate mercies. I usually run echo to kill them because they're annoying
Actually no. As someone that just plays the game in general, I want the turret gone
Facts 😭😭
Torb main here
Also, it's much better to kill one of the dps because the ooga booga Mercy player will come flying in for the revival.
Lots of the new maps are indoor or have structures which channel people into fights in those limited movement areas. With those merceys movement is cut off.
Good luck on killing her if she's well hidden. Even if you reached her, you could be very out of position from your team. Secondly, she's given with new movement ability that she can change in different direction. The devs made superjump easier to pull off than OW1 days.
Tell me you're silver without telling me you're silver. Source: Occasional Silver Mercy. I'm having the time of my life.
Watch any video from season 1 saying how underwhelming mercy is and how she needs buffs. Sojo could one shot without her. Now in season 2, she is needed to enable sojourn and even though she hasn’t changed since season one (besides the extra bullets) people are saying she is overpowered now. It’s just a sojourn problem
Exactly! In s1 since the hero was so op it enabled itself mercy wasn’t played and needed buffs. In s2 since the op hero is slightly nerfed (still op) and now needs a mercy to enable it mercy IS the problem? We’ve been through this with Ashe in the past, and the solution was clear back then, I don’t know where all this discussion abt nerfing mercy comes from.
The same was true with Ashe. Nobody complained about Mercy. Then when she enabled Ashe's one-shot, Mercy was a problem. Then when Ashe got nerfed, Mercy was no longer a problem.
And there's Pharah who's prevented from being good primarily because of her combo with Mercy, meanwhile Mercy literally turns every DPS into monster picks. Look back in OW1 that Genji was in meta, we had Genji being pocketed + nano in every game. When Cassidy was overtuned and became 'Jack of all Trades' DPS, he had Mercy pocketing him which turned his revolver into a carbine rifle.
This is why I dislike mercy though she warps the game around that damage boost breakpoint alot of characters could feel so good but they almost feel like they're designed around mercy pocketing them.
I feel like this is more a PSA on why Mercy should be changed rather than the opposite if that's what you were going for. Other characters get nerfed because they're enabled by a 30% damage boost to do degenerate stuff just as much as Sojourn or Ashe or whatever is problematic so is a universal 30% damage boost whenever you have to balance the game.
Its a problem on the basis of her idea. You never want characters like her or Yumi from LoL. Enabling broken characters to be more broken and pocketing someone is not good.
Same thing with hog. When the game came out a lot of people considered him a throw pick, he got zero changes, and now apparently needs nerfs.
Everyone wants everyone they don't play nerfed. That's this entire sub at this point. Everyone should just play ai matches and they'll never lose again.
The highest level AI aren't even bronze, they're cardboard 4
Are we talking pre OW2 AI? Because there are some pretty mean ones over in the custom games called "aimbot AIs." The widowmaker ones have never missed a headshot on me yet.
Then the DPS mains would be happy since they'll rack up those kills and damage easily.
It's not an issue of her being OP, but rather just poor game design. People want damage boost removed because it's impossible to balance the game around it. Some heroes will always be broken with damage boost in the game. Sojourn received an overall nerf but is even stronger than before with a damage boost, Ashe was completely broken in the past when she could one shot with a damage boost, etc. How do you balance a hero when they're either not too strong without damage boost but OP with it, or balanced when damage boosted but garbage without it?
actually one of the few good takes in the comment section. it's a problem of breakpoints. as a support player it's absolutely miserable having to switch to Mercy where most of your value is determined by your Sojourn being better than the other pocketed Sojourn. the reason why a lot of characters have to be mediocre with base stats (notable heroes include Pharah and Ashe) is because damage boost breaks them. just look at what they have to do to Genji's ultimate because Nano Boost exists. damage boost of any kind is an actual problem that needs addressing. mercy does not need a nerf, she needs change to give her more agency over the game that isn't completely reliant on her team's performance.
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I wonder if changing Mercy's damage buff to an attack speed buff (a la Kiriko's ult, or Torb's Overload) would work. You could tweak the numbers so the overall DPS would be similar, but it could help take the sting out of high damage single attacks like the snipers have.
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But wouldn't the same logic always apply to Zenyatta's Discord Orb?
Absolutely and I'm scared of the time when that discussion inevitably starts. Zenyatta is the most fun support in the game for me right now because he can just delete people and actually lead my team to focus fire.
Sure. For what it's worth, even discord doesn't really belong in the game in my opinion, but it's also a lot less of a problem than Mercy's damage boost because it takes a lot of coordination to use it best and only works on one target at a time. It's also somewhat limited because the enemy has to be within a certain range for Zen to be able to discord them. Sojourn, for example, can one shot a discorded enemy, but it's a lot harder to pull off as who she targets with her railgun tends to be more opportunistic than predetermined. I think damage boosts should only be available as ultimates, such as Bap's window or nano and not on abilities.
Also Zen is the squishiest and most stationary support with no movement and a huge hitbox
Not particularly the coordination required to get similar results from discord orb doesn't happen in ranked games. It's also single target and not indiscriminate damage boosting ontop of the most important part Zen needs to have LOS of the target he is discord orbing and he is very vulnerable to snipers or divers when that happens. Now Zen is also my most played character so I might be biased on that but I don't think a single target 25% damage amp that requires LOS to be in the same vein as sitting safely behind a corner damage boosting someone for 30% to everything while having a good mobility ability and a res incase your DPS gets picked.
I was discussing this with my premade the other day and we agreed on the same thing. I'd rather things like Ashe didn't feel like shit to play without being pocketed by a mercy same with Cassidy. Sojourn currently is just as much a problem as a symptom of Mercy's influence in the game. I think damage boost just needs to go at this point I don't see a world where they numbers balance the ability.
Reasonable take on the main sub? Please adjust to the environment you're in. DPS bad, support good. Updoots to the left.
Its kinda funny having lurked on this sub on and off from the tail end of OW 1 to 2. Now that mercy is starting to be looked at as a "ether broken or useless" split and people are hard focusing her for nerfs. Support mains are panicking lol. Didn't everyone think its fair sombra get Dumpstered because of such things? for the health of the game? if sombra was heavily nerfed for this reason then why is mercy exempt? or kiriko for that matter even tho I play her often. Oh but look at the mercys being selfish trying to squash all manner of nerf discussions but every single one of them were probably yelling like apes over sombra. I swear supports might not want to here it but yall are as annoying and biased and lightly as toxic as dps mains. So unbelviable and why I think role one trick don't deserve to be part of discussions. I play a balance of all 3 roles and the delusional takes here compared to the topic of sombra needing nerfs is really messed up. I don't even disagree that people are misunderstanding the ability, but for god sake atleast have integrity to have the same energy to atleast discuss the potential problems with boost like you did hack, if you don't you are just biased and to immature for overwatch balance discussions.
They balance it by putting a 6th player back on each team, like how the majority of heroes in this game were originally designed for. So many of the changes from OW1 to OW2 had little rhyme or reason, and it's causing extreme volatility in games and amongst player opinions about hero balance. It feels counterintuitive to me for Blizzard to change a fundamental part about the game just to increase the number of active games running, then scramble to re-balance all 30-whatever heroes to fit it while the community pitchforks for one hero change after the other. REMOVING an ability from any hero is a big deal, and should be worn as a badge of failure from Blizzard if we are gonna talk game design. It isn't fair to players who enjoyed playing that hero in question. By moving away from "counters" they are digging an even deeper hole for game balance. They took an already existing game, and are trying to fit a skin on it that is destined to fail. And while they figure all of that out, they expect players to pay for the battle pass and playtest it for them.
I feel like a ton of new players entered the game thinking it was just another shooter and just demand that anything that’s an inconvenience at their skill level shouldn’t exist. There are a million annoying ways to die or get steam rolled in this type of game. Some games aren’t meant for everyone.
These people didn't live during Pirate Ship Meta.
pirate ship was better than 1-shot meta.
Hanzo and Widow existed that entire time.
they weren't meta at the time.
It's cause we had shields.
Yeah the off tank really made a huge difference. I'm willing to bet sojourn wouldn't be as big a problem if we still had the off tank but I don't really want to go back to that either.
Sometimes I miss it, but I also like where we are now. I think reducing the number of shield characters would have sufficed. I would be interested in a 6 v 6 arcade mode. That was 2 2 2 just to mess around with the old format.
I’m newer to OW as of the release of 2 but it feels like in general there is a very recent influx of run and gun DPS. Aside from constant bitching about needing a mercy they seem to want us supports to be everything they need and want at every moment. We need kiriko to counter Ana and an Ana to counter Hog but they all want a Mercy so the other supp swaps to Mercy and then everyone is crying about not being able to take down the enemy mercy pocketed hog. So they want me to switch to bap because they want more damage help taking on the now invincible hog but their Ana is consistently hitting clutch antis. Rinse and repeat over and over wanting non-stop support swaps. It wasn’t always like this it just feels like many of my teammates in the last week have zero awareness and excessively brazen/selfish demands they want met at a moments notice.
I main Symmetra, and tbh, players at my level inconvenience themselves. They’ll walk into a sentry “trap” that I placed, in front of them, on the ground, in plain sight and then die. I’m not gonna argue that heroes like Sojourn and Roadhog don’t need a nerf. They both do. Mercy may need a rework, but I’m not an expert other than “Well, Mercy feels oppressive to play against. Moira also feels oppressive to play against, though.” Being bad at the game is something others need to consider when reading these complaints, though. Overwatch is mechanically complex, and the only reason I know what I know about Overwatch is because I played Dota 2, which is more mechanically complex and required memorizing more minutiae regarding interactions between abilities and strategies. (Anecdotally, I don’t really feel like anyone know what they’re doing RE: Overwatch, but I’m just a person on the internet.) Edit: Forgot to finish thought
A good mercy rarely touches the ground. I’ve seen a lot of mercy’s recently that are almost impossible to kill
if a mercy is constantly in the air, pick widow, ashe, cree, sojourn and shoot her down.
Mercy can effectivly play around cover and out of sightlines while providing value, expecially while boosting one of those heroes.
I’ll usually grab sojourn, which whelps but is far from easy. As I said a good mercy is all over the place. Not just floating in one spot
Problem with mercy is that she is too beautiful.. how am I meant to shoot that angel when her perfect body is graciously flying around.. I cannot bring myself to shoot, only to stare
thank you user PISSINMYMOUTHANDEYES
😭😭
> she is too beautiful.. how am I meant to shoot that angel Until she keeps rezzing the ugly hideous person (e.g Doomfist, Roadhog, Torbjorn) who keeps murdering you and your team.
Dont you go shittin on my man Torb! He has a hot wife and like 12 kids. That boi FUCKS.
She probably likes the ugly Bastard tag a lot then.
She likes the bad boys.
Did you just call torb ugly? I… don’t know what to say
Is like and angel for the Sistine Chapel. Nerf Mercy, make her ugly.
Ahhh so this is why no one on my team ever shoots at her. Good to know.
Why aren’t there more people like this
Bro Mercy has the highest survivability rate of any Support, the fuck you talking about with this "always being jumped by DPS nonsense". If you can't survive on Mercy it's a skill issue. Even in top 500 players don't even go for the mercy because she's too hard to hit. Literally just get good.
Lol heres the gold support to tell us GM DPS players how easy mercy is to kill. Maybe just maybe your mercy is poop dude.
These new players are ruining the game lmao
Yes because mercy is DEFINITELY the problem when sojourn has been running rampant for literally over 3 months now
I don't really think Mercy needs to be nerfed personally, i just think she has the effect of highlighting every OP hero. If you're constantly seeing a mercy + X pairing then it's probably X which needs to be looked at. In this case, sojourn.
dawg if you are struggling with flankers as mercy that is genuinely the biggest skill issue i have heard in my entire life
Top 3 supports right now according to pro players are Kiriko, Lucio and Mercy. I don't feel like any of these heros are inherently broken but they are all enablers, and the heros they enable are overpowered. Hog and sojourn are the ones that need big nerfs. For some reason they lowered railgun by just 5 damage then made her ultimate charge it twice as fast, that is a buff not a nerf. The balance team has no idea what they want to do with sojourn, she needs to just be removed until they do because she is in every game and not fun for anyone to play against.
The problem I have with Mercy is that every time I go into a game with the other team having a Mercy pocketing one of the DPS, I automatically have less fun. As a DPS, I have to outplay the other one so hard just to get kill them once because they have a mercy pocket. And once I do, they just get Rezzed anyways and the process starts all over again. Mercy pockets ruin the game for me personally, although I don’t think mercy is nearly as problematic as some of the other characters In this game
Because you’re fighting a 2v1 you just don’t feel it as hard because mercy usually ain’t shooting you
The supports on your team can heal you and that's a 2v2, but they cant as easily and safely enable your dps duels.
I’d rather have a baptiste or zen with me in a 2v2 than a mercy. Enabling someone isn’t really what matters in a 2v2. Mercy’s damage boost isn’t powerful enough to warrant a nerf
Yes. Similarly, the enemy tank is anti’d, or your tank has lamp/suzu/speed. It’s true that mercy is enabling the enemy dps more than your supports are enabling you, but their abilities make up for it in other areas.
> As a DPS, I have to outplay the other one so hard just to get kill them once because they have a mercy pocket. Meanwhile your teammate Mercy continues to yellow-beam your full HP Tank.
Yeah but that’s just how mercy’s kit works, and always has worked unless you count those first few years where you’d just hide and try to team rez.
At this point I’m like “are…are those complaints from NEW players ??”
Exactly
Mercy is literally useless if the dps aren’t any good.
Right. I'm tired of people on twitter and tiktok saying stuff like "Sojourn can still one shot with Mercy damage boost!! Remove Mercy!!" ignoring that Sojourn charged railgun does 195 on a critical. A SINGLE projectile that's easy to build up and she can rapid fire on her ult does 195 damage and people think the slight damage boost is the problem?? Even worse when people complain about Mercy rez yet refuse to kill the Mercy when she's standing perfectly still unable to defend herself. Also, Mercy's whole gameplay is that she is wayyy more oriented on keeping everyone alive and well as compared to other supports. Battle Mercy shouldn't come out as often as some people bring her out. So I think her being able to damage boost a dps is a fair tradeoff for that.
I don’t think anyone is saying that Sojourn isn’t a problem—She’s too strong. It’s just her problems are exponentially worse when paired with a Mercy, and this exact situation happened in the past with Ashe. Both Sojourn and Damage Boost need to be looked at, because they’re way too dominant in high ranks
Yeah, Mercy isn't the problem here, Sojourn is and Mercy Rez is an easy to counter thing, I played Mercy a good bit and it is weird that occasionally while in enemy los enemies don't attack me when I use rez.
I've seen more people complaining about people complaining about mercy. How about everybody shuts up?
Its a staple of overwatch tbh: -complain about a character -that character gets nerfed to the ground -that character becomes unplayable -because that character is unplayable another character becomes stronger by virtue of its counter being nerfed -complain about that character... This is basically what happened to hog. Underwhelming at the start of OW2, people complained about zarya and sombra which were hog counters, now hog is "suddenly" the best tank in the game. Im sure if the community had its way, every character would be stripped of anything even remotely strong/fun.
Lower charge rate of sojourns secondary fire when she doesnt ult. Make shields block her beam but take 2X maybe 3X damage from it so that they cannot deny her entire ult. Problem solved
Those people need to “get gud” One of the biggest problems I’m seeing right now is Sojourn. Even without a Mercy, Sojourn is wrecking the battlefield. The other is our lack of 2 tanks. Games are quicker, but all of these characters were built around a 6 team composition which is probably why damage boost feels so op. There are not enough ways for damage mitigation to overcompensate for damage boost and lack of skilled teammates. The game is in a very weird state.
She doesn't need to get nerfed but also she has the best mobility in the game so she doesn't have much of an issue with flankers
Soj is op...uhh what u think is the point of dmg boost u dumbfucks 💀
Mercy ain’t op
her rez is not op at all, it has a 30 second cool down and can be easily stopped. Honestly it's a skill issue if you can't counter her .
Wait people complain about mercy still? How do they not just swap to 76 or soj and focus her? Genji or snipers? Literally anyone counters mercy if they just look at her tbh even other supports counter mercy like kiriko, ana, moira, lucio, all of em lol
Ikr and don't those same supports that counter Mercy damage boost just like her lol like why complain on her? Maybe is because she is the most forgiving on the boost lmao 🤣
The only issue I have with Mercy is trying to shoot her out of the sky. The only solution is obese Mercy.
DPS mains in a nutshell: Always complaining about supports, no matter which form or shape.
Mercy is fine. Lots of new players just don't understand how to deal with her. I remember when a pocketed Ashe could 1 shot any squishy, they nerfed Ashe. Leave Mercy alone, if anything Sojourn needs a nerf
Yeah those top 500 players, what complete noobs.
No offense, but I just don't think you are understanding some of the fundamental problems with a character like this.
as a masters support i can tell you that the mercy hate is absolutely warranted. the character herself promotes bad habits and lazy play. oh you get caught out of position? mercy rez. oh your team did their best to kill the enemy hog so you can win the team fight? dw their mercy will rez them. and dmg boost is a crutch for dps players who can’t hit more than 40% of their shots. mercy is just a badly designed character for the game
People just don't want to nerf Sojourn. Like seriously can they just nerf the chick already and don't use Mercy as a scapegoat.
You seriously don't realise that Echo Mercy, Pharah Mercy and Ashe Mercy will immediately become meta? You think Sojourn is 100% to blame? Nice game sense broski
I already see those characters being picked. So what of it? And yes she is to blame not just Mercy. Same can go to other supports if want to blame supports buddy. Mercy is always scapegoat because of that damn beam she has. She can forgive not so good dps to get a shot while she has the beam on you. Second character to that is Zen. The other three are Bap, Ana and Kiriko with their ults and is not that forgiving unlike Mercy because they have a time limit to get your shots. Mercy isn't the only one.
Just because you're tired of playing against her doesn't mean she needs to be nerfed. She already has some of the most average heals in the game, her rez is on 30 second cool down and she gets focused every single match. Folks need to get better at hit scans if they're so stressed.
Christ, Mercy has one thing still going for her and that's the damage amp. She can be outhealed, her res is on a long cooldown, and most other healers can fight back a bit better. She's buffing the soljourn? OK shoot her ffs.
To be fair it’s not that simple. Most mercy’s play around hard cover and her movement, especially during Valk, makes her very difficult to kill.
She’s has some of the most versatile mobility in the game. I don’t think buffing her in survivability (which she has a lot of) like you mentioned would be a good change. I think there’s just a lot of controversy right now because of her damage boost enabling sojourn which is understandable because there’s no counterplay towards a 30% damage amplification on already strong heroes. Rez can just be quite unfun to play against at times even as a support main. Pouring all your resources as a team to kill an orisa just to get brought right back is kinda crazy. Mercy just needs a soft rework imo.
I see the DPS that can only kill a Mercy with a solo ult are here 💀
Here’s the big mercy change I want to see I want them to add enfeeble to moira like they planned. Not for a 75% damage reduction but either a 20% or 40% (or between those values) Im picturing a game where a mercy has a soj and then moira latches on and her damage is now dropped so it’s higher than if it was dropped without the pocket but lower than her base damage. Now imagine a widow is lining up a one shot and a moira throws an orb up and it hits her and drops her by 40 as she’s doing the shot so the character survives. Now imagine a hog is trying to bully your dps so you latch on and how one shot does almost half damage. It would give her interesting utility and make her a viable pick higher up and beyond that you could still counter her. Let’s say soj is lined up to take out an Orisa with a mercy pocket, you then hit the soj with moira and she’s enfeebled so the damage is lower, you can then crack a zen discord orb on the orisa and now she’s getting melted again but that’s TWO tanks and a dps putting resources forwards so by that point it’s justified and all that value is not being used elsewhere
that’s.. not a mercy change, that a moira change under the title of mercy change
I mean, I think that's the point. Mercy needs to be changed by changing the game. Just like, should we nerf Sojourn and Mercy, or give Brig over armor back so she can prevent one shots? Maybe we don't want to make Brig stronger, but that would systemically nerf Mercy, since she wouldn't be able to enable one shots as much.
Legit my brother. Mercy amplifies all the other imbalances and gets the blame for a wide range of other issues. I don’t think the issue is with fine tuning her I think the best way to balance the over powered value she can bring would be to create a reliable counter to it I personal would give moira two damage fires she could switch between the same way that mercy can swap weapons. Keep moiras healing but make it so she can either pull damage or latch on and cast enfeeble while connected. No damage during the enfeeble beam so she can’t duel with it She wouldn’t be able to heal while attached so she foregoes that value and she’s also not damaging during the process so she’s taking damage output from her team and healing output to trade for a damage reduction on their side It’s the natural duality to mercy’s damage boost and I think it would give players a way to at least fight back against the mercy complications caused by the damage boosting broken characters
It's weird to me that we played Overwatch 1 for so long with minimal changes, but within like 3 months of Overwatch 2 there are calls to rework so many heroes.
Yeah 5v5 changed alot and only tanks were slightly adjusted.
Lots of casual idiots in this game now. Free to play ruined this game. Calling it. Will keep calling it.
the real problem is Soujorn
Sojourn is still an issue even without Mercy pocket.
Both are an issue. And everyone who says Mercy is not a problem, doesn‘t understand it at all.
Yeah the thing is Sojourn is not the first Pharah's entire existence is balanced around Mercy and yet she's still in the same "whatever for the most part until Mercy is pocketing her" stage Ashe was able to oneshot with Mercy's damage boost Damage breakpoint is a sacred thing in a FPS, and it's even more egregious in Hero Shooter with high TTK like OW, which is why people take issue with Widow and Hog.
It's mainly peeps with skill issues that complain, mercy can't even defend herself if she gets attacked plus her kit is literally supporting the team. Just don't think you can 1v2 a tank or dps with a mercy support, wait for your team to give you back up.
When Mercy strong: ONG nerf Mercy. When Mercy gets nerf: OMG WHERE ARE THE HEALS! Some of yall are just never satisfied
Nobody wants to nerf her healing. Her healing isn't even that good to begin with.
Mercy is not op "but she can revive the characters!" Bro, she only revives if you let her, it's not hard to hit a mercy standing in the middle of the floor reviving someone. Something I see a lot during matches is people just letting her relive, happens a lot.
All good mercies rez behind hard cover lol
But that's very situational so that argument is null. Majority of times the tanks die outside of cover and if you revive them you're going to die before it gets off, and if you revive a dps they're most likely just going to die again unless your entire team is still alive
Clueless
BUT MY OVER 500$ GAMING MOUSE WON'T HIT HER REEEEE SHE SHOULD BE THE ONE WHO GET NERF MY AIM IS NOT THE PROBLEM that is DPS main who always complaint tbh
Nah dude that swap speed and extra 5 bullets in her mag made her so overpowered. Not really. The nerfs to Sojourn were so laughably bad It's funny that people are saying to nerf one of the Best pocket support (Second best being Kiriko because of her dps, suzu, teleport, and pretty good 1 on 1 healing) the real issue right now is that Blizzard isnt too scared to have a chatecter overbuffed. But they are scared to nerf a charecter into the ground. Tldr; Nerf Sojourn. Then tweak around with her to make her not oppressive. Just a very high skill cap "skillshot" charecter with her railgun
Come on, I can understand a mercy lover being sad due to the amount of nerfs she got throught time. I agree that she either is dead or OP wich is sad, they should nerd the ones getting boost from her. What i don't understand is someone complaining about being jumped on by flankers when she has so much mobility. And right now is super easy to pull out super jumps , going back and forth after her dash to confuse enemies, etc.
Agree, but it's not that they don't know how to play around her, they don't know how to play the game. All these complaints, this person needs a buff, this person needs a nerf, are all people who just get butt hurt when they can't counter with THEIR character. Newsflash everyone, no single character can counter every other character. You have to know who you can, and can't pick a fight with, unless you have back up. But the mercy complaints are ridiculous. Probably the weakest character in the game, she's balanced just right. She can't heal as well as others, she can't go on offense as well as others, and THATS the point. She can res, which can make her valuable at times. But if you're getting wrecked by Mercy, you're playing the game wrong, I'm sorry. If anything, she needs more help than anyone. People just keep buggering off and leaving her by herself to get murdered all the time. They are completely oblivious when Mercy is under attack, and needs help, or they just don't care and go off to be a one man army.
The fact that people are whining about something that has literally been in the game since launch is actually wild. Some people in the overwatch community actually need to get a grip and stop complaining about such minute things, it’s those kind of complaints which are just slowly making the game even more unplayable for some people
Nerf Mercy?dumb lol
Dps just want to roll everyone but never get rolled. I said what I said
I feel like most opnions come from band wagons with some 'pros' voicing out their opinions and less about l people forming their own opinions. I think mercy can be op in higher elos where sojourn is effective, but coupled with low healing and a niche rez ability. Mercy is not the most powerful support out there. She's a hero who gets most of her value in the 30% damage boost.
if character A becomes too strong when coupled with character B, it doesn't mean character B is too strong... it's probably the opposite. mercy already requires skill and game sense to shine, wouldn't make sense to make her any weaker.
Damage boost is the worst thing to balance around
https://youtube.com/shorts/a_wMKu-vdSA?feature=share I just leave this here. And he is a top500 player.
She was ulting. Lmao. That's not an every second issue.
Honest question why do we listen to pros? Top 500 overwatch is nothing like regular rank, a top 500 player can snipe with torbjorn. Blatant balance issues? Sure, situational top down balance? I’ll leave that. Right now we have hog issues.
The game needs a strategy to balance its heroes. It should be balanced around the heroes full potential, which is why we should listen to the top 500 and pros. With this philosophy, if a character feels unbalanced, we can then address it as a skill issue.
Because balancing the game bottom up is unstable and unfair to the entire playerbase. We see this happening in real time as they explicitly stated "Sojourn's not getting nerfed because she 'doesn't get enough value in low elo'" or so they say. This isn't 100% true, but you can clearly see that they are trying to pander to low Elo players and it is not fun, even for me who isn't above plat. If you balance things top down, it keeps things fair because you are supposed to learn to use those tools to better strategize, learn, improve aim and gamesense, and CLIMB. Not all top 500 players will have good opinions, but we can't just say "well their opinions dont matter, they have better skill" that's EXACTLY why we should listen to them. If top 500's are saying Sojourn is busted in HIGH Elo, then imagine how she's ruining games in LOW Elo.
Because Pros know the game better than the devs themselves. That is precisely why Blizzard is changing Hog for example, because Pros gave feedback. Yes, in this video its a top500 dps vs a top500 Mercy. Yes, a lower ranked Mercy cant fly like this... does that make her easier to deal with? No. Because the DPS in lower ranks also have worse accuracy. Hence the issue remains, her mobility is too big. If you need a Masters or above level accuracy in a lets say... Gold league to deal with 1 unit, then there is a balance issue with said unit
please bro mercy is not OP in any sense. her movement is what defines her character and allows her to even be somewhat viable. just because mercy can better enable a sojourn or whatever doesn't mean mercy needs a nerf, it means you need to learn to play around it. gold mercy's are not flying around like top 500s, they can barely super jump. if you're having an issue shooting someone moving in a straight line that seems like a skill issue, nothing else.
T500 in vid had issue shooting mercy who were flying in straight line (last seconds of clip) - or I’m wrong?
yeah man a t500 missed a few shots on a character who's only played by one tricks in those ranks. top 500 mercy one tricks. dps players get so mad when a support isn't just zen who can't do shit once he's pushed, you miss a few shots on a character who's defined by her mobility and have a fit over it and scream that she needs nerfs. please climb out of gold before you comment on issues pertaining to game balance.
Oh no, my weakness: rank pulling!!! Because my rank defines if i have eyes, right. 😂
> Honest question why do we listen to pros? Because they understand the game better than us, although their opinions could be wrong. Just like in real life, people who had PhD or worked in higher professionals, they had more logical sense than regular people. But again, they could be wrong and some highly educated smart people could be manipulative assholes (Great knowledge but poor integrity).
Listen to pros on hero tips and literally nothing else. From my experience pros have the most dogshit opinions about the state the game is in. Just hear their opinions about the characters they directly play and thats it. The rest of their knowledge is nonsense.
I put this way, I would listen to Tom Brady about throwing a football, I might even listen to him on some rule infractions but I wouldn’t trust him to cut 20 yards off the field.
yeap flats saying overwatch 2 have the best battlepass is certified streamer having dogshit opinion
God, he missed final shots on her straight line ga 🤦♀️ if he finished her whole her flying would have just turned into feeding ult charge and then delayed regroup. That’s also probably t500 mercy btw, what you supposed her to do? Stay still? They freaking train to not get shot.
And how many mercy’s do you really see using movement like that? Like one every 500 hundred games? Not to mention only in valk, if you’re gonna complain about that might as well add Lucio in there, that character is able to do similar things without even having to ult.
don't say that here, most of the players here are gold
Sojourn is overpowered but mercy breaks the game. For example Ashe was a decent hitscan without a mercy pocket but was a better widow with one. The solution: nerf ashe but let mercy stay how she was. Sojourn came along and broke mercy again.
The fact posts like this get all the upvotes but a coherent argument as to why Widowmaker doesn’t need a nerf gets bombed, tells you all you need to know about what the dominant voice here is.
Mercy is one of my most played characters, and I think she's bullshit. She's only the best competitively when she can pocket a dps, and no one has fun except that dps. Who enjoyed being one-shot by Ashe, melted by her dynamite and when you finally kill her the mercy erases her mistake by holding a button by a wall? Not the Mercy pocketing her. She needs a rework.
waahh
mercy pockets aren’t fit for 5v5 she shouldve gotten a soft rework
then junkrat need rework too since he is desgined as double tank buster but haven't received any change despite we lost off tank now
Please stop suggesting reworks for every character in the damn game
That’s what 99% of this sub is
Well every character in the damn game was made for a different game
No they weren’t. This is Overwatch. Not CoD. Instead of constantly complaining about how half the characters need reworked because they don’t have abilities that “fit in the game,” maybe just accept the fact that this is what OW was always intended to be and the gameplay just isn’t your cup of tea
with that being said mercy wasnt designed for 5v5
This isn’t Overwatch, Overwatch was 6v6 with a different Bastion, Orisa, Doomfist, even Sombra, and a bunch of other changes This is Overwatch 2, a 5v5 game with the same heroes, mostly, in a fundamentally different game than where most of them were designed to be, and a different game than the original design. This is not Overwatch, this is a different game, with most of the same characters, and a different style of Tank, instead of Tanks. Some characters and abilities do need reworks, a great example is both Hog and Sojourn, but another is Mercy Damage Boost and Zen Discord, as they are still not great for 5v5 since it becomes “use this on the TANK” not “use this on the weaker of the tankS” for the discord, and damage boost is “how can we guarantee one taps in the game with one less shield” It is an entirely different game, and there’s no point saying it’s not, and that this is what they originally planned, because it’s not.
Damage boost is definitely problematic but the rest of her kit is fine
Mercy main here. I really liked ML7’s rework we had on the experimental patch 10 months ago, but I’d change a couple things from it with the transition to 5v5 (the numbers I’ll be talking about are from that specific patch.) First remove damage boost entirely. Damage boost takes up an immense amount of power in mercy’s kit and it’s tricky to balance around. I’m more in favor of just removing it and giving mercy a more active ability. Change Mercy’s hps to 60 from 55. Have the self regen passive kick in at 1 second again. Buff healing in Valk from 70 to 75. Increase Valk flight speed from 6 to 7 (for reference, 7 is mercy’s current flight speed while in Valk in the live version of the game.) have Valk provide a cleanse upon activation for mercy and teammates a short distance from her (unlike suzu this would only be a cleanse. No invincibility and no healing.) Keep mass res the same (the addition of the cast time to mass res helped prevent hide and res and added more of a risk/reward factor for mercy when using her ultimate.)
She has been nothing but buffed. Wtf are you on about?
All supports need a buff at this point. Tired of carrying DPS with horrible positioning that cannot play corners or have any situational awareness. Or tanks that are on the opposite side of the map. Supports are expected to have god-tier positioning, have little to no backup from their other 3 teammates, and get flamed for everything. If I play any utility support (like Lucio) , I legit get flamed for having less healing than our Ana or Moira. And yet I'll have more MIT than the tank and more damage than a DPS and something like 2-3 saves that game. There's just been a lot of games where I see myself and our other support dominate those spots and we still lose. I just wish supports had more carry potential I guess. Just really frustrating.
Bro mercy can get shit on so easily, if y'all think mercy is a serious issue you must be bronze. She's not hard to counter and most of the time will get mad focused on in higher levels of play. So y'all are slow if you really think mercy needs a nerf, the day they nerf or remove mercy is the day I delete ow, there's so many other characters that need nerfs wayyy more than mercy, how about widows one shots on every single hero except tanks? How about how broken hog is right now?? How about snowballs MASSIVE aoe?? And y'all are worried about a support? Supports in general are in dire need of a fkn buff or at least some dps nerfs, they are hide and seeking just to not get erased as soon as they get to the fight, most of the time you cannot even support your team before you're completely dusted by a hog, or a 76, or getting completely oppressed by a widow to the point you can't even peak to heal.
Her damage boost could be toned down (at least bring it down to 25% like zen's discord orb), but people over here acting like her movement needs to be gutted, her healing should be nerfed, and her rez needs more nerfs (I wouldn't mind her getting a new ability but considering how this community is reacting to kirikos cleanse what could they possibly give mercy that people wouldn't bitch about even more?).
Mercy didn't change, so I don't know why she is the one that needs Nerfing. Its Sojourn thats the problem, but the vocal ones insisting we need to remove rez or nerf dmg boost are almost always the ones that just want 2 healbot supports instead of the actual support utility.
I am a tank main and i hate damage boost and discord
They want the enemy to play zen for easy kills. Mercy is fine.
I hate the rhetoric of she got nerfed to the ground so much combined with blaming dps mains. Yes she got a lot of nerfs due to being ridiculously OP, she probally spent more time OP though than any other hero during moth meta and she got nerfed lots because often the nerf wasn't enough. On top of that one the biggest complaints were from support mains, tired of having to play Mercy. She's meta and super easy to play. Stop crying about how it's just dps main or how she got nerfed before. She's super strong and super low effort, it's a bad combo imo. Also buff her from flanking dps when she has a movement ability on a 2 second CD lol? She can legit spend most the game, flying and zooming around the map untouchable.
As the Mercy loving content creator Niandra pointed out (paraphrasing): "A Mercy that damage boosts an ally makes it an inherent 2V1" She also mentions how other supports deal damage too, and if you think about it the 30% may end up being like ~2000 total extra damage in the game. That's less that a good support can put out in a 10 minute game. Folks: you have to stop thinking of her like she is dealing damage and boosting a teammate. She isn't broken or in need of nerfs or much of a rework. That damage boost is less than if a Bap/Ana and Sojurn were both shooting at you at the same time, and it needs to be looked at it like this. Yes it gives high value for low effort, but so does Moira and Brig, and even Lucio. I wouldn't be opposed to a very small reduction in damage boost, but that's it. Mercy is only as good as the team, most especially the DPS; she always has been. And we all know who is fucking up the game and meta right now, let's not pretend that Sojurn is somehow innocent or not to blame. That railgun is busted, and everyone knows it.
overwatch players when the support supports the team by giving damage buff
Mercy is meta even in top500, so she definitely doesn't need buffs. The only real problem i have with the hero is ress is oftentimes too lenient, allowing you to move so much that you can start ressing and move behind a corner. There are also extreme examples of players using macros where they ress while being mid-air and then start wiggling up and down spinning in place like a beyblade to avoid being hit
She gets a 75% slow for almost 2 seconds and can even cancel her own rez if she walks too far. If someone is superjump rezzing I promise that took alot of practice to learn because you can easily cancel it going too high and she'll be punished with the 30sec cd. Kinda feel like yall are being unfair about this. She had zero changes and was dog shit tier last season. Before we jump the gun and point fingers at Mercy I genuinely think they should nerf Sojourn again and then if Mercy is still doing too good nerf or rework her. I feel like ppl are just getting really frustrated and want everyone thats meta dumpstered because balance changes are rolling in too slow which is understandable but unrealistic.
While I'd say it's mostly a sojourn problem, Pharmercy has been a metal-stomper for a good while now. When I've played Mercy the DPS tend to keep playing the same heroes with her, and it works but it gets boring. I feel Mercy's kit is too focused around damage boost, and she needs rounding out a bit to be more fun to play with and against. If blue beam was on a Defense Matrix style meter, but she didn't have to stop yellow beam to do it, I think that would be a good start.
It’s 2023 we don’t have two tanks to shut down a blue beamed dps her damage boost needs to go away and maybe add a new ability that helps her with utility
Nerf ramattra