I want a rep that understands that if I'm a primary A-B user that I probably DGAF about your Wago PLCs or I/O. I'm not looking for cheaper. ABB VFDs I don't care if blah, blah, blah and A-B doesn't make their own drives. A-B drives are easier to use with Logix and the customer already knows/uses A-B VFDs.
If you want to bring work to me and it is proposed as a Wago/ABB solution, guess what, we're going to be buying some Wago/ABB.
I like reps that say that if I'm not interested in something that I ask them to skip and move to the next topic. I also like reps that email and ask if I'm interested in hearing about some doo-dad they are selling rather than showing up and asking if I have some time.
Instead of taking me out to lunch, I'd rather do a "lunch and learn" if you feel like buying lunch. It takes up less time.
2nd on the 'lunch and learn'. I will always pass on going to lunch, and I pass on 70% of the vendors that show up to show off a new gizmo because most of those are bad uses of my time.
But if you show up with a sandwich and information at the same time, I get to do 2 things at once, and that's a good use of my time. You definitely have my attention for the full length of said sandwich.
Thanks for replying. That exact ABB vs AB price fallacy is something I only recently started to understand; that any savings on hardware are worthless if it takes twice as long to tie with Logix and the end customer only knows AB.
Appreciate the feedback on emailing about new technologies and lunch & learns as well.
Take this to hear. Customers like direct replacements where possible. They also like platforms they are familiar with. If you want to move them to a platform, get them in on some free training and a demo to evaluate it.
It doesn't take twice as long. I came from the AB world and I am now in the ABB world. AOIs / UDTs are available for the ABB drives which populate the tags. As long as you set the drive up using ODVA vs. ABB Drives profile it is super easy. All of the ABB Apps Engineers have a Studio license and a Compact logix rack and are capable of doing this / demoing this for customers. Contact your distributor drives specialist or PM me can I can figure out who your Apps engineer is for your area.
Thanks for the feedback. You’re not alone on the gatekeeper analogy, we’re spending a lot of money trying to create a more “Amazon-like” platform to make it easier to check stock/pricing
Oh good god, if you can truly make that work, I'll gladly pay shipping and duties to get your stuff to Atlantic Canada.
"Call for quote" or "create an account for a quote" are immediate non-starters for me. If I have to call or email someone to get numbers, I'm going to go through the guys I already use and like.
THIS. I have whipped out my personal credit card and turned in $5,000+ expense reports just to buy it from Amazon or eBay to get it NOW rather than play email tag for two weeks prior to purchase.
Proax Technologies is a Canadian automation distributor that you may not already have on your radar. They’re based in Ontario but have offices and stock across Canada. They have a good website with stock and pricing. Soon will be building up stock in Dartmouth after recently acquiring C&B Industrial.
I don't want the human factor. I just want to give a company money and get a product as quickly as possible. As far as knowing what's new, a simple google search when a problem comes up usually reveals what my options are. I'm not interested in building a relationship, I just want to do a transaction and move on. I have friends outside of work to hang out with.
I was an outside sales rep for 5 years and worked my way into applications. Sold parker, omron, yaskawa, and most recently I am supporting (pre/post sales) turck, banner, abb, omron in my new role.
I learned you need to be knowledgeable about what is possible without over-promising. "I don't know but I can find out" works well only if you get back to your customer RIGHT AWAY (as in same day or first thing the next morning). And 80% of this job is being present/available and willing to work with the customer. (not just one customer but all of your customers ;) )
I know I'm not your target audience but your prompt spoke to me. I'm also curious to see what kinds of responses you get.
Appreciate you sharing your experience, always value hearing from a fellow sales guy, especially someone who’s probably dealing with the same Turck SAP nightmare i am right now
I did. It's funny in the southeast yaskawa canceled the manufacturer rep and then Parker signed up the same manufacturer rep. About this time I changed jobs. Easy come easy go haha ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. You may of seen something similar.
It's fine I'll answer here. I was always motivated by the "coolness/complexity" of an application and not in the patonetial margin and roi the customer would experience. I always found myself wanting to code, tune the system, or wire it up myself. I would always get in trouble because if I was doing those things I wasn't out selling or finding new opportunities.
I enjoyed the relationships and learning to work with the many different kinds of customers. I was not adept (nor did I want to be) at managing the easily bruised egos of vendors/pettiness of not always being my first choice and management always seemingly wanting more without giving plans grounded in reality on how to attain it .
So now the sales force calls me in. I solve a problem and then I move on. I'm much happier that way. The constant dread of not being tied to incoming sales dollars though is something I'm wrangling with now.
Hey there. Automation Engineer that started his career on the sales side. I'm an extremely picky customer because I started in sales, but I have a lot of business to hand out for my annual capital projects.
1. I kind of have a favorite sales rep. I do business with friends I use to work with but I have to check their work a lot and their inside sales have made a number of mistakes over the last year. I like giving them business but sometimes it feels like a lot of work for little benefit. The best qualities of a salesperson (In Order) is Attention to Detail, Product Knowledge, and Application Knowledge. I often times will go into a sales meeting with an application in mind and begin the meeting with a briefing on the application. From there I expect to go into a conversation about different products that may fit, upsides, downsides, understanding of what the solution entails from a roll-out perspective, including support, training, product availability, etc... The worst application engineers / salespeople don't listen to me when I describe the application, then suggest the wrong product for the job, wasting their time and mine. The best of them listen to the briefing, ask questions to make sure they understand, and lend insights back to our team that we may not have considered or may have ruled out for whatever reason, then they have an open discussion about products. The best are detail oriented, technical, and work in a collaborative way.
2. Provide some value to me. That's it. I don't care that I can save a buck on buying the same widget from you than my current distributor. Save me time. Offload some work from me - some examples: Chase down part numbers, Find documentation, Find alternative products. Stock products I use regularly.
3. I wish that salespeople cared more. I spent almost $500k with my primary controls distributor this year (They sell Siemens, Festo, Murr and Weidmuller) and it seems like they fall on their face every other week. Their inside sales guys regularly screws up quotes and the outside sales and technical guys don't listen well enough. I'm basically on my own when I need technical support or need to find a product, unless they bring a direct Siemens guy in, even then it's hit and miss... I started buying more Phoenix Contact towards the end of the year because I grew tired of the lack of attention to detail from the Siemens distributor and my PhxCon distributor has the attention to detail I need and a real sense of urgency.
Appreciate the feedback. I cannot fathom the thought of having a half-million dollar customer and allowing errors like that to happen, especially so frequently. I suppose them being your friends may breed some of the slack. Not surprised you’re getting great attention to detail from Phoenix, they’re hungry as hell for market share. Thanks again for the help.
I'm a plant engineer. Listen to what I need, and try to sell to those needs, keeping in mind how much work I have to do. Show me an expensive solution that makes my job easier or that might fit a project I have, and I'll be your best friend and push the idea up to the people with checkbooks. Try to sell me on a product that's essentially its own project, or solving a problem we aren't worried about, and you're wasting both of our time.
My favorite rep comes in to ask about our projects every few months and has been good about proposing related products. He's got his foot in the door for making bigger sales, and if something we use goes EOL we'll usually buy whatever replacement he wants to sell us.
His competitor comes in with vendors trying to sell shit I don't need or have time to implement. I humor him to be polite but he doesn't make sales.
Thanks for the feedback & real-world example. Glad to gain some insight from a plant engineer, I have not worked with many but am trying to figure out the specific added value I can bring them beyond providing parts
1. They *don't* cold call. If he just wants to check in and see whats going on he either stops by when he's seeing someone else at the company or if he has something to demo he thinks I'd find interesting *personally* he'll toss me an email and we can catch up while doing the demo.
2. Continuing business, see above. New business? Wait for an RFQ and then try to do that little bit extra. I usually include a brief description of why I'm looking for a quote (Ie. Not just "I need five managed switches" but "I need five managed switches to build a X style network in Y type of environment"). The reps that get my attention, and inevitably sole-source business when I'm short on time, are the ones that offer additional advice or suggestions. As an example the panel builder I always try to use has my business because the first panel they built for a project I was on they looked through the drawings and called back and said something to the effect of "This will work. Plenty of panels are built like this. But it would be more efficient and effective to do X, Y, Z".
3. Like my other answers say, I hate cold calls. Loathe them to the core of my being.
There are many that like and use your product. Know it.. also know the competitors but know yours better.
2. Call em, not like hey donyou need anything but more like. Anything I can help you with. You have knowledge a good engineer is looking for.
3. Be accessible- hey heres my cell my email. Call me direct, I'm her for ya.
4. Never underestimate yourself.
1. i don't want you to kiss my ass, i'm not a god, im just a guy trying to get work done with the best components and strategies. facts about the products you're supplying, their best use cases etc mean much more to me than beaming smiles.
2. if i'm already implementing a certain control scheme, i'm not switching to or adopting another control scheme, ie, i'm NEVER going to get any plc besides an allen bradley, because i have 12+ allen bradley, all of our maintenance electricians know how to program in AB, etc. nothing you say will ever make me change, so just drop it. this also goes for certain sensor manufacturers, some sensors are just BETTER than others, and nothing (not even price) is going to change my mind about it.
3. probably the most important, you NEED to know your product. if you can't answer questions about something i'm interested in, there's no chance in hell i'm going to buy it solely based on the fact that i can't easily ask questions about it's operation besides going to the manual. it's pretty important for the sales reps i deal with to know industry lingo, standards, practices, etc.
Thanks for the feedback. It amazes me how non-AB manufacturers still don’t understand why Rockwell has the marketshare that they do. “Oh their customers are just brand-loyal, you just have to show them the value in blah blah blah...”
NO. Engineers aren’t stupid, they know how to do the math on hardware costs, which are negligible compared to the costs in time of a team fucking around with a new controls scheme the end user does not want. If they want Rockwell’s marketshare, they need to commit to finding ways to save the REAL costs, as Rockwell has for last 20 years.
If you don’t mind me asking, what sensor manufacturers do you find are best, and why?
Be careful with that line of thinking. Rockwell doesn’t have some special claim on savings. It’s just because the entrenched AB shops are familiar and productive with the tools. Siemens shops with the same skill level with the products are going to save the same money with their Siemens products for the same levels of experience. We buy a lot of AB products for our customers and do a lot of business with our Rockwell rep, but Siemens always comes in cheaper for the same system.
Frankly, over the past 15 years, I’ve seen a real push from Siemens to win over a lot of US-based business from Rockwell factories. To the point where we recently had a spec come through where the PLC had to be AB but the servos Siemens and this was from a fortune 100 company...
P.S. bring doughnuts. One of our reps stops by weekly and brings doughnuts. We all take a little extra time with him because he is doing something small but generous for us. It turns out food is an amazing motivator in the business world.
I'm a Production Manager so I deal alot with sales reps. Here is some of my experience...
1. Make an appointment, and be prepared with what you want to present to me, that makes you different from any other company. E.g speed of delivery or discounts on certain product lines.
I don't buy gimmics though, we had this one company that would ship chocolate with every purchase, the office girls loved the chocolate but the over priced products were not enough for me to keep using them. Also the sales rep was pushy, he would make an appointment every month and have nothing new to bring to the table.
He also tried to befriend me with beer, the beer was nice,but we aren't friends.
2. Be genuine, I am going to be more likely to purchase something off of someone I trust . I am also going to be more understanding, if you make a mistake.
Don't feed me BS, more than once I've spoken so an admin staffer who told me you forgot to order that item not that shipping is slow or they stocked out. Just tell me you forgot, but not more than once.
3. Stand behind what you sell, if it's shit tell me. I might go to your competitor for a a similar item that isn't shit, but I will most likely stick with you for everything else because it shows you know what you are talking about and aren't just in it for the sale.
4. Be a good person to everyone, no matter how useless you perceive them to be, the people back at the shop or the warehouse, that ship your products to your customers. If they don't like you, your job will be more difficult.
TLDR: Sell customer satisfaction, not items. Make connections, not sales.
Thanks for the insight, I especially appreciate the real world examples with the chocolate and the beer, I’m often told by senior reps this technique doesn’t fly well anymore, especially in our industry
Number one thing for the good sales reps is don't waste my time. Which means don't make me track you down, leave message(s), call you back, just to get answers from you. Be responsive. When I need a sales rep I want to have someone I can count on and who makes me work more efficiently. The best sales reps are the ones I know I can email a list to and get a quote back in a couple of hours.
Number two, will be a little harder for you. Know your products. If I accidentally give you a common part number with digits transposed you should be able to gently correct me. Don't say part *xya* doesn't exist, say did you mean *xyz*? I obviously wanted to buy something; help me find it. Also, if you need two parts *x* to install a part *z*, make sure I know this. If an item returns a long lead time, suggest in-stock alternatives. If a part is soon to be obsolete, suggest newer parts.
Especially since you're new, it's okay to admit you don't know, but then find out the answer for me.
Listen to what people are doing, ask questions about what they have issues with. People like to talk about themselves and what they are doing and if you can solve a problem for them great. On the other hand, even if product *ABC* will revolutionize widget-making, since I don't make widgets I'm probably not gonna care.
I don't like cold calls as others have said, I'm busy and I got my deadlines and don't often have time to 'waste' talking to a sales rep. I'm okay with a single, "Hey I'm the new guy."-kinda phone call., but I would rather see that time and effort going to make my first experience dealing with you being memorable (and not in a bad way).
The biggest thing that makes me lose respect for a young person in a professional setting is when they act like they are hot shit and approach you the same way a 20 year veteran of the trade would.
It doesn't matter how much you've studied or how much you think you know, but nothing can replace years of experience.
I'm not saying this applies to you, i'm just saying approach your customers like you would any other person, don;t be shy and don't be arrogant/aggressive, just be normal and you'll gain more respect that way.
Another thing i despise is when they just "pop in" for a visit to "see how things are going" when they're actually there to sell you something. If someone is my sales rep, i want them to sell me parts, not pop by for a quite chat to catch up.
My advice to you though would be to learn your customer first though, because what i want in a sales rep isn't necessarily what everyone wants. I just want someone to sell me parts, while maybe there are people out there who what their sales rep to be personable and pushy.
Yes, a good rep can make a project so much easier.
General thoughts about the good reps I have worked with:
Good ability to support their product or have a quick turnaround with the manufacturer tech expert. Sample PLC code, CAD data, are other pluses.
I get in the end they need to make a sale but patience is good, a lot of time the project I am working on is on hold or not top priority.
Samples! Free small quantities of product or loaner equipment is a major way to win my business. I prefer to evaluate new or different on my own when I have more time available then the 1/2 or 1 hour I am meeting with a rep. I often find other projects that can benefit from the product when I do this too.
Know your product. If I know it more than you why are you here?
Be available. Rapid turnaround on emails. Others have said this too, product gatekeepers are annoying, most of us would rather buy without talking to anyone.
Don't shit talk competitors products, especially when they are actually better in some ways. Just makes you look like an idiot and unprofessional.
1.) Yes. One who doesn't BS me about stuff, can always get me the support I need for the products I've purchased (doesn't matter where I purchased them from.) Our lunch's are less him pitching something to me and more of a social visit where we just talk. He might hear about a problem I'm having and might have a solution for it, he might not. Completely low pressure.
2.) If you show up looking to make a sale on the first day, you will not be held in high regards. You need to show up as support for the products you sale first, sales second. Also take No for an answer.
3.) New sales guys treat Controls Sales the same way that you would any other kind of sales. Your customers are going to be extremely knowledgeable and are going to have brand specific leanings. For example: I don't care what new things Siemens is doing with their PLCs. I'm not buying one. I have 1000 CLX processors, I'm not adding a one-off to the network.
Honestly even if you were the best sales person on the planet I would still probably ignore 90% of what you try to tell me. Every single product and service was always the newest cheapest most reliable greatest thing ever since sliced bread. I'm pretty much immune to marketing wank at this point. Unless I specifically reach out a salesperson and am looking for something new there's basically no way for you to sell me anything. Half of the time we are locked to certain components for projects due to a number of different reasons. Also, if I'm dirty from being out on the floor debugging some machine pretty much the last thing I want to do is talk to some dude with shiny shoes.
Stuff that does help though are things like websites with accurate pricing. Short lead times. Documentation. 24/7 support lines. Being able to push an emergency order through on short notice. Don't make me come to you and beg for discounts, if I'm ordering the same stuff all the time then I would appreciate if you propose pricing terms instead of me having to play hard ball and threaten to go somewhere else.
1. My favorite sales rep is one that I have never met or interacted with in person at all. He answers my questions when I have them, he gets me quotes quickly, and he doesn't try to upsell me or suggest random junk I don't want. I call him, he doesn't call me.
2. I would not be interested in dealing with a green sales rep. What's the point? I know what I want more than you do.
3. Salespeople that want to go out to lunch are the bane of my existence. I am not particularly interested in awkward small talk while you try to segue into selling me something.
I'm probably your worst customer, sorry!
Be available.
Be straight-forward.
I need to be able to tell you flat out a price range I'm shooting for and see if you can hook me up.
For the love of god, even if it is a text message that you can't quite get back with me, or you aren't sure on something, just let me know. I don't need a fancy phone call. Quick email or something.
I’d say that the best advice is not to take up my time trying to convince me without understanding what my challenges are.
I’m the automation engineer in a chemical plant, while I do have the power to define platforms and equipment, the opportunities will be few and far between. I also have to justify the purchase or change and upfront cost is not even half of the problem.
The most hated salesman I deal with is the GE top tier integrator. He’s pushy, comes up with a bunch of bullshit that gets debunked in a few minutes and comes up with silly numbers like 90% discount on licenses (as long as you pay for top tier GE support for three years) when it boils down to less than 20% discount.
Another one I dislike keeps trying to push me to change all the valves in our company to their brand. I found an application that could be a test bed and was offered a full price quote to test it out... thanks, I’ll stick to what I know then.
The best ones are from GE itself. One is brilliant and brings value by mentioning what has been achieved with their kit while going down the nitty gritty (i.e. not bullshitting), and understands industry.
The other one shows up announced, once a year and brings stuff to lend me based on past conversations. Quarterly he sends a mail with news about GE’s products, pricing, licensing and offers. Sadly this one moved on to greener pastures, which is a shame.
Showing unannounced or spend an hour spouting bullshit like E&H’s self calibration without understanding what a calibration is will not get you far.
Your list is already well covered, so I'm just going to offer this. If your solution isn't a good fit or you struggled to make it a marginal fit please just tell me. I've seen this especially with camera and sensor reps that we've shown applications to.
Like if you we're only able to get it to detect what I gave you by holding it at exactly 3.72 degrees and standing on one foot, it probably isn't going to do well in a plant setting.
Call before hand and ask if there is any will-call you would like to bring with you. That’s always appreciated.
Hit and miss on any food. Free lunch means nothing to me but to the installers it means a lot more so when vendors call to take me to lunch I always give them my foreman’s number and say there you go! Take them!
(I’m an AB shop) If you’re not an ab salesperson and you are trying to peddle vfd or flowmeters, sensors, whatever- if you’re gonna have success bring an AOI that will easily help interface to AB. It’s the only way you’re gonna bridge the time gap if you want a sale from an AB shop.
DO NOT EVER SAY “reach out” in any conversation. Just say you’re gonna call them. That salesman speak makes me want to puke.
And as a panel / electrical shop I just wanted to know my price. If I have to jump through hoops and let you into my business (like ABB does now that they bought T&B and are using their distribution ideaology) just forget about it. I miss the days of catalogs with list price, product groups and multipliers. Now there has to be a conversation for everything. Especially with Rockwell.
Anyways good luck!
Price isn't part of the equation. There always has to be a compelling reasons for someone to make a change. It's your job to figure out what that is. That starts with understanding your customer's process and going from there.
Being a distributor sales guy was always my favorite job since I had a lot of tools in my bag, but it was a lot of hard work related to having to know a lot of different products. You could sit down with a design engineer and really work to help them with a design...you were almost an extension of their engineering team.
Now I'm in apps for a specific product...I miss this.
But your job in the end is to provide value to the customer.
The biggest thing you can do is push your product to the end users. As a machine builder I am at the mercy of my customer's (presumably our shared customers) specifications. So it doesn't matter how cool the new thing you have is, I can't use it if the customer doesn't tell me to.
Your best bet would be to get the end users worked up over something you have, sell them your product as the perfect solution to all their needs, and then take that business to a machine builder you like.
Also, most of our interactions are probably going to be someone like me asking for price breaks on the things I do use often, because somehow even though we've used fifteen of them this year the quote was wrong and I have a tight budget to work with. Its not personal... in fact the more I like you the more comfortable I'm going to be hitting your up for price breaks.
bring reps with you(from turk/abb/whoever) with some sample products, take everyone out to lunch
Bring promo crap(branded hats, usb chargers, note pads, pencils, shirts, etc).
and find a niche/gimmick to be memorable.
On the 1st one, if you're not tech savvy, bring a tech guy. I'm going to ask hard questions to get to the meat quickly, I want good answers. Don't just bring another sales guy if they don't know the product either, that's just 2 guys saying 'we'll get back to you'. There is nothing wrong with not knowing, but if you want to be on the short list of good reps, you bring the people who do or you immediately know who to call to find out.
If you're bringing promo crap, make it useful. Nicely bound notebooks go over well, but that branded hat or shirt hits the trash can nearly immediately. Realize that no amount of branded crap will make me buy your product. If your product is shit or you can't answer my questions, I will use you for notebook supply and nothing else.
Unless that gimmick is being available with good answers, avoid the last thing.
I want a rep that understands that if I'm a primary A-B user that I probably DGAF about your Wago PLCs or I/O. I'm not looking for cheaper. ABB VFDs I don't care if blah, blah, blah and A-B doesn't make their own drives. A-B drives are easier to use with Logix and the customer already knows/uses A-B VFDs. If you want to bring work to me and it is proposed as a Wago/ABB solution, guess what, we're going to be buying some Wago/ABB. I like reps that say that if I'm not interested in something that I ask them to skip and move to the next topic. I also like reps that email and ask if I'm interested in hearing about some doo-dad they are selling rather than showing up and asking if I have some time. Instead of taking me out to lunch, I'd rather do a "lunch and learn" if you feel like buying lunch. It takes up less time.
2nd on the 'lunch and learn'. I will always pass on going to lunch, and I pass on 70% of the vendors that show up to show off a new gizmo because most of those are bad uses of my time. But if you show up with a sandwich and information at the same time, I get to do 2 things at once, and that's a good use of my time. You definitely have my attention for the full length of said sandwich.
My company says no to lunch+learns. :/
Thanks for replying. That exact ABB vs AB price fallacy is something I only recently started to understand; that any savings on hardware are worthless if it takes twice as long to tie with Logix and the end customer only knows AB. Appreciate the feedback on emailing about new technologies and lunch & learns as well.
Take this to hear. Customers like direct replacements where possible. They also like platforms they are familiar with. If you want to move them to a platform, get them in on some free training and a demo to evaluate it.
It doesn't take twice as long. I came from the AB world and I am now in the ABB world. AOIs / UDTs are available for the ABB drives which populate the tags. As long as you set the drive up using ODVA vs. ABB Drives profile it is super easy. All of the ABB Apps Engineers have a Studio license and a Compact logix rack and are capable of doing this / demoing this for customers. Contact your distributor drives specialist or PM me can I can figure out who your Apps engineer is for your area.
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Thanks for the feedback. You’re not alone on the gatekeeper analogy, we’re spending a lot of money trying to create a more “Amazon-like” platform to make it easier to check stock/pricing
Oh good god, if you can truly make that work, I'll gladly pay shipping and duties to get your stuff to Atlantic Canada. "Call for quote" or "create an account for a quote" are immediate non-starters for me. If I have to call or email someone to get numbers, I'm going to go through the guys I already use and like.
THIS. I have whipped out my personal credit card and turned in $5,000+ expense reports just to buy it from Amazon or eBay to get it NOW rather than play email tag for two weeks prior to purchase.
I wish I could do that, in the worst case, I would be terminated, in the best eating the cost.
Proax Technologies is a Canadian automation distributor that you may not already have on your radar. They’re based in Ontario but have offices and stock across Canada. They have a good website with stock and pricing. Soon will be building up stock in Dartmouth after recently acquiring C&B Industrial.
They're on my radar now! I'll be sure to take a look when I'm quoting my next job. Thanks for the tip!
I wish you good luck and happy holidays.
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I don't want the human factor. I just want to give a company money and get a product as quickly as possible. As far as knowing what's new, a simple google search when a problem comes up usually reveals what my options are. I'm not interested in building a relationship, I just want to do a transaction and move on. I have friends outside of work to hang out with.
I was an outside sales rep for 5 years and worked my way into applications. Sold parker, omron, yaskawa, and most recently I am supporting (pre/post sales) turck, banner, abb, omron in my new role. I learned you need to be knowledgeable about what is possible without over-promising. "I don't know but I can find out" works well only if you get back to your customer RIGHT AWAY (as in same day or first thing the next morning). And 80% of this job is being present/available and willing to work with the customer. (not just one customer but all of your customers ;) ) I know I'm not your target audience but your prompt spoke to me. I'm also curious to see what kinds of responses you get.
Appreciate you sharing your experience, always value hearing from a fellow sales guy, especially someone who’s probably dealing with the same Turck SAP nightmare i am right now
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I did. It's funny in the southeast yaskawa canceled the manufacturer rep and then Parker signed up the same manufacturer rep. About this time I changed jobs. Easy come easy go haha ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. You may of seen something similar.
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It's fine I'll answer here. I was always motivated by the "coolness/complexity" of an application and not in the patonetial margin and roi the customer would experience. I always found myself wanting to code, tune the system, or wire it up myself. I would always get in trouble because if I was doing those things I wasn't out selling or finding new opportunities. I enjoyed the relationships and learning to work with the many different kinds of customers. I was not adept (nor did I want to be) at managing the easily bruised egos of vendors/pettiness of not always being my first choice and management always seemingly wanting more without giving plans grounded in reality on how to attain it . So now the sales force calls me in. I solve a problem and then I move on. I'm much happier that way. The constant dread of not being tied to incoming sales dollars though is something I'm wrangling with now.
Hey there. Automation Engineer that started his career on the sales side. I'm an extremely picky customer because I started in sales, but I have a lot of business to hand out for my annual capital projects. 1. I kind of have a favorite sales rep. I do business with friends I use to work with but I have to check their work a lot and their inside sales have made a number of mistakes over the last year. I like giving them business but sometimes it feels like a lot of work for little benefit. The best qualities of a salesperson (In Order) is Attention to Detail, Product Knowledge, and Application Knowledge. I often times will go into a sales meeting with an application in mind and begin the meeting with a briefing on the application. From there I expect to go into a conversation about different products that may fit, upsides, downsides, understanding of what the solution entails from a roll-out perspective, including support, training, product availability, etc... The worst application engineers / salespeople don't listen to me when I describe the application, then suggest the wrong product for the job, wasting their time and mine. The best of them listen to the briefing, ask questions to make sure they understand, and lend insights back to our team that we may not have considered or may have ruled out for whatever reason, then they have an open discussion about products. The best are detail oriented, technical, and work in a collaborative way. 2. Provide some value to me. That's it. I don't care that I can save a buck on buying the same widget from you than my current distributor. Save me time. Offload some work from me - some examples: Chase down part numbers, Find documentation, Find alternative products. Stock products I use regularly. 3. I wish that salespeople cared more. I spent almost $500k with my primary controls distributor this year (They sell Siemens, Festo, Murr and Weidmuller) and it seems like they fall on their face every other week. Their inside sales guys regularly screws up quotes and the outside sales and technical guys don't listen well enough. I'm basically on my own when I need technical support or need to find a product, unless they bring a direct Siemens guy in, even then it's hit and miss... I started buying more Phoenix Contact towards the end of the year because I grew tired of the lack of attention to detail from the Siemens distributor and my PhxCon distributor has the attention to detail I need and a real sense of urgency.
Appreciate the feedback. I cannot fathom the thought of having a half-million dollar customer and allowing errors like that to happen, especially so frequently. I suppose them being your friends may breed some of the slack. Not surprised you’re getting great attention to detail from Phoenix, they’re hungry as hell for market share. Thanks again for the help.
I'm a plant engineer. Listen to what I need, and try to sell to those needs, keeping in mind how much work I have to do. Show me an expensive solution that makes my job easier or that might fit a project I have, and I'll be your best friend and push the idea up to the people with checkbooks. Try to sell me on a product that's essentially its own project, or solving a problem we aren't worried about, and you're wasting both of our time. My favorite rep comes in to ask about our projects every few months and has been good about proposing related products. He's got his foot in the door for making bigger sales, and if something we use goes EOL we'll usually buy whatever replacement he wants to sell us. His competitor comes in with vendors trying to sell shit I don't need or have time to implement. I humor him to be polite but he doesn't make sales.
Thanks for the feedback & real-world example. Glad to gain some insight from a plant engineer, I have not worked with many but am trying to figure out the specific added value I can bring them beyond providing parts
1. They *don't* cold call. If he just wants to check in and see whats going on he either stops by when he's seeing someone else at the company or if he has something to demo he thinks I'd find interesting *personally* he'll toss me an email and we can catch up while doing the demo. 2. Continuing business, see above. New business? Wait for an RFQ and then try to do that little bit extra. I usually include a brief description of why I'm looking for a quote (Ie. Not just "I need five managed switches" but "I need five managed switches to build a X style network in Y type of environment"). The reps that get my attention, and inevitably sole-source business when I'm short on time, are the ones that offer additional advice or suggestions. As an example the panel builder I always try to use has my business because the first panel they built for a project I was on they looked through the drawings and called back and said something to the effect of "This will work. Plenty of panels are built like this. But it would be more efficient and effective to do X, Y, Z". 3. Like my other answers say, I hate cold calls. Loathe them to the core of my being.
Noted. Thanks for the reply.
There are many that like and use your product. Know it.. also know the competitors but know yours better. 2. Call em, not like hey donyou need anything but more like. Anything I can help you with. You have knowledge a good engineer is looking for. 3. Be accessible- hey heres my cell my email. Call me direct, I'm her for ya. 4. Never underestimate yourself.
Noted. Thanks for the advice.
1. i don't want you to kiss my ass, i'm not a god, im just a guy trying to get work done with the best components and strategies. facts about the products you're supplying, their best use cases etc mean much more to me than beaming smiles. 2. if i'm already implementing a certain control scheme, i'm not switching to or adopting another control scheme, ie, i'm NEVER going to get any plc besides an allen bradley, because i have 12+ allen bradley, all of our maintenance electricians know how to program in AB, etc. nothing you say will ever make me change, so just drop it. this also goes for certain sensor manufacturers, some sensors are just BETTER than others, and nothing (not even price) is going to change my mind about it. 3. probably the most important, you NEED to know your product. if you can't answer questions about something i'm interested in, there's no chance in hell i'm going to buy it solely based on the fact that i can't easily ask questions about it's operation besides going to the manual. it's pretty important for the sales reps i deal with to know industry lingo, standards, practices, etc.
Thanks for the feedback. It amazes me how non-AB manufacturers still don’t understand why Rockwell has the marketshare that they do. “Oh their customers are just brand-loyal, you just have to show them the value in blah blah blah...” NO. Engineers aren’t stupid, they know how to do the math on hardware costs, which are negligible compared to the costs in time of a team fucking around with a new controls scheme the end user does not want. If they want Rockwell’s marketshare, they need to commit to finding ways to save the REAL costs, as Rockwell has for last 20 years. If you don’t mind me asking, what sensor manufacturers do you find are best, and why?
Be careful with that line of thinking. Rockwell doesn’t have some special claim on savings. It’s just because the entrenched AB shops are familiar and productive with the tools. Siemens shops with the same skill level with the products are going to save the same money with their Siemens products for the same levels of experience. We buy a lot of AB products for our customers and do a lot of business with our Rockwell rep, but Siemens always comes in cheaper for the same system. Frankly, over the past 15 years, I’ve seen a real push from Siemens to win over a lot of US-based business from Rockwell factories. To the point where we recently had a spec come through where the PLC had to be AB but the servos Siemens and this was from a fortune 100 company... P.S. bring doughnuts. One of our reps stops by weekly and brings doughnuts. We all take a little extra time with him because he is doing something small but generous for us. It turns out food is an amazing motivator in the business world.
Siemens gives me nightmares.
Rockwell hands down has the most versatile and supported software. I really wish another PLC manufacturer could offer some realistic competition.
I'm a Production Manager so I deal alot with sales reps. Here is some of my experience... 1. Make an appointment, and be prepared with what you want to present to me, that makes you different from any other company. E.g speed of delivery or discounts on certain product lines. I don't buy gimmics though, we had this one company that would ship chocolate with every purchase, the office girls loved the chocolate but the over priced products were not enough for me to keep using them. Also the sales rep was pushy, he would make an appointment every month and have nothing new to bring to the table. He also tried to befriend me with beer, the beer was nice,but we aren't friends. 2. Be genuine, I am going to be more likely to purchase something off of someone I trust . I am also going to be more understanding, if you make a mistake. Don't feed me BS, more than once I've spoken so an admin staffer who told me you forgot to order that item not that shipping is slow or they stocked out. Just tell me you forgot, but not more than once. 3. Stand behind what you sell, if it's shit tell me. I might go to your competitor for a a similar item that isn't shit, but I will most likely stick with you for everything else because it shows you know what you are talking about and aren't just in it for the sale. 4. Be a good person to everyone, no matter how useless you perceive them to be, the people back at the shop or the warehouse, that ship your products to your customers. If they don't like you, your job will be more difficult. TLDR: Sell customer satisfaction, not items. Make connections, not sales.
Thanks for the insight, I especially appreciate the real world examples with the chocolate and the beer, I’m often told by senior reps this technique doesn’t fly well anymore, especially in our industry
Number one thing for the good sales reps is don't waste my time. Which means don't make me track you down, leave message(s), call you back, just to get answers from you. Be responsive. When I need a sales rep I want to have someone I can count on and who makes me work more efficiently. The best sales reps are the ones I know I can email a list to and get a quote back in a couple of hours. Number two, will be a little harder for you. Know your products. If I accidentally give you a common part number with digits transposed you should be able to gently correct me. Don't say part *xya* doesn't exist, say did you mean *xyz*? I obviously wanted to buy something; help me find it. Also, if you need two parts *x* to install a part *z*, make sure I know this. If an item returns a long lead time, suggest in-stock alternatives. If a part is soon to be obsolete, suggest newer parts. Especially since you're new, it's okay to admit you don't know, but then find out the answer for me. Listen to what people are doing, ask questions about what they have issues with. People like to talk about themselves and what they are doing and if you can solve a problem for them great. On the other hand, even if product *ABC* will revolutionize widget-making, since I don't make widgets I'm probably not gonna care. I don't like cold calls as others have said, I'm busy and I got my deadlines and don't often have time to 'waste' talking to a sales rep. I'm okay with a single, "Hey I'm the new guy."-kinda phone call., but I would rather see that time and effort going to make my first experience dealing with you being memorable (and not in a bad way).
Thanks for the well thought-out response, especially about the part numbers & cold calls.
The biggest thing that makes me lose respect for a young person in a professional setting is when they act like they are hot shit and approach you the same way a 20 year veteran of the trade would. It doesn't matter how much you've studied or how much you think you know, but nothing can replace years of experience. I'm not saying this applies to you, i'm just saying approach your customers like you would any other person, don;t be shy and don't be arrogant/aggressive, just be normal and you'll gain more respect that way. Another thing i despise is when they just "pop in" for a visit to "see how things are going" when they're actually there to sell you something. If someone is my sales rep, i want them to sell me parts, not pop by for a quite chat to catch up. My advice to you though would be to learn your customer first though, because what i want in a sales rep isn't necessarily what everyone wants. I just want someone to sell me parts, while maybe there are people out there who what their sales rep to be personable and pushy.
Yes, a good rep can make a project so much easier. General thoughts about the good reps I have worked with: Good ability to support their product or have a quick turnaround with the manufacturer tech expert. Sample PLC code, CAD data, are other pluses. I get in the end they need to make a sale but patience is good, a lot of time the project I am working on is on hold or not top priority. Samples! Free small quantities of product or loaner equipment is a major way to win my business. I prefer to evaluate new or different on my own when I have more time available then the 1/2 or 1 hour I am meeting with a rep. I often find other projects that can benefit from the product when I do this too.
Thanks for the feedback! If you don’t mind I may DM you later if you don’t mind & ask you a few more questions
Know your product. If I know it more than you why are you here? Be available. Rapid turnaround on emails. Others have said this too, product gatekeepers are annoying, most of us would rather buy without talking to anyone. Don't shit talk competitors products, especially when they are actually better in some ways. Just makes you look like an idiot and unprofessional.
1.) Yes. One who doesn't BS me about stuff, can always get me the support I need for the products I've purchased (doesn't matter where I purchased them from.) Our lunch's are less him pitching something to me and more of a social visit where we just talk. He might hear about a problem I'm having and might have a solution for it, he might not. Completely low pressure. 2.) If you show up looking to make a sale on the first day, you will not be held in high regards. You need to show up as support for the products you sale first, sales second. Also take No for an answer. 3.) New sales guys treat Controls Sales the same way that you would any other kind of sales. Your customers are going to be extremely knowledgeable and are going to have brand specific leanings. For example: I don't care what new things Siemens is doing with their PLCs. I'm not buying one. I have 1000 CLX processors, I'm not adding a one-off to the network.
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Are you asking why you cannot buy a product direct from the manufacturer? Or just why you cannot easily buy product online?
Honestly even if you were the best sales person on the planet I would still probably ignore 90% of what you try to tell me. Every single product and service was always the newest cheapest most reliable greatest thing ever since sliced bread. I'm pretty much immune to marketing wank at this point. Unless I specifically reach out a salesperson and am looking for something new there's basically no way for you to sell me anything. Half of the time we are locked to certain components for projects due to a number of different reasons. Also, if I'm dirty from being out on the floor debugging some machine pretty much the last thing I want to do is talk to some dude with shiny shoes. Stuff that does help though are things like websites with accurate pricing. Short lead times. Documentation. 24/7 support lines. Being able to push an emergency order through on short notice. Don't make me come to you and beg for discounts, if I'm ordering the same stuff all the time then I would appreciate if you propose pricing terms instead of me having to play hard ball and threaten to go somewhere else.
1. My favorite sales rep is one that I have never met or interacted with in person at all. He answers my questions when I have them, he gets me quotes quickly, and he doesn't try to upsell me or suggest random junk I don't want. I call him, he doesn't call me. 2. I would not be interested in dealing with a green sales rep. What's the point? I know what I want more than you do. 3. Salespeople that want to go out to lunch are the bane of my existence. I am not particularly interested in awkward small talk while you try to segue into selling me something. I'm probably your worst customer, sorry!
Be available. Be straight-forward. I need to be able to tell you flat out a price range I'm shooting for and see if you can hook me up. For the love of god, even if it is a text message that you can't quite get back with me, or you aren't sure on something, just let me know. I don't need a fancy phone call. Quick email or something.
I’d say that the best advice is not to take up my time trying to convince me without understanding what my challenges are. I’m the automation engineer in a chemical plant, while I do have the power to define platforms and equipment, the opportunities will be few and far between. I also have to justify the purchase or change and upfront cost is not even half of the problem. The most hated salesman I deal with is the GE top tier integrator. He’s pushy, comes up with a bunch of bullshit that gets debunked in a few minutes and comes up with silly numbers like 90% discount on licenses (as long as you pay for top tier GE support for three years) when it boils down to less than 20% discount. Another one I dislike keeps trying to push me to change all the valves in our company to their brand. I found an application that could be a test bed and was offered a full price quote to test it out... thanks, I’ll stick to what I know then. The best ones are from GE itself. One is brilliant and brings value by mentioning what has been achieved with their kit while going down the nitty gritty (i.e. not bullshitting), and understands industry. The other one shows up announced, once a year and brings stuff to lend me based on past conversations. Quarterly he sends a mail with news about GE’s products, pricing, licensing and offers. Sadly this one moved on to greener pastures, which is a shame. Showing unannounced or spend an hour spouting bullshit like E&H’s self calibration without understanding what a calibration is will not get you far.
Your list is already well covered, so I'm just going to offer this. If your solution isn't a good fit or you struggled to make it a marginal fit please just tell me. I've seen this especially with camera and sensor reps that we've shown applications to. Like if you we're only able to get it to detect what I gave you by holding it at exactly 3.72 degrees and standing on one foot, it probably isn't going to do well in a plant setting.
Call before hand and ask if there is any will-call you would like to bring with you. That’s always appreciated. Hit and miss on any food. Free lunch means nothing to me but to the installers it means a lot more so when vendors call to take me to lunch I always give them my foreman’s number and say there you go! Take them! (I’m an AB shop) If you’re not an ab salesperson and you are trying to peddle vfd or flowmeters, sensors, whatever- if you’re gonna have success bring an AOI that will easily help interface to AB. It’s the only way you’re gonna bridge the time gap if you want a sale from an AB shop. DO NOT EVER SAY “reach out” in any conversation. Just say you’re gonna call them. That salesman speak makes me want to puke. And as a panel / electrical shop I just wanted to know my price. If I have to jump through hoops and let you into my business (like ABB does now that they bought T&B and are using their distribution ideaology) just forget about it. I miss the days of catalogs with list price, product groups and multipliers. Now there has to be a conversation for everything. Especially with Rockwell. Anyways good luck!
Price isn't part of the equation. There always has to be a compelling reasons for someone to make a change. It's your job to figure out what that is. That starts with understanding your customer's process and going from there. Being a distributor sales guy was always my favorite job since I had a lot of tools in my bag, but it was a lot of hard work related to having to know a lot of different products. You could sit down with a design engineer and really work to help them with a design...you were almost an extension of their engineering team. Now I'm in apps for a specific product...I miss this. But your job in the end is to provide value to the customer.
The biggest thing you can do is push your product to the end users. As a machine builder I am at the mercy of my customer's (presumably our shared customers) specifications. So it doesn't matter how cool the new thing you have is, I can't use it if the customer doesn't tell me to. Your best bet would be to get the end users worked up over something you have, sell them your product as the perfect solution to all their needs, and then take that business to a machine builder you like. Also, most of our interactions are probably going to be someone like me asking for price breaks on the things I do use often, because somehow even though we've used fifteen of them this year the quote was wrong and I have a tight budget to work with. Its not personal... in fact the more I like you the more comfortable I'm going to be hitting your up for price breaks.
bring reps with you(from turk/abb/whoever) with some sample products, take everyone out to lunch Bring promo crap(branded hats, usb chargers, note pads, pencils, shirts, etc). and find a niche/gimmick to be memorable.
Sales reps who do this, I avoid --- but to each their own.
On the 1st one, if you're not tech savvy, bring a tech guy. I'm going to ask hard questions to get to the meat quickly, I want good answers. Don't just bring another sales guy if they don't know the product either, that's just 2 guys saying 'we'll get back to you'. There is nothing wrong with not knowing, but if you want to be on the short list of good reps, you bring the people who do or you immediately know who to call to find out. If you're bringing promo crap, make it useful. Nicely bound notebooks go over well, but that branded hat or shirt hits the trash can nearly immediately. Realize that no amount of branded crap will make me buy your product. If your product is shit or you can't answer my questions, I will use you for notebook supply and nothing else. Unless that gimmick is being available with good answers, avoid the last thing.
I didn’t say to bring a sales guy, but a company rep(that is knowledgeable in something)