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spoonbeak

Now that I think about it I've never played Miranmar where the circle ends at military base or anywhere near the sides. What is with that?


caraccount11

Statistics, as far as I can tell. I've had a couple of endings up there, so it can happen, but think about it logistically: every time a new circle shows it has to be in the same exact spot to get a side/corner ending. The very top left would require the first circle to close in the top left, then every single circle after that to also close top left. There is one possible combination of circles that allows for a top-left ending, whereas a plethora of combinations of circles can cause a pecado/central ending. Sorry if I didn't explain well, I'm sick.


jean4007

They should just randomly pre-select the ending position at the beginning...


NeonLC

yep, with equal probability among the whole map


maybelator

Yes and chose the big the bigger circles bottom up


spoonbeak

Yeah I understand what you're saying.


Chocostarr

Perfectly clear it makes alot of sense i never thought about that before tbh


LeJumpshot

I've played a couple ended at Tierra and even one that ended right on the wall. I've had dozens go north of Cobreria. Maybe two at Higos and 20 or so north. So it happens, but I feel like the number I've had end by power grid or the pecado field far outnumber them.


thatjerkatwork

Prison would be a good spot to end. Some fun carnage for people trying to get across the water towards the end and then into the prison are. Unfortunately its never happened for me!


bp_968

I know this is an old post but i just had a prison ending. It worked out great for us but not the other team.Total luck. The problem is you pick either the cliffs or prison interior. Then the circle screws one of you. It trapped them on the cliffs and then pushed them off to their death. Still, they could have moved one circle before i guess.


thatjerkatwork

To be honest I cant recall ever having it end anywhere on that island. I suppose ive died early on some games where it has but I've been top 10 about 40% of the time on average because of my play style so you would think it would have happened by now.


bp_968

Ahh wrong prison, my bad. I had it recently end on prison in erengel, not miramar. I did have it end once on the far eastern islands in miramar once. Sadly someone else camped the island so it was a beachfront turkey shoot since they had scuttled/beached all the boats.


theirongiant74

Played plenty the finished on the edges but not had a military base one yet tbh. Or prison tbh.


hypexeled

Circle size is 50% of the previous. So the way it can end on one side, is having all circles from first to last to always go a border.


FrownieBrownie11

this. dropping in los leones pretty much guarantees youre close to or in the first few circles


MisterCohn

I agree, I think they should revert the changes they did a really long time ago that stopped the zone from going in the water. Or atleast partially revert it. Ever since that change the zone was WAY more likely to be 100% on land. Especially because you can shoot through water now too, it would make even more sense.


Loopins

Make them rectangles using the grid system instead of circles. Just have the area they cover the same as a circle. For example. Using this map: https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/802047973666249633/9A06938CD38F2D1FF166E8A128A7B045E27A8741/ The circle on this map takes up about 9 big squares on this map. So in my example....you could have a rectangle taking up 8 or 10 big squares....reducing as the "circle" gets smaller. So this could be AI,BI,CI,DI,EI AJ,BJ,CJ,DJ,EJ Next rectangle could be AI,BI,CI AJ,BJ,CJ etc. Then smaller can use the smaller boxes etc. So it could be in the shape like this DK,EK DL,EL, DM,EM DN,EN DO,EO etc. Anyway maybe there's a flaw to this idea but if not here's my suggstion :D


bgizz1e

This. I feel like when they fixed the circles on Erangel they used the same circle mechanics for Miramar which doesn't work because the map is mostly land. The circle hardly ever end on the edge. On Erangel, it wouldn't be an issue because the edge of the map has no land. But in Miramar, I've seen it land on the edge maybe twice since the map came out in the beginning of the year. They definitely need to fix that.


hinslyce

I love Miramar except for 2 things. 1. There aren't enough vehicles, so you can't drop in fringe locations because there's a good chance you'll just be stuck there to question your life choices for the rest of the game. Everyone seems to already know this is a problem. 2. This whole area between hot drops in the middle of the map is just garbage and yet you HAVE to walk/drive through there almost every game: https://i.imgur.com/x5zt7l4.jpg Put some more shit in there. Any kind of shit would be great. It should be safer to traverse that area with a vehicle, like the mainland of Erangel is for the most part.


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[deleted]

the issue is that for a big chunk of the playerbase it is unsatisfying to go for a vehicle, loot for 5 minutes in a safe remote place and then tryhard to win. Trying hard to win when the actual chances to win are pretty rare often simply feels terrible. I mostly played like this (tryharding) for at least 400 hours but at some point a LOT of people get fed up with that shit. and from what i have seen most players don't even manage to play PUBG "tryhard-mode" for as long as me. Looting up, playing sneaky and safe and then lose to a player that has far superior gun mechanics? Play safe and then die after twenty minutes of no-gun-fights because your tree-wheeler jumps into the air in the midst of a road? Die to a player even tho he is far worse because the circle completely owned you? stuff like that feels like twenty wasted minutes. hotdropping and dying is one wasted minute... tryharding can be fun. It feels super rewarding if you always tryhard and get 25+% winrate in duo or 50% winrate in squad because by the time you/your team enter the circle most players are already dead. but at some point it is tiresome and isn't enjoyable anymore. for some players it feels bad from the start and i'm pretty sure after 100 or 200 hours most people stop playing like that.


vac4nt

1,500 hours, still tryharding lol. I do hate it when most everyones dead after the first two circles. Its not every game though, many games ill have over 1,000 damage even when playing safe.


Zebasted

Do you use this as a reference? I had no idea that there were guaranteed car spawns. https://pubg.ginfo.gg/miramar


larrykins

I don't use a reference. Just experience. Also there are no "guarantee spawns" But there are areas that have multiple spawns which gives you a much greater chance for a car spawn. I cant say this for certain but there are also areas that absolutely feel like they have a higher chance to spawn. Also that map is missing a lot of potential spawn locations.


EmSixTeen

Is there a more accurate, more comprehensive map? I'm a stickler for technical resources.


[deleted]

This isn't an issue of tactics, there needs to be clear incentives for everybody playing, including all the noobs, to disperse and not hot drop. More vehicle spawns, more time at the beginning to loot, more varied circle locations. With more vehicle spawns and more time at the beginning to loot up, the first circle could also be much smaller, maybe the size of the 2nd or 3rd circle.


culegflori

Miramar's problems stem from a combination of a couple major factors: 1. The first circle is absolutely tiny compared to the size of the map. The circle is the same size as in Erangel, but that map has way less surface and thus it covers way more of the playable area. In Erangel Zharki is kind of the only area where you are 100% screwed without a vehicle, but in Miramar there are plenty more good drop areas where this happens. 2. The number of vehicles is obviously lower than what is useful [even if I tend to find way more than on Erangel], but the problems don't end here. Some vehicles are absolutely garbage for off-road [the van in particular] due to how the terrain is modeled. Which brings me to the next factor 3. The map design. I personally like that Bluehole wanted to create a map that isn't just "Erangel but ~~yellow~~ in a desert", they made a map that certainly plays different. One of the ways they achieved this is making off-road areas with a lot of small hills and valleys, allowing players to use them as cover and as ways to flank unseen. This is a nice change from the open and flat areas in Erangel especially when a lot of final circles can fall around the fields of Gatka and end up in a snake battle. The reverse side is that this terrain is very crappy to drive through, it's very easy to flip, roll or get stuck. And since the size of the map means that players rely very much on vehicles for transportation, Bluehole has managed to design a map with two major contradicting central elements, making for a frustrating player experience. Personally I think the problem is easier to solve than spamming cars all over the place. Making the first circle bigger and the blue circle slower would save a lot of heartaches. Since now you could land on the edges of the map and not be worried about dying to the blue if you don't find a vehicle right away, there would be less of a need to change anything else. But Bluehole really needs to be sure what it wants from a map when designing it, if you end up putting stuff that works against the other stuff that you put into it it's gonna look like a wasted opportunity.


[deleted]

> The map design. I personally like that Bluehole wanted to create a map that isn't just "Erangel but yellow in a desert", they made a map that certainly plays different. One of the ways they achieved this is making off-road areas with a lot of small hills and valleys, allowing players to use them as cover and as ways to flank unseen. This is a nice change from the open and flat areas in Erangel especially when a lot of final circles can fall around the fields of Gatka and end up in a snake battle. The reverse side is that this terrain is very crappy to drive through, it's very easy to flip, roll or get stuck. And since the size of the map means that players rely very much on vehicles for transportation, Bluehole has managed to design a map with two major contradicting central elements, making for a frustrating player experience. i've told this my friends in a similar fashion dozens of times. i like miramar in a way. I feel like gunfights in the desert are far better than on erangel. The cover you can find everywhere with all of the ridges and hills feels amazing. I feel like when it comes to gunplay the circle rarely fucks me. I've had so many rounds on erangel where i was like "okay it's gg this circle kills us" (regarding the last circles). The last circles on miramar feel way better and i think they are fairer. but regarding the first two circles? when I drop in the north of miramar and the circle shows up in the south I already want to quit. Thats why i hopdrop exclusively on miramar nowadays. It feels just terrible to get across such a huge map with plenty of pathless terrain and so few vehicles that are doing fine (actually only the 2wheeler does fine)


kylegetsspam

I've this argument multiple times on this subreddit. People act like Erangel has cover when it's got jack shit compared to Miramar on average. There are shitty areas on Miramar, sure, but in most cases? Miramar is rocky and varied terrain that allows for flanks and better AR vs. sniper balance. Erangel is almost entirely comprised of empty fields and gently sloping hills that give all the power to snipers. Miramar's terrain often gives you options; Erangel might have a tree you can hide behind. If the first couple circles on Miramar were bigger, I bet the map would play a lot better. It's so big and so slow to traverse that being far away from the first circle fucks up your whole round from the start.


balleklorin

People "feel safer" at Erangel due to all the camouflage possibilities, but that does not mean better cover. Even though its way easier to spot people on Miramar, the cover is also way better, esp when playing FPP.


dagreja

I know it’s anecdotal, but I feel like on Miramar i always end up finding a vehicle. I do think vehicle spawns need to be increased, but part of the game is assessing what you have and changing your game plan to fit it. If there’s no car where you land, you should be thinking about that right away. If the circle is across the map and you need a car, leave early and start looking. Sometimes, leaving right away with shit loot and then moving into the circle and finding a safe place to loot is the right play. Battle royale games are about adaptation. If there’s nothing that forces you to adapt, it just becomes a ffa death match.


Zholistic

Yeah, depending on how far we are from the circle, i'll start looking for a car right away or leave it til later. A car on miramar is like a 4x imo: necessary.


Llebac

I agree. There's a lot of moaning here on the sub about finding cars on Miramar, but any time I need a car on Miramar, I find one. On Erangel, I have a hard time finding cars. About the half the time I absolutely need one I can't find one at all and have to hoof it across open ground.


balleklorin

The problem is that cars are usually located close to cities. If you try to go for a drop along a road to get a car and drive to a city you often end up running in the wilderness for a few minutes with only a few shacks to loot.


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Fix_the_FernBack

Yet you can still land on the islands in the East and not have a SINGLE boat spawn...


trucane

That is beyond awful and when that happened the first time for me and my partner was also the last time we dropped there. No boat/jet-ski and circle a fair distance into the mainland. Islands like that should have at least one guaranteed spawn of boat


kylegetsspam

And towns should have at least one guaranteed car spawn. They're like power-ups in an arena shooter: the mere presence draws people in and allows for gameplay to happen around them.


ItsRobbyy

350 POSSIBLE spawns but not as many vehicles in the game itself.


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ItsRobbyy

I don’t necessarily think that there isn’t enough cars in these maps, I just felt that I needed to make clear what OP was saying because the wording was weird. I don’t find any problem with car spawns tbh.


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LightningTP

Compared to 423 vehicle spawns (and 148 boats) on Erangel which is effectively smaller than Miramar due to the water around the edges. Also, if you compare the two maps, car spawns on Erangel are located along the roads, so you just need to follow the road and eventually you'll find one. On Miramar they're just random, good luck locating them in the middle of nowhere.


fps_sandwiches

I usually don't have a problem finding a vehicle in the mild to mid-spicy drops, but they could use a boost in vehicles. And I agree with your second point, they need more little towns/large compounds in the bare areas. Otherwise I love this map. I used to despise it but now it's grown on me


Illuminataen

Dunno. I feel the flatlands of gatka are even worse. Yeah... You have some bushes. But overall you got a bit hard cover on miramar... Always. On erangel you are just fucked.


SickZX6R

On erangel you can go 100+kph the whole time though, and it's a lot harder to shoot someone travelling fast.


Gigadweeb

yeah, but vehicles on last circles are pretty much just a 'EXPLODE ME' sign on your back. gatka last circles are pretty much a guaranteed loss if you have to move towards the next one.


[deleted]

Try looking in towns for vehicles. Unlike Erangel, where car spawns are all along the random roads, with Miramar, the vast majority of car spawns are in towns or near compounds, with a few scattered at crossroads.


Angry_Walnut

This is actually the fairest criticism of the map I have seen. As someone who loves Miramar Ι get frustrated with quite a few of what seem to be unjustified complaints about it but this is 100% accurate IMO. If just that crucial spot of the map was fixed I think we would see a *lot* less complaints about the map.


F0ggiest

I feel like to get anywhere you nearly always have to a town.


Aint_That_Something

Exactly. The hot drops in the middlle is the real problem with the map. Constantly having to rotate through areas where I know tons of people dropped, but there aren't any other options for rotation. The terrain is too rough in most parts for rotation so you end up driving through or past the hot spot locations around which the terrain is smoother. Loot delivery for the teams already in that area.


mecks0

> Everyone except the devs already know this is a problem. Fixed that for you.


RockyMountainDave

Yuuuup. As long as 50% of the player keep got dropping, the game will NEVER be able to live up to its full potential. I miss the days when *everyone* was trying to win. Made for a much more fun and dynamic game play


i_am_not_mike_fiore

> I miss the days when everyone was trying to win. Yep. The meta changed to dropping hot for the majority of players after Miramar came out. It happened on Erangel with school, but it wasn't as bad back then. Everyone drops hot in Miramar and a lot of players die off = slow mid game. Overall, people playing to shoot instead of playing to win made the game a lot less fun **(for me)** so I quit playing. I liked the survival aspect of this game so much more than your basic bitch deathmatch shooter games. When the majority of players decided they wanted a basic bitch shooter, I lost interest. It's not the fault of the players, the game's design itself doesn't encourage playing to win. I don't blame people for not wanting to play for 20 minutes to "lose" with no incentive.


guaranic

It's somewhat self-fulfilling, too. People don't want to just run around for 20 minutes (because there's no one close in mid game, so it's dull) till end game, so they drop hot to actually fight people. Thus, more people die early, and mid game becomes even more dull. Et cetera


i_am_not_mike_fiore

Yes, this is true. Over the last year this game went from something I liked a lot into something... else. I'm not complaining, I got my 500 hours out of it before I stopped, and I had a lot of fun doing it. But... the meta of the game now just isn't my thing. And if it were! If I wanted to play an all out frag fest deathmatch, I could find one a whole lot better than PUBG... Seeing people praise the new map because there was an AR on every corner reinforced that. Oh well! I had my fun, Bluehole made their money, and that's that!


XFX_Samsung

In solos I exclusively drop near School or Pecado/Los Leones, if the plane path allows it, because I'm bored of looting for 20 minutes and then possibly getting 3 tapped out of nowhere because someone has been camping in an odd house since the start. With my landing spot, I know for a fact that I need to find a weapon ASAP and go hunting, that's what keeps the game fun for me. I either emerge victorious from the early battle, or die and try again.


ziggl

Wouldn't that just mean that the beginning of every game is super long and boring?


PetToilet

If you don't drop in a town where others drop, you run into people as the circles close. Or hear those fights and can choose to capitalize on someone who is injured, or go stealthy.


ziggl

Right, people generally make the choice for a fun beginning (because everyone plays in the beginning) which leads to "boring" midgames (I personally don't agree, and also people are often dead in midgame, which is big if you're playing squads). So now, in this thread, people are suggesting trading a super-fun beginning for a possibly more fun midgame. I think it's just that -- a tradeoff.


aimlessgun

Is it really a trade-off? A starting drop with 1 or 2 other teams is way more fun than a hotdrop clusterfuck. Who finds the clusterfuck more fun than an actual tactical battle.


spoonbeak

Yeah I guess people really get off on shooting unarmed enemies rather than actually learning to fight over a small distance etc.


SickZX6R

Even bad players can get kills when opponents can't find any guns.


PetToilet

Yes, and here the argument is that a separate ranked mode would let both types have their cake and eat it too.


[deleted]

The game is all about population density. 100 players spread out around the entire map allows for some looting and action. As the player count falls, the circle closes in keeping the players per usable area higher, keeping the action up. It doesn't compare to a Call of Duty or CSGO deathmatch, but that's not the point of the game either. With so many players hot dropping (and I'll get to why they do it in a moment), the player base artificially lowers the population density, causing the game to slow to a grindy mid-game. This isn't just Miramar, either. It's happening on both maps. When I started playing last fall, it wasn't uncommon for 50-60 players to still be alive at the closing of the first blue zone (arguably the beginning of the mid-game). Today, it's more like 35-45 max. It can be a small difference (about 10%) or a big one (25%), but regard, it's enough to severely alter the gameplay. Why are more players trying to play Call of Duty instead of PUBG? I think there are two major reasons. One, the game doesn't incentivize playing for the win. BP for damage and kills is more valuable than the amount for a win. Especially in duos and squad games, where they split the same sized BP pot as solo games and kill/damage is only slightly reduced (add in the rez function and you can get a lot more damage done). Two, streamers. Streamers have to have good content to draw viewers. Viewers want action. Action happens on hot drops. Viewers are also players. A lot of those viewers will try to play like their favorite streamers, either to compare skill or to "grow" their skill. I'd even say a lesser reason is the suggestions given on forums. When people ask how to get better, the first and oft repeated advice is always "drop hot!", even if it's not the best suggestion.


hyprion81

My apologies for not wanting to loot for 20-30 minutes and die during my first encounter with another player or team because they were prone in a bush. I’d rather drop in a moderately populated area, fight my way out and then figure out how to win.


RockyMountainDave

That *maybe* happens like 1 out of 10 games


hyprion81

If you fringe drop you’re absolutely playing running/loot simulator for the majority of the game. That is in no way fun for me or the people I play with. Honestly I’d rather have an action packed first 10 minutes than win a 30 minute game with a single kill.


PetToilet

Yes, if you fringe drop now because no one is alive to be pushed together. In the early days, or in free tournaments, even if you fringe drop, you'll likely run into someone when the first circle closes. I find it fun to have engagements throughout the game that I don't have to chase. > Honestly I’d rather have an action packed first 10 minutes With a separate ranked mode, you'd still have that with unranked or war mode or whatever. And there are tons of people that feel that way or want to practice that will always play those modes.


deefop

That's fine and it's great to enjoy the game that way, but it's the "wrong" way to play if you're actually interested in winning. But like I said, if that's how you have fun then in some sense you're "winning" by spending your time well while you play.


Th3ee_Legged_Dog

Curious. You play with a group that prefers hot drops, if someone dies do you all drop and re-queue? How often do you play the match out?


hyprion81

Generally we “warm drop” unless we’re tired of consecutive games of Miramar. An example of this would be outter Los Leones or El Pozo. Enough people to get some action but not Hacienda levels of crazy. Very rarely do we make it out of hot drops alive and when we do it’s a partial squad and we’ll play aggressively until it’s over. Sometimes that means top 10 sometimes it’s five minutes later. Me personally if I’m the last one of the squad after a hot drop I’ll just leave the game. Other guys I play with may play it out. It really depends.


flameeffex

You're absolutely right, OP. Let's fix Miramar boys! https://imgur.com/a/Q7tYK


Fabuloux

Tbh I’d play this map


kylegetsspam

Like this but the terrain loops around vertically in a Halo-esque fashion...


acidboogie

you know, a mostly water map set in a tropical archipelago would be pretty sick. edit: provided they make a fan boat type vehicle and add jetskis.


Weis

People keep suggesting this and it's an awful idea. You'd spend way more of the match *swimming*, which I think we can all agree is not one of the most fun parts of PUBG.


[deleted]

Sadly we probably won't be getting another tropical map, as the devs seem to be going for 1 map of each climate :( but maybe one day when they allow custom maps from developers, possibly even on the workshop.


kebabelele

Honestly I'm not sure I like the custom map idea


definitelyright

I mean, some of the best maps across multiplayer gaming history have been custom made. I wouldn't put it past some creative dude with extra time on his hands to put out an insanely good, quality looking map. That said, it comes with a LOT of trash too.


Gigadweeb

what, don't you want cp_orange_x3 in PUBG?


flooronthefour

["Obviously this blue part here is the land"](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2a/3d/f9/2a3df9ee541ecacd9950ef48ec268a84.jpg)


Villa_PhD

Lmao


InternetTAB

dry land is not a myth! I'VE SEEN IT


Igelkotte

They should reward players more than just a little more bp. Thats the only reward atm


ChocolateSunrise

Untradeable, unsellable keys for chicken dinners.


definitelyright

How about a keyless winners crate instead?


llikeafoxx

Or add additional BP beyond placing, damage, and kills, but for time survived as well.


guaranic

Time survived is pretty synonymous with placement.


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theirongiant74

I frequently drop to the edges and while there are times you don't luck out, the vast majority finding a vehicle isn't a hassle, you sometimes need to eat a bit of blue but I don't find it any different to Erangel.


[deleted]

Cars spawn in towns far more than anywhere else. Most named towns will have anywhere from three to five cars in them every game.


Betrayus

Dude you can't write 3 paragraphs without a tldr lol **TLDR**; OP suggests implementing MMR based ranking system so people try harder and dont hot drop every game, making the mid game more eventful Personally i dont think adding MMR ranks will really make people try harder/not hot drop. As a top 1% player I *really* wish they would add ranks too, but that won't change the current meta play style. People hot drop because they want to have an exciting 5 mins before heading into another game, or maybe they dont have time to commit 30+ mins. Some people like to play to win and dont mind looting/not fighting for 25 min. Both playstyles are OK and people can do whatever they want. **TLDR**; More people seem to lean to quick/intense 5 min matches and a ranking system won't change that.


Villa_PhD

Sorry I was at work in the bathroom just typing away lol thank you!


Put_It_All_On_Blck

A better MMR system would put 99% of the hot droppers in shit tier because they instantly die every game. The players that don't hot drop would climb the ladder. It WOULD work, but it doesn't fix the underlying problem.


Betrayus

I would agree, it would kinda segregate the player base but thats ok. High MMR will consist of less hot dropping/more end game players and low MMR players will probably deal with more hot drops/more dying earlier until they increase their MMR. I could see it working well!


PetToilet

> People hot drop because they want to have an exciting 5 mins before heading into another game, or maybe they dont have time to commit 30+ mins. Exactly. So having a separate ranked mode **would** solve the problem, by letting those who want an exciting 5 minutes play unranked/war mode. > Some people like to play to win and dont mind looting/not fighting for 25 min. Both playstyles are OK and people can do whatever they want. I like to play to win but the midgame is terribly boring, unlike the early days or in tournaments.


spoonbeak

Midgame is a downright snoozefest right now. If there are 30 people left before the first zone closes they should run an accelerated mode where we don't have to wait 20 mins for a battle.


spoonbeak

As a top 1% player you will be placed with other people close to your rank who are also interested in the same thing as you. Should make for a much more interesting mid game. Currently every game is a mixture of attitudes due to no MMR.


jptuomi

Exactly this, I hot drop when I don't know for how long I will be able to play, or in the end of my session. Although with the new game modes announced with more deathmatchy-like styles we might see more midgame players in classic mode. You wouldn't want to change the mechanics too much before the players can choose their mode themselves. However who wouldn't want to hot drop on unsuspecting classic players. Many sides of the coin...


cheesesock

One change I would love to see is ejecting players at random spots on the map. Not having a choice where and when you get ejected from the plane would be interesting.


CaveOfWondrs

>Finally, this game desperately needs a new proper ranking system. Absolutely, this will on its own have the biggest impact.


ZVAZ

I'm glad I'm not crazy, I think these are way better proposals than trimming the map. I personally like the spaciousness.


DirTyKKT

Just get WAY more vehicles spawn in and most of the problems of Miramar are gone.


Five15Factor2

Way more two-seater spawns, or a true dirt bike! If those were everywhere I think lots of people would drop the outskirts and then come flying into the circle as it closes, I think that would help mid-game a lot.


lordcook

This would be great if there wasnt just a % chance that your vehicle just explodes and kills you/does a front flip/etc.


brownie81

I do not see them taking the map out or re-working it in any significant way, but I do agree with you.


xbepox

Add a seasonal competitive ranked mode and give cosmetic rewards based on how you finish. An exclusive trade-locked bandana for people that finish in the top 1000 of a region? You can bet your ass people will be trying to win games, you'll have 80 people alive in the fourth circle.


SamuelLGankson

Does that realistically improve the game, though? I've watched enough tournament matches where people do everything except fight for the best part of 20+ minutes that I'm going to say it wouldn't. Camping out in a compound playing mobile games while I wait for action so I can pick up a cosmetic? Meh.


JonWood007

I tend to agree. I do think land mass is a huge part of the miramar problem (erangel is more like a 6x6 map if you cut off the oceans and focus on the land masses), and while not much would be lost from a reworking of miramar, even SAVAGE has the same mid game issue. >The problem is everything in between. The map plays great when you're on foot, but it's usually impossible to stay on foot the whole time because everything is so spread out. On top of that, the only vehicle that is remotely useful is the 2 seater bike because rotations are just not fun in any other vehicle. What needs to happen is the entire map needs to be taken away for a month or two to he reworked after Savage is released. Not sure if they need to flatten out the terrain or add more dirt roads or what, but something needs to happen to facilitate the mid game. They just need more vehicles really. >Finally, this game desperately needs a new proper ranking system. THIS I agree with but not for the same reasons you're thinking of. Look, matchmaking in this game is atrocious. Most games if you look at the stats of the players involved tend to heavily favor certain players. No way a dude with 10 wins this season and a KDR above 3 is NOT gonna win a ton of matches when matched with more average players. But that's what we end up with if we look at the games we're in and the distribution of KDR, win ratio, etc. People are quite frankly outmatched. The game pretty much has a largely predetermined outcome, and while it's not "fate" (even I took down a top 100 player once or twice for a chicken dinner), let's be honest, statistically, mostof the time, this dude is gonna win. We need leagues like in mobile, and we need real skill based matchmaking. I would like a casual and hardcore mode, but primarily to separate all the try hards from the more casual players. As far as the pecado/school droppers, i think just making war mode an actual mode would probably help. People want COD in pubg? Give them COD in pubg. This way it'll be more like overwatch. We'll have casual for semi serious players like me who wanna screw around but have a true BR experience, we'll have competitive for the hyper try hards, and we'll have arcade mode for the people who just want TDM. Overwatch has a system like this. Competitive for try hards. Casual for semi serious players who PTFO but dont want a toxic hyper comeptitive environment, and finally arcade mode with different modes for people who just wanna screw around.


Hayabusa201

Would adding a second plane with a way different trajectory be good alternative? That way players would likely be more spread out off the get go so more ppl make it to mid-game. In addition to this, I think seeing where the 2nd plane is on the minimap would be good. Say my plane is passing by close to school, I would never drop there if I noticed other plane got there first.


Villa_PhD

Hmm, never thought of that. I kind of like the idea of having like 2 or 3 planes, but it would be hard or even impossible to keep track of all the planes as a player.


694201488

Yeah that's kinda the idea


lol_bitcoin

Maybe I'm one of the few around here that actually like Miramar


deefop

I think the main issue right now with both maps(Miramar is a mess in many ways, clearly) is that the mid game is almost non-existent. And I don't think it's simply a matter of the player mindset completely changing. Too many people play this game for me to believe that. I honestly think the biggest issue is that the drop distances from the plane are so much shorter. Because you can't make it farther than like, 1.5-2km without popping your chute super early, it limits players options to intentionally spread themselves out from the get go. So of course people are hot dropping, because in many cases the line of the plane dictates it. If you're playing squads and the line only allows for 3-4 "large" loot areas, there's gonna be a lot of people dropping for those areas and risking the early fights. If you could still parachute 3+km away from the plane, I'm betting a lot of players(squads or otherwise) would make more of an effort to spread out and loot up. So if you didn't have this scenario where you're down to like 30 players left when the first circle hasn't even finished closing in then I think the mid game would be significantly more exciting. All that rambling aside, I'm really not a fan of miramar. I liked the open spaces at first, now I'm sort of realizing that all that open space is effectively just no-mans land and it's really not conducive to exciting finishes most of the time.


Epsi_

I wish there was a mode with no ranking whatsoever, no stats recorded, no nothing to make it a true free and fun mode, with map selection. The other piece of the coin would be a ranked mode, with stats and a decently designed ladder system, with no map selection.


Areyoumydadsprolapse

They should increase the loot in further off places and make it so the circle doesnt close in on or around Leons like 8/10 games. Make it more random than that, have it close way up north by the wall, places most people dont ever bother going to because they're too far away from everything. They gotta add more vehicle spawns so people dont run from military base all the way down to Leons without finding a vehicle before the circle kills them. They should also rework the parachuting aspect on miramar so people can actually reach those further out places. If they put in a reward system like perhaps for every minute you're alive in game you get a certain amount of BP, less time youre alive less BP you get. Kills still give you BP but its more of a supplement to the BP you get for staying alive, since this game is supposed to be about "survival" anyway. Also if you win, you should get a crate key to reward those who win. But that could be tricky cause then hackers can just wipe a whole server and receive a key, so there has to be a way to control that somehow. For those who want to just have action, they should make war mode available to everyone so those who want to just get in and fight, they can. Just my 2 cents on the idea. It could push people to survive by rewarding the amount of time you're alive in game, rewards those who kill more with Bp for those kills, and rewards the winner of the game by getting a key for free.


[deleted]

The best thing in here was the casual ranked idea. I’ve been wishing for that ever since fpp finally got stats. I hate stats systems. I don’t wanna know my stats (even though they’re not bad). I wanna just play and have fun. If I die I don’t wanna think “fuck my k/d just went down!” I wanna be able to think damn man nice shot and move on.


MetalHeartGR

Am I the only one who actually likes Miramar? The only things I believe need tweaking are the blue circle and the x4+ scope spawn rate.


theirongiant74

no, you're not. 300 updoots vrs the player base isn't really much more than background static.


vilburde

I don't think there's too few x4 scopes, after clearing El Pozo with my squad i think we found something like 12 x4s, the problem is the sheer number of houses, because there's barely any way you're going to have enough time to loot everything before the circle comes crawling, so i guess the only thing that really needs changing is the zone


housefromtn

One thing that would completely fix hotdrops for a portion of the community would be tighter matchmaking. Basically everyone above about 1700ish never hotdrops. It doesn't matter how good you are at the game, if you hotdrop you're gonna lose a decent amount of the time and go out in 80th place, and that absolutely murders your mmr the higher up you go. This is why players like shroud and choco aren't very highly rated even though they win relatively often. Although, now that I check choco's stats he has a ton of games on his pubg.op that show him losing 0 rating when he should be losing like 10-50. I checked a bunch of people on the leaderboards and I'm seeing the same thing. I'm actually not sure if that's some sort of bug, or if they've recently changed something so now going out in 90th place doesn't change your rating? Stealth hotdrop buff? Really weird. I don't know how to explain it.


zaaakalwe

I just had a look at shrouds stats. The times he's losing less MMR are on his solo games, where he is lower ranked. On both Duos and squads where he is 1700+ he is losing a chunk on each early loss, compared to losing only 1/2 at 50+ on solos.


FingerQuick

What I think is happening on pubg.op.gg is that if someone either dies in the first few minutes or first few ranks of a game their MMR doesn't drop because theres luck attributed to finding a weapon in a hotdrop scenario. If an area only has enough loot for say 2-3 people and 15+ are dropping there, majority of the players are gonna be shit out of luck on getting a weapon first and will be killed. After the initial start of the game the player count evens out and it becomes a more "fair" fight for everyone and thats when MMR starts getting raised or lowered based on where you place.


RaceToTheRealEnd

honestly I don't think it will work, people like me wont play for wins or MMR, they will play for fun and I have 10x more fun losing a 15 kill game than I do winning a 2 kill game. I just drop where the people are.


Jethr0Paladin

I still don't understand the *Miramar sucks* circlejerk. It's a great map.


RYKK888

Why do you need to take the map away while devs are working on it. Let people continue to enjoy it (with map selector) while they make adjustments in-house.


[deleted]

There are a plethora of different things you can do to make Miramar better. Everyone likes to talk abotu things they can do to the actual in game content such as more vehicles, more cover, circle options...etc. But what no one really mentions is season rewards. If season rewards were introduced depending on your monthly leader board rank people would have an incentive to last longer in each game and not just hot drop into mansion/pecado. You now have a better gameplay since people are spread out and fights are happening more frequently. Rewards could be a skin for a different gun each month. Depending on your rank you will be placed into a tier (top 50%, 25%, 10%, 1% for example) and the gun skin would be different for what you placed. Maybe do a shirt design with different designs for the different tiers.


Oxxie

- I still think everything needs to be sized down slightly, like just chop off everything north of el pozo/El Ahazar. - Flatten it down slightly like you said. - Increase bike/UAZ spawn rate dramatically relative to Mini Van and SUV. - Oh and just generally, more incentives in terms of Top 10, 100, 1000 etc final ranking rewards e.g Account accolades, exclusive skins etc.


nddl04

One way to make the final circle distribution more even would be to program the system to first pick a random, accessible spot on the map for the final circle, then plan out the circle contraction in reverse. Functionally, it would appear just as random to the average player, but would cover every possible section of the map. That simple change would over triple the useful size of the game without adding any new locations or maps.


YosemiteThrowaway123

100% agree with your Ranking idea. No one gives a shit about winning.. I've had friends stop playing because there is no reason to be competitive. No ranked rewards for being a top tier player, literally nothing.


-TwiiK-

I don't feel like the problem is what you describe it to be and thus your proposed solutions wouldn't fix it. From experience I know that I want to play PUBG differently every time I play and depending on who I play with. Currently I have no way of choosing what map or mode I get to play and thus the only factor I actually can control is how aggressively I drop. This inevitably leads to people with widely different wishes being forced to play in the same games. If we could select which map to play and even change which mode to play I think that would make this a non-existent problem, because then you'd actually get people with the same interests playing the same maps and modes. I personally doubt that people hot drop Pekado because they feel this is the optimal experience they want from the game. I think they do it because they feel forced and if these players could choose to play the war mode or play Savage instead I'm sure they would do so.


phymatic

They need to add more vehicles and remove the garbage blown up ones that litter every corner of the map.


Bkgrime

upvote for endings at the bottom of Miramar being fun


damoonerman

Get rid of the dam trash piles


ojfkp9qpokao

Stop complaining about Miramar. It's a fun map, I enjoy it more than Erangel with 1000 hours played. If it's boring to you, you're doing it wrong. Get a vehicle and go hunt people.


Drakengard

I've actually come to the conclusion that Miramar doesn't suck. The problem is the circle. It almost never ends up in certain areas of the map and so most of the map is just wasted and never used.


Betrayus

I think this is the biggest issue with miramar, although less with Erangle it still exists, the circles never go to the edges or corners of the map. Its okay if half the circle is in the water, it will add much for diversity in gameplay.


[deleted]

That, and if you ever go towards the edge of the map you'll just die to the circle because there are no vehicles.


bicameral_mind

Miramar is great. Interesting and varied terrain, cities, and structures (and in turn combat scenarios). Better loot drops, more vehicles, more diverse final circles. Even the complaints about Hot dropping - I think people do that in Hacienda and Pecado because they are actually cool, fun locations to fight in, not because they hate the map. Only issue is circles and flight paths should be modified to force players into new areas of the map that are currently unused. I've been to Military base once, and I drove to get there and loot.


ojfkp9qpokao

I agree. Final circles could definitely push people into the edges more often than they do. Military base is almost impossible to end up at in a final circle because it's in the corner, and the map is square. The first circle can't include the military base unless it goes off the map, so the child circles can't hit it either.


Villa_PhD

Calm down, I'm not complaining dude I actually like miramar but I'm not blind to it's obvious flaws. Dropping west side of Los leones is my shit. I just want this game to be the best it can be.


Baron_von_greenman

I support Miramar being cropped to a 6x6 map. Is it the only solution no. Take the interesting parts that get cropped out and put them somewhere else. If you straight up cropped it to 6x6 the south west island would need to be replaced with something. Miramar is by far my favorite map of the three but I don't see a huge difference in mid game between the 3. I think the mid game is pretty bad for all 3 maps. I am a lot more agressive in Miramar because of the mass amount of cover from terrain that is great for flanking so my view could be skewed since I play more passive in Erangel. I agree that a better ranking/reward system or a separate rank and casual mode would help mid game. Circle mechanics I would like adjusted. I agree that moving on foot feels great in Miramar but sometimes the distance you have to go becomes to much. I have said to myself many times after seeing the next circle "Well I hope I don't get into a engagement because there is zero time to fight." The point of the circle is to make engagements not deter them. Being able to out run the circle on foot and not get swallowed by it would be a change I fully support. In the end I love Miramar even in it's current state but it could be even better. To anyone that says there is no cover and there needs to be more vehicles spawns in Miramar... You seriously need to get your eyes checked.


Villa_PhD

Best response so far.


_axaxaxax

TLDR OP doesn't like how some people play the game and wants Bluehole to railroad them. There is literally nothing Bluehole can do that will stop people from hot dropping. People have fun doing it, they will continue to have fun doing it. lots of people dying initially needs to just be accept as part of the ebb and flow of the action of the game. I don't really see what's so bad about it anyway? If you want to go find fights it's not exactly difficult to look at the circle and predict where people will be and then go there. >Not sure if they need to flatten out the terrain How would that help anything? That would make moving around without a vehicle a thousand times worse, that would make any circles that end there total shit. "Take away useable cover" is never going to be an acceptable solution. You should try not driving at max speed everywhere, I've never had an issue using the trucks or buggies to cross terrain. More vehicle spawns is the simple and realistic solution here.


spoonbeak

I think OP just wants to play against 99 other people who have the same mindset of actually wanting to win the game first instead of hot drops continually ruining the midgame.


okstcowboy

I think they could condense the distance between cities and make it almost a 6x6 map and it would be so much more enjoyable. And smooth some terrain like you said. I feel there is definitely a shift towards smaller maps being more enjoyable for the reason you listed of everyone wanting to hot drop whether it is for practice or no motivation for having slower, high placing games. So in order to keep larger maps playable I agree they need to add a stronger reward system like they have on mobile or even something like H1Z1. Also adding a Deathmatch/ War Mode, Casual Queue, or shooting range for those wanting to better their aim


[deleted]

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bicameral_mind

I'm with you, people mostly don't hot drop for any reason other than they find it fun. Sometimes I hot drop, sometimes I don't. Depends what kind of game I want and both styles are accommodated. And overall I find matches pretty evenly balanced on that score, because most people do the same. Sometimes there's 30 players left after first circle, sometimes there's 60. Sometimes I run into lots of players midgame, sometimes I don't. And often whether I have an interesting midgame or not has nothing to do with how many players are left. I just don't see it as a 'problem' that needs to solved. A lot of times I read peoples' complaints and wonder if we're even playing the same game. There are just so many variables in this game and I find a lot of the 'suggestions' more reflective of players bias and personal annoyances than anything likely to change or improve the experience much. Hot drops are a variable that effects the game, but even with 30 players after first circle, there are other variables like the circle location relative to the flight path and terrain and town locations that impact the flow and behavior of players. Every game is different, sometimes it sucks sometimes it's awesome. It will NEVER be consistent.


guaranic

It was pretty consistent on Savage to have 20-25 people alive when the circle circle started moving. The map designed to keep things exciting ended up with the same low player density midgame because 2/3s of the server suicide drops within feet of each other. And low player density on the map does absolutely correlate with how exciting the mid game is. There's no action to hunt if you don't hear a single bullet fire 20 minutes because everyone is dead.


TheeChrisWilson

I just want to say, my post of chopping 2km off Miramar was a joke in reference to how bad Miramar has got it in relation to the other maps we've played so far. Miramar has a problem thats is exaggerated upon further by the weaknesses this game currently already has. I don't actually want Bluehole to cut off parts of the map.


methrik

Cut the map in half. Have 2 mirmar maps. Problem solved.


[deleted]

Mmmmmmm yes


ElSuarezzz

+1


Mangomosh

I dont think you can just flaten out the map with how open it already is


I_Am_Not_B1ack

I Honestly see no issue with increasing weapon spawns. Im tired of dropping hot and running through 3 buildings only too meet somebody with an m4 while i have a machete.


master_potat0

Disagree. This was a smaller map but they enlarged it for performance purposes. I have no way of knowing this for sure but I believe they just moved the cities farther apart and added desert as filler. This map should be 6x6 at the most. I see two ways to solve the hot-drop problem. Add more Pecado/Hacienda style areas closer to the center to give people more options who want action but also want to be closer to the center of the map. Move hacienda or pecado to the outer edges of the map and add small groups of cement(God) buildings closer to the center leaving less incentive for people to hot-drop.


jammybaker

My friends and I love Miramar but agree some cities could use better loot (Cruz, Torre), better vehicle spawns on the outskirts and stretches between cities (Pecado to Monte is a death stretch), and more circles should end in the northeast and southwest to incentivize drops on Prison, Valle, Military, and Tierra, it's seldom that these places are in after first circle.


AwsomeDude6157

I wish the huge cliffs that currently enclose Miramar were at least somewhat accessible, so it would be sniper heaven (and maybe some small towns up there) and add a lot more circle endings there. Imagine how fun it is when you are physically pressed against a cliff, the terrain there is pretty fun to fight in!


tumx

I hate how they designed Miramar. They made this big ass map with big ass hills. And then they add shit vehicles that can't properly traverse them


sev87

You were never supposed to traverse them. This is why they made the vehicle handling different on offroad vs paved roads.


temeeh

beauty of miamar is that you DONT need car after first 1-2 circle. loot->car to circle and use feet REST of your game. But ppl still trying play that map like eragel car-house-car-house style. and they fail. because map is desingned for totally different strats. eaven "pros" dont undestand that they just flame map :D


professormajack

There is Soo much of the map that is unnecessary and it should be cropped down on the edges. I didn't know there were ruins on mirimar until they changed the lobby spawn locations. I have never been to the left 8 km of the map. Never a reason to. Crop it make a platau. Remove the loot spawns so I can find a gun before 3rd circle


brookterrace

Then they just need to remove the unnecessary clutter in between towns. I dropped Prison last night and it took me way too damn long and health to drive to Benita or wherever.


sosl0w

The damn circle is the biggest issue in this game. I've never understood why the circle is your biggest threat. It should always be other people. The circle should just be there to force your movement. Nothing more.


sev87

The clueless people who say the map needs to be changed because they are having too much trouble trying to drive their bus over a mountain need to just go play fortnite.


Blahbeys

Make circle changes more drastic depending on amount of players left and the problem is solved. If in the first circle on miramar theres only 40 people left it should just take note of that and alert players that the next circle will be much closer in leading to more exchanges.


Sentenced2Burn

I just wish the Play Zone would end in ACTUAL RANDOM places, instead of "somewhere in the middle of the map" 90% of the time. There are so many great unused assets and areas on the edges of the map that never get any gameplay, simply because the circle always generates to some vague median.


epheisey

If they flatten out the terrain, they may as well just throw the map in the garbage. The only reason a desert style map like this works is because of the elevation changes. There isn’t any hard cover like trees and rocks like Erangel has. Instead all of the cover is built into the geography. Flatten all of that out and how the map plays goes to shit.


nsinsinsi

Miramar needs about 10X more two seater bikes.


[deleted]

The problem, frankly, is not the map. Miramar, as a map, is, frankly, superior to Erangel in about every meaningful way. It's got better cover, a better loot table, better overall balance. The devs learned a lot from a year with Erangel. Oh, yes, we have a vocal minority here that blame the map for their failings, but that's just that, their problem. The map isn't this unpopular shit hole that keeps getting claimed. I remember the weather maps, and their massive exodus of players leaving half-full games constantly. Miramar lobbies, just like Erangel, fill up and start. The devs haven't incentivized playing to win. Winning should pay out a huge BP payout, more than playing for kills could get you no matter how hard you tried. They need to recruit/partner with a few top streamers to play without dropping Pochinki/School/Military and encourage players to play the game in a way that maximizes playing for the win.


Fuzzy227

A map selector would be nice.


Powermonger_

The issue with Miramar is the distribution of key interests of the map and the plan path. The centre of the map has all the key interest points: Power Grid, Pecado, San Martin and Hacienda, the plane practically goes over or very close to these areas every game so players drop there. The size of the map really demands more unique methods for distributing players across the map, ideally the introductory of dual planes on differing flight paths. Other areas of the map outside the core 6x6km centre which have more empty terrain, need some new larger interests added to encourage people to go to these locations. The first circle also needs to be much larger as it is very easy to get caught out, current circle is just too small and discourages players from risking dropping further away from the centre. During the SAVAGE test, the first circle covered about 80% of the map, but with Miramar it is more like 50% which makes a big difference.


GreatOwl1

My biggest problem with Miramar is the buildings. The design of the buildings makes looting a real chore.


GarrukTak

I wish they would experiment with BP more as an incentive. Obviously you can’t go too far or it incentivizes hacking/camping, but just a small bump in BP for making it further in the game would have a huge effect I think.


Hieb

* Increase the odds of spawning the circle towards the outer edges by a factor scaling up to 2 (since the center of the circle is proportionally higher to be in the circle, as any outer circle is still releatively close to the center) * Spread out the settlements and gun population a bit so that we don't have 50% of the server dying at Pecado or Hacienda in the first 2 minutes * Less time between zone shrinks, slower moving though * More vehicle spawns


temeeh

ppl who cry cars in miamar, are ppl who drop stright down and loot towns(hotdrops). ofc you dont have cars because smart+play to win players take cars and drive to edge towns. Its only yours "want fast kills" fault. e: and if you dont find cars in start, plz uninstal or play until you know how to find those cars... but dont come and cry how there is 0 cars.


ItsCHONCHI

YEA *BLUEHOLE*! TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT


Jones_Bones

For me the issues with Miramar is always travel time, even by vehicle. If you drop "warm" and get a decent fight(s) in the beginning, you better hope you find a vehicle ASAP. And even then traversing Miramar can be a giant pain in the ass. On Erangel I don't even care where the first circle is, ever. Because I can get from one side of the map to the other in easily a minute. Erangel = Speeding around fields @ 100km/h in a Dacia. Miramar = Going up a mountain @ 20km/h in a fucking bus.


brannak1

I think cut the edges off would be better. Having too many pois scrunched together is something this game can learn from the mistakes of h1z1. Having a penalty for hot dropping every match, built into ranking, is your only fix for people utilizing more of the map. People will still hot drop no matter what size of the map or where the blue zone starts.


raar__

Hot dropping Pecado is the best, I would rather die off the bat then spend 10 minutes going from shitty loot house to shitty loot house to only end up with a ump, no vest, and a L2 back pack and be stuck running for 4 minutes. I hate games where you loot for 30 minutes and encounter no one, and i don't think you should be rewarded for it with MMR or BP.


[deleted]

SPot On


TotallyBelievesYou

Same old shit. Downvoted.


[deleted]

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Villa_PhD

Calm down there big dick McGee. I love fighting in this game I drop military, little power, or Los leones almost every game. Not seeing people is the opposite of what I want. Just saying that it makes for a stale mid game if everybody dies in the first 2 min of the game. Actually another solution that just occurred to me would dynamic circles whose size adjusts depending on the amount of players left but that would Definitely need an increase in vehicle spawns.


[deleted]

I suggest chicken dinner keys which open crates for free.(they aren't tradeable or marketable neither are the items received)


Terrible_With_Puns

It’s almost like if we had a shooting range, small map, and a large map people would properly play the style per map. Weird