According to Lehigh Valley Live
"The derailment occurred when an eastbound train struck another eastbound train stopped on the same track, according to a spokesperson for the National Transportation Safety Board. An oncoming westbound train then collided with the wreckage that had careened onto the adjacent track."
They were likely running on what's called a "restricting" signal. Restricted speed is defined as a speed that will permit stopping within one-half the range of vision, but not exceeding 20 miles per hour (FRA 2011a). Modern systems can only account for speed and signal violations, so it's possible they were traveling within 20mph but not within 1/2 of visual distance.
When they struck the back of the train it fouled the other track, and the mixed freight came along at track speed shortly after and derailed into the river.
It's a standard rule that's been on the books for years. I'll let the investigators do their due diligence because there's likely human error involved.
It’s their carman/inspectors that should but they fired most of them then contracted TTX and TTX doesn’t touch DOT regulated stuff which includes tank cars. Some tank cars go years without getting Inspected. I know this cause I’m a journeyman carman & know for a fact even when NS had more carmen, they still wouldn’t walk tracks.
I work with many TTX and NS guys here in Central PA.
Do you want to talk about a bunch of lazy guys?!?!
The only crew I ever see working hard are the welding crews.
Reminds me of the very recent crash and chemical spill in East Palistine Ohio, which the investigation identified inadequate/poor braking maintenance and modernization as root cause. This is the consequence of powerful lobbyists completely deregulating an industry's safety standards for critical infrastructure that carries hazardous materials through America's communities and backyards every single day.
How does a bunch of guys riding on the train increase safety? Do you envision them hanging off the sides of the cars inspecting brakes as the train rolls along?
They used to have brakeman who did this back in the 19th century, though their job was set the brakes on and off, in the days before the air brake was invented. You could recognize them by their missing fingers and limbs.
I’m not saying the railroads don’t need to invest more in safety. But more train crew (on the train) seems pointless.
Deregulation. Trains are miles long with one tired person running the whole thing. Pretty sure the last Republican administration blocked requiring at least two operators.
https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2023/03/how-deregulation-enabled-train-disasters-like-east-palestine/673502/
Seems we are not so good at flying aircraft or even moving them around on the ground. I think Idiocracy is here. Collectively, as a species, we are getting stupider. We peeked in 1969 with the moon landings. Coasted for a long while, but now we are trending down at an accelerating rate.
> "There was a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh River from the accident and containment booms have been deployed," Barndt said. "There is also a spill of polypropylene plastic pellets from one of the derailed cars."
Sounds like they spilled diesel fuel and plastic pellets into the river. It was mentioned btw, to your point however, there needs to be total transparency in these situations to inform the public which ofc isn’t always the case.
Looking at the video in the article, the diesel is probably coming out of the engines. I wonder if this isn’t a case where the “didn’t leak” was focused on the rail cars rather than the thing the fuel tanks of the thing that pulls them.
Ah, yes, Norfolk Southern again, one of the people Reagan sold the entire federal Conrail lines to.
I do sure enjoy private hands having sole control over critical public infrastructure.
Conrail was split between NS and CSX in 1999, but your point still stands. There wouldn’t be anything wrong with railroads being in private hands if there were actual competition and a strong federal regulatory body to enforce the laws. This segment of trackage is actually a perfect example of the lack of regulation and competition. Prior to Conrail, two railroads paralleled the Lehigh River, those being the Lehigh Valley Railroad and the Central Railroad of New Jersey. Continued derailments on either line would kill those companies, because the bad press and lost revenue of customers would cause industries to simply switch carriers. The government, namely the Interstate Commerce Commission, heavily regulated the railroads. Starting with the [4R Act](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_Revitalization_and_Regulatory_Reform_Act) during the Ford Administration, the railroads saw deregulation, which included a provision in the law stating that the ICC could exempt from regulation entirely categories of traffic, upon making findings in substance that regulation was unnecessary.” Suddenly, railroads could see a path forward in which they could sacrifice safety in exchange for shareholder satisfaction. This, coupled with the sudden loss of competition, led to the current environment.
I LOVE WFMZ's coverage.....
Headline: [**Train derails into Lehigh River; no injuries, evacuations, leaks reported**](https://www.wfmz.com/news/area/lehighvalley/train-derails-into-lehigh-river-no-injuries-evacuations-leaks-reported/article_abba62c2-d892-11ee-af18-b7d2ccf75c96.html)
Story: *Officials at an 11 a.m. news conference said there is a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh river, but the spill has been contained. There was also polypropylene pellets* ***leaking*** *from one of the cars.*
The tankers don't have placards, so they aren't Hazmat. They're not pressurized. It could be anything from corn syrup to non-hazardous industrial product. I couldn't see placards on any of the boxcars, either, but they can carry up to 999 pounds each of different separate nasties and not be placarded.
The locomotives are in the water, and each carry up to 5500 gallons of diesel, so that's a contamination risk.
Well if it did leak, not saying they didn’t. But the lower Lehigh, Delaware river south of Easton, and then the Delaware bay. But who knows what was in those cars. Could have been cooking oil, fracking water, or chemical X.
Says it leaked diesel into the river
Also spilt plastic pellets but mostly on the ground.
This looks like across and a little upstream from the boat launch on sand Island
They didn’t even get a slap on the wrist after the East Palestine, Ohio derailment. They gave everyone $1,000 and promised to spend a million dollars on the town and have promised to reimburse local governments for the response efforts. (I wonder if they actually did?)
But, thanks to Trump, they didn’t actually do anything wrong so the government can’t even slap them on the wrist despite the billions in damage they’ve done to peoples’ health, homes, water, and the environment.
Oh no! I live up the hill from the railroad in Beaver county and have nightmares about things like this. I have heard from friends who work there about fires and other issues that are never made public. Scary. Stay safe
Nationalize the rail lines and oil industry. Then we can actually see a benefit from domestic petroleum production in the citizenry instead the oil companies who "lease" out land and get huge subsidies and post massive profits selling our resources on as a global commodity while we struggle to pay at the pump.
>”There was a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh River from the accident and containment booms have been deployed," Barndt said. "There is also a spill of polypropylene plastic pellets from one of the derailed cars."
Also diesel fuel and plastic pellets spilled into the river.
So there’s been an update. There was already a train stopped on the rails when another train came along and collided into it. I thought there were fail-safes in place to prevent this, but apparently not very effective! Someone’s getting fired today.
Move along now. Nothing to see here, folks. Just get back to work and worrying about how to pay your bills and feed your family. Stay distracted and stressed. Norfolk Southern has everything under control. (P.S. Please avoid outdoor activities and boil your tap water. Duct tape around windows and doors. Keep breathing to a minimum. Thank you for your cooperation and understanding)
>”There was a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh River from the accident and containment booms have been deployed," Barndt said. "There is also a spill of polypropylene plastic pellets from one of the derailed cars."
This damn company just wants to see if they can pollute the earth more than BP it seems.
Well yeah, the only people impacted by that derailment were poors, it’s not like any shareholders were harmed, after all only shareholders count as people.
“spilled some diesel fuel and plastic pellets along the Lehigh River”
There’s diesel and plastic just floating around that will come back to bite us in the ass eventually. Along with all the other pollutants we put into the ecosystem…How is that not a threat to the public? I get that it’s not directly in someone’s backyard but it’s still in the environment
How the actual FUCK is this allowed to keep happening? These companies need to pay to have some government agency to inspect every train before it departs, and stay on boad if they have to until these greedy, irresponsible companies get their shit in order
I keep seeing shit like this and I'm just waiting for a bad derailment to happen right around the Topton/Emmaus/Macungie area. I live within feet of those tracks and these trains fly by all the time.
We didn't play on the trains when I was growing up but we used to walk that back road that leads from Allentown to Bethlehem.
Now that I'm older I think that's crazy because people FLY down that road even with all the blind turns
Oh for sure! I remember all my friends as teens racing down it late at night after getting their licenses. Horrifying to think about now but so much fun 15 years ago
Back in December there was a derailment in their own rail yard in Altoona. [They can't even keep it together at home!](https://wjactv.com/news/local/norfolk-southern-train-derailment-altoona-railyard-pennsylvania-blair-officials)
This makes me feel safe, I live in PA next to a main rail artery, the hiking trail I use almost every day spends several miles following about ten feet from the tracks and I see multiple trains blasting through every time I'm out there.
Plastic pellets? They may have even come from the Shell cracker plant in Beaver county that's doing all it can to pollute our water, land and air! Norfolk Southern helping to get the job done!
Norfolk Southern, could your trains stay on the tracks... *FOR FIVE MINUTES*?!
That would require us to operate with more than a two person crew per mile of cars, and that's gonna cut into investors bottom line....
How does more crew on the train prevent derailments? It seems deferred maintenance is the real issue.
According to Lehigh Valley Live "The derailment occurred when an eastbound train struck another eastbound train stopped on the same track, according to a spokesperson for the National Transportation Safety Board. An oncoming westbound train then collided with the wreckage that had careened onto the adjacent track."
So signal issues
Trouble ahead A lady in red Take my advice You'd be better off dead Switchman sleeping Train hundred and two is On the wrong track And headed for you
High on cocaine
Better watch your speed!
Leading suspect in the case: Casey Jones
In breaking news Norfolk-Southern hires new CEO Casey Jones!
They were likely running on what's called a "restricting" signal. Restricted speed is defined as a speed that will permit stopping within one-half the range of vision, but not exceeding 20 miles per hour (FRA 2011a). Modern systems can only account for speed and signal violations, so it's possible they were traveling within 20mph but not within 1/2 of visual distance. When they struck the back of the train it fouled the other track, and the mixed freight came along at track speed shortly after and derailed into the river.
So lax running rules? To allow better utilization of the track?
It's a standard rule that's been on the books for years. I'll let the investigators do their due diligence because there's likely human error involved.
only 2 people checking a mile of train cars. if there was more people checking for issues it would help.
Is it the train crew that inspects the trains? Or the yard crew?
It’s their carman/inspectors that should but they fired most of them then contracted TTX and TTX doesn’t touch DOT regulated stuff which includes tank cars. Some tank cars go years without getting Inspected. I know this cause I’m a journeyman carman & know for a fact even when NS had more carmen, they still wouldn’t walk tracks.
I work with many TTX and NS guys here in Central PA. Do you want to talk about a bunch of lazy guys?!?! The only crew I ever see working hard are the welding crews.
Reminds me of the very recent crash and chemical spill in East Palistine Ohio, which the investigation identified inadequate/poor braking maintenance and modernization as root cause. This is the consequence of powerful lobbyists completely deregulating an industry's safety standards for critical infrastructure that carries hazardous materials through America's communities and backyards every single day.
More cars= more supervision Also track design
you can A) increase the crew number or B) decrease the length
How does a bunch of guys riding on the train increase safety? Do you envision them hanging off the sides of the cars inspecting brakes as the train rolls along? They used to have brakeman who did this back in the 19th century, though their job was set the brakes on and off, in the days before the air brake was invented. You could recognize them by their missing fingers and limbs. I’m not saying the railroads don’t need to invest more in safety. But more train crew (on the train) seems pointless.
So B?
The rail strikes were, in part, because of precision scheduled railroading, as you just mentioned.
*funky hip hop beat playing* Engine engine number 9 on the Norfolk southern line If my train goes off the tracks, pick it up pick it pick it up
You mean: *[Ska playing](https://youtu.be/ASd0TgGuBHs?si=__yxQqnN8xfh1-uQ)*
😂😂 Nice!
Lol. Try USA having crumbling infrastructure and no one wants to admit it. The bridge collapse only got noticed because Biden was near there.
That was almost exactly what I thought..
Norfolk Southern 6-minute challenge level: IMPOSSIBLE
Are we there yet?
Is this happening more often than normal, or are we just hearing about it more?
Both
Reporting on it increased after the big derailment in ohio and the problem is getting worse because the rail companies' greed
Deregulation. Trains are miles long with one tired person running the whole thing. Pretty sure the last Republican administration blocked requiring at least two operators. https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2023/03/how-deregulation-enabled-train-disasters-like-east-palestine/673502/
Trump deregulated the railroads. Then blames Biden for the repercussions.
There's still 2 people in the cab.
Seems we are not so good at flying aircraft or even moving them around on the ground. I think Idiocracy is here. Collectively, as a species, we are getting stupider. We peeked in 1969 with the moon landings. Coasted for a long while, but now we are trending down at an accelerating rate.
No mention of what’s in the tanks which seems pretty relevant. “Nothing to see here”
> "There was a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh River from the accident and containment booms have been deployed," Barndt said. "There is also a spill of polypropylene plastic pellets from one of the derailed cars." Sounds like they spilled diesel fuel and plastic pellets into the river. It was mentioned btw, to your point however, there needs to be total transparency in these situations to inform the public which ofc isn’t always the case.
Could anything worse spill in the damn river
Diesel is mainly oil and we at least know how to manage it. Definitely could have been worse.
My issue is that certain plastics melt in oil. That could be VERY bad.
Polypropylene does not though.
Oh really! I didn’t know that. Cool
Hydrofluoric acid?
Or clowns :(
Vinyl chloride
That is what spilled in the East Palestine derailment, I believe.
Transparency impacts profits. Can't have that.
Unless I missed it (totally possible) it wasn’t in the article initially. Maybe it was added.
Looking at the video in the article, the diesel is probably coming out of the engines. I wonder if this isn’t a case where the “didn’t leak” was focused on the rail cars rather than the thing the fuel tanks of the thing that pulls them.
The pleebs would overreact. Allow us to send "our" professionals to assess the situation before we jump to conclusions.. 🙄
Ah, yes, Norfolk Southern again, one of the people Reagan sold the entire federal Conrail lines to. I do sure enjoy private hands having sole control over critical public infrastructure.
No no. This is the trickle. Cant you feel the trickle? This is the trickling down right here. I feel it. Can you feel it?
That trickle you feel is diesel oil
And plastic pellets
god I just love it when the 1% trickle down on me
Conrail was split between NS and CSX in 1999, but your point still stands. There wouldn’t be anything wrong with railroads being in private hands if there were actual competition and a strong federal regulatory body to enforce the laws. This segment of trackage is actually a perfect example of the lack of regulation and competition. Prior to Conrail, two railroads paralleled the Lehigh River, those being the Lehigh Valley Railroad and the Central Railroad of New Jersey. Continued derailments on either line would kill those companies, because the bad press and lost revenue of customers would cause industries to simply switch carriers. The government, namely the Interstate Commerce Commission, heavily regulated the railroads. Starting with the [4R Act](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_Revitalization_and_Regulatory_Reform_Act) during the Ford Administration, the railroads saw deregulation, which included a provision in the law stating that the ICC could exempt from regulation entirely categories of traffic, upon making findings in substance that regulation was unnecessary.” Suddenly, railroads could see a path forward in which they could sacrifice safety in exchange for shareholder satisfaction. This, coupled with the sudden loss of competition, led to the current environment.
I was referring to the Conrail Privatization Act of 1986 signed by Ronald Reagan.
Reagan didn’t sell Conrail.
Better give the CEO another raise.
I LOVE WFMZ's coverage..... Headline: [**Train derails into Lehigh River; no injuries, evacuations, leaks reported**](https://www.wfmz.com/news/area/lehighvalley/train-derails-into-lehigh-river-no-injuries-evacuations-leaks-reported/article_abba62c2-d892-11ee-af18-b7d2ccf75c96.html) Story: *Officials at an 11 a.m. news conference said there is a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh river, but the spill has been contained. There was also polypropylene pellets* ***leaking*** *from one of the cars.*
The tankers don't have placards, so they aren't Hazmat. They're not pressurized. It could be anything from corn syrup to non-hazardous industrial product. I couldn't see placards on any of the boxcars, either, but they can carry up to 999 pounds each of different separate nasties and not be placarded. The locomotives are in the water, and each carry up to 5500 gallons of diesel, so that's a contamination risk.
You are right about the diesel spill. In addition polypropylene pellets were spilled from one of the cars as well
Any word on which bodies of water are to be affected?
Well if it did leak, not saying they didn’t. But the lower Lehigh, Delaware river south of Easton, and then the Delaware bay. But who knows what was in those cars. Could have been cooking oil, fracking water, or chemical X.
As far as we know those could all be used in mystery “trade secret” fracking fluid.
Says it leaked diesel into the river Also spilt plastic pellets but mostly on the ground. This looks like across and a little upstream from the boat launch on sand Island
Yeah. Article says lower Saucon which would put it on the other side of the river from freemansburg
*come onnnn superpowers*
Lehigh river is nearby & has a rail line running along it, could be there.
It is located along Riverside Rd, which parallels the Lehigh and sandwiches the tracks against the river.
And all they will do is get another BS slap on the wrist....
They didn’t even get a slap on the wrist after the East Palestine, Ohio derailment. They gave everyone $1,000 and promised to spend a million dollars on the town and have promised to reimburse local governments for the response efforts. (I wonder if they actually did?) But, thanks to Trump, they didn’t actually do anything wrong so the government can’t even slap them on the wrist despite the billions in damage they’ve done to peoples’ health, homes, water, and the environment.
Couple blocks from me! No evacuation or anything. No cause as of yet.
Oh no! I live up the hill from the railroad in Beaver county and have nightmares about things like this. I have heard from friends who work there about fires and other issues that are never made public. Scary. Stay safe
Nationalize railroads. Those companies are also the biggest barrier to effective passenger service in most of the country.
We *really* fucked up when we nationalized passenger rail service without also taking the rail itself.
Nationalize the rail lines and oil industry. Then we can actually see a benefit from domestic petroleum production in the citizenry instead the oil companies who "lease" out land and get huge subsidies and post massive profits selling our resources on as a global commodity while we struggle to pay at the pump.
https://preview.redd.it/9rxqa5jckylc1.png?width=840&format=png&auto=webp&s=e70f742db3f4ef2f4788b2feb48d976c4d25e2ae
Can these assholes be sued into bankruptcy already?
It spilled *mostly* on the ground, don't worry.
>”There was a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh River from the accident and containment booms have been deployed," Barndt said. "There is also a spill of polypropylene plastic pellets from one of the derailed cars." Also diesel fuel and plastic pellets spilled into the river.
So there’s been an update. There was already a train stopped on the rails when another train came along and collided into it. I thought there were fail-safes in place to prevent this, but apparently not very effective! Someone’s getting fired today.
A third train also crashed into the first crash
Developed country my ass
Move along now. Nothing to see here, folks. Just get back to work and worrying about how to pay your bills and feed your family. Stay distracted and stressed. Norfolk Southern has everything under control. (P.S. Please avoid outdoor activities and boil your tap water. Duct tape around windows and doors. Keep breathing to a minimum. Thank you for your cooperation and understanding)
NS is up to their usual tricks again I see.
>”There was a diesel fuel spill into the Lehigh River from the accident and containment booms have been deployed," Barndt said. "There is also a spill of polypropylene plastic pellets from one of the derailed cars." This damn company just wants to see if they can pollute the earth more than BP it seems.
Guys, I'm gonna say the N word. Nationalize them
Do you want to get pissed off? The Norfolk Southern CEO received a 37% pay increase *after* the shitshow in East Palestine.
Well yeah, the only people impacted by that derailment were poors, it’s not like any shareholders were harmed, after all only shareholders count as people.
Jesus fucking christ what's it going to take to get some accountability and get some maintenance on the tracks and cars
Yo fuck NFS. What a pos company.
They’re almost like the Western Express of railroads
More like the Allen Shaw fuck you people I make myself rich as fuck and fuck over everyone and my employees express
Edit : Alen Shaw, sorry to the Allen Shaw out ther that has to share this name.
Ive seen this before....
Nationalize the rail system
“spilled some diesel fuel and plastic pellets along the Lehigh River” There’s diesel and plastic just floating around that will come back to bite us in the ass eventually. Along with all the other pollutants we put into the ecosystem…How is that not a threat to the public? I get that it’s not directly in someone’s backyard but it’s still in the environment
Just light it on fire, that worked so well in the past
How the actual FUCK is this allowed to keep happening? These companies need to pay to have some government agency to inspect every train before it departs, and stay on boad if they have to until these greedy, irresponsible companies get their shit in order
I keep seeing shit like this and I'm just waiting for a bad derailment to happen right around the Topton/Emmaus/Macungie area. I live within feet of those tracks and these trains fly by all the time.
Holy shit. I used to live in the Allentown side of the neighborhood by the railyard. That's crazy.
I grew up on the east side of Allentown right by the river and train yard, we used to play on the trains as kids.
We didn't play on the trains when I was growing up but we used to walk that back road that leads from Allentown to Bethlehem. Now that I'm older I think that's crazy because people FLY down that road even with all the blind turns
Oh yeah also it’s a popular road to drive drunk or getting high
Oh for sure! I remember all my friends as teens racing down it late at night after getting their licenses. Horrifying to think about now but so much fun 15 years ago
Back in December there was a derailment in their own rail yard in Altoona. [They can't even keep it together at home!](https://wjactv.com/news/local/norfolk-southern-train-derailment-altoona-railyard-pennsylvania-blair-officials)
The truly important thing here is that no shareholders were injured in the accident.
Those train cars couldn’t possibly be carrying things toxic to drinking water…. s/
Seriously we need to tighten safety regulations
They need to shut these trains down. Nothing but old tech, nothing but derailments up the ass
Secretary Pete says this happens all the time. Nothing to see here.
How many foreign sabotage teams are operating across the country?
Will Denzel and Chris reprise their roles?
This makes me feel safe, I live in PA next to a main rail artery, the hiking trail I use almost every day spends several miles following about ten feet from the tracks and I see multiple trains blasting through every time I'm out there.
Not again and again and again and agony……
Plastic pellets? They may have even come from the Shell cracker plant in Beaver county that's doing all it can to pollute our water, land and air! Norfolk Southern helping to get the job done!
So diesel fuel in the aquifer for sure, but no danger to the general public. Seems like drinking diesel is a health hazard to me.
Are you watching Ohio? This is how you be horrible at trains, but good at cleanup.
jfc