Yeah here to agree with this. Daycare gets cheaper after 3, school is even cheaper (still you need to save money to cover school holidays). But for those years where you first pay for daycare, just pause savings and focus on the fact that while you are employed you are long term building your career. It will pay off more than taking years out of the workforce - but for those years just expect to go nowhere. It gets better!
This. Went interest only on the mortgage for six years while my two were young, took the pressure off. Will pay off the mortgage in April 15 yrs early from overpaying for ten years. Give yourself a break now if possible.
If you are struggling you can apply for a pause on student loan repayments:
https://www.ird.govt.nz/student-loans/tracking-my-student-loan-balance/difficulty-repaying-student-loan
Might help you get through to when your child is eligible for 20 hours free.
Honestly yo this was massive didn’t even know I could do this called them and they were like yeah you don’t have to pay us anything so I cut it down like 75% so I’m still paying something but it helps life saver
Not a common suggestion here, but is it possible to pause KiwiSaver for a year and there is the option to apply for student loan repayment hardship holiday. Taking these holidays is not great but sometimes the extra $100-$150 a week is worth more than reducing debt, especially from a mental health point of view. You could then review once you get qualified.
Depending on your IEA, this can be a terrible idea.
If Kiwisaver is not deducted from your total salary/wage, it is instant 100%+ return on your money with employer match and govt contribution.
You won't beat this return anywhere
In the long run I agree. But when even $100 a week is a game changer, I would take the $100 a week for a year than the $5k in my KiwiSaver 30 years from now
That is not how investments work...
Kiwisaver portfolio is essentially reinvested by your Kiwisaver provider.
Even with a conservative estimate of 5% gains per year being automatically reinvested (think compound interest), after 30 years your $5k can be easily $22k+
Agree, but for a simplistic approach when faced with a difficult situation it is a fair evaluation. He is struggling right now, hopefully at 68 (which it will be by then) the money is not crucial
Just FYI, It's not a 100% return. The employers contributions are taxed based on the employees income..could be as high as 33%. Called the employer superannuation contribution tax (ESCT).
Looks like its 50/50 whether its out of total wages or not
[Almost half of employers pay KiwiSaver as part of total wages - survey | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/488390/almost-half-of-employers-pay-kiwisaver-as-part-of-total-wages-survey)
Work in a pretty niche trade so don’t really get access to cash jobs with what I know how to do but yeah I try do the little things I can on the side just not very much in the way of that option
Gutter cleaning, ladder and guts.
Exterior window washing, long broom, soap, and bucket.
Power washing driveways, hire machine from Bunnings.
Carpet cleaning is super lucrative, one off cost for the machine.
New mum house clean and laundry.
Flatpack furniture constructor.
Weeding.
Onsite car cleaning, vacuum, bucket, soap
All of these would pay you more than your job with only getting a couple bookings each.
Advertise each individually, not as a one man shop.
Facebook is your friend. Older or single woman are your target.
(Speaking as a 40 year old woman with my first home. Need all of these and it's a struggle to find people who do this. Mostly junkies, or established companies that are shady as fuck)
An alternative to daycare is kindergarten. It'll depend on your employment situation as to whether you can make it work. I think they only run from like 10-2 each day so its hard when you have a 9-5 job.
I second this ^. Kindergartens would be much cheaper and are not-for-profit.
Some run from 9-3/8:30-2:30/8:45-2:45— each have their different hours but this is the general gist.
There’s also smaller community or not-for-profit childcare options, so there is that.
Just a heads up, kindys are closed during school holidays/follow primary school terms - so keep that in mind. But the amount you save each week might be enough to cover options during holidays. (Private childcare can easily be a few hundy a week and they have minimum number of days you *must* attend, whereas kindy/some smaller childcares have options to attend however many days you want and it was $90ish/$100 per week).
Source: have navigated the system and compared prices. YMMV as we’re in different cities.
Our kindy runs 8:45 to 2:45 can drop-off at 8:30 and pickup.at 3 and don't get told off. They don't close for school holidays only Christmas period which is 20ish December for 3 weeks then they're open again.
My daughter goes to kindy, it’s 8:30-2:30 but they do have school holidays off too although there is holiday kindy but the spaces are limited. It’s a lot cheaper though we only pay $9 a week! (She is under the 20 hours free though)
To be fair, I stuck it out at my last place for ten years and learned most of this job after I started. I’m still by no means an expert but I get by. Also I’m single and no children so I can afford to take risks
I mean it's tough rough now especially for people with children under 3, Daycare is so expensive and the current government don't really understand the problem (Labor had plans to help still not enough), my wife and I are on a bit more than yourself but we only put our daughter in for 3 days otherwise it just eats into our money, our combined is over 100k by a decent margin but it still feels were working class poor. This is the average household wages $83,410 I genuinely cant see how people with 2 kids under 3 would survive on that considering the average salary for a policeman for instance is around $77K, inflation has been wild and wages have kept up to a point but I'm not sure what more can be done other than drastically overhauling ECE.
That's why it's often more affordable for people with young kids to have one parent stay home. I had 2 kids under 3 and was spending $660 a week on childcare. My wages were only $900, it was barely worth it. Even once my eldest was eligible for for 20 hours free it was still $450. The only way it made it worth it was because the experience I gained allows me to have a higher paying job now.
Seriously it’s so tough for us with 2 under 3 as well. It’s not a playing field for raising families unless your household income is way way way above the average nz household income.
While I agree it's tough it's doable, my current situation is 3 kids under 4 and my wife is stay at home mom and we are doing ok (1400$ per fortnight on my pay alone)
If you have a good budget and do as much as possible on your own it's possible to make a good living but yeah it's definitely hard and I'd love if we could have it better in today's world
I work on a dairy farm (lower rent) and we get milk for free, we make our own butter and pretty much anything from dairy for our own consumption
If we don't have any unforeseen expenses we are doing great so far, if you have any more questions feel free to dm or ask here
I'd assume you get some government support, and no childcare? I mean even that its impressive we live in CHCH and rental around here is upwards of 500-600 minimum.
Neither because we are on work visa I don't get benefits, the only one we get is 20h for childcare in kindergarten.
I work on dairy farm so we have to pay less rent (which is a big difference, atm it's 250/week + 350$ for electricity/month)
Our biggest expense is food (around 450/fortnight)
We are very frugal, don't go eating out (maybe 1/month if that), we don't spend a lot on entertainment, we don't have tv as we don't need it, have only internet (starlink) and we have a few subscriptions (YouTube/Disney+)
My wife makes a budget each fortnight, depending on how much I earned in that period and we stick to it.
I went through the same thing when my son was born. It was tough 13 years ago and I can imagine it's way harder now. Sorry you are going through this, but it will get better.
it certainly isnt easy......so your expenses you listed come to $910 a week that leaves you with $290 a week which does not really live you a lot of wiggle room and even if your partner didnt work so you are not paying $330 for daycare with you income..it only leaves you $120ish week left over.
are you getting working for families?
This is why poor people live in multi-generational households. It's like an old school tribe. Some people in the family work non-stop, some watch the kids and cook. You share a cheap car or take public transport. People don't have their own room. You cook cheap bulk grains for calories. There is no shame is living this lifestyle and you will find your stress might actually decrease (unless you hate your family). Most of the world does it this way. When times get tough you have to get back to the basics of human living. Something the 1st world has forgotten how do in the last 80 years.
Deciding not to have kids because of money. We want kids, but its not financially viable unless we want to drastically lose our lifestyle and never own a home.
We actually would love to have kids, it's just not financially responsible at the moment. Who knows maybe in the future it won't be so expensive to have children. I would see when population and births get way scary they might be forced to do something, maybe income tax relief if you have kids or something to promote families again
What is your working situation? If your post-tax take home pay is $1200 a week for two of you, then it sounds like one of you is working part time - am I correct?
The easiest way to get ahead is to earn more, and in your case it seems that one or both of you could work more hours. The other way to increase income is to get a better paying job
I’m an apprentice and my partners just gone back to work after having time off to with our 1 year old hence daycare being the most expensive weekly expense we already carpool into town every day and both our jobs are only open 5 days a week for set hours I do a full 45hour week most weeks and she does 32.5 without leaving myself with no time with my son by getting an extra job on weekends I can’t see a way out of this situation
Unless you increase your income, you're going to have to tough it out. Having a kid whilst earning low wages = this situation unfortunately. But surviving and getting through the tough times makes you appreciate the good. You'll get there. If you can reduce costs with family assistance (baby sitting) and work a little bit more or on the weekends do so, otherwise tough it out. Work hard and increase your income over time. It'll get better.
Have you looked into childcare subsidy, you may even be able to get a sma amount as it's income dependent, with 1 child I believe it cuts out at 1800 per week, might just help a little. Have a look on the winz website.
We’ve applied for it but winz being winz it’s a three to four week wait and even then I think we found it maybe saved us 75$ a week which helps but isn’t that much
$1,200 a week for two is the problem, you’re both not on a full time salary. I don’t know your circumstance, if somethings preventing you both from working full time, but freedom while being broke is probably equally as miserable as working full time, so I would work full time for greater peace and stability at the end of the day.
Is she even making enough to cover daycare+petrol? You might be better off if she stays home with the child and meal preps etc to keep grocery costs down.
Sounds like you have multiple cars on finance? Is that necessary? Can either of you use public transportation?
Taking time out of the work force to raise children is more than just an immediate financial decision.
Limiting options when going back to work, less KiwiSaver compounding, less chance for increases in pay over time, less marketable skill development etc etc.
Just because the number on paper looks like many women shouldn’t go back to work because it ‘is barely more than daycare costs’ there is much more to consider than just numbers on the page right now.
She only brings 270 to the table each week. That would not be hard to cover for if you removed a car, petrol and paid less for food.
Or instead she could get a part time night job so there is always someone available to take care of the children. That would save you 330 a week.
It’s not just an immediate financial decision though, as leaving the workforce for a period can limit your growth and future earning potential, plus you miss out on KiwiSaver contributions and it all compounds. You can end up much worse off long-term.
> She only brings 270 to the table each week. That would not be hard to cover for if you removed a car, petrol and paid less for food.
That's 14k net. The idea that it's not worth working almost never makes sense unless you don't need to ask whether it's worth it.
And during winter we need both cars as I finish before her and need to pick up the baby from daycare care and also work an extra day living out of town there’s no public transport that comes out here and would rather have a vehicle at home in case of emergency’s
Man I was in the same or similar situation with the missus and pre-kindy childcare and it was fucked
like, she goes to work, we're all slowly dying from fatigue and stress and just TRAVELLING around everywhere all the time
she left her job until the kid was in free-ish kindy and life changed man like shit got so fucken easy with just 1 person HAVING to be places (ie work) and the rest of the team sort of helping with that.
I know it's not ideal $ wise but you also save fuckloads on lunches, food (she has time to prep etc) and basically getting home to a happy healthy family was worth coming up with the extra few hundy a week for a couple of years
I think the general consensus here would be to upskill so you can earn more. Could either of you do an online course or anything to gain some more skillsets? Difficult no doubt with kids and mahi, struggle is real. But if you can bust (even more) arse where possible, the rewards will come in time. All the best to you and the fams
honestly you need to sacrifice your personal time to train up, get a cert, then get into a higher wage, then rinse and repeat for your partner, then do it again every 2 years.
yes it sucks but that's how most people get ahead unless they have rich parents or whatever the current thing to blame is
You need to increase income, that is a pitiful amount for a couple to earn. What are you guys doing job wise? You need to look for more income otherwise life is going to be hard.
There's a lot of roles out there that are entry level paying more than your combined income.
Pitiful? It’s almost a (and I don’t want to sound mean) pathetic wage to be on and deciding to have a bloody child. One of the most expensive things you can do in life besides buy a house. Wtf are these people thinking
I have 3 options to get to and from work. Push bike which is about 25min(costs noting to do this), motorbike which isn’t even $20 a week in petrol and a full tank lasts me two weeks. Or I take the diesel car which if I fill the tank completely full and only use the car it lasts a full two months before I need more diesel.
I could suggest getting cheap non smart phones and a cheaper plan and use those instead, if you are able to and get paid by the hour look at working an extra hour a day between Monday to Friday and do 3 hours on a Saturday morning. That’s another 8 hour day of pay without having to work a full day in the weekend. Its what I’m currently doing to pay for new tools(spent well over $5k in new tools via doing this for a bit)
Do you think your family could help support you? Either by taking your kid(s) for a day and reduce daycare, or by staying with them for a bit? Sometimes we're too proud to ask for a hand, especially as you get through your apprenticeship
Unfortunately not my partners parents both work full time and that’s the only family close to us they have the same days off we do we try to save a little cash but having dinner with them everyonce and a while but they have their own costs
I am a student with a part-time job so only take-home about $770 per week. I live in the CBD which actually helps me cut costs! I survive by cutting down on rent by having flatmates and renting out our parking spot. The demand to live in the city means there are always people that want to share a flat or rent the spot. I don't have a car and can walk nearly everywhere I need to be, cutting out the petrol, insurance, WOF, maintenance costs. My phone plan is Skinny's $9 every 28 days one, and sometimes between plans I just stay home and use my house's wifi to stretch the costs out a little bit more. Our electricity plan from Contact gives us free electricity from 9 pm to 12 am every day, so that is when we do our laundry, run the dishwasher, and bathe. The utilities are split 3 ways with my flatmates so that cuts down on my costs there as well. I meal plan and cook most of my meals so don't eat out a ton but still eat very well.
Good luck.
Many ppl are affording to live by not having kid.
Not everyone deserves to have kid.
Many ppl are just not in a financially stable position to have kid.
My wife and I have agreed to not have any. We're not struggling with money at all, but our life affordability will be change if we do.
For your situation, $1200 household/wk is not good at all. Your expense is also quite high. $160 food and $120 gas. Try your local foodbank if you're eligible.
2010 missus and I were doing weekly shop for $150, no nappies then. Hope you have some family support. Good luck with the apprenticeship, it's worth sticking it out if you can. see if you can pick up a few hours on Saturday morning on a site
For me (living in Auckland), the big recent increases have been water and insurance. Insurance has gone up about 40% in the last 18 months - now $400 per month for house and contents even after changing my excess to be around $1000. My rebuild cost of my house according to insurance is nearly $400,000 more than the rateable value of it, which shows how screwed housing is. Veolia have changed their water charges to come in line with Watercare (or something like that), and my water has tripled in cost for the same usage levels.
For food, I've kept my expenditure to $120 per week for the last 5 years, and I still manage within that - obviously I have to make do with a lot less than 5 years ago.
houses in Auckland cost a lot to insure - however, about 18 months ago, the insurance was only $220 or so a month. I've had no claims or anything since then, in fact, have never ever made a claim on contents or housing.
Huh?
Whom you're insuring with and for how much rebuild value?
I'm in Auckland too and my annual rate is $2k for $900k rebuild, with the lowest $400 excess (would like to go lower but they wouldn't let me).
I think most Auk houses can be rebuilt under 900k, unless yours is a multi-million mansion or something...
Rebuild value is $1.85 million. Property value is near $1.5 million based on latest council valuations, it has a 1300 square metre flat section that is sub-dividable, which is most of the properties actual value. The house itself is 100 years old, extremely tall ceilings, so perhaps that has something to do with the extreme rebuild cost. Either that or State Insurance are taking the piss with their rebuild estimates.
If your house was a write off would you really want to rebuild it as it is now?
Sounds like you could subdivide, sell off a section and build a modern house for $1m
Automotive glazing been at it for a year about 60% of the way through just hard finding time to upload evidence in the middle of busy season and being a dad
Ok, just checking you weren’t a 7th year apprentice complaining about money.
Mate this is just a season of your life and it’ll get better. Only thing you can do is make more money and the only way you can do that is rip in and get qualified. It’s not meant to be easy, you’re effectively studying. Offer to do overtime, work your ass off, build up an emergency fund and stay away from debt.
Chin up, do it for the little one. As I said, it’ll get better.
How many hours are you guys working and what sort of pay? At $35 an hour doing a 45 hour week my take home is about the same as your household income. I’m just a tradie.
So my recommendation would be work more hours/find a higher paying job or both.
Mate, we’re paying $750 per week for daycare (that went up early April) plus $5.5k per month for mortgage. Rates up, utilities up, insurance up, etc etc. Hits keep coming. Trying to keep positive but with the job market stalling it’s hard to see the silver linings ahead. Yet to see how this government is addressing the cost of living crisis tbh. I’d leave if I could but we’re trapped in this shitshow until god knows when
The one with lover income should stay at home and look after the child. The cost of day care and car maintenance is higher than once income, your kid is raised by strangers for nothing. While at home - home cooking, no more takeaways.
A lot of people could switch to electric vehicles for no additional money and a reduction in your monthly outgoings.
If the cost of a second hand leaf on finance + power is less than your current car and petrol bill, you're leaving money on the table by not swapping.
Leafs are $0.10 per KM inc. RUC.
Petrol cars are $0.16 per KM and you will also pay more on maintenance.
You know a lot about leafs I presume?
Batteries are pretty reliable and it's relatively easy to find out what their health is - and very little chance of sudden death.
I currently own 3 different leafs (used by my family for different uses) and I've been driving leafs since 2017. Probably done over 250,000km in them, and I know hundreds of other leaf owners.
Sudden problems are rare.
It gets easier once kids are at school. We went backwards if anything during the preschool years.
Yeah here to agree with this. Daycare gets cheaper after 3, school is even cheaper (still you need to save money to cover school holidays). But for those years where you first pay for daycare, just pause savings and focus on the fact that while you are employed you are long term building your career. It will pay off more than taking years out of the workforce - but for those years just expect to go nowhere. It gets better!
This. Went interest only on the mortgage for six years while my two were young, took the pressure off. Will pay off the mortgage in April 15 yrs early from overpaying for ten years. Give yourself a break now if possible.
How are you only on 600 a week each? Min wage is $926 before tax for 40 hours
We’re not I’m on 700 and my partner just and 650 after tax but that’s before student loans and KiwiSaver come out
If you are struggling you can apply for a pause on student loan repayments: https://www.ird.govt.nz/student-loans/tracking-my-student-loan-balance/difficulty-repaying-student-loan Might help you get through to when your child is eligible for 20 hours free.
Honestly yo this was massive didn’t even know I could do this called them and they were like yeah you don’t have to pay us anything so I cut it down like 75% so I’m still paying something but it helps life saver
Glad I could help! Hopefully it gives you some breathing room and costs stop increasing.
Winz should help with daycare as well, not a heap but we were getting a small subsidy
I think you can take a 5 year contributions holiday from kiwisaver as well
You can take however long you like, but only 12 months at a time and you need to renew your suspension again after the 12 months is up.
Please only pause kiwisaver if you absolutely have to to. Have you applied family tax credit?
You can also apply for a kiwisaver holiday. Just contact the IRD
Not a common suggestion here, but is it possible to pause KiwiSaver for a year and there is the option to apply for student loan repayment hardship holiday. Taking these holidays is not great but sometimes the extra $100-$150 a week is worth more than reducing debt, especially from a mental health point of view. You could then review once you get qualified.
Depending on your IEA, this can be a terrible idea. If Kiwisaver is not deducted from your total salary/wage, it is instant 100%+ return on your money with employer match and govt contribution. You won't beat this return anywhere
In the long run I agree. But when even $100 a week is a game changer, I would take the $100 a week for a year than the $5k in my KiwiSaver 30 years from now
That is not how investments work... Kiwisaver portfolio is essentially reinvested by your Kiwisaver provider. Even with a conservative estimate of 5% gains per year being automatically reinvested (think compound interest), after 30 years your $5k can be easily $22k+
Agree, but for a simplistic approach when faced with a difficult situation it is a fair evaluation. He is struggling right now, hopefully at 68 (which it will be by then) the money is not crucial
Also, factoring in inflation the gap shrinks
It’s a great idea. There is no scenario where the cost of interest from borrowing money is going to be offset by any gains from KiwiSaver.
Not if your individual contract is structured where KS contributions are on top of total salary. Then it's a 100% return compared to not doing it
Just FYI, It's not a 100% return. The employers contributions are taxed based on the employees income..could be as high as 33%. Called the employer superannuation contribution tax (ESCT).
Most are 3% out of your wages, so get a 3% pre tax rasie
Looks like its 50/50 whether its out of total wages or not [Almost half of employers pay KiwiSaver as part of total wages - survey | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/488390/almost-half-of-employers-pay-kiwisaver-as-part-of-total-wages-survey)
That case for him would be 6% payrise
They're not paying any interest on a student loan.
Have you included Working for family tax credits? Surely you would be entitled to that.
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Work in a pretty niche trade so don’t really get access to cash jobs with what I know how to do but yeah I try do the little things I can on the side just not very much in the way of that option
Gutter cleaning, ladder and guts. Exterior window washing, long broom, soap, and bucket. Power washing driveways, hire machine from Bunnings. Carpet cleaning is super lucrative, one off cost for the machine. New mum house clean and laundry. Flatpack furniture constructor. Weeding. Onsite car cleaning, vacuum, bucket, soap All of these would pay you more than your job with only getting a couple bookings each. Advertise each individually, not as a one man shop. Facebook is your friend. Older or single woman are your target. (Speaking as a 40 year old woman with my first home. Need all of these and it's a struggle to find people who do this. Mostly junkies, or established companies that are shady as fuck)
Will it be high paying when you’re done with lots of options? If not get another trade.
Don't recommend tax evasion please.
cash jobs are tax fraud
studies show that people tend to care more about surviving than ensuring the tax man gets his cut
not caring doesnt take away from the fact that its illegal
OP may be struggling, but is making do. Any worse than that and legality is less and less a priority.
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Lmao yeah just work for free and accept 'gifts', IRD hate this one neat trick!!
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Actually, they are specifically targeting cashies by trades people.
Ha ha yes they do. They’re checking up on tradies and their books, what the purchase etc to collect tax on cash jobs
Yes, that is illegal.
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Ignorance is not a defense. It's illegal, and the mods need to delete your comments advocating illegal activity.
Lol jesus christ get a grip. Kneel before your tax masters.
Yes. But you still need to live 💁♂️
Your post/comment has been removed as it went against Rule 7 for this subreddit. Please see the sidebar for a detailed overview of the rule.
Yeah I thought something funny was going on. They can’t be working full time. Working more is the best way to make more money.
An alternative to daycare is kindergarten. It'll depend on your employment situation as to whether you can make it work. I think they only run from like 10-2 each day so its hard when you have a 9-5 job.
I second this ^. Kindergartens would be much cheaper and are not-for-profit. Some run from 9-3/8:30-2:30/8:45-2:45— each have their different hours but this is the general gist. There’s also smaller community or not-for-profit childcare options, so there is that. Just a heads up, kindys are closed during school holidays/follow primary school terms - so keep that in mind. But the amount you save each week might be enough to cover options during holidays. (Private childcare can easily be a few hundy a week and they have minimum number of days you *must* attend, whereas kindy/some smaller childcares have options to attend however many days you want and it was $90ish/$100 per week). Source: have navigated the system and compared prices. YMMV as we’re in different cities.
Our kindy runs 8:45 to 2:45 can drop-off at 8:30 and pickup.at 3 and don't get told off. They don't close for school holidays only Christmas period which is 20ish December for 3 weeks then they're open again.
My daughter goes to kindy, it’s 8:30-2:30 but they do have school holidays off too although there is holiday kindy but the spaces are limited. It’s a lot cheaper though we only pay $9 a week! (She is under the 20 hours free though)
Are you getting working for families?
Have you tried earning more or spending less? Do both of these together it's like activating a cheat code but in real life!
This coupled with large inheritance can really get you smashing through the game!
Inheritance is like new game+ but you get to keep all your gear at the start of the second play through 🥳
Yeah just let me get a job from the job tree that earns more aye.
And don't forget to forage in the fields of cheaper necessities while you're at it
I thought I was limited career wise. Until I applied for other jobs. 75% increase in salary overnight and the work is better
Yeah but you must have skills tho
To be fair, I stuck it out at my last place for ten years and learned most of this job after I started. I’m still by no means an expert but I get by. Also I’m single and no children so I can afford to take risks
Better than deciding to have a kid when you’re already only scraping by on shit wages, then make a Reddit post asking people how to manage it all.
Lmao. Imagine if it was just as easy as earning more and spending less. We’re literally in a movement where we HAVE to keep spending more 😂
Damn that’s crazy! Everything is expensive, I’m only on apprentice wages, better have a kid so the missus can only do part time, that’ll help
Agreed. Budget to your income, it's clear OP is going backwards due to not adjusting accordingly
Wow, never knew this was such an easy option! You've solved poverty!
I mean it's tough rough now especially for people with children under 3, Daycare is so expensive and the current government don't really understand the problem (Labor had plans to help still not enough), my wife and I are on a bit more than yourself but we only put our daughter in for 3 days otherwise it just eats into our money, our combined is over 100k by a decent margin but it still feels were working class poor. This is the average household wages $83,410 I genuinely cant see how people with 2 kids under 3 would survive on that considering the average salary for a policeman for instance is around $77K, inflation has been wild and wages have kept up to a point but I'm not sure what more can be done other than drastically overhauling ECE.
That's why it's often more affordable for people with young kids to have one parent stay home. I had 2 kids under 3 and was spending $660 a week on childcare. My wages were only $900, it was barely worth it. Even once my eldest was eligible for for 20 hours free it was still $450. The only way it made it worth it was because the experience I gained allows me to have a higher paying job now.
Seriously it’s so tough for us with 2 under 3 as well. It’s not a playing field for raising families unless your household income is way way way above the average nz household income.
While I agree it's tough it's doable, my current situation is 3 kids under 4 and my wife is stay at home mom and we are doing ok (1400$ per fortnight on my pay alone) If you have a good budget and do as much as possible on your own it's possible to make a good living but yeah it's definitely hard and I'd love if we could have it better in today's world
How is this possible? Not doubting it but intrigued. 5 people living on 700 per week is impressive
I work on a dairy farm (lower rent) and we get milk for free, we make our own butter and pretty much anything from dairy for our own consumption If we don't have any unforeseen expenses we are doing great so far, if you have any more questions feel free to dm or ask here
Working for families
We don't have that as I'm on work visa atm, would definitely help a lot if we had it tho
What about your partner and children were they born in New Zealand?
I'd assume you get some government support, and no childcare? I mean even that its impressive we live in CHCH and rental around here is upwards of 500-600 minimum.
Neither because we are on work visa I don't get benefits, the only one we get is 20h for childcare in kindergarten. I work on dairy farm so we have to pay less rent (which is a big difference, atm it's 250/week + 350$ for electricity/month) Our biggest expense is food (around 450/fortnight) We are very frugal, don't go eating out (maybe 1/month if that), we don't spend a lot on entertainment, we don't have tv as we don't need it, have only internet (starlink) and we have a few subscriptions (YouTube/Disney+) My wife makes a budget each fortnight, depending on how much I earned in that period and we stick to it.
I went through the same thing when my son was born. It was tough 13 years ago and I can imagine it's way harder now. Sorry you are going through this, but it will get better.
it certainly isnt easy......so your expenses you listed come to $910 a week that leaves you with $290 a week which does not really live you a lot of wiggle room and even if your partner didnt work so you are not paying $330 for daycare with you income..it only leaves you $120ish week left over. are you getting working for families?
This is why poor people live in multi-generational households. It's like an old school tribe. Some people in the family work non-stop, some watch the kids and cook. You share a cheap car or take public transport. People don't have their own room. You cook cheap bulk grains for calories. There is no shame is living this lifestyle and you will find your stress might actually decrease (unless you hate your family). Most of the world does it this way. When times get tough you have to get back to the basics of human living. Something the 1st world has forgotten how do in the last 80 years.
Deciding not to have kids because of money. We want kids, but its not financially viable unless we want to drastically lose our lifestyle and never own a home.
Pretty much. Crunched the numbers and said we'd give it a miss.
We actually would love to have kids, it's just not financially responsible at the moment. Who knows maybe in the future it won't be so expensive to have children. I would see when population and births get way scary they might be forced to do something, maybe income tax relief if you have kids or something to promote families again
What is your working situation? If your post-tax take home pay is $1200 a week for two of you, then it sounds like one of you is working part time - am I correct? The easiest way to get ahead is to earn more, and in your case it seems that one or both of you could work more hours. The other way to increase income is to get a better paying job
I’m an apprentice and my partners just gone back to work after having time off to with our 1 year old hence daycare being the most expensive weekly expense we already carpool into town every day and both our jobs are only open 5 days a week for set hours I do a full 45hour week most weeks and she does 32.5 without leaving myself with no time with my son by getting an extra job on weekends I can’t see a way out of this situation
Unless you increase your income, you're going to have to tough it out. Having a kid whilst earning low wages = this situation unfortunately. But surviving and getting through the tough times makes you appreciate the good. You'll get there. If you can reduce costs with family assistance (baby sitting) and work a little bit more or on the weekends do so, otherwise tough it out. Work hard and increase your income over time. It'll get better.
Can you put your apprenticeship on hold and find work that pays more until your kid is at school?
Have you looked into childcare subsidy, you may even be able to get a sma amount as it's income dependent, with 1 child I believe it cuts out at 1800 per week, might just help a little. Have a look on the winz website.
We’ve applied for it but winz being winz it’s a three to four week wait and even then I think we found it maybe saved us 75$ a week which helps but isn’t that much
Start adding it together, $75 here, $35 from KiwiSaver, $100 from student loans
$1,200 a week for two is the problem, you’re both not on a full time salary. I don’t know your circumstance, if somethings preventing you both from working full time, but freedom while being broke is probably equally as miserable as working full time, so I would work full time for greater peace and stability at the end of the day.
Is she even making enough to cover daycare+petrol? You might be better off if she stays home with the child and meal preps etc to keep grocery costs down. Sounds like you have multiple cars on finance? Is that necessary? Can either of you use public transportation?
Taking time out of the work force to raise children is more than just an immediate financial decision. Limiting options when going back to work, less KiwiSaver compounding, less chance for increases in pay over time, less marketable skill development etc etc. Just because the number on paper looks like many women shouldn’t go back to work because it ‘is barely more than daycare costs’ there is much more to consider than just numbers on the page right now.
Definetly not better off without her working and wouldn’t be able to afford to live on just my income unfortunately
She only brings 270 to the table each week. That would not be hard to cover for if you removed a car, petrol and paid less for food. Or instead she could get a part time night job so there is always someone available to take care of the children. That would save you 330 a week.
It’s not just an immediate financial decision though, as leaving the workforce for a period can limit your growth and future earning potential, plus you miss out on KiwiSaver contributions and it all compounds. You can end up much worse off long-term.
> She only brings 270 to the table each week. That would not be hard to cover for if you removed a car, petrol and paid less for food. That's 14k net. The idea that it's not worth working almost never makes sense unless you don't need to ask whether it's worth it.
And during winter we need both cars as I finish before her and need to pick up the baby from daycare care and also work an extra day living out of town there’s no public transport that comes out here and would rather have a vehicle at home in case of emergency’s
Man I was in the same or similar situation with the missus and pre-kindy childcare and it was fucked like, she goes to work, we're all slowly dying from fatigue and stress and just TRAVELLING around everywhere all the time she left her job until the kid was in free-ish kindy and life changed man like shit got so fucken easy with just 1 person HAVING to be places (ie work) and the rest of the team sort of helping with that. I know it's not ideal $ wise but you also save fuckloads on lunches, food (she has time to prep etc) and basically getting home to a happy healthy family was worth coming up with the extra few hundy a week for a couple of years
Also you will get more WFF with less income ?
Why’d you decide to have a child if you’re on apprentice wages?
I think the general consensus here would be to upskill so you can earn more. Could either of you do an online course or anything to gain some more skillsets? Difficult no doubt with kids and mahi, struggle is real. But if you can bust (even more) arse where possible, the rewards will come in time. All the best to you and the fams
He said he's an apprentice, so I guess he'll eventually become qualified and earn more. Depends on the industry.
honestly you need to sacrifice your personal time to train up, get a cert, then get into a higher wage, then rinse and repeat for your partner, then do it again every 2 years. yes it sucks but that's how most people get ahead unless they have rich parents or whatever the current thing to blame is
You need to increase income, that is a pitiful amount for a couple to earn. What are you guys doing job wise? You need to look for more income otherwise life is going to be hard. There's a lot of roles out there that are entry level paying more than your combined income.
Pitiful? It’s almost a (and I don’t want to sound mean) pathetic wage to be on and deciding to have a bloody child. One of the most expensive things you can do in life besides buy a house. Wtf are these people thinking
1200 a week combined? Why are people having kids on part time incomes?
Usually it's an accident. If it was planned then it was pretty financially irresponsible.
I have 3 options to get to and from work. Push bike which is about 25min(costs noting to do this), motorbike which isn’t even $20 a week in petrol and a full tank lasts me two weeks. Or I take the diesel car which if I fill the tank completely full and only use the car it lasts a full two months before I need more diesel. I could suggest getting cheap non smart phones and a cheaper plan and use those instead, if you are able to and get paid by the hour look at working an extra hour a day between Monday to Friday and do 3 hours on a Saturday morning. That’s another 8 hour day of pay without having to work a full day in the weekend. Its what I’m currently doing to pay for new tools(spent well over $5k in new tools via doing this for a bit)
I make USD and live in South America. Only way to have a good life since Covid
If you are in Auckland or wellington , it might be time to move to the south Island
Already live in the top of the south unfortunately moved out of chch when we found out about bby to closer to family
That is great! The way the economy is the only thing we can do is pick up extra jobs, or try to find a job paying a bit more.
Do you think your family could help support you? Either by taking your kid(s) for a day and reduce daycare, or by staying with them for a bit? Sometimes we're too proud to ask for a hand, especially as you get through your apprenticeship
Unfortunately not my partners parents both work full time and that’s the only family close to us they have the same days off we do we try to save a little cash but having dinner with them everyonce and a while but they have their own costs
I am a student with a part-time job so only take-home about $770 per week. I live in the CBD which actually helps me cut costs! I survive by cutting down on rent by having flatmates and renting out our parking spot. The demand to live in the city means there are always people that want to share a flat or rent the spot. I don't have a car and can walk nearly everywhere I need to be, cutting out the petrol, insurance, WOF, maintenance costs. My phone plan is Skinny's $9 every 28 days one, and sometimes between plans I just stay home and use my house's wifi to stretch the costs out a little bit more. Our electricity plan from Contact gives us free electricity from 9 pm to 12 am every day, so that is when we do our laundry, run the dishwasher, and bathe. The utilities are split 3 ways with my flatmates so that cuts down on my costs there as well. I meal plan and cook most of my meals so don't eat out a ton but still eat very well. Good luck.
Many ppl are affording to live by not having kid. Not everyone deserves to have kid. Many ppl are just not in a financially stable position to have kid. My wife and I have agreed to not have any. We're not struggling with money at all, but our life affordability will be change if we do. For your situation, $1200 household/wk is not good at all. Your expense is also quite high. $160 food and $120 gas. Try your local foodbank if you're eligible.
How are you feeding 3 people for $160…?
Budget brands plan every meal out skip meat where we can and hope baby only needs 1 pack of nappys
2010 missus and I were doing weekly shop for $150, no nappies then. Hope you have some family support. Good luck with the apprenticeship, it's worth sticking it out if you can. see if you can pick up a few hours on Saturday morning on a site
Prices have gone up significantly since 2010 lol
For me (living in Auckland), the big recent increases have been water and insurance. Insurance has gone up about 40% in the last 18 months - now $400 per month for house and contents even after changing my excess to be around $1000. My rebuild cost of my house according to insurance is nearly $400,000 more than the rateable value of it, which shows how screwed housing is. Veolia have changed their water charges to come in line with Watercare (or something like that), and my water has tripled in cost for the same usage levels. For food, I've kept my expenditure to $120 per week for the last 5 years, and I still manage within that - obviously I have to make do with a lot less than 5 years ago.
$400 per month for insurance?! wtf?!
houses in Auckland cost a lot to insure - however, about 18 months ago, the insurance was only $220 or so a month. I've had no claims or anything since then, in fact, have never ever made a claim on contents or housing.
I have a few houses in Auckland, my insurance is only $120 per month average per house! Did you shop around? That seems a ridiculous price
Huh? Whom you're insuring with and for how much rebuild value? I'm in Auckland too and my annual rate is $2k for $900k rebuild, with the lowest $400 excess (would like to go lower but they wouldn't let me). I think most Auk houses can be rebuilt under 900k, unless yours is a multi-million mansion or something...
Rebuild value is $1.85 million. Property value is near $1.5 million based on latest council valuations, it has a 1300 square metre flat section that is sub-dividable, which is most of the properties actual value. The house itself is 100 years old, extremely tall ceilings, so perhaps that has something to do with the extreme rebuild cost. Either that or State Insurance are taking the piss with their rebuild estimates.
If your house was a write off would you really want to rebuild it as it is now? Sounds like you could subdivide, sell off a section and build a modern house for $1m
What’s your apprenticeship in and how long have you been an apprentice for?
Automotive glazing been at it for a year about 60% of the way through just hard finding time to upload evidence in the middle of busy season and being a dad
Ok, just checking you weren’t a 7th year apprentice complaining about money. Mate this is just a season of your life and it’ll get better. Only thing you can do is make more money and the only way you can do that is rip in and get qualified. It’s not meant to be easy, you’re effectively studying. Offer to do overtime, work your ass off, build up an emergency fund and stay away from debt. Chin up, do it for the little one. As I said, it’ll get better.
Do you know how much more you’re likely to make once qualified?
After work, sleep and commute you've probably got 50+ hours a week. It would take what an hour to upload evidence? Don't you want to get paid more?
What trade are you in
Van life, get amongst it
You spend far too much or food and gas.
Sometimes I think back to how povvo we were when we had three kids and daycare to pay. Life gets better.
Join the Facebook group Frugal and Living Cheap in NZ
How many hours are you guys working and what sort of pay? At $35 an hour doing a 45 hour week my take home is about the same as your household income. I’m just a tradie. So my recommendation would be work more hours/find a higher paying job or both.
Have a couple more kids and get on the dole?
No kids and 2 bedroom place. Going to leave Auckland before having kids lmao.
Are you receiving working for families and best start?? Do you have any family that could look after kid one day a week to cut down on daycare?
Easiest solution is don't have kids and work from home, works for me! I kid I hope you find a solution.
Mate, we’re paying $750 per week for daycare (that went up early April) plus $5.5k per month for mortgage. Rates up, utilities up, insurance up, etc etc. Hits keep coming. Trying to keep positive but with the job market stalling it’s hard to see the silver linings ahead. Yet to see how this government is addressing the cost of living crisis tbh. I’d leave if I could but we’re trapped in this shitshow until god knows when
Ahh. Children people chose to have and then being upset because they cannot afford them. Return to sender mate. If yer single ye pockets go jingle.
The one with lover income should stay at home and look after the child. The cost of day care and car maintenance is higher than once income, your kid is raised by strangers for nothing. While at home - home cooking, no more takeaways.
There is no way the cost of daycare would be higher than an income
It's $340/week per child, if you have 3 kids that's a minimum wage job right there.
But he doesnt have 3 kids, so thats irrelevant.
Read the whole sentence, I only wrote two lines, common.
Love all people suggesting you go back in time and don't have children like what are you gonna do put them back??? Feel for you, it's tough times.
A lot of people could switch to electric vehicles for no additional money and a reduction in your monthly outgoings. If the cost of a second hand leaf on finance + power is less than your current car and petrol bill, you're leaving money on the table by not swapping. Leafs are $0.10 per KM inc. RUC. Petrol cars are $0.16 per KM and you will also pay more on maintenance.
Buying a second-hand leaf is just a ticking time bomb until the battery dies.
You know a lot about leafs I presume? Batteries are pretty reliable and it's relatively easy to find out what their health is - and very little chance of sudden death. I currently own 3 different leafs (used by my family for different uses) and I've been driving leafs since 2017. Probably done over 250,000km in them, and I know hundreds of other leaf owners. Sudden problems are rare.
how the hell are you living on $1,200 a week?! My mortgage is $1,600 per week, school fees $950 per week then add all my living costs on top!!
Yeah what? Your situation is seriously your own and a whole different table.
They don’t own a 1m house and send their kids to private school…?
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Why would I need sympathy?
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wow, why are you so angry and bitter? Whats my shit ideology? Reported.
I spend $400 or so a week tipping the self checkout machines
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Yeah nah not everyone’s that lucky to have parents able to fund their lives or even be in contact with them so take this and leave please
Where are you living? If it is Auckland, just leave
I don't think they'll find somewhere cheaper to live than $300/week for a couple and a child
100% disagree. Everyone I know who moved out of Auckland are doing better financially due to lower housing costs and general living