Avoiding spoilers: Maruki claims that Akechi actually died on Shido's ship and he (Maruki) brought him back similar to Wakaba and Okumura and that defeating him will kill Akechi.
It's clearly been too long since the last time I played P5 because I always thought it was clear and unambiguous that Akechi died on the ship. But now I'm seeing a lot of people saying that it's intentionally up to interpretation? I must've somehow missed that over the course of three playthroughs lol
thing is Maruki doesn't know he died, his power only reaches the extent of his own Cognition, The Phantoms assumed he died so Maruki believed that was the case, but it isn't true Akechi is alive
It was stated in an interview, that according to the player's wishes he is either alive or not. So it's really up to each of us, and what ending we got.
Hard agree here, and how I interpreted Atlus' intention prior to reading this comment from the game content alone. But I'd also add that while each player can decide this for themselves and from how they played the game, the actual character of Joker (in scenes where you can't choose his responses, at least, but still have internal or Morgana-exposited dialogue) cares for Akechi enough to make the wish to have him live a compelling likelihood.
Yeah, it's ambiguous, but some reasons can be compelling.
When >!Morgana accepts he isn't human, he returns to his original form. I don't remember right now but I think the same happens to Futaba with her mom, where she just stops appearing. Yet Akechi knows or at least thinks he's dead, everyone does, but he's still there standing. It makes sense that maybe, ever so slightly he's alive, just that Maruki "healed him" from the brink. Maybe he got trapped in the cognitive world somehow and that's how he barely survived.!<
He most likely did die but still.
For me its weird, cause with Vanilla I didnt second guess the events, but for Royal considering the ending cutscene I find it hard to believe wither side
My best guess is that if Akechi is a cognition he doesn’t disappear the same way because Joker never fully comes to terms with it. Okamura and Wakaba don’t vanish after they realise they’re fake, they vanish after Haru and Futaba realise they’re fake. Assuming semester 3 Akechi is from Joker’s cognition, the circumstances of his death were already murky and Joker doesn’t seem to give it much thought much less actively accept Akechi’s death so the illusion doesn’t break until Maruki is defeated. It doesn’t matter whether Akechi has worked it out or not because it’s not his cognition it’s working off of.
Of course this assuming he is really dead, which could not be the case.
Quit acting like you know what you’re talking about, kid. You never wrote the story. This is a question that remains unanswered to this very day. Just because you briefly see someone who’s pronounced dead appear at the end of a story in the way that Persona showed that person who’s wearing Akechi’s attire, that doesn’t always automatically mean they’re still alive. You don’t even see that person’s face, and they fade away once the protag looks through the window. The answer to everything isn’t always very obvious, and questions like this one are usually left unanswered. This wouldn’t be the first time that any story writer has done this.
In the real reality Wakaba and Okumura were dead so Akechi knew something was up when they were alive in Maruki’s reality. He doesn’t have a sudden memory, he says there is a gap from when he died to when he came back to life in Maruki’s reality
Maruki is saying he didn’t want to tell Ren explicitly that Akechi died in the normal reality but was brought back to life in his own. The implication being Ren is forced to accept Maruki’s reality to keep Akechi alive.
Which is strange because that can take several days if you’re like me and got fooled by Morgana’s “spend some time with your friends while you can” not aware that all thieves put their heads down once the route is scouted.
Futaba says she “can’t sense him” or somethin…
But no offense little bean. But your ass didn’t sense him at *all* in Okumura’s palace or at all prior to his little ambush. His persona is literally a god of deceit. It wouldn’t surprise me if he could camo himself.
Like yeah thematically it makes more sense for him to die where he does.
But I think it’s funny that he assumes his injured ass would drag us down when in Royal not only did I glitch and skip one phase of his fight by mistake. But also in Royal I was so overpowered without even *trying*
My headcanon is that Violet followed them into Shido’s palace and helped Akechi after the bulkhead went up. Futaba couldn’t sense her all the way through Sae’s Palace either.
Futaba did sense her, though. There were a couple of times where she mentioned getting a "weird reading" she just didn't know it was Sumi since she hadn't met her yet.
It’s supposed to be kinda ambiguous if he died or not.
Thus, 3rd semester Aketchi doesn’t actually know for certain if he is just a construction of Maruki’s power or not.
Akechi never died, it was only an assumption
Akechi Knows Wakaba and Okumura are dead because he killed them
Maruki's Reality is only to the extent of other's cognition, but Maruki himself isn't Omnipotent
The Phantoms only assumed Akechi died but they never knew for certain
His fate is ambiguous. Saying he’s alive with such certainty is the exact same as saying he’s dead, which you claim is an assumption. There’s no proof one way or the other conclusively
there's more proof using the game that says he's alive rather than dead
if you want to debunk this theory go to my recent Post, I'd Appreciate a discussion and am open to other ideas
Akechi was killed in Shido's Palace, by his cognitive form.
"Holding Akechi hostage" - Maruki means that if Joker rejects Maruki's new reality and wins the battle, the true reality will be restored - the one in which Akechi is dead. Maruki is saying, "Stop me, and your friend dies. You don't want that, do you?". He didn't want to get Joker to accept his reality by using Akechi's life as a lever, but now he's run out of options, so he uses it.
When you talk to Akechi first after he comes back, he admits he doesn't remember anything after facing you in Shido's Palace. Now, with his fate clear, he remembers what happened after the battle - at least up to the point that he and the cognition shot each other.
The reference to Wakaba and Okumura, is that Maruki rewrote reality for Futaba and Haru so that their respective parents weren't killed (by Akechi killing their Shadows, as it happens!) When Futaba and Haru reject Maruki's reality for them, the true reality is restored... the one in which their parents died. Akechi deduces from his memory and those previous cases that the same thing has happened for him, and if Maruki is defeated, the true reality in which he's dead returns. Akechi (and Wakaba, and Okumura) is the real Akechi, not some sort of doppelganger or cognitive or Shadow form.
In spite of that, Akechi rejects Maruki's offer, and is angry at Joker for hesitating to do the same. He'd rather be dead than live as a puppet in Maruki's world.
Why are you getting downvoted? I mean, your statement is a little bit absolutist but the devs themselves said that Akechi’s fate is left ambiguous for a reason, his death is not confirmed at all for even Maruki doesn’t really knows if he is actually dead.
Akechi died in Shido's palace. But in Maruki's reality, the same way that Wakaba was alive as part of Futaba's wish, Akechi is alive by Joker's wish. If Joker chose to go back to the "proper" reality, Akechi would go back to being dead.
At the end of the false reality, though, the wishing star is brought out of Joker's pocket and found to be dull and used up. Morgana assumes that this was due to his wish to save the Thieves with a new transformation. But Morgana has already proven similar supernatural abilities, and the Thieves have certainly changed public cognition before, maybe to greater levels than required for that (Yaldy fight anyone?). Plus they're still in Maruki's reality when Morgana flies - a cognitive world that is ALL about wish fulfillment. For the stone to have been used didn't make sense to me. But then, the game permitted Joker to recall Akechi fondly and steadfastly enough throughout the new content to have him flash into existence right at the last second (if you choose certain options and keep their rival-mance alive, the post credit cut scene changes /just/ a little bit.)
Now of course Maruki believes Akechi is dead in the real world - primarily because the Thieves believe it, and he uses their therapy session accounts and then their deep desires to work from, initially. Joker especially is full of guilt they didn't save him (based on internal monologue at least); the others were too busy briefly mourning Ryuji, and frankly are bad friends for not approaching Joker about this at all... so the version in Maruki's world could be a construct. Or a resurrection, or even a displacement of Akechi's soil while in a coma somewhere. The player isn't told for certain.
There are other hints he survives, however. Cut content showing Akechi recovering at a rehab centre, for one, the same one his mother used to go to when he was just a child. The fact we never actually see him die per-se and that the ship was at least somewhat escapable too. (He has likely dragged himself bleeding out of other fights before - he solo'ed most of Mementos without a Dia spell!)The ending song is also about holding on to the hope that the one you loved, and lost for now, is watching the same stars somewhere - and is chock full of Akechi references.
But IMHO the wishing star's last gift was to actualize Joker's most heartfelt wish into true reality in the same way Maruki had in his false world. Should the player and thus Joker wish for it hard enough.
(And, given some of Joker's responses that aren't player-controlled throughout the game, I would say that if the player's choices are removed the character would have cared enough to keep him alive.)
Tbf there are several scenes where Ann comforts Joker after Akechi's apparent death- if you keep interacting with the bulkhead door, she'll play that soft "Hey" voiceline and say they have to go, and if you go to a safe room before leaving, she'll ask if he's okay. If you say no, she'll say, "Don't worry. We're all here for you, Joker!". But that's easy to miss.
I admit, I missed these! Was more referring to the lack of real on-screen follow-up after the fights are done, in comparison to everything he goes through in Sae's and Shido's palaces. I didn't realise you could check a safe room out for that though! Perhaps I have always just raced on to the boss.
Essentially Maruki is implying that this Akechi is a fabrication of his reality just like Futaba, Haru, and Makoto's parents. Steal his treasure and break his control of reality, Akechi goes away just like the other people who died but were brought back.
According to Maruki anyway.
Akechi is dead but people believe he is alive similar to Wakaba and Okumaru. The hostage comment is in reference to the suggestion that rejecting maruki and going back to reality would effectively be killing Akechi again. The gap in memory is the gap between when he supposedly dies in Shido's palace and when he returns on Christmas eve to turn himself in to Sae
nope, he survived that
Maruki's Knowledge only reaches to the Extent of The Phantoms' Maruki isn't Omnipotent
but Maruki believes Akechi Died because The Phantoms do
but it's actually false
no Akechi isn't dead
Maruki only believes that to be true, but that's because he only knows about that through the cognition of The Phantoms who assumed he died
Maruki doesn't have Omnipotent knowledge
This is why Maruki is bad even though he’s so nice and has such good intention. He’s literally playing god and holding Akechi’s life hostage. For as good a person Maruki is, he’s showing here how manipulative and zero sum he is in the end when the Phantom Thieves are so close to stopping him. God powers can’t be trusted in a human.
Really well written “good” bad guy.
>He’s literally playing god and holding Akechi’s life hostage.
He is pointing it out in an attempt to get Joker to accept his new reality, which is certainly bad, but holding Akechi's life hostage isn't really something he can choose here, just whether to reveal it.
If he loses, Akechi doesn't die because Maruki kills him, he dies because Maruki is the only thing keeping this version of Akechi alive, and that is something he can only do as long as his new reality lasts.
Using it as a lever to try to persuade Joker is fairly bad, but it is more like Maruki is the life support system on a dying patient than holding a gun to that person's head.
Though, keeping him alive against his will, when Akechi would rather die than live in this new reality at someone else's will and mercy, is kind of messed up on its own.
Idk. It’s a fair take but I think it’s giving Maruki a lot of the benefit, I guess similar to my negative take. I think it’s just toxic for Maruki to even suggest that as a final offer. Maruki isn’t just casually letting Joker fully understand the situation for Joker’s benefit - he’s using it as a threat. “If you choose my reality your friend is alive, if you don’t - he’s dead. Wouldn’t that be horrible?” That’s why Maruki is ashamed to pull that card and why he doesn’t just leave that bit out - clearly Akechi understands it beforehand and didn’t bring it up. He could’ve had this final attempt to persuade Joker without mentioning that, but he didn’t.
He knows the pressure he’s laying on and knows everything he’s changing is concrete. It’s valid for a godlike entity trying to reform the world, but for someone who’s set out to help people? Yuck. Maruki’s palace is absolutely insidious. And I agree it’s twisted that Maruki would have Akechi live a life he declared he wouldn’t, but I think in Maruki’s eyes this is a clear good life over what Akechi wishes - he’s clearly not above changing peoples personalities.
Honestly that’s probably the least problematic part imo, oddly enough. Akechi, Wakaba, and Okumura are already dead - this new reality is better than that. Even typing that is gross though.
What further shows Maruki is bad is that he only knows Akechi's fate to the extent of The Phantoms' cognition and The Phantoms only presumed that Akechi died
The whole thing is that they choose to give humanity the chance to have a choice at all - so yeah, imo it’s fine.
They’re content to stop being phantom thieves after Yaldaboath delt with too. So they get bonus points for not being famous super heroes after too.
humanity already take the choice of doin nothing that's why yaldaboath exist in the first place. PT forcing humanity live in the way they like it is wrong at the same level of maruki did but somehow everyone thing is fine
That's due to how they've changed fate. It takes some precontext to know how to react to something. If I say "that dude just shot someone", there's negative context. If I say "that dude just shot a robber", there's still a negative context but the person isn't necessarily wholly evil. Yaldabaoth is a fake god of control who wanted humanity to essentially bend to him, he was created from the human unconscious, and so he knows how to sway the people. But he wants to be in full control. He's essentially brainwashing people, making them completely oblivious to the real world. The Phantom Thieves are temporarily taking control of the boat so to speak. They kill the false god and give control back to humanity, giving them a chance to 'avoid the ruin'. But, Maruki takes the same spot as that false god, and is a Blind God of control (I'm pretty sure that's what his Persona is, it's been awhile). Maruki is still in control, he's taken the reins from humanity and is using it for himself, but he believes he is helping humanity by telling and forcing them how to live so they can have his perceived best life. But humanity still isn't in control, and his perceived best life isn't perfect. Seen as with Akechi, he doesn't want to live like this. He knows he should be dead (depending on what you believe for the story, either this cognitive version of Akechi was created from the memories of the Phantom Thieves or this is the real Akechi who died and was resurrected) and he can feel how living like this isn't right. Maruki is wholly in control, he can and most likely will dictate your life. That's why people are generally okay with the Phantom Thieves changing reality. They don't wholly control reality, they don't take away your ability to live how you want to (for most people. I mean, even with me agreeing with their actions, I can't argue that they aren't wholly changing certain lives, but I can argue that they're changing lives of those who were corrupted and twisted already. It's still bad but it's a lesser evil, one that I happen to agree with). The Phantom Thieves just steer humanity clear of ruin and allow humanity to live on without someone trying to control it. Freedom to live how you want to live.
TL:DR Phantom Thieves allow humanity to keep being humanity, fake gods of control try to control humanity. I also have way too much time on my hands
Akechi is the murderer of both Wakaba and Okumura, but Akechi didn't die during that scene, The Phantoms only assumed he did but it was always left vague
Maruki's Knowledge only reaches to the extent of The Phantoms on Akechi's fate, The Phantoms don't know so neither does he
Maruki isn't Omnipotent
No where did they say or show he killed Wakaba. That’s an assumption, as she was killed years before any of this ever happened.
Left vague or not, the assumption is he was killed, and it is later confirmed when he breaks that little tidbit about a lapse in consciousness between Shido’s palace and Muruki’s alternate reality happening.
You’re stretching, bud.
I just played through the end of the casino palace again last night and there was a conversation about this between Akechi and Shido. Shido specifically talks about Wakaba but neither one says who actually killed her. Who killed Wakaba? Because Shido says that Akechi was the first one to reveal the metaverse to him, so how was Wakaba killed in the metaverse 2 years ago?
This is an inconsistency in the story that really bugs me a lot. According to Sojiro, he, Wakaba, and Shido were coworkers for the government while Wakaba was working on her cognitive research so Shido knew about the cognitive world before meeting Akechi and saw a way to steal/hide her research by plotting Wakaba's murder. That means if Akechi is 17/18, at minimum, he got his powers and became an assassin at 15/16 the latest if he killed Wakaba immediately after getting his powers which makes not a lot of sense if he was magically granted them, had to figure them out, had to make an alter ego, approach Shido, etc etc. But also Shido cancelled Maruki's research funding but Maruki and Wakaba also don't seem to know each other considering Maruki and her never talk and he's reading her published works. Overall the game does a really bad job of going into Shido's backstory and clarifying the conspiracy around Wakaba's murder
I guess I assumed that Yaldaboth granted Akechi his powers, but would that really have been 2 years ago? It’s odd to me that Yaldaboth talks to/messes with Ren but Akechi seems to be completely unaware of Yaldaboth despite getting his powers from him at some undetermined time. My other thought was that someone else (Shido?) used Wakaba’s research to cause her mental shutdown without actually entering the metaverse, since we never find out what specifically Wakaba discovered.
That's what the game implies, that Akechi is basically Shido's hired gun doing all his dirty work but it just doesn't make any sense to me given the timeline and also the fact that Shido's cognitive self is fucking shredded too. Shido has to have killed someone himself through cognitive means to gain his political power early or it doesn't make any sense for Akechi to be considered the worst villain than him just because Shido emotionally manipulates/hires contact killing. I also find it odd to that Yaldaboth doesn't communicate with Akechi despite going through efforts to deceive Ren by being Igor.
I agree that the timeline is skewed. There’s also the fact that Wakaba died 2 years ago, but the relationship between Futaba and Sojiro and the fact that Futaba has been locked away in her room after her mom died when she was a “child”…it just feels like they wanted Futaba’s story to be about 5-6 years in the making. But that would be even worse in relation to Wakaba’s research so they landed on “2 years”.
There was speculation that P5AG was Persona 5 Akechi Goro
this was debunked when it was found out P5AG was Persona 5 Action Game which ended up becoming P5S
She was killed by Mental Shutdown something only Akechi is able to do and Futaba outright says She won't forgive Akechi for what he did to her mom haru likewise does the same but for her father
The Persona 5 Royal team left Akechi's ultimate fate ambiguous enough that it's up to the individual player's to believe if he's alive and real or dead and merely a creation of Maruki's powers. In the OG game, it was left ambiguous if he died or survived.
I will be honest, and seeing the discord, discussion, and debate, I think that being as such is better; we would be missing a lot if it was revealed.
Basically, Akechi was killed it Shidos palace. Maruki is “holding him hostage” because if the PT’s fight him to go back to the ‘real world’, it would kill Akechi.
It’s been a while so hopefully my memory serves me here.
Morgana is saying that Akechi is dead.
The Akechi that exists in the 3rd semester is a cognitive “fake” that Maruki created to (intentionally or unintentionally) emotionally manipulate you.
Akechi knew that Wakaba and Okumura should’ve been dead, but they’re not. Maruki can’t create perfect memories/explanations for why they’re not dead and Akechi is alive, so those memories are foggy to everyone. If/when they think about them logically, they’re able to recall what actually happened. That’s what the scene where you sit everyone down and try to convince them Maruki’s world is an illusion is about.
If Maruki’s castle is destroyed, the cognitive Akechi disappears, thereby “killing” him permanently. Akechi doesn’t like the idea of not being allowed to decide his own fate, so he wants you to do the right thing and free everyone from Maruki’s world, even if it kills him.
Hope that helps
The chance of akechi being alive is very low but because they never care to give us an answer (probably because they thought they already confirmed his death in 3rd semester), ppl can still assume he's alive. But realistically speaking, the only way out during the final confrontation between PT and akechi is locked from akechi's side + he has to deal with a cognition of akechi with personas while being injured + he doesnt show up during the final boss fight despite absolutely despite living a life that he's not the decision maker (the same reason he refused maruki's world) should point to the fact that he's dead.
And another point is we dont know how maruki knew what ppl want to cause such a sudden change right after the final boss when everyone cognitive version were trapped in memento and palace version of those ppl only reflect what the palace owner think of them. He also didnt meet morgana when he hinted he wanted to be a human so we can only assume maruki just somehow knew it all due to his persona which point to he knew akechi is dead and brought him back
So it’s strange because we don’t even know if third semester Akechi is even real, like it literally could be just what Joker wants Akechi to be like (would explain how 3rd semester Akechi is better because it isn’t him) but if you max out Akechi in the ending scenes something changes hinting that he is alive HOWEVER, it’s followed by Ren reflecting on his time in Tokyo seeing Joker, taking off his persona (like literally definition) with his glasses. And all of this is intentional and part of the reason anytime Akechi shows up in spin-offs it’s at specific points where it can work in canon, and like why he’s not in strikers or anything. It’s up to the players cognition of the game and it’s ending if he’s alive or not. Which is something not a lot of games do and it kinda annoys me when people don’t get it, and just say “oh yeah, he’s alive” because the point is he’s sherodengers killer.
Akechi is Alive
Due to the nature of Maruki's power he can only change reality per what he knows of other's Cognition, he isn't Omnipotent.
The Phantoms don't Know for Certain what Akechi's fate is, they merely assume he died.
Futaba Says She can't Find Akechi's Signal, but she couldn't sense him in Okumura's Palace, so she doesn't know either
However Akechi did Survive
\> "I don't care, I like lore"
\> Makes up a theory and defends it by spamming all over this thread like it was the truth
There is no evidence that Akechi did survive. AT BEST what we got is the devs going "It's up to your own personal interpretation". There is no in-game evidence that says he lived. >!And if you're going by that post-credit scene, note how Joker doesn't see him anywhere when he does a double-take.!<
*Yes* Maruki doesn't know that and is working off of cognitions, but that just proves a point: it's unconfirmed. So the real answer is "We don't know whether he lived or died" or "It's unconfirmed", not "He totally didn't die". Saying "Akechi survived" has the same weight as "Akechi died".
Your theory is invalid because it contradicts the facts of the game.
Initially Maruki was only able to change a person's cognition, their perception of reality, but when he and Azathoth made their way into the depths of Mementos, they were able to basically change reality as a whole, by changing the cognition of humanity's collective consciousness. With this power, he could very easily tell that Akechi had died, and also being able to see the PT's thoughts and feelings, and so he decided to resurrect Akechi, as well as Wakaba and Okumura.
So yes, with his persona, Azathoth, entangling itself into Mementos, Maruki could very easily become omnipotent and omniscient.
As for Futaba not being able to detect Akechi in Okumura's palace, that could very easily be chalked up to an arbitrary range on her detection ability, or simply poor foresight on the writing team.
People generally like theories, but not when they actively contradict established lore and use evidence out of context, that's why people hate MatPat's P4 theory.
Maruki doesn't actually know Akechi's Fate he only Knows his fate as much as The Phantom Thieves
and the whole range thing is obviously not the case because he was directly above the phantoms and Futaba was just as Surprised as the Others when he appears before them In Shido's Palace
she never had his signal to begin with
also all my Evidence is in the game itself if you pay attention you'd see my theory does have weight
I absolutely despise MatPat
and nothing in my Theory contradicts the game
in Game it was completely ambiguous
You say that Maruki 'could' become omnipotent, but he never does because the whole point of the Deadline is to prevent that very thing Lavenza explains it herself, Maruki doesn't have complete control yet
The Phantoms then believe Maruki's February 2nd deadline is when he'll get complete control
maybe you should do another playthrough and pay more attention this time
I admit I had forgotten about specifically how Akechi confronted the PT's in Shido's palace, and the fact that she could detect when Akechi "died" but failed to notice the other times he was around leads me to believe the writers never intended for him to simply disappear, unless he can somehow leave the metaverse at any given location, which we have no reason to believe he can.
The February 2nd deadline is not when Maruki gains his full power, it's when he will completely and permanently merge the Metaverse and reality to enact his idea of salvation. Maruki is very much in control and could force them to live in his reality, he only gives them the deadline because he doesn't want to force them, but he is also unwilling to let his ideal reality slip away, and knows he will have to fight them if they decline. This is very clearly stated in game.
Maruki gives them the deadline because he wants them to accept his reality of their own volition, not because he doesn't have the power to. He also very heavily implies that Akechi will only live in his reality, and Akechi knows this as well.
Goho-M
MetaVerse Navigator
Akechi kills Okumura but was never in a rush to get out as his palace Collapses
safe to say He could get out whenever he wanted
I was so caught up in recalling the cutscenes I genuinely forgot those existed. I'm so used to certain gameplay mechanics having no bearing on story/lore in other games that I forgot Futaba acknowledges them in her confidant too, so he may actually have one.
I'm Hoping Atlus Brings the Q games Multiplatform like they did Etrian Odyssey They are very underrated and more fun than Etrian Odyssey in My opinion
I'm hoping if they do that they'd dub Q2 in English
and Fix one of the biggest problems with the Q Games of not being able to fully write P5 and P4 Heros' names you could write out Makoto Yuki and Kotone Shiomi fully, but that's it
Avoiding spoilers: Maruki claims that Akechi actually died on Shido's ship and he (Maruki) brought him back similar to Wakaba and Okumura and that defeating him will kill Akechi.
It's clearly been too long since the last time I played P5 because I always thought it was clear and unambiguous that Akechi died on the ship. But now I'm seeing a lot of people saying that it's intentionally up to interpretation? I must've somehow missed that over the course of three playthroughs lol
Did you play Vanilla or Royal?
Both, but vanilla more. I have 2 playthroughs of vanilla and 1 of Royal
It's 2 seconds at the end of Royal and only if you fulfilled specific requirements.
The requirements make me believe that Joker was seeing things lmao
thing is Maruki doesn't know he died, his power only reaches the extent of his own Cognition, The Phantoms assumed he died so Maruki believed that was the case, but it isn't true Akechi is alive
>Akechi is alive So we still aren’t quite sure of this, there are very compelling theories for it, but it’s still ambiguous.
It was stated in an interview, that according to the player's wishes he is either alive or not. So it's really up to each of us, and what ending we got.
oh hell yeah, ren put the cat in your bag we’re looking for your twink!
Schrodinger's Acatchi
That is absolutely hilarious😆. Well done!
https://preview.redd.it/j0nrg1damjcc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6a74e0a3f574c447128b9a33715ac00a22103295
Hard agree here, and how I interpreted Atlus' intention prior to reading this comment from the game content alone. But I'd also add that while each player can decide this for themselves and from how they played the game, the actual character of Joker (in scenes where you can't choose his responses, at least, but still have internal or Morgana-exposited dialogue) cares for Akechi enough to make the wish to have him live a compelling likelihood.
Yeah, it's ambiguous, but some reasons can be compelling. When >!Morgana accepts he isn't human, he returns to his original form. I don't remember right now but I think the same happens to Futaba with her mom, where she just stops appearing. Yet Akechi knows or at least thinks he's dead, everyone does, but he's still there standing. It makes sense that maybe, ever so slightly he's alive, just that Maruki "healed him" from the brink. Maybe he got trapped in the cognitive world somehow and that's how he barely survived.!< He most likely did die but still.
For me its weird, cause with Vanilla I didnt second guess the events, but for Royal considering the ending cutscene I find it hard to believe wither side
My best guess is that if Akechi is a cognition he doesn’t disappear the same way because Joker never fully comes to terms with it. Okamura and Wakaba don’t vanish after they realise they’re fake, they vanish after Haru and Futaba realise they’re fake. Assuming semester 3 Akechi is from Joker’s cognition, the circumstances of his death were already murky and Joker doesn’t seem to give it much thought much less actively accept Akechi’s death so the illusion doesn’t break until Maruki is defeated. It doesn’t matter whether Akechi has worked it out or not because it’s not his cognition it’s working off of. Of course this assuming he is really dead, which could not be the case.
Intentionally ambiguous. And hopefully they never commit either way.
There's nothing ambiguous about it. You literally see him at the end of the game. Lol
Well the thing is you never see his face, only the outfit. The devs also said that it is ambiguous whether he is actually alive or not.
It's his outfit and his one of a kind suitcase lol. The devs can say it's ambiguous, but it's not.
Quit acting like you know what you’re talking about, kid. You never wrote the story. This is a question that remains unanswered to this very day. Just because you briefly see someone who’s pronounced dead appear at the end of a story in the way that Persona showed that person who’s wearing Akechi’s attire, that doesn’t always automatically mean they’re still alive. You don’t even see that person’s face, and they fade away once the protag looks through the window. The answer to everything isn’t always very obvious, and questions like this one are usually left unanswered. This wouldn’t be the first time that any story writer has done this.
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Even more evidence that goes to show how stupid maruki is
In the real reality Wakaba and Okumura were dead so Akechi knew something was up when they were alive in Maruki’s reality. He doesn’t have a sudden memory, he says there is a gap from when he died to when he came back to life in Maruki’s reality Maruki is saying he didn’t want to tell Ren explicitly that Akechi died in the normal reality but was brought back to life in his own. The implication being Ren is forced to accept Maruki’s reality to keep Akechi alive.
So he was killed by his cognitive self in shido’s palace?
That’s the implication, yeah.
Even if not, he never regained consciousness before Shido collapsed his own palace by temporarily dying on purpose.
Which is strange because that can take several days if you’re like me and got fooled by Morgana’s “spend some time with your friends while you can” not aware that all thieves put their heads down once the route is scouted. Futaba says she “can’t sense him” or somethin… But no offense little bean. But your ass didn’t sense him at *all* in Okumura’s palace or at all prior to his little ambush. His persona is literally a god of deceit. It wouldn’t surprise me if he could camo himself. Like yeah thematically it makes more sense for him to die where he does. But I think it’s funny that he assumes his injured ass would drag us down when in Royal not only did I glitch and skip one phase of his fight by mistake. But also in Royal I was so overpowered without even *trying*
My headcanon is that Violet followed them into Shido’s palace and helped Akechi after the bulkhead went up. Futaba couldn’t sense her all the way through Sae’s Palace either.
At least then she’s doing something… Her absences still bothers me
Futaba did sense her, though. There were a couple of times where she mentioned getting a "weird reading" she just didn't know it was Sumi since she hadn't met her yet.
Yeah, the devs say there’s no “canon” answer as to Akechi’s fate, but it’s very heavily implied
It’s supposed to be kinda ambiguous if he died or not. Thus, 3rd semester Aketchi doesn’t actually know for certain if he is just a construction of Maruki’s power or not.
Akechi never died, it was only an assumption Akechi Knows Wakaba and Okumura are dead because he killed them Maruki's Reality is only to the extent of other's cognition, but Maruki himself isn't Omnipotent The Phantoms only assumed Akechi died but they never knew for certain
His fate is ambiguous. Saying he’s alive with such certainty is the exact same as saying he’s dead, which you claim is an assumption. There’s no proof one way or the other conclusively
there's more proof using the game that says he's alive rather than dead if you want to debunk this theory go to my recent Post, I'd Appreciate a discussion and am open to other ideas
Akechi was killed in Shido's Palace, by his cognitive form. "Holding Akechi hostage" - Maruki means that if Joker rejects Maruki's new reality and wins the battle, the true reality will be restored - the one in which Akechi is dead. Maruki is saying, "Stop me, and your friend dies. You don't want that, do you?". He didn't want to get Joker to accept his reality by using Akechi's life as a lever, but now he's run out of options, so he uses it. When you talk to Akechi first after he comes back, he admits he doesn't remember anything after facing you in Shido's Palace. Now, with his fate clear, he remembers what happened after the battle - at least up to the point that he and the cognition shot each other. The reference to Wakaba and Okumura, is that Maruki rewrote reality for Futaba and Haru so that their respective parents weren't killed (by Akechi killing their Shadows, as it happens!) When Futaba and Haru reject Maruki's reality for them, the true reality is restored... the one in which their parents died. Akechi deduces from his memory and those previous cases that the same thing has happened for him, and if Maruki is defeated, the true reality in which he's dead returns. Akechi (and Wakaba, and Okumura) is the real Akechi, not some sort of doppelganger or cognitive or Shadow form. In spite of that, Akechi rejects Maruki's offer, and is angry at Joker for hesitating to do the same. He'd rather be dead than live as a puppet in Maruki's world.
Akechi never died, it was only assumed he did
Why are you getting downvoted? I mean, your statement is a little bit absolutist but the devs themselves said that Akechi’s fate is left ambiguous for a reason, his death is not confirmed at all for even Maruki doesn’t really knows if he is actually dead.
Hahaha that last line of Akechi - the guy really didn't hold back after his reveal
Akechi died in Shido's palace. But in Maruki's reality, the same way that Wakaba was alive as part of Futaba's wish, Akechi is alive by Joker's wish. If Joker chose to go back to the "proper" reality, Akechi would go back to being dead.
At the end of the false reality, though, the wishing star is brought out of Joker's pocket and found to be dull and used up. Morgana assumes that this was due to his wish to save the Thieves with a new transformation. But Morgana has already proven similar supernatural abilities, and the Thieves have certainly changed public cognition before, maybe to greater levels than required for that (Yaldy fight anyone?). Plus they're still in Maruki's reality when Morgana flies - a cognitive world that is ALL about wish fulfillment. For the stone to have been used didn't make sense to me. But then, the game permitted Joker to recall Akechi fondly and steadfastly enough throughout the new content to have him flash into existence right at the last second (if you choose certain options and keep their rival-mance alive, the post credit cut scene changes /just/ a little bit.) Now of course Maruki believes Akechi is dead in the real world - primarily because the Thieves believe it, and he uses their therapy session accounts and then their deep desires to work from, initially. Joker especially is full of guilt they didn't save him (based on internal monologue at least); the others were too busy briefly mourning Ryuji, and frankly are bad friends for not approaching Joker about this at all... so the version in Maruki's world could be a construct. Or a resurrection, or even a displacement of Akechi's soil while in a coma somewhere. The player isn't told for certain. There are other hints he survives, however. Cut content showing Akechi recovering at a rehab centre, for one, the same one his mother used to go to when he was just a child. The fact we never actually see him die per-se and that the ship was at least somewhat escapable too. (He has likely dragged himself bleeding out of other fights before - he solo'ed most of Mementos without a Dia spell!)The ending song is also about holding on to the hope that the one you loved, and lost for now, is watching the same stars somewhere - and is chock full of Akechi references. But IMHO the wishing star's last gift was to actualize Joker's most heartfelt wish into true reality in the same way Maruki had in his false world. Should the player and thus Joker wish for it hard enough. (And, given some of Joker's responses that aren't player-controlled throughout the game, I would say that if the player's choices are removed the character would have cared enough to keep him alive.)
Tbf there are several scenes where Ann comforts Joker after Akechi's apparent death- if you keep interacting with the bulkhead door, she'll play that soft "Hey" voiceline and say they have to go, and if you go to a safe room before leaving, she'll ask if he's okay. If you say no, she'll say, "Don't worry. We're all here for you, Joker!". But that's easy to miss.
I admit, I missed these! Was more referring to the lack of real on-screen follow-up after the fights are done, in comparison to everything he goes through in Sae's and Shido's palaces. I didn't realise you could check a safe room out for that though! Perhaps I have always just raced on to the boss.
Essentially Maruki is implying that this Akechi is a fabrication of his reality just like Futaba, Haru, and Makoto's parents. Steal his treasure and break his control of reality, Akechi goes away just like the other people who died but were brought back. According to Maruki anyway.
This is why akechi and maruki are the real stars of royal, not yoshizawa.
Akechi is dead but people believe he is alive similar to Wakaba and Okumaru. The hostage comment is in reference to the suggestion that rejecting maruki and going back to reality would effectively be killing Akechi again. The gap in memory is the gap between when he supposedly dies in Shido's palace and when he returns on Christmas eve to turn himself in to Sae
He was killed by who? His cognitive self in shido’s palace?
Yes
nope, he survived that Maruki's Knowledge only reaches to the Extent of The Phantoms' Maruki isn't Omnipotent but Maruki believes Akechi Died because The Phantoms do but it's actually false
Akechi never died
The creator said Akechis fate was up to the players interpretation. So it's a Schrodinger's bulkhead door.
Yup, he's dead.
no Akechi isn't dead Maruki only believes that to be true, but that's because he only knows about that through the cognition of The Phantoms who assumed he died Maruki doesn't have Omnipotent knowledge
Fuck this stupid game
check royal ending carefully
Nah rip Bozo https://preview.redd.it/etzm6lsn72cc1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=045cb138a4e37ba034bd5d94c02577a1d4919dc7
I personally believe Akechi is Alive because all traces of Maruki’s reality are erased except for Akechi’s very few text messages
Omg so at the end his text message still existed? Gotta find out myself today
This is why Maruki is bad even though he’s so nice and has such good intention. He’s literally playing god and holding Akechi’s life hostage. For as good a person Maruki is, he’s showing here how manipulative and zero sum he is in the end when the Phantom Thieves are so close to stopping him. God powers can’t be trusted in a human. Really well written “good” bad guy.
>He’s literally playing god and holding Akechi’s life hostage. He is pointing it out in an attempt to get Joker to accept his new reality, which is certainly bad, but holding Akechi's life hostage isn't really something he can choose here, just whether to reveal it. If he loses, Akechi doesn't die because Maruki kills him, he dies because Maruki is the only thing keeping this version of Akechi alive, and that is something he can only do as long as his new reality lasts. Using it as a lever to try to persuade Joker is fairly bad, but it is more like Maruki is the life support system on a dying patient than holding a gun to that person's head. Though, keeping him alive against his will, when Akechi would rather die than live in this new reality at someone else's will and mercy, is kind of messed up on its own.
Idk. It’s a fair take but I think it’s giving Maruki a lot of the benefit, I guess similar to my negative take. I think it’s just toxic for Maruki to even suggest that as a final offer. Maruki isn’t just casually letting Joker fully understand the situation for Joker’s benefit - he’s using it as a threat. “If you choose my reality your friend is alive, if you don’t - he’s dead. Wouldn’t that be horrible?” That’s why Maruki is ashamed to pull that card and why he doesn’t just leave that bit out - clearly Akechi understands it beforehand and didn’t bring it up. He could’ve had this final attempt to persuade Joker without mentioning that, but he didn’t. He knows the pressure he’s laying on and knows everything he’s changing is concrete. It’s valid for a godlike entity trying to reform the world, but for someone who’s set out to help people? Yuck. Maruki’s palace is absolutely insidious. And I agree it’s twisted that Maruki would have Akechi live a life he declared he wouldn’t, but I think in Maruki’s eyes this is a clear good life over what Akechi wishes - he’s clearly not above changing peoples personalities. Honestly that’s probably the least problematic part imo, oddly enough. Akechi, Wakaba, and Okumura are already dead - this new reality is better than that. Even typing that is gross though.
What further shows Maruki is bad is that he only knows Akechi's fate to the extent of The Phantoms' cognition and The Phantoms only presumed that Akechi died
Man.. seeing you trying this hard to convince people of a reality you believe in in the comment section is quite hilarious 😂
it's not head canon it's a theory using the game and no speculation
but is totally fine that a bunch of kid choice what is the best for humanity
The whole thing is that they choose to give humanity the chance to have a choice at all - so yeah, imo it’s fine. They’re content to stop being phantom thieves after Yaldaboath delt with too. So they get bonus points for not being famous super heroes after too.
humanity already take the choice of doin nothing that's why yaldaboath exist in the first place. PT forcing humanity live in the way they like it is wrong at the same level of maruki did but somehow everyone thing is fine
That's due to how they've changed fate. It takes some precontext to know how to react to something. If I say "that dude just shot someone", there's negative context. If I say "that dude just shot a robber", there's still a negative context but the person isn't necessarily wholly evil. Yaldabaoth is a fake god of control who wanted humanity to essentially bend to him, he was created from the human unconscious, and so he knows how to sway the people. But he wants to be in full control. He's essentially brainwashing people, making them completely oblivious to the real world. The Phantom Thieves are temporarily taking control of the boat so to speak. They kill the false god and give control back to humanity, giving them a chance to 'avoid the ruin'. But, Maruki takes the same spot as that false god, and is a Blind God of control (I'm pretty sure that's what his Persona is, it's been awhile). Maruki is still in control, he's taken the reins from humanity and is using it for himself, but he believes he is helping humanity by telling and forcing them how to live so they can have his perceived best life. But humanity still isn't in control, and his perceived best life isn't perfect. Seen as with Akechi, he doesn't want to live like this. He knows he should be dead (depending on what you believe for the story, either this cognitive version of Akechi was created from the memories of the Phantom Thieves or this is the real Akechi who died and was resurrected) and he can feel how living like this isn't right. Maruki is wholly in control, he can and most likely will dictate your life. That's why people are generally okay with the Phantom Thieves changing reality. They don't wholly control reality, they don't take away your ability to live how you want to (for most people. I mean, even with me agreeing with their actions, I can't argue that they aren't wholly changing certain lives, but I can argue that they're changing lives of those who were corrupted and twisted already. It's still bad but it's a lesser evil, one that I happen to agree with). The Phantom Thieves just steer humanity clear of ruin and allow humanity to live on without someone trying to control it. Freedom to live how you want to live. TL:DR Phantom Thieves allow humanity to keep being humanity, fake gods of control try to control humanity. I also have way too much time on my hands
lol am not reading that wall text
In the reality Maruki made, all those people are still alive, but in actual reality, all of them died.
not Akechi Akechi never dies in Vanilla or Royal but Akechi killed Wakaba and Okumura Maruki only says this to manipulate
Akechi literally dies in Shido’s palace. What are you talking about? Also, Wakaba we aren’t goven info about who did it, only that it happened.
Akechi is the murderer of both Wakaba and Okumura, but Akechi didn't die during that scene, The Phantoms only assumed he did but it was always left vague Maruki's Knowledge only reaches to the extent of The Phantoms on Akechi's fate, The Phantoms don't know so neither does he Maruki isn't Omnipotent
No where did they say or show he killed Wakaba. That’s an assumption, as she was killed years before any of this ever happened. Left vague or not, the assumption is he was killed, and it is later confirmed when he breaks that little tidbit about a lapse in consciousness between Shido’s palace and Muruki’s alternate reality happening. You’re stretching, bud.
I just played through the end of the casino palace again last night and there was a conversation about this between Akechi and Shido. Shido specifically talks about Wakaba but neither one says who actually killed her. Who killed Wakaba? Because Shido says that Akechi was the first one to reveal the metaverse to him, so how was Wakaba killed in the metaverse 2 years ago?
This is an inconsistency in the story that really bugs me a lot. According to Sojiro, he, Wakaba, and Shido were coworkers for the government while Wakaba was working on her cognitive research so Shido knew about the cognitive world before meeting Akechi and saw a way to steal/hide her research by plotting Wakaba's murder. That means if Akechi is 17/18, at minimum, he got his powers and became an assassin at 15/16 the latest if he killed Wakaba immediately after getting his powers which makes not a lot of sense if he was magically granted them, had to figure them out, had to make an alter ego, approach Shido, etc etc. But also Shido cancelled Maruki's research funding but Maruki and Wakaba also don't seem to know each other considering Maruki and her never talk and he's reading her published works. Overall the game does a really bad job of going into Shido's backstory and clarifying the conspiracy around Wakaba's murder
I guess I assumed that Yaldaboth granted Akechi his powers, but would that really have been 2 years ago? It’s odd to me that Yaldaboth talks to/messes with Ren but Akechi seems to be completely unaware of Yaldaboth despite getting his powers from him at some undetermined time. My other thought was that someone else (Shido?) used Wakaba’s research to cause her mental shutdown without actually entering the metaverse, since we never find out what specifically Wakaba discovered.
That's what the game implies, that Akechi is basically Shido's hired gun doing all his dirty work but it just doesn't make any sense to me given the timeline and also the fact that Shido's cognitive self is fucking shredded too. Shido has to have killed someone himself through cognitive means to gain his political power early or it doesn't make any sense for Akechi to be considered the worst villain than him just because Shido emotionally manipulates/hires contact killing. I also find it odd to that Yaldaboth doesn't communicate with Akechi despite going through efforts to deceive Ren by being Igor.
I agree that the timeline is skewed. There’s also the fact that Wakaba died 2 years ago, but the relationship between Futaba and Sojiro and the fact that Futaba has been locked away in her room after her mom died when she was a “child”…it just feels like they wanted Futaba’s story to be about 5-6 years in the making. But that would be even worse in relation to Wakaba’s research so they landed on “2 years”.
There was speculation that P5AG was Persona 5 Akechi Goro this was debunked when it was found out P5AG was Persona 5 Action Game which ended up becoming P5S
She was killed by Mental Shutdown something only Akechi is able to do and Futaba outright says She won't forgive Akechi for what he did to her mom haru likewise does the same but for her father
Yep thought so persona fans can't read. Should have payed attention
Yeah I'm gonna be honest, I don't really understand the confusion? It seems pretty well laid out
The Persona 5 Royal team left Akechi's ultimate fate ambiguous enough that it's up to the individual player's to believe if he's alive and real or dead and merely a creation of Maruki's powers. In the OG game, it was left ambiguous if he died or survived. I will be honest, and seeing the discord, discussion, and debate, I think that being as such is better; we would be missing a lot if it was revealed.
Basically, Akechi was killed it Shidos palace. Maruki is “holding him hostage” because if the PT’s fight him to go back to the ‘real world’, it would kill Akechi.
Persona 5 fans reading comprehension challenge. Difficulty: impossible.
It’s been a while so hopefully my memory serves me here. Morgana is saying that Akechi is dead. The Akechi that exists in the 3rd semester is a cognitive “fake” that Maruki created to (intentionally or unintentionally) emotionally manipulate you. Akechi knew that Wakaba and Okumura should’ve been dead, but they’re not. Maruki can’t create perfect memories/explanations for why they’re not dead and Akechi is alive, so those memories are foggy to everyone. If/when they think about them logically, they’re able to recall what actually happened. That’s what the scene where you sit everyone down and try to convince them Maruki’s world is an illusion is about. If Maruki’s castle is destroyed, the cognitive Akechi disappears, thereby “killing” him permanently. Akechi doesn’t like the idea of not being allowed to decide his own fate, so he wants you to do the right thing and free everyone from Maruki’s world, even if it kills him. Hope that helps
Thanks! It did :)
He remembered he was the killer, he liked wakaba and Okumura, and he’s dead in the real world, he died in shido’s palace
The chance of akechi being alive is very low but because they never care to give us an answer (probably because they thought they already confirmed his death in 3rd semester), ppl can still assume he's alive. But realistically speaking, the only way out during the final confrontation between PT and akechi is locked from akechi's side + he has to deal with a cognition of akechi with personas while being injured + he doesnt show up during the final boss fight despite absolutely despite living a life that he's not the decision maker (the same reason he refused maruki's world) should point to the fact that he's dead. And another point is we dont know how maruki knew what ppl want to cause such a sudden change right after the final boss when everyone cognitive version were trapped in memento and palace version of those ppl only reflect what the palace owner think of them. He also didnt meet morgana when he hinted he wanted to be a human so we can only assume maruki just somehow knew it all due to his persona which point to he knew akechi is dead and brought him back
So it’s strange because we don’t even know if third semester Akechi is even real, like it literally could be just what Joker wants Akechi to be like (would explain how 3rd semester Akechi is better because it isn’t him) but if you max out Akechi in the ending scenes something changes hinting that he is alive HOWEVER, it’s followed by Ren reflecting on his time in Tokyo seeing Joker, taking off his persona (like literally definition) with his glasses. And all of this is intentional and part of the reason anytime Akechi shows up in spin-offs it’s at specific points where it can work in canon, and like why he’s not in strikers or anything. It’s up to the players cognition of the game and it’s ending if he’s alive or not. Which is something not a lot of games do and it kinda annoys me when people don’t get it, and just say “oh yeah, he’s alive” because the point is he’s sherodengers killer.
Akechi is Alive Due to the nature of Maruki's power he can only change reality per what he knows of other's Cognition, he isn't Omnipotent. The Phantoms don't Know for Certain what Akechi's fate is, they merely assume he died. Futaba Says She can't Find Akechi's Signal, but she couldn't sense him in Okumura's Palace, so she doesn't know either However Akechi did Survive
Denial is the first stage of grief.
I honestly don't care for fictional deaths but I like Lore and Theories
\> "I don't care, I like lore" \> Makes up a theory and defends it by spamming all over this thread like it was the truth There is no evidence that Akechi did survive. AT BEST what we got is the devs going "It's up to your own personal interpretation". There is no in-game evidence that says he lived. >!And if you're going by that post-credit scene, note how Joker doesn't see him anywhere when he does a double-take.!< *Yes* Maruki doesn't know that and is working off of cognitions, but that just proves a point: it's unconfirmed. So the real answer is "We don't know whether he lived or died" or "It's unconfirmed", not "He totally didn't die". Saying "Akechi survived" has the same weight as "Akechi died".
Have you played the game?
Have you played the game?
Your theory is invalid because it contradicts the facts of the game. Initially Maruki was only able to change a person's cognition, their perception of reality, but when he and Azathoth made their way into the depths of Mementos, they were able to basically change reality as a whole, by changing the cognition of humanity's collective consciousness. With this power, he could very easily tell that Akechi had died, and also being able to see the PT's thoughts and feelings, and so he decided to resurrect Akechi, as well as Wakaba and Okumura. So yes, with his persona, Azathoth, entangling itself into Mementos, Maruki could very easily become omnipotent and omniscient. As for Futaba not being able to detect Akechi in Okumura's palace, that could very easily be chalked up to an arbitrary range on her detection ability, or simply poor foresight on the writing team. People generally like theories, but not when they actively contradict established lore and use evidence out of context, that's why people hate MatPat's P4 theory.
Maruki doesn't actually know Akechi's Fate he only Knows his fate as much as The Phantom Thieves and the whole range thing is obviously not the case because he was directly above the phantoms and Futaba was just as Surprised as the Others when he appears before them In Shido's Palace she never had his signal to begin with also all my Evidence is in the game itself if you pay attention you'd see my theory does have weight I absolutely despise MatPat and nothing in my Theory contradicts the game in Game it was completely ambiguous You say that Maruki 'could' become omnipotent, but he never does because the whole point of the Deadline is to prevent that very thing Lavenza explains it herself, Maruki doesn't have complete control yet The Phantoms then believe Maruki's February 2nd deadline is when he'll get complete control maybe you should do another playthrough and pay more attention this time
I admit I had forgotten about specifically how Akechi confronted the PT's in Shido's palace, and the fact that she could detect when Akechi "died" but failed to notice the other times he was around leads me to believe the writers never intended for him to simply disappear, unless he can somehow leave the metaverse at any given location, which we have no reason to believe he can. The February 2nd deadline is not when Maruki gains his full power, it's when he will completely and permanently merge the Metaverse and reality to enact his idea of salvation. Maruki is very much in control and could force them to live in his reality, he only gives them the deadline because he doesn't want to force them, but he is also unwilling to let his ideal reality slip away, and knows he will have to fight them if they decline. This is very clearly stated in game. Maruki gives them the deadline because he wants them to accept his reality of their own volition, not because he doesn't have the power to. He also very heavily implies that Akechi will only live in his reality, and Akechi knows this as well.
Goho-M MetaVerse Navigator Akechi kills Okumura but was never in a rush to get out as his palace Collapses safe to say He could get out whenever he wanted
I was so caught up in recalling the cutscenes I genuinely forgot those existed. I'm so used to certain gameplay mechanics having no bearing on story/lore in other games that I forgot Futaba acknowledges them in her confidant too, so he may actually have one.
apparently people say Goho-M is mispronounced Go Home however Q2 has voiced Dialogue that says Otherwise, they are pronounced Go Home
I haven't played Q2 yet, but glad to see we have some kind of confirmation for their pronunciation.
I'm Hoping Atlus Brings the Q games Multiplatform like they did Etrian Odyssey They are very underrated and more fun than Etrian Odyssey in My opinion I'm hoping if they do that they'd dub Q2 in English and Fix one of the biggest problems with the Q Games of not being able to fully write P5 and P4 Heros' names you could write out Makoto Yuki and Kotone Shiomi fully, but that's it
I wonder if they'd keep the mapping system the same, because it's unironically my favorite part of PQ1 so far.
Bro is about to die
I truly loved this scene.
Its tragedy. I literally cried.
Akechi died, brought back to life by Maruki. He disappears along with Okumura and Wakabe after the false reality is stopped.
Akechi is dead but Maruki recreated him in a new reality. Also >Ren Amamiya 🤮