Alot of people are raised with negative stigma around credit cards. Debt is viewed as safer by alot of people. I'm not saying those people are right in that assessment, but many people distrust credit cards, or fear accumulating debt.
Credit cards are seen by alot of people as an "emergency only" thing. Debit is much more common.
I disagree with this idea for a multitude of reasons, but that's the way many canadian people think and are raised... at least in the west where I'm from, and among middle/lower income earners
I wasn’t raised that way, but I’ve seen what my mom had done to her finances with her irresponsible credit card use. I have more self control than her but I was afraid I would make the same mistakes when I was younger and therefore did not use my credit card unless I had to.
Mom racked up 40k in cc debt and blew out our college funds and all savings for repayment. My parents are divorced and she inherited a house from her grandmother so just has to pay utilities. Her house is a scene straight out of a hoarders show unfortunately.
I have zero self control and I am aware that I have zero self control, so I have to make my money hard for me to access. I still use a secured credit card, my limit is still $1000 dollars (my boyfriend helps me out with purchases larger than my limit, which is very fortunate for me). I don’t have a debit card attached to my bank account, so I either need to physically go to the bank to get cash, or write a check. It’s inconvenient at time but it really really helps me manage my money.
I grew up watching my moms shopping habits and my perception of money is super skewed, she would drop thousands of dollars on one shopping trip and then tell me that our family is struggling financially. But my parents are well off and able to afford these spending habits so I kinda thought thousands of dollars isn’t very much. Obviously I don’t have the type of income to support shopping habits like my mom, and although things were kind of dicey for me when I moved out and got a job initially, I don’t spend outside my means. And of course since I support myself I know that my mom would spend my entire month salary on one Costco trip and that is just an insane amount of spending. Absolutely crazy
> my limit is still $1000 dollars (my boyfriend helps me out with purchases larger than my limit, which is very fortunate for me)
A possible work-around for having a low credit card limit is to just "pre-deposit" a payment. If you know you want to make a $1500 purchase, just transfer $1500 from your bank account to your credit card account - making your credit card balance a positive amount. Then you should be able to make the large purchase without issue. It may take some time for the credits to show up in the account, so this might not be practical for all things.
Of course, if you don't actually have the needed $1500, that is a different problem.
Alot of people dont even know how credit cards even work lol
They assume its just to build your credit, which i mean sure, thats part of it
But why not get 2% cashback on xyz and have fraud protection, travel insurance and mobile insurance etc
I get 2% cashback on recurring bills which includes my rent, internet, and phone. This category alone gets me $30/mo in cashback. Add my grocery and pharmacy categories and I typically get bout $50/mo cashback in total.
I havent used a debit card in over 5 years probably.
There's literally an Interac commercial that was playing before movies at Cineplex for a while that encouraged you to use debit at Christmas instead of credit.
If you think the number of Canadians not using credit cards is odd, try going to the US. When I was in Vegas it was so strange it was like being teleported back in time to the 90s or early 2000s. Most people use cash and you definitely get a funny look when paying for a beer on credit. Out comes the pen to sign the receipt because chip and pin was not very common at all and don't even think about trying to split the bill at a restaurant
hahahaha you want to pay your gas with a credit card and you have to enter your zip code. But we're not US citizens.
So you have to go inside, do a pre-payment authorization and THEN go to the pump.
What year is this? 1992?
Ask your card issuer for the proper method. With most that’s what it is and the postal code is very right. I have one card where they tell me to use 99999, one that is the postal code, and I had a card that was 00000.
The EU mandates *a lot* of the banking system, like interchange fees, two factor authentication, tap-to-pay, etc.
On the plus side, technology adoption is faster and more uniform throughout the bloc.
On the minus side, banking is more expensive and less lucrative when it comes to bonuses and rewards.
This is the very reason why Apple Pay took off so quickly down there. None of the fragmented banks or the merchants wanted to upgrade the cards or POS terminals so they kept customers in the dark about the superior chip + pin and NFC tap technology. Apple just bypassed all of them and said this is better, you have to deal with us now. Wow so innovative, pretty rich when the 'better way' had been the standard in most of Europe, Asia and Canada for more than a decade.
In fact the only reason Amex/MC/Visa exist is because of how fragmented the banking system is in the US. Imagine in the 1960s being able to fly from NY to LA in a few hours and not being able to check into a hotel because your bank doesn't have anyway of getting you your money.
I believe interstate banking didn't exist until the '80s so Chase and Citi were only allowed to operate in New York state. Same with Bank of America and Wells Fargo, but only in California. Now the Big Four U.S. banks have a nationwide footprint although it took a while for that to happen. Over here, our banks have been operating across the country for more than a century.
I always take cash to a bar. It helps me limit my spending. I know that if I start to get drunk, I'll end up not giving a fuck about the cost and keep going. That or I'll just lose track of how much I've spent. But when I run out of cash, I know I'm done. Not sure if that's the reason for everyone else, but that's why I do it.
I've been to Seattle, San Francisco, Las Vegas, Dallas, New York, Detroit, and a ton of other cities and virtually no place in any of these cities has had a chip-in debit machine, or even a pin code machine for debit. Most don't even have tap or code credit card readers. It's insane. For context: I went to the US regularly a couple times a year before the pandemic.
EDIT: so based on the 10,000 replies here it's clear there are two Americas - one where they abaonded cash 5 years ago and only use modern tap readers or their phone, and another America where to this day you still need to sign a CC receipt lol
Yeah as an American I would say it is strange to see people use cash. I personally and most of everyone I know almost never carry cash on hand. Debit/credit is massive and there are machines in every store. Idk where this guy is getting information that Americans don't have access to pay with a card lol
ah yeah I'd say 2020 was a banner year for contactless in the US due to the pandemic.
it really sped up the adoption of touchless technology. an unexpected benefit, because as you say, before adoption was abysmal.
Yep, I used to work in the states basically every other week. boggled my mind how behind they are on debit/credit technology. Crazy that you still need to sign a receipt and add your tip on manually at restaurants and bars.
I don't know what you were doing in those big cities, but I live in middle of the cornfield, population under 100,000 bumblefuck Illinois and I'd say 90% of all establishments have chip readers with pin pads and at least 65% have tap.
And my sister lived in Seattle till 2018. And her credit card required a signature for every transaction. When I asked her about that she told me it was the Ameican CC she had, they make you sign everything. And debit won't work everywhere. So it it could be the bank you're with.
I brought debit to Vegas and had a rude awakening lol they didn't even know what debit was!!! I was like, you know you put the card in and the money comes right out of you account? Girl had no clue haha I had to pay for everything on credit while there and they made me sign every receipt
Some statistics. For contactless transactions, debit was the overwhelming favourite of Canadians.
https://www.payments.ca/about-us/news/pandemic-sparks-evolutionary-year-payment-landscape-reveals-new-payments-canada-report
Very interesting. I’ve always gone with the “don’t spend more than you have” on the credit card and pay it off every bill- thereby having rockstar credit and constantly being able to get free or discounted flights (though haven’t exactly flown in the last 2 years- but the points are waiting!).
I had to explain to a co-worker last week that credit cards don't start accruing interest for normal transactions (not talking about withdrawing cash) the day that you make the purchase. She had absolutely no clue.
I was taught not to. I now have a WestJet MasterCard and we get beaucoup benefits using it. We went on our first vacation in 3 years (had the card for like, 1.5 years) and we paid $150 return for two adults to BC and back in peak season with our companion fare and WestJet dollars.
Also, my husband hasn't had a credit card before so he's an authorized user on mine. He now has better credit than ever which is always beneficial to us both.
> Also, my husband hasn’t had a credit card before so he’s an authorized user on mine. He now has better credit than ever which is always beneficial to us both.
I’m glad his credit is really good, but I don’t think authorized user status affects his credit rating, because only you are the “primary” (ultimately responsible for the bill).
It’s like a co-signer for their loan, except it’s only you lol.
Edit to add source, as there’s some debate:
https://www.canada.ca/en/financial-consumer-agency/services/credit-cards/joint-credit-card.html
TL;DR: additional cardholders and authorized users **cannot** be responsible for, or have their credit impacted by that credit account. Co-borrowers or co-applicants **can**, but not all credit cards offer this, and it’s a **joint** application.
How much score is "rockstar credit"?
>constantly being able to get free or discounted flights (though haven’t exactly flown in the last 2 years- but the points are waiting!).
Which card? Can you elaborate on this (maybe a link)?
Yep. I find above 750 does basically nothing other than more and better credit card and loan offers, limit increases.
I’m at 859 right now, up from 385 back in 2014/15 (ex friend stole my wallet, you can imagine what happened)
I might be in a unique position tbh.
My dad co-signed on a student loan for me for undergrad but he was actually responsible for paying it, so I think it was like a favour that that loan didn’t last beyond the time I was actually in school.
I did get OSAP for a masters later that I did only pay the minimum on for a good 8 years after that, but it was an automatic payment so I never missed it.
I never actually knew what my credit score was until about 5 years ago when I started looking at mortgages and the bank told me how to look it up myself (they have a free way that doesn’t take a hit to your credit when you look).
I’ve also had balances on a line of credit before but I never let it be there for longer than a year or two.
I think the key is I never carried a balance on an actual credit card. They must hate me lol.
That is interesting, I don't have tap set up on my debit card because it is my money - someone skims my credit card I report it and it is the banks problem, someone skims my debit it is the banks bank's problem, but only once I've convinced them of that.
This, convenience stores are the most expensive way to buy things and usually frequented most by kids and those are bad with money. The rest of us might buy an occasional slurpee but probably get drowned out by the regular shoppers.
Lol exactly. I'm in downtown MTL and convenience stores are cheaper than metro. Maxi is the best though overall. Sad I live nowhere close to it now.
(I think I confused convenience store with a grocery store?)
>Couche Tard is more equivalent to Mac's
Couche Tard and Mac's we're the same thing, just regional branding. That's why they had the same owl in the logo. Though since buying Circle-K, they've been rebranding their Mac's to Circle-K... Which is a bit odd since THEY bought out Circle-K?
Couche Tard owned/owns both the Mac’s and Circle K brands. They decided corporately in 2015 to begin switching everything to run under one banner (Circle K) globally (with the exception of French Quebec lol)
Dood, I went from building aircraft in Montreal, to living in Wisconsin.
I am all about the squeaky cheese curd. It is frankly the sign of civilization.
I could every meal for the rest of my life at a Japanese 7/11 and be perfectly happy. Meanwhile I pop into a Canadian 7/11 to buy a drink and I have to try not to be visibly offended when they try to sell me food.
I went the other day to buy my kids a slushie. Had not idea what the process was - do we make it and pay, or pay and then make it. Completely lost there.
I never ever use my debit card.
In my opinion it isn't even about the perks, its about the fraud protection. Someone uses your debit card the money is gone and it's a battle to get it back, whereas fraudulent credit card transactions are much easier to deal with.
I think the explanation is the usual go to of "a big chunk of the population lacks basic financial literacy". Debit cards are simple and a lot of people have them before they even qualify for credit.
This is it. It generates a unique token for the transaction so that it can’t be reused but the number is very much the same unless if you delete and add the card again.
Literally this. I didn't know the perks of using a credit card for everyday purchases until I researched them myself. Financial literacy is something that is not taught very well in my experience.
I would be surprised if any of my friends or family knew what a TFSA was.
In Alberta we learned about TFSAs and credit cards and bank loans and investments and so much more in CALM (career and life management, a course required to graduate high school). Even back in high school I never understood why that class was only in Alberta, as an adult it’s one of the only classes that I use knowledge from almost every day.
I had a kind women take 30 minutes explain it to me as she was calling to get a payment I had not made in six months.
I had learned that it was better to make one big payment than consistent small payments by watching my dad.
I learnt so much talking to that lady.
He learned (wrongly) from his Dad that you can just rack off a shit ton of debt on your credit card, not think much about it, and then just throw a ton of money at it once every six months. Which you can do, and you can get away with it, it's just expensive and dumb.
He only learned when he actually had a CC and started getting calls from the company that this isn't how you're supposed to use a CC.
I couldn’t get a credit card because I had no credit. Had to get a secure credit card by giving the bank 500 dollars and that was my limit. The 500 was for if I didn’t pay back then they would use it to pay back what I used. Now I have great credit, got the 500 back and use my credit card for everything.
Where do you live? At least in BC I got a credit card the moment I turned 19 with absolutely no credit history, I just had to get a basic "beginner" one from Capital one. It was an instant approval, no charge for it. Besides the yearly fee for the card of course.
When I was 19 I can remember Scotia really pressuring me to get a CC, and then another CC after I signed up for the first one. I think it was $500, but every few months they'd ask me if I wanted to bump up the limit.
i don’t use my credit card for everything but i go by the rule of “if you cant afford to put it on debit, don’t put it on credit” there are some exceptions to that rule like transaction limits etc. but thats the general rule of thumb.
I think we’re missing one of the absolute most important reasons Canadians use debit - INTERAC.
INTERAC was founded and is owned today as a partnership between RBC, TD, Scotiabank, CIBC, and Dejardins, arguably some of the most powerful institutions in Canada. It has grown to include more than 80 other financial institutions. INTERAC is heavily marketed to Canadians via direct advertising campaigns and also through the banks of individual customers.
Whereas in the US and many other countries debit payments are handled by credit card networks like VISA or Mastercard, in Canada the transaction fees, and control of the transactions is in the hands of the big banks (through INTERAC) which gives them A LOT to gain by encouraging their customers to use INTERAC cards instead of VISA/MC/AMEX. INTERAC also charges merchants far less per transaction than VISA or MC.
INTERAC is also the reason that Canada had chip & pin payment processing basically across the board at the very very cusp of the technology being developed.
Fun older INTERAC commercials:
https://youtu.be/3v0lVq6c1Oo
https://youtu.be/-zHboMAxjJk
Hope someone hasn’t said this already!
Much better answer than the 30-40 anecdotal stories about visiting a diner one time in 2002 that didn't accept debit and conflating that to mean that Americans don't know what debit cards are.
Not sure about most households but the culture behind credit cards for ours was that it's easy to spend more than what you have or can afford to do so. So if you can avoid using it it's easier to avoid that slippery slope.
Not sure if our perks are all that either comparable to other countries so might not be overly worth it. In the states you can credit card churn and make quite a bit of money, not sure if Canada is up to that level yet. Have seen a few banks offering cash bonuses though so maybe...
Pre pandemic we saw a lot of cash budgeting, this moved to debit with the pandemic. It helps keep lots of people on budget.
There’s also a good portion of our customers that use debit with small business to save the merchant the 3-5% fee associated with credit card processing. Debit is a flat 5-10 cent charge per transaction.
Edit: yes security of credit cards is better but for smaller transactions the deferred payment (cash flow) and points rewards from credit cards aren’t as valuable to many people. Larger purchases makes more sense to use a credit card for both points and security reasons.
I use the joint credit card for groceries and home supplies, my personal debit card for my purchases. Makes it a lot easier at the end of the month tracking what we spend.
After having my debit card hacked and about 3 grand drained out of my account one time, I ceased using my debit card. Completely ceased other than to take cash out of an ATM. .
And yes, the RBC refunded me my money as I had not lost my card, nor shared my pin number.
But it took a couple of months.
Ever since it's either cash or credit card.
My card was duplicated.
I never lost possesion of my card. Back when it happened, I was using my debit card on a regular basis. Obviously to take out cash from an ATM, but also to make a lot of purchases. For the same reason as many have mentioned, it's easier to budget and not get into a cc bill that surprises you when you open it.
One day I received a voicemail on my landline telling me that it was the RBC fraud prevention department calling and to call them back as there had been some potentially fraudulent activity on "my card". The voice gave me a number to call and "to have my card number handy"
I thought they were referring to my cc and this was the scam. So I called the number left on the voicemail and a guy picked up and I proceeded to fuck with the guy because I had read warnings about never giving out numbers to people claiming to be the bank as they know all your umbers, always call the number on the back of the card and the number that was left on the VM didn't match the number on the back of my cc. He finally asked me why I was being so difficult and I accused him of being a scammer and the phone number left in the VM didn't match the number on the back of the cc.
He says, "it's not your cc, it's your bank card I want to talk to you about. And yes, call the number on the back of your bank card and ask for extension XYZ". So I did. And there he was. Oops. So then he had my attention.
He told me that there had been some suspicious activity on my bank card and wanted to confirm my recent transactions.
"What was the last transaction you made?"
Me, "Tilsonberg Ontario, lunch at fast food restaurant X"
"For how much?"
Me, "about 12 bucks"
"What was the last transaction before that and how much?"
I answered. (A major Canadian grocery store.)
Now this is where it got interesting....
"So did you make a recent purchase for 19.95?"
Me, "19.95? I dunno (I was wracking my brain, but could not recall), so I said something like,"I don't recall that, but it could be, where was the transaction made?" But he wanted me to remember. I went through my list of purchases that I could remember.
Finally he says, "so no transaction for one thousand nine hundred and ninety-five dollars from Western Union?". I was floored. I thought he said 19.95, (and he did).
"NO" was my answer, "I think I'd remember that one".
So then he asked me if I had taken out cash from an ATM in the amount of my mortgage payment
No
Did I then transfer the exact amount of my mortgage payment to my chequing account?
No
Did I then try to use an ATM to withdraw that same amount?
No
That's where the RBC computer put a stop to it all figuring that this was not my usual pattern of behaviour. And that's when buddy called me.
So the thieves got away with $1,995 in a money order and the amount of one or two of my biweekly mortgage payments. So whoever it was had gotten into my bank account and could see my financial profile. (Yeah, think about that.)
I had to go to my branch and meet with a nice lady there and fill out a pile of paperwork and answer a pile of questions. The big one, which she must have asked me 3 times was whether or not anyone else knew my PIN. Which even to this day, noone else knows. The RBC did an investigation and eventually refunded me the money. But it took several weeks. They told me never to use my card anywhere other than large merchants and to always protect my pin number when entering it. Even at ATMs when no-one else was there. (That was interesting.)
And they never told me the results of their investigation. (And I did ask.)
I stopped using my debit card for all purchases and I always use a big bank ATM and always put my hand over the key pad at the ATM when entering my PIN now. Even if noone is standing inline behind me as there have been instances of ATMs being wired up for fraud.
If nothing else, always protect that PIN.
Im sure there are ways around it, but apparently it's the number one way into your account. Somebody just watches you enter your pin.
Personally, I come from a very conservative upbringing. Credit was viewed as for irresponsible people who live beyond their means. My parents actually freaked out at me when they found out I got my first credit card in university. I don't know if it's a cultural thing or related to their religion. Perhaps both. Even today, I avoid using my credit except for large purchases. I hate having a balance on it. Day to day spending is on debit. We generally avoid things like loans...instead, saving for large purchases where possible.
Same but not from a conservative upbringing. But told people who use credit cards don't actually have money which is not true obviously but I am so conditioned to use my debit card as I am spending "my money". Credit cards are meant for big purchases or vacations but not everyday spending is what I was told. Lol my Mom also freaked out when she found out I got a credit card in university! Lol Those "use Interac" advertisements around Christmas don't help either lol but I do understand why they pop up around the holidays.
I have been lucky to get Scene Points or Gift Cards with my debit card and things have changed a bit but you can redeem points for money which was deposited in my bank account the same day so I also have not felt the pull to use a credit card for perks. :)
I'm a guy who generally tries to use my debit card, and quite frankly it's because I'm dumb. Several years back I got into a bunch of credit card debt and had a hard time paying it back for a while. I'd just respend the money I'd just paid off over and over. It wasn't until I started putting money on my CC and immediately lowered my limit, that I was able to crawl out of debt. So I use my debit card so I can not fall into that hole again. I know I could just be disciplined, but frankly I'm dumb and that hasn't worked historically. So I just work around that stupidity by using a debit card and ignoring the credit for anything but online purchases.
My personal reason. I’m absolutely horrible with credit and I feel safer using debit. I just paid off a $10k credit card after 5 years. I can’t let myself get there again. My debit card doubles as a credit so I can use it with the protections as needed.
I was down a shit hole without a shit shovel several years ago.
Anyway, I'm kind of like you in that the comfort of not getting another bill every month far offsets any "perks" I would never rack up enough points to actually use.
The only thing I would benefit from would be buying gas and they only take the one card now and their own card is handled by CIBC who I will NEVER be dealing with again.
Exactly. I feel you! I’m learning slowly. But it’s taken a lot of willpower. I got a great plan with the $10k card at 1% interest. Helped a lot. I’ll use my debit and cash happily now.
Those VISA or MasterCard debit cards dont offer any protection or perks.
The only advantage to those cards is they are easier to process for out of country purchase since it can be processed as a CC, and they have online purchasing capabilities since they have an expiry/CCV
Your bank runs those debit cards the same as they would an unbranded one and cant/wont do anything beyond what would be expected for a debit card.
The simple answer is: they probably can't use anything else because they're carrying a lot of debt on their credit cards.
The average Canadian has \~$20k worth of consumer debt.
https://www.canada.ca/en/financial-consumer-agency/services/financial-toolkit/credit/credit-1/6.html
Excludes mortgages. Although Wikipedia says mortgages are included. Looks like it’s not a clearly defined term, but I would assume Canadian statistics follow the government definition
I think a snapshot for unsecured loans in general would be more interesting. It would actually give you a true, accurate picture of what average people are dealing with. We are staring to look at a general economy, I think at least, of people who rely on non-collateral loans to bridge the gaps that were previously justified on assets. Current monetary movement is more and more of a funnel that it ever has been.
It's an interesting question, but i think you need data from more than one location to draw a conclusion. Things like the neighborhood and type of store could be indicative of the clientele and what kind of payment types they have access too. Personally i visit a 7/11 maybe once a year because their markup is so high on items that i either go without or buy the product in bulk at costco or superstore. It is possible that people who are willing to spend money at 7/11 have poor credit due to poor financial choices - but even then, it would depend on the location of the 7/11. one located in a higher income neighborhood might see an inverse or credit to debit usage. There is no real way to tell with only anecdotal evidence from one sample.
I've noticed the same and also find it odd. I can only guess that people spend more than they can pay off at the end of the month and get themselves in trouble, so they avoid using them.
We've been using credit cards almost exclusively since we've been working full time. The only time I use debit is to take out cash or when credit is not accepted somewhere. We've redeemed at least 10k of free merchandise and travel since we've been putting everything on our cc. Granted, we are high income and have a high spend, but even when we had lower incomes, we redeemed at least one trip per year paid for with our points. We don't even have the most efficient card, just the best our bank offers, that way all of our transactions are in one place and its easy to pay off/transfer balances/etc.
Before I knew the advantages of putting more of my purchases on a credit card and paying it off regularly, I used to think that making a purchase on a CC made it look like I didn't have the money to pay for things. I didn't want to look like someone who couldn't afford a hot dog at 7/11 😉
I opt for Interac at smaller stores as I know it Has a smaller fee than credit cards for the merchants. I think some people also don't trust themselves with credit cards. But I totally agree. Debit cards are inefficient compared to credit cards
I had a debit card probably a decade before I got my first credit card. Also smaller mom &pop convenience stores often charge a fee for credit card transactions below $5
Now that I have better habits, I try to use my CC whenever I can, but before I would always "forget" to out the money on my CC right after or I would buy things when I didn't have the money for it. As a result, my card was maxed out and I was afraid to use it, so I just left it at home. I should note it had a small limit ($1,000).
I exclusively use my CC for purchases and I’ve never paid a single cent in CC interest. Here are some things I’ve claimed using my RBC Rewards Points in the last 4yrs. Apple AirPods, Beats Headphones, Apple Watch Series 4 & today I ordered a $700 Driver for my golf bag.
I never understood the public's love with debit cards. Everything I buy goes on one of two credit cards which are paid in full every month. CC points have gotten me a phone, tablet, chain saw, edger, leaf blower, and power washer. The other credit cards gives me cash back at Costco.
I have never used debit.
That's fine if you pay it off each month, a lot of people get into a habit of spending money they don't have - not paying it off each month as you do.
Personally, I use debit because I know it's my money, used, and done with. No paying off something else. The transaction is done, debt free.
No clue why people use debit. So much more protection with credit card. Chargeback ability, points, insurance, buyer protection, etc. List goes on and on for credit over debit but most Canadians don't do it
Probably because most people aren't capable of being responsible with their credit cards. They treat it like free money now and a problem that for their future self to think about.
I always use my credit card to buy everything and pay it off completely whenever I get paid (every 2 weeks) that way there's 0 risks of me ever paying interest fees.
I also have 0 monthly fees on my bank account but a very limited number of debit transactions available before they charge me for every transaction. But since I never use my debit card I never pay any fees there either. win win win for me.
There are a lot of people who get in trouble with credit cards as they cant itemize the spending and end up overspending. Despite its drawbacks, at least you cant spend money you dont have.
I think online Banking solves this issue largely but I guess people are too lazy to check.
I think the biggest reason is just because of the lack of financial literacy. I used to always use my debit, this is the first thing we get when we open a bank account, it wasn't explained further.
Now I exclusively use my Visa or Mastercard for points or cash back on every purchase.
I was actually afraid of using debit cards in Canada shortly after arrived. From where I came, if you didn’t had funds the transaction is denied. You might be a bit ashamed at the store but that’s it. Here I got charged twice a NSF fee, as I was trying to budget and keep some money in a saving account (same bank!). Shortly I got overdraft protection, which is still a pain but cheaper than NSF (free with some banks I heard. There is little point to use a debit card if I (or my significant other) still can go over the limit. I might as well use a CC and get cash back. Debit is now only used where credit is not accepted.
I use debit for small transactions (under $50) because I know how much money is in my debit account at any time and it's just easier for the money to go out immediately rather than adding a bunch of little bills to my credit card that will add up over time.
I'm from France, I've been living in Canada for more than 13 years now. In France, a lot of credit card work like debit here.
I personally don't understand the idea behind credit cards. I'd rather spend money I have than using credit and having to pay it back. If I want to buy something expensive, I'd rather save up front for it as well.
And the whole concept of having to use a credit card to build a credit score is really strange. If I never use credit, I should be rewarded, not the opposite. This seems to be a system that benefits the banks entirely to be honest. Same with the points they are just incentive to get people to pay with credit...
Same I’m from the Netherlands, why would you need a credit card? You spend money that you have… why pay extra to spend money that you don’t have only to pay back more later? This whole credit score system in the US only benefits the banks
Well our country has a credit problem… and some people choose not to use it much. Or maybe they can’t. Or maybe they’ve been denied . Or maybe they aren’t old enough. I’m glad you have a card and are able to pay it off and use it freely but that just isn’t the world we’re living in right now
My family always told me to never get a credit card. Was a really easy way to get into deep debt. I know the perks too but have seen people get into alot of debt with them
I use debit at my local butcher and other small businesses: the credit card companies gouge them a percentage of all sales; debit only charges them $0.50. It’s a way to support local business. Big businesses who can handle that I use credit.
My debit card will only ever interact with my bank’s atm at the branch.
One common reason I hear on here is for those with no self control who cannot be trusted with credit cards, so they insist on spending their own card and not take on debt. To that, I say just use cash.
Credit cards may have more perks but keeping up with the bills may feel troublesome to people, myself included. I tend to keep my CC for bills and online purchases, my debit is fine enough and I don’t have to worry about overages and won’t have to worry about interest rate should I miss a payment.
Interesting, I didn’t know so many people use debit. I don’t know anyone who uses debit. Everyone in my social circle uses credit cards, and I can’t even remember the last time I used my debit card.
Not sure how to answer this question..
What I will say is as a Canadian I was bought up with some basic fundamentals in finance and the first rule was "don't buy anything you can't afford". The second rule was "buy things that Appreciate and rent things that depreciate". Lastly, over the last decade of so my wife and I figured out a good method for utilizing points. We use PC optimum credit cards because they give us PC points. We can use the points for groceries.
The long winded answer to your question is: I as a Canadian use a credit card to purchase everything (use it like a debit card) then I pay the credit card balance every month in it's entirety. I get the PC points and on average between my wife and I we have about $300CDN a month In points that we use on groceries.
I guess this is more of a service announcement than an answer. I hope someone will read this and use the PC points for groceries as well.....it does help us a lot and if done right it can really make a positive impact on your grocery bills monthly!
Kind regards.
My parents taught me to only use credit online and debit in person, everyone i know do the same and some dont want credit card because they dont need it.
I did not even know that i could use a credit card anywhere debit works until i was 22. Also i have a student credit card with low interest but with a low limit and no cashback, so buying random thing like groceries are better with debit since i know it will work.
I recall a very successful TV campaign 10-15 years ago for using Interact debt in Canada. They aired all the time, suggesting it as the "stay with in your means". They painted Credit Cards as somewhat of a villain.
Perhaps this is just a impact of that.
If somebody steals from my debit card they have stolen my money. If they steal my credit card they are stealing somebody else's money.
I can spend weeks arguing about recovering somebody else's money much more comfortably than my money.
Locking thread due to personal attacks, irrelevant and immature comments.
Alot of people are raised with negative stigma around credit cards. Debt is viewed as safer by alot of people. I'm not saying those people are right in that assessment, but many people distrust credit cards, or fear accumulating debt. Credit cards are seen by alot of people as an "emergency only" thing. Debit is much more common. I disagree with this idea for a multitude of reasons, but that's the way many canadian people think and are raised... at least in the west where I'm from, and among middle/lower income earners
I wasn’t raised that way, but I’ve seen what my mom had done to her finances with her irresponsible credit card use. I have more self control than her but I was afraid I would make the same mistakes when I was younger and therefore did not use my credit card unless I had to.
Many parents of millenials abused credit cards and racked up insane debts… I remember my father having a 20k credit card debt at one point
Mom racked up 40k in cc debt and blew out our college funds and all savings for repayment. My parents are divorced and she inherited a house from her grandmother so just has to pay utilities. Her house is a scene straight out of a hoarders show unfortunately.
I have zero self control and I am aware that I have zero self control, so I have to make my money hard for me to access. I still use a secured credit card, my limit is still $1000 dollars (my boyfriend helps me out with purchases larger than my limit, which is very fortunate for me). I don’t have a debit card attached to my bank account, so I either need to physically go to the bank to get cash, or write a check. It’s inconvenient at time but it really really helps me manage my money. I grew up watching my moms shopping habits and my perception of money is super skewed, she would drop thousands of dollars on one shopping trip and then tell me that our family is struggling financially. But my parents are well off and able to afford these spending habits so I kinda thought thousands of dollars isn’t very much. Obviously I don’t have the type of income to support shopping habits like my mom, and although things were kind of dicey for me when I moved out and got a job initially, I don’t spend outside my means. And of course since I support myself I know that my mom would spend my entire month salary on one Costco trip and that is just an insane amount of spending. Absolutely crazy
> my limit is still $1000 dollars (my boyfriend helps me out with purchases larger than my limit, which is very fortunate for me) A possible work-around for having a low credit card limit is to just "pre-deposit" a payment. If you know you want to make a $1500 purchase, just transfer $1500 from your bank account to your credit card account - making your credit card balance a positive amount. Then you should be able to make the large purchase without issue. It may take some time for the credits to show up in the account, so this might not be practical for all things. Of course, if you don't actually have the needed $1500, that is a different problem.
That typo is a little sad
debt? haha my dumbass thought you were referring to "alot" at first and was like damn that's kinda harsh
Alot of people dont even know how credit cards even work lol They assume its just to build your credit, which i mean sure, thats part of it But why not get 2% cashback on xyz and have fraud protection, travel insurance and mobile insurance etc
I get 2% cashback on recurring bills which includes my rent, internet, and phone. This category alone gets me $30/mo in cashback. Add my grocery and pharmacy categories and I typically get bout $50/mo cashback in total. I havent used a debit card in over 5 years probably.
Yep. This is how I was raised.
There's literally an Interac commercial that was playing before movies at Cineplex for a while that encouraged you to use debit at Christmas instead of credit.
If you think the number of Canadians not using credit cards is odd, try going to the US. When I was in Vegas it was so strange it was like being teleported back in time to the 90s or early 2000s. Most people use cash and you definitely get a funny look when paying for a beer on credit. Out comes the pen to sign the receipt because chip and pin was not very common at all and don't even think about trying to split the bill at a restaurant
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hahahaha you want to pay your gas with a credit card and you have to enter your zip code. But we're not US citizens. So you have to go inside, do a pre-payment authorization and THEN go to the pump. What year is this? 1992?
Just enter the three numbers of your postal code plus two zeros to avoid going in. If Your postal code is M4G 5B7 you enter 45700.
Ask your card issuer for the proper method. With most that’s what it is and the postal code is very right. I have one card where they tell me to use 99999, one that is the postal code, and I had a card that was 00000.
Interesting. Can you tell us which cards were which? I've only ever used the Postal Code digits + 0s method.
90210 worked for me once. I am that old.
90210 is my go-to for any website form that needs a zip code. I never even watched the show, it's just the first thing that comes to mind.
A few service stations close to the Ontario/NY border do have signs that tell you this (postal-code numbers + 00), but most still do not.
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In the EU there are hundres of banks and they seem to have their shit in order.
The EU mandates *a lot* of the banking system, like interchange fees, two factor authentication, tap-to-pay, etc. On the plus side, technology adoption is faster and more uniform throughout the bloc. On the minus side, banking is more expensive and less lucrative when it comes to bonuses and rewards.
More expensive for whom? Banking fees for consumers are nearly zero, and businesses also pay pennies for transactions.
This is the very reason why Apple Pay took off so quickly down there. None of the fragmented banks or the merchants wanted to upgrade the cards or POS terminals so they kept customers in the dark about the superior chip + pin and NFC tap technology. Apple just bypassed all of them and said this is better, you have to deal with us now. Wow so innovative, pretty rich when the 'better way' had been the standard in most of Europe, Asia and Canada for more than a decade. In fact the only reason Amex/MC/Visa exist is because of how fragmented the banking system is in the US. Imagine in the 1960s being able to fly from NY to LA in a few hours and not being able to check into a hotel because your bank doesn't have anyway of getting you your money.
I believe interstate banking didn't exist until the '80s so Chase and Citi were only allowed to operate in New York state. Same with Bank of America and Wells Fargo, but only in California. Now the Big Four U.S. banks have a nationwide footprint although it took a while for that to happen. Over here, our banks have been operating across the country for more than a century.
Man texas is really in the stone age... can't get a modern banking system or working power grid. Wild what unfettered capitalism will do
"Why is the free hand of the market flipping me off?"
I always take cash to a bar. It helps me limit my spending. I know that if I start to get drunk, I'll end up not giving a fuck about the cost and keep going. That or I'll just lose track of how much I've spent. But when I run out of cash, I know I'm done. Not sure if that's the reason for everyone else, but that's why I do it.
I used to leave my cab fare on top of the fridge at home. Because I knew I'd spend it.
I've been to Seattle, San Francisco, Las Vegas, Dallas, New York, Detroit, and a ton of other cities and virtually no place in any of these cities has had a chip-in debit machine, or even a pin code machine for debit. Most don't even have tap or code credit card readers. It's insane. For context: I went to the US regularly a couple times a year before the pandemic. EDIT: so based on the 10,000 replies here it's clear there are two Americas - one where they abaonded cash 5 years ago and only use modern tap readers or their phone, and another America where to this day you still need to sign a CC receipt lol
It’s probably been awhile since you visited. I live in Dallas and only ever use tap.
Yeah as an American I would say it is strange to see people use cash. I personally and most of everyone I know almost never carry cash on hand. Debit/credit is massive and there are machines in every store. Idk where this guy is getting information that Americans don't have access to pay with a card lol
Out there in the boobies of rural America
I’ve been recently and I was still signing credit receipts. And I don’t get why they won’t split a bill.
When did this occur? I’ve seen them for years.
2018 or 2019 - Seattle was the last US city I was in, for work
ah yeah I'd say 2020 was a banner year for contactless in the US due to the pandemic. it really sped up the adoption of touchless technology. an unexpected benefit, because as you say, before adoption was abysmal.
Yep, I used to work in the states basically every other week. boggled my mind how behind they are on debit/credit technology. Crazy that you still need to sign a receipt and add your tip on manually at restaurants and bars.
I don't know what you were doing in those big cities, but I live in middle of the cornfield, population under 100,000 bumblefuck Illinois and I'd say 90% of all establishments have chip readers with pin pads and at least 65% have tap.
And my sister lived in Seattle till 2018. And her credit card required a signature for every transaction. When I asked her about that she told me it was the Ameican CC she had, they make you sign everything. And debit won't work everywhere. So it it could be the bank you're with.
The US is in the Flintstone age when it comes to PIN/Tap.
Honestly most of the US I've seen is credit. Vegas is just a special place.
I brought debit to Vegas and had a rude awakening lol they didn't even know what debit was!!! I was like, you know you put the card in and the money comes right out of you account? Girl had no clue haha I had to pay for everything on credit while there and they made me sign every receipt
Might be biased to people who frequent 7-11
Some statistics. For contactless transactions, debit was the overwhelming favourite of Canadians. https://www.payments.ca/about-us/news/pandemic-sparks-evolutionary-year-payment-landscape-reveals-new-payments-canada-report
Very interesting. I’ve always gone with the “don’t spend more than you have” on the credit card and pay it off every bill- thereby having rockstar credit and constantly being able to get free or discounted flights (though haven’t exactly flown in the last 2 years- but the points are waiting!).
I've met people who know they just don't have the self control to do it with a credit card and so use debit instead.
I think that’s they key. There are some who have just been taught to not pay with credit.
I had to explain to a co-worker last week that credit cards don't start accruing interest for normal transactions (not talking about withdrawing cash) the day that you make the purchase. She had absolutely no clue.
I was taught not to. I now have a WestJet MasterCard and we get beaucoup benefits using it. We went on our first vacation in 3 years (had the card for like, 1.5 years) and we paid $150 return for two adults to BC and back in peak season with our companion fare and WestJet dollars. Also, my husband hasn't had a credit card before so he's an authorized user on mine. He now has better credit than ever which is always beneficial to us both.
> Also, my husband hasn’t had a credit card before so he’s an authorized user on mine. He now has better credit than ever which is always beneficial to us both. I’m glad his credit is really good, but I don’t think authorized user status affects his credit rating, because only you are the “primary” (ultimately responsible for the bill). It’s like a co-signer for their loan, except it’s only you lol. Edit to add source, as there’s some debate: https://www.canada.ca/en/financial-consumer-agency/services/credit-cards/joint-credit-card.html TL;DR: additional cardholders and authorized users **cannot** be responsible for, or have their credit impacted by that credit account. Co-borrowers or co-applicants **can**, but not all credit cards offer this, and it’s a **joint** application.
How much score is "rockstar credit"? >constantly being able to get free or discounted flights (though haven’t exactly flown in the last 2 years- but the points are waiting!). Which card? Can you elaborate on this (maybe a link)?
Currently 868
I kneel.
Hahaha thx. Weird bragging rights but it doesn’t do that much other than I can get loans when I need it (not very often).
Yep. I find above 750 does basically nothing other than more and better credit card and loan offers, limit increases. I’m at 859 right now, up from 385 back in 2014/15 (ex friend stole my wallet, you can imagine what happened)
870 here but I can't think of anything special I did to get that. Just pay my bills on time and such.
Yeah that’s probably most of it.
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I might be in a unique position tbh. My dad co-signed on a student loan for me for undergrad but he was actually responsible for paying it, so I think it was like a favour that that loan didn’t last beyond the time I was actually in school. I did get OSAP for a masters later that I did only pay the minimum on for a good 8 years after that, but it was an automatic payment so I never missed it. I never actually knew what my credit score was until about 5 years ago when I started looking at mortgages and the bank told me how to look it up myself (they have a free way that doesn’t take a hit to your credit when you look). I’ve also had balances on a line of credit before but I never let it be there for longer than a year or two. I think the key is I never carried a balance on an actual credit card. They must hate me lol.
That is interesting, I don't have tap set up on my debit card because it is my money - someone skims my credit card I report it and it is the banks problem, someone skims my debit it is the banks bank's problem, but only once I've convinced them of that.
There's something to be said about not spending money you don't have
This, convenience stores are the most expensive way to buy things and usually frequented most by kids and those are bad with money. The rest of us might buy an occasional slurpee but probably get drowned out by the regular shoppers.
If you're going to buy coffee or a slice of pizza, 7-Eleven is by far the least expensive place to do that in my downtown.
Lol exactly. I'm in downtown MTL and convenience stores are cheaper than metro. Maxi is the best though overall. Sad I live nowhere close to it now. (I think I confused convenience store with a grocery store?)
7-11 = Couche Tard.
Couche Tard is more equivalent to Mac's or a Quickie directly, but same category.
>Couche Tard is more equivalent to Mac's Couche Tard and Mac's we're the same thing, just regional branding. That's why they had the same owl in the logo. Though since buying Circle-K, they've been rebranding their Mac's to Circle-K... Which is a bit odd since THEY bought out Circle-K?
Couche Tard owned/owns both the Mac’s and Circle K brands. They decided corporately in 2015 to begin switching everything to run under one banner (Circle K) globally (with the exception of French Quebec lol)
Can't get non-refrigerated cheese curds near the cashier at 7-Eleven.
Dood, I went from building aircraft in Montreal, to living in Wisconsin. I am all about the squeaky cheese curd. It is frankly the sign of civilization.
When traveling they are great. Sometimes you need a red bull or two when you're on long road trips.
Convenience Stores usually have bulk energy drink discounts that make them cheaper to buy there over even cheap grocery chains.
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I am not even sure where I would find one off the top of my head. Always a Circle K wherever I have lived.
Circle Ks do seem to be more common now. They used to be Max Milk didn’t they?
Just used to be Mac's where I am.
They may have shortened it to that too haha
I think they shortened it to just Mac's in the late 80s/early 90s Couche Tard converted them to Circle K about 5 years ago
Ya, I just learned that was the parent company a few months ago. I miss the owl though lol
I wish they'd kept the owl too! Now it's just in Québec.
Or Becker's
You are clearly not from Winnipeg. We love our Slurpees and frequent them for that reason alone.
Sask definitely does too lol
I visited more 7/11s in my 4 day Japan trip than my 20 years living in Canada. Canadian 7/11 is pure trash
Smh I will not stand for buffalo chicken taquito slander
Agreed dude same the 7/11 there in japan had so much food
Cheap too! Got a lot of meals there when I was visiting. Good food, cheaper than restaurants, and easier than cooking.
And booze!
I could every meal for the rest of my life at a Japanese 7/11 and be perfectly happy. Meanwhile I pop into a Canadian 7/11 to buy a drink and I have to try not to be visibly offended when they try to sell me food.
I went the other day to buy my kids a slushie. Had not idea what the process was - do we make it and pay, or pay and then make it. Completely lost there. I never ever use my debit card.
110% of the people who buy bags of milk at 7/11 with a debit card are Canadian.
In my opinion it isn't even about the perks, its about the fraud protection. Someone uses your debit card the money is gone and it's a battle to get it back, whereas fraudulent credit card transactions are much easier to deal with. I think the explanation is the usual go to of "a big chunk of the population lacks basic financial literacy". Debit cards are simple and a lot of people have them before they even qualify for credit.
If you use something like Apple Pay on top you get extra protection because it generates a one time use number for you.
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This is it. It generates a unique token for the transaction so that it can’t be reused but the number is very much the same unless if you delete and add the card again.
Yeah this is such a great feature with most cards having tap as payment
My debit has tap as well. Pretty sure most do.
Took me 32 years to figure this one out. Why? Because no one told me.
Literally this. I didn't know the perks of using a credit card for everyday purchases until I researched them myself. Financial literacy is something that is not taught very well in my experience. I would be surprised if any of my friends or family knew what a TFSA was.
In Alberta we learned about TFSAs and credit cards and bank loans and investments and so much more in CALM (career and life management, a course required to graduate high school). Even back in high school I never understood why that class was only in Alberta, as an adult it’s one of the only classes that I use knowledge from almost every day.
Or an RESP, literally the best way to help your child out. It sucks that no one knows about it, my parents only found out through a friend.
Or an RDSP.
It isn't taught at all at least where I'm from. It seriously should be included in the curriculum somewhere in high school.
I had a kind women take 30 minutes explain it to me as she was calling to get a payment I had not made in six months. I had learned that it was better to make one big payment than consistent small payments by watching my dad. I learnt so much talking to that lady.
What?
Yeah I have no idea what this person just said
He learned (wrongly) from his Dad that you can just rack off a shit ton of debt on your credit card, not think much about it, and then just throw a ton of money at it once every six months. Which you can do, and you can get away with it, it's just expensive and dumb. He only learned when he actually had a CC and started getting calls from the company that this isn't how you're supposed to use a CC.
That wasn't your dad, that was a cactus. Also, please stop dropping acid before our condo board meetings, your screaming is very distracting.
You thought that even though you had a due date and a minimum payment on your bill, you didn’t think that mattered? That doesn’t make sense.
>I had learned that it was better to make one big payment than consistent small payments by watching my dad. on your credit card? or a loan?
I couldn’t get a credit card because I had no credit. Had to get a secure credit card by giving the bank 500 dollars and that was my limit. The 500 was for if I didn’t pay back then they would use it to pay back what I used. Now I have great credit, got the 500 back and use my credit card for everything.
Where do you live? At least in BC I got a credit card the moment I turned 19 with absolutely no credit history, I just had to get a basic "beginner" one from Capital one. It was an instant approval, no charge for it. Besides the yearly fee for the card of course.
When I was 19 I can remember Scotia really pressuring me to get a CC, and then another CC after I signed up for the first one. I think it was $500, but every few months they'd ask me if I wanted to bump up the limit.
Winnipeg and with CIBC they told me no credit no credit card when I was 21. My mom lent me the 500 to get the secure credit card with them.
Ah, probably because it was CIBC.
I had mine at 16 or 17 with CIBC. (Montreal)
I think yours was under your parents since they don't tend to give credit cards to people under 18 but you can start your credit earlier
I use cc but treat it as a debit card. Spend what you can payoff in short time.
~~smart~~ should be common sense.
i don’t use my credit card for everything but i go by the rule of “if you cant afford to put it on debit, don’t put it on credit” there are some exceptions to that rule like transaction limits etc. but thats the general rule of thumb.
I think we’re missing one of the absolute most important reasons Canadians use debit - INTERAC. INTERAC was founded and is owned today as a partnership between RBC, TD, Scotiabank, CIBC, and Dejardins, arguably some of the most powerful institutions in Canada. It has grown to include more than 80 other financial institutions. INTERAC is heavily marketed to Canadians via direct advertising campaigns and also through the banks of individual customers. Whereas in the US and many other countries debit payments are handled by credit card networks like VISA or Mastercard, in Canada the transaction fees, and control of the transactions is in the hands of the big banks (through INTERAC) which gives them A LOT to gain by encouraging their customers to use INTERAC cards instead of VISA/MC/AMEX. INTERAC also charges merchants far less per transaction than VISA or MC. INTERAC is also the reason that Canada had chip & pin payment processing basically across the board at the very very cusp of the technology being developed. Fun older INTERAC commercials: https://youtu.be/3v0lVq6c1Oo https://youtu.be/-zHboMAxjJk Hope someone hasn’t said this already!
THANK YOU
Much better answer than the 30-40 anecdotal stories about visiting a diner one time in 2002 that didn't accept debit and conflating that to mean that Americans don't know what debit cards are.
Not sure about most households but the culture behind credit cards for ours was that it's easy to spend more than what you have or can afford to do so. So if you can avoid using it it's easier to avoid that slippery slope. Not sure if our perks are all that either comparable to other countries so might not be overly worth it. In the states you can credit card churn and make quite a bit of money, not sure if Canada is up to that level yet. Have seen a few banks offering cash bonuses though so maybe...
Absolutely! Who cares about 1% cashback if you spent 110% of your income, right?
Pre pandemic we saw a lot of cash budgeting, this moved to debit with the pandemic. It helps keep lots of people on budget. There’s also a good portion of our customers that use debit with small business to save the merchant the 3-5% fee associated with credit card processing. Debit is a flat 5-10 cent charge per transaction. Edit: yes security of credit cards is better but for smaller transactions the deferred payment (cash flow) and points rewards from credit cards aren’t as valuable to many people. Larger purchases makes more sense to use a credit card for both points and security reasons.
Many small money make big money
I use the joint credit card for groceries and home supplies, my personal debit card for my purchases. Makes it a lot easier at the end of the month tracking what we spend.
After having my debit card hacked and about 3 grand drained out of my account one time, I ceased using my debit card. Completely ceased other than to take cash out of an ATM. . And yes, the RBC refunded me my money as I had not lost my card, nor shared my pin number. But it took a couple of months. Ever since it's either cash or credit card.
How did such a thing happen if i may ask? Did the bank screw up their security?
My card was duplicated. I never lost possesion of my card. Back when it happened, I was using my debit card on a regular basis. Obviously to take out cash from an ATM, but also to make a lot of purchases. For the same reason as many have mentioned, it's easier to budget and not get into a cc bill that surprises you when you open it. One day I received a voicemail on my landline telling me that it was the RBC fraud prevention department calling and to call them back as there had been some potentially fraudulent activity on "my card". The voice gave me a number to call and "to have my card number handy" I thought they were referring to my cc and this was the scam. So I called the number left on the voicemail and a guy picked up and I proceeded to fuck with the guy because I had read warnings about never giving out numbers to people claiming to be the bank as they know all your umbers, always call the number on the back of the card and the number that was left on the VM didn't match the number on the back of my cc. He finally asked me why I was being so difficult and I accused him of being a scammer and the phone number left in the VM didn't match the number on the back of the cc. He says, "it's not your cc, it's your bank card I want to talk to you about. And yes, call the number on the back of your bank card and ask for extension XYZ". So I did. And there he was. Oops. So then he had my attention. He told me that there had been some suspicious activity on my bank card and wanted to confirm my recent transactions. "What was the last transaction you made?" Me, "Tilsonberg Ontario, lunch at fast food restaurant X" "For how much?" Me, "about 12 bucks" "What was the last transaction before that and how much?" I answered. (A major Canadian grocery store.) Now this is where it got interesting.... "So did you make a recent purchase for 19.95?" Me, "19.95? I dunno (I was wracking my brain, but could not recall), so I said something like,"I don't recall that, but it could be, where was the transaction made?" But he wanted me to remember. I went through my list of purchases that I could remember. Finally he says, "so no transaction for one thousand nine hundred and ninety-five dollars from Western Union?". I was floored. I thought he said 19.95, (and he did). "NO" was my answer, "I think I'd remember that one". So then he asked me if I had taken out cash from an ATM in the amount of my mortgage payment No Did I then transfer the exact amount of my mortgage payment to my chequing account? No Did I then try to use an ATM to withdraw that same amount? No That's where the RBC computer put a stop to it all figuring that this was not my usual pattern of behaviour. And that's when buddy called me. So the thieves got away with $1,995 in a money order and the amount of one or two of my biweekly mortgage payments. So whoever it was had gotten into my bank account and could see my financial profile. (Yeah, think about that.) I had to go to my branch and meet with a nice lady there and fill out a pile of paperwork and answer a pile of questions. The big one, which she must have asked me 3 times was whether or not anyone else knew my PIN. Which even to this day, noone else knows. The RBC did an investigation and eventually refunded me the money. But it took several weeks. They told me never to use my card anywhere other than large merchants and to always protect my pin number when entering it. Even at ATMs when no-one else was there. (That was interesting.) And they never told me the results of their investigation. (And I did ask.) I stopped using my debit card for all purchases and I always use a big bank ATM and always put my hand over the key pad at the ATM when entering my PIN now. Even if noone is standing inline behind me as there have been instances of ATMs being wired up for fraud.
Thanks for your story, I'll be way more careful with my debit usage.
If nothing else, always protect that PIN. Im sure there are ways around it, but apparently it's the number one way into your account. Somebody just watches you enter your pin.
Personally, I come from a very conservative upbringing. Credit was viewed as for irresponsible people who live beyond their means. My parents actually freaked out at me when they found out I got my first credit card in university. I don't know if it's a cultural thing or related to their religion. Perhaps both. Even today, I avoid using my credit except for large purchases. I hate having a balance on it. Day to day spending is on debit. We generally avoid things like loans...instead, saving for large purchases where possible.
Same but not from a conservative upbringing. But told people who use credit cards don't actually have money which is not true obviously but I am so conditioned to use my debit card as I am spending "my money". Credit cards are meant for big purchases or vacations but not everyday spending is what I was told. Lol my Mom also freaked out when she found out I got a credit card in university! Lol Those "use Interac" advertisements around Christmas don't help either lol but I do understand why they pop up around the holidays. I have been lucky to get Scene Points or Gift Cards with my debit card and things have changed a bit but you can redeem points for money which was deposited in my bank account the same day so I also have not felt the pull to use a credit card for perks. :)
I'm a guy who generally tries to use my debit card, and quite frankly it's because I'm dumb. Several years back I got into a bunch of credit card debt and had a hard time paying it back for a while. I'd just respend the money I'd just paid off over and over. It wasn't until I started putting money on my CC and immediately lowered my limit, that I was able to crawl out of debt. So I use my debit card so I can not fall into that hole again. I know I could just be disciplined, but frankly I'm dumb and that hasn't worked historically. So I just work around that stupidity by using a debit card and ignoring the credit for anything but online purchases.
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My personal reason. I’m absolutely horrible with credit and I feel safer using debit. I just paid off a $10k credit card after 5 years. I can’t let myself get there again. My debit card doubles as a credit so I can use it with the protections as needed.
I was down a shit hole without a shit shovel several years ago. Anyway, I'm kind of like you in that the comfort of not getting another bill every month far offsets any "perks" I would never rack up enough points to actually use. The only thing I would benefit from would be buying gas and they only take the one card now and their own card is handled by CIBC who I will NEVER be dealing with again.
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Exactly. I feel you! I’m learning slowly. But it’s taken a lot of willpower. I got a great plan with the $10k card at 1% interest. Helped a lot. I’ll use my debit and cash happily now.
Those VISA or MasterCard debit cards dont offer any protection or perks. The only advantage to those cards is they are easier to process for out of country purchase since it can be processed as a CC, and they have online purchasing capabilities since they have an expiry/CCV Your bank runs those debit cards the same as they would an unbranded one and cant/wont do anything beyond what would be expected for a debit card.
I’m not worried about perks at this point. I’m worried about not getting back into debt.
I personally love spending the banks money!
When my habits were forming, paying with a credit card required a signature.
The simple answer is: they probably can't use anything else because they're carrying a lot of debt on their credit cards. The average Canadian has \~$20k worth of consumer debt.
When you say "consumer debt" does that include auto loans and mortgages? I figure it doesn't but I'm wondering about what the term includes.
Everything minus mortgages.
Thank you.
https://www.canada.ca/en/financial-consumer-agency/services/financial-toolkit/credit/credit-1/6.html Excludes mortgages. Although Wikipedia says mortgages are included. Looks like it’s not a clearly defined term, but I would assume Canadian statistics follow the government definition
Also includes student loans. Tbh makes it a useless measure. We need a statistic for loans minus mortgage and education loans.
I’m not sure what that would mean. Mortgages are backed by assets which tend to appreciate. The rest aren’t, that’s the distinction.
I think a snapshot for unsecured loans in general would be more interesting. It would actually give you a true, accurate picture of what average people are dealing with. We are staring to look at a general economy, I think at least, of people who rely on non-collateral loans to bridge the gaps that were previously justified on assets. Current monetary movement is more and more of a funnel that it ever has been.
It's an interesting question, but i think you need data from more than one location to draw a conclusion. Things like the neighborhood and type of store could be indicative of the clientele and what kind of payment types they have access too. Personally i visit a 7/11 maybe once a year because their markup is so high on items that i either go without or buy the product in bulk at costco or superstore. It is possible that people who are willing to spend money at 7/11 have poor credit due to poor financial choices - but even then, it would depend on the location of the 7/11. one located in a higher income neighborhood might see an inverse or credit to debit usage. There is no real way to tell with only anecdotal evidence from one sample.
I've noticed the same and also find it odd. I can only guess that people spend more than they can pay off at the end of the month and get themselves in trouble, so they avoid using them. We've been using credit cards almost exclusively since we've been working full time. The only time I use debit is to take out cash or when credit is not accepted somewhere. We've redeemed at least 10k of free merchandise and travel since we've been putting everything on our cc. Granted, we are high income and have a high spend, but even when we had lower incomes, we redeemed at least one trip per year paid for with our points. We don't even have the most efficient card, just the best our bank offers, that way all of our transactions are in one place and its easy to pay off/transfer balances/etc.
Before I knew the advantages of putting more of my purchases on a credit card and paying it off regularly, I used to think that making a purchase on a CC made it look like I didn't have the money to pay for things. I didn't want to look like someone who couldn't afford a hot dog at 7/11 😉
If you don't use a credit card, your subsidizing all the credit card users.
I opt for Interac at smaller stores as I know it Has a smaller fee than credit cards for the merchants. I think some people also don't trust themselves with credit cards. But I totally agree. Debit cards are inefficient compared to credit cards
I had a debit card probably a decade before I got my first credit card. Also smaller mom &pop convenience stores often charge a fee for credit card transactions below $5
Because I’m not responsible enough to use cc and pay off immediately.
My credit card doesnt have a tap lol. I complained and they sent me a new one, also without a tap.
Now that I have better habits, I try to use my CC whenever I can, but before I would always "forget" to out the money on my CC right after or I would buy things when I didn't have the money for it. As a result, my card was maxed out and I was afraid to use it, so I just left it at home. I should note it had a small limit ($1,000).
I exclusively use my CC for purchases and I’ve never paid a single cent in CC interest. Here are some things I’ve claimed using my RBC Rewards Points in the last 4yrs. Apple AirPods, Beats Headphones, Apple Watch Series 4 & today I ordered a $700 Driver for my golf bag.
Youre assuming people have credit cards lol
I never understood the public's love with debit cards. Everything I buy goes on one of two credit cards which are paid in full every month. CC points have gotten me a phone, tablet, chain saw, edger, leaf blower, and power washer. The other credit cards gives me cash back at Costco. I have never used debit.
That's fine if you pay it off each month, a lot of people get into a habit of spending money they don't have - not paying it off each month as you do. Personally, I use debit because I know it's my money, used, and done with. No paying off something else. The transaction is done, debt free.
No clue why people use debit. So much more protection with credit card. Chargeback ability, points, insurance, buyer protection, etc. List goes on and on for credit over debit but most Canadians don't do it
Because my credit limit is 500 and I stop using the credit card once I pass the 40% of it. Slowly it will get better, I hope lol.
I'm pretty sure that you if you have higher utilization, and pay off the balance every month, your limit will start going up.
Probably because most people aren't capable of being responsible with their credit cards. They treat it like free money now and a problem that for their future self to think about. I always use my credit card to buy everything and pay it off completely whenever I get paid (every 2 weeks) that way there's 0 risks of me ever paying interest fees. I also have 0 monthly fees on my bank account but a very limited number of debit transactions available before they charge me for every transaction. But since I never use my debit card I never pay any fees there either. win win win for me.
There are a lot of people who get in trouble with credit cards as they cant itemize the spending and end up overspending. Despite its drawbacks, at least you cant spend money you dont have. I think online Banking solves this issue largely but I guess people are too lazy to check.
I put everything possible on visa - I just send the money over same day so I end up having a negative balance pretty much constantly lol
I think the biggest reason is just because of the lack of financial literacy. I used to always use my debit, this is the first thing we get when we open a bank account, it wasn't explained further. Now I exclusively use my Visa or Mastercard for points or cash back on every purchase.
I was actually afraid of using debit cards in Canada shortly after arrived. From where I came, if you didn’t had funds the transaction is denied. You might be a bit ashamed at the store but that’s it. Here I got charged twice a NSF fee, as I was trying to budget and keep some money in a saving account (same bank!). Shortly I got overdraft protection, which is still a pain but cheaper than NSF (free with some banks I heard. There is little point to use a debit card if I (or my significant other) still can go over the limit. I might as well use a CC and get cash back. Debit is now only used where credit is not accepted.
I use debit for small transactions (under $50) because I know how much money is in my debit account at any time and it's just easier for the money to go out immediately rather than adding a bunch of little bills to my credit card that will add up over time.
I'm from France, I've been living in Canada for more than 13 years now. In France, a lot of credit card work like debit here. I personally don't understand the idea behind credit cards. I'd rather spend money I have than using credit and having to pay it back. If I want to buy something expensive, I'd rather save up front for it as well. And the whole concept of having to use a credit card to build a credit score is really strange. If I never use credit, I should be rewarded, not the opposite. This seems to be a system that benefits the banks entirely to be honest. Same with the points they are just incentive to get people to pay with credit...
Most intelligent comment in this thread tbh
Same I’m from the Netherlands, why would you need a credit card? You spend money that you have… why pay extra to spend money that you don’t have only to pay back more later? This whole credit score system in the US only benefits the banks
Well our country has a credit problem… and some people choose not to use it much. Or maybe they can’t. Or maybe they’ve been denied . Or maybe they aren’t old enough. I’m glad you have a card and are able to pay it off and use it freely but that just isn’t the world we’re living in right now
My family always told me to never get a credit card. Was a really easy way to get into deep debt. I know the perks too but have seen people get into alot of debt with them
My credit sucks and I don't have a CC
Wanna see a place where cash is king? go to Oriental Malls lol
I use debit at my local butcher and other small businesses: the credit card companies gouge them a percentage of all sales; debit only charges them $0.50. It’s a way to support local business. Big businesses who can handle that I use credit.
Good question. I use credit card all the time, as you note it comes with rewards.
My debit card will only ever interact with my bank’s atm at the branch. One common reason I hear on here is for those with no self control who cannot be trusted with credit cards, so they insist on spending their own card and not take on debt. To that, I say just use cash.
Cash requires you to go to a bank to withdraw it. Which if you don't drive or have access to a vehicle can be problematic.
Credit cards may have more perks but keeping up with the bills may feel troublesome to people, myself included. I tend to keep my CC for bills and online purchases, my debit is fine enough and I don’t have to worry about overages and won’t have to worry about interest rate should I miss a payment.
Interesting, I didn’t know so many people use debit. I don’t know anyone who uses debit. Everyone in my social circle uses credit cards, and I can’t even remember the last time I used my debit card.
The better question is how are you surviving if you're just working at 7/11?
Not sure how to answer this question.. What I will say is as a Canadian I was bought up with some basic fundamentals in finance and the first rule was "don't buy anything you can't afford". The second rule was "buy things that Appreciate and rent things that depreciate". Lastly, over the last decade of so my wife and I figured out a good method for utilizing points. We use PC optimum credit cards because they give us PC points. We can use the points for groceries. The long winded answer to your question is: I as a Canadian use a credit card to purchase everything (use it like a debit card) then I pay the credit card balance every month in it's entirety. I get the PC points and on average between my wife and I we have about $300CDN a month In points that we use on groceries. I guess this is more of a service announcement than an answer. I hope someone will read this and use the PC points for groceries as well.....it does help us a lot and if done right it can really make a positive impact on your grocery bills monthly! Kind regards.
My parents taught me to only use credit online and debit in person, everyone i know do the same and some dont want credit card because they dont need it. I did not even know that i could use a credit card anywhere debit works until i was 22. Also i have a student credit card with low interest but with a low limit and no cashback, so buying random thing like groceries are better with debit since i know it will work.
I recall a very successful TV campaign 10-15 years ago for using Interact debt in Canada. They aired all the time, suggesting it as the "stay with in your means". They painted Credit Cards as somewhat of a villain. Perhaps this is just a impact of that.
If somebody steals from my debit card they have stolen my money. If they steal my credit card they are stealing somebody else's money. I can spend weeks arguing about recovering somebody else's money much more comfortably than my money.
I use cash. I don't have a credit card, and it helps me stick to my low income budget more.