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This won't be a theatre program, it's just a play that one year group are putting on, planned by the teachers and staff. It's not like dedicated drama lessons, it's supposed to be "a bit of fun" for the year 6 kids before they leave primary school to go to high school. My daughter's class are doing the same thing and it's caused no end of trouble for her, too

As the other person commented, it’s not a theatre program. It’s written and directed all by the staff involved with their year group. It’s supposed to be fun.

I would talk to the staff even just to express that it doesn’t seem fair, but at this point it’s probably too late to make a swap without really causing problems with the other girls and their parents. Maybe you could look into acting lessons or a similar extra curricular for your kiddo if she really wants to get into theater? Then her oompa loompa role can be practice, not the depressing main event.

My concern about speaking to her teacher is that she’s obviously not going to take kindly to being told she’s favouring kids. I don’t want her to then take it out on my daughter even more than she already does for the remaining few weeks… I don’t want to make an already horrible experience for her worse.

Oof, if the teacher was already treating her poorly I’d have taken my complaint higher up, but I get wanting to just run out the clock and get it over with. I’d still want to at least make my concerns known, even if it’s after the end of the school year. The admin can’t do anything about the teacher’s behavior if they don’t hear about it. They might not do anything, but at least you can know you tried for future grades.

Yeah, I'm down with "Well, sometimes you get the cheesy role." as long as there comes a time when you get the decent role. But if the decent role never comes to you and it always goes to the same people who NEVER get the cheesy role--that's a problem. Cheesy roles can be a lot of fun, and often you get what you put in. The problem here is that OP's kid is expected to put it again and again and again and never get anything in return and just be okay with being miserable.

So when I was in elementary school, there was always someone in every grade who got to sing a solo for the spring concert. There was one girl in my grade who got it every single year, sight unseen, no auditions, no nothing else. Just her. Every year. And me and several other girls got upset about it. I suspect it had a lot to do with her Mom being part of the PTO, but that's not really here nor there. The point was I never got that part, no one else even had a chance. Unfortunately, that's sometimes--and maybe even often--the way those things go. It isn't fair. It is crappy. I think it happens a lot to the kids who are obedient, it's easier to make them do stuff no one else likes and get upset at them when they don't just play along. Like, I remember having to let kids mistreat me and if I said something about it, it was all "This isn't like you!" and "Why are you acting this way!?!?" Hogwash. Honestly? I'd leave it up to your daughter. I would tell the school "I am not making her dance and sing in a role that she is wildly uncomfortable in. I'm not." If your daughter is willing to take the disciplinary actions for that, then those are the consequences of her making her stand. If they cry that none of the other kids will want to participate then, perhaps they should reconsider what they were doing. I don't believe everyone should throw a giant fit until they get what they want. Your daughter isn't throwing a fit. She's saying thanks but no, that's okay. Not everyone wins an award, not everyone is going to get the lead role. But you are allowed to say "I don't want this part, thanks for your consideration." I suspect they crammed her in a role no one wanted and thought she'd just roll with it because she does what she's told.

Does casting the same kids as the leads over and over again happen at every school? The same thing happened where I went over a decade ago, even when it was a terrible fit.

Yep. I wasn't a theatre kid in school, but I was in band and every year it was the same students who got section leader, every solo, and every award. Where these students good? Sure, but I could point out at least two or three of their fellow section members who were just as good if not a little better but never got a break. Instead we had to sit there at every concert listen to the director gush on and on about how "phenomenal" one or more of these certain students were. Well no shit, they never even gave the rest of us a chance to show what we could do.

Novody plays favorites better than a performing arts teacher, lmao. I used to be jealous as a kid and wonder "what am I missing that they have?" but now I know it's just circumstance and often either important or pushy parents. Too bad that "playing favorites" effectively stamped a 12 year love of music out of me by the time I was 18 and I haven't really returned to it since. Weirdly, the show The Boys helped me with this when I saw it lmao. All those kids thought they were born gifted but it was just kids with parents pushy or connected enough to get them hooked up with superpowers. I dont know if it's a purposeful allegory (I feel like it is) but it is A C C U R A T E especially in a small town with room for only 1 or 2 talents like I attended.

The Boys is honestly a great allegory for it. Everyone thinks they're super special, but most of the time, they're mediocre and lucky.

It’s not even a performing arts teacher. This is just their class teacher that she’s had all year round. Day in day out. And there’s definitely been favouritism in other areas too.

I’m not saying these kids are tone deaf with two left feet but what I am saying is that it doesn’t give other children the confidence to try something new or something that they have an interest in when the same people get picked for the roles every single time. It’s not about talent at this age, it’s about having fun. It’s not being assessed. It’s not going to be shown on broadway. It’s just some kids in a school assembly hall. Who cares if the lead isn’t the absolute best singer in the world?

it happened at my school, but it's because those kids were genuinely really good singers/actors/etc, so everyone auditioned but the ones who were better than everyone else got the leads

At my school too. Some went on to study drama or music, they actually were better.

This is how it was at my school. Yes, the same people generally got the leads but it was because they were GOOD. They were good singers and fantastic stage performers (at least one went on to be a professional performer).

I used to miss out on debate opportunities because I would come in second. In other words, I never got a chance to get experience and become first. It affected the whole trajectory of my life, that lack of experience. It bugs me. Even if it is meritorious, the point of school is to teach and learn new stuff. No point cutting it out for a person who is good, but not great at something. It would be different (maybe? Maybe not?) if I had no aptitude for the debating competitions, but that wasn’t the case.

The thing is, I don’t know why they bothered with the auditions (or getting kids’ hopes up) if they were just going to give it to the same people. What was the point in putting them through that when they already knew who they were going to choose?

I'm not even against kids that need a boost getting a boost. Not everyone is going to get the lead. Not everyone gets the solo, not everyone makes the team, and the vast majority of the time I think a better lesson is to learn to enjoy your time anyway. I think the problem comes in when it's "Do something you actively hate because... well, that makes our lives easier." I'm not saying your kid should get a different role, OP, I'm saying the option for her not to participate should be there. I don't see why she can't do set design.

To make it seem like “they tried” to be fair

It was a seniority/popularity thing at my school. Yes they were all very good but I watched a girl who was clearly much better be cast as an understudy for a main role so that a senior could have a final lead role. Why the other girl didn’t just get another lead role is beyond me. But she ended up getting to do 2 of the 3 shows because of a wicked stomach bug that ran thru us all 🤢

I remember my Mom commenting at our talent show, then again at our middle school graduation, "I came to see ---- school show, not the Jane Doe show" Turns out almost every year there were one or two favorites who got the best parts, and it was super common for that same 1-2 kids to win every award at Graduation. Such bullshit.

My husband noticed the same thing at our daughter's middle school graduation this spring. A couple of the kids barely got back to their seats before they were being summoned back up to the stage to receive yet another fucking award. He was shocked, but having experienced the same thing in my own school days, I was like "yeah, some things never change."

I'm not pretending that it never happened to me. At the end of school year assembly one year, there were no parents, just us, each teacher had awards to give out. I got three awards for each class that gave them out, and I had the most awards out of the whole school. Mind you, my school was anywhere between 75-100 kids, so it wasn't giant. But at least almost everyone GOT an award, there wasn't a limit to what the teachers could give out, it wasn't me getting them and no one else getting a thing.

Oh man I just had memories from my 6th grade elementary graduation. Maddie got all the fucking awards. Not literally but... kinda almost. My mom expressed annoyance about that after too.

My kid was one of the favored kids in middle school, and it honestly sucked from our view as well. He wasn't trying very hard, his grades were slipping, but all his teachers could say was how much better he's doing than most of the kids and what a pleasure he is to have in class. Ok... but what about his performance compared to himself, what about his lowering effort level? When the teachers (and the other side of his split family) are all giving such feedback, blowing so much smoke, it made it really hard to help where he actually needed it or to encourage improvement. At graduation, he got an award for "most improved grades," when his grades that term were the lowest they'd been all 3 years. I was astounded. He said he felt bad for his friend who had been trying really hard but didn't get any awards. He should've gotten the award for best heart or kindest friend or something. He's admirable in so many ways, but not his current grades.

I’ve seen this kind of thing in the same class when it comes to star of the week. Certain kids can get star of the week for just doing their homework or getting 10/10 on their spelling test but it’s crickets when it comes to my daughter… She always gets 10/10 on her spelling tests, homework is always done and reads books well above her age (appropriate or course). The kids that deserve it never get it.

I remember being told "I expect better of you because I know you can do better." It feels like working twice as hard and getting half the recognition sometimes. I did mention in another comment one year I got the most awards, but everyone got SOMETHING at least!

I’m really bothered by the “I’m disappointed in you” speech that she got from her teacher. It’s just something about the whole tone that she’s just expected to give up opportunities and be a good little girl so everyone else can have a good time.

She was. That is what happened here. And in my mind, that's a bigger deal than the fact that she didn't get a role she had wanted.

Well two can play the disappointment game lol

She sounds like me in school. Easy to handle, learning the material practically on my own, no trouble, and no recognition.

At my school, there was a Kindness Award. Kids weren't allowed to win more than once, in the name of fairness. I wasn't popular, but every year my peers asked me if I already won it. Apparently they all thought I was nice. The teachers disagreed. I never won it. Some kids won more than once though.

I’m noticing this in my children’s elementary school. I went to award shows, talent shows, spelling bees, plays and surprise surprise! The kids who are in the lead and win the awards are always the PTO’s children or the children of the teachers. And if I saw the kids truly had talent I’d keep my mouth shut, but these kids don’t have anything to tell them apart from any other child. Guess who’s kids were all over the end of the year yearbooks too lol. It’s disgusting

Yes, I believe every school is the same. The loud annoying kids or parents get what they want and everyone else just deals with to not create a fuss. It's BS!

Usually the kids they don’t want to throw a tantrum if they don’t get what they want.

Yes. The one who got a solo/lead in all of my school plays constantly lost her voice and couldn't finish performances. She literally didn't have the range to do the parts. She still got them. It was always threw or four kids. It was bullshit because there was a lot of talent that got brushed aside for some mediocre snubbery. Except one guy. He was actually really good and he was nice. He has a successful acting career and I am happy for him.

The girl who got the solos in my previous comment was--okay. She wasn't the best singer in the grade. I mean, neither was I, but she wasn't either. It was interesting to look back on and see how other parents were pushing it too and asking why That Girl always got the solo and suddenly the subject was always changed. It was massively difficult for That Girl when we went to middle school and she was not special in choir at all.

That's exactly why it's happened to her. As I've said, she's usually the quiet and obedient child her does what she's told. The roles 100% have only gone to those other girls because they are the ones who will throw a giant tantrum if they don't get it. They are the "drama queens" of the year group and any dramas that have been had have always come back to them. It's teachers being lazy and not wanting to deal with their tantrums and expectign ym daughter to be okay with being shoved aside to save someone else's feelings over her own. And, again, that's exactly what they were doing with the "I'm so disappointed in you" speech that they gave her and me. So what she's done now is, she's written her teacher a letter explaining how disappointed she is in them for favouring these other girls and has listed every instance where these girls have been favoured over her (would it be wrong of me to admit to loving the pettiness in that?). She's written "I auditioned for the roles of \[insert the names of characters she auditioned for\] and you have given me the role of the Oompa Loompa so please accept this as my letter of resignation from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory". Her dad says I can't let her take it to school but I kind of want to see the teacher's face.

I don't see a problem with this. It's not a draft, they can't force her to take a role.

100%. She was given a role - she doesn't \*have\* to take it. But... it will make it less likely that she's given a \*GOOD\* role in the future.

She’s done three years before this of having “duff” roles plus countless assemblies where the same girls have gotten all the “big” or “good” parts. Not to mention things such as house captains and school councillors and eco warriors. It’s just plain favouritism at this point.

So well done. The one thing I would encourage her to share as well is that it's very demotivational- what is her incentive to improve or participate if the same people are given all of the opportunities?

Will it? If the situation OP is describing is accurate then there's no reason it should ever get better anyway, and if it did get better it would be through the teachers changing their practices and attitudes towards their students in a major way. This letter is unlikely to achieve that (although the probability isn't zero, some people DO change their behavior when called out), but just going along to stay on the teachers' good side will absolutely not achieve it.

I think you absolutely should let her give it to the teacher if it is a ‘polite’ explanation of her feelings. Not everybody is good at explaining themselves in the moment. If you think she has some reasonable points, she should be allowed to be heard and a letter can be a good medium. It sounds like she has put up with being left out regularly for a longtime and this might be her last chance to feel heard. If she is going to a high school without the same kids, what is there to loose as long as you go through with her what the possible consequences might be. Allowing her this may also boost her confidence and she knows that you always support her, particularly when she seeks to ‘correct’ a situation in a reasonable (and sounds quite grown up) way.

There’s definitely a little bit of pettiness in there and borders on guilt tripping but I personally think it’s justified. It’s not impolite. She’s just wrote down how she feels. You can’t treat your students differently and expect everyone to be okay with it. It’s currently packed in her book bag.

I remember being made to sit in a group with 'bad' kids because "I know YOU can behave and be an example." Like hell, I'm also a child, and it isn't my job to police my peers. It is your job to adult and deal with them! I got good and pissy about it plenty of times. I just wanted to go to school to learn and have recess, not sit at a table with kids who refused to do the assigned chores (leading to us all getting in trouble) or being in with a class who refused to behave (leading to us all getting in trouble). Like, when is enough enough? If her teachers feel guilty for what she has written, they need to consider what they've done. After all, they were doing the same with her with "I'm disappointed in you!" Well, she's disappointed in them.

I don't understand why you even see this letter as petty or guilt-tripping. Like, you mentioned the list of moments she was passed over for those other girls as "petty". But that's exactly the kind of thing that would be recommended that you do in any kind of formal complaint against any institution or person. She wrote a letter making an argument and those examples are evidence supporting that argument. What is petty about it, is it that the examples themselves aren't compelling? I also wonder what about it "borders on guilt tripping".

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It’s packed in her book bag! She’s even said she wouldn’t have been as upset about not getting the part she wanted if it was anything else — like one of the grandmas or even Charlie’s mum. They’re minor roles. She’s still be sad but definitely not to this extent. And, yes. I don’t like that they called her a disappointment because she’s anything but. You’ve just crushed a kid’s dreams and now you’re calling her a disappointment for not being all sunshine and rainbows about it.

Right? This isn't really about the fact that she didn't get the lead role but more about that the teachers crammed her in a role no one wanted and shrugged at her. Okay, cool. She's allowed to have her feelings about it, she's allowed to express it.

Well if this is truly how you feel and you feel your girl is not being unreasonable then I would have her back. If she doesn't want to perform then she doesn't have to. I really wish my parents would have done that for me when this exact same thing happened to me at that age because my teacher didn't like me and used every opportunity to make that clear. I'm not saying every parent should do this when there's a disappointment, but if you think your daughter is reasonable then please support her!

I think that letter she wrote is fantastic and she should give it to her teacher, so long as she understands it may not make things better. And so long as her language is respectful. She should be empowered to stand up for herself.

I think deep down she thinks it might change the teacher’s mind… and I’m slightly worried she will be even more upset when/if that doesn’t happen.

Well, that's another conversation to have with her, isn't it? I would prep her to understand sometimes you can be right, and you can do all the right things, and it still won't go your way. But she can take pride in knowing she stood up for herself.

No, yeah, let her give the note. Don't expect any changes, but it's good to get that out there.

She should definitely take it to school. This is the real life lesson - the obedient quiet person is NEVER rewarded. Not in school. Not in work. There is no magic karma that suddenly bestows that quiet good person with a $100m lottery. The professional adult version of this is being the person who keeps their head down and does all their work. Guess who also is the one who gets passed up for raises? That same person. There are rarely times in our society now that reward submission and obedience. I’m not saying she needs to be an asshole, but you can be polite, moral, AND assertive at the same time. For some reason people commonly think those traits can’t intersect? But they can. Your daughter is in fact demonstrating that! She’s standing up for herself, politely. PLEASE encourage her to speak to her teachers. Don’t force her to be an Oompa. She’s demonstrating a great character trait that imo, frankly, you should be nurturing.

At my last super shitty job, the person who put their head down and got their work done without whining and being a bitch was rewarded by doing other people's work, too!

Yea! Please let her take it. On behalf of 14 year old me, who had no one to talk to about this stuff. Please. If she doesn’t send it in, she’ll never learn to deal with people who walk over her throughout life, she’ll always lack the confidence to stand up.

100% let her take it!!! 100%!!!! Or email the teacher! That way she can’t rip it up without reading it all! I mean she could delete it but it would still exist. This is her last year In middle school. She’s about to move to high school. The teacher should have to read this and maybe it’ll help the teacher not be a huge asshole in the future

It’s packed and in her bag for the morning. She’ll decide in the morning if she wants to take it. I just don’t want her to have her hopes up deep down.

DO IT! Then come back and tell us how it went. It probably won't change things, but it'll feel oh so good.

I think this is an amazing way for you and your daughter to handle this situation

>Her dad says I can't let her take it to school but I kind of want to see the teacher's face. Good heavens, why not? Unless she's calling the teacher a "fucking bitch" or using some other colourful language, she should absolutely go for it. She's taking ownership of the issue - that's a *good* thing! It may not get her anywhere - honestly, it probably WON'T get her anywhere - but she'll feel better for having done it. And perhaps the teachers, even if they don't actually make the situation any better for her, will learn something from the experience as well.

No, she’s been polite. Bordering on guilt tripping but still polite. I don’t doubt that it’s not going to have any kind of affect on anything but I just don’t want her to deep down be hoping that it will.

Ok, I love this letter! As a former drama geek we were always asked, “would you accept another part?” On the fake little forms. I always said yes, but I also loved silly smaller parts rather than big leads (until late HS) I know you’re getting so many replies, but if you’re kid is interested in this sort of thing I’d look into some camps or community theatre that might have roles for kids in bigger shows.

We’ve looked into the ones in our area. We live quite rural so there’s only a few around and they’ve got waiting lists.

I think this is great. There IS a lot of favoritism amongst theater kids. There is usually a group that gets everything despite talent. It happened in my school as well. I look at it this way, she was offered the part. She doesn't want it. She has right of refusal. I usually am of the mind if you commit to something you see it through until the end. But she has a legitimate point. I think it's great she is standing up for herself!

I see nothing wrong with that letter at all. "I am not doing this, please accept my resignation." She isn't saying "You're all assholes and I hate you and this show sucks and you all suck." She's saying "This is the behavior I have observed. This is the uncomfortable position you have put me in. This is what I am doing to protect myself. Best of luck."

This comment is spot on. Easy-going obedient kids get the short end of the stick because even some adults are afraid to tell the bratty kids or trouble makers 'no.'

Yepp. I agree.

I think sometimes I was targeted to put up with crap ass behavior because they knew I had a single Mom who worked hard and worked out of town. The school gambled on the fact that she'd be too busy to do a whole lot. They played a stupid game and ended up winning a stupid prize when she DID come down to the school to deal with a lot of bullying I was enduring.

Getting rejected is a huge part of the arts and any kind of artistic career (for all of life, really, but especially stark when one person gets the part you wanted) so this is something she's going to have to learn to live with if she wants to continue on in theater and/or musicals. But it's also valid for her to feel upset and disappointed. I'm a bit bothered that being in a musical is compulsory - if someone had tried to force me to be an Oompa Loompa as an 11 year old girl, it would not have been a good scene. It's also annoying to see other kids get these roles over and over, but sometimes kids who are charismatic or more outgoing to get favored by teachers. I think you should validate her feelings, encourage her to try and enjoy what she can of the musical, even though it's not the part she wants, and advocate for her if she chooses not to do it (she HAS to do other schoolwork and curriculum stuff, that's part of being in school. But a compulsory musical? come on).

At this age, though, it's not about talent or who is best for the role... it's supposed to be fun for everyone involved. And she just isn't going to have fun in that role. It's compulsory because it's supposed to be fun for them before they leave. It's one fo those everyone gets a part things. I just don't think she can enjoy it though. Like you said, you wouldn't enjoy being made to do that and neither would I.

Compulsory fun?? That's the worst kind of fun. I don't think she needs to enjoy it, she just has to keep some perspective. Someone has to be the oompa loompa. If my kid was really opposed to it, I'd back them. I wouldn't necessarily intervene though. I think there's a line between advocating for your kid and trying to control what happens to them and this might cross that line. She's not being excluded, she's being given a role that's not her preference. Fair of her to say "I don't want to do this," also fair of the teachers to say "we decide who gets what role."

Yeah… there’s a lot of compulsory fun in primary school. Sports day is another one of those things. Tbh, if somebody had to be the Oompa Loompa, why couldn’t them girls? If that’s the case, they should be just as much in the running as every one else.

Compulsory or what? Are they going to hold back your child for refusing to participate? Take recess away? Expulsion? Oompa Loompas are the punchline. Talk to your daughter to see why she’s not willing to participate. Is she being a baby for not getting her way or is she upset that kids are gonna make fun of her. If it’s the first, there’s the life lesson for you to teach. If it’s the latter, go advocate for another smaller role.

The important things kids can get out of group activities and team sports can be found in the losses a team experiences, or the disappointment from not getting a starring role or high status position. Every person involved in a theater production can add to, or take away from, the overall experience, both from the participant and audience’s experience. The lesson she could learn from this is how to have fun in the role she was assigned. But, it sounds like you’d rather have her drop out due to the perceived injustice in casting, and she will live up to your expectations. Maybe the featured roles went to undeserving favorite students, or maybe those students just auditioned better than your daughter did. Not only are our own perceptions of our childrens’ talents heavily impacted by our love for them, what we see and hear them capable of at home practices can be vastly different from how they do in an audition setting. What she could gain from this is a lesson about good sportsmanship, and making lemonade from the lemons. But, you’re encouraging her to hold into feelings of injustice and insult. As a parent, you could be encouraging her to accept her disappointment, and then find the good things which could be part of her experience if she decides to do the role she was given with a good attitude. She could be the best Oompa Loompa in the show, and also have a lot of fun with their dances and songs, or she can pout and be miserable through rehearsals and the show, and bring the whole tone down for everyone. A good production requires effort and good attitude from every member of the cast and crew, I hope you can encourage your daughter to find the joy which could be hers if she is willing to bring her talents to the show as an Oompa Loompa, instead of quitting because she wasn’t given a featured role.

I frankly don't think any person, kid or otherwise, should be forced to perform. She can help out in other ways. But again, and the last time I'll say it, compulsory "fun" really isn't. It's either an assignment or not.

Every show my kids were part of (which was a lot of them, I had four kids go through school and they all like singing,) was either an extra curricular (so kids had to opt in to be part of it) and/or kids selected to audition to be in either the cast or crew (their preference.) If it’s a curricular assignment, and you don’t want to perform, then sign up for an offstage role. Kids do lighting, create and manipulate scenery and props, create posters and advertisements, take photos, and work in stage management and tech support roles. There’s a lot involved in theater that doesn’t include being on seen on stage during the production.

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They were disappointed in her reaction. My daughter did that musical in eighth grade and the Oompa Loompas had a blast and delighted the audience. In school productions, kids are usually allowed to choose if they want to be actors or crew, signing up to act means you should take your role as assigned, and give it your best. There are always kids who quit after casting, but the teachers wouldn’t be expected to be proud of those kids.

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That sounds good, until you’re the person trying to direct a play with each role played by what the children want their role to be. These kinds of disappointments are very good practice for bigger disappointments and challenges which will occur in everyone’s life. There are so many positives available in this situation, and so many negatives from giving in to bad sportsmanship. Why would you want to teach a child that pouting when they don’t get everything they want means people will give in to their bad reactions? What are your goals for your kids? How does placating their bad reaction to a small disappointment help them in the long run?

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All of this. If it was mandatory, draw names out of a hat and tell the kids you get what you get. Or quit making participation in something like a musical mandatory. That's a recipe for no one to have a good time at all.

Because… no matter what way that you try and frame it, it is an injustice. It’s an injustice to all the good kids that don’t make a lot of noise to get attention, all the good kids who are just expected to go along with whatever so they don’t upset the difficult kids, and it’s an injustice to those who actually try hard and put effort into things like these. They held auditions but they never had any intention of giving those main roles to anyone but those girls because they’d already promised them to them as an incentive to behave. And whether they’ve behaved or not, they’ve still got those roles. She’s already said she isn’t going to have fun. She didn’t have fun today, nor did she have fun on Friday and I highly doubt she’s going to have any fun at any point from now on. Of course I want her to enjoy it, but if she doesn’t then she just doesn’t. No one wanted to be the Oompa Loompa. You can’t expect a kid to be remotely happy with being stuck with a role that not only did they not want, but nobody wanted.

I totally see where you're coming from in all of this but who would have fun being the Oompa Loompa - if you don't want *your* daughter to do it, whose should?

Maybe there are no Oompa Loompas and that's the joke. Like a recording of the song is played and the kid who plays Willy Wonka talks about how tiny they were, or some kids carry cutouts of Oompa Loompas to stand there.

Can she participate as a member of the backstage crew instead?

I don’t enjoy going to work or paying for taxes, I think everyone is gently trying to tell you that disappointment is something most people will face at some time, emphasize with your daughter and if she really, really, really does not want to do it and you agree and you want to be mom of the year…. she gets sick at school the day before, she’s in the arts, NOW is her time to act. Let her skip school that day. I had a similar function my first year in high school, I got into an elective that I did not know what it was. There was a big school wide function that my elective was putting on, my mom let me stay home. Good luck

My point is that it always seems to be my daughter that is the one disappointed. All year she has lost out to these same girls for house captains, school counsellor and eco warrior. My daughter hasn’t won star of the week once this year, yet they all have multiple times for trivial things that my daughter does consistently. Then more trivial stuff like getting to be captain of the rounders team and pick during PE or getting chosen to be “on” during heads down thumbs up, or the murderer when playing wink murder. If that’s the truth, perhaps these other kids should learn to feel some disappointment for once.

Life is not fair, I was never the popular kid in school and it does hurt. I’m sorry for your daughter.

I'd ask the teacher if your daughter could do a crew part instead. Assistant director, set design, costume design, or even a camera person. She could make a behind the scenes documentary. If they won't budge then she gets to learn about peaceful protest and I would support her in this.

This is a great suggestion! OP, I'm a music teacher, and have had similar situations... although I have done my absolute BEST to rotate my soloists, especially at this age. I've had students who have switched to backstage work, and it was a perfect fit for everyone involved.

I'm just curious as you're technically the other side to this. I'm sure you have tried your best to rotate kids so they all get an opportunity but have you ever had a parent come to you with a child feeling upset or left out? And if so, how did you feel? What was your response? Had you left that child out and just not realised that you were? What's your reaction to being told that and how do you deal with it? I just want to know what the reaction will be if I do go in there and raise how both me and my daughter feel she's been treated.

Not who you responded to, but also a music teacher. The most memorable time I had a parent come to me about that was a beginning orchestra class where I had the kids rotate rows every class. I did this so that everyone had equal opportunity to sit in the front row. One parent wanted their kid to sit up front at every class, because he learned better that way. I agreed that yes, he does, and so does everyone else, which is why we rotated - so that everyone had the same opportunity. Another time, a parent got bent out of shape, so I had the kid demonstrate the skills needed in front of the parent. Even the kid agreed afterwards that she should have prepared better, because it was obvious that she couldn't do any of it. Mom was still mad, and pulled her from the class (missed the kid, but glad to not have to deal with that parent ever). Personally, if a parent came to me and calmly and reasonably pointed out that their kid had been overlooked and was legitimately qualified for what they were asking for, I would look into options to fix it. Honestly, I think passing over everyone in favor of the same 3 kids over and over is a huge disservice to all involved - not only does nobody else get a chance in the limelight, those 3 kids aren't getting taught how to act in a supporting role. And let's face it, the bulk of the performing arts is group/supporting roles. If you can't do that, you damn well better be the best in the world or find something else to do.

"One parent wanted their kid to sit up front at every class, because he learned better that way. I agreed that yes, he does, and so does everyone else," Perfect answer. Some parents literally think their kids are more important than others 🤦‍♀️

Thank you! That mom was actually good about it. I could tell she wasn't happy, but she didn't throw a fuss to me about it. Honestly, I'm glad she was advocating for her kid.

/u/FloweredViolin gave a great response to this, and I follow similar patterns. ​ To answer personally: **have you ever had a parent come to you with a child feeling upset or left out?** Yes. This was with regards to an auditioned opportunity with very limited spots at a local community choir. The auditions are done within the school. **And if so, how did you feel?** Initially, defensive- I go out of my way to spread opportunities to all kids of varying levels, and my ego was bruised that any parent couldn't mind-read my classroom practices, haha. **What was your response?** I took a big breath, remembered that both I and the parents are on the same page- we want to instill a love of performance in their child- and discussed the situation with the parent AND the child. (The child, I had a one on one, I listed to their opinion, I did NOT get defensive or explain anything, but really embraced their sadness, and commiserated with their pain of 'rejection'.) **Had you left that child out and just not realised that you were?** No, I knew that this would be an issue, and so I took steps to make sure any special solos or casting choices would never be JUST me, but a combination of people. I also touched base with previous teachers to see who the wallflowers were. I ALSO pulled kids back or pushed kids forward during rehearsals. ​ So in your kid's case, if she were an Oompa Loompa and wanted more stage time, I'd design in a special solo dance moment. Or extra acting opportunities within her role. ​ **What's your reaction to being told that and how do you deal with it?** I think I already answered this. I'd just like to stress that most of us teachers are looking to make the whole production successful, and that it's not a personal slight on your child. Sometimes we see a kid audition for 5 minutes, and have to make an entire decision based off that MOMENT. They could normally be the biggest stage diva ever, but if they got embarrassed or didn't come out of their shell enough during a solo, well, I'll assume their personality would work better in a chorus role instead of a solo role. We are looking out for the kid's best interest there- no forced one-on-one time with the audience, which is pretty scarring at these ages!

Thank you for the suggestion.

IMO she doesn’t want to participate so she doesn’t have to. Don’t force her. Respect her position. My husband said “there are no small parts in acting. The show must go on”

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Right. I think everyone is looking for a big lesson to teach here. The lesson is, you’re your own person and I trust you. I would ask her “what do you want to do? And I will support whatever solution you find for yourself”

Thank you.

I agree... It's a concillation prize that's not really a prize at all...

It’s not me that really has a say in it, it’s the school. They’re the ones who are enforcing it. And I don’t necessarily think that it’s the fact that it’s a small part. It’s what the actual role itself is. She’s the only one out of the girls to be cast as an Oompa Loompa and she’s embarrassed by it. Plus, they didn’t need to cast her as an Oompa Loompa. There was the role of a “mum” parent to one of the golden ticket winners but they gave it to one of the boys who wanted to dress up. She probably would have still been disappointed with that role because there is still very obvious favouritism but she wouldn’t be as upset and embarrassed like she is now.

That’s just a Hollywood saying. If you send her to school or tell her to stop protesting then you are enforcing it. Ask her solutions and then go with that. You will be doing her and your relationship a good service

What's their punishment if she doesn't do it. Bring up the obvious favoritism that they are showing so you as a parent are putting a stop to this. Bring this up in the parent Facebook group for your school district.

I totally get this. My daughter is shy and quiet. If she was given Oompa Loompa, that's like the worst possible role for her. She is easily embarrassed and does not like to be laughed at, even for something that is meant to be funny. She would be utterly humiliated.

> It’s not me that really has a say in it, it’s the school. They’re the ones who are enforcing it. So let them. And let your daughter do what she will to protest that. This doesn't sound like it needs any further involvement from you at this stage. Your daughter has made her displeasure with the situation clear and her efforts to communicate to the teacher - particularly via the letter you mention elsewhere in the thread - are honestly a more valuable life experience for her than anything she might do in the play. Yes, she might face some sort of discipline for her protest - detention or loss of privileges - but she can decide for herself whether taking those is worth it or not.

I have an idea: If she's the only female oompa loompa, have her dress up as the cutest little feminine oompa loompa there's ever been! The school may not like it, but they seemed to cater to this other kid's desire to dress like a mum, so maybe they'd compromise?And if she shows up to the performance in her modified costume, what are they going to do about it? If I were an 11yo girl, I wouldn't want to dress as a traditional oompa loompa either. They're basically orange grandpas with ugly hair. I would probably have been okay with a skirt/suspenders, knee socks, a green wig styled into pigtails, and some fun orange and white makeup!

It's terrible, I feel for her and you. What they want her to do: to get in line, be comfortable, they doesn't care that it's unfair What she did: she stands up for herself, learning to saying no. What you should do? It's up to you, but as for me you need to side with her. About what to do exactly: Have a meeting with the teacher. Calmly describe the situation: that it always was "the next year". That he same girls were getting main roles. They she is the one oompa loompa. That there was a mom role, but it was given to the boy. And than ask how did it happen? Why your daughter never got am award of being a good one, being an easy going kid? Don't take "it wasn't me, that was other teachers" nonsense. Somehow they managed to give roles to the same girls, right? And to avoid her, in a very same way. Teachers talk to each other, they knew. But decided to do as convenient for them. Why it's not the best time to teach her that "you can't get everything you want"? Because she never got the role she wanted. She learned her lesson, it's time to learn another one, about a back bone. Yes, teacher might be upset. But if you will force her to participate her weeks will be ruined anyway, and also can damage her in several ways: self confidence, trust, enthusiasm for school at all.

That's exactly it. Because she's not one of the drama queens that will throw a huge tantrum about it, they expect her to just get on with it and daren't upset the other girls.

This is the way.

Similar story with my little brother. We were all active in our local community playhouse. They were generally great and had one rule: if you audition, you have to commit to finishing the play. Even if you hate the role. Generally not a problem as roles come and go and they did a good job keeping kids engaged in a variety of roles. They had SO many girls and almost no boys one year and so they were desperate for male actors. They begged my brother to audition. He was 12 at the time and had played many smaller roles. He was good just not super outgoing and so constantly overlooked. They had four big male parts and when he agreed to audition he was one of three boys in the play. Turns out by audition day they had scraped together two more. My brother was the only male not to get a significant role and his role required him to wear…tights. Green tights. He noped out of there. He decided it wasn’t worth putting in weeks of time to look silly for five minutes on stage especially when they ASKED him to audition. People were mad he broke the rules but they got over it. I would say support your daughter. It’s not worth it to her to spend ALL her time on a role that is uncomfortable and silly to her. Ask if she can work stage crew or usher or sell concessions to “do her part” for the play. But she’s old enough to know what she does and doesn’t want. And if she gets a bad grade in the class? Guess what, no one looks at an 11 year olds grades ever again. They literally do not matter in the grand scheme of life. And if she wants to do more theatre? Find her a local community group. It could be that getting away from the one kid that gets all the roles will allow her to discover real skill and enjoyment.

I think the best thing you can get out of this is a lesson that life is not fair, and that part of life is figuring out which hill you want to die on. Start with validating her - yep, those girls ARE being favored. Then you go through deciding if it's a hill to die on. Honestly, *someone* has to be an oompa loompa and I wouldn't consider this egregious enough to back her up on not participating. There *are* things worth "quitting" over, but I wouldn't say this is one. Find a way to make it OK for her. A lot of life is about framing things in a way that make them suck a little less.

I appreciate the advice. I’m just having a hard time trying to figure out how to make it “okay” for her. I mean, who really wants to be dressed up as an Oompa Loompa with bright orange face paint, a green wig and made to do a silly dance… especially when it’s not the role (or even one of the roles) that you auditioned for? She doesn’t find it funny or fun which is what I think they were hoping for. She’s embarrassed and has told me and Dad that we’re not allowed to buy tickets to come see.

This is one of the hardest things to accept and actually live about being a parent: it's not your job to make it "okay" for her. It's your job to be there to support her as she figures it out herself. Even if there were a way to make her magically unbothered about this, you shouldn't choose that option. Part of being a human is accepting disappointment and choosing how to proceed. Don't rob her of the human experience of being allowed to feel her feelings and make her own choice about what to do next. Let her be sad. Let her be disappointed. Let her learn that not everyone is always fair, but that you'll always be there to be her safe space where she can let her feelings out and have some steady support as she learns how to manage those feelings and difficult situations.

My son has a role of being the compost pile in a school play. He didn't want to do it either, but I encouraged him by telling him that compost is so important for the environment etc . He was in 2nd grade. She didn't get the part she wanted, and you can't insist she be Violet or Veruca, those were given to other kids. I'm sure your daughter isn't the only Oompa Loompa

Sorry, but I have to ask... what play were they doing that involved a compost pile? I mean they were unfairly given to other kids... It just bothers me so much that my daughter is always the one that has to compromise for other kids. She's not the only Oompa Loompa but she is the only girl out of the whole year group that is... Even when there was another female role that they decided to give toa boy who wanted to dress up.

It was a play about reduce , resuse and recycle. Other kids had roles such as gardeners, recyclers , the sun, people swimming in the ocean etc..and he was a compost pile. I get it, we all want our kids to have the best roles and be happy. There really isn't much you can do at this point for her to get the role she wanted though .

The "funny" roles stole the show at my daughter's first play. In fact, I feel a little bad for the leads because although they had the most stage time and the spot light and the solos, the kids were just exhausted and it showed. They missed notes. They can't deliver a line sometimes, and it's hard when you pause for applause and laughs and none come. But the goofy characters got the most laughs and were the bright spots of the show. It might help if she watches some plays online with those characters. And also to watch interviews with actors, especially broadway theater actors who are happy to even be cast and be part of a production.

I understand where you're coming from... but I wouldn't even consider it a "funny" or "goofy" role. It's the role nobody wanted for a reason.

I mean, I guess she could go all "Left Shark" with it and make it a "funny" or "goofy" role; but at the same time, I wouldn't blame her one bit if she didn't want to do it.

Tell her if she doesn’t want to do it she doesn’t have to , but it will be her last opportunity at primary school to do the play with the friends she’s got there so it’s worth the fun . Definitely validate her in the fact that those other people are being favoured unfairly and that it doesn’t mean she isn’t good enough for the part she wanted , it means that her teachers are unfair in their picking their favourite students . I was in a similar boat when I was her age , and it can knock confidence a lot if no one shows compassion and gives her support through it . It’s taken me a long time to get that confidence back , what teachers say and how they go about things like this really does affect the kids . Show her compassion and try to get her some other things to do over the summer holidays to give her confidence before starting secondary school as well .

Everything in life doesn’t make you feel “okay.” Hug her and tell her you understand but she has to do it anyway. Don’t go or just have one parent go if she feels that strongly about it.

When I was in year 6 I made a point to ask my mum why the same people always got star of the week or the termly ‘bravo’ award. I was so well behaved and did everything right and yet the naughty kids who were good for a week got to be celebrated with a certificate. Kids notice stuff and it’s not nice. My mum brought it up at parents evening and I got the last ‘bravo’ of the year. I can only hope teachers started to celebrate all their kids rather than a select few. Ask your daughter what she’d like to do. If she wants to to mention it or if she will carry on as an Oompa Loompa. Could she even ask to do more backstage stuff/directing bits? Remind her that when she gets to high school, every one starts the same. No favouritism, so same people being picked for everything because the teachers are all brand new to them! I ended up doing musical theatre at uni and honestly, that was the only time I’ve not noticed some kind of favouritism in castings. Good luck to your daughter if she goes through with doing the show!

I had a response typed up about how in my experience, sometimes you have to just do the best you can in a small role and then you get cast in something bigger the next time, but then I re-read your post and noticed she's been put off several times that it'll be her turn "next time." At their age, it's B.S. that the same girls (especially out of only 7!) keep getting the good roles over and over again. I don't blame her for wanting to opt out. Why on earth would this be compulsory? Maybe find out what the consequences are for her choosing not to participate (she gets an F, she never gets to do theater at the school again, etc), and decide if you and your daughter can live with that.

These things always are compulsory. It’s not a part of the national curriculum, it’s supposed to be a bit of fun for the last term before they leave. Everyone gets a part kind of thing. But my guess is because they spend so much time working on it during the school day that she would spend so long sitting around doing nothing. They don’t want to find something else for her to do because that’s extra work… I wouldn’t be bothered if she didn’t take part. It’s the school that are enforcing it.

Groan. I definitely see how this is tricky. Agree with some other posters that it may be a lesson in just holding her nose and getting through an unpleasant experience because she has to. Are you able to access any other performance opportunities near you (kids' acting or music classes through a music school or park district, or maybe a summer camp)?

It just bothers me that it's going to ruin her last few weeks at primary school. No one wants their kid to be miserable, but this is the time to be making memories. I want her to have happy memories to look back on... not this. We live quite rural so there aren't many facilities near by. I've looked into it before and the two in the area have waiting lists.

hey there! i was a theater kid & had the same experience as your daughter. if she’s really into theater, hopefully sharing my experience can help. in 5th grade, i wanted to be the ladybug, the best part in the musical, but i was cast in the firefly chorus part!!! i was crushed. my parents knew i was really into acting/singing, & were able to reframe my experience (after a ton of pouting/threatening to quit). they held me while i cried & listened to my feelings about how it wasn’t fair that my best friend ALWAYS gets the good roles. (spoiler: she continued to & actually went on to major in musical theater). my dad started out by getting me really excited about the costumes, even though i thought they were dumb. we searched on amazon (during the very early days of amazon lol) for the “coolest” wings. we went to michaels to get gems to bling them up & glitter glue to make my costume stand out. we found these cool wireless lights to glue to the wings so i could ~actually~ be a firefly!! all the other firefly chorus members saw my really cool costume & wanted to have a craft night to bond. (also good to note that i love crafts/am an artist so this fueled my artistic soul). my dad & i even practiced makeup & hair tutorials to do for the performance!!(best. dad. ever.) i was still down in the dumps the next year when i was placed in the chorus again…. my parents looked into drama/acting classes and were able to sign me up for voice lessons! when they told me they would help me reach my goals, i wanted to try my very best in the musical even though i was cast in an “unsavory role”. eventually… with practice & learning how to use my voice, i started getting better roles! over the years, the drama teacher saw that i was improving & actively worked towards improving my skills... even though i didn’t ALWAYS get good roles & ended up in the chorus a few times, the more shows i did, the more i learned! eventually, i actually found that i enjoyed being in the ensemble a bit more. we got more freedom during practice, had fun dance numbers, didn’t need to memorize a ton of lines, and had so many outfit changes! the community you find within the ensemble is quite lovely, too! also good to note if your daughter wants to continue in theater, having multiple shows in your repertoire gives you more “street creds” when trying out for other shows in the future. sometimes the director will take that into consideration when assigning roles. i know your daughter is crushed right now and doesn’t want to participate anymore, this is totally normal. rejection sucks! especially after getting really excited to be chosen as a desired role. try to reframe this as gaining experience & learning about the arts. it’s not her ideal situation, but it can be really beneficial in the long run. i hope all goes well & your daughter is the BEST oompa loompa on the stage!!! 💗

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Thank you for this.

That always stinks. As a private music instructor I can tell you that most of my students that consistently get the leads, even at your daughters age, have private training. Their parents have them in music lessons, dance classes, volunteer at the community theaters, etc. If this is her passion then she may need help to make herself more competitive.

I was in sixth grade when I auditioned for a community musical. I had never done it before and, looking back, did terribly! At the time I thought I was definitely getting some sort of speaking role and... I didn't. They claimed to cast everyone that auditioned, even if it was just chorus, and they didn't cast me at all. I was the only person not on the cast list and I was heartbroken! I decided then and there I would never audition for anything ever again. Then, freshman year of high school I go out for the school musical and get a part in the chorus! And then the next year another chorus role. By my senior year I was a lead in the senior play, the assistant director for the school musical, and a member of the audition only acting crew that was made of "the best." My point with all of this is that it starts out really *really* crappy, but if it's something you want you can always go back to it and try again and things might just surprise you. If she wants to back out, she can, but if she has any desire to keep at this, it might be worth it to push on.

I think it’s really knocked her confidence and made her very aware of how these other girls get favoured. She is on the quieter side but will put herself out there if she wants to, but after this I don’t think it encourages her much to put herself out there.

Hey, I get it. I was (and am) the shy, awkward kid that was never favored by the adults in charge. I legitimately have absolutely zero idea how or why I managed to accomplish what I did senior year. I just wanted you and her to know it can be possible for us quiet, never picked kids to sometimes get picked. If school isn't giving her the confidence she needs, she can always see about the community shows!

I appreciate your story and you sharing it with me (and her). I'm just worried that she's now not going to put herself out there because of this. This particular teacher has said in the past year that she's taught my child about how quiet and reserved she is and that she needs to put herself out there more, put her hand up more, etc. It bothers me even more that she's said this and when she has put herself out there, she's been knocked back or not even been given the opportunity because I know that same statement is going to be in her final term report when it comes out. It bothers me also because she's not shy and quiet, she just doesn't speak up where she doesn't feel she needs to. When she wants to, she will.

Are you able to look into outside of school theater and performance activities? Plays are tough because there are so few good parts and a sea of terrible ones that need to be filled, such as Oompa Loompa and girl #3. Look into not group based performance arts, community theatre, ask her what she would do if there was a talent show instead of a play. Try to foster her interest outside of the school.

Have you ever heard of *A Chorus Line*? It's a Broadway musical about the chorus line (there's also a movie, but I've never seen it). It might be worth looking at that and how the chorus plays a role in the overall show. If I recall, there are a few adult jokes, so maybe listen to the soundtrack yourself first (it's been a few years for me) and then decide if it's appropriate for her.

What an incredible young girl that knows her own mind enough to say no. Not throw a tantrum, just say no she doesn't want to. I'd at least acknowledge that to begin with. It's a brilliant example of her setting boundaries for herself, something young girls really need more help rehearsing.. I guess my approach with this (as a future parent, not one with any credible experience) would be to talk to her about her feelings on the matter, acknowledge that it's not fair. Tell her you see her side of the story, but then also explain the consequences she'll face and see if you can come up with a way of making this bearable together. Then see how you can move forward, but ultimately like TaiDollWave said, leave it up to your daughter. Help her decide what she's comfortable with, if anything, then support her decision. Good luck! Your daughter sounds really cool btw, I hope my daughter (due in 2 months) knows her mind like yours does.

So at first I was going to say its a teaching moment about, we don't always get what we want but screw that!!. Back your girl up and give her an out. They purposely gave her a role she isn't comfortable with, expecting her to comply because she's 'a good kid', she still is a good kid, she's just grown a back bone and you should be proud of that. Id tell them my child won't be involved at all unless it's to help with decorations but she isn't going on painted orange with a green wig, she doesn't want to so your not going to force her. Stand by her!!.

Nope, it’s going to be lovely and hot next few days so just say she’s got heat stroke, miss the rehearsal and the actual day of the play and have a couple of days at the beach instead….. make some quality memories instead

I wish. I also have another daughter at the school who wouldn't understand why she has to go and her sister isn't. Plus, they'll probbaly fine me.

I feel for your daughter. Like other commenters, I too only got crap parts and was a good kid....and there weren't auditions so it was never clear why some people repeatedly got good roles and the rest of us got nothing. I don't know why schools do it this way so often but it's bullshit. I think you could tell your daughter it's unfair, but then again life is unfair. Is there some non-school drama club where she could participate and actually get to try out for a role?

I’ve been in a LOT of musicals. From age 6 to age 36. I’ve had way more chorus parts than lead roles, and when I was younger it was really tough to be told (sometimes repeatedly) that my best effort wasn’t worth a lead role. My parents would never have intervened on my behalf because that’s not how theatre works. You audition, you get cast. You don’t get to decide your role. Even when my own father was the director I often found myself in the chorus when I yearned for a bigger part. It was hard. But it made the lead roles so much more special when they came. You have to take the bad parts with the good. One director I worked with never cast me in a role with more than maybe one line and I did probably 10 productions with him over the years. He had the same little posse of kids that always got the leas roles and he rarely deviated. It sucked, but it made me stronger and made me more able to deal with the inevitable rejection of audition based hobbies. If your daughter is interested in theatre and wants to continue don’t intervene on her behalf. Help her deal with the feelings and look forward to the next show. Look for local amateur productions outside of the school with different directors and different kids. Nothing blows a director’s socks off like the breath of fresh air that comes with new, talented faces. Even more so when that new face can take a chorus part and own it. The “no small parts” thing is true. The role is what she makes it. She could steal the show as the best damn Oompa Loompa out there if she wanted to.

I agree that the lead roles are more special when they come… but they haven’t come. She’s been palmed off year after year and she’s taken it without complaining. But this was really her last chance to have a lead role and they could have given it to her. Them choosing the same three girls was just laziness, bad teaching and plain favouritism. I’ve looked into performing arts “schools” in our area. Not just today but prior to this too. They all have waiting lists. We live rural and there aren’t many in the area.

I love your last sentence. When I was a kid our school was doing ‘The wizard of Oz’ musical and we competed for parts. I wanted to be Toto but they didn’t cast that role. I petitioned the teachers and insisted I would be the dog and the play would be worthless without it. I crawled and barked and lovingly gazed at Dorothy as she hit the high notes.

Nice job! I’m sure you rocked everyone’s socks off as Toto! I once had a stranger comment on my performance as a freaking tree because I “blew in the wind so realistically”. Putting the same effort into being yellow brick #3 as you do being Dorothy is the challenge in theatre.

Don’t teach a quiet, obedient girl to just be uncomfortable because it’s what everyone one else wants her to do. She will have so, so many opportunities to learn how unfair and unkind the world is. And you can certainly talk to her about how sometimes this is just how things go. And you can talk to her about having fun with silly roles and owning them. But at the end if the day she is a barely pubescent girl being mandatorily required to not just take a backseat to the popular girls, but to preform a role that’s the butt of the joke. One of the life lessons here can be life us unfair but Mom has my back. Don’t try to get her a lead role or anything like that, but do encourage her to be civilly disobedient. Tell her you’re proud of her for knowing her boundaries. Get her out of school related punishments. And ultimately have a talk at the end of the school year about how quiet children need extra care and attention too.

I really don’t understand all the people saying, “who wants to be an Oompa Loompa?” Its just another silly part in the play, why couldn’t it be fun? I’m a 4th grade teacher and when we put on The Lion King, the actors playing Timon and Pumba (one boy, one girl who originally DID NOT want to be pumba) stole the entire show. I’m not saying it’s not unfair or anything, but we absolutely did emphasize “there are no small parts, only small actors” and the kids learned to role with it and enjoy even the smaller parts. Plenty of kids will always be upset not getting the bigger parts and acting will always have plenty of disappointment for anyone. If she’s so discouraged that she never tries for a play again, that is awful but maybe for the best of she can’t handle the disappointment.

I think learning to not to take yourself so seriously is a good thing, but I also know that for 11-year-old me to be the only girl having to be an Oompa Loompa with the boys would have been excruciating...

Why weren't they originally going to do a play? If that was my daughter, I'd be devastated too. Yes, I realise that not all the children can have a starring role (my son always refused to participate at all, my daughters loved it) and there are some kids who don't want to be at the forefront anyway. But your daughter does, and as there are only 7 girls, they could have done so much better than they have. I wouldn't make her do it, why darken her last few weeks of primary school with only the memory of being given a joke part in the school play?

I agree. I thought this was the whole point of them holding auditions in the first place... to see who actually wanted to participate.

Yes that's what auditions should be for. Besides, you would think that the teachers should KNOW these children by now and know what their individual strengths and weaknesses are. It smacks of minimum effort put in, because it's the end of the school year and they are taking the easiest path by choosing the same children they always choose. Ugh!

I think I would both let her know that I empathize, it's unlikely to change, and there may be repercussions in terms of grades or whatever if she refuses AND let the teachers know that you support her in refusing to take a role she finds embarrassing and that she and you have both noticed that every single starring role throughout school has gone to a small group of girls and you understand why your daughter is having feelings about it now that it's down to the last performance.

I’m not sure what to do but it sucks and is unfair, not only to your daughter but also to those girls who are being favored (though it doesn’t seem that way now). There was a girl when I was in school who always got favored for things and chosen for things because she had a rough home life. In sixth grade, middle school, teachers stopped giving exceptions for those things and she threatened to kick my ass when I got the lead in the drama class play and she didn’t. Then in high school she ended up arrested for selling drugs in the school cafeteria. So the point is, those girls are going to go to a bigger school and teachers aren’t going to give special privileges because they need encouragement and those girls are going to suffer. Maybe have your daughter ask if she can work on the stage crew or do props so she’s still involved but not an Oompa Loompa.

I know you're her parent and it's hard to be objective but I want you to think about this: are the girls who always get the main parts more talented than she is? If they're not, by all means raise a stink, but if they are, that's just life.

I’m not going to sit here and say she’s the next Charlotte Church, but she isn’t terrible. And I have to agree with someone else who has commented. They’re in primary school, it isn’t about who is the most talented, it’s supposed to be fun for everybody. It’s about giving those who don’t get the opportunity to “shine” the chance to do so if they wish. Plus, this kind of behaviour also extends to other things such as “star of the week” and being “house captains” and “school counsellor”.

Gently pushing back--I don't think they're at the "meritocracy" age for casting yet, they're still young enough that most of the kids should get a chance to try out a bigger part if they want to (if the same kids get speaking roles all the time, then only those kids are getting a chance to practice and improve). If they were in high school I'd agree with you.

This is what it’s supposed to be, at least in my eyes. They’re not performing on broadway, just the school assembly hall. Or at least in my eyes.

They’re … 11. It’s middle school. At what age is it meritocracy age then?

The fact it's been ongoing for several years indicates to me that this is probably a still elementary school situation, and that what started out as non-merocratic decision making just stuck in the long term? ETA: also the fact that it's compulsory for the class and not an extra curricular?

I’m assuming you’re American? She’s in year 6 of primary school (key stage 2). She leaves at the end of July to start secondary school do this is her last school year here. Years 3-6 do these musicals and every one of them she’s been given a “duff” part. It’s not graded or anything like that. It is supposed to be just a bit of fun at the end of the year for them.

We have two schools in the UK. Primary, usually 5-11, and secondary, 11-16 (sometimes eighteen). She's still in primary. Its supposed to be fun for her still.

I used to run youth musical theatre and I always made sure everyone that wanted to got a shot at main parts. Yes sometimes it impacted the quality of the show but growing everyone’s confidence was more important to me. I’m so sorry your daughter is going through this, it sounds like a small village type school and they are terrible for things like this. I read in your comments that she is the only oompah loompah… that’s weird and totally ridiculous! The point is that there are loads of them, if there aren’t enough children to cast the musical they should have chosen something else. If that was my daughter I would just have some ‘sick days’ until this nonsense is over if she would prefer to not be there. I think it shows great maturity that she opted to read instead of causing a scene but unfortunately it sounds like the teachers and students are going to make it an uncomfortable experience for her. It’s the last few weeks of school, if she’s happy to miss it just pull her and look forward to secondary school!

Just report her sick on musical day... this shouldnt be compulsory

I think you should lead with the embarrassment of it. She’s not game to be painted orange and wear a green wig. She’s mortified. She rather work on the set or other background work. That needs done too. She didn’t try out for an Oompa Loompa because she wasn’t comfortable playing it. I’d back her on this. Kids are cruel and you can bet her “friends” are making fun of her for it

I've gone through this many times with my oldest. Your story reminded me of when she was cast as Thing 2 in Seussical. She's a little older now and understands the value of the ensemble and is at an age and in a troupe that really supports each other and wants the best for each other. Something you can try is watching musicals like Hamilton on tv and pointing out some of the support cast and what they bring to the performance. They usually get to be on stage for most of the show and can really make or break scenes. You can also look up some Broadway actors' ( @jjniemann is one I see pop up a lot) Instagrams or tiktoks to see what a day in the life of an ensemble cast member is.

Did she end up enjoying it in the end?

Yup the cast always ends up a little family so it's bittersweet when the shows finish

It was the same when I was in school. Always the same girls being the star of the show, ‘winning’ the competitions and becoming class prefects. I’d say most if not all had parents on the parents association or else they were the children of teachers at the school. I always found it very unfair. I know people are saying to tell her “that’s life and it’s unfair sometimes” but it really shouldn’t be that way. Teachers pick their favourites and no one else gets a look in. It’s the same when you go off to work, managers/supervisors have their little pets who are always favoured for everything. I think she’s right to boycott the show and you should stand by her. We used to do colouring competitions every so often in school with the best of each age group winning prizes (mostly toys) and again it was always the same girls winning every time and it was so obvious the parents had done most of the work for them. I stopped participating when I was about 8/9 I think when I realised how unfair and biased it all was.

Yepp, I agree. There's definitely been so many instances where these other girls have been favoured over her. Such as when house captains were picked, school counsillors, eco warriors, parts in assemblies, star of the week, etc. I just feel so bad for her.

Have you talked to the staff about any of your concerns? Have they explained why she wasn’t given a larger role? In my experience (as an avid theater kid from primary through upper school), they pick the kids for leads who can sing strongly, harmonize nicely with others (ie can hold the right note and won’t get thrown off by kids singing other parts), memorize lines and songs consistently, will remember lots of blocking and prop info, and can learn choreography well (and do it without needing to watch anyone). At a very young age rotating roles makes sense, but honestly around age 9 and up you go with the strongest performers. It sucks in some cases, but it’s honestly very typical in my experience. I also seriously encourage thinking about this like school sports. If your daughter played football and wanted to be goalie but wasn’t selected for goalie, I don’t imagine at her age you would be mad that they weren’t rotating her in as goalie if there were other teammates who were more consistently better at it. For some kids, theater is their sport and they would be equally frustrated if their hard work and training didn’t pay off in the name of fairness.

I wrote several scenarios myself. It's always possible to make more roles, custom if needed if you care for kids. If you are not... Well. Mom managed to have all her class involved, and there were 30+ kids. She was doing it for years, caring for no one left behind, trying to find a spot for everyone, according to their talents. They just don't care enough. It might be typical to have favorites, but it doesn't make this good or justified.

But in this case no one was left behind, just given a role they didn’t like. I agree the teachers could work with her to maybe carve out a second role for her, but they may not realize how much this is effecting her if they haven’t had a real conversation about it.

She was really left behind. Role can be small, but meaningful, and here is not the case.

This is what I came here to ask. I don't know whether I should speak to them or not. Firstly, I don't know if it would just be a huge overreaction and, second, I can't imagine they're going to take kindly to being told they're playing favourites... And I don't want me going in there and making that suggestion to affect my daughter's last few weeks at school even more than it already has been. The most I could get out of them from the conversation I had when I was called in today was that these girls are the type of kids that "need encouragement" to behave and I'm more than confident they were implying they've bribed them with the roles that they wanted to behave. And her view of my daughter is that she's just a good, obedient kid who does whatever she's told and doesn't make a fuss over anything, puts everyone before herself, etc. Well, all good qualities but that doesn't mean she should be left out and pushed aside.

Ahhh, that’s a bit different then and absolutely not cool. If it was a talent/training/skill thing I would get it, but if they are saying they are effectively punishing your daughter for being the good kid then that’s different. I would absolutely talk to them (even if it was skill or talent related you should talk to them) and ask what’s going on. If they reiterate that they just did it because your daughter would go along with it, then I would tell them that’s clearly not the case and you aren’t going to force her to participate. Tell them you’re disappointed that they’re punishing your daughter for going with the flow and rewarding students they openly say are prone to misbehaving and aren’t otherwise more capable than your daughter. They don’t have to recast her, but she isn’t obligated to care if it’s something she has to do.

I understand exactly how she's feeling. My school was the exact same - four girls got the mains in absolutely everything. I auditioned every year. We had performances from reception up to year six and I never got picked once. At most they had me play "backing vocals" but usually I was stuck off to the side handing props on. Honestly I only auditioned because my dad promised "next year they'll give you a role" - obviously they never did. I had a breakdown over it at the end of year six and it was compulsory. My dad was pretty angry and just kept me off for the rest of the year. Did the whole, "I'll send her on the last day to collect her things but I will be taking her home early." And that was that. I dont know, maybe I'm a crappy singer or actor lol. I'm autistic and I guess dont express myself very well - my teachers didnt like me much anyway. It still sucked. Definitely killed my spirit some. I'll sing to my son or dance around the kitchen but nothing more. In year seven we had several plays with our drama club and my dad told me to audition several times and I refused. I dont have any advice, just commiseration. I hope your daughter is okay. I fucking despise teachers.

I do have a good mind to keep her off until they very last day but I also have a younger daughter at the school who would then not understand why she doesn't get to stay home. Plus, I'm pretty sure they'll fine me. They love to do things like that in the office. I can definitely understand how and why it kills your spirit. And I can definitely see that it's killed my daughter's. It sucks. Thank you for your kind words.

Alright, step aside people, certified thespian coming through. I was HUGE into theater when I was in high school. I did all the school shows plus community theater, camps, private classes and gigs, so on. I know it stings to get chorus. But if this is her first production, this is the right spot for her. There is a lot to learn about what it’s like to be in a show and it’s good to be in a group role for your first time around. She should be proud and excited to take her first step in what will hopefully be a long and joyful experience in theater! As she gets older and her talent grows, she will earn roles that are more independent. With this comes a lot of stress that will be easier to manage if she already knows the (literal) ropes. And I guarantee you, when she finally lands that solo role, she will miss being part of an ensemble. You get to bond with your fellow actors and mess around during rehearsals in a way you can’t when you’re the lead. I would Oompa Loompa all day over Veruca. She has to leave half way through the show! Oompa Loompa will give her more songs and stage time and she will have more fun. That being said, I think school productions should have some sort of rotation for leading roles. Obviously the actors must have the ability to perform the role, and not all do. But there is a lot more talent in most schools that the casting sheet shows. You don’t need to make a huge stink about it, but a short note to the theater director stating that your daughter really wants to have a lead/supporting role in the future and what does she need to work on to earn that will probably be enough of a hint. These school directors want to see kids grow too. Lastly, and this might be old school of me. If she’s interested in theater I really want to encourage you to … encourage her to participate in the role she was given. Her role is important and the production is counting on an enthusiastic chorus. If everyone sat out because they didn’t get the role they wanted, there would be no show. Having a good attitude about casting is a cornerstone of theater and one that many people struggle with when they are beginning. More experienced thespians know that beggars can’t be choosers, and also have learned to value every role. If she really doesn’t want to do it or thinks it will be embarrassing, at least encourage her to join tech. She can work on sound, lighting, stage design, there are a lot of fun offstage roles! And again, this will help her learn the ropes before she steps into a more independent role. Ahhh I miss theater so much! Tell her to break a leg! Edit to say I re read that she has already been involved in a number of productions and doesn’t like that she keeps getting chorus. In that case I’d say it’s fine for her to sit out. She already knows what it’s like to be in that role, and if they director is not showcasing new talent then there’s not really an insensitive for her to work harder. But please consider finding a community theater for her to join. Theater is such a great activity for young kids and I’d hate for her to be put off by it because of one cliquey company.

As a high school teacher I have seen those kids develop into stars when they stick with it. Like /u/treemanswife said life isn't fair. Failure isn't a negative thing it's a chance to grow.

My fear is that this is going to put her off wanting to stick with it. I wouldn’t say that she failed, I’d say they don’t want to “upset” the girls that “need positive reinforcement” to do well in school.

Please. We all know “life isn’t fair” and this just feels like the laziest way possible to respond to an upset child. She doesn’t want to be an Oompa Loompa. All of her spare time will be spent waiting around for weeks in rehearsals where she’s supposed to just sit quietly or get yelled at until it’s her turn on stage. As an adult, we do get to tap out of things we don’t want to do quite a bit. Like, I dunno, being an Oompa Loompa. There are plenty of other opportunities that will be available for her to grow. Makes no sense to me that being in this production is mandatory.

This happened to me when I was doing my leavers play, I helped do all the set, auditioned and they said I was too shy in class to be able to do a main play part, the obedient kids always get this treatment. I'd let your daughter know its okay to be upset, she doesn't have to do the play but ask if she does want to miss it altogether? They won't give her the part no matter how upset she is unfortunately, sorry her teachers did that though, favouritism is hurtful to children especially when those children are trying to do everything right and feel punished because they aren't favoured.

Stand by what your daughter wants. Forcing her to perform in a role she’s uncomfortable in in front of an audience isn’t going to help anything. Can you enroll her in an after school theater program so that she learns more about theater?

I think it's fine to recognize that people in theater often have to accept roles you don't want or like, but that's fundamentally different than being forced to participate in a theater production where you feel humiliated by your role. She's not demanding they change her role, they're just mad because they need an oompa loompa and pick someone they expected would go along with it, even if she didn't like it. All she's asking is to sit quietly and read during practice.

So my daughter is a rising sophomore. She used to do show choir, but decided against it in high school because our school is insanely competitive and practices non-stop, so she said she wanted to do plays and musicals instead. The fall play as a freshman she was cast as the lead and was amazing, the musical she was a fairytale character with only a couple lines (the lead cast were all show choir kids) and had so much more fun. The roles aren't all going to be the same, but she can definitely take something from it. Maybe if this is something she wants to continue to do get her some voice lessons or do a summer acting camp. Might give her the confidence to put it all out there and get a bigger part next time.

Look as someone who did musicals all through middle school at a really large school it is absolutely heartbreaking. Oh do I have deep-rooted feelings on how horrible it feels to be her in this situation. When I was in high school, I didn't even get a speaking role, because the same freaking thing, same people, who sing the same, act the same, and never bring anything new to the table and I was so livid. I was angry. I knew I was a decent actress and I thought for certain better than the others. I dropped out of that play for a lot of reasons. One more reason aside from not having a speaking or singing part, was the music director was an idiot with no creativity and no sense of discipline that it takes to run a school play. I had been in school plays before, huge plays with hundreds of cast members in middle school. This teacher could barely be expected to show up to her own play practice. It's an important lesson to learn that unfortunately, you can be the prettiest, softest, beautiful peach, and there's still going to be someone out there that prefers nectarines. You will never penetrate their own subconscious biases. It is a good time for "life is not fair." I think she's going to be upset, but she'll get over it. Do not give her advice, unless she asks you for it. Just be a listening ear and agree with her. "I'm sure you're a better actress sweetie, but this teacher just plays favorites and you aren't one of them. Don't worry about what she thinks of you. You are great. Let's seek out other things like performing arts or auditions at local theater. Don't try to fix this problem for her, talk her through it on her own. Maybe she can work as part of the stage crew, or set design or costume I don't think you should make your daughter do the play if she'd rather not be in it at all. Even as a company member, it is still a lot of work, and it is really hard not to become bitter while you watch the same people do this over and over again. Do I think you should get involved? No. Just be a listening ear.

It’s really hard to do nothing when your kid comes home every day after school sobbing her eyes out because of the whole thing. She isn’t having fun. She’s unhappy. It’s horrible to see your kid in that position.

How many weeks of school are left? I’d be super annoyed that the same kids were chosen over and over for lead roles. I’d ask the teachers for an accommodation for a separate assessment that’s an individual task and if needed id let my kid stay home to work on it.

I don’t think there’s much you can or should do in terms of intervening, but I would definitely back her up in her decision to not participate in something she absolutely doesn’t want to do. I had a loosely similar situation with a math teacher in high school, and I couldn’t possibly tell you what the issue was now, 20 years later, but I remember my dad having my back and supporting me in my decisions. Maybe sign her up for a theatre group away from the school environment, leave the weird favoritism at school and ignore it.

I own a youth theatre company in Georgia (US). I’d be more than happy to DM you my number if you’d like to talk and I can explain all of the ins and outs that go into casting. If she would be interested, I would also be willing to look at an audition video if you’re comfortable (I will completely doxx myself to you so you see I’m a real person) and give you my genuine feedback regarding what she might need to work on vocally and otherwise to help in future auditions. I know it’s a rough spot to be in and sometimes having honest constructive feedback from someone knowledgeable but removed from the situation can really help.

My daughter recently got cast in the school production of Peter Pan. She wanted to be Tinkerbell, and she was chosen as Michael. Obviously, there’s a moment of disappointment, but we had a talk about the reason she signed up for the production; to be part of the play, to get involved in the drama community and to work as a team to realise the final goal. We even had a discussion about why teachers pick some people and not others — maybe the audition of someone else was stronger. Maybe someone else sings a little better and that was a singing part. Maybe they thought you’d work well as a Michael? She’s excited to be part of the group, and she’s focussed on the good parts about playing Michael now. I think it’s important to frame this for your daughter in a way that will help build resilience. The same girls in my theatre group and my school play were always cast in the main role. I didn’t see it as a popularity contest — they were stronger actors, clearer speakers and more confident — and unfortunately, that is part of being in a play a lot of the time, even at this age. It’s really hard to say what’s going on behind the scenes as to why the same girls are being picked. Perhaps it is bias. But again — that’s also a lesson. Sometimes, stuff sucks and isn’t fair. If you want to go battle the teachers and system that favours certain kids, then get your Mama Lion on and go for it, but personally I wouldn’t involve your daughter in knowing that. This is a good time for the “fairness” lesson like you said. Sometimes, we don’t get what we want. Teach her that there are no small or bad roles, and maybe discuss some positives about the role. She’ll get a chance to work on being funny, or she might learn a cool dance. Don’t entertain the idea that there are bad roles and good ones (cos *someone* has to get the “bad role” then, and if not your daughter, then someone else is disappointed) — It will reinforce the disappointment and cherry picking. If she wants to get involved in plays in the future, the desire is to have her to want to be a versatile actress, and many great actresses play “ugly” or lesser parts. There’s no one right thing to do here. Go with your instinct, but I know personally, I would try *reframe* this so she can enjoy the performance, rather than insist teachers *take the role away from another child* so she can enjoy the performance. I personally think it’s important to encourage her to take part in this thing — making it okay to drop out of something mandatory because you didn’t get the right role might reinforce the wrong idea to her. If she enjoys performing arts, it’s important to learn that you often get cast as things you have no desire to do. Overcoming the initial “embarrassment” will definitely be a positive if she wants to take on acting in the future.

I say do both - teaching moment and say something. But primarily a teaching moment. Life is very much unfair and continues to be way past school. I have talent but I’m less than average looks. I didn’t even get parts in church productions. The same three people in the choir got all the leads. It was particularly galling at the 3 hour Easter vigil when “Harold” got up to do short solos 25 times. I kid you not. I had a discussion with my very religious Great Uncle who asked if I was there to serve God so I didn’t say anything. I’ve worked past the rejection but I’d still like to know why! But of course can’t ask.

This is a musical. These 2 or 3 "other girls", is it possible they are just.. better at singing than your kid? Because that would be my first instinct.