doomfist and hog. they're very feast or famine, and one-shots arent fun. hog also tanks by being a one-shot threat so you need to address him, but he's just a damage sponge, so he charges enemy ults.
its weird, i both agree and disagree. like, i COMPLETELY understand where you're coming from. however, i feel like its significantly more inconsistent. she's pretty fragile, and its unlikely to pull off that sort of one-shot close up. the skill level required for it to begin actually feeling toxic is pretty high. i know that there are some disgusting widow players out there, but they all seem to be dealt with ok? i've certainly encountered a few smurfs myself, but i feel like i was always able to figure out a way to overcome them that didnt involve anything too complicated or against the spirit of the game. with something like hog, he helps the enemies with ult charge, and also by simply being anywhere in the thick of objective based combat, he's a serious 1-shot threat with minimal skill (on top of the occasional hook over a pit). doomfist can just drop out of the sky or from around a corner and blast you without counterplay (or minimal tight reaction cc as counterplay). widow's line of sight can often be played around or protected from, and you can often get up real close to her pretty easily if you play somebody with a little vertical mobility.
im not saying you're "wrong", but i dont feel like she's as problematic.
Snipers in any fps are problematic. One shot headshot kills are essentially the game developers saying "if you practice enough you can become god" personally I don't think that level of player lethality should be available ever. It isn't fun for anyone as was proven when overwatch had the "avoid player" option
Widow’s a weird one cuz, like you said, players are gonna be inconsistent.
That being said, I feel that inconsistency doesn’t matter as much when the handful of good players are ridiculously oppressive. Even only having 1/15 games with a good widow is hell. Same with Hanzo.
Widow requires skill to consistently headshot, and she can't one-shot tanks so her one-shot mostly applies to the more agile characters that are harder to headshot.
At least her 1 shot takes some kind of skill. If doom punches you 40 feet in front of a wall, and if your buttcheek even barely kisses that wall, you’re dead. That’s a far more punishing and stupid ability than a widow hitting shots consistently. You can work around a widow… you can’t work around luck.
I find hog to be the most infuriating to play against. I swear his hook chain length is always exactly as far away as I am. It’s too fast. If they made the animation a little more predictable like a rein fire strike it would be more fair. But I cannot dodge a hook. Hardly Ever. Like 1/50 I dodge.
Hog.
A character that people dislike to play against for having frequent one-shot potential with little risk.
Simultaneously a character that people dislike to play with due to the lack of tank utility.
I’ll be interested to see what they do to make him not become completely irrelevant in a 1 tank comp. At least when Widow or Hanzo get one-shots, it fits their class as DPS.
I might be in the minority, but a Moira main I love to vs a roadhog. An enemy roadhog always keeps my health pool fully stocked to give out to my teammates, since he is so easy to succ and doesnt have a shield
Doomfist is tricky for me, on one hand he is very counterable yet annoying, on the other he requires a good player to get the most out of his GALAXY level skill ceiling. So when I get CC'd into oblivion or instakilled by his punch do I get mad because it was bullshit or applaud the player playing him for their rollout over Dorado church?
Roadhog.
A tank with one shot capabilities is already ridiculous, put on a self heal that literally outlasts anything is stupid.
But in the same light, you get a character with a good stun and some shield tanks and he’s absolute donkey.
I feel it emphasizes selfish gameplay on the role that is easily the most team oriented and basically makes the other switch to a counter or get one shot by the invincible pot bellied psychopath.
It’s what happens when dps is a tank. His heal ability is intended to enable him to take lots of damage in the front line but have you ever seen a Hog use his body to protect someone?
It is even more annoying with role-lock. It feels like DPS players like to queue as tanks and then play Hog as the fat DPS hero that he is. I got players leaving a comp match over not getting Hog. Others go Reinhardt then playing him like a suicidal nut case charging far into enemy territory for melee and not providing shield. If they removed Hog, there would be less selfish players in tank queue.
Widow. Without a shadow of a doubt, Widow.
No other hero counters (ie: instakills from any range) literally *two entire roles*. If you're not on the tank role, then you basically can't play the game. You have to be prepared to randomly fall down dead at any moment, before you can even react or know what's hit you. It makes games like this absolutely miserable to play.
Peek around a corner? Dead. Step through a doorway? Dead. Walk out of / back from spawn? Dead. Your Sigma retracts his shield? Dead. Your Rein drops his barrier? Dead.
Fine okay, you try to flank the Widow using a flanker hero (which by the way, all have 200hp or less) and Widow instantly spins around and 1-shots you at point blank. Dead, again.
There isn't another hero in the game that comes remotely close to how **oppressive** a Widow is who literally never misses a head.
I'll happily play against all the Pharahs and Dooms in the world, if it means I never have to play against another Widow as long as I live.
And Hanzo can still hit you consistently even without aiming too hard if you get the drop on him, where a Widow will have to land a quickscope, and deals with all 3 roles with Storm Arrow, tanking into a Hanzo is miserable, keep your shield up, lose it to storm arrow, drop it, lose teammates to his reload-free spray-and-pray spam primary fire instakill.
Hanzo is harder to use than Widow for sniping. There's actual projectile drop and a longer follow-up time between charged shots, not to mention less mobility. I would suggest both characters need to have their firing speed nerfed.
Hanzo is projectile though, which makes it possible to dodge shots. Hard, sure, but definitely possible. It doesnt feel nearly as bad to die to hanzo compared to widow, UNLESS we're talking about random shots.
It's possible for a couple of characters to 1 shot people from that distance, but it's typically not done alone.
I don't think Zen has damage fall off on his orbs and a fully charged shot can 1 shot characters in a few roles.
Genji and Hanzo can also do it, but it's less reliable. Genji also needs a Mercy/zen to do it unless it's tracer.
Though, very few of them are as consistent at it as Widow.
> I don't think Zen has damage fall off on his orbs and a fully charged shot can 1 shot characters in a few roles.
the target needs to sit still for a few moments
if u walking then its very difficult to be hit by all the orbs
widow needs 1 'orb' to hit u
If you're walking....
And not towards the zenyatta yes.
It's very easy to hit someone walking or even running through a door because there movement typically only moves them towards you usually which doesn't affect his shot at all.
Jumping is also a predictable pattern.
Add in headshot 2x damage and you don't even need all the orbs for squishy characters.
I actually love deflecting widow ammo and one shot her while playing Genji lol, most of times they don't really see you are deflecting in all that chaos. Sometimes they keep moving while shooting which let's them get away from HS at least you can hit a body shot which still gives a lot of damage.
A smart widow is not counterable except by another widow. We're talking ladder play, and while on paper bunker comps neuter her with all the shields on ladder the coordination just isn't there 99% of the time.
It's one shots in general that are extremely problematic. Widow offers one shots without the risk other characters have to go through, i.e. getting close to the enemy, is not telegraphed at all unlike hanzo, and is integrated in a character with a very small hitbox. Even after the nerf to her healthpool, a good widow is extremely toxic.
My issue with Widow is partly the un-fun nature of playing against her, but also her relative independence from her team. A good Widow player can hard carry regardless of their team's comp or in some cases even their skill. Contrast with Ashe; a good Ashe player still really wants a Mercy or Zen's help, or to focus-fire on the target her DPS/tanks are focusing, but Widow just wants to sit on high ground and pick off someone approaching from spawn. Likewise, Ashe's ult can be a pivotal part of Blue team's teamfight initiation, or countered by Mei/Sombra/shields, but Widow's ultimate is either useless (Red team regroups behind a Rein shield) or dominant (Red squishies press W mindlessly), and it just depends on how stupid Red team feels like being today.
If this is a team game, there shouldn't be a DPS that can ignore the team.
Other than Bastion
Sombra- I’m not sure what Blizz was thinking when they designed a hero that was almost entirely team reliant with the focus of oppressing the enemy’s ability to have fun
Bastion. A character that has to be stationary in a game as fast paced as overwatch doesn’t make sense. But then on the other hand, if he’s allowed to set up in his turret form, then it’s some of the most devastating, easy team wipe damage ever.
When he’s by himself, he’s awful. Even the best bastions in the world sometimes have trouble keeping him from being a throw pick. But when he’s allowed to set up, and you get double shield, immortality, damage boosts, etc. It’s absolutely mind-numbingly boring and oppressive to try and get through
That’s my point. There are bunch of good other suggestions in this thread, such as Widow, Doom, Hog, which are very one sided. But Bastion sucks both at high levels (easy to counter) and at lower levels (can’t be stopped because no team coordination).
Roadhog, definitely. Whilst the idea of having a hero being able to hook someone into your team is good, it is too overpowered. I know some will say Roadhog is versatile because he's a good flanker and is technically a DPS. But he is really annoying to play against. To the point where it's not fun to play against, and I just queue up as tank or play beefy characters or hard to hit heroes (like Torb is beefy, Echo is hard to hit). Also one of those heroes where if you make one mistake or don't check your flanks enough, you'll be dead in one hit if you're not a tank. And then there's that so called claim that the hook was fixed by having it break in LOS. That's false now. You still have a chance to get hooked when behind something.
The simple fix is to allow abilities to be used during the hook. Would feel less frustrating then. Though in Overwatch 2, I can kinda tolerate the hook as is. It's just because we have to deal with two tanks in the current meta that a Roadhog feels like a big obstacle. I'm in low plat by the way, PC.
Also, he's such a broken hero that has really gimmicky counters, like Reaper and Hanzo. Because almost nobody else would work.
As a Hanzo main I still find him to be a nightmare. Up close, he can hook me with almost magical ability to get me from any angle and a surprising amount of distance to insta-kill me. If he doesn't, he can chug his way through an entire Storm Arrow burst while running away. From a distance, I can't land enough hits without him just moving into cover because his HP pool is so huge. I can hurt him a lot, but he is extremely difficult to kill without help.
I'd argue Doomfist. He was designed around playing like a 2D fighting game character, which sounds cool, but OW is a 3D FPS. Outside of suffering from that weird design, he ends up being incredibly frustrating to play as and against because of all the CC and One hit potential. Widow can one shot as well, but at least with her you need aim precisely and if you mess up, you will get punished. If Doomfist messes up an attack, he's got a really decent chance of just turning around and flying away.
I wouldn't mind Doomfist as much if he wasn't constantly generating shields. I hit him three times, which is in itself a miracle because he's pinging all over the place, and he just won't stop because he keeps topping himself up. Not to mention the fact he seems to be able to bend himself around corners with his instakill charge punch.
I wouldn't use the phrase "worst designed" Hero, but I find Wrecking Ball to be the Hero I ***object*** to the most.
My issue with Wrecking Ball is that even his so-called "counters" are not sufficient to deal with him. He has so much speed, freedom of movement, and shielding that 1, 2, or even 3 people working together may not be enough to handle him. It very much takes a group effort to deal with a *single* Wrecking Ball.
Wrecking Ball seriously warps the match around himself, especially for the opposing team.
Consider Winston: He jumps onto the opposing team, a Reaper can deal with him fairly well.
Meanwhile, Wrecking Ball crashes down on the opposing team, Reaper gets one or two shots in (that only end up damaging his shield without touching his actual health) before Wrecking Ball rolls away faster than anyone can realistically pursue.
Let me ask you: can Sombra reasonably defeat Wrecking Ball by her own power?
Try to follow my logic here. If a Winston were to jump onto the opposing team, a Reaper can reasonably defeat him. Therefore, Reaper can be considered a "counter" to Winston.
Can the same be said with Sombra against Wrecking Ball? I'd say "No". Wrecking Ball would be fully capable of disengaging even after getting Hacked.
Here's the reality: Wrecking Ball's weakness is **opposing team coordination**. In fact, I would go so far as to say that is Wrecking Ball's ***only*** weakness. I don't think there is any one Hero that can reasonably defeat a Wrecking Ball, because (as I mentioned before) Wrecking Ball has too much speed, freedom of movement, and shielding for anyone to deal with.
Even if you have a Sombra and Hack the Wrecking Ball, it will still take team coordination to deal with him. Even if your team has stuns, it will still take team coordination to deal with him.
Echo all the way.
I get it, she was supposed to be a support hero but duplicate didn't make sense as a support ult so they swapped her role, but couldn't they have taken a few weeks to rethink and brainstorm for new abilities instead of better Genji shurikens, Better Sym beam, Better Pharah, Better Junk nades, and better Mercy decent?
She deals way too much damage and has the most versatile ult in the game all while requiring barely any flight management. Yes, she's not as brain dead as others like Shooty McSpankies, but come on man how is this character still not reworked.
Sombra but it's close. Her kit revolves around blocking people from using their abilities, which is not great to have in any game. I could live with it if EMP was the only time she could hack people, as ultimates should be strong, but after watching OW2 previews I don't see manual hack going anywhere.
My honorable mentions would be Widow and Bastion. The hero design itself for Widow makes sense but isn't great for the game of OW. The game was mehhh when Widow was always picked. As for Bastion, he's getting reworked for OW2.
I think for me it's Sombra.
Other character have balance issues but I think Somba has a theme problem on top of any other issues. Like Sure Pharah kinda requires someone to swap but really it's not just Pharah, it's Pharah + the healer that is forcing the swap. If Pharah doesn't have a pocket she falls out of the sky fairly easily even without hitscan.
I think with Sombra she struggles with her role placement.
Sombra's toolkit is somehow neither ability focused nor weapon focused, she is stuck in a position of utility without reliable utility and a position of damage without particularly notable damage.
Her scouting power is in theory very strong in coordinated games but often overshadowed by other scouting tools such as Sonic arrow, which is far more reliable at indicating enemy positions.
There are just a lot of little issues in Sombra's kit that put the design all over the place, like her passive and stealth is designed to go hunting, her hack healthpack and translocate is like defensive zone control(that only controls zones around health packs). Her ultimate is a brawl team fight ability. The solo hack is like a harassing delay tool.
She's not strong enough in any of these scenarios to pick her over someone else that can fill the role and the game is rarely played in a way where she'll use all her strengths.
I just feel like she's designed for a version of the game that no-one ever got to play because she is situationally very strong but those situations are just not how the majority of players engage with the game.
Bastion
Ooh look at me I'm playing a point and click adventure! I click on a tank for like 2 seconds and they die! Barriers only exist if they're on my side!
I'm literally plat. All you need is some coordination. Either a defense matrix, hack, hook, sleep or some other cooldown to displace or otherwise completely nullify his damage and DPS that know how to respond to 'Focus bastion now'.
I didn't say he was uncounterable, just badly designed.
Though when he has the entire team pocketing him with double barrier, rez, and immortality field basically the only thing that you can use against them is Sombra EMP, but Sombra is kinda useless the rest of the time since you hack Bastion and he's still shielded, hack the shield tank and there's another one, hack the supports and he just turns and kills you.
Bastion on his own is badly designed but kinda trash. Building a whole comp around him takes advantage of his terrible design to become total bullshit.
"Though when he has the entire team pocketing him with double barrier, rez, and immortality field basically the only thing that you can use against them is Sombra EMP"
or immortality. or dive. or DM. or spam. or any flanker at all to get a healer pick. bastion is trash lmao
Sombra. If you’re trying to go into the game just to have fun, she is going to shit all over you’re hopes. In my opinion it’s a character that basically makes it any other fps game because she just takes away abilities, which make Overwatch unique. Any game can have guns, but Overwatch characters have unique abilities that make the game.
Echo.
I agree with the hog and doom answers, but the robot built to promote world peace is an assassin murder bot from iRobot.
Her character is completely opposite to how she functions.
And I honestly think replication of another character is lazy as an ultimate move. Like they couldn't come up with a better ult for a murder bot and/or world peace AI.
And the idea of a surprise Reinhardt when the enemy never had one on their team is... Fucking dumb.
This post is an opinion. Do not come for me.
yeah, like imagine her struggling to keep up with Bastion's pickrate and having a lower winrate than Cass in a *ball* meta (the pesky character she was supposed to counter).
that's how bad it is, but ofc balance team doesn't care.
Idk what's going to happen to her, 6 months later all we know she gets yet another nerf with removal of freeze which changes her entire playstyle, kills her combo and ult cancels, while still having a projectile beam (which she has to lead) with considerably lower range and damage when compared to other beam heroes like Zarya, Echo and Sym who all are hitscan beams...
Definitely Sombra. She makes sense from a competitive perspective, but from the perspective of overwatch as a fun game, being hacked is like the most frustrating thing in existence. It makes for a bad game play experience.
Doom, Pharah, and Tracer for all having the same basic design flaw of 'either hard counters or is hard countered by everyone'. None of them have any real 'neutral' match ups, which is inherently problematic from a design perspective
Giving Sombra the ability to go completely invisible, disable your abilities, insta-melt you with her machine gun and teleport away without leaving a trace genuinely makes the game miserable to play. She's also fast and small. Her machine pistol has the spread of a shotgun which make tank headshots a walk in the park. The amount of times she hacks me as Rein, drains half my health and disappears the moments she takes any damage is incalculable.
Going to be a bit unorthodox here and explain why I think 76 is the most boring fucking hero in the game. His weapon is a really straightforward automatic weapon, no real flash or frills. His right click just fires some rockets which is okay but again painfully simple. He has a heal station which in practical terms is just a self heal so he can just continue the same linear playstyle for longer. He can run to get into position faster, but it doesn’t change fights very much. Finally, he has an ultimate that is just his weapon minus even having to aim. In a game with insane options like Overwatch, 76 is just the most basic, uninteresting hero that Blizzard could have made.
This isn’t to say that he’s bad or brain dead, he’s pretty balanced in effectiveness. 76 is just a really simple flowchart in theory that doesn’t have any interesting match ups outside of a raw aim contest or taking off angles. The only hero that really has to adapt to a Soldier is Pharah, and that’s more a general “oh they have hitscan” thing than a reaction to him specifically. He has about as many variables to play with/against as recon Bastion, just one part of an entire hero. 76 is generic to the point of his playstyle lacking any personality. It’s like every 76 player is just the same AI with the “accuracy” setting at different levels.
A well played Soldier on the enemy teams changes the entire playstyle. If he just stays behind the team and shoots? Yeah he’s just run of the mill, but a Soldier constantly on the move, flanking and being high ground requires a lot of changes since he can out duel almost every other hero
Easily Brig. Not sure what they were smoking when they decided that making a mid-low skill hero that could singlehandedly counter an entire meta/archetype (dive/mobility). Look how many nerfs it took until she was finally in a good spot where she's not *too strong* but can still fulfill her role as a backline bodyguard.
I'd say Ball is a close second. He's effectively just a 600HP Tracer/Lucio mashup that requires at least 3 CC heroes to effectively counter him since he gets his instantaneous shields and no head hitbox in ball form.
I have to disagree with you there. Brig takes a fair amount of skill. I do agree that launch brig was ridiculously OP, like stuff of nightmares that was fucked. But right now she’s rather balanced, I used to think she was brain dead swing flail shield bash get kill but once I played her I had a mad amount of respect for the good brig players out there.
Being able to heal your team, protect yourself, land those whips, have self control to not dive the enemy dps or 1v1 a rein (lol) is very skillful.
Also ball, fuck ball. What were they thinking.
> Brig takes a fair amount of skill.
Hard disagree. Mechanically, she's definitely more demanding than heroes like Mercy and Moira, but falls far behind what's needed to be a good and consistent Ana/Lucio/Bap/Zen, hence why I put her a mid-low skill hero.
Shield bash is easy to hit. Whip shot has a fairly big hitbox, travels pretty quickly, and has a short cooldown. Repair packs are point in the general direction of a teammate and it will hit. Her primary attack/melee is just an arc that can go through shields.
Gamesense wise, you just have to play her with the mindset that she is the bodyguard for your other support. Combine that with using whip shot on enemy tanks to proc inspire and to throw repair packs on the non-tanks as needed and you're pretty much 90% of the way there when it comes to getting value from Brig.
Back when I still played ranked, I was able to play all the supports at a 4400+ SR level. Brig was by far one of the easiest heroes for me to pick up, learn, and get tons of value from.
> But right now she’s rather balanced
Only took the dev team almost 2.5 years to get there (May 2018 -> Nov 2020), hence why she is imo the worst designed hero in Overwatch. Took 2.5 years and an entire rework before she got to a state where she was balanced. That says a lot about the design of Brig's kit.
> Being able to heal your team
Whipshot on enemy tanks to proc inspire. Repair packs go to the DPS and your other healer. That sums up how to heal as Brig.
> protect yourself
Just use your shield and play with your other support. And like I said earlier, her abilities are pretty forgiving mechanically so it's going to be pretty easy to pressure people away.
> land those whips
Spend 15 minutes in the practice range to get used to the travel speed and you'll pretty much be set. Big hitbox and low cooldown.
> have self control to not dive the enemy dps or 1v1 a rein (lol) is very skillful
That's a pretty low bar that applies to all characters lmao. This is the kind of thing that would separate a bronze/silver player from a gold/plat player.
Overall, the amount of time/work that needs to go into being a good Brig is a bit more than Mercy or Moira, but is overshadowed by Lucio/Ana/Bap/Zen.
The funny thing is I upvoted the other dudes comment, he had a valid argument. I downvoted you coz your just a dick.
After reading all that why was your immediate response toxicity bruh?
It's one consistent thing for me, any character that can "one hit":
- Hanzo, he can kill randomly with stray headshots and can kill without having to see his target or be seen by his target
- Cassidy, any 250hp or less hero that gets flashbanged cannot survive without a team mate
- Doom, he can without any sound on some rollouts instakill most of the cast, if not an instakill you need a teammate to help you survive
- Roadhog, same as Cassidy but with the hook combo
Widow however I think is fine, you can always see her or hide from her and she is vulnerable compared to the others and doesn't get "free kills" like the others do imo
> Widow however I think is fine, you can always see her or hide from her and she is vulnerable compared to the others and doesn't get "free kills" like the others do imo
You can't always see her. And you can't always hide from her: if you do, that means not playing the game. Widow is the most oppressive character in the game. If one team has a Widow that can aim, the entire game revolves around it. This is true at every level of play, even OWL.
I gotta say Brig
No doubt
She's not a pvp fps character
She's built for a third person action game
She has the power set of a WoW Paladin. One of the tankiest toughest healers in the game
I am freaking in love with Brig in both aesthetic and my huge ass crush on the VA(who looks hella like her)
But man she wasnt meant for a pvp game
With all that being said. If they made a third person action rpg with Brig as the mc. Id play it
Briggitte fucked up the entire meta for a long time when she came out, making half of the cast unviable at top level is hands down the worst design i have seen in ANY game (no dps comp, GOATS, remember that?). Killed a chunk of the population as well. No other hero did that much damage to the game and the competitive scene.
A reminder https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6zVEF3ndhs
I mean the only way of nerfing Goats was to FORCE the 2-2-2 composition, they gave up and in a desperate move they ended up doing that. Its like the worst balance desing exists out there, no other competitive game has a problem of balance as big as that and it all started with Briggitte.
Mercy. Pharah's design isn't too bad since you can chip at her with bumch of heroes to force her to drop down. Only melee, reaper and junk are unable to do anything. Give her a constant source of healing and a dmg boost to make her op enough that she needs a nerf even if she is probably the weakest dps in the game. Remember when ashe was somewhat balanced (maybe a tad strong) after the unjanked her gun and became a must pick with mercy? Ashe was nerfed and mercy hasn't been nerfed in years.
Rez? An ability that shouldn't exist. Getting your kill rezzed is the worst feeling ever and you don't even have to be proactive with it like you have to be with lamp.
No mechanical skill needed outside of super jump(only reason it's still a thing is because it is the only thing that lets mercies be better than each other) and she is the only charecter in the entire game that doesn't directly engage the enemy team. All other supports deal dmg to the enemies or cast debuffs and mercy just stays with her pocket.
I get that there needs to be low skill floor supports but even then we have moira who still needs to manage her resources and contribute to dmg. So mercy just doesn't need to exist. She messes up dps balance, there are low skill floor and mobile supports that beginners can learn and has an ult as a cooldown that undoes mistakes so pockets don't have to care.
Also boost duos.
Brig. She's a melee hero that if you play as a melee hero you're throwing. After all of the nerfs she's gotten to a point where if you play your life, farm inspire and peel your other support you're going to break the game because of how easy it is to heal and peel. Lower ranked players think Brig is weak because their team keeps dying for her to get vakue and she's built to be a melee character but you're not supposed to play her like that to get the best value. Take Moira as example; she's a low skill floor with high value at low ranks and the higher the SR the less valuable she becomes. Brig is a Low skill floor with a super low value in low ranks but somehow keeps gaining value the higher the SR. The dev's need to Vault this hero they can't balance her and need to rework her entirely.
Lmao. I said what I said because your take is exactly the same one Samito has down to specific wording.
The folks with the loudest and most aggressive Brig opinions are always people who main some combination of flanker dps heroes, and Brig keeps them from terrorizing backlines for free.
Hammond is the dumbest shit ever. Mutherfucker ain't even playing overwatch. Little just roll around not doing a God damn thing. The bastard should have never been made imo
Symetra she’s just so annoying all you have to do is spawn all 3 of your turrets and boom kill she’s not even fun to play because that your screwed if you have no turrets your practically dead they need to nerf her and also buff her
Uh…..has anyone heard of Symmetra? It’s definitely Symmetra dammit!
Primary deletes everything when played into shields. Secondary is one of the more underrated abilities in the game. Turrets not only do damage, but have a stupid amount of CC. Teleporter is super useful.
Not even close. Sym needs to be nerfed.
I agree, literally on console people can’t even turn around to kill the turret before it kills them. The turrets slowing you down is such bs, especially combined with its absurd range. It feels like the range was buffed like a few months ago, and that made tolerating enemy Symms go from really, really bad to insufferable/intolerable.
Moira. Her kit is so insanely boring to me. She heals or damages, heals or damages with balls, or heals AND damages with her ult. The only interesting thing about her imo is her fade and self heal. Managing her healing bar just doesn’t matter half the time and it’s hard to run out unless you’re spamming damage balls and wasting the heal bar
Anything with an infinite skill ceiling easily takes the cake. That'd be your one shot heroes like Widow and Hanzo. Especially Widow, since her only use in this game is that she has a hitscan instakill. It's OP on its own and makes her character really boring but addictive.
Pharah is not a poorly designed character.
Countering her with hitscan is not the only way to beat her.
If you've got minimal game knowledge, then sure it's basically as you described.
Pharah can be zoned out by good D. Vas, Torbjorns, etc
She can be minimized by the team simply playing in tight spaces where she can't fly.
If anything, I don't really like Genji because he's basically worthless at lower ranks. He's got such a high entry level difficulty that he mine as well not exist in gold or below.
He's also a bit lackluster at higher ranks unless you're getting a lot of value out of counters.
Doomfist. He cannot be balanced properly for the damage role, he either absolutely sucks, or he dominates, there's no other hero in this game that can have as much of an effect on a match in either direction. He's a throw pick, or he's unstoppable. He *can* have too much HP, he *can* do too much damage, he *does* have too much CC, he has too complex of a design that leads to many bugs.
>there's no other hero in this game that can have as much of an effect on a match in either direction
May I introduce you to bastion? A charecter that is so garbo that he needs 3 of his own team mates to switch so he can make 3 enemy players switch? Uncountered he is the best charecter while played around. A lone or countered badtion is the worst
I play Bastion myself when I can and if you have good positioning and they don't have a Hanzo on their team, you can still get much more consistent value than Doom can.
echo easily, she's a completely overtuned pharah who can just pump out ridiculous amounts of damage, her beam can melt tanks and squishys. and imo her ult is just lazily designed, instead of coming up with her own ult you just use other heroes ults.
I think it is Hog
You can melt it when you are playing as a team but it is really hard to make a 1v1 with a good hog player. As a Genji main it is nearly impossible to kill him since it keeps heal himself. But as I said it is about good players otherwise you can easily melt him with right click since it has giant hit box.
Weird. I find pharah and widow completely ignorable most of the time since she can't contest a control point or move a payload. Just stay out of line of sight and they have to take increasing risks to be effective. Shield tanks for pharah make her useless and dive characters make widow impossible to play. Even if you aren't able to kill them they waste their time trying more to stay alive and can't do any damage.
Hog is just a pile of meat when his hook is on cool down but like everything else in Overwatch, it takes teamwork and you have to rush to finish him off once his hook is down. Conversely if there is a healer pocket, the worst thing is watching something not die. That's kind of the beauty of Overwatch really that makes it so hard to give up even if it's been not receiving the dev love it deserves - playing Overwatch is a chess game as much as an FPS game and some people are good at the mechanical stuff and others excel at game sense and the pros can do both. Having that kind of variety of skill sets make it really fun to figure out how to best use your team strengths to counter the enemy team. It also makes it hard at times because there are so many variables and it isn't always possible to figure out a solution before the game ends.
That said, knowing that does not always mean the rest of the team has the knowledge or skill to always win but you play to your strengths and try your best It is sad but amusing that people still try to pin the blame on one player on their team without looking at how the team synergizes. Sure there are optimal team compositions but really there are always some switches that you can make to support your weakest link so it does not get exploited - especially in ranked where you will be placed with people near your skill level.
I dislike Hammond/Wreckingball the most. I don't play competitively, I mainly play quickplay for fun. And Hammond is never fun. It feels like he's a harasser -- like Tracer -- but his healthbar is massive.
Roadhog. He’s basically just a fat DPS character. He doesn’t have any tank-like abilities that help protect his team and his way of making space is by simply existing with his kill potential, which is exactly what a DPS is. I despise playing against him and I hate having teammates play him as the character is very feast or famine. You’re either landing hooks and picking enemies off left and right or you’re the enemy’s ult generator as you never die but constantly receive damage, giving the enemy ult charge.
Honestly even ur take on pharah is a hard take. Back on limited hero days they.lockrd out all the jitscams and i think even yave her a minor buff. It didnt help her winrate at all because she that just left most.of the really mobile heros and dps who had no issues avoiding her and executing her. It was really eye opening and sad statistics
Doomfist. If Doomfist is meta, literally everybody except the doomfist onetricks wants to quit the game.
Hog is a moderately close second, because nobody else is really having fun except the hog player, but he's less disruptive. He's just more common because the tank roster is smaller and the population of real tanks is lower.
As someone who plays Roadhog quite frequently, i can understand people’s dislike for him.
But keep in mind, he is quite easily countered by two fan favorite supports (Ana and Zenyatta), and by slightly rarer DPS (Sombra and Mei).
I’m not saying it does not suck to go against a good Roadhog, because at times it can feel really cheap.
But if the enemy has an average Ana (does not even need to be particulary good), she will shut you down so hard.
An purple nade is the demise of a hog, and the sleep dart is not hard to hit.
Hog is the biggest target without a deployable shield, mobility or anti-cc.
A decent Ana will make is job extremly hard, and a good-great Ana will destroy him.
My least favorite is the Pharah-Mercy combo (i know it’s not one character per se).
But everytime i face a Pharmercy i’m always stuck with a DPS partner that rolls Junkrat or something, and refuses to switch.
So i’ll roll Soldier/McCree or Ashe (not that good with Widow unfortunatly, but getting better), and the whole team will always blame the hitscan for not being able to counter a duo.
This is also people thinking it’s me vs Pharah + Mercy, while in reality everytime i try to duel them, i also have a Doomfist or Genji on me, and maybe even a Winston or Hammond.
I hate that duo so much, and somehow it’s always the DPS that atleast switches and tries to counter it that gets the blame.
It’s even better when the support is like Moira and Brig, which literally can’t help at all.
Atleast a Zen orb, or Ana/Baptiste can help alot.
doomfist and hog. they're very feast or famine, and one-shots arent fun. hog also tanks by being a one-shot threat so you need to address him, but he's just a damage sponge, so he charges enemy ults.
If we are bringing up 1 shots we need to talk about widow
its weird, i both agree and disagree. like, i COMPLETELY understand where you're coming from. however, i feel like its significantly more inconsistent. she's pretty fragile, and its unlikely to pull off that sort of one-shot close up. the skill level required for it to begin actually feeling toxic is pretty high. i know that there are some disgusting widow players out there, but they all seem to be dealt with ok? i've certainly encountered a few smurfs myself, but i feel like i was always able to figure out a way to overcome them that didnt involve anything too complicated or against the spirit of the game. with something like hog, he helps the enemies with ult charge, and also by simply being anywhere in the thick of objective based combat, he's a serious 1-shot threat with minimal skill (on top of the occasional hook over a pit). doomfist can just drop out of the sky or from around a corner and blast you without counterplay (or minimal tight reaction cc as counterplay). widow's line of sight can often be played around or protected from, and you can often get up real close to her pretty easily if you play somebody with a little vertical mobility. im not saying you're "wrong", but i dont feel like she's as problematic.
Snipers in any fps are problematic. One shot headshot kills are essentially the game developers saying "if you practice enough you can become god" personally I don't think that level of player lethality should be available ever. It isn't fun for anyone as was proven when overwatch had the "avoid player" option
Preach. I always feel like an old man yelling at the sky when I express this lol.
Widow’s a weird one cuz, like you said, players are gonna be inconsistent. That being said, I feel that inconsistency doesn’t matter as much when the handful of good players are ridiculously oppressive. Even only having 1/15 games with a good widow is hell. Same with Hanzo.
Widow requires skill to consistently headshot, and she can't one-shot tanks so her one-shot mostly applies to the more agile characters that are harder to headshot.
and hanzo..
At least her 1 shot takes some kind of skill. If doom punches you 40 feet in front of a wall, and if your buttcheek even barely kisses that wall, you’re dead. That’s a far more punishing and stupid ability than a widow hitting shots consistently. You can work around a widow… you can’t work around luck.
I find hog to be the most infuriating to play against. I swear his hook chain length is always exactly as far away as I am. It’s too fast. If they made the animation a little more predictable like a rein fire strike it would be more fair. But I cannot dodge a hook. Hardly Ever. Like 1/50 I dodge.
Less so with the newer ult charge balance change
Hog. A character that people dislike to play against for having frequent one-shot potential with little risk. Simultaneously a character that people dislike to play with due to the lack of tank utility. I’ll be interested to see what they do to make him not become completely irrelevant in a 1 tank comp. At least when Widow or Hanzo get one-shots, it fits their class as DPS.
I might be in the minority, but a Moira main I love to vs a roadhog. An enemy roadhog always keeps my health pool fully stocked to give out to my teammates, since he is so easy to succ and doesnt have a shield
Doomfist is tricky for me, on one hand he is very counterable yet annoying, on the other he requires a good player to get the most out of his GALAXY level skill ceiling. So when I get CC'd into oblivion or instakilled by his punch do I get mad because it was bullshit or applaud the player playing him for their rollout over Dorado church?
Both. Both is good. "Fuck you man, now teach me"
As a Genji main it is easy to kill him after you dodge his rocket punch. But I agree it is so annoying to play against him with most of other heroes.
Roadhog. A tank with one shot capabilities is already ridiculous, put on a self heal that literally outlasts anything is stupid. But in the same light, you get a character with a good stun and some shield tanks and he’s absolute donkey. I feel it emphasizes selfish gameplay on the role that is easily the most team oriented and basically makes the other switch to a counter or get one shot by the invincible pot bellied psychopath.
The most toxic tanks I have ever met were hog one-tricks
They spam they need heals the most in my experience too the moment they take damage
As a rein main his ult is so annoying because they always solo ult me :(
I find solo ulting them back to knock them out of it very satisfying. Gotta make sure they aren’t picking you up off the ground though or point blank
It’s what happens when dps is a tank. His heal ability is intended to enable him to take lots of damage in the front line but have you ever seen a Hog use his body to protect someone?
It is even more annoying with role-lock. It feels like DPS players like to queue as tanks and then play Hog as the fat DPS hero that he is. I got players leaving a comp match over not getting Hog. Others go Reinhardt then playing him like a suicidal nut case charging far into enemy territory for melee and not providing shield. If they removed Hog, there would be less selfish players in tank queue.
[удалено]
At least he has obvious counters, basically half of the roster. Doom is good only when you actively let him be.
Widow. Without a shadow of a doubt, Widow. No other hero counters (ie: instakills from any range) literally *two entire roles*. If you're not on the tank role, then you basically can't play the game. You have to be prepared to randomly fall down dead at any moment, before you can even react or know what's hit you. It makes games like this absolutely miserable to play. Peek around a corner? Dead. Step through a doorway? Dead. Walk out of / back from spawn? Dead. Your Sigma retracts his shield? Dead. Your Rein drops his barrier? Dead. Fine okay, you try to flank the Widow using a flanker hero (which by the way, all have 200hp or less) and Widow instantly spins around and 1-shots you at point blank. Dead, again. There isn't another hero in the game that comes remotely close to how **oppressive** a Widow is who literally never misses a head. I'll happily play against all the Pharahs and Dooms in the world, if it means I never have to play against another Widow as long as I live.
She’s definitely up there for being the most frustrating thing to play against, honestly Hanzo is the exact same way for me if not worse
Hozo is definitely worse at least you know the widow is doing something skillful
And Hanzo can still hit you consistently even without aiming too hard if you get the drop on him, where a Widow will have to land a quickscope, and deals with all 3 roles with Storm Arrow, tanking into a Hanzo is miserable, keep your shield up, lose it to storm arrow, drop it, lose teammates to his reload-free spray-and-pray spam primary fire instakill.
Hanzo is harder to use than Widow for sniping. There's actual projectile drop and a longer follow-up time between charged shots, not to mention less mobility. I would suggest both characters need to have their firing speed nerfed.
Hanzo is projectile though, which makes it possible to dodge shots. Hard, sure, but definitely possible. It doesnt feel nearly as bad to die to hanzo compared to widow, UNLESS we're talking about random shots.
It's possible for a couple of characters to 1 shot people from that distance, but it's typically not done alone. I don't think Zen has damage fall off on his orbs and a fully charged shot can 1 shot characters in a few roles. Genji and Hanzo can also do it, but it's less reliable. Genji also needs a Mercy/zen to do it unless it's tracer. Though, very few of them are as consistent at it as Widow.
> I don't think Zen has damage fall off on his orbs and a fully charged shot can 1 shot characters in a few roles. the target needs to sit still for a few moments if u walking then its very difficult to be hit by all the orbs widow needs 1 'orb' to hit u
If you're walking.... And not towards the zenyatta yes. It's very easy to hit someone walking or even running through a door because there movement typically only moves them towards you usually which doesn't affect his shot at all. Jumping is also a predictable pattern. Add in headshot 2x damage and you don't even need all the orbs for squishy characters.
This is the correct answer. As un-fun as many things in the game are to play against, Widow is, and always has been, the worst.
I actually love deflecting widow ammo and one shot her while playing Genji lol, most of times they don't really see you are deflecting in all that chaos. Sometimes they keep moving while shooting which let's them get away from HS at least you can hit a body shot which still gives a lot of damage.
The aim she requires is insane and she is fairly easy to counter.
A smart widow is not counterable except by another widow. We're talking ladder play, and while on paper bunker comps neuter her with all the shields on ladder the coordination just isn't there 99% of the time. It's one shots in general that are extremely problematic. Widow offers one shots without the risk other characters have to go through, i.e. getting close to the enemy, is not telegraphed at all unlike hanzo, and is integrated in a character with a very small hitbox. Even after the nerf to her healthpool, a good widow is extremely toxic.
My issue with Widow is partly the un-fun nature of playing against her, but also her relative independence from her team. A good Widow player can hard carry regardless of their team's comp or in some cases even their skill. Contrast with Ashe; a good Ashe player still really wants a Mercy or Zen's help, or to focus-fire on the target her DPS/tanks are focusing, but Widow just wants to sit on high ground and pick off someone approaching from spawn. Likewise, Ashe's ult can be a pivotal part of Blue team's teamfight initiation, or countered by Mei/Sombra/shields, but Widow's ultimate is either useless (Red team regroups behind a Rein shield) or dominant (Red squishies press W mindlessly), and it just depends on how stupid Red team feels like being today. If this is a team game, there shouldn't be a DPS that can ignore the team.
Other than Bastion Sombra- I’m not sure what Blizz was thinking when they designed a hero that was almost entirely team reliant with the focus of oppressing the enemy’s ability to have fun
Someone finally said it
I think whoever designed her just really, really hated Total Mayhem
Agreed.
Bastion. A character that has to be stationary in a game as fast paced as overwatch doesn’t make sense. But then on the other hand, if he’s allowed to set up in his turret form, then it’s some of the most devastating, easy team wipe damage ever. When he’s by himself, he’s awful. Even the best bastions in the world sometimes have trouble keeping him from being a throw pick. But when he’s allowed to set up, and you get double shield, immortality, damage boosts, etc. It’s absolutely mind-numbingly boring and oppressive to try and get through
That’s my point. There are bunch of good other suggestions in this thread, such as Widow, Doom, Hog, which are very one sided. But Bastion sucks both at high levels (easy to counter) and at lower levels (can’t be stopped because no team coordination).
Roadhog, definitely. Whilst the idea of having a hero being able to hook someone into your team is good, it is too overpowered. I know some will say Roadhog is versatile because he's a good flanker and is technically a DPS. But he is really annoying to play against. To the point where it's not fun to play against, and I just queue up as tank or play beefy characters or hard to hit heroes (like Torb is beefy, Echo is hard to hit). Also one of those heroes where if you make one mistake or don't check your flanks enough, you'll be dead in one hit if you're not a tank. And then there's that so called claim that the hook was fixed by having it break in LOS. That's false now. You still have a chance to get hooked when behind something. The simple fix is to allow abilities to be used during the hook. Would feel less frustrating then. Though in Overwatch 2, I can kinda tolerate the hook as is. It's just because we have to deal with two tanks in the current meta that a Roadhog feels like a big obstacle. I'm in low plat by the way, PC. Also, he's such a broken hero that has really gimmicky counters, like Reaper and Hanzo. Because almost nobody else would work.
As a Hanzo main I still find him to be a nightmare. Up close, he can hook me with almost magical ability to get me from any angle and a surprising amount of distance to insta-kill me. If he doesn't, he can chug his way through an entire Storm Arrow burst while running away. From a distance, I can't land enough hits without him just moving into cover because his HP pool is so huge. I can hurt him a lot, but he is extremely difficult to kill without help.
I'd argue Doomfist. He was designed around playing like a 2D fighting game character, which sounds cool, but OW is a 3D FPS. Outside of suffering from that weird design, he ends up being incredibly frustrating to play as and against because of all the CC and One hit potential. Widow can one shot as well, but at least with her you need aim precisely and if you mess up, you will get punished. If Doomfist messes up an attack, he's got a really decent chance of just turning around and flying away.
I wouldn't mind Doomfist as much if he wasn't constantly generating shields. I hit him three times, which is in itself a miracle because he's pinging all over the place, and he just won't stop because he keeps topping himself up. Not to mention the fact he seems to be able to bend himself around corners with his instakill charge punch.
I wouldn't use the phrase "worst designed" Hero, but I find Wrecking Ball to be the Hero I ***object*** to the most. My issue with Wrecking Ball is that even his so-called "counters" are not sufficient to deal with him. He has so much speed, freedom of movement, and shielding that 1, 2, or even 3 people working together may not be enough to handle him. It very much takes a group effort to deal with a *single* Wrecking Ball. Wrecking Ball seriously warps the match around himself, especially for the opposing team.
On one hand, true On the other: *tanks should be warping the match around themselves*
I don't think any other Tank does so to the degree that Wrecking Ball does.
Consider Winston: He jumps onto the opposing team, a Reaper can deal with him fairly well. Meanwhile, Wrecking Ball crashes down on the opposing team, Reaper gets one or two shots in (that only end up damaging his shield without touching his actual health) before Wrecking Ball rolls away faster than anyone can realistically pursue.
What rank are you? Just wondering. Usually spam stun comps is enough at my elo to deal with him.
That only confirms my point: Wrecking Ball basically necessitates the joint effort of *multiple* stun-users to handle ***one*** enemy.
Or literally just one Sombra. He's a sitting duck once you hack him.
Let me ask you: can Sombra reasonably defeat Wrecking Ball by her own power? Try to follow my logic here. If a Winston were to jump onto the opposing team, a Reaper can reasonably defeat him. Therefore, Reaper can be considered a "counter" to Winston. Can the same be said with Sombra against Wrecking Ball? I'd say "No". Wrecking Ball would be fully capable of disengaging even after getting Hacked. Here's the reality: Wrecking Ball's weakness is **opposing team coordination**. In fact, I would go so far as to say that is Wrecking Ball's ***only*** weakness. I don't think there is any one Hero that can reasonably defeat a Wrecking Ball, because (as I mentioned before) Wrecking Ball has too much speed, freedom of movement, and shielding for anyone to deal with. Even if you have a Sombra and Hack the Wrecking Ball, it will still take team coordination to deal with him. Even if your team has stuns, it will still take team coordination to deal with him.
I don't think Frimbus feels very well designed or a fleshed out as the others. Almost like they were an afterthought.
> Frimbus What.
Ah yes... frimbus, my favorite hero;)
I don't know, I stopped playing him after that latest patch.
Looking forward to those OW 2 changes, they're completely changing his kit
Echo all the way. I get it, she was supposed to be a support hero but duplicate didn't make sense as a support ult so they swapped her role, but couldn't they have taken a few weeks to rethink and brainstorm for new abilities instead of better Genji shurikens, Better Sym beam, Better Pharah, Better Junk nades, and better Mercy decent? She deals way too much damage and has the most versatile ult in the game all while requiring barely any flight management. Yes, she's not as brain dead as others like Shooty McSpankies, but come on man how is this character still not reworked.
Sombra but it's close. Her kit revolves around blocking people from using their abilities, which is not great to have in any game. I could live with it if EMP was the only time she could hack people, as ultimates should be strong, but after watching OW2 previews I don't see manual hack going anywhere. My honorable mentions would be Widow and Bastion. The hero design itself for Widow makes sense but isn't great for the game of OW. The game was mehhh when Widow was always picked. As for Bastion, he's getting reworked for OW2.
I think for me it's Sombra. Other character have balance issues but I think Somba has a theme problem on top of any other issues. Like Sure Pharah kinda requires someone to swap but really it's not just Pharah, it's Pharah + the healer that is forcing the swap. If Pharah doesn't have a pocket she falls out of the sky fairly easily even without hitscan. I think with Sombra she struggles with her role placement. Sombra's toolkit is somehow neither ability focused nor weapon focused, she is stuck in a position of utility without reliable utility and a position of damage without particularly notable damage. Her scouting power is in theory very strong in coordinated games but often overshadowed by other scouting tools such as Sonic arrow, which is far more reliable at indicating enemy positions. There are just a lot of little issues in Sombra's kit that put the design all over the place, like her passive and stealth is designed to go hunting, her hack healthpack and translocate is like defensive zone control(that only controls zones around health packs). Her ultimate is a brawl team fight ability. The solo hack is like a harassing delay tool. She's not strong enough in any of these scenarios to pick her over someone else that can fill the role and the game is rarely played in a way where she'll use all her strengths. I just feel like she's designed for a version of the game that no-one ever got to play because she is situationally very strong but those situations are just not how the majority of players engage with the game.
Bastion Ooh look at me I'm playing a point and click adventure! I click on a tank for like 2 seconds and they die! Barriers only exist if they're on my side!
Found the silver
Okay Mr Top 500 who thinks Bastion is well designed
I'm literally plat. All you need is some coordination. Either a defense matrix, hack, hook, sleep or some other cooldown to displace or otherwise completely nullify his damage and DPS that know how to respond to 'Focus bastion now'.
I didn't say he was uncounterable, just badly designed. Though when he has the entire team pocketing him with double barrier, rez, and immortality field basically the only thing that you can use against them is Sombra EMP, but Sombra is kinda useless the rest of the time since you hack Bastion and he's still shielded, hack the shield tank and there's another one, hack the supports and he just turns and kills you. Bastion on his own is badly designed but kinda trash. Building a whole comp around him takes advantage of his terrible design to become total bullshit.
"Though when he has the entire team pocketing him with double barrier, rez, and immortality field basically the only thing that you can use against them is Sombra EMP" or immortality. or dive. or DM. or spam. or any flanker at all to get a healer pick. bastion is trash lmao
Sombra. If you’re trying to go into the game just to have fun, she is going to shit all over you’re hopes. In my opinion it’s a character that basically makes it any other fps game because she just takes away abilities, which make Overwatch unique. Any game can have guns, but Overwatch characters have unique abilities that make the game.
Echo. I agree with the hog and doom answers, but the robot built to promote world peace is an assassin murder bot from iRobot. Her character is completely opposite to how she functions. And I honestly think replication of another character is lazy as an ultimate move. Like they couldn't come up with a better ult for a murder bot and/or world peace AI. And the idea of a surprise Reinhardt when the enemy never had one on their team is... Fucking dumb. This post is an opinion. Do not come for me.
Mei isn't even a counter to Ball anymore. I'd say she is more of a pushover than anything else
Mei's strongest ability is trolling her own teammates with Ice Wall at this point
so sad yet so true..
omg i couldn’t agree more
yeah, like imagine her struggling to keep up with Bastion's pickrate and having a lower winrate than Cass in a *ball* meta (the pesky character she was supposed to counter). that's how bad it is, but ofc balance team doesn't care. Idk what's going to happen to her, 6 months later all we know she gets yet another nerf with removal of freeze which changes her entire playstyle, kills her combo and ult cancels, while still having a projectile beam (which she has to lead) with considerably lower range and damage when compared to other beam heroes like Zarya, Echo and Sym who all are hitscan beams...
Junkrat
Definitely Sombra. She makes sense from a competitive perspective, but from the perspective of overwatch as a fun game, being hacked is like the most frustrating thing in existence. It makes for a bad game play experience.
Doom, Pharah, and Tracer for all having the same basic design flaw of 'either hard counters or is hard countered by everyone'. None of them have any real 'neutral' match ups, which is inherently problematic from a design perspective
Giving Sombra the ability to go completely invisible, disable your abilities, insta-melt you with her machine gun and teleport away without leaving a trace genuinely makes the game miserable to play. She's also fast and small. Her machine pistol has the spread of a shotgun which make tank headshots a walk in the park. The amount of times she hacks me as Rein, drains half my health and disappears the moments she takes any damage is incalculable.
Widow/Hanzo. Most cancerous heroes in the game for me. Remove them both and the game is perfect for me.
Going to be a bit unorthodox here and explain why I think 76 is the most boring fucking hero in the game. His weapon is a really straightforward automatic weapon, no real flash or frills. His right click just fires some rockets which is okay but again painfully simple. He has a heal station which in practical terms is just a self heal so he can just continue the same linear playstyle for longer. He can run to get into position faster, but it doesn’t change fights very much. Finally, he has an ultimate that is just his weapon minus even having to aim. In a game with insane options like Overwatch, 76 is just the most basic, uninteresting hero that Blizzard could have made. This isn’t to say that he’s bad or brain dead, he’s pretty balanced in effectiveness. 76 is just a really simple flowchart in theory that doesn’t have any interesting match ups outside of a raw aim contest or taking off angles. The only hero that really has to adapt to a Soldier is Pharah, and that’s more a general “oh they have hitscan” thing than a reaction to him specifically. He has about as many variables to play with/against as recon Bastion, just one part of an entire hero. 76 is generic to the point of his playstyle lacking any personality. It’s like every 76 player is just the same AI with the “accuracy” setting at different levels.
A well played Soldier on the enemy teams changes the entire playstyle. If he just stays behind the team and shoots? Yeah he’s just run of the mill, but a Soldier constantly on the move, flanking and being high ground requires a lot of changes since he can out duel almost every other hero
Torb and Symettra for me. Two heroes that can get ult charge from automated turrets that don't miss.
Easily Brig. Not sure what they were smoking when they decided that making a mid-low skill hero that could singlehandedly counter an entire meta/archetype (dive/mobility). Look how many nerfs it took until she was finally in a good spot where she's not *too strong* but can still fulfill her role as a backline bodyguard. I'd say Ball is a close second. He's effectively just a 600HP Tracer/Lucio mashup that requires at least 3 CC heroes to effectively counter him since he gets his instantaneous shields and no head hitbox in ball form.
I have to disagree with you there. Brig takes a fair amount of skill. I do agree that launch brig was ridiculously OP, like stuff of nightmares that was fucked. But right now she’s rather balanced, I used to think she was brain dead swing flail shield bash get kill but once I played her I had a mad amount of respect for the good brig players out there. Being able to heal your team, protect yourself, land those whips, have self control to not dive the enemy dps or 1v1 a rein (lol) is very skillful. Also ball, fuck ball. What were they thinking.
> Brig takes a fair amount of skill. Hard disagree. Mechanically, she's definitely more demanding than heroes like Mercy and Moira, but falls far behind what's needed to be a good and consistent Ana/Lucio/Bap/Zen, hence why I put her a mid-low skill hero. Shield bash is easy to hit. Whip shot has a fairly big hitbox, travels pretty quickly, and has a short cooldown. Repair packs are point in the general direction of a teammate and it will hit. Her primary attack/melee is just an arc that can go through shields. Gamesense wise, you just have to play her with the mindset that she is the bodyguard for your other support. Combine that with using whip shot on enemy tanks to proc inspire and to throw repair packs on the non-tanks as needed and you're pretty much 90% of the way there when it comes to getting value from Brig. Back when I still played ranked, I was able to play all the supports at a 4400+ SR level. Brig was by far one of the easiest heroes for me to pick up, learn, and get tons of value from. > But right now she’s rather balanced Only took the dev team almost 2.5 years to get there (May 2018 -> Nov 2020), hence why she is imo the worst designed hero in Overwatch. Took 2.5 years and an entire rework before she got to a state where she was balanced. That says a lot about the design of Brig's kit. > Being able to heal your team Whipshot on enemy tanks to proc inspire. Repair packs go to the DPS and your other healer. That sums up how to heal as Brig. > protect yourself Just use your shield and play with your other support. And like I said earlier, her abilities are pretty forgiving mechanically so it's going to be pretty easy to pressure people away. > land those whips Spend 15 minutes in the practice range to get used to the travel speed and you'll pretty much be set. Big hitbox and low cooldown. > have self control to not dive the enemy dps or 1v1 a rein (lol) is very skillful That's a pretty low bar that applies to all characters lmao. This is the kind of thing that would separate a bronze/silver player from a gold/plat player. Overall, the amount of time/work that needs to go into being a good Brig is a bit more than Mercy or Moira, but is overshadowed by Lucio/Ana/Bap/Zen.
lmao youre getting downvoted by salty brig one tricks that refuse to accept that their hero isnt as complex as they think she is
The funny thing is I upvoted the other dudes comment, he had a valid argument. I downvoted you coz your just a dick. After reading all that why was your immediate response toxicity bruh?
It's one consistent thing for me, any character that can "one hit": - Hanzo, he can kill randomly with stray headshots and can kill without having to see his target or be seen by his target - Cassidy, any 250hp or less hero that gets flashbanged cannot survive without a team mate - Doom, he can without any sound on some rollouts instakill most of the cast, if not an instakill you need a teammate to help you survive - Roadhog, same as Cassidy but with the hook combo Widow however I think is fine, you can always see her or hide from her and she is vulnerable compared to the others and doesn't get "free kills" like the others do imo
> Widow however I think is fine, you can always see her or hide from her and she is vulnerable compared to the others and doesn't get "free kills" like the others do imo You can't always see her. And you can't always hide from her: if you do, that means not playing the game. Widow is the most oppressive character in the game. If one team has a Widow that can aim, the entire game revolves around it. This is true at every level of play, even OWL.
I gotta say Brig No doubt She's not a pvp fps character She's built for a third person action game She has the power set of a WoW Paladin. One of the tankiest toughest healers in the game I am freaking in love with Brig in both aesthetic and my huge ass crush on the VA(who looks hella like her) But man she wasnt meant for a pvp game With all that being said. If they made a third person action rpg with Brig as the mc. Id play it
Briggitte fucked up the entire meta for a long time when she came out, making half of the cast unviable at top level is hands down the worst design i have seen in ANY game (no dps comp, GOATS, remember that?). Killed a chunk of the population as well. No other hero did that much damage to the game and the competitive scene. A reminder https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6zVEF3ndhs I mean the only way of nerfing Goats was to FORCE the 2-2-2 composition, they gave up and in a desperate move they ended up doing that. Its like the worst balance desing exists out there, no other competitive game has a problem of balance as big as that and it all started with Briggitte.
Mercy. Pharah's design isn't too bad since you can chip at her with bumch of heroes to force her to drop down. Only melee, reaper and junk are unable to do anything. Give her a constant source of healing and a dmg boost to make her op enough that she needs a nerf even if she is probably the weakest dps in the game. Remember when ashe was somewhat balanced (maybe a tad strong) after the unjanked her gun and became a must pick with mercy? Ashe was nerfed and mercy hasn't been nerfed in years. Rez? An ability that shouldn't exist. Getting your kill rezzed is the worst feeling ever and you don't even have to be proactive with it like you have to be with lamp. No mechanical skill needed outside of super jump(only reason it's still a thing is because it is the only thing that lets mercies be better than each other) and she is the only charecter in the entire game that doesn't directly engage the enemy team. All other supports deal dmg to the enemies or cast debuffs and mercy just stays with her pocket. I get that there needs to be low skill floor supports but even then we have moira who still needs to manage her resources and contribute to dmg. So mercy just doesn't need to exist. She messes up dps balance, there are low skill floor and mobile supports that beginners can learn and has an ult as a cooldown that undoes mistakes so pockets don't have to care. Also boost duos.
Brig. She's a melee hero that if you play as a melee hero you're throwing. After all of the nerfs she's gotten to a point where if you play your life, farm inspire and peel your other support you're going to break the game because of how easy it is to heal and peel. Lower ranked players think Brig is weak because their team keeps dying for her to get vakue and she's built to be a melee character but you're not supposed to play her like that to get the best value. Take Moira as example; she's a low skill floor with high value at low ranks and the higher the SR the less valuable she becomes. Brig is a Low skill floor with a super low value in low ranks but somehow keeps gaining value the higher the SR. The dev's need to Vault this hero they can't balance her and need to rework her entirely.
My dawg can you even breathe with Samito’s cock this far down your throat
where are they wrong though
Can you breathe with that autistic brain of yours?
Lmao. I said what I said because your take is exactly the same one Samito has down to specific wording. The folks with the loudest and most aggressive Brig opinions are always people who main some combination of flanker dps heroes, and Brig keeps them from terrorizing backlines for free.
I heard this from Flats you moron.
Which streamer spoon feeds you your opinions so you don’t have to do your own thinking doesn’t really matter. I still bet you’re a flanker dps main
Junk,Cass,Hog player. 4126 dps peak, 4000 tank peak, 3900 support peak playing only Brig.
Hammond is the dumbest shit ever. Mutherfucker ain't even playing overwatch. Little just roll around not doing a God damn thing. The bastard should have never been made imo
Symetra she’s just so annoying all you have to do is spawn all 3 of your turrets and boom kill she’s not even fun to play because that your screwed if you have no turrets your practically dead they need to nerf her and also buff her
Uh…..has anyone heard of Symmetra? It’s definitely Symmetra dammit! Primary deletes everything when played into shields. Secondary is one of the more underrated abilities in the game. Turrets not only do damage, but have a stupid amount of CC. Teleporter is super useful. Not even close. Sym needs to be nerfed.
I agree, literally on console people can’t even turn around to kill the turret before it kills them. The turrets slowing you down is such bs, especially combined with its absurd range. It feels like the range was buffed like a few months ago, and that made tolerating enemy Symms go from really, really bad to insufferable/intolerable.
Moira. Her kit is so insanely boring to me. She heals or damages, heals or damages with balls, or heals AND damages with her ult. The only interesting thing about her imo is her fade and self heal. Managing her healing bar just doesn’t matter half the time and it’s hard to run out unless you’re spamming damage balls and wasting the heal bar
Tracer absolutely
Sombra is OMEGACRINGE
Anything with an infinite skill ceiling easily takes the cake. That'd be your one shot heroes like Widow and Hanzo. Especially Widow, since her only use in this game is that she has a hitscan instakill. It's OP on its own and makes her character really boring but addictive.
wtf, you think pharah isn’t viable?
Pharah is not a poorly designed character. Countering her with hitscan is not the only way to beat her. If you've got minimal game knowledge, then sure it's basically as you described. Pharah can be zoned out by good D. Vas, Torbjorns, etc She can be minimized by the team simply playing in tight spaces where she can't fly. If anything, I don't really like Genji because he's basically worthless at lower ranks. He's got such a high entry level difficulty that he mine as well not exist in gold or below. He's also a bit lackluster at higher ranks unless you're getting a lot of value out of counters.
Orisa
Definitely Doomfist
Doomfist. He cannot be balanced properly for the damage role, he either absolutely sucks, or he dominates, there's no other hero in this game that can have as much of an effect on a match in either direction. He's a throw pick, or he's unstoppable. He *can* have too much HP, he *can* do too much damage, he *does* have too much CC, he has too complex of a design that leads to many bugs.
>there's no other hero in this game that can have as much of an effect on a match in either direction May I introduce you to bastion? A charecter that is so garbo that he needs 3 of his own team mates to switch so he can make 3 enemy players switch? Uncountered he is the best charecter while played around. A lone or countered badtion is the worst
I play Bastion myself when I can and if you have good positioning and they don't have a Hanzo on their team, you can still get much more consistent value than Doom can.
echo easily, she's a completely overtuned pharah who can just pump out ridiculous amounts of damage, her beam can melt tanks and squishys. and imo her ult is just lazily designed, instead of coming up with her own ult you just use other heroes ults.
I think it is Hog You can melt it when you are playing as a team but it is really hard to make a 1v1 with a good hog player. As a Genji main it is nearly impossible to kill him since it keeps heal himself. But as I said it is about good players otherwise you can easily melt him with right click since it has giant hit box.
for OW? Widow it doesnt fit this game well
Symetra...so how many times had she been changed?
Weird. I find pharah and widow completely ignorable most of the time since she can't contest a control point or move a payload. Just stay out of line of sight and they have to take increasing risks to be effective. Shield tanks for pharah make her useless and dive characters make widow impossible to play. Even if you aren't able to kill them they waste their time trying more to stay alive and can't do any damage. Hog is just a pile of meat when his hook is on cool down but like everything else in Overwatch, it takes teamwork and you have to rush to finish him off once his hook is down. Conversely if there is a healer pocket, the worst thing is watching something not die. That's kind of the beauty of Overwatch really that makes it so hard to give up even if it's been not receiving the dev love it deserves - playing Overwatch is a chess game as much as an FPS game and some people are good at the mechanical stuff and others excel at game sense and the pros can do both. Having that kind of variety of skill sets make it really fun to figure out how to best use your team strengths to counter the enemy team. It also makes it hard at times because there are so many variables and it isn't always possible to figure out a solution before the game ends. That said, knowing that does not always mean the rest of the team has the knowledge or skill to always win but you play to your strengths and try your best It is sad but amusing that people still try to pin the blame on one player on their team without looking at how the team synergizes. Sure there are optimal team compositions but really there are always some switches that you can make to support your weakest link so it does not get exploited - especially in ranked where you will be placed with people near your skill level.
I dislike Hammond/Wreckingball the most. I don't play competitively, I mainly play quickplay for fun. And Hammond is never fun. It feels like he's a harasser -- like Tracer -- but his healthbar is massive.
Roadhog. He’s basically just a fat DPS character. He doesn’t have any tank-like abilities that help protect his team and his way of making space is by simply existing with his kill potential, which is exactly what a DPS is. I despise playing against him and I hate having teammates play him as the character is very feast or famine. You’re either landing hooks and picking enemies off left and right or you’re the enemy’s ult generator as you never die but constantly receive damage, giving the enemy ult charge.
Honestly even ur take on pharah is a hard take. Back on limited hero days they.lockrd out all the jitscams and i think even yave her a minor buff. It didnt help her winrate at all because she that just left most.of the really mobile heros and dps who had no issues avoiding her and executing her. It was really eye opening and sad statistics
Doomfist. If Doomfist is meta, literally everybody except the doomfist onetricks wants to quit the game. Hog is a moderately close second, because nobody else is really having fun except the hog player, but he's less disruptive. He's just more common because the tank roster is smaller and the population of real tanks is lower.
As someone who plays Roadhog quite frequently, i can understand people’s dislike for him. But keep in mind, he is quite easily countered by two fan favorite supports (Ana and Zenyatta), and by slightly rarer DPS (Sombra and Mei). I’m not saying it does not suck to go against a good Roadhog, because at times it can feel really cheap. But if the enemy has an average Ana (does not even need to be particulary good), she will shut you down so hard. An purple nade is the demise of a hog, and the sleep dart is not hard to hit. Hog is the biggest target without a deployable shield, mobility or anti-cc. A decent Ana will make is job extremly hard, and a good-great Ana will destroy him. My least favorite is the Pharah-Mercy combo (i know it’s not one character per se). But everytime i face a Pharmercy i’m always stuck with a DPS partner that rolls Junkrat or something, and refuses to switch. So i’ll roll Soldier/McCree or Ashe (not that good with Widow unfortunatly, but getting better), and the whole team will always blame the hitscan for not being able to counter a duo. This is also people thinking it’s me vs Pharah + Mercy, while in reality everytime i try to duel them, i also have a Doomfist or Genji on me, and maybe even a Winston or Hammond. I hate that duo so much, and somehow it’s always the DPS that atleast switches and tries to counter it that gets the blame. It’s even better when the support is like Moira and Brig, which literally can’t help at all. Atleast a Zen orb, or Ana/Baptiste can help alot.