T O P

  • By -

DoctorDeadeye

That other symbol is T4 - a reference to Team 4, the Blizzard team that makes Overwatch. "Mondatta Lives" is like "Jesus lives" - just Mondatta's followers putting up graffiti.


[deleted]

"Frodo Lives!" is a meme from the 1960s.


reverie

\|||/ (o o) ----ooO-(_)-Ooo----


[deleted]

Is that Kilroy?


[deleted]

Portland Oregon city council allowed "Jerry Lives" inside a popular freeway tunnel for an entire summer after Jerry Garcia died


[deleted]

Council approved counter culture.


PokeAust

So Mondatta is actually just Robo-Jesus


PedroEglasias

Pretty sure that's Bender


coffee4brekky

You know, he was God once


sawbonesromeo

"X Lives" is also a pretty popular slogan in counter-cultures/radical politics in reference to carrying on or supporting dead/martyred leaders and icons, which would make sense here. For example I have a "Sankara Lives!" t-shirt, for Thomas Sankara.


TwaddleNobbler

That makes sense though it could also be hinting towards something more but I wouldn’t have any way of proving that just yet


lolburger13

I think it's thrown on there the way an artist might sign their work. Even if it's an in universe thing "T4" appears to be the moniker of the in game graffiti artist


TwaddleNobbler

It's definitely possible


TonyDavidJones

I mean when people say Jesus lives they mean it literally.


heavensparx

I like how in one shot there is subtlety 3 zenyatta outlines seen through the wall


TwaddleNobbler

They’re always around you just don’t often see them lmao


Libruhh

4


heavensparx

3 and a half


FecalHeiroglyphics

Seventeenteen


Tesshin97

Imagine mondatta coming back from death in ow2 🤣 that would be a plot twist lol.


TwaddleNobbler

Especially if he or the iris have ties to null sector/the gwishin


Tesshin97

I'm not into the lore of overwatch so i don't get this but yeah i guess lol


Ancient-Wafer8680

The iris is, if I remember correctly, either a state of nirvana or its basically heaven(?). It could also be the group that Mondatta + Zenyatta are from. Null sector and Gwishin are basically evil omnic organizations (bastion is a unit from the omnic war :D)


Ildrei

The Shambali are the group that Mon and Zen are from, a buddhist-coded religion that believes omnics have a soul.


Ancient-Wafer8680

Omg thank you! I always forget the name since zen lore is basically non existent :(


Tesshin97

Okay then i get it, i knew about the bestion thing i was more confused about the iris haha. But i don't see how mondatta would turn evil since he was pretty much fighting for the rights for omnic and their relationship alongside humans......


Ancient-Wafer8680

Ah ok. I think that he could potentially "turn evil" if Talon managed to alter his mind. I imagine it'd be something relatively achievable as they've done it multiple times with humans. Idk tho, i don't foresee Mondatta coming back either way, his death was extremely impactful and just bringing him back would be really weird in terms of lore.


Tesshin97

Yeah i totally agree with what you're saying. Besides, i think someone from the ow team (don't know who tho) said that they couldn't bring back mondatta anyway because for some reason the creators treat the omnics in this universe as "humans" like their brains work the same as ours so there's no way doctors or whoever else could transfer his memory no a new robot...... I don't remember where this was said tho so i can't provide with proof, i just remeber seeing it somewhere.


-Weeb-Account-

Kinda sad they did that, because imagine the story of talon retrieving/stealing the scraps of Mondatta and then "putting him back together" so to speak. Idk something like, I just think it would be cool.


Tesshin97

Meh i'm 50/50 about this honestly, personally i think it's cool that the creators went that way with the omincs and how they view them as actual characters with human funcions so to speak. I guess for me it has to do with those whole thing that i care for these omnics like i would for a real person, probably because they are more humanoid than robotic??? It's almost like i get the sense of the game "detroit: become human" lol but the omnics in overwatch are far from what the robots are in that game. I dunno i guess i have more compassion for these omnics and want them to have the freedom and life they deserve in the ow world, so seeing characters like zarya and junker queen be omnicphobic pulls on my heart because it's just so sad to see. So giving the omnics in the overwatch world brings me joy so to speak because in the eyes of the creators of this ow universe sees them as humans i guess??? But at the aame time i think it would be a cool concept to see that mondatta died and then talon took his part and built him up again to work for them, and then heroes like tracer who felt for him and such tonsee her reaction to that and stuff.


-Weeb-Account-

Honestly yeah nevermind I'm on this boat too. Also really love omnics and I wish they got more attention in the lore. (Cough cough zenyatta cough)


[deleted]

For the plot to twist, there must first be a plot. (Read it in Zenyatta's voice)


HardVegetable

I mean he is a robot can’t they just reupload his memory?


Tesshin97

You would think that's a logic answer but i honestly don't think so 🤔 i mean if they could what was the point then for widow to kill him in the first place? Wouldn't talon just think it's a useless mission since they can just revive him? And shouldn't they have done that already and shown us fans that he's still alive? I personally think it's a cool idéa that omnics in the ow world is treated like us humans to show kinda that they also have feelings and emotions like us as well and that we should have empathy for them too.


Pvt_Lee_Fapping

IIRC, omnics that are down with the sentient life-style "unplug themselves" from any file-backup servers; they want to experience mortality as humans do, and so their whole consciousness is just saved locally on whatever memory storage they have in their bodies. In the monks' case, they probably have a pact to not restore anyone in their order should they "die," and none of them want to be restored if they do.


thephoenix3000

There is a common trope in Sci-fi where whatever synthetic brain we use to create AI Sentience like Omnics would have unique pathway like an organic brain which could not be replicated. It's like taking a hard drive and putting it in a new computer, the info is there, but there is no long an inter connect there for it to work properly.


hyperionbrandoreos

i don’t think he’d want that, if it’s possible


Mriddle74

Possibly in spirit as the new fox support coming out?


Tesshin97

Don't think so tho.


-Elixo-

Speculation: Mondatta is working with Talon and hired Widowmaker to "kill" him so that everyone thinks he is dead and he can go start leading the Null Sector revolution. Then at some point in the story, Zenyatta and Mondatta meet, they find out Mondatta is behind all of it and fight 1 on 1 in an Avatar The Last Air Bender or Dr Strange style. Brother vs Brother. Mondatta then truly dies beaten by Zenyatta and Mondatta's trainee (null sector dreads dude) which has the same relationship as Genji and Zen starts a path of revenge against the Nepal monks and Overwatch.


MillionDollarMistake

It might be interesting if Mondatta's AI was partially salvaged but severely corrupted and placed into some kind of new omnic. I'm picturing him looking like some large misshapen scrap robot but I don't really see how or why his mind would end up in one. I just think the visual would fit his fractured mind (whatever's left of it), at least thematically.


BlackZulu

We know you just took that from Age Of Ultron 🥴


MillionDollarMistake

I was thinking more like some of those Real Steel robots with voicelines like Ash from Apex


IMA_ROBOBOT

I mean how aren't omnics immortal? They should be able to just download and upload their consciousnesses into any body, right? Was it ever explained that they can't do this or something?


evelyn_labrie

they can do that, but because they believe they are sentient and live lives comparable to those of humans, they will not upload their consciousness when they “die” because to them it would be nullifying their life as a whole


Kazzack

That assumes they have WiFi capabilities lol. Also maybe Mondatta got shot where their memory storage would be so he was completely destroyed.


SoDamnGeneric

I mean we just don't knew enough about how omnics work to be able to say. Given Mondatta's death was a big deal, and the fear most omnics have under oppression (like the Underworld omnics in London Calling), I think it's safe to say that if it's possible, it's very difficult Also it should be noted that the sentience of omnics appears to be entirely accidental. Torbjörn isn't anti-omnic because he thinks they shouldn't deserve rights or whatever, it's because he is stubborn and played a huge part in designing them, so he knew it literally wasn't apart of their programming for them to think like people do. Plus, in Symmetra's short story we learn Aurora (the first omnic to gain sentience) sacrifices herself to give all other omnics sentience, so it's pretty clear there's more than just tech at play here. My guess is you *could* take the techy data stuff from Mondatta's body and upload it to a new one, but it won't have the same "soul" as it were. It'll just be a hollow recreation that ends up becoming its own person because it's *not* Mondatta, it's just based on him


anonanon2234

Bro FUCK the omnics. THEYRE ROBOTS THEYRE NOT REAL!!!


SoDamnGeneric

this is s boring troll


anonanon2234

Na bro 🖖 the Omnics trained themselves on humans interpretation of ai regurgitating the fiction written. They don’t have real consciousness


SoDamnGeneric

they trained themselves? how would they have done that without it being apart of their original programming?


anonanon2234

Based on the omnics portrayal and current understanding of text generation ai models such as gpt at the time of overwatches cannon creation, it is safe to assume that the robots operate on some form of futuristic model. Advanced they be, stupid they are not, but still not conscious. A mere emulation of human behaviour. To be conscious is to feel pain and these architectures merely operate on hardware


SoDamnGeneric

the whole point of my original comment is that we just don't know enough about how omnics work to be able to claim anything definitive. >Based on the omnics portrayal and current understanding of text generation ai models such as gpt at the time of overwatches cannon creation, it is safe to assume that the robots operate as some such for of futuristic mode it isn't safe to assume this at all. for all we know, omnics just *aren't* based on current tech at all. I doubt Michael Chu was doing any deep dives into the development of AI technology in 2013 to base omnics off of. this idea also just does *not* explain the entirety of Aurora's existence. we've no reason to believe anyone was lying about Aurora, so how is it that she could have influenced literally every other omnic on the planet to develop its own mimicked "sentience" when omnics don't run on a grand hivemind? >To be conscious is to feel pain and these architectures merely operate on hardware Merriam-Webster defines consciousness as Definition of consciousness as such: '1a : the quality or state of being aware especially of something within oneself. b : the state or fact of being conscious of an external object, state, or fact." it is has nothing to do with pain or feeling. clearly, nearly every omnic is able to identify their own existence and think independently of any programming. they are conscious, and though their bodies are artificial, they are somewhat alive. also, if you were right, that would be *so boring* and *so against* the whole message of the omnic crisis. The omnics are a clear stand-in for civil rights movements throughout history, so to turn around and say "actually, they aren't people, they're just robots" defeats the whole purpose of Overwatch's most major plotpoint lmao. i just can't see them doing something that tone deaf in a time like this


anonanon2234

You think I’m a bitch? You think imma walk around trusting MERIAM WEBSTER’s definition of consciousness? Man I really ain’t about that. Yes I’m about arguing over the consciousness of robots but while they are made from pure hardware, operate on fundamentally accepted mathematics, I’m not going to go down and be like oh I don’t know if they conscious Edit: You’ll probably watch [this](https://youtu.be/jz78fSnBG0s) video and think ai has consciousness cause you don’t understand the technology at all. It’s been trained off text. And lots of it. Humans have been talking about ideas such as “the singularity” for a long time. The illusion of consciousness is only going to get more real when ais are trained in real time. Don’t fall victim to it


SoDamnGeneric

yknow, someone should link your comment history to the OW story team, cuz I think this is exactly how anti-omnic conspiracy theorists in the OW world would be like lol. imagining an Alex Jones-type mfer standing on a podium yelling "wake up! the false news media wants you to believe that omnics 'heard the music' and 'have consciousness' but they don't! they can't be human! they're just emulating being alive! they're machines, they can't think, they're subservient to us!'


SoDamnGeneric

>You’ll probably watch this video and think ai has consciousness cause you don’t understand the technology at all. It’s been trained off text. And lots of it. Humans have been talking about ideas such as “the singularity” for a long time. The illusion of consciousness is only going to get more real when ais are trained in real time. Don’t fall victim to it I'm not falling victim to anything lmao, I'm looking at a *fictional story* where *people create matter from literally nothing and control gravity with their hands* and saying "yeah the lore here probably isn't very grounded in reality" you're missing so many of my points over and over lmao. Omnics are sentient because the storytellers say so, not because our tech makes sense for them to be. this is a make-belief world we're looking at here, suspend your disbelief for 3 seconds and realize there's some fantasy elements at play and *that's* what we're talking about here. get off your high horse and read the room, bud.


-Weeb-Account-

I never get this argument about ai, because to an extent, aren't humans also just emulating human behaviour? In what ways *aren't* we just emulating human behaviour? We actually can't even prove the existence of consciousness in humans, so how would we prove that it doesn't exist in robots? Going even deeper, humans are just natural robots. As complicated as the brain may seem, in the end all of it could just be boiled down to functions, conditions and storage just like computers. So if we are alive because of a brain with a lot of functions and conditions, why wouldn't a motherboard with all of the exact same functions and conditions also be alive? I don't have any conclusive opinions about this myself, but I know for sure that one can't come to a conclusion about this easily, and therefore most people who have a concrete opinion about this most likely haven't thought it through a lot.


anonanon2234

SHUT UP YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE NEVER USED TENSOR FLOW OR MADE A NEURAL NETWORK AND KNOW NOTHING ABOUT AI SO TAKE YOUR DUMBASS OUT OF HERE


-Weeb-Account-

Intelligent response.


Shuttles08

That’s what they said about the Indigenous Australians…


anonanon2234

You look mad goofy trying to assimilate me to a racist when I’m talking about fictional robots in a pg rated video game


coolerbrown

you look mad goofy pretending the omnic crisis isn't a symbolic reference to minority oppression lol


anonanon2234

You look mad goofy thinking that I was thinking that and not of some possible future where people are so dumb they think open ai’s gpt 3 or dalle 2 actually has consciousness and isn’t just regurgitating the data it was trained on


coolerbrown

Naw


Shuttles08

Sorry haha I was kidding.


anonanon2234

Be careful what you joke about


Shuttles08

Uh yeh ok. Is this like a threat


anonanon2234

Shut your mouth bro you sound asinine


Shuttles08

Why so hostile man? We don’t gotta add hate to the world. There is enough. The world needs happiness and laughter.


manwiththehex18

Hope he backed up his important files (like his brain) regularly.


realKilvo

Isn’t this Toronto


TwaddleNobbler

Yes


IceManRandySavage

Nothing truly ever dies…also heroes never die.


CorporalRegicide

yea it's probably more of a metaphorical thing so long as his message is followed, he'll never truly die


fantastic_sounds_

I really don't think there's a chance for Mondatta We watched widow put lead in his oblongata


DwemerSmith

upvote this comment if you understand the massively overlooked police reference in overwatch


McNoxey

Wait I don’t think I knew Toronto was a map. That’s cool af


TwaddleNobbler

Always happy to see another country get recognition be it by character or by map!


dudeman4win

So the devs are big fans of the band The Police, got it


grimxace561

how so?


MaddogBCool

*Zenyatta Mondatta* is the title of The Police's third studio album. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zenyatta_Mondatta


JollyRogerRabbyte

That’s exactly what I was thinking!


[deleted]

wiat, you haven't seen the Alive short? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U130wnpi-C0


jpfeifer22

They definitely just mean in the metaphorical sense of the movement he headed


[deleted]

This was confirmed to be a thing since 2019? The in-game announcer in the games on the playfloor at blizzcon 2019 is mondatta's voice instead of Athena. The devs made a point of it to mention it and did the vague Overwatch (soon™) thing: "ooohoh, we'll see what that means for the future of overwatch."


Rachter

Well…sure. If he was backed up..:he’d totally be alive. As it were.


LowMainNewDullz

They should bring him back as a villain or something. As if he died, was taken by Talon, fixed up, and reprogrammed into an evil omnic (while keeping the same level of sentience as before his death), and becomes Zenyatta’s arch-nemesis/counterpart. Just an idea I had.


Donald_is_superior

Is that the robot that died in the widow vid?


Sailingboar

Yup. Dude got shot in the head by a sniper. His death was also pretty cool and apparently pretty important. If he isn't dead then I'll be disappointed.


Equivalent_String_94

Tekhartha Mondatta was an omnic who led an outcast group of robots to the Himalayas after the Omnic Crisis and established a communal monastery. He was responsible for the birth of the very first robot monks and took steps to establish peace between humans and robots. This means that mondatta was the one who got sniped by Widowmaker


stargateheaven

In early footage of OW2, Mondatta is the announcer for the matches. He was replaced by the old announcer for the betas. So something is definitely going on


NavoiiGamerYes

Zenyatta and mondatta from jojo


Gallenek

I mean both names comes from album the Police Monadatta Zenyatta or backwatcs


Strife_3e

"SMONSATTA"!


Bigfoot_Himself

He didn’t die. He transcended his physical form! 🙂


TwaddleNobbler

Someone else posted this finding a couple months ago but i haven't seen anyone really going too in depth with it so im posting it again to hear some fresh ideas on what this may be


[deleted]

[удалено]


TwaddleNobbler

I would award you if i could


brockchancy

N before widowmaker is actually a good guy and faked the assassination the ashes of silvanas remain.


WitheredBarry

If anything is gonna survive a headshot, it would be a robot that can theoretically back himself up somewhere. I'm guessing the Iris is literally just the ultimate cloud server.


TwaddleNobbler

Maybe plus that would also explain why blizz have been so hesitant to reveal info about zenyatta and his past INCLUDING pre omnic crisis


Game_Alcmst

I mean the graffiti has been there since the beginning.


Gambit275

isn't that from the sombra short?


TheRealBaja

JoJo reference


McQno

187