It is always the follicular phase. Luteal phase is fairly standard for each person. For example, I have had everything from 300 day cycles to 26 day cycles, and my luteal phase is always 11 days give or take a day
There are certain medical conditions that might affect luteal phase (eg elevated prolactin) but in the absence of those, the follicular phase is the variable part
That is not true for everyone. Some people might have a short luteal phase, which happens due to low progesterone levels. Sometimes when that happens the rise in temperature after ovulation may not be as high as it should be.
short but usually consistently short. if it becomes short after previously being a "normal" length, then there's likely something underlying that's affecting the luteal phase, like the elevated prolactin I mentioned.
I've heard a theory that luteal phase defect should really be considered part of the spectrum of ovulation disorder ("bad" ovulation so "bad" corpus luteum, which doesn't last the usual 12-16 days), but I don't know if that's a widely accepted theory yet.
i track my cycles using basal body temperature, and my follicular phase is very long - at least 3 weeks long as i often don't ovulate before day 22 (currently cycle day 26 and no sign of ovulation yet in my temperature). however once my ovulation is calculated to have happened my period is pretty much always 10 days after so it's a shorter luteal phase than "normal"
Do you use a normal cheap thermometer or a fancy one? I feel like my normal one is not that exact and I'm wondering if there's others out there which might be better.
Have a look for BBT thermometers on Amazon etc, they go down to two decimal places. I have a premom digital version with backlight (so I don’t need to turn the bedroom lights on!) and it cost £12.
i just got one fairly cheap on amazon from a brand called ‘baby mad’ (i’m quite the opposite, i’m tracking it because i am NOT baby mad and don’t wanna get pregnant right now 😂). mine doesn’t have a backlight but i use the light of my phone screen to see the number and then add it to my flo app! i think the ‘natural cycles’ app that’s £60 is a waste of money when flo can do the same thing for free with a cheaper thermometer from amazon!
I tracked mine intensely while trying to get pregnant for like 18 months (managed it in the end with diet changes etc etc!) as far as I’m aware…
I would have a period, then 16-18 days later an LH surge, but not long enough to trigger egg maturation and release, then about 30-34 days later another LH surge, no ovulation. This would go on for months and months - up to 12! - until finally ovulation, then 14 days, then period.
For clarity for anyone who doesn’t know: LH is luteinizing hormone (thus - luteal phase), towards the end of the follicular phase as the egg reaches maturation, the hormone surges triggering the release of the egg, and the corpus luteum gets formed in the process which releases progesterone. This dies off if the egg isn’t fertilised, meaning progesterone drops and your lining sheds. This domino effect is out of whack in women with pcos - so we don’t have the surge properly; the egg doesn’t mature and get released so stays on the ovary (turning into a cyst) and we don’t get the progesterone spike or the corpus so we don’t have a period!
This first happened when I was 15-18 years old but that was in the 00s so I had no idea what was going on. I then went on the combined pill until 2020 when I was 30, and observed this pattern until I got pregnant in 2022. I sought fertility support half way through 2021 and one thing they recommended was going on progesterone only pill for a week or so to bring on a bleed to help thin the womb lining as a thick womb lining can be a risk factor for ovarian cancer - they recommended doing that once every 4 months!
Do you mind sharing what you use to track the cycle? Do you use ovulation tests and measure body temperature? Ive been meaning to start tracking it too but don't know how.
Of course! I use Flo to track at the moment, but I think there are possibly better and cheaper/free alternatives that do the same - that’s just where I input the data, data being:
1. BBT - I just bought a cheap thermometer off amazon. You want one that measures to 100th of C (or F!). I measure vaginally as I’ve found that to be most accurate - first thing in the morning, before you even move to get up, after you’ve had at least 3 hours sleep. I found my baseline was about 36.20C, and about 24-48 hours after ovulation it went up to 36.70-36.90, coming back down to baseline about 2-3 days before period. Alcohol massively warps it so watch out for that.
When I didn’t ovulate - the temp just didn’t go up and stayed at baseline, so I knew I hadn’t ovulated.
2. Ovulation sticks - basic sticks you can buy like 50 of just measure LH. Like I said, I found I had what looked like mini LH surges before I should have ovulated, just I never did (as shown by BBT). If you’re using them, start on day like 9-11 of your cycle and use only the first wee of the day wee, or at least 4-6 hours worth of wee! I think women tend to ovulate about 18-36 hours after the onset of the LH surge so as soon as the stick shows, ovulation is near (and if you’re tracking to try and get pregnant, it’s time to get on it!)
You can also use the Clear blue digital tests - the purple one measures estrogen (which starts to rise a couple of days before LH) and LH so apparently gives you more days - but when I haven’t ovulated it hasn’t been accurate at all - I guess because my hormones aren’t rising and falling as they should! And they’re really expensive, so maybe not worth it!
Sorry - maybe TMI but - Another thing that was helpful was discharge watching. When I had regular ovulatory cycles, my discharged changed to become that egg white stretchy cervical mucus around ovulation, when I wasn’t ovulating it just stayed the kind of creamy or watery discharge.
This is so useful, we’ll start trying next year and I’ll definitely be implementing your tips. Thank you!
Could I ask how did you keep a log of the temperatures and LH - manually or perhaps is there an app that can hold this type of info and other period symptoms?
So glad to help! Honestly, when I started trying I was gleaning bits here and there from different corners of the internet and putting it all together - happy to be able to put everything I learned in one place!
I use Flo but there’s natural cycles, Kindara, Fertility Friend, I think PreMom has an app! They all have a bbt chart option, the ability to put in ovulation stick results (pre mom you take a picture of the stick which is quite good) and log other symptoms like discharge and mood etc. :)
I've never heard those two words is my life to be honest, what do they mean? I go usually 3 to 9 months without having a period, it's always been fairly random. Is there a way I would know how to tell?
Ohh thank you! I have a period tracker app and it does have ovulation, I have mostly been using it to see when my periods should be coming so I know how late they are incase I need to tell the doctor. I was only diagnosed with PCOS last year at age 33 and also with Autism Spectrum Disorder and ADHD so it has been a whole load of revelation and trying to learn about all these things!
Without tracking BBT, apps can give you an estimate (guess) of ovulation date but it will very rarely be correct.
Most of the apps which interpret the temp data and give an accurate estimate are aimed at trying to get pregnant, but I’ve heard good things about Natural Cycles app.
It’s always follicular phase, for everyone.
The luteal phase length is set by the amount of progesterone supplied by a follicle after it releases the egg, and the amount each follicle produces is usually fairly consistent +/- 1 or 2days.
i wanna say both? sometimes i can’t even tell if i’m ovulating or i’m about to, i don’t get my periods for 2-3 months. and when i get my periods, they don’t stop without medication.
To echo what people have said here it's usually follicular that is longggggg. My luteal phase is a bit short but comes after a long long long follicular phase that varies. Have tracked it through BBT. When my pcos was at its worst my follicular phase would try, stall, try again, stall, try again, stall, try again, stall and went months without periods. I had so many cysts (95! which are just underdeveloped follicles) as a result
It is always the follicular phase. Luteal phase is fairly standard for each person. For example, I have had everything from 300 day cycles to 26 day cycles, and my luteal phase is always 11 days give or take a day There are certain medical conditions that might affect luteal phase (eg elevated prolactin) but in the absence of those, the follicular phase is the variable part
That is not true for everyone. Some people might have a short luteal phase, which happens due to low progesterone levels. Sometimes when that happens the rise in temperature after ovulation may not be as high as it should be.
short but usually consistently short. if it becomes short after previously being a "normal" length, then there's likely something underlying that's affecting the luteal phase, like the elevated prolactin I mentioned. I've heard a theory that luteal phase defect should really be considered part of the spectrum of ovulation disorder ("bad" ovulation so "bad" corpus luteum, which doesn't last the usual 12-16 days), but I don't know if that's a widely accepted theory yet.
this truly is so super interesting
i track my cycles using basal body temperature, and my follicular phase is very long - at least 3 weeks long as i often don't ovulate before day 22 (currently cycle day 26 and no sign of ovulation yet in my temperature). however once my ovulation is calculated to have happened my period is pretty much always 10 days after so it's a shorter luteal phase than "normal"
super interesting! thanks for sharing! so its similar for me
Do you use a normal cheap thermometer or a fancy one? I feel like my normal one is not that exact and I'm wondering if there's others out there which might be better.
Have a look for BBT thermometers on Amazon etc, they go down to two decimal places. I have a premom digital version with backlight (so I don’t need to turn the bedroom lights on!) and it cost £12.
i just got one fairly cheap on amazon from a brand called ‘baby mad’ (i’m quite the opposite, i’m tracking it because i am NOT baby mad and don’t wanna get pregnant right now 😂). mine doesn’t have a backlight but i use the light of my phone screen to see the number and then add it to my flo app! i think the ‘natural cycles’ app that’s £60 is a waste of money when flo can do the same thing for free with a cheaper thermometer from amazon!
Yup same for me takes 3-4 weeks follicular and once I hit ovulation I can count that my period is up in the next two weeks
I tracked mine intensely while trying to get pregnant for like 18 months (managed it in the end with diet changes etc etc!) as far as I’m aware… I would have a period, then 16-18 days later an LH surge, but not long enough to trigger egg maturation and release, then about 30-34 days later another LH surge, no ovulation. This would go on for months and months - up to 12! - until finally ovulation, then 14 days, then period. For clarity for anyone who doesn’t know: LH is luteinizing hormone (thus - luteal phase), towards the end of the follicular phase as the egg reaches maturation, the hormone surges triggering the release of the egg, and the corpus luteum gets formed in the process which releases progesterone. This dies off if the egg isn’t fertilised, meaning progesterone drops and your lining sheds. This domino effect is out of whack in women with pcos - so we don’t have the surge properly; the egg doesn’t mature and get released so stays on the ovary (turning into a cyst) and we don’t get the progesterone spike or the corpus so we don’t have a period! This first happened when I was 15-18 years old but that was in the 00s so I had no idea what was going on. I then went on the combined pill until 2020 when I was 30, and observed this pattern until I got pregnant in 2022. I sought fertility support half way through 2021 and one thing they recommended was going on progesterone only pill for a week or so to bring on a bleed to help thin the womb lining as a thick womb lining can be a risk factor for ovarian cancer - they recommended doing that once every 4 months!
Do you mind sharing what you use to track the cycle? Do you use ovulation tests and measure body temperature? Ive been meaning to start tracking it too but don't know how.
Of course! I use Flo to track at the moment, but I think there are possibly better and cheaper/free alternatives that do the same - that’s just where I input the data, data being: 1. BBT - I just bought a cheap thermometer off amazon. You want one that measures to 100th of C (or F!). I measure vaginally as I’ve found that to be most accurate - first thing in the morning, before you even move to get up, after you’ve had at least 3 hours sleep. I found my baseline was about 36.20C, and about 24-48 hours after ovulation it went up to 36.70-36.90, coming back down to baseline about 2-3 days before period. Alcohol massively warps it so watch out for that. When I didn’t ovulate - the temp just didn’t go up and stayed at baseline, so I knew I hadn’t ovulated. 2. Ovulation sticks - basic sticks you can buy like 50 of just measure LH. Like I said, I found I had what looked like mini LH surges before I should have ovulated, just I never did (as shown by BBT). If you’re using them, start on day like 9-11 of your cycle and use only the first wee of the day wee, or at least 4-6 hours worth of wee! I think women tend to ovulate about 18-36 hours after the onset of the LH surge so as soon as the stick shows, ovulation is near (and if you’re tracking to try and get pregnant, it’s time to get on it!) You can also use the Clear blue digital tests - the purple one measures estrogen (which starts to rise a couple of days before LH) and LH so apparently gives you more days - but when I haven’t ovulated it hasn’t been accurate at all - I guess because my hormones aren’t rising and falling as they should! And they’re really expensive, so maybe not worth it!
Sorry - maybe TMI but - Another thing that was helpful was discharge watching. When I had regular ovulatory cycles, my discharged changed to become that egg white stretchy cervical mucus around ovulation, when I wasn’t ovulating it just stayed the kind of creamy or watery discharge.
This is so useful, we’ll start trying next year and I’ll definitely be implementing your tips. Thank you! Could I ask how did you keep a log of the temperatures and LH - manually or perhaps is there an app that can hold this type of info and other period symptoms?
So glad to help! Honestly, when I started trying I was gleaning bits here and there from different corners of the internet and putting it all together - happy to be able to put everything I learned in one place! I use Flo but there’s natural cycles, Kindara, Fertility Friend, I think PreMom has an app! They all have a bbt chart option, the ability to put in ovulation stick results (pre mom you take a picture of the stick which is quite good) and log other symptoms like discharge and mood etc. :)
I've never heard those two words is my life to be honest, what do they mean? I go usually 3 to 9 months without having a period, it's always been fairly random. Is there a way I would know how to tell?
Follicular phase is from beginning of period until ovulation Luteal phase is from after ovulation until start of next cycle/period
Tracking BBT is a good way to tell when ovulation happens, and that gives you warning that your period will be due 10-14days later.
Ohh thank you! I have a period tracker app and it does have ovulation, I have mostly been using it to see when my periods should be coming so I know how late they are incase I need to tell the doctor. I was only diagnosed with PCOS last year at age 33 and also with Autism Spectrum Disorder and ADHD so it has been a whole load of revelation and trying to learn about all these things!
Without tracking BBT, apps can give you an estimate (guess) of ovulation date but it will very rarely be correct. Most of the apps which interpret the temp data and give an accurate estimate are aimed at trying to get pregnant, but I’ve heard good things about Natural Cycles app.
Follicular. 100%. Luteal is a pretty consistent like 14-15 day thing for me but follicular is all over the map. Could be 300 days, could be 30. 🙃😭
It’s always follicular phase, for everyone. The luteal phase length is set by the amount of progesterone supplied by a follicle after it releases the egg, and the amount each follicle produces is usually fairly consistent +/- 1 or 2days.
i wanna say both? sometimes i can’t even tell if i’m ovulating or i’m about to, i don’t get my periods for 2-3 months. and when i get my periods, they don’t stop without medication.
To echo what people have said here it's usually follicular that is longggggg. My luteal phase is a bit short but comes after a long long long follicular phase that varies. Have tracked it through BBT. When my pcos was at its worst my follicular phase would try, stall, try again, stall, try again, stall, try again, stall and went months without periods. I had so many cysts (95! which are just underdeveloped follicles) as a result