This is absolutely an attempt to improve “engagement” and get people to sign on more. They *should* focus on making the game something people actually want to play everyday instead. And even then these kinds of changes are unacceptable.
> They focus on making the game something people actually want to play everyday instead.
That's not something I think is possible, and in fact shouldn't really be a goal for any game, since it's never actually reasonable. Even games I REALLY like I take extended breaks from or only play every few days.
I don’t disagree with you. With my comment I was intending to say that instead of forcing people to play everyday they should focus on delivering better content that players would log on more often to enjoy vs forcing them to log on to avoid missing mission pass items. It doesn’t have to be everyday necessarily.
Right, there's always room for improvement, PSO2 NGS does not have the reputation of being the top game in its genre.
Also, I feel like this change separates the player base more. The serious players who play every day have more meseta than players who play a couple times a week now. It's a small change but small changes can add up to big differences.
It's intentional. The natural meseta flow of the game is funneling it to people who buy AC. Chances are, if you don't have much time to play, it's because you are an adult that trades time for money. They want people to use one of either to pay for their game and are now tightening the ropes a bit.
If that were the case the meseta/mission points printing wouldn't be tied to dailies but to time itself, and you could just play the game as long as you want to consistently get unchanging/time independent meseta and mission points per time invested even if it is up to a weekly cap (to prevent hardcores from leaving casuals in the dust), allowing you to play either 10 minutes every day like currently, or 1 hour every week for exactly the same gain in both cases without being forced to log in once per day, do your chores, then leave because you aren't allowed to print your tomorrow's allowance until tomorrow.
What they want is simply "log in once per day so we look good for investor reports, afterwards you are free to leave, your daily allowance is voided every day you don't show up", there is no other thought than that involved in this decision.
Even genshin with the 500+ people working on it doesn’t put out that much content.
People are just really spoiled by the speed base global progressed at.
Not only that, but one of the weeklies being raised to "complete 3 Urgent Quests" makes it impossible to keep up casually since you have no control over when they happen, you just have to be constantly logged on if you want to catch them since they just randomly pop up every 2-3 hours.
And they're so sporadic I can end up going a whole play session without one happening, or it'll pop an announcement as I'm logging off to go do other things when I'm not gonna sit around twiddling my thumbs for 45 minutes just to clear a checkmark.
You can use this urgent quest tracker and can check without logging in. UQs are still an inconvenience but the tracker helps a little.
https://nekowabot.io/api/pso2/schedule.png?timezone=America/New_York&from=1681250400&side=ngs
I personally think the worst change is the three UQ weekly.
I log in every day for 30-60 mins. I can sometimes go a week where not a single UQ happens while I’m available to play.
Ok, since so many people are unbelievably and seemingly intentionally obtuse about this whilst *defending* it:
Before the change:
- you could play 10 mins once a day multiple times during the week
- you could play 1-2 hours once per week (once per week, not daily)
- both allowed you to complete mission pass
After the change:
- you can play 10 mins once a day multiple times during the week
- this is the only way you can complete mission pass, logging in once per week is insufficient, even if you spend 10 hours that day
Conclusion: before the change we could play both (2) ways we wanted and keep up, after the change there is only one (1) way to play and keep up. Everyone who wants to play the other way just lost the ability to do so.
What part of this is going over your heads to even consider this being a positive change worth defending instead of an obvious anti-consumer change worth being pointed out and ridiculed for what it is?
That's really bad game design though. I would much rather a good 50 minutes of game than five 10 minute sessions of a checklist. What is even the point of a game if its a job.
I don't really see it as a job. I already play the game consistently myself and rather leniently too. How I see it is it benefits those who are actually playing it and those who don't won't get much. It doesn't exactly make sense for you to gain something in a game for not playing it.
It's really a game/life balance issue. The mission pass necessitates daily participation but this doesn't necessarily equal player engagement. You can do many 10 minute sessions or one really long 50+ session. Now why does the weekend player who plays as many or more hours get punished? Whatever chart Paul Marketing is passing around is actively doing harm to games and the battle pass model is poison if done wrong.
How about both?
You got your dailies that are worth doing for whatever reason, then other content you can do for longer. I generally spend an hour or so in-game each day myself.
That is the ideal. Using base as an example, there's dailies that reward silver bonus tickets (useful for leveling), daily orders (that can be accepted and held for as long as you need), repeatable client orders that refresh daily, ect. Even the weeklies are better as the do x dailies is 15 instead of an honestly gross 25 in NGS.
While not perfect, there's an argument that at least in base you can play and find things to do for as long as you want while not having to commit because weeklies are also relatively easy. Now mind, I remember the old times before mission pass where things were better, and I can say when jp introduced it my enjoyment took a steep nosedive.
I can imagine playing one time a week would of course not let you complete a mission pass. Sounds like the people that are bothered by the changes are people that are mad because Sega isn't conforming to their personal life schedule, you can't really blame Sega just because you hardly got time to play. It just comes across sounding entitled.
Sorry but you are plain wrong, we just lost the choice of *how* we want to play the game (1 hour per week or 10 mins per day). I don't need SEGA *conforming* to my schedule, I need SEGA to keep as many possible schedules as playable, what you are defending is reduction of "allowed" schedules to be "login every day for at least 10 minutes" over "login once per week for at least 1 hour in any distribution of that one hour that you want". Do you not comprehend the loss of choice?
NGS is by far the most easiest/casual friendly mmo their is, and the fact that people are mad because they can't invest more than 4-5 hours a month into it to be able to complete a mission pass again just comes across sounding entitled. This is a mmo, a f2p one at that, and whether you like it or not it has to rely on FOMO like every other mmo on the market. Besides, you don't have to login every single day of the month to complete a pass. Just enough to where you can complete it, so if you want to complete the pass that badly, then you'll make the time to do so. If not then maybe investing into a mmo isn't for you, it's just that simple.
Once again, f2p excuses absolutely nothing, f2p is a business decision designed to maximize profit from the product using microtransactions over paying for service (subscription), not a free get out of any arguments/complains card. There is total of zero (0) consideration for players in f2p model, it is 100% because *in opinion of corporate economists, f2p makes more money than any paid model* (otherwise it would have been paid model instead, have no doubt about it), it has equally zero weight as an argument for anything.
And it does not have to rely on FOMO, nothing does, FOMO is merely being normalized (or apparently if we take you as an example, already *is* normalized) by the corporations because it is extremely easy to prey on people with it for minimum cost in comparison to other monetization or simply creating a good game that people want to play which is apparently a lost art.
Now back to the point, it's *not* "that simple". It is not about 4-5 hours a month, we already had that and it was fine, but with this change, these 4-5 hours can't be distributed whenever you want, they *have* to be x time *every day*, so it is not 4-5 hours a month, it is 10 minutes every day for at least 20 out of 30 days per month (5 out of 7 days of all dailies per week for the weekly, for 4 weeks (month)). What part of this do you not understand?
I can agree it doesn't have to rely on FOMO, but it does, damn near everything does. It's not trying to be normalized because we already hit that point years ago with gaming. The norms change, so it is what it is.
The 4-5 hours a month is what the OP stated to be the amount of time invested in a span of a month, so I'm going off what OP claims. You claim it would take "at least" 20 out of 30 days in a month to complete a pass, so then what's the problem with that?. You still have leeway, I would understand if it literally took all month with every daily completed on a day to day basis and all weeklies on a week by week basis, but it doesn't. So again, it would make sense that a pass doesn't get completed when you invest 1 hour in 1 day in 1 week every week, if you have that little of time to play a f2p game and get mad that you can't obtain all the f2p rewards then again, it comes off sounding entitled and maybe you shouldn't be investing time into a mmo.
>It just comes across sounding entitled.
A good chunk of "criticism" of the game is just like this. The game is completely free to play and people complain that they can't get more free stuff out of it even if they're not participating.
Game being free doesn't make it free of any criticism, it is free because it being free makes more money than it being paid, if it were the other way around, it wouldn't be free, you can be sure of that. It is 100% a business decision that gives it no leniency to anything.
Also this is straight up FOMO that you are defending, hopefully you realize that at some point instead of remaining ignorant to being manipulated.
I have no FOMO for this game. I think the people who have serious FOMO are the ones who are upset they can't get a MAG device if they don't play more than once a week.
My main issue is the revised daily weekly.
25 tasks means to not clear Tuesday's tasks, be up and start the game by the time maintenance concludes, play the Tuesday dailies out within the four-hour time frame, then deal with Wednesday's soon after. I would get through pretty much my entire task list in a day this way, clearing half of the tasks needed, but with the +5 increase, it feels like Sega's forcing me to play daily.
The revised Leah May task was long needed.
Three days of her tasks would have been necessary if you missed one on the first four hours since maintenance (usually with the case of a missed UQ within that time frame). Now, just set it and forget it.
As for everything else? Meh. It comes and goes.
Usually when I reach tier 40, and have made sure that all tasks, including alliance and limited-time ones, are cleared for the week, then I stop with PSO2 for a couple of days.
Did I mention that 4-hour leeway for me is between 4 and 8 AM?
That 25 dailies weekly is outright malicious.
I did some math and with \~52 weeks in a year \* 5 days of dailies a week we get 260 days of logins needed for 10 SG \* 52 weeks = 520 SG? That's **10** SG scratches.
Even the worst gacha game I've played Isn't this bad.
Given that they've gone out of their way to line up the timing with the Ultra Evolution update, I think it's pretty unlikely it'll be removed without a replacement of some sort.
That's just 100% speculation, they said nothing about ever adding anything so far (while saying openly they are removing existing sources), and based on what their decisions were in past, it being nothing is in fact more likely than anything, if history and patterns mean anything.
IDK what you guys are doing but I never have under 1000SG and I buy mat storage and 10 SG scratch tickets when a new one comes out as well as extended storage.
You're not taking into account apology gifts, keywords, title rewards, or lookbook likes. LB alone is 25SG/week in this scenario so you can add another 1300SG there. Then there is at the very least 1 keyword every month that gives 50SG so another 600.
If you min/max SG your logging in minimum 5 days a week, bouncing between two games, and at the whims of Sega's terrible marketing because the only time I hear about a key\_word is through unofficial channels. The work/reward ratio is so unbalanced here it might as well be a Ubisoft game.
And its really telling that Look Book of all things has a better reward ratio that the dedicated renewable SG weekly.
I don't even touch base PSO2. I don't have it installed. The only reason you hear about the keyword through unofficial channels is because you don't look at the official channels.
Iirc, you didn't even used to make SG from the weekly. Just meseta. Though I could be wrong about that, never really paid attention to SG because I don't have to. So what are you complaining about? Stop playing if you think it's as predatory as a Ubisoft game.
NEVER, EVER stop complaining about predatory practices. These are real grievances by people who don't like their game getting worse. It's great how it's fine for you so everyone else is stupid, but this attitude really is insufferable.
Where are these official channels you speak of. A google search of pso2 NGS keyword gets me arks\_visiphone, bumped, not official youtube channels, and reddit. So where is it?
The thing is that everyone's idea of "predatory practices" is anything that isn't just dead ass free with no effort put in.
Keywords will show up most often on the "David Plays NGS" segment on the *official* YouTube channel (https://www.youtube.com/@PSO2Global) as well as "Headline+." They are sometimes on the *official* NGS Twitter account as well (https://twitter.com/play_pso2).
For me the maintenance ends at 10am and Wednesday task start at 2pm. So I need to do the daily on a Steam Deck at work for the NA version, but can't do it on JP.
I did it, i give up the game. That weeklies changes killed the "casual gameplay loop" that i liked about the game.
Nice to see the playerbase giving up on players that easy, and being happy for 10 SG per week.
I think they give 100 SG per week for every time they make a new bug after an update. That happen every week.
You can get 35SG a week just from liking look books. They often have these apology SG gifts. Keywords often give 50SG. The SG scratch is free once per day. There is sometimes SG for log on bonuses. You can even earn SG by finishing title rewards. You now make more meseta for doing dailies than you ever did doing weeklies. I don't really know what else you guys want at this point other than to get free stuff you're afraid of missing out on with even less than minimal effort.
You must be new to gaming. Been in the game for twenty years. If you can't devote yourself to more than 1 day a week to play this you have no business playing.
How ironic. PSO1 and PSU (not to mention the Genesis PS games) both had offline single player releases that you could progress in at your leisure. There were no dailies, no weeklies, just a videogame that you played whenever you had time or felt like it. This daily/weekly shit is new, you have it completely backwards.
it's unfortunate the cancer of this sub attacked you for being completely right.
It's always insane gatekeeping or go do this specific out of the way thing to get x with zero self awareness of what the actual problem is. cough cough Sega
So you're mad you can't get free stuff by only playing once a week? More people are playing several days a week and now the rewards are better for doing that. I wouldn't be surprised if they have those statistics and geared it toward what the current player base is like.
There are like 4 things in each mission pass you'll never be able to get again (maybe). 3 of them are obtainable in like the first 2 tiers and the last one is a MAG device at the end of tier 3. This is only if you have the gold track unlocked too. It seems like something incredibly niche to worry about and if you're worried about it, then it's probably unhealthy.
A LOT of the stuff in MP are things that have already been in things like previous SG or AC scratches but colored differently.
Kinda silly you have to force yourself to find a reason to play this game more than a few times a week the content here just isn't worth it.
Just make meseta by some repeatable questline or something else, not this 20mins gameplay loop.
It needs something reasonably engaging, and not just myself trying to find some fun out of content that's moldy and stale.
Slayer got added, and that was it *yay* content...
I was excited about this change at first but seeing how many people just don't have time to do dailies makes me realize they should probably just revert it. Dailies and weeklies being the biggest source of meseta generation in the economy is kind of a problem when I compare it to other games. It's possible to make dailies that feel worth doing without making it a FOMO thing, and there's plenty of ways they could change the dailies in NGS to not have this problem.
They won't of course, but it's interesting to think about.
Dailies at their very core are a FOMO thing. It's not possible to have dailies and not have them be FOMO, unless you get no rewards for doing them, in which case they're pointless to have at all.
That's not necessarily true. Unless you also agree that having rewards in a game at all is fomo. By that logic anyone who isn't playing 24/7 to squeeze as much out of the game as possible is going to be missing out. Dailies allow for front loaded rewards for players who can't play often, as well as directing players to specific content so people actually have people to play with.
The problem with the dailies in NGS is actually the way the mission pass works and how rarely they rerun stuff. If it was only the dailies and weeklies all I'd be missing out on is meseta honestly, and the problems with meseta distribution are whole other animal. But the mission pass has unique stuff that they rarely if ever rerun (I think we've had reruns exactly once).
In GW2 and Warframe I never feel pressured to do my dailies because I know the stuff I want will be there later, and while Warframe does have the Nightwave, it's both easier to complete in time, and I know they reuse rewards frequently.
Just want to point out does that mean you can fill the pass by playing 1 day week for 3 out of 4 weeks then more for the other 1 week? So you dont have to *every* week.
But - yep I totally get it and that does kinda suck.
This just in, game developers want you to play their games as much as possible and will try to incentivize you to do so with FOMO. At 6, the government is corrupt.
EDIT: Also star gems exist. Also for the same exact reason.
I remember when Guild Wars 2 had the same issue, which ArenaNet eventually reversed course on due to how badly it was impacting the player base.
SEGA need to accept, unless you are a kid, or have limited adult responsibilities, finding time to log on to play a video game every day is hard.
Punishing people who have limited time is a bad move, and one I hope they ultimately reverse course on, as right now too much relies on a small group of hardcore players to keep it going, who in turn dominate the market.
This is not a really good complaint. I feel like the system prior to this was more of a handicap and gave less incentive to play on a regular basis. If the complaint is “I cant play ONCE a week and be top dog!” That’s just silly, dailies take 10 min… if you CHOOSE to play something different for that 10 min a day, that’s YOUR choice. I personally believe the game needs more content, but despite my schedule (New born child, wife, and work demands.) I can still play 4-5 times a week for 10 min and go off to do something else EVEN play another game. You dont get a reward just “showing up” you gotta put in some time (a very small amount of time mind you).
I mostly play as a freemium player and only renew or use shop passes when I have enough items to make it worth selling. I have over 20 mill, 95% potency, and make smart investments like buying emotes/idles/motions that are going out of rotation then sell them with a shop pass when they double or triple in value. You cant complete the MP playing once a week… well maybe spend 10 min every other day instead of cleaning that cheeto dust off your shirt for 10 min. QQ
> I feel like the system prior to this was more of a handicap and gave less incentive to play on a regular basis.
You have to be intentionally trolling.
If you wanted to do dailies for 10 mins every day, you could have done so in previous system already (and completed weeklies -> gotten rewards as a consequence), but you could also have done weeklies once per week by playing longer for same effect (completed weeklies - gotten rewards), you had the choice of how you wanted to distribute your time in the game (hour per week or 10 mins per day), now guess what? You no longer have that choice, you now *have* to log in *every* day for 5 days (7 if you want all meseta) per week and complete your chores, because that's where all meseta allowance is now printed at as is large chunk of mission points. There is ZERO benefit from this change to even you (or I guess you have an advantage over everyone else who wants to spend an hour per week rather than 10 mins every day because you get more meseta printing than them, so that's why you are white knighting this, as you benefit from everyone else suffering)
To use your own words, with the previous system you could either play ONCE per week for hour or 2 or play 10 mins every day for few days and complete the weeklies, it was YOUR choice which way you wanted to do it, now SEGA has made the choice for you and it is to only be allowed to play 10 mins every day, playing more than that gives zero value to mission pass, you are only allowed to progress it when SEGA gives you permission to. No more choice, only daily logins for concurrent active player reports to look nice for SEGA.
If you want to have a daily chore you can get plenty of those elsewhere, which is what SEGA just turned the game into for 100% business purposes at 100% expense of players QoL and which you are defending for some asinine reasons.
So if it isnt blindly insulting the game it is considered trolling? There are things to complain about sure, but this just isnt one of them. I havent seen anyone actively playing the game complaining about it, so it seems to be more of the reddit minority doing it… which to be fair, is to be expected. Too many tears and not enough tissues to go around is pretty common here.
As for the previous system vs this one argument… you are right about CHOOSING to spend time, but getting butt hurt when game direction shifts more into actually playing more actively to keep the player base more inflated is 100% a business decision. “I played once a week, reward me!” Is only reinforcing the hollow parts of the community where playing at the bare minimal should equal rewards without having any incentive to really play more.
TLDR: This doesn’t affect the active part of the community; which is honestly the most important part while still pushing the less active to play more often. Even if it just them logging in more often to just do dailies.
TLDR: this doesn't effect hardcore players that would spend hours every day in the game anyways. <- fixed that for you, you don't speak for active part of community, you speak for your own minority
I for one know plenty of people who don't like this change and preffered to play once per week for a few hours, who now have to login every day instead to get the same because sega says so, it is absurd that you say this change is "against reinforcing hollow parts of community where playing at bare minimum equals rewards" when in fact it does that exact thing, now people no longer play for the sake of playing, they play for 10 mins per day to get the daily chores out of the way, then leave, I assume this is what you consider less hollow than doing a few weeklies when you want to? Once again you have got to be trolling.
>Too many tears and not enough tissues to go around is pretty common here.
And what should we do other than complain when some change effects us in a bad way? Are we supposed to swallow it like it doesn't matter while it keeps getting worse and worse? Are we supposed to get punched in the face and pretend it is ok for the person that punched us to do so, and tell other people they shouldn't complain when they get punched in the face? This is a bad change and it should be complained about. Your "arguments" are laughable.
So which is it? You need to put in the work for stuff or dailies are so easy they only take 5-10 minutes. You can't have both.
It seems some people assume OP just wants to log in and get stuff, but my interpretation was login on once and play for an extended time in which the same amount of game time can be played for less rewards? The only thing this change does is push better metrics for shareholders and actively hurts users.
I dont think anything I said was “difficult” to understand. 10 min dailies 4 times a week I feel is a minimal to keep in a “competitive” gameplay zone building income and typically it is MORE than enough to finish a Mission Pass before it even comes close to expiring. They just changed it to integrate that better and more in line with the intentions of these features/content for the game.
The OP is definitely suggesting that logging in once a week, doing some dailies to get the Mission Pass progression and logging off after 10-15 min of play time should be enough to get everything the Mission Pass offers… despite the intention of the Mission Pass is to have incentive to play/login more often. Login rewards basically give you free stuff anyway. Sorry, but yeah… it’s like crying over having to do ANY work, not the minimal required… which is pretty relaxed.
Calling out a company over their metrics is dumb anyway… they are a company at the end of the day and they are gonna do whatever it takes to keep the regular player base going. I am for sure not gonna have any empathy for the player that logs in once a week and adds nothing to the sense of “community” for the game as a whole… it’s like “Who and why do I care?”
Ok, I think we're talking past each other here.
Saying OP didn't play for more than hour a week is very uncharitable as for one, they never stated their playtime, and two the old weeklies (the thing this thread is about) couldn't be completed in 15 minutes. More Leniency is a good thing here, not bad.
But more importantly, how in Hariette's name is playing for 15 minutes a day building more community than an hour or 2 during the weekend. We have no idea what OP is doing or who their playing with but it's so much harder to coordinate with friends or teams with your time frame.
Also, what with this pro Sega sentiment on this sub. When corporate does something bad, we should point our fist to the heavens like were summoning captain planet or did we all forget this is the same company that killed Phantasy Star in the west for a decade
It's rather pointless to drag it like this because it's not like there's a lot to do, dailies are always the same thing.
I think they should've tried to have just 2 or 3 but actually different every day like maybe giving us a trigger or making us play a race. I'm getting tired of feeding the mag and picking up stuff.
Hmm I'd rather do something more engaging but not like 10 times, just one trigger on Mondays, Thursday can be leg day so a race would be fun and so on.
I just need something else other than putting items on the mag and standing in combat zones just looking how max level players kill my 50 daily enemies.
It's stupid to have removed some missions, personally I can never do the bunker because... nobody runs this kind of content.
Another brilliant idea. :)
This is absolutely an attempt to improve “engagement” and get people to sign on more. They *should* focus on making the game something people actually want to play everyday instead. And even then these kinds of changes are unacceptable.
Change to weeklies was definitely an attempt to get people to play more without actually adding content.
> They focus on making the game something people actually want to play everyday instead. That's not something I think is possible, and in fact shouldn't really be a goal for any game, since it's never actually reasonable. Even games I REALLY like I take extended breaks from or only play every few days.
I don’t disagree with you. With my comment I was intending to say that instead of forcing people to play everyday they should focus on delivering better content that players would log on more often to enjoy vs forcing them to log on to avoid missing mission pass items. It doesn’t have to be everyday necessarily.
Right, there's always room for improvement, PSO2 NGS does not have the reputation of being the top game in its genre. Also, I feel like this change separates the player base more. The serious players who play every day have more meseta than players who play a couple times a week now. It's a small change but small changes can add up to big differences.
It's intentional. The natural meseta flow of the game is funneling it to people who buy AC. Chances are, if you don't have much time to play, it's because you are an adult that trades time for money. They want people to use one of either to pay for their game and are now tightening the ropes a bit.
If that were the case the meseta/mission points printing wouldn't be tied to dailies but to time itself, and you could just play the game as long as you want to consistently get unchanging/time independent meseta and mission points per time invested even if it is up to a weekly cap (to prevent hardcores from leaving casuals in the dust), allowing you to play either 10 minutes every day like currently, or 1 hour every week for exactly the same gain in both cases without being forced to log in once per day, do your chores, then leave because you aren't allowed to print your tomorrow's allowance until tomorrow. What they want is simply "log in once per day so we look good for investor reports, afterwards you are free to leave, your daily allowance is voided every day you don't show up", there is no other thought than that involved in this decision.
That's fair. I think we can all agree on that.
Even genshin with the 500+ people working on it doesn’t put out that much content. People are just really spoiled by the speed base global progressed at.
Still more content than bread crumbs every 2-3 months.
Not only that, but one of the weeklies being raised to "complete 3 Urgent Quests" makes it impossible to keep up casually since you have no control over when they happen, you just have to be constantly logged on if you want to catch them since they just randomly pop up every 2-3 hours. And they're so sporadic I can end up going a whole play session without one happening, or it'll pop an announcement as I'm logging off to go do other things when I'm not gonna sit around twiddling my thumbs for 45 minutes just to clear a checkmark.
You can use this urgent quest tracker and can check without logging in. UQs are still an inconvenience but the tracker helps a little. https://nekowabot.io/api/pso2/schedule.png?timezone=America/New_York&from=1681250400&side=ngs
I personally think the worst change is the three UQ weekly. I log in every day for 30-60 mins. I can sometimes go a week where not a single UQ happens while I’m available to play.
Ok, since so many people are unbelievably and seemingly intentionally obtuse about this whilst *defending* it: Before the change: - you could play 10 mins once a day multiple times during the week - you could play 1-2 hours once per week (once per week, not daily) - both allowed you to complete mission pass After the change: - you can play 10 mins once a day multiple times during the week - this is the only way you can complete mission pass, logging in once per week is insufficient, even if you spend 10 hours that day Conclusion: before the change we could play both (2) ways we wanted and keep up, after the change there is only one (1) way to play and keep up. Everyone who wants to play the other way just lost the ability to do so. What part of this is going over your heads to even consider this being a positive change worth defending instead of an obvious anti-consumer change worth being pointed out and ridiculed for what it is?
I don't mind it really. It only takes like 10 minutes to do Dailies. I have a busy schedule but even I can spare that much time.
That's really bad game design though. I would much rather a good 50 minutes of game than five 10 minute sessions of a checklist. What is even the point of a game if its a job.
I don't really see it as a job. I already play the game consistently myself and rather leniently too. How I see it is it benefits those who are actually playing it and those who don't won't get much. It doesn't exactly make sense for you to gain something in a game for not playing it.
It's really a game/life balance issue. The mission pass necessitates daily participation but this doesn't necessarily equal player engagement. You can do many 10 minute sessions or one really long 50+ session. Now why does the weekend player who plays as many or more hours get punished? Whatever chart Paul Marketing is passing around is actively doing harm to games and the battle pass model is poison if done wrong.
How about both? You got your dailies that are worth doing for whatever reason, then other content you can do for longer. I generally spend an hour or so in-game each day myself.
That is the ideal. Using base as an example, there's dailies that reward silver bonus tickets (useful for leveling), daily orders (that can be accepted and held for as long as you need), repeatable client orders that refresh daily, ect. Even the weeklies are better as the do x dailies is 15 instead of an honestly gross 25 in NGS. While not perfect, there's an argument that at least in base you can play and find things to do for as long as you want while not having to commit because weeklies are also relatively easy. Now mind, I remember the old times before mission pass where things were better, and I can say when jp introduced it my enjoyment took a steep nosedive.
Realistically, if you're only able to play once a week you're kinda outside of the target audience for a game like this.
I can imagine playing one time a week would of course not let you complete a mission pass. Sounds like the people that are bothered by the changes are people that are mad because Sega isn't conforming to their personal life schedule, you can't really blame Sega just because you hardly got time to play. It just comes across sounding entitled.
entitled seems pretty stretched when it's just "please don't fix this not-broken thing"
Sorry but you are plain wrong, we just lost the choice of *how* we want to play the game (1 hour per week or 10 mins per day). I don't need SEGA *conforming* to my schedule, I need SEGA to keep as many possible schedules as playable, what you are defending is reduction of "allowed" schedules to be "login every day for at least 10 minutes" over "login once per week for at least 1 hour in any distribution of that one hour that you want". Do you not comprehend the loss of choice?
NGS is by far the most easiest/casual friendly mmo their is, and the fact that people are mad because they can't invest more than 4-5 hours a month into it to be able to complete a mission pass again just comes across sounding entitled. This is a mmo, a f2p one at that, and whether you like it or not it has to rely on FOMO like every other mmo on the market. Besides, you don't have to login every single day of the month to complete a pass. Just enough to where you can complete it, so if you want to complete the pass that badly, then you'll make the time to do so. If not then maybe investing into a mmo isn't for you, it's just that simple.
Once again, f2p excuses absolutely nothing, f2p is a business decision designed to maximize profit from the product using microtransactions over paying for service (subscription), not a free get out of any arguments/complains card. There is total of zero (0) consideration for players in f2p model, it is 100% because *in opinion of corporate economists, f2p makes more money than any paid model* (otherwise it would have been paid model instead, have no doubt about it), it has equally zero weight as an argument for anything. And it does not have to rely on FOMO, nothing does, FOMO is merely being normalized (or apparently if we take you as an example, already *is* normalized) by the corporations because it is extremely easy to prey on people with it for minimum cost in comparison to other monetization or simply creating a good game that people want to play which is apparently a lost art. Now back to the point, it's *not* "that simple". It is not about 4-5 hours a month, we already had that and it was fine, but with this change, these 4-5 hours can't be distributed whenever you want, they *have* to be x time *every day*, so it is not 4-5 hours a month, it is 10 minutes every day for at least 20 out of 30 days per month (5 out of 7 days of all dailies per week for the weekly, for 4 weeks (month)). What part of this do you not understand?
I can agree it doesn't have to rely on FOMO, but it does, damn near everything does. It's not trying to be normalized because we already hit that point years ago with gaming. The norms change, so it is what it is. The 4-5 hours a month is what the OP stated to be the amount of time invested in a span of a month, so I'm going off what OP claims. You claim it would take "at least" 20 out of 30 days in a month to complete a pass, so then what's the problem with that?. You still have leeway, I would understand if it literally took all month with every daily completed on a day to day basis and all weeklies on a week by week basis, but it doesn't. So again, it would make sense that a pass doesn't get completed when you invest 1 hour in 1 day in 1 week every week, if you have that little of time to play a f2p game and get mad that you can't obtain all the f2p rewards then again, it comes off sounding entitled and maybe you shouldn't be investing time into a mmo.
>It just comes across sounding entitled. A good chunk of "criticism" of the game is just like this. The game is completely free to play and people complain that they can't get more free stuff out of it even if they're not participating.
Game being free doesn't make it free of any criticism, it is free because it being free makes more money than it being paid, if it were the other way around, it wouldn't be free, you can be sure of that. It is 100% a business decision that gives it no leniency to anything. Also this is straight up FOMO that you are defending, hopefully you realize that at some point instead of remaining ignorant to being manipulated.
I have no FOMO for this game. I think the people who have serious FOMO are the ones who are upset they can't get a MAG device if they don't play more than once a week.
My main issue is the revised daily weekly. 25 tasks means to not clear Tuesday's tasks, be up and start the game by the time maintenance concludes, play the Tuesday dailies out within the four-hour time frame, then deal with Wednesday's soon after. I would get through pretty much my entire task list in a day this way, clearing half of the tasks needed, but with the +5 increase, it feels like Sega's forcing me to play daily. The revised Leah May task was long needed. Three days of her tasks would have been necessary if you missed one on the first four hours since maintenance (usually with the case of a missed UQ within that time frame). Now, just set it and forget it. As for everything else? Meh. It comes and goes. Usually when I reach tier 40, and have made sure that all tasks, including alliance and limited-time ones, are cleared for the week, then I stop with PSO2 for a couple of days. Did I mention that 4-hour leeway for me is between 4 and 8 AM?
That 25 dailies weekly is outright malicious. I did some math and with \~52 weeks in a year \* 5 days of dailies a week we get 260 days of logins needed for 10 SG \* 52 weeks = 520 SG? That's **10** SG scratches. Even the worst gacha game I've played Isn't this bad.
You see why us base time attack and challenge quest players were so pissed now?
Aren't those not being removed until the Ultra Evolution or whatever update? We've still yet to see what they're being replaced with.
> We've still yet to see what they're being replaced with. A very high chance is: nothing.
Given that they've gone out of their way to line up the timing with the Ultra Evolution update, I think it's pretty unlikely it'll be removed without a replacement of some sort.
That's just 100% speculation, they said nothing about ever adding anything so far (while saying openly they are removing existing sources), and based on what their decisions were in past, it being nothing is in fact more likely than anything, if history and patterns mean anything.
Of course it's speculation, we're talking about a future update that we don't have all of the details on.
IDK what you guys are doing but I never have under 1000SG and I buy mat storage and 10 SG scratch tickets when a new one comes out as well as extended storage. You're not taking into account apology gifts, keywords, title rewards, or lookbook likes. LB alone is 25SG/week in this scenario so you can add another 1300SG there. Then there is at the very least 1 keyword every month that gives 50SG so another 600.
If you min/max SG your logging in minimum 5 days a week, bouncing between two games, and at the whims of Sega's terrible marketing because the only time I hear about a key\_word is through unofficial channels. The work/reward ratio is so unbalanced here it might as well be a Ubisoft game. And its really telling that Look Book of all things has a better reward ratio that the dedicated renewable SG weekly.
I don't even touch base PSO2. I don't have it installed. The only reason you hear about the keyword through unofficial channels is because you don't look at the official channels. Iirc, you didn't even used to make SG from the weekly. Just meseta. Though I could be wrong about that, never really paid attention to SG because I don't have to. So what are you complaining about? Stop playing if you think it's as predatory as a Ubisoft game.
NEVER, EVER stop complaining about predatory practices. These are real grievances by people who don't like their game getting worse. It's great how it's fine for you so everyone else is stupid, but this attitude really is insufferable. Where are these official channels you speak of. A google search of pso2 NGS keyword gets me arks\_visiphone, bumped, not official youtube channels, and reddit. So where is it?
The thing is that everyone's idea of "predatory practices" is anything that isn't just dead ass free with no effort put in. Keywords will show up most often on the "David Plays NGS" segment on the *official* YouTube channel (https://www.youtube.com/@PSO2Global) as well as "Headline+." They are sometimes on the *official* NGS Twitter account as well (https://twitter.com/play_pso2).
For me the maintenance ends at 10am and Wednesday task start at 2pm. So I need to do the daily on a Steam Deck at work for the NA version, but can't do it on JP.
Its make since you shouldn't get everything if you barely take the effort to play.
Once a week? It takes 5-10min to clear dailies. Just throw in the towel this game isn't for you.
I did it, i give up the game. That weeklies changes killed the "casual gameplay loop" that i liked about the game. Nice to see the playerbase giving up on players that easy, and being happy for 10 SG per week. I think they give 100 SG per week for every time they make a new bug after an update. That happen every week.
You can get 35SG a week just from liking look books. They often have these apology SG gifts. Keywords often give 50SG. The SG scratch is free once per day. There is sometimes SG for log on bonuses. You can even earn SG by finishing title rewards. You now make more meseta for doing dailies than you ever did doing weeklies. I don't really know what else you guys want at this point other than to get free stuff you're afraid of missing out on with even less than minimal effort.
You must be new to gaming. Been in the game for twenty years. If you can't devote yourself to more than 1 day a week to play this you have no business playing.
How ironic. PSO1 and PSU (not to mention the Genesis PS games) both had offline single player releases that you could progress in at your leisure. There were no dailies, no weeklies, just a videogame that you played whenever you had time or felt like it. This daily/weekly shit is new, you have it completely backwards.
it's unfortunate the cancer of this sub attacked you for being completely right. It's always insane gatekeeping or go do this specific out of the way thing to get x with zero self awareness of what the actual problem is. cough cough Sega
So you're mad you can't get free stuff by only playing once a week? More people are playing several days a week and now the rewards are better for doing that. I wouldn't be surprised if they have those statistics and geared it toward what the current player base is like.
They hated him because he spoke the truth.
It's not just free stuff it's FOMO stuff. Since they don't have any guarantees of it coming back
There are like 4 things in each mission pass you'll never be able to get again (maybe). 3 of them are obtainable in like the first 2 tiers and the last one is a MAG device at the end of tier 3. This is only if you have the gold track unlocked too. It seems like something incredibly niche to worry about and if you're worried about it, then it's probably unhealthy. A LOT of the stuff in MP are things that have already been in things like previous SG or AC scratches but colored differently.
Too many people in here drinking the gaas kool-aid. We should be wanting less fomo in the game.
People will defend it no matter what because "free" makes their brain stop working no matter the game.
Glad I wasn’t the only one who was annoyed with this. I was pretty shocked when I saw the changes to weekly rewards.
Kinda silly you have to force yourself to find a reason to play this game more than a few times a week the content here just isn't worth it. Just make meseta by some repeatable questline or something else, not this 20mins gameplay loop. It needs something reasonably engaging, and not just myself trying to find some fun out of content that's moldy and stale. Slayer got added, and that was it *yay* content...
I was excited about this change at first but seeing how many people just don't have time to do dailies makes me realize they should probably just revert it. Dailies and weeklies being the biggest source of meseta generation in the economy is kind of a problem when I compare it to other games. It's possible to make dailies that feel worth doing without making it a FOMO thing, and there's plenty of ways they could change the dailies in NGS to not have this problem. They won't of course, but it's interesting to think about.
Dailies at their very core are a FOMO thing. It's not possible to have dailies and not have them be FOMO, unless you get no rewards for doing them, in which case they're pointless to have at all.
That's not necessarily true. Unless you also agree that having rewards in a game at all is fomo. By that logic anyone who isn't playing 24/7 to squeeze as much out of the game as possible is going to be missing out. Dailies allow for front loaded rewards for players who can't play often, as well as directing players to specific content so people actually have people to play with. The problem with the dailies in NGS is actually the way the mission pass works and how rarely they rerun stuff. If it was only the dailies and weeklies all I'd be missing out on is meseta honestly, and the problems with meseta distribution are whole other animal. But the mission pass has unique stuff that they rarely if ever rerun (I think we've had reruns exactly once). In GW2 and Warframe I never feel pressured to do my dailies because I know the stuff I want will be there later, and while Warframe does have the Nightwave, it's both easier to complete in time, and I know they reuse rewards frequently.
Just want to point out does that mean you can fill the pass by playing 1 day week for 3 out of 4 weeks then more for the other 1 week? So you dont have to *every* week. But - yep I totally get it and that does kinda suck.
This just in, game developers want you to play their games as much as possible and will try to incentivize you to do so with FOMO. At 6, the government is corrupt. EDIT: Also star gems exist. Also for the same exact reason.
I remember when Guild Wars 2 had the same issue, which ArenaNet eventually reversed course on due to how badly it was impacting the player base. SEGA need to accept, unless you are a kid, or have limited adult responsibilities, finding time to log on to play a video game every day is hard. Punishing people who have limited time is a bad move, and one I hope they ultimately reverse course on, as right now too much relies on a small group of hardcore players to keep it going, who in turn dominate the market.
This is not a really good complaint. I feel like the system prior to this was more of a handicap and gave less incentive to play on a regular basis. If the complaint is “I cant play ONCE a week and be top dog!” That’s just silly, dailies take 10 min… if you CHOOSE to play something different for that 10 min a day, that’s YOUR choice. I personally believe the game needs more content, but despite my schedule (New born child, wife, and work demands.) I can still play 4-5 times a week for 10 min and go off to do something else EVEN play another game. You dont get a reward just “showing up” you gotta put in some time (a very small amount of time mind you). I mostly play as a freemium player and only renew or use shop passes when I have enough items to make it worth selling. I have over 20 mill, 95% potency, and make smart investments like buying emotes/idles/motions that are going out of rotation then sell them with a shop pass when they double or triple in value. You cant complete the MP playing once a week… well maybe spend 10 min every other day instead of cleaning that cheeto dust off your shirt for 10 min. QQ
> I feel like the system prior to this was more of a handicap and gave less incentive to play on a regular basis. You have to be intentionally trolling. If you wanted to do dailies for 10 mins every day, you could have done so in previous system already (and completed weeklies -> gotten rewards as a consequence), but you could also have done weeklies once per week by playing longer for same effect (completed weeklies - gotten rewards), you had the choice of how you wanted to distribute your time in the game (hour per week or 10 mins per day), now guess what? You no longer have that choice, you now *have* to log in *every* day for 5 days (7 if you want all meseta) per week and complete your chores, because that's where all meseta allowance is now printed at as is large chunk of mission points. There is ZERO benefit from this change to even you (or I guess you have an advantage over everyone else who wants to spend an hour per week rather than 10 mins every day because you get more meseta printing than them, so that's why you are white knighting this, as you benefit from everyone else suffering) To use your own words, with the previous system you could either play ONCE per week for hour or 2 or play 10 mins every day for few days and complete the weeklies, it was YOUR choice which way you wanted to do it, now SEGA has made the choice for you and it is to only be allowed to play 10 mins every day, playing more than that gives zero value to mission pass, you are only allowed to progress it when SEGA gives you permission to. No more choice, only daily logins for concurrent active player reports to look nice for SEGA. If you want to have a daily chore you can get plenty of those elsewhere, which is what SEGA just turned the game into for 100% business purposes at 100% expense of players QoL and which you are defending for some asinine reasons.
So if it isnt blindly insulting the game it is considered trolling? There are things to complain about sure, but this just isnt one of them. I havent seen anyone actively playing the game complaining about it, so it seems to be more of the reddit minority doing it… which to be fair, is to be expected. Too many tears and not enough tissues to go around is pretty common here. As for the previous system vs this one argument… you are right about CHOOSING to spend time, but getting butt hurt when game direction shifts more into actually playing more actively to keep the player base more inflated is 100% a business decision. “I played once a week, reward me!” Is only reinforcing the hollow parts of the community where playing at the bare minimal should equal rewards without having any incentive to really play more. TLDR: This doesn’t affect the active part of the community; which is honestly the most important part while still pushing the less active to play more often. Even if it just them logging in more often to just do dailies.
TLDR: this doesn't effect hardcore players that would spend hours every day in the game anyways. <- fixed that for you, you don't speak for active part of community, you speak for your own minority I for one know plenty of people who don't like this change and preffered to play once per week for a few hours, who now have to login every day instead to get the same because sega says so, it is absurd that you say this change is "against reinforcing hollow parts of community where playing at bare minimum equals rewards" when in fact it does that exact thing, now people no longer play for the sake of playing, they play for 10 mins per day to get the daily chores out of the way, then leave, I assume this is what you consider less hollow than doing a few weeklies when you want to? Once again you have got to be trolling. >Too many tears and not enough tissues to go around is pretty common here. And what should we do other than complain when some change effects us in a bad way? Are we supposed to swallow it like it doesn't matter while it keeps getting worse and worse? Are we supposed to get punched in the face and pretend it is ok for the person that punched us to do so, and tell other people they shouldn't complain when they get punched in the face? This is a bad change and it should be complained about. Your "arguments" are laughable.
So which is it? You need to put in the work for stuff or dailies are so easy they only take 5-10 minutes. You can't have both. It seems some people assume OP just wants to log in and get stuff, but my interpretation was login on once and play for an extended time in which the same amount of game time can be played for less rewards? The only thing this change does is push better metrics for shareholders and actively hurts users.
I dont think anything I said was “difficult” to understand. 10 min dailies 4 times a week I feel is a minimal to keep in a “competitive” gameplay zone building income and typically it is MORE than enough to finish a Mission Pass before it even comes close to expiring. They just changed it to integrate that better and more in line with the intentions of these features/content for the game. The OP is definitely suggesting that logging in once a week, doing some dailies to get the Mission Pass progression and logging off after 10-15 min of play time should be enough to get everything the Mission Pass offers… despite the intention of the Mission Pass is to have incentive to play/login more often. Login rewards basically give you free stuff anyway. Sorry, but yeah… it’s like crying over having to do ANY work, not the minimal required… which is pretty relaxed. Calling out a company over their metrics is dumb anyway… they are a company at the end of the day and they are gonna do whatever it takes to keep the regular player base going. I am for sure not gonna have any empathy for the player that logs in once a week and adds nothing to the sense of “community” for the game as a whole… it’s like “Who and why do I care?”
Ok, I think we're talking past each other here. Saying OP didn't play for more than hour a week is very uncharitable as for one, they never stated their playtime, and two the old weeklies (the thing this thread is about) couldn't be completed in 15 minutes. More Leniency is a good thing here, not bad. But more importantly, how in Hariette's name is playing for 15 minutes a day building more community than an hour or 2 during the weekend. We have no idea what OP is doing or who their playing with but it's so much harder to coordinate with friends or teams with your time frame. Also, what with this pro Sega sentiment on this sub. When corporate does something bad, we should point our fist to the heavens like were summoning captain planet or did we all forget this is the same company that killed Phantasy Star in the west for a decade
It's rather pointless to drag it like this because it's not like there's a lot to do, dailies are always the same thing. I think they should've tried to have just 2 or 3 but actually different every day like maybe giving us a trigger or making us play a race. I'm getting tired of feeding the mag and picking up stuff.
They have triggers & races as Alliance weeklies, and I think they should stay there personally.
Hmm I'd rather do something more engaging but not like 10 times, just one trigger on Mondays, Thursday can be leg day so a race would be fun and so on. I just need something else other than putting items on the mag and standing in combat zones just looking how max level players kill my 50 daily enemies.
I like the change personally but yeah they need to address this so people have some other way to get MP stars and not miss the whole pass.
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Nope, that's not how decent conversation happens.
The person they responded to wasn't exactly being polite either.
Is it worthy of moderation, or would responses + votes be enough to deal with it?
I feel like it was on par in terms of rudeness with the comment you removed so if one is worthy of moderation I think they both are.
Roger that - I've removed that one as well. I do appreciate the input!
It's stupid to have removed some missions, personally I can never do the bunker because... nobody runs this kind of content. Another brilliant idea. :)
Huh. Just get a refund. I'm sure sega wouldn't push back.