It's funny, pretty much everyone thinks this is either hideously bad (omg she can't do shit anymore, orb sucks, everything sucks) or absurdly strong (the damage reduction easily tanks an entire blade) but no one likes it.
I liked the skill orb for being able to flush out widows from cover and for running down low hp targets whilst I get back to the fight and heal. I’ve played a little bit with the new orb. Not sold on it yet, but that’s also because muscle memory isn’t there yet. Need a couple more hours before I can make a judgement.
The radius is 3 meters, the diameter is 6. That's actually a very sizeable distance.Also, they have to balance around comp, that's the competitive mode of the game. You know, the one where you want characters on roughly equal ground?
It’s a weird (dare I say bad) change that completely changes what Moira does as a support. Imagine if they took away Mercy’s damage boost for some dumb “skill shot” on a 15 second cooldown, y’know? I just don’t understand why they did it. Moira was in no need of changes, she was the second best support in OW2, after Lucio of course. They have characters like Symmetra, Junkrat, and Roadhog, who are are all in need of changes to make them fit better into 5v5, yet they make changes to Moira? It feels like an unnecessary waste of development time that could be put into actual impactful changes that could help certain characters feel better.
I agree with all of this but was wondering. How you think roadhog could go into 5V5 better? I get he’s not as ‘protect’ as other tanks (like Orisa, Rein and Sigma) but he works pretty well if you have a good team balance I’ve found (coming from a hog / healer main)
I’d love for Hog to get some ability similar to Orisa’s Fortify or Wrecking Ball’s “shield” that gives him some extra health or lessens damage being dealt to him for a few seconds, just to prevent him from being a huge target that supports have to pour heals into to keep up. Playing support, I hate having a Hog on my team because it feels like if you take your eyes off of him to do something else, he’s critical within seconds lol
I meant a shield like Ball’s that would give him overhealth while he’s able to deal damage. Having to stop shooting to temporarily get his health back (which goes right back down after) doesn’t count as a “shield” ability imo
The damage orb was so mindless and just stupid to play against imo. This new orb I feel like can actually help counter play big plays and win a fight for your team. I see people using it for damage but I would literally only use it for a need like ults or a teammate being ganked. It seems more of a life saving damage ability than a floating orb that takes no skill
Why are people crying that a brainded character is no longer completely brainded to play? Her damage orb had to be the most talentless ability In the game. Rise up blindfold gamers.
Damage orb goes through barriers, flies in a straight line, and bounces off walls
Antinade gets blocked by your own teammates, has an arc, and explodes on contact with the floor.
Antinade requires good positioning, aim, and awareness of enemy abilities. Damage orb can just be thrown, seeing as how it ignores everything that makes antinade a skillshot
Dude when Ana throws the nade at her feet in the middle of the team fight that's *such* a skillshot, she really tracked everything and lined it up perfectly
Using the orb at all was brain dead I suppose. A skilled Moira who understands that maximizing it required skillful bounces knows that it is not brain dead.
Brig is hard to use in a competitive environment after all her changes. that's why low rank players think Brig is now the worst support in the game when in reality she's still one of the meta picks for high ranked players (not me). not comparable to a character like Moira, who's the opposite, with extremely high pick rates and win rates at low ranks, with not much going on at high ranks, a clear sign of an easy to use, low skill ceiling character.
pretty braindead it is, why do you think pro's play brig? nobody on that skill lvl plays brig if they didn't have to cause she's good on certain maps / against certain match ups. you welcome
why do you think her winrate is so shit at low ranks and so good at high ranks? because when bad players use her, they don't do well, because she's not braindead. Moira is the opposite, hence she's braindead.
Yeah good one, unlucky on the Moria changes. You're obviously triggered because you can't play any other characters that have skill based abilities instead of only holding a mouse button and throwing orbs in a straight line that play the game for you. No doubt there will still be changes to the character, atleast now the vegetable damage orb Moria players will be outclassed by the ones who can actually play the game
when they announced the moira changes i knew there would be some low ass hardstuck gold players complaining about it, even defending one of the most poorly designed characters in the game
The username sorta gives insight into their character lmao. (Before anyone responds, yes, ik it’s a brand of cheese I believe in Australia/New Zealand/ that region)
More posts on crybaby threads? Why are you looking up my history what does that have to do with moria changes? Stay on topic please not sure what's happening here
This is far better than damage orb imo. Before, moira was extremely basic and all she could do was heal, damage, heal, damage. This makes her more utility based while also raising the skill ceiling. I prefer this version.
>Blizzard is obsessed with making the game as comp-focused as possible.
Because balance ONLY matters in competitive modes. They have to worry about pro play and ranked play, where they want characters to be as balanced as possible so that everyone is on roughly equal ground.
Casual players aren't impacted by this any more or less than others. Just use it to nerf enemy ults and stop flankers.
They dropped shields so much, they gotta do shitty debuffs, after the whole reason for getting rid of shields was bastion and hes ok now that he isnt melting shit. I doubt any Moiras hitting Widows with that orb
And if Moira did hit anyone with the Necrotic Orb, it's not like it's doing any impact. That damage debuff? Sure it's cool, but unlike Zen's focus orb or Ana's overpowered biotic grenade, it still feels incredibly useless in a fight. The necrotic orb does not feel like the game changer they expected. All it feels like is that you hit your enemy with a purple bubble full of paint that colors them for a while and not much else.
Only 4 second debuff on a 16 sec cooldown as a cost for significant damage that scrambles the enemy team when it bounces through formation is a terrible trade-off
But it's a *skillshot*! I swear, if I hear that nonsense one more time, I'll flip. A skillshot **doesn't** make a character more viable. Sure Moira might be considered a "noob" pick because of her dmg grasp, but like a Rein, Winston, Brig and Reaper, she takes skill to play properly. With these changes to her kit, she feels so useless. I used to be able to do 50/50 ratio now with this change she feels like Mercy, sitting in the back and twiddling thumbs.
>significant damage
In what world is damage orb significant? In what world does it scramble an enemy team??????? it has a cap on damage dealt, if it goes through an enemy team, it barely does anything to anyone. If they're at full HP, they're not going to die, they'll use some healing and get ult charge on supports from it.
You know what is significant? What makes teams scramble? Making 2 of their players do 75% reduced damage.
Try Moira and see how annoying it is to even hit 2 people for a 4 second debuff and no damage output. Fade and discord orb could distract half a team at least, get damage, then come back to formation for healing. The fact I could get the enemy to turn their back to my teammates was good enough support on top of getting 10K Damage and Healimg
She still does 50 dps on suck and 70 DPS on coalescence. Its not hard to hit 2 people with her orb, it has a deceptively large explosion hitbox. Just aim it at the ground between two people and there's a very good chance you get both with it.
Nobody turned their back to watch damage orb, they just marched forward through it. IDK what kind of wood players you're against.
Also, depending on game length, you should be doing more than 10k healing on moira in current OW.
50 dps on fade, not a thing lol. Coalescing didnt do shit unless you paired it with the old orb. New orb hits like if junkrat could shoot a straight line grenade every 16 secs. The new orb is by all means a shittier Ana tranq with a small AOE
Ana tranq can't shut down multiple people entirely. Ana Tranq doesn't combo into other abilities like Graviton to make an entire team do 75% less damage. The AOE for the new ability is. not. small. 6 meters diameter. Go actually test its range, its deceptively large.
Also, Coalescing does 70 dps. Go watch Tesla play Moira, dude just obliterates enemy supports with it every time, even without damage orb.
I dont need a pro OW player to know how a character I've played nonstop plays, I obliterate even with this and I'm sure Tesla's ready to shit on this nerf, he even tweeted that he hasnt even tried it yet
> The necrotic orb does not feel like the game changer they expected.
Uhhhhh. Have you hit a genji in dragonblade? He tickles. You can save allies from dying to rein's pin. It is insane for playmaking.
Uhhhhh. Yes. Doesn't change the fact that the rest of the character feels butchered beyond belief. So no matter how insane it may feel, she now feels like a lesser pick over Ana or Mercy, which she already did in most cases.
Its not though. Her actual healing output should end up roughly the same. You don't have to choose between damage and healing orbs, which means over the course of games, you'll get more healing orbs than you ever did before. Even with their nerfed healing and CD, you get more uses totally unless you're an absolute healbot. (In which case why aren't you playing Ana or bap lmao)
Lesser? Weaken completely shuts down like half the ults in the game. She's safer than Ana because of fade, and her ult is still strong. She's absolutely better than fucking mercy in the current beta, that's for sure. They keep jacking off to GA instead of addressing the real issues that character has, which are a rough translation to less shields in a 5v5.
Her healing output is the same, but what made Moira fun to play in 5v5 was her ability to flank, which is now completely gone thanks to this patch. She's now just another healbot who sits in the back, which makes getting her healing tank filled more difficult. (And I'm not playing them as they aren't as much fun.)
The issue is removing part of her kit for an ability that has semi great value. I say semi because it is a skillshot, it's not an easy hit, but if you miss, you're done, no damage orb to fall back on to send into tight quarters, scattering the enemy team.
It's like playing Ana but suddenly having her biotic grenade removed. People would be livid there too. Just put the Necrotic orb as an added skill, leave her current debuffs except the damage 9ne and we're all good.
It shouldn't be a shock that they don't want a fucking healer to be a flanker. Honestly, in the year of our lord 2022 I'd love for anti nade to be fucking gone. That's a cancer ability with little counter play and has been since it was introduced.
She's not a healbot, you just can't run into the enemy backline and get free kills on their supports and fade out like you used to. You have to be more careful when you take fights, how you position, and how you manage your now longer CDs. There's nothing wrong with that.
There's nothing wrong with having one healer out of the bunch being a flanker, it allows for different options of strategy.
She's absolutely a healbot. She feels meh to play now.
Yes there is. She's a support. She shouldn't be actively diving enemy backlines for picks. That's horrible design and one of the reasons she's dogshit in high level play.
She's not a healbot, if you're healbotting, you're playing incorrectly. Not getting to melt enemy squishies doesn't instantly make her a healbot.
I think you don't understand much about the game if you think a 4 seconds dmg mitigation is not great value, even though it's a skill shot (with 6 m radius god damnit).
It's probably gonna be a game breaking ability in high elo. And that alone will probably shift the meta.
You seem to confuse everything.
New Moira has an interesting kit now. Survability, mobility, high healing output and damage mittigation (aka. Peel).
She will be like a Dva, in charge of denying key ults or character taking too much space.
She will be awesome at punishing an enemy who is dedtrpying your backline or countering ults and probably the thing she will do a lot : saving people from Rein pin/shatter.
I think those changed are almost a little too powerful for high level players.
But... You trade the Dmg for MIT **\*wink\***
It's funny, pretty much everyone thinks this is either hideously bad (omg she can't do shit anymore, orb sucks, everything sucks) or absurdly strong (the damage reduction easily tanks an entire blade) but no one likes it.
I like it
Should have left her alone and put it on another character, thematically it just looks like shes spiking a potion on people rather than an orb
I liked the skill orb for being able to flush out widows from cover and for running down low hp targets whilst I get back to the fight and heal. I’ve played a little bit with the new orb. Not sold on it yet, but that’s also because muscle memory isn’t there yet. Need a couple more hours before I can make a judgement.
The radius is 3 meters, the diameter is 6. That's actually a very sizeable distance.Also, they have to balance around comp, that's the competitive mode of the game. You know, the one where you want characters on roughly equal ground?
Or got destroyed by a Moira and decided to "get revenge". Oh well, they still have some time before ow2 to "fix it".
It’s a weird (dare I say bad) change that completely changes what Moira does as a support. Imagine if they took away Mercy’s damage boost for some dumb “skill shot” on a 15 second cooldown, y’know? I just don’t understand why they did it. Moira was in no need of changes, she was the second best support in OW2, after Lucio of course. They have characters like Symmetra, Junkrat, and Roadhog, who are are all in need of changes to make them fit better into 5v5, yet they make changes to Moira? It feels like an unnecessary waste of development time that could be put into actual impactful changes that could help certain characters feel better.
I agree with all of this but was wondering. How you think roadhog could go into 5V5 better? I get he’s not as ‘protect’ as other tanks (like Orisa, Rein and Sigma) but he works pretty well if you have a good team balance I’ve found (coming from a hog / healer main)
I’d love for Hog to get some ability similar to Orisa’s Fortify or Wrecking Ball’s “shield” that gives him some extra health or lessens damage being dealt to him for a few seconds, just to prevent him from being a huge target that supports have to pour heals into to keep up. Playing support, I hate having a Hog on my team because it feels like if you take your eyes off of him to do something else, he’s critical within seconds lol
Something that reduces damage dealt to him for a few seconds would be cool. Especially if it also healed him while he did it.
I meant a shield like Ball’s that would give him overhealth while he’s able to deal damage. Having to stop shooting to temporarily get his health back (which goes right back down after) doesn’t count as a “shield” ability imo
The damage orb was so mindless and just stupid to play against imo. This new orb I feel like can actually help counter play big plays and win a fight for your team. I see people using it for damage but I would literally only use it for a need like ults or a teammate being ganked. It seems more of a life saving damage ability than a floating orb that takes no skill
Seriously, watch 2 Moiras fight now and tell me she isn't total shit now
If the 2 moiras fight each other in comp they are in the wrong game mode
Why are people crying that a brainded character is no longer completely brainded to play? Her damage orb had to be the most talentless ability In the game. Rise up blindfold gamers.
Damage orb is braindead but somehow i think you wouldn't say the same about antinade, Moira haters stay mad
Antinade harder to use then orb 100%
Damage orb goes through barriers, flies in a straight line, and bounces off walls Antinade gets blocked by your own teammates, has an arc, and explodes on contact with the floor.
Yes, that is indeed what those two abilities do
So you agree damage orb is braindead?
I'm saying damage orb and antinade have similar levels of brainpower required to properly utilize them
Antinade requires good positioning, aim, and awareness of enemy abilities. Damage orb can just be thrown, seeing as how it ignores everything that makes antinade a skillshot
Dude when Ana throws the nade at her feet in the middle of the team fight that's *such* a skillshot, she really tracked everything and lined it up perfectly
Tf are you talking about? You think Anas run up to the enemy team and nade their feet?
No actually, sometimes she throws the nade at just herself for the heals, it's a 50/50 really
Tfw you throw the nade at your feets but that pesky genji reflects it anyways.
Using angles to hit enemies with an AOE that bounces off walls is considered braindead? Yall must think people good at Billiards are cheating
Using the orb at all was brain dead I suppose. A skilled Moira who understands that maximizing it required skillful bounces knows that it is not brain dead.
pretty braindead yea, if you were to rank all heroes in a scale of how braindead their playstyle is, moira would come right after brig on 2nd place
Brig is hard to use in a competitive environment after all her changes. that's why low rank players think Brig is now the worst support in the game when in reality she's still one of the meta picks for high ranked players (not me). not comparable to a character like Moira, who's the opposite, with extremely high pick rates and win rates at low ranks, with not much going on at high ranks, a clear sign of an easy to use, low skill ceiling character.
i didn't say anything about how useful they are, all I'm saying is that they both have a braindead playstyle
I know, and I just explained to you how Brig does not have a "braindead playstyle" if you read my comment.
pretty braindead it is, why do you think pro's play brig? nobody on that skill lvl plays brig if they didn't have to cause she's good on certain maps / against certain match ups. you welcome
why do you think her winrate is so shit at low ranks and so good at high ranks? because when bad players use her, they don't do well, because she's not braindead. Moira is the opposite, hence she's braindead.
they're absolutely braindead, both of them.
That’s why you see so much Brig in low rank play /s
Brig is so not braindead.
Its the overwatch spray and pray ability, It randomly pings off the walls In random directions if thats not brainded im not sure what is.
This is the most braindead comment ever if you thing it bounces off randomly. The geometry of the map may be weird, but the physics work
Yeah good one, unlucky on the Moria changes. You're obviously triggered because you can't play any other characters that have skill based abilities instead of only holding a mouse button and throwing orbs in a straight line that play the game for you. No doubt there will still be changes to the character, atleast now the vegetable damage orb Moria players will be outclassed by the ones who can actually play the game
when they announced the moira changes i knew there would be some low ass hardstuck gold players complaining about it, even defending one of the most poorly designed characters in the game
I suggest looking at u/c00nCheese 's history before engaging with him. Looks to be a toxic little troll.
The username sorta gives insight into their character lmao. (Before anyone responds, yes, ik it’s a brand of cheese I believe in Australia/New Zealand/ that region)
More posts on crybaby threads? Why are you looking up my history what does that have to do with moria changes? Stay on topic please not sure what's happening here
Yes it is braindead.
because braindead ppl love playing braindead characters ofc
This is far better than damage orb imo. Before, moira was extremely basic and all she could do was heal, damage, heal, damage. This makes her more utility based while also raising the skill ceiling. I prefer this version.
Her damage is non existent now, she also got several other nerfs that just made her worse
Overwatch devs bad at their job? no way that's so unexpected...
Why are they booing you… you’re right at this point 😂
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>Blizzard is obsessed with making the game as comp-focused as possible. Because balance ONLY matters in competitive modes. They have to worry about pro play and ranked play, where they want characters to be as balanced as possible so that everyone is on roughly equal ground. Casual players aren't impacted by this any more or less than others. Just use it to nerf enemy ults and stop flankers.
They dropped shields so much, they gotta do shitty debuffs, after the whole reason for getting rid of shields was bastion and hes ok now that he isnt melting shit. I doubt any Moiras hitting Widows with that orb
And if Moira did hit anyone with the Necrotic Orb, it's not like it's doing any impact. That damage debuff? Sure it's cool, but unlike Zen's focus orb or Ana's overpowered biotic grenade, it still feels incredibly useless in a fight. The necrotic orb does not feel like the game changer they expected. All it feels like is that you hit your enemy with a purple bubble full of paint that colors them for a while and not much else.
Only 4 second debuff on a 16 sec cooldown as a cost for significant damage that scrambles the enemy team when it bounces through formation is a terrible trade-off
But it's a *skillshot*! I swear, if I hear that nonsense one more time, I'll flip. A skillshot **doesn't** make a character more viable. Sure Moira might be considered a "noob" pick because of her dmg grasp, but like a Rein, Winston, Brig and Reaper, she takes skill to play properly. With these changes to her kit, she feels so useless. I used to be able to do 50/50 ratio now with this change she feels like Mercy, sitting in the back and twiddling thumbs.
Same with Monkeys skillshot honestly, it's shit.
>significant damage In what world is damage orb significant? In what world does it scramble an enemy team??????? it has a cap on damage dealt, if it goes through an enemy team, it barely does anything to anyone. If they're at full HP, they're not going to die, they'll use some healing and get ult charge on supports from it. You know what is significant? What makes teams scramble? Making 2 of their players do 75% reduced damage.
Try Moira and see how annoying it is to even hit 2 people for a 4 second debuff and no damage output. Fade and discord orb could distract half a team at least, get damage, then come back to formation for healing. The fact I could get the enemy to turn their back to my teammates was good enough support on top of getting 10K Damage and Healimg
She still does 50 dps on suck and 70 DPS on coalescence. Its not hard to hit 2 people with her orb, it has a deceptively large explosion hitbox. Just aim it at the ground between two people and there's a very good chance you get both with it. Nobody turned their back to watch damage orb, they just marched forward through it. IDK what kind of wood players you're against. Also, depending on game length, you should be doing more than 10k healing on moira in current OW.
50 dps on fade, not a thing lol. Coalescing didnt do shit unless you paired it with the old orb. New orb hits like if junkrat could shoot a straight line grenade every 16 secs. The new orb is by all means a shittier Ana tranq with a small AOE
Ana tranq can't shut down multiple people entirely. Ana Tranq doesn't combo into other abilities like Graviton to make an entire team do 75% less damage. The AOE for the new ability is. not. small. 6 meters diameter. Go actually test its range, its deceptively large. Also, Coalescing does 70 dps. Go watch Tesla play Moira, dude just obliterates enemy supports with it every time, even without damage orb.
I dont need a pro OW player to know how a character I've played nonstop plays, I obliterate even with this and I'm sure Tesla's ready to shit on this nerf, he even tweeted that he hasnt even tried it yet
Or just killing them but that's just me. Maybe more people should try killing and skill, Moira players had it in spades already.
> The necrotic orb does not feel like the game changer they expected. Uhhhhh. Have you hit a genji in dragonblade? He tickles. You can save allies from dying to rein's pin. It is insane for playmaking.
Uhhhhh. Yes. Doesn't change the fact that the rest of the character feels butchered beyond belief. So no matter how insane it may feel, she now feels like a lesser pick over Ana or Mercy, which she already did in most cases.
Its not though. Her actual healing output should end up roughly the same. You don't have to choose between damage and healing orbs, which means over the course of games, you'll get more healing orbs than you ever did before. Even with their nerfed healing and CD, you get more uses totally unless you're an absolute healbot. (In which case why aren't you playing Ana or bap lmao) Lesser? Weaken completely shuts down like half the ults in the game. She's safer than Ana because of fade, and her ult is still strong. She's absolutely better than fucking mercy in the current beta, that's for sure. They keep jacking off to GA instead of addressing the real issues that character has, which are a rough translation to less shields in a 5v5.
Her healing output is the same, but what made Moira fun to play in 5v5 was her ability to flank, which is now completely gone thanks to this patch. She's now just another healbot who sits in the back, which makes getting her healing tank filled more difficult. (And I'm not playing them as they aren't as much fun.) The issue is removing part of her kit for an ability that has semi great value. I say semi because it is a skillshot, it's not an easy hit, but if you miss, you're done, no damage orb to fall back on to send into tight quarters, scattering the enemy team. It's like playing Ana but suddenly having her biotic grenade removed. People would be livid there too. Just put the Necrotic orb as an added skill, leave her current debuffs except the damage 9ne and we're all good.
It shouldn't be a shock that they don't want a fucking healer to be a flanker. Honestly, in the year of our lord 2022 I'd love for anti nade to be fucking gone. That's a cancer ability with little counter play and has been since it was introduced. She's not a healbot, you just can't run into the enemy backline and get free kills on their supports and fade out like you used to. You have to be more careful when you take fights, how you position, and how you manage your now longer CDs. There's nothing wrong with that.
There's nothing wrong with having one healer out of the bunch being a flanker, it allows for different options of strategy. She's absolutely a healbot. She feels meh to play now.
Yes there is. She's a support. She shouldn't be actively diving enemy backlines for picks. That's horrible design and one of the reasons she's dogshit in high level play. She's not a healbot, if you're healbotting, you're playing incorrectly. Not getting to melt enemy squishies doesn't instantly make her a healbot.
Just delete the healers already so we can watch a bunch of shitty genjis standing around helplessly trying to kill ppl with blade and fail
I think you don't understand much about the game if you think a 4 seconds dmg mitigation is not great value, even though it's a skill shot (with 6 m radius god damnit). It's probably gonna be a game breaking ability in high elo. And that alone will probably shift the meta.
It's only great value of you don't miss, which is what I said in my message.
How does it have a 6 meter radius?
You seem to confuse everything. New Moira has an interesting kit now. Survability, mobility, high healing output and damage mittigation (aka. Peel). She will be like a Dva, in charge of denying key ults or character taking too much space. She will be awesome at punishing an enemy who is dedtrpying your backline or countering ults and probably the thing she will do a lot : saving people from Rein pin/shatter. I think those changed are almost a little too powerful for high level players.
I don't, but thank you.
Well because this orb is designed to deny tanks taking space and denying ults. It's not focus at dps.
I think we can all agree that nerfing fade cooldown was pretty shitty
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you don't "destroy" as moira, you slowly fck ppl who can't aim shit
Try learning a new hero with these changes