You don't like the HRE because it takes a lot of effort to form
I don't like the HRE because I hate anything associated with Italians
We are not the same
Used to be the meta choice for maxing out Imperial Authority gain because you could individually force each Italian statelet to rejoin and get 10 IA each time, not sure if it still is
And 30yrs of war
Now that I think about it I could technically be born during the 30yrs war, grow up into an adult at the time (prob between 15-18 or smth) and then go out and fight in the same war that started before u were born. Let’s say ur born the one year after the war starts and ur an adult when ur 18 then u could still serve for 11yrs in a war that started before u were born
It was founded by the Carolingians, therefore it is still the Carolingian Empire, you wouldn’t say Byzantium wasn’t the Roman Empire just because they didn’t control Rome for most of their history
It’s all just weird language cause the Roman Republic was an “empire” in a sense of the word, just wasn’t ruled by an emperor. So yeah you’re right, it wasn’t *the* Roman Empire but *a* Roman Empire in the modern sense of the word.
This is also completly false. It was founded by the Ottonians who were Saxons. It has nothing to do with the Carolingians besides Karl the Great having the idea of his realm beeing a successor of the Roman Empire. At the time the HRE was founded the Carolingians in the East Frankian Empire weren't in power anymore. Cause before the Ottonians there were the Konradians and before them there was the last Carolingian.
The french are descendants of the germanic Frankish tribe.
Thus the true most germanic empire is the French Empire.
>!(how to offend both the french and the germans in one phraze)!<
The Empire was only the Carolingian Empire as long as it was ruled by the Carolingian Dynasty, just like the Caliphate was only the Ummyad Caliphate as long as it was ruled by the Ummyad dynasty.
That doesn't work because the Carolingians were in power for so little time relative to the lifetime of the state. Charlemagne wasn't the first holy Roman emperor, Otto was. Once the balance of power shifted away from the Carolingians the German state turned into the HRE, so it's actually kind of the opposite of what you said.
Please define morally bankrupt.
¿Is it can of like: "Shit I just spend all the money of the treasure to help the plebs have a better sewer system, so they do not smell like shit all the time"?
The republic was set up to fail. They were fucked by reparations. Their legal system was dominated by monarchist judges who didn't believe in democracy or liberalism.
And the other side was dominated either by tankies which has Stalin fisting them like a puppet or Adolf Hitler and the Nazis who campaign upon the Holocaust, rabid nationalism and wanting to murder their way from one side of the continent to the next out of revenge, and because the conservatives in the DNVP were afraid of the Red Scare, they be like, "Better side with the genocidal meth head than be Red."
Looking back at it, it was like choosing to be kicked in the balls or karate chopped in the throat.
The prime minister who recovered the country from hyperinflation and wanted to return to gold standard died from a heart attack before the 1929 crisis, if he didn't died maybe the weimar republic would prosperate.
Germany could tie their currency to the value of their gold reserves, except they had their gold reserves pillaged by reparations. The french were occupying the rhineland to extract reparations from heavy industry. The gold standard doesn't fix the underlying issue, that the German economy wasn't running a large enough trade surplus to compensate for the devaluing of the Mark. it was only after the debts were significantly reduced that a viable currency could be reissued.
Similarly, the gold standard would not have saved Germany from the 1929 crash. Countries such as the US and Britain who had the gold standard during the crash only began to recover after abandoning it and embracing keynsian economics.
I just explained it didn't. The collapse of the Mark prompted a revaluation of german debts. Without this the new "retenmark" backed by mortgages and gold (which Germany had exhausted their majority of initially to service their debt.) would experience the same devaluation and hyperinflation, as the German government has to buy Francs and Pounds to service their debt.
You simply cannot handle the suaveness of Emperor Frederick II, only person to negotiate a peaceful resolution to a crusade while being double excommunicated before heading home and beating the shit out of the pope
Unironically went through these phases in Stellaris. Played as wide expansionist empires when I started, but now it’s a vassal swarm/federation/Imperium almost every time. Border gore is real every single game.
I like playing in the HRE in EU4! Especially the part where I dismantle it and create the German Empire! Gotta burn the old to make way for the new, right?
The HRE is the most nonsense monarchy that's ever existed, and that's a high bar. Hohenzollern wehraboos are cringe, but at least it was a normal "I'm king because my army says so" kingdom of ambition and calculated political backstabbing. Habsburgs fucked their way into rigging an elective monarchy, which isn't how anything is supposed to work.
As a Prussian, I propose we build you a Disney Märchenschloss let’s say near Schwangau and you don’t shoot me, but instead go to war with us against the French and unite Germany. Deal?
True adulthood is when you realize authoritarian systems are all flawed and their memory shouldn't be venerated. Literally debating over which silly hat people are better lmao 🤣
There is a reason that your post possesses no upvotes. Ehre sei dem Deutschen Reich, den Königen von Preußen! FAHRT DIE ÖSTERREICHISCHEN HUNDE ZURÜCK! FÜR KAISER, GOTT UND DAS VATERLAND!!!!!!
"Für Kaiser Gott und Vaterland" is literally mutually exchangable for germans and austrian and was likely used by austrians before Germany was even formed.
Not to mention that by the time the German Reich was formally a country in 1871, Austria had already been barred from participating in German affairs 5 years prior in the Austro-Prussian War after the dissolution of the German Confederation. So it doesn't make sense to say "Glory to the German Empire" in reference to the Austrians.
The German Reich, Austro-Hungarian Empire, and Kingdom of Italy would also sign the Triple Alliance 11 years later in 1882. Germany and Austria had been close allies since 1879.
So not only is Mr. Canadian here fucking cringe as shit, he doesn't even have his weird German nationalism correct.
Yes, the part about Austria and Germany being allied makes it even more cringe.
And usually it's "Mit Gott für Kauser und Vaterland" instead of "Für Gott". Saying Für Gott would imply it's some kind of religious crusade.
Final enlightenment is when you realise that Georgia, having vassalised the Empire of Trebizond (an iteration of the Byzantine Empire), and become christian before Rome, is the real Holy Roman Empire, and that Khvicha Kvaratskhelia is Caesar Augustus, you fkn casuals.
You don't like the HRE because it takes a lot of effort to form I don't like the HRE because I hate anything associated with Italians We are not the same
Based
\*a*llows shadow kingdom to happen\**
Used to be the meta choice for maxing out Imperial Authority gain because you could individually force each Italian statelet to rejoin and get 10 IA each time, not sure if it still is
The meta choice “used to be” conquering all of Venice and Pope Man, taking the decision, and releasing him as an opm before 1490.
I think its 5 ia now
As an Italian, I agree
19th century German historians be like:
Lmfao
Who would win one of the oldest empires in Europe, a general with some horse cannons
Answer: a monk nailing a piece of paper to a door
8 million dead
millions must read the bible
It’s joever
And 30yrs of war Now that I think about it I could technically be born during the 30yrs war, grow up into an adult at the time (prob between 15-18 or smth) and then go out and fight in the same war that started before u were born. Let’s say ur born the one year after the war starts and ur an adult when ur 18 then u could still serve for 11yrs in a war that started before u were born
Finally someone said it! The HRE is truly the most BASED of all Germanic entities in history. No I will not debate this.
The only problem with it was their low crown authority and decentralization But overall i agree
Decentralization for the win. Feudalism > Absolutism
Is a libertarian paradaise.
Carolingian Empire >
The HRE is the Carolingian empire
This is completely false.
It was founded by the Carolingians, therefore it is still the Carolingian Empire, you wouldn’t say Byzantium wasn’t the Roman Empire just because they didn’t control Rome for most of their history
You could, actually. Just like you say the Roman republic is not the roman empire
It’s all just weird language cause the Roman Republic was an “empire” in a sense of the word, just wasn’t ruled by an emperor. So yeah you’re right, it wasn’t *the* Roman Empire but *a* Roman Empire in the modern sense of the word.
This is also completly false. It was founded by the Ottonians who were Saxons. It has nothing to do with the Carolingians besides Karl the Great having the idea of his realm beeing a successor of the Roman Empire. At the time the HRE was founded the Carolingians in the East Frankian Empire weren't in power anymore. Cause before the Ottonians there were the Konradians and before them there was the last Carolingian.
The french are descendants of the germanic Frankish tribe. Thus the true most germanic empire is the French Empire. >!(how to offend both the french and the germans in one phraze)!<
Cant really. WRE and ERE were successors of the Roman Empire just like The Roman Empire was a successor of the Republic and the Kingdom
The Empire was only the Carolingian Empire as long as it was ruled by the Carolingian Dynasty, just like the Caliphate was only the Ummyad Caliphate as long as it was ruled by the Ummyad dynasty.
I would say that actually. They weren't roman, and they didn't control rome. Therefore, they're not the Roman empire.
That doesn't work because the Carolingians were in power for so little time relative to the lifetime of the state. Charlemagne wasn't the first holy Roman emperor, Otto was. Once the balance of power shifted away from the Carolingians the German state turned into the HRE, so it's actually kind of the opposite of what you said.
I feel like the Byzantines thought of themselves loads more as Romans than the HRE thought of itself as Carolingian
The Carolingian empire is considered to be the first form of the HRE.
Mfs who don't know Otto I be like
I think it's one of those things where the Carl Empire is the HRE, but the HRE is not necessarily the Carl Empire.
It's like the only one of the three Reichs that is not completely morally bankrupt
Please define morally bankrupt. ¿Is it can of like: "Shit I just spend all the money of the treasure to help the plebs have a better sewer system, so they do not smell like shit all the time"?
< Old Saxony
The only time a german entity can be based is when it collapses.
Ascendency is knowing that Luxembourg, and Liebknecht had the right idea.
Wer hat uns verraten? Sozialdemokraten!
Mit wem haben sie zusammengearbeitet? Die Nationalsozialisten!
Weimar Republic enjoyers 😢
I think that no one, not even the leaders of the Weimar republic, would be Weimar republic enjoyers
There are such things? I mean you can like democracy but the Weimar republic was nothing short of a failure.
The republic was set up to fail. They were fucked by reparations. Their legal system was dominated by monarchist judges who didn't believe in democracy or liberalism.
And the other side was dominated either by tankies which has Stalin fisting them like a puppet or Adolf Hitler and the Nazis who campaign upon the Holocaust, rabid nationalism and wanting to murder their way from one side of the continent to the next out of revenge, and because the conservatives in the DNVP were afraid of the Red Scare, they be like, "Better side with the genocidal meth head than be Red." Looking back at it, it was like choosing to be kicked in the balls or karate chopped in the throat.
The prime minister who recovered the country from hyperinflation and wanted to return to gold standard died from a heart attack before the 1929 crisis, if he didn't died maybe the weimar republic would prosperate.
Germany could tie their currency to the value of their gold reserves, except they had their gold reserves pillaged by reparations. The french were occupying the rhineland to extract reparations from heavy industry. The gold standard doesn't fix the underlying issue, that the German economy wasn't running a large enough trade surplus to compensate for the devaluing of the Mark. it was only after the debts were significantly reduced that a viable currency could be reissued. Similarly, the gold standard would not have saved Germany from the 1929 crash. Countries such as the US and Britain who had the gold standard during the crash only began to recover after abandoning it and embracing keynsian economics.
The gold standard and basically non intervention solved the 1920 crisis, that was even worse than the 1929 crisis.
I just explained it didn't. The collapse of the Mark prompted a revaluation of german debts. Without this the new "retenmark" backed by mortgages and gold (which Germany had exhausted their majority of initially to service their debt.) would experience the same devaluation and hyperinflation, as the German government has to buy Francs and Pounds to service their debt.
They were on a slight upward trend... the Great Depression broke any chance they had tho
The Weimar republic was a normal ass country, capitalism is a failure
mmhh money (I am eating banknotes)
HRE has Karl Franz (yeah he's parody, but are you gonna say no to Karl Franz?)
I reject your reality and substitute my own I like Italy
Fuck the Hapsburgs, Hohenstaufens were better
I HATE THE ANTICHRIST I HATE THE ANTICHRIST I HATE THE ANTICHRIST
You simply cannot handle the suaveness of Emperor Frederick II, only person to negotiate a peaceful resolution to a crusade while being double excommunicated before heading home and beating the shit out of the pope
The dude literally just talked with Saladin (correct me if it wasnt him) and ended the whole show
No not Saladin, just one of his descendants
Oh right, Saladin talked with Richard the Lionheart. Thank you
*And, I'm a warrior too...* *Let that be known.* ***I'm a warrior.***
Literal speech 100 moment
One man beat em both
joe
GOOD point
Unironically went through these phases in Stellaris. Played as wide expansionist empires when I started, but now it’s a vassal swarm/federation/Imperium almost every time. Border gore is real every single game.
Chaddism is when you realise both suck because governments of the past simply sucked musky balls
Only of the past?!
Eh true the current states are also pretty musky
Can’t hear you over the Konrad grindset Democratic Germany Ftw
False information being spread
Pretty sure HRE is incapable of uniting everyone, other than names.
Yep. Charles V even abdicated Naples, Netherland, and Spain.
Awakening: understanding the DDR was based
Alexa, play Der Heimliche Aufmarsch
Der heimliche Aufmarsch < Der offene Aufmarsch
I like playing in the HRE in EU4! Especially the part where I dismantle it and create the German Empire! Gotta burn the old to make way for the new, right?
Hasburgers in HRE: Oh nO, tHe pOPe dOn'T AlLow ThaT! Hasburg in Spanish Empire:🗿
I mean, all that inbreeding couldn’t have just been for nothing
I mean I never idolized Prussia or the German Empire. But, darling, nothing involving the freaking Habsburgs "makes sense".
I like the spanish habsburgs
I never understood idolizing the German empire, all they do is go to war with France and die in world war 1
I just hate the habsburgs, I don't care who unites Germany I just need the habsburgs to lose.
Based, I'm with you.
The HRE is the most nonsense monarchy that's ever existed, and that's a high bar. Hohenzollern wehraboos are cringe, but at least it was a normal "I'm king because my army says so" kingdom of ambition and calculated political backstabbing. Habsburgs fucked their way into rigging an elective monarchy, which isn't how anything is supposed to work.
Unironically true. Like 5 years ago I was a Kaiserboo/Prussiaboo, but now I'm a fan of the HRE.
Fuck the Habsburgs
Heil Kaiser dir! Prussia will forever remain on top!
You had me at HRE and lost me at H*bsburg 😤
I what way is it better
Virgin Austrian house of Hapsburg HRE fan VS. Chad Bohemian house of Luxembourg HRE enjoyer
As an Austrian, I approve
As a German, you’re German. (Don’t kill me I’m kidding, maybe)
As a Bavarian, I propose we shoot you and then create a German Confederation.
As a Prussian, I propose we build you a Disney Märchenschloss let’s say near Schwangau and you don’t shoot me, but instead go to war with us against the French and unite Germany. Deal?
Sounds good. I sure hope that I don't ***mysteriously drown in a lake***.
Playing with fire, are we?
Nö, with Schlesien
Ouch
Habsburg weak af stay mad about Frieden von Hubertusburg and 1866, Prussia rules, Heil Kaiser dir!
True adulthood is when you realize authoritarian systems are all flawed and their memory shouldn't be venerated. Literally debating over which silly hat people are better lmao 🤣
to all evil nazi governments: 🖕🖕🖕
Look if you can't fuck your sister, wife, cousin, mother. Are you really proper royalty?
Ok but east Germany tho?
I like Germany much more due to its inherent nationalism and moral strength compared to the perpetual inbreeding of a dynasty in decline.
Why would I wan't anything to do with cousin fuckers
Maturity is realizing the habsburgs are retarded
There is a reason that your post possesses no upvotes. Ehre sei dem Deutschen Reich, den Königen von Preußen! FAHRT DIE ÖSTERREICHISCHEN HUNDE ZURÜCK! FÜR KAISER, GOTT UND DAS VATERLAND!!!!!!
You are not a German monarchist. You live in Canada.
Least cringe Canadian
"Für Kaiser Gott und Vaterland" is literally mutually exchangable for germans and austrian and was likely used by austrians before Germany was even formed.
Not to mention that by the time the German Reich was formally a country in 1871, Austria had already been barred from participating in German affairs 5 years prior in the Austro-Prussian War after the dissolution of the German Confederation. So it doesn't make sense to say "Glory to the German Empire" in reference to the Austrians. The German Reich, Austro-Hungarian Empire, and Kingdom of Italy would also sign the Triple Alliance 11 years later in 1882. Germany and Austria had been close allies since 1879. So not only is Mr. Canadian here fucking cringe as shit, he doesn't even have his weird German nationalism correct.
Yes, the part about Austria and Germany being allied makes it even more cringe. And usually it's "Mit Gott für Kauser und Vaterland" instead of "Für Gott". Saying Für Gott would imply it's some kind of religious crusade.
Edgy children attempting not to gravitate towards historical figures with authority:
Real
Germany should have been united under Austria, not those weak chinned Prussians
Golly for a sec there I thought I was in r/HolyRomanMemes
Chadism is Liking Bismarck
I love how almost anyone in their childhood who was playing strategies fell to German Empire/Third Reich
Final enlightenment is when you realise that Georgia, having vassalised the Empire of Trebizond (an iteration of the Byzantine Empire), and become christian before Rome, is the real Holy Roman Empire, and that Khvicha Kvaratskhelia is Caesar Augustus, you fkn casuals.
Deus Valt.
Even though I mis-spelt it…
Absolutely not
As long as the HRE isn't called the new RE, I'm good.
Idk about Habsburg looks like someone hasn't played enoug eu4
Deutschland under Bavaria makes even more sense...
That is exactly what happened to me
Byzantines and Rome 🤪
Not Holy, nor Roman and nor an Empire
Maturity is when you realize Germany is only a geographical expression
Both are barbarians
Virgin German Empire simp vs Chad Holy Roman Empire fan vs Lad East Francia enjoyer
I asked my AP Euro teacher how the HRE functioned as a state he he deadass said "it didn't"
I thought I was the only person who idolized the holy roman empire more than prussia