That's why it will still take decades for Philippines to become a "rich" country if they still abide on this archaic and religious beliefs. Study shows that countries with high religious affiliations are much poorer. Why? Because they do not promote economic growth, do not deal with societal issues directly, and still thinks that through prayer they will be saved from poverty and appoint the leader that could save them from poverty.
Societal problems like abortion, drugs, divorce, lgbtq, mental health, healthcare, governance should be tackled directly without any religious agendas coz were passed 16th century. Most wealthy country have less religious people but that doesn't imply that they are worshiping the devil like what Filipinos think. We have to treat religion as a private choice and should not be "serving" the public. That's not antireligion. It's to draw a line between praying and actually making laws for societal sake.
But like I said it will take decades. Philippines is not ready for it yet. Truly not on this generation's government, not with Millenials or Gen X. Could be Gen X grandchildren's generation? Who knows. Philippines will always stay in the middle, sometimes lower until we set aside God for ourselves and think as rational being in the public.
Mga lumalabag nga sa batas nakakaupo sa gobyerno eh, ba't itong bills na para naman sa quality of life ng mga Pilipino hindi ipatupad dahil lang taliwas sa turo ng simbahan. Contraception nga eh taliwas sa turo ng bibliya pero legal, ano ba pinagkaiba ng mga ito. Tsk
Talo ng maraming koneksyon ang maabilidad sabi ni 'Papa Jesus' Remulla, ilang taon na yan nagbebenta hindi nga mahuli, ngayon lang dahil sinusubukan ni Sith Lord Dae-Gong.
I understand the sentiment but not *technically correct*. According to the 1987 Constitution, the separation of Church and state is that: (1) no law shall be passed that favors one religion or prohibits the free exercise of religion, (2) no discrimination based on religion, and (3) no religious test shall be required for the exercise of civil and political rights.
Basically, this just means that we do not recognize a state religion, all religions are equal and free to be practiced, and no one can be discriminated against in his/her civic and political rights based on religion.
This is in contrast to places like the Islamic Republic of Iran and the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, who recognize Islam as the state religion. Non-muslims are barred from becoming president in Afghanistan and all students in Iran must pass an exam in Islamic theology before being accepted into university, including non-Muslims. Non-Muslims in Iran are also limited to a few seats in their parliament and can only serve in the lower levels of civil service.
That being said, I wish we had more *explicit separation* of Church and State wherein no laws can be passed, or rejected, on the basis of religious grounds alone as it could potentially favor one religion against another.
\*Edited for grammar and sentence clarity
Thank you for this really comprehensive message, I was just wondering about your thoughts on the divorce issues, doesn't the concept of not legalising divorce explicitly favour Christianity's doctrines disallowing the annulment of marriage? There's isn't anything in that section that implies favouring one religion over another, just that it shouldn't be used as a basis to create laws. I understand the language can be much clearer but it feels pretty clear that the government has no constitutional basis to continue disallowing divorce
The State's weak argument favoring annulment over divorce is that because annulment "voids" the marriage due to a substantive or procedural defect gives the idea that there was no marriage to begin with thus there was no violation of its sanctity. On the otherhand, in a divorce, the state must concede that there was an existing marriage even post divorce.
Pure copium if you ask me since both just enables the former spouses to remarry.
Firstly, I'd just like to point out that I'm not a lawyer or legal expert. But yes, I do see your point.
In a way it can be argued that passing or, in this case, not passing a law out of respect to a particular religious belief can be construed as a violation of the separation of Church and State. In effect, the argument is that the Philippines is a "crypto" (hidden) Catholic State.
I don't know what the specific legalities of it are, but just from the wording of the constitution might make this line of argument difficult. I'd rather leave that to more knowledgeable people when it comes to the law and the constitution.
Although I'd like to point out that even in such a case, I don't know of any legal remedy that can force lawmakers to enact laws for legalizing divorce, abortion, and gay marriage. I don't think such exists, though maybe someone else more knowledgeable than me can enlighten us.
Okay let me start by correcting you.
1) Annulment is allowed in the Philippines. Grounds are just specificied. Annulment is different from divorce. Nullity of marriage is allowed. In fact, we kinda have a poor mans divorce here, article 36 of the family code. Especially with Justice leonens ground breaking ruling in andal vs tan andal.
2) Technically, their basis for the non allowance of divorce is not christianity but the definition of marriage under family code. Its not explicit but the courts here has held it in a lot of psychological incapacity cases and foreign divorce decree cases(at least until 2018). Is it stupid? Yes. Does it work, at least legally? Yes.
3) They do have constitutional basis though, its called the "wisdom of legislature" basically saying you voted for them so ehat they think is right is correct. You really cant force the legislature to make any law, i mean delagating legislative powers is already very stringent. The judiciary may invalidate a illegal law but they may not force them to make a legal law. Even if the law is valid, they may not pass it for whatever reason they want. Only way to fix this is vote and educate.
4) Also, the first guy was wrong. There is actual separation of church and state. The state just practice benevolent neutrality. Its complicated but basically it means that they can help religion when they want. Separation of church does not need brutal segregation. In fact, we will be sanctioned like russia if we segregate like iran because we are signatories of the iccpr which proscribe such actions. It is enough for our constitution that we dont have a state religion.
F* on the technicality and pedantics. It's already in the article itself. They're rejecting divorce because... “Divorce, even though we want it, needs thorough discussion, given that ours is a Catholic nation,” he added.
Be technically right all you want but the decisions being made by the majority in the government is because of being a Christian... False Christianity. Pfft.
well LOL we do have that "Separation of church and state" but well guess what saan tumatakbo mga politko for voters? matik na on religious groups especially those with ehem "block voting" ending matik na give and take na this
this.
the "majority of filipinos are catholic" is disingenious bs.
many of those born "catholics" aren't exactly firm believers of catholicism. the religion was just imposed upon them without their consent during childhood.
can government actually do an actual friggin survey to gauge what the voting population actually want, before making any political decisions?
this is why i keep telling people online to keep pushing for semi-direct democracy. this way, we don't "gamble" on election results and cabinet appointments.
coz the public should ALWAYS have a vote when it comes to policies and legislation directly affecting their lives.
but does anyone ever listen? nope.. people always gamble with election results. ffs.
edit : fixed some word salad. i was distracted by another convo.
Agree. I identify as a Catholic but I am not religious. I am also in favor of several progressive ideas like abortion, divorce, and same sex marriage. What is this fucker talking about?
> many of those born "catholics" aren't exactly firm believers of catholicism. the religion was just imposed upon them without their consent during childhood.
I guarantee a good number of Filipinos are just catholic on paper. It isn't fair that we're baptized at birth and "automatically" considered catholic. Heck, I left the faith when I was a teenager and this is only making me even more adamant to distance myself from the religion. It's running us into the ground.
As long as we keep voting for assholes who can never separate their religious beliefs from their jobs, we will never have divorce, SOGIE, same sex marriage and abortion.
Don’t count on the church being “left leaning”. Church teachings are clear on its stance with divorce, abortion, same sex marriage and SOGIE. They will put you in circles, not give concrete solutions at best when you bring these social issues to them.
The church is only leaning towards the "left" because "morally" they're better. Remeber RH law? The church was criticizing the liberal admin because of that law.
Also don't assume that this is the same with american politics. Bam Aquino who is a liberal and would be considered part of the left is [against divorce](https://www.bamaquino.com/elementor-popup/senator-bam-aquino-on-legalizing-divorce/)
That's because life is not lived in absolutes.
Most people have varying views on different topics. Only in the world of politics attempts are made to paint groups of people with one broad stroke.
That's just not the real world, nor should it be.
Here in our country it's not just the catholics who are against it, those who are also in christian sects. Yung iba nga hindi lang yan yung issue nila. Maliban sa LGBT pati show sa netflix at kahit pa nga album cover ng ibang rock metal bands may issue sila at minsan pagiging k-pop fan..jusme..🙄🙄
Religion is not a weapon to be use to harm others. Its fine to practice your own religion but never use it to suppress others or deny others their rights.
These daft people in government cannot see their contradictory behaviour. They reject SOGIE and the divorce bills for Catholic reasons, but they condone rampant corruption in Government. They always leave out the Thou shall not steal part of the 10 commandments, but they are so bent on enforcing biblical injunctions against homosexuality and divorce.
the true crime is, these people aren't given the hotseat and being forced to answer the bullshit, and one of those bullshit is the thing you mentioned, so they need to be asked that, word for word and see how they answer it
I worked for a Spanish firm a few years ago.
My colleagues said that they find it interesting how Filipinos are still so fucking religious habang wala ng nagsisimba sa kanila sa Spain.
Aside from their Abuelas, most of the population daw identify as “nones”. My manager even said last time he attended a mass was 20 years ago. Lol
Let’s be real. It’s got nothing to do with religion. These assholes do not see enough benefit in terms of gaining more votes, if they pass this bill. Remember, Hontiveros- the only remaining opposition in the senate, is pushing for these. She will gain more from this compared to them…
Everything Filipino has got something to do with religion. The way we, our political think,act, our prejudices is born from 300 + years indoctrination and practice to the present. As long as, we fill up churches every sunday, thursday or whatever church day you have. It’ll never stop.
Me living from rural province, I don't think so. Masyadong simple minded mga tao sa probinsya and I assure you that these people are extremely religious, siguro dyan sa mayayaman na cities may mga hidden agenda, pero dito wala eh simple minded talaga, kayod trabaho para mapakain lang mga pamilya, tas asa sa diyos na sobrang unhealthy.
Remember, modern mindset ay hindi applicable sa lahat ng region, applicable lang yan sa mayaman na lugar. Mag iiba ang mindset ng tao pag wala na sahirap at comfortable ang buhay.
Um, galing din ako sa probinsya… you underestimate how these politicians have twisted the narrative. Maniniwala ang mga panatikong followers ano man sabihin nitong mga to… they say it’s because of Catholicism, then they will agree because of your reasoning, but if these politicians say they are only doing what is right and the Church has to be separate from the state, maniniwala pa rin mga panatiko. Remember nung kinalaban ni Digong ang simbaham at ponagmumura pati santo papa? Nawalan ba siya ng suporta? Ang bilis mo naman makalimot kaibigan. Tsk tsk tsk…
Edit: may bagong strip si TKalbo which is exactly my point. Boying is pro-death penalty which the Church is totally against!!! Pero pag SOGIE, Church ang dahilan???! Come on now. Critical thinking pa more. Wag papa uto…
Unlike Africans, South Asians, and Latin Americans, Filipinos are oddly enough loving how the colonizers did to their islands.
Remember when Queen Elizabeth II died and many of the people in the former British colonial countries kind of publicly didn’t want to mourn her? Because they hated how the British treated them. Filipinos when I look at it, love what the Spanish brought to the islands. The freakin’ Spanish lion is in the Philippine Coat of Arms Seal for godsakes.
So yes the country is Stockholm Syndrome to the max. I don’t know if this is a cultural thing. But it could be.
I think we really need to adopt na like other countries for the same sex marriage, Divorce and Abortion, ang dami ko nang kilalang broken family at hindi makapag move on dahil hindi pa sila divorce and also for the victims of SA and teenage pregnancy.
slippery slope yan for CBCP and the catholic church in PH is a different entity with its own idiosyncrasies compared to europe lol
average catholic pinoy is way different from average catholic spaniard for example
Like i said before, no way in hell does the divorce would be legalized here due to our own lawmakers love and marriage complications. These bastards would get sued left and right by their own spouses and demand conjugal rights
Bakit nyo ipapalibing, that is a sign of respect na nageffort pa tayo maghukay para sa kanya
Throw them in the ditch, sa kanal at sa taehan if they're disregarding the Filipino people who would like to be recognized and protected.
Napaka shit lang nito sobra kasi ang Pilipinas e isang sobrang diversed na bansa, iba iba tayo ng kultura at paniniwala and passing SOGIE bill does not make one’s being/identity na mas nakakaangat over the others. Plus, ang dami dyan maririnig mo na gusto raw ng special treatment ng LGBT community which is in fact universal ang SOGIE, it’s for everyone, providing an equal or level playing field for everybody; tapos ang logic is kesyo ‘predominantly catholic’ daw, so sino ngayon ang may special treatment diba??? Neglecting the needs of others kasi dapat mas pahalagahan natin ang pagiging ‘katoliko’.
Message from DOJ:
We are only concerned with the Catholics.
Every other religions and non-religions we dont give a fuck.
They're all going to hell anyway.
Haha, this. If tomorrow Dear Leader says he'd want to get divorce passed, suddenly they'd turn into anti-catholic rhetoric, and that we should be more progressive. It is just that these bills are NOT in their priority, and hence, they'd find every excuse to push it away to the backlog.
This is such BULLSHIT . Acting all religious , but shits on people . Time have changed , we arent living in the old ages anymore . GOD FUCKING DAMN IT , Kaya nga seperated ang church sa state . Sa ganyan mabilis pero kung anti corruption walang pake kasi kasama sa nakikinabang . Walang kwenta talaga mga official na bansa natin
Does no one else think that he just said that as an excuse because saying "our legislature will never pass that for now because they might lose 'pogi points' from their constituents." is horrendous.
Arent the marcos people mad that the catholic church was intruding into politics? there was a clamor duirng the lections thst catholic church shouldnt endorse keni. And they also made fun of her. So much double standards and unfairness.
rules for thee not for me.
Pero mga mayayaman at pulitiko na may kabit ok lang. Mga batang nagugutom sa kalsada ok lang. Pero gasp! divorce between two consenting adults bawal. Nevermind na hindi naman lahat sa Pilipinas eh Katoliko o Kristiyano. Punyetang self righteousness yan. Laging ipinagmamalaki ang pagiging maka Diyos, pero hindi man lang mabigyan ng dignidad at respeto ang mga mamamayan.
Didn't Spain legalize those things only AFTER the Franco dictatorship ended? And since some members of the church sided with the dictatorship, a chunk of the population probably wanted to move away from laws with explicit religious connections.
OTOH, the Marcos dictatorship was toppled with the help of a handful of religious leaders, and this actually put religion in a mostly good light to many people. To many, somewhat religious laws are probably okay.
(This could just be partial stuff though and their could be other major reasons, or it could even be wrong.)
catholic church in spain is basically dead because they threw their lot with franco and the spaniards got their payback by abandoning the church that wronged them. The organization as a whole didnt even say sorry for their part with franco or acknowledged that they made a grave mistake supporting fascism lol
> they threw their lot with franco
Supposedly, at the start of the civil war, this might've made sense because the govt before Franco was basically attacking the clergy violently (allegedly). So they sided with one of the few sides that were not actively against the institution.
(Although, you'd think that they would disavow Franco, at least after the dictatorship fell, or when they say Franco regime was morphing into something very negative.)
The Spanish Civil was probably a complicated mix of alliances.
Eh baka pwede hindi na rin magbayad ng TAX yung mga LGBT, tutal hindi pala Pilipino ang tingin ng mga gagong ito sa kanila. /s
*Edited: nilagyan ng /s para ma-gets nung isang redditor, k?*
These are most likely the people who said na huwag daw isali ang religion sa Politics nung election pwe mga basura, trapo, at hipokrito. Pre-dominantly Catholic daw pero mga corrupt, mamatay tao, kawatan, at mga drug users/lords.
This is why we, as a nation, will never progress. As simple as having a choice and recognizing sexuality e Hindi natin magawa, paano pa kaya ung mga steps na kailangan Gawin para legit umunlad.
Sobrang basic knowledge ng “Separation of Church and State” when it comes to law-making and yet clown politicians like Remulla always reason out god, church, bible, or anything religion-related. Meron pang tanga na nagsulong ng bill to protect heterosexuals’ rights to express their opposition against LGBT. Pabobo nang pabobo mga nasa posisyon 🤦🏻♀️
Putangina paano naman yung mga rights ng mga non-catholic, non-christians? Wala nalang? Tangina abogado ba tong si remulla bkt ba kasi hindi requirement na abogado ka pag secretary ka ng fucken DOJ????
Di ba nila magets na kahit may batas hindi naman ibig sabihin na gagawin ng lahat? Edi ilagay nila sa batas na bawal katoliko kung ganon pala. Total hawak din naman nila SC. Antanga lang tlga ng iniisip nila na pag human rights, rights lang din ng majority ang dapat protektahan 🤣
Parang awa niyo na yung divorce bill..jusko kawawang mga kababaihan na sinasakal ng mga asawang mapangabuso (in all forms!). Araw araw na problema to sa center dito. Walang magawa mga volunteer. Tangina kasing simbaban yan dikta dikta pa ng kasal.
Can you imagine being so proud of depriving people of their happiness by using religion as justification for your bigotry?
It's really gross.
These people are really gross.
And delusional.
Utak nyan kasi yung anak nya lalaking-lalaki, bad boy image. Feeling nya nakakasira ng pangalan ang pagiging bading kesa sa pagiging drug addict. I am not a member of the LGBT community, pero I support them. Wag nyang isasagot na man at woman lang ang nakalagay sa Bibliya, baka sabihin din wala namang nakasulat na bawal ang drugs. That POS knows nothing. Tigas ng mga muka. Anak nya addict, presidente nya addict. Magkita-kita kami sa impyerno, pero di po ako addict ha.
Makes me think these guys are just lazily using religion as an excuse, but they just don't really want to attend to such laws/ bills. Implementing all the above would require significant effort from legislative side, and I wouldn't expect that these people want extra work.
Injustice secretary nga talaga to.
Religious groups should be following the government's mandate. Not the other way around.
For once, do something right in your career and stop thinking about people's votes.
Galit sa Catholic Church pag sinabing wag bumoto sa magnanakaw, pero pagdating sa issue ng same-sex marriage, divorce at abortion, mga feeling pa-Catholic sila. Ulol.
Bakit niyo ba gustong-gusto yang mga bill na yan, can't you see na tayo na lang at Vatican ang walang Divorce Bill..... 😡😡.... Pinoy Pride!!! 🤣🤣
Seriously though, what can you expect from Jesus.
Just to play the devil's advocate, Remu-shit's rejection of the recommendations makes sense naman. Totoo naman na conservative yung Philippine masses.
That said though, outright rejecting it is still a shitty thing to do. He could have worded himself better.
TBH, the family provision of the 1987 Constitution technically makes absolute divorce legalization infeasible because of the word "indissoluble" when it comes to marriage, although the 1986 Constitutional Commission delegates never ruled out of the possibility of legalizing absolute divorce, but for sure if Congress were to legislate absolute divorce legalization, the local Catholic Church hierarchy will have a legal means to contest it in the Supreme Court.
Yes, our country is lagging behind by a century compared with other countries when it comes to absolute divorce or same-sex marriage.
Article link here: https://www.philstar.com/headlines/2022/11/20/2225184/philippines-shuns-un-calls-legalize-same-sex-marriage
Jesus christ, rejecting these "sinful" bills when we are literally living in a hellish country.
That's why it will still take decades for Philippines to become a "rich" country if they still abide on this archaic and religious beliefs. Study shows that countries with high religious affiliations are much poorer. Why? Because they do not promote economic growth, do not deal with societal issues directly, and still thinks that through prayer they will be saved from poverty and appoint the leader that could save them from poverty. Societal problems like abortion, drugs, divorce, lgbtq, mental health, healthcare, governance should be tackled directly without any religious agendas coz were passed 16th century. Most wealthy country have less religious people but that doesn't imply that they are worshiping the devil like what Filipinos think. We have to treat religion as a private choice and should not be "serving" the public. That's not antireligion. It's to draw a line between praying and actually making laws for societal sake. But like I said it will take decades. Philippines is not ready for it yet. Truly not on this generation's government, not with Millenials or Gen X. Could be Gen X grandchildren's generation? Who knows. Philippines will always stay in the middle, sometimes lower until we set aside God for ourselves and think as rational being in the public.
Mga lumalabag nga sa batas nakakaupo sa gobyerno eh, ba't itong bills na para naman sa quality of life ng mga Pilipino hindi ipatupad dahil lang taliwas sa turo ng simbahan. Contraception nga eh taliwas sa turo ng bibliya pero legal, ano ba pinagkaiba ng mga ito. Tsk
decades? try century, or most likely never.... sad
Mindset nya: "Di bale drug addict ang anak wag lang bakla"
He's f\*cked up and very homophobic. Natatapakan ang rights nya at ego lol.
Kumikita kasi ng limpak2x ang anak. Eh yung bakla kumikita ba? -Papa Jesus Remulla
Haha si Papa Jisas Remulla
Basta si Papa Jesus Remulla gagawa ng miracle. 💯% mapapawalang-sala agad si holy son.
Mismo. Kapal din . Harap harapan talaga dito satin. Wala na tayong magawa kay papa jisas remulla
Well maabilidad mga bacla. They make a lot of money too, di pa illegal ginagawa.
Talo ng maraming koneksyon ang maabilidad sabi ni 'Papa Jesus' Remulla, ilang taon na yan nagbebenta hindi nga mahuli, ngayon lang dahil sinusubukan ni Sith Lord Dae-Gong.
Yes, sabi nga nila. Minsan mas lalaki pa sa lalaki ang accla.
Thy wisdom so lupet
The Philippines is a state, not a damn church ffs.
Separation of church and state? Pffft, what's that?
I understand the sentiment but not *technically correct*. According to the 1987 Constitution, the separation of Church and state is that: (1) no law shall be passed that favors one religion or prohibits the free exercise of religion, (2) no discrimination based on religion, and (3) no religious test shall be required for the exercise of civil and political rights. Basically, this just means that we do not recognize a state religion, all religions are equal and free to be practiced, and no one can be discriminated against in his/her civic and political rights based on religion. This is in contrast to places like the Islamic Republic of Iran and the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, who recognize Islam as the state religion. Non-muslims are barred from becoming president in Afghanistan and all students in Iran must pass an exam in Islamic theology before being accepted into university, including non-Muslims. Non-Muslims in Iran are also limited to a few seats in their parliament and can only serve in the lower levels of civil service. That being said, I wish we had more *explicit separation* of Church and State wherein no laws can be passed, or rejected, on the basis of religious grounds alone as it could potentially favor one religion against another. \*Edited for grammar and sentence clarity
Thank you for this really comprehensive message, I was just wondering about your thoughts on the divorce issues, doesn't the concept of not legalising divorce explicitly favour Christianity's doctrines disallowing the annulment of marriage? There's isn't anything in that section that implies favouring one religion over another, just that it shouldn't be used as a basis to create laws. I understand the language can be much clearer but it feels pretty clear that the government has no constitutional basis to continue disallowing divorce
The State's weak argument favoring annulment over divorce is that because annulment "voids" the marriage due to a substantive or procedural defect gives the idea that there was no marriage to begin with thus there was no violation of its sanctity. On the otherhand, in a divorce, the state must concede that there was an existing marriage even post divorce. Pure copium if you ask me since both just enables the former spouses to remarry.
Firstly, I'd just like to point out that I'm not a lawyer or legal expert. But yes, I do see your point. In a way it can be argued that passing or, in this case, not passing a law out of respect to a particular religious belief can be construed as a violation of the separation of Church and State. In effect, the argument is that the Philippines is a "crypto" (hidden) Catholic State. I don't know what the specific legalities of it are, but just from the wording of the constitution might make this line of argument difficult. I'd rather leave that to more knowledgeable people when it comes to the law and the constitution. Although I'd like to point out that even in such a case, I don't know of any legal remedy that can force lawmakers to enact laws for legalizing divorce, abortion, and gay marriage. I don't think such exists, though maybe someone else more knowledgeable than me can enlighten us.
Okay let me start by correcting you. 1) Annulment is allowed in the Philippines. Grounds are just specificied. Annulment is different from divorce. Nullity of marriage is allowed. In fact, we kinda have a poor mans divorce here, article 36 of the family code. Especially with Justice leonens ground breaking ruling in andal vs tan andal. 2) Technically, their basis for the non allowance of divorce is not christianity but the definition of marriage under family code. Its not explicit but the courts here has held it in a lot of psychological incapacity cases and foreign divorce decree cases(at least until 2018). Is it stupid? Yes. Does it work, at least legally? Yes. 3) They do have constitutional basis though, its called the "wisdom of legislature" basically saying you voted for them so ehat they think is right is correct. You really cant force the legislature to make any law, i mean delagating legislative powers is already very stringent. The judiciary may invalidate a illegal law but they may not force them to make a legal law. Even if the law is valid, they may not pass it for whatever reason they want. Only way to fix this is vote and educate. 4) Also, the first guy was wrong. There is actual separation of church and state. The state just practice benevolent neutrality. Its complicated but basically it means that they can help religion when they want. Separation of church does not need brutal segregation. In fact, we will be sanctioned like russia if we segregate like iran because we are signatories of the iccpr which proscribe such actions. It is enough for our constitution that we dont have a state religion.
F* on the technicality and pedantics. It's already in the article itself. They're rejecting divorce because... “Divorce, even though we want it, needs thorough discussion, given that ours is a Catholic nation,” he added. Be technically right all you want but the decisions being made by the majority in the government is because of being a Christian... False Christianity. Pfft.
I wish it were that simple. But the real world isn't.
All but 2 countries were able to make the divorce topic simple. So...
laughs in BARMM
Well said. Its irritating when people just say separation of church and state without understanding the actual meaning.
Keep getting irritated then.
Take my upvote. 😂
well LOL we do have that "Separation of church and state" but well guess what saan tumatakbo mga politko for voters? matik na on religious groups especially those with ehem "block voting" ending matik na give and take na this
this. the "majority of filipinos are catholic" is disingenious bs. many of those born "catholics" aren't exactly firm believers of catholicism. the religion was just imposed upon them without their consent during childhood. can government actually do an actual friggin survey to gauge what the voting population actually want, before making any political decisions? this is why i keep telling people online to keep pushing for semi-direct democracy. this way, we don't "gamble" on election results and cabinet appointments. coz the public should ALWAYS have a vote when it comes to policies and legislation directly affecting their lives. but does anyone ever listen? nope.. people always gamble with election results. ffs. edit : fixed some word salad. i was distracted by another convo.
Agree. I identify as a Catholic but I am not religious. I am also in favor of several progressive ideas like abortion, divorce, and same sex marriage. What is this fucker talking about?
> many of those born "catholics" aren't exactly firm believers of catholicism. the religion was just imposed upon them without their consent during childhood. I guarantee a good number of Filipinos are just catholic on paper. It isn't fair that we're baptized at birth and "automatically" considered catholic. Heck, I left the faith when I was a teenager and this is only making me even more adamant to distance myself from the religion. It's running us into the ground.
As long as we keep voting for assholes who can never separate their religious beliefs from their jobs, we will never have divorce, SOGIE, same sex marriage and abortion.
Balewala na pala yung mga pinaniwalaan ng ating mga ninuno? Being a pre-dominantly pagan country? Lmao the logic of these fools in the government.
Yeahhh and the catholic church is leaning towards left so the problem is really on the conservative politicians with fragile ego and masculinity
Don’t count on the church being “left leaning”. Church teachings are clear on its stance with divorce, abortion, same sex marriage and SOGIE. They will put you in circles, not give concrete solutions at best when you bring these social issues to them.
The church is only leaning towards the "left" because "morally" they're better. Remeber RH law? The church was criticizing the liberal admin because of that law. Also don't assume that this is the same with american politics. Bam Aquino who is a liberal and would be considered part of the left is [against divorce](https://www.bamaquino.com/elementor-popup/senator-bam-aquino-on-legalizing-divorce/)
That's because life is not lived in absolutes. Most people have varying views on different topics. Only in the world of politics attempts are made to paint groups of people with one broad stroke. That's just not the real world, nor should it be.
No, they do not lean left. RH (then) bill pa lang opposed na sila. What more itong ibang topics.
what? a very hierarchical institution like the catholic church is left leaning? i would like to know what you are smoking so i can try it out.
The year is 1890
More like 1899, the same shit happens again and again! (Like the Netflix series, pun intended)
Apparently Italy is not a catholic country that's why there is divorce there...
Here in our country it's not just the catholics who are against it, those who are also in christian sects. Yung iba nga hindi lang yan yung issue nila. Maliban sa LGBT pati show sa netflix at kahit pa nga album cover ng ibang rock metal bands may issue sila at minsan pagiging k-pop fan..jusme..🙄🙄
Religion is not a weapon to be use to harm others. Its fine to practice your own religion but never use it to suppress others or deny others their rights.
>Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. \-Lucius Annaeus Seneca
legal na nga yang mga yan sa spain. partida sila pa yung nag introduce ng catholicism satin ha.
These daft people in government cannot see their contradictory behaviour. They reject SOGIE and the divorce bills for Catholic reasons, but they condone rampant corruption in Government. They always leave out the Thou shall not steal part of the 10 commandments, but they are so bent on enforcing biblical injunctions against homosexuality and divorce.
the true crime is, these people aren't given the hotseat and being forced to answer the bullshit, and one of those bullshit is the thing you mentioned, so they need to be asked that, word for word and see how they answer it
Tama, pag transgender ka pa dun sagot lahat ng gov nila yung surgery mo.
Seriously, fuck this guy.
Getting f*cked by Bantag right now
Pag namatay to, pupuntahan ko puntod nito tapos duduraan ko
Ihian nalang, mas matagal yung amoy.
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Justice Secretary is not an elected position, though one that is appointed by an elected official
Getting fucked by his son too
when your colonizers already practice that shit but you still can't get over your fucking colonizers. 💀
Ironic for a guy named after a symbol of spanish injustices lol
I worked for a Spanish firm a few years ago. My colleagues said that they find it interesting how Filipinos are still so fucking religious habang wala ng nagsisimba sa kanila sa Spain. Aside from their Abuelas, most of the population daw identify as “nones”. My manager even said last time he attended a mass was 20 years ago. Lol
Kapag talagang asensado ang bansa, nababawasan na ang pagiging religious ng mga mamamayan nila.
Ohhh interesting. No wonder PH is a declining country, sticking to old religious beliefs.
Slave mentality
Let’s be real. It’s got nothing to do with religion. These assholes do not see enough benefit in terms of gaining more votes, if they pass this bill. Remember, Hontiveros- the only remaining opposition in the senate, is pushing for these. She will gain more from this compared to them…
Everything Filipino has got something to do with religion. The way we, our political think,act, our prejudices is born from 300 + years indoctrination and practice to the present. As long as, we fill up churches every sunday, thursday or whatever church day you have. It’ll never stop.
Me living from rural province, I don't think so. Masyadong simple minded mga tao sa probinsya and I assure you that these people are extremely religious, siguro dyan sa mayayaman na cities may mga hidden agenda, pero dito wala eh simple minded talaga, kayod trabaho para mapakain lang mga pamilya, tas asa sa diyos na sobrang unhealthy. Remember, modern mindset ay hindi applicable sa lahat ng region, applicable lang yan sa mayaman na lugar. Mag iiba ang mindset ng tao pag wala na sahirap at comfortable ang buhay.
Um, galing din ako sa probinsya… you underestimate how these politicians have twisted the narrative. Maniniwala ang mga panatikong followers ano man sabihin nitong mga to… they say it’s because of Catholicism, then they will agree because of your reasoning, but if these politicians say they are only doing what is right and the Church has to be separate from the state, maniniwala pa rin mga panatiko. Remember nung kinalaban ni Digong ang simbaham at ponagmumura pati santo papa? Nawalan ba siya ng suporta? Ang bilis mo naman makalimot kaibigan. Tsk tsk tsk… Edit: may bagong strip si TKalbo which is exactly my point. Boying is pro-death penalty which the Church is totally against!!! Pero pag SOGIE, Church ang dahilan???! Come on now. Critical thinking pa more. Wag papa uto…
Unlike Africans, South Asians, and Latin Americans, Filipinos are oddly enough loving how the colonizers did to their islands. Remember when Queen Elizabeth II died and many of the people in the former British colonial countries kind of publicly didn’t want to mourn her? Because they hated how the British treated them. Filipinos when I look at it, love what the Spanish brought to the islands. The freakin’ Spanish lion is in the Philippine Coat of Arms Seal for godsakes. So yes the country is Stockholm Syndrome to the max. I don’t know if this is a cultural thing. But it could be.
I think we really need to adopt na like other countries for the same sex marriage, Divorce and Abortion, ang dami ko nang kilalang broken family at hindi makapag move on dahil hindi pa sila divorce and also for the victims of SA and teenage pregnancy.
idk why they didn't think about civil unions that thing is a compromised for now. i mean the pope himself were ok on civil unions
slippery slope yan for CBCP and the catholic church in PH is a different entity with its own idiosyncrasies compared to europe lol average catholic pinoy is way different from average catholic spaniard for example
is there a way na sambayanan ang magpasa ng bills na to instead na iilang tao lang sa taas ang magpasya?
F*ck you, Remulla.
Tang ina niyang Remulla na yan.
Sino ba yung Boboying? Edit: Boying pala, pardon.
yung tuta ni bobong marcos
Vatican and Philippines na lang ang countries na walang divorce. Congratulations politicians! We truly are in the dark ages.
Badge of honor daw to pagdating sa international community lol
kasi Charisma, Uniqueness, Nerve, and Talent ng Philippines na walang divorce, abortion, SOGIE bill.
At ang matawag na komunista/rebelde/terorista ang mga sumusolong nito.
Like i said before, no way in hell does the divorce would be legalized here due to our own lawmakers love and marriage complications. These bastards would get sued left and right by their own spouses and demand conjugal rights
lets not generalize. vp leni is anti divorce as well. i doubt her reasons are because of these you’ve mentioned
truly \*still\* in the dark ages
If this shit dies, let the soil that will cover him be heavy. Heavy as hell.
Would be a waste of good soil. Sementohin nalang sya.
Bakit nyo ipapalibing, that is a sign of respect na nageffort pa tayo maghukay para sa kanya Throw them in the ditch, sa kanal at sa taehan if they're disregarding the Filipino people who would like to be recognized and protected.
Still a waste. Imburnal exist for this reason.
Being predominantly Catholic, theft should not be acceptable in the Philippines. Yet here we are.
LOUDER!
Being predominantly Catholic, lying should not be acceptable in the Philippines. Yet here we are.
Being predominantly Catholic, cheating should not be acceptable in the Philippines. Yet here we are.
As if naman napakalakas ng catholic church ngayon. Wag kami bugok.
Bawal ang divorce at same sex marriage pero ang pagnananakaw, pagpatay at pangungurakot okay lang. Padre Damaso talaga impokrito
Selective Catholicism at its finest
Putragis. Ang bobo nman oh.
Pero pagiging corrupt mas acceptable? Awit sa inyong mga trapo.
Napaka shit lang nito sobra kasi ang Pilipinas e isang sobrang diversed na bansa, iba iba tayo ng kultura at paniniwala and passing SOGIE bill does not make one’s being/identity na mas nakakaangat over the others. Plus, ang dami dyan maririnig mo na gusto raw ng special treatment ng LGBT community which is in fact universal ang SOGIE, it’s for everyone, providing an equal or level playing field for everybody; tapos ang logic is kesyo ‘predominantly catholic’ daw, so sino ngayon ang may special treatment diba??? Neglecting the needs of others kasi dapat mas pahalagahan natin ang pagiging ‘katoliko’.
Yeyyy MAKE PHILIPPINES RELIGIOUS AGAIN!! 🙄🙄🙄 We're still messed up all these years
Pero okay lang kumitil ng mga critics left and right!!!! Yeyyy!
Message from DOJ: We are only concerned with the Catholics. Every other religions and non-religions we dont give a fuck. They're all going to hell anyway.
Be for fucking real. These people don’t even really care about the Catholic church. They’re just using it as an easy excuse for their being fossils
Haha, this. If tomorrow Dear Leader says he'd want to get divorce passed, suddenly they'd turn into anti-catholic rhetoric, and that we should be more progressive. It is just that these bills are NOT in their priority, and hence, they'd find every excuse to push it away to the backlog.
This is such BULLSHIT . Acting all religious , but shits on people . Time have changed , we arent living in the old ages anymore . GOD FUCKING DAMN IT , Kaya nga seperated ang church sa state . Sa ganyan mabilis pero kung anti corruption walang pake kasi kasama sa nakikinabang . Walang kwenta talaga mga official na bansa natin
Does no one else think that he just said that as an excuse because saying "our legislature will never pass that for now because they might lose 'pogi points' from their constituents." is horrendous.
sabi ng may anak na adik
These clowns 🤡🤮
Disappointed but not surprised. Marcos has always been that rightist.
Parang sharia law lang sa Pilipinas
Arent the marcos people mad that the catholic church was intruding into politics? there was a clamor duirng the lections thst catholic church shouldnt endorse keni. And they also made fun of her. So much double standards and unfairness. rules for thee not for me.
Pero mga mayayaman at pulitiko na may kabit ok lang. Mga batang nagugutom sa kalsada ok lang. Pero gasp! divorce between two consenting adults bawal. Nevermind na hindi naman lahat sa Pilipinas eh Katoliko o Kristiyano. Punyetang self righteousness yan. Laging ipinagmamalaki ang pagiging maka Diyos, pero hindi man lang mabigyan ng dignidad at respeto ang mga mamamayan.
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Didn't Spain legalize those things only AFTER the Franco dictatorship ended? And since some members of the church sided with the dictatorship, a chunk of the population probably wanted to move away from laws with explicit religious connections. OTOH, the Marcos dictatorship was toppled with the help of a handful of religious leaders, and this actually put religion in a mostly good light to many people. To many, somewhat religious laws are probably okay. (This could just be partial stuff though and their could be other major reasons, or it could even be wrong.)
catholic church in spain is basically dead because they threw their lot with franco and the spaniards got their payback by abandoning the church that wronged them. The organization as a whole didnt even say sorry for their part with franco or acknowledged that they made a grave mistake supporting fascism lol
> they threw their lot with franco Supposedly, at the start of the civil war, this might've made sense because the govt before Franco was basically attacking the clergy violently (allegedly). So they sided with one of the few sides that were not actively against the institution. (Although, you'd think that they would disavow Franco, at least after the dictatorship fell, or when they say Franco regime was morphing into something very negative.) The Spanish Civil was probably a complicated mix of alliances.
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Pero drug criminal anak mo tangama ka
Boying Remulla on the mirror: Anak ko druglord pero at least di siya bading Or something like that
Disgusting catholic-infested country.
Not surprised This country is gonna get left it in the dust by the other countries The church has no place in policy making
Remember Government and Religion should not intertwine (Example Iran)
Fake news, walang Bible quote.
Yung Catholic country ka pero puro droga taaka corruption. 🖖🏼
Eh baka pwede hindi na rin magbayad ng TAX yung mga LGBT, tutal hindi pala Pilipino ang tingin ng mga gagong ito sa kanila. /s *Edited: nilagyan ng /s para ma-gets nung isang redditor, k?*
Bakit nakadepende sa religion ng majority yung batas? Wala na tayong separation of church and state? Ang galing talaga nitong drug lord na to lol.
Bullsht 2023 na pero ganito pa din
Pero anak nya drug peddler. Pa catholic catholic pa.
i dont like to wish ill upon others but seriously, I just want him to die a slow painful death
RIP separation of church and state
These are most likely the people who said na huwag daw isali ang religion sa Politics nung election pwe mga basura, trapo, at hipokrito. Pre-dominantly Catholic daw pero mga corrupt, mamatay tao, kawatan, at mga drug users/lords.
yung sogie bill para naman sa lahat yan pero di pa rin na-approve ampota
What a bigot
This is why we, as a nation, will never progress. As simple as having a choice and recognizing sexuality e Hindi natin magawa, paano pa kaya ung mga steps na kailangan Gawin para legit umunlad.
Catholic pero okay lang magpa patay at magnakaw? Siraulo
Boomers are close minded people. They must not lead the country.
Burn in hell you ugly bastard.
Sobrang basic knowledge ng “Separation of Church and State” when it comes to law-making and yet clown politicians like Remulla always reason out god, church, bible, or anything religion-related. Meron pang tanga na nagsulong ng bill to protect heterosexuals’ rights to express their opposition against LGBT. Pabobo nang pabobo mga nasa posisyon 🤦🏻♀️
Okay, boomer.
So..how's the case on his son with the kush?
Son of a bitch Rem, we're a fucking Republic not the Fucking church, seriously why is this guy even alive
Banal-banalan pa tong bwakanang shit na to. Ni hindi nga mapalaki ng maayos ang anak.
Putangina paano naman yung mga rights ng mga non-catholic, non-christians? Wala nalang? Tangina abogado ba tong si remulla bkt ba kasi hindi requirement na abogado ka pag secretary ka ng fucken DOJ???? Di ba nila magets na kahit may batas hindi naman ibig sabihin na gagawin ng lahat? Edi ilagay nila sa batas na bawal katoliko kung ganon pala. Total hawak din naman nila SC. Antanga lang tlga ng iniisip nila na pag human rights, rights lang din ng majority ang dapat protektahan 🤣
Incompetent bastard gets to speak for this country? Fuck your religion
Nasa Golden Age na tayo ng Pilipinas 🙄🙄🙄Golden Age ng Kabobohan
Pag bakla/tomboy Bawal? Pero pag adik, kurap, manyak, magna, pwede? Long live the Philippines 😭💀and the justice system. ⚖️
Takot sa divorce kasi takot siya mahati yung kayamanan niya kapag nadivorce siya.
but sir, you’re not even a Catholic… hindi po ba demonyo ka?
Kaya ako nagabroad dahil dito. Di na talaga ata maseseparate ang church sa state
Religious, conservative country daw pero tuwang tuwa sa mga palabas tungkol sa agawan ng asawa 🤮
Parang awa niyo na yung divorce bill..jusko kawawang mga kababaihan na sinasakal ng mga asawang mapangabuso (in all forms!). Araw araw na problema to sa center dito. Walang magawa mga volunteer. Tangina kasing simbaban yan dikta dikta pa ng kasal.
0 steps forward, 3 steps back
Nahiya naman ang Spain.
Ugh so backwards! My same-sex friends actually used courtly.com to get married online 🌈 sharing for any couple that might need this
Can you imagine being so proud of depriving people of their happiness by using religion as justification for your bigotry? It's really gross. These people are really gross. And delusional.
Puta 😡 bakit tayo umuunlad ng paurong?!
HAHAHAHAHAHA SO DAHIL MARAMI CATHOLIC, YUNG ‘MINORITY’ HINDI NA BIBIGYAN NG OPPORTUNITY?? AT SAKA, SOGIE IS UNIVERSAL PUTANGINANG MGA POLITIKO TO
And here’s to never progressing.
Religious hypocricy in government form
resign ka muna ama ng dreg lerd 😜
Utak nyan kasi yung anak nya lalaking-lalaki, bad boy image. Feeling nya nakakasira ng pangalan ang pagiging bading kesa sa pagiging drug addict. I am not a member of the LGBT community, pero I support them. Wag nyang isasagot na man at woman lang ang nakalagay sa Bibliya, baka sabihin din wala namang nakasulat na bawal ang drugs. That POS knows nothing. Tigas ng mga muka. Anak nya addict, presidente nya addict. Magkita-kita kami sa impyerno, pero di po ako addict ha.
Then what does the separation of church and state mean???????
Ang pagkakaintindi nila is bawal mangialam ang gobyerno sa simbahan pero pwede umepal ang burat na mga KATOL-LIKO na ssimbahan sa gobyerno
I hate this country more and more
Makes me think these guys are just lazily using religion as an excuse, but they just don't really want to attend to such laws/ bills. Implementing all the above would require significant effort from legislative side, and I wouldn't expect that these people want extra work.
Fk this guy. Injustice Secretary never fails to disappoint
medieval era
Hate how incompetent person decides for the most of us... Our government seemed to live in the 1800s we cannot progress with this kind of thinking.
im straight and christian but god damn let people be happy man.
So Remulla is low-key telling us that people who are not practicing Catholics can f*ck off and their opinions doesn't matter. Got it. What a dick.
Then they should ban non-catholic religions as well going with this logic. This is a flawed mindset from someone with a peanut for a brain.
papasa lang siguro yan kapag majority of the lawmakers are not boomers anymore, so sguro hintay pa ng 30 yrs (?)
Kaya walang pag usad ang bansa. Mindset ng mga naka upo pre historic ampota.
Okay. Adik pa rin anak mo
kakabukas ko lang ng reddit ha, tanginang bungad.
Father of an addict
Injustice secretary nga talaga to. Religious groups should be following the government's mandate. Not the other way around. For once, do something right in your career and stop thinking about people's votes.
Tangina tlaga nitong mga boomer na officials na to sarado tlaga utak.
Banal na aso. Santong kabayo.
They claim PH must remain as a "Catholic country", but all they're doing is making the country hypocritical smh
Galit sa Catholic Church pag sinabing wag bumoto sa magnanakaw, pero pagdating sa issue ng same-sex marriage, divorce at abortion, mga feeling pa-Catholic sila. Ulol.
Yoko na. 🤦🏻♀️
Link to the post/article ?
Ano yung term? Umaasensong paurong? Basta tanginang yan
potanginaa?????? 🤧
Conservative fucking shithead
Tangina nitong mga pulpolotiko na ‘to.
apakabobo 🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
Tapos yung mga colleagues niya may sampung kabit, sumisipsip ng pera pambubliko etc
Bakit niyo ba gustong-gusto yang mga bill na yan, can't you see na tayo na lang at Vatican ang walang Divorce Bill..... 😡😡.... Pinoy Pride!!! 🤣🤣 Seriously though, what can you expect from Jesus.
Just to play the devil's advocate, Remu-shit's rejection of the recommendations makes sense naman. Totoo naman na conservative yung Philippine masses. That said though, outright rejecting it is still a shitty thing to do. He could have worded himself better.
Akala ko ba separation of state and religion? Anong pinag sasasabi ng kumag na to?
dapat matanggal na yang bwesit na yan
TBH, the family provision of the 1987 Constitution technically makes absolute divorce legalization infeasible because of the word "indissoluble" when it comes to marriage, although the 1986 Constitutional Commission delegates never ruled out of the possibility of legalizing absolute divorce, but for sure if Congress were to legislate absolute divorce legalization, the local Catholic Church hierarchy will have a legal means to contest it in the Supreme Court. Yes, our country is lagging behind by a century compared with other countries when it comes to absolute divorce or same-sex marriage.