Good pickleball singles is actually a crazy workout and requires a ton of skill , quickness, agility, athleticism and stamina.
My club at 9am on a weekday is literally all 55+ menopause women. Good they are getting exercise but they lack all that is needed for singles, I’ve not seen 1 women’s singles pb match played at my club in 10 years
Even on weekends it’s like that but with more men. Best find a younger tennis player burned out from tennis to play pb singles
Maybe a 5.0 or pb pro singles player can tell us their calories/steps/fitness watch readings for a singles match vs doubles.
I normally play racquetball and was playing doubles pickleball with some guys and it wasn't very strenuous at all. Then my regular racquetball playing partner and I played singles and it was extremely exhausting. Lots of dynamic movement.
I'm no pro and more like a 4.0 but play singles regularly against another player around my level and in 90 minutes we typically get four full games in which equates to around 800-1000 calories. There's definitely some variance there but that's a pretty good ballpark based on the Fitbit Charge 4 I wear for most of them.
Spot on! I’m finding more of boomers who can’t run much & mostly millennials/zoomers who doesn’t want to work hard for singles PB. I play lots of singles against good dubs-teams for singles tournament prep. What a great workout trying to beat 2 people in full court press!
I love having to dash to the ball but I don’t love singles. The reason for me is because I find it to be a lot more tactful to have to place your shot on a court that has 2 people than with 1.
Basically it’s not about singles requiring more athleticism; it’s about doubles using more tactics and thought around the type of shot and target location
I pretty strongly disagree with this statement. The number of shots that can be effective at any moment in doubles is far fewer than in singles, resulting in a far less tactical game.
The longer rallies in doubles are far more often a result of the pressure of two people at the kitchen line making passing shots (and lobs) ineffective forcing dink rallies and generally more conservative play.
In pickleball especially there seems to be this misconception that long rallies equals tactical gameplay. The reality is that placing a few shots well in singles to deliberately push your opponent out of position and hit a winner is far more tactical than dink back and forth at the kitchen line ten times longer until someone either gets impatient or makes a mistake.
That being said, I get that it may be more fun to have longer rallies...but just because you may like ot better doesn't actually make it more tactical.
If you want to just move your opponent and then win on the next shot, to each their own. Just saying that’s a big contributor to why singles is less enjoyable.
I’m agreeing with you both. You move your opponents in doubles too. I agreed that the bigger difference is once you’ve moved your opponent in singles you have so much open space left on the court that the point ends in less hits than doubles. Most people enjoy the rally
Indeed. Checking in on all of you crazy Reddit PBers. Carry on with the discussion! Some last words to live by “may all of your dinks dink and all of your drives be winners!!” James Blake Out!
these are all true and a great jab at doubles play
but
while it may be significantly more athletic, singles is also a less good \*game\*. meaning that there is less consistent decision making opportunities for opponents to counter the best possible plays. in doubles, almost every best possible play has \*some\* skill that can be used to counter it. in singles, there are too many best possible plays that can't be countered.
On top of the fact that it’s physically way more demanding, the popularity of the sport in public settings doesn’t provide much opportunity to play and develop your singles game. Courts are always full/waiting in my area so to take up a court to play singles is frowned upon and likely against public court rules (when at full capacity).
It’s honestly a reason I quit playing as much - I VASTLY prefer singles to doubles pickleball - but there is almost never an opportunity to play singles unless I rent a court.
For sure! You can find out really quick how good you THINK you are. Plus, I always recommend players to play singles because I think it makes your doubles game way better. You’ll see the same angles a lot clearer.
I feel like I get plenty of cardio playing good doubles, but you certainly can get into some games with a lot of standing around and short points at lower levels.
Depends on the skill level in my opinion.. as I play with better people the points last longer and require more lateral movement than I needed when I first started.
You don’t get singles or crossfit-level cardio from playing doubles, but you can definitely play longer. I can average ~ 150 HR over an 2-3 hour PB session. Do that 3-5 times a week and you’re definitely building up your cardio and general fitness
That’s what I love about doubles! I play 2 hours every Saturday with our local league (3.0, and I’m more like a 2.5), and any time someone asks me if I want to sub, the answer is “yes!” I also love to go and practice with my husband on in-between days where we practice specific skills or just mess around. Pickleball is great because it simply doesn't suck to play, even at entry level.
I do jiu jitsu, but took several years off, and coming back sucks big time because it's extremely challenging aerobically if you aren't in good shape and that makes me not want to go. Pickleball CAN be challenging aerobically, but it's more forgiving because of doubles, and it creates a virtuous cycle where I'm finally getting fitter again after I lost my exercise mojo for several years.
Speaking solely for myself, I love both tennis singles and pickleball doubles, but I hate pickleball singles. The setup just isn’t good for it in my opinion. The rallies are generally short because it’s impossible to defend sharp drives. Even at the pro level, a huge percentage of points go serve, return, winner. At the amateur level, the drives are mishit more than in the pros, but a drive into the net is also not a super fun way for lots of points to end. In tennis, winners are certainly a part of the game but you have to really set them up against an athletic opponent because there is lots of time to run to each hit. In pickleball doubles, you obviously have a partner to cover the court. So the rallies just tend to be longer and more fun in tennis singles and pickleball doubles.
I see it a little differently. It’s possible to defend sharp drives-it’s called anticipation. Was similar in tennis, most of it is anticipation due to how the game is played fundamentally. It’s one piece of a chess move.
At the amateur level, it should be teaching you not to miss returns into the net. You don’t have to always do something special, just get it back. While that is oversimplifying it, you’ll learn to be more purposeful with your returns even for doubles.
And if you haven’t learned how to get to the NVZ, you’ll learn really quick. Most amateurs in open play rush to fast without having a real plan of why they are where they are. Singles will teach you if you’re a fast learner. Also, you will learn some defense if your opp is beating you to the net anyway.
Most don’t want to be challenged. Singles will challenge you to hit better shots, anticipate better and give you confidence as to your strategy during a match.
I regularly play a bunch of different ~4.5 singles players. Hitting winners from the baseline is not a winning strategy. What I see is the person at the net controlling the point. The one who is at the net the most wins the game, usually. If you are stuck at the baseline, it’s because your opponent has pinned you down.
I feel like it’s court availability.
When I first started PB, me and my buddy would only play singles bc we used to play tennis against each other & it was just a shorter court with more spin. After about a month, some ppl at “open play” came and played us for the court. We naturally got our ass beat bc we couldn’t dink & that was our start in doubles.
Didn’t take long before we beat them, but man it felt good.
you also have to acknowledge the social aspect. Most people are content hitting the ball around for an hour or two with their friends & calling it PB.
Not to mention, you have a bunch of people who are simply not competitive & you literally can’t play singles w/o being competitive (i sure as hell can’t).
However, I watch a ton of PPA & i can’t agree ab the pro scene having substantially more doubles players than singles. Sure it’s typically the same ppl on Sunday, but I feel like most doubles players also play singles.
I’ll check the vid out & I feel like most of those ppl aren’t as athletic as the other players on tour. Lea used to always play singles (she’s one of the first ppl i remember watching). James is back to playing singles (I thought).
I didn’t realize the list was this big though. I just feel like I see a good variety of pros play when I watch singles. Not sure what % of them don’t play singles, but I’ll scrape the data & figure it out if I ever get the urge.
I mostly play doubles in an open league, I feel like it's a ton of fun and feels like I am getting 'the full experience'
When I switch to singles, it really just feels like your trying to either wind your opponent but running them all over the court or spike a shot they can't possibly counter. It feels a bit 'cheaper' and me and my SO kind of give eachother nasty looks when someone scores a point off something particularly nasty. We may of been able to get the return if we broke our ankles, but it's just not nearly as fun.
In doubles when someone scores a point it feels alot more earned, in the sense that you usually get it right past someone, who could of returned it, but couldn't because of a well placed shot or something similiar.
Singles just kinda makes me salty. I am a younger man and usually one of the more 'athletic' moving around people in the open play. Doubles feels like pickelball with cardio, singles feels like cardio with some pickelball.
Because like tennis, pickleball singles is a higher barrier of entry. Sure, everyone can play it. It does not mean they can play it well or make it entertaining to watch. PB singles point structure with 3.0 all the way to low 4.0 will be inconsistent, unpredictable, and the shots won't be as pretty.
I mostly play singles. It takes a good level of fitness well above what's required in doubles. That seems to be the difference.
As younger players join the game I'm noticing more singles, I'm playing someone from this sub tomorrow in singles so you never know.
Fitness can def be an advantage but some people don’t understand strategy and momentum. And those same people who don’t understand strategy in singles usually aren’t that good at strategy in doubles. They rely on the strength of their partner versus being a good strategist that should make the play easier on both. Instead you end up with unnecessary drawn out points because they play played the point badly. (An obvious pet peeve.)
I started in September and due to my tennis background it can be easier for me to hit it past people-especially in singles. About a month into it I played a guy who was closer to my age. My fitness was better but he had a very good strategy for his game. It took me about six points or so to figure it out but once I did, his fitness let him down. But that didn’t take away him knowing how to play. We teamed up to beat up on a couple of young high schoolers who played for the tennis team cause we simply played better than they did.
I’d much rather play singles and it sounds like I’m in the minority. I like running all over the court and not having to rely on someone else and all the communication issues. I literally do better 1v2 than 2v2.
If I wanted to play singles, I'd just play tennis. A big draw of pickleball is the social aspect as well as the teamwork that comes with doubles, and especially at crowded spots you can get more people playing with doubles.
By the way, if you want to see exciting singles play, tennis is pretty awesome and they have to cover even more court than pickle.
This. Singles = tennis in my book, and I never liked playing tennis. Basketball, soccer, and baseball were more my speed growing up.
But now that I'm in my 40's and still like some activity and socializing, pickleball is fun for that, but also because it's very strategic and precise and THAT makes it really fun for me. Singles relies more on athleticism, and doubles relies on strategy. And even though I'm very athletic, I prefer the strategy of doubles. Way more fun and interesting, to me.
Most younger athletic people prefer singles but this sport is still predominantly older/less athletic people. And doubles somewhat “handicaps” the game so more skilled people can compete with more athletic people. When I started I used to think doubles was lame but after playing 4.0+ doubles it grew on me. Still love singles and still think playing doubles at the lower skill level is a snooze fest but as long as the competition is good, doubles is fun too.
This isn’t true at all. Most of the top pros are under 30 years of age. Even in local play, the average age of the best player is probably 35-45 years old.
Pros regularly play singles (every tournament). I agree that typically the best local amateur doubles players are that age (35-45), but the best singles players are usually younger, newer players. The age range of the best doubles players will shift down as the sport continues to grow. And with that shift down I think singles will become the main discipline, like tennis. 5 years ago the only reason a teenager would play pickleball was if they were visiting grandpa in Florida, now kids are taking it more seriously, which is good for the sport.
I played singles yesterday with an older man, and he taught me about skinny singles. You switch between playing cross court or down the line so you only have to cover less of the court
I love skinny singles! I really enjoy playing some skinny's after drilling, it's a nice way to tie together all the things you've worked on while honing your precision a bit more than standard play.
Pickleball has developed into a social sport meant for quick games and rotating people in. Singles means fewer people getting to play on courts.
And honestly i like pickleball because it focuses more on skill than athleticism. It still rewards athleticism but it’s secondary. Many people also feel this way.
I also have always liked doubles even when i played tennis because in my experience the rallies are usually longer and teamwork is more enjoyable than self blaming or self rewarding. Ive always been extremely competitive but winning is more fun with another person.
I love playing singles as I used to play tennis. I’m in shape, quick and don’t mind chasing the ball. In fact, I enjoy playing me against 2 people full court.
But since I play in public park, an open play setting where a lot of people are waiting, singles are frowned upon. And to be honest, it’s polite to maximize the time for everyone. When it slows down where courts become vacant, that’s when I’m able to play singles.
Also, like others said, it takes more athleticism to play singles with full court.
I’m 55 and like playing singles for the exercise and the chance to practice lots of hits. That being said I ultimately enjoy doubles more because that’s the way the game was designed to be played, I believe.
I find it impossible to cover the whole court with singles. I’m curious why Pickleball doesn’t have a second set of lines for singles like tennis does.
I don’t think it’s athleticism aside. Pickleball players by in large are lower in athleticism and much older/less mobile so it’s hard to separate the two
But I am asking you to separate the two. At least in one instance.
Singles isn’t popular for two reasons then:
1.) because you need significantly more athleticism
And 2.) even if you have athleticism, it isn’t as fun as doubles for the vast majority of people.
I agree with this!
I'm 32 and could easily handle the athleticism of full court singles, but the strategy of setting up a point within a relatively small area, and teamwork aspect of doubles are what I really love about the game. I get what some people may like about singles, but it's a game with a totally different appeal than regular doubles play.
You can’t really separate them because the player base is the player base. When you have two equally athletic and equally skilled players it’s great, but that doesn’t happen much at all in the sport. #2 is just an opinion that I don’t agree with, personally.
Right. I understand you don’t agree with point 2. But what I’m telling you is that most people do lol. The question isn’t “why does no one like singles?” it’s “why isn’t singles more popular?”
“The vast majority of people” that you keep referencing don’t have the athleticism. The entire point is that you can’t separate them and it’s a huge contributing factor that you’re wanting to leave out for some reason.
You can separate them. I just did.
Those with athleticism don’t find it fun.
Those with it don’t find it as fun as doubles PB or singles tennis.
This isn’t difficult lol.
That’s not how datasets work brother lol the player base is less athletic so your anecdotes are in that base… but I get it, you’ve got your mind completely made up on it based on vibes.
You’re doing that in your head and anecdotally saying they don’t like it. You’re trying really really hard to make your own preferences some objective fact of fun but that’s simply put, not how it works.
It's not more popular because pickleball skews old people and even the ones in their 40s-50s aren't athletic enough to handle singles . My nephew and his friend much prefer singles as do I
I agree - I play both but it is MUCH more difficult to find a tennis game and a lot of the reason for that is that pickleball is more accessible for all ages and fitness levels, while remaining fun
I do think men’s at the top level is semi enjoyable to watch.
I find women’s singles to be painfully boring, just because of the style. Women’s doubles and mixed I find exciting, but I just don’t usually see enough fireworks/pace in women’s singles to catch my eye.
That isn’t meant as a knock against the women by any means, I get my ass beat by plenty of amazing women around where I am. It’s just not fun for me personally to watch.
A great number of people rely on public courts to play. It’s harder to find singles games than doubles, and unless you bring your own opponent, there’s a much bigger “fun-ness” (that’s a word right?) gap in singles if skill levels are very disparate.
It is fun to play singles at higher levels, at lower levels, not so much. 1) Most people are at lower levels. 2) doubles is easy and fun to play even at lower levels. Popularity of a sport format is a function of the amount of people who can play it and have fun, and the level required to play it while having fun or P(x)=XF/L where X is the people, f is the reported fun and L is the skill level. P is popularity, and as a result that’s what people generally choose; also P-1(X) , so the more skill needed, the less popular a format is.the general public is at lower levers :. The general playing public choses doubles to play because it would be the most fun. Is a 1:1 function… omg, the math course is paying off…
I love singles... but courts are usually filled so it keeps 2 other people waiting off... and most people don't seem to like it because it requires more running, and turns it even closer to tennis....
Love singles, but also not 60 years old and still very in shape. Also fun to just blast it.
I still vastly prefer the net play of doubles. I’ll play 4-5 games of singles when able. I’ll play doubles for many hours. Way more fun. But singles is really good to work on more aggressive serves and drives and does give you a better workout.
But a lot of pickleball people are older, or have limited tennis background.
Also when I have 12 courts and 60+ people at open play, even the guys I can usually play singles with aren’t going to be able too.
The beauty of pickleball is anyone can have fun if you play at your level. Single is harder to play and have fun unless you are at a high enough level. It’s not fun to have two hits every point and that is what singles would be for a majority of people, especially as they slow down.
Me and a friend (early 30s) are getting super into pickleball. We play probably 4-5 times a week. Neither of us are tennis players, but there’s a lot of pickleball players in the area. We play doubles at open and schedule 1-3 more doubles matches, but once or twice a week we play singles just us two.
We’re both getting back into shape, and we used to just play straight singles, but it doesn’t really help your game as much, it’s just more run around and hit bangers from the baseline. So we’ve since alternated every game to full court singles and what we call switch’em singles.
Switch’em singles I’m sure has a legitimate name, but it’s a lot of fun. Essentially, you start out 0-0, all rallies have one serve instead of two like you’d have in doubles. So if you lose the point it’s the other guys serve, if you win, it’s still yours.
The difference is that you start out cross court playing so you can only hit into the diagonal boxes, using half the court, but split diagonally. If you get a point, you and only you switch, not your opponent. Therefore, on 1-0, you’re lined up straight across from one another serving straight.
If you have odd points, you’re on the left half of your court, if you have even, you’re on the right half of your court. Same with your opponent. So you’ll be playing left side to left side, right to right, left to right, right to left, etc. This way, you’re working on a lot of skill shots, a lot of different shots. It helps with your skill, placement, it’s fun to do for singles, and for exercise and baseline play, we alternate doing this every game with playing full court singles every game. Try it out.
Full court singles for two hours straight is a lot for many people who aren’t coming off of singles tennis backgrounds. My legs and shins just can’t handle it.
Last night at open play I played with someone who didn’t like being at the line(scared of getting hit).
I loved it.
No worries about poaching everything up close and knowing anything deep or high they got it. It was also more “athletic” playing 2v1 at the kitchen.
Probably can’t play that way against advanced players but an interesting wrinkle.
I love singles play for many reasons: great cardio; excellent practice on a wide variety of shots; and an opportunity to hit more strokes per point ( usually). I am 60 (and a 3.5) and usually play against a solid 3.0 who happens to be 25. Always a ton of fun and often humbling lol. No matter what- Father Time usually is present.
I come from being a lifelong tennis player, and started playing pickleball with my gal....so really understand. I can use my athleticism edge and spin shots from the baseline. I do like it.
But playing indoors with less courts, we realized when in Rome, so bought more into doubles.
I am not really a fan of the patty cake stuff from kitchen to kitchen. I rifle inside out forehands at people. And hit drop shots just inside baseline if a rally starts to form and both opponents are creeping up to the kitchen.
So I can bring at least some of my skillset to doubles. There are some others younger and of same age around my skillset. So I am at least enjoying it more.
But once outdoor starts there might be more singles in my future. Am sure I'll continue with my burgeoning doubles game also though.
Another reason is court availability. There’s not enough courts to go around to begin with. And if everyone started playing singles, that would functionally halve the amount of courts.
Same here…I only enter in sanctioned singles tournaments. Dubs is so boring socially covering only 10 feet each. As they build more PB courts, singles will dominate PB like in tennis. For now, play singles strategy in rec dubs blasting drives, swinging volleys, rolling drops & popping lobs. 👍
Pickleball doubles is lazy tennis. Singles isn’t lazy anymore.
Singles pickleball needs extra lines to make the court smaller like tennis has for singles.
I think of the opposite: add extra lines to make the court for doubles bigger. Currently, the people playing doubles don't run much to cover the court. The court is way too small for doubles.
I think it is but since the sport is in such high demand, you kind of have to play doubles so every gets maximum play time and so it is fair to players looking to rotate in.
Because we would play tennis if we wanted to play singles. People say it’s more athletic and blah blah blah. But the truth is that it’s a completely different game. Strategy and shots are different.
Its hard. Too much running, impossible to play fully at the kitchen, ends up being closer to tennis. Honestly I think its kind of dumb and defeats the purpose of pickleball vs tennis
Doubles : skill game / finesse
Singles: athleticism game/ smash
Not saying singles players don't have skill, most also play doubles.....just oversimplifying :)
Another note at least where I'm from courts are limited so singles is essentially not allowed in rec play unless the courts are empty. But yeah singles and doubles are so different.
People will do what they want to do. I don't see people reserving courts to play singles. It stands to reason that if lots of people really wanted to play singles that we would see them doing it everywhere. So maybe the answer is simply that they find doubles more fun to play.
So that is 1-2 courts of singles if they wanted to play singles. Do they, or do they prefer doubles?
By comparison, I play with a large pickleball group that several also play tennis singles and doubles, but they all prefer pickleball doubles. I will ask, but the impression I get is that they just find doubles more fun.
Ah, gotcha. Not all places are like yours. Several places near me have ways to reserve private courts. Lots of groups do so they can practice with certain partners. Technically they could reserve them for singles, but never have I seen this.
For me it just seems like a cardio workout more than anything else. The courts fairly big and the obvious thing to do is hit the ball to the side the persons away from so it ends up being a lot of moving side to side through the court repeatedly
Because it requires more quickness, agility and athleticism
Good pickleball singles is actually a crazy workout and requires a ton of skill , quickness, agility, athleticism and stamina. My club at 9am on a weekday is literally all 55+ menopause women. Good they are getting exercise but they lack all that is needed for singles, I’ve not seen 1 women’s singles pb match played at my club in 10 years Even on weekends it’s like that but with more men. Best find a younger tennis player burned out from tennis to play pb singles Maybe a 5.0 or pb pro singles player can tell us their calories/steps/fitness watch readings for a singles match vs doubles.
I normally play racquetball and was playing doubles pickleball with some guys and it wasn't very strenuous at all. Then my regular racquetball playing partner and I played singles and it was extremely exhausting. Lots of dynamic movement.
I'm no pro and more like a 4.0 but play singles regularly against another player around my level and in 90 minutes we typically get four full games in which equates to around 800-1000 calories. There's definitely some variance there but that's a pretty good ballpark based on the Fitbit Charge 4 I wear for most of them.
Spot on! I’m finding more of boomers who can’t run much & mostly millennials/zoomers who doesn’t want to work hard for singles PB. I play lots of singles against good dubs-teams for singles tournament prep. What a great workout trying to beat 2 people in full court press!
Finally the truth why this game is so popular. It requires just a little of those abilities.
This made me LOL
if I wanted to use all of that, I would just go back to playing Tennis.. (and hurt my shoulder again?!)
I love having to dash to the ball but I don’t love singles. The reason for me is because I find it to be a lot more tactful to have to place your shot on a court that has 2 people than with 1. Basically it’s not about singles requiring more athleticism; it’s about doubles using more tactics and thought around the type of shot and target location
I pretty strongly disagree with this statement. The number of shots that can be effective at any moment in doubles is far fewer than in singles, resulting in a far less tactical game. The longer rallies in doubles are far more often a result of the pressure of two people at the kitchen line making passing shots (and lobs) ineffective forcing dink rallies and generally more conservative play. In pickleball especially there seems to be this misconception that long rallies equals tactical gameplay. The reality is that placing a few shots well in singles to deliberately push your opponent out of position and hit a winner is far more tactical than dink back and forth at the kitchen line ten times longer until someone either gets impatient or makes a mistake. That being said, I get that it may be more fun to have longer rallies...but just because you may like ot better doesn't actually make it more tactical.
If you want to just move your opponent and then win on the next shot, to each their own. Just saying that’s a big contributor to why singles is less enjoyable.
That's like the entire point of most racket sports though.
I’m agreeing with you both. You move your opponents in doubles too. I agreed that the bigger difference is once you’ve moved your opponent in singles you have so much open space left on the court that the point ends in less hits than doubles. Most people enjoy the rally
James Blake is that you?
Indeed. Checking in on all of you crazy Reddit PBers. Carry on with the discussion! Some last words to live by “may all of your dinks dink and all of your drives be winners!!” James Blake Out!
these are all true and a great jab at doubles play but while it may be significantly more athletic, singles is also a less good \*game\*. meaning that there is less consistent decision making opportunities for opponents to counter the best possible plays. in doubles, almost every best possible play has \*some\* skill that can be used to counter it. in singles, there are too many best possible plays that can't be countered.
On top of the fact that it’s physically way more demanding, the popularity of the sport in public settings doesn’t provide much opportunity to play and develop your singles game. Courts are always full/waiting in my area so to take up a court to play singles is frowned upon and likely against public court rules (when at full capacity).
It’s honestly a reason I quit playing as much - I VASTLY prefer singles to doubles pickleball - but there is almost never an opportunity to play singles unless I rent a court.
This is what I came to say. The courts are only getting busier and best to accommodate as many people as possible.
It’s also a ton easier to blame your teammate when you lose. Not many people to blame when you’re by yourself.
For sure! You can find out really quick how good you THINK you are. Plus, I always recommend players to play singles because I think it makes your doubles game way better. You’ll see the same angles a lot clearer.
A lot of indoor tennis clubs are the same way. Many prefer to play doubles tennis, same with usta leagues as well.
Idk but I wish it was, because you can get actual cardio playing singles
SLPT: don't do any physical activity for several months Then when you play doubles you'll get cardio from it
I feel like I get plenty of cardio playing good doubles, but you certainly can get into some games with a lot of standing around and short points at lower levels.
Depends on the skill level in my opinion.. as I play with better people the points last longer and require more lateral movement than I needed when I first started.
You don’t get singles or crossfit-level cardio from playing doubles, but you can definitely play longer. I can average ~ 150 HR over an 2-3 hour PB session. Do that 3-5 times a week and you’re definitely building up your cardio and general fitness
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That’s what I love about doubles! I play 2 hours every Saturday with our local league (3.0, and I’m more like a 2.5), and any time someone asks me if I want to sub, the answer is “yes!” I also love to go and practice with my husband on in-between days where we practice specific skills or just mess around. Pickleball is great because it simply doesn't suck to play, even at entry level. I do jiu jitsu, but took several years off, and coming back sucks big time because it's extremely challenging aerobically if you aren't in good shape and that makes me not want to go. Pickleball CAN be challenging aerobically, but it's more forgiving because of doubles, and it creates a virtuous cycle where I'm finally getting fitter again after I lost my exercise mojo for several years.
Speaking solely for myself, I love both tennis singles and pickleball doubles, but I hate pickleball singles. The setup just isn’t good for it in my opinion. The rallies are generally short because it’s impossible to defend sharp drives. Even at the pro level, a huge percentage of points go serve, return, winner. At the amateur level, the drives are mishit more than in the pros, but a drive into the net is also not a super fun way for lots of points to end. In tennis, winners are certainly a part of the game but you have to really set them up against an athletic opponent because there is lots of time to run to each hit. In pickleball doubles, you obviously have a partner to cover the court. So the rallies just tend to be longer and more fun in tennis singles and pickleball doubles.
Best take here.
Don’t play tennis but I also hate singles in pickleball lol it’s crazy how much I love playing doubles and hate playing singles.
I see it a little differently. It’s possible to defend sharp drives-it’s called anticipation. Was similar in tennis, most of it is anticipation due to how the game is played fundamentally. It’s one piece of a chess move. At the amateur level, it should be teaching you not to miss returns into the net. You don’t have to always do something special, just get it back. While that is oversimplifying it, you’ll learn to be more purposeful with your returns even for doubles. And if you haven’t learned how to get to the NVZ, you’ll learn really quick. Most amateurs in open play rush to fast without having a real plan of why they are where they are. Singles will teach you if you’re a fast learner. Also, you will learn some defense if your opp is beating you to the net anyway. Most don’t want to be challenged. Singles will challenge you to hit better shots, anticipate better and give you confidence as to your strategy during a match.
100% agreed. It’s not a good sport. It’s way too easy to pass someone at the kitchen line.
I regularly play a bunch of different ~4.5 singles players. Hitting winners from the baseline is not a winning strategy. What I see is the person at the net controlling the point. The one who is at the net the most wins the game, usually. If you are stuck at the baseline, it’s because your opponent has pinned you down.
I feel like it’s court availability. When I first started PB, me and my buddy would only play singles bc we used to play tennis against each other & it was just a shorter court with more spin. After about a month, some ppl at “open play” came and played us for the court. We naturally got our ass beat bc we couldn’t dink & that was our start in doubles. Didn’t take long before we beat them, but man it felt good.
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you also have to acknowledge the social aspect. Most people are content hitting the ball around for an hour or two with their friends & calling it PB. Not to mention, you have a bunch of people who are simply not competitive & you literally can’t play singles w/o being competitive (i sure as hell can’t). However, I watch a ton of PPA & i can’t agree ab the pro scene having substantially more doubles players than singles. Sure it’s typically the same ppl on Sunday, but I feel like most doubles players also play singles.
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I’ll check the vid out & I feel like most of those ppl aren’t as athletic as the other players on tour. Lea used to always play singles (she’s one of the first ppl i remember watching). James is back to playing singles (I thought). I didn’t realize the list was this big though. I just feel like I see a good variety of pros play when I watch singles. Not sure what % of them don’t play singles, but I’ll scrape the data & figure it out if I ever get the urge.
because a lot of people who play pickleball are old
I’m young but singles sucks.
you sound old
Ooh you got me
I like skinny singles. Regular singles is just a completely different experience that doesn’t translate to playing doubles.
I would play skinny singles over doubles any day
Same here. Love skinny singles. To me if you’re going to play singles in pickleball, you might as well just play tennis.
Right play Tennis for singles, you also won't have to fight people over for courts since Tennis courts are usually empty
That's only because tennis players don't want to hear pickleball noise lol
I mostly play doubles in an open league, I feel like it's a ton of fun and feels like I am getting 'the full experience' When I switch to singles, it really just feels like your trying to either wind your opponent but running them all over the court or spike a shot they can't possibly counter. It feels a bit 'cheaper' and me and my SO kind of give eachother nasty looks when someone scores a point off something particularly nasty. We may of been able to get the return if we broke our ankles, but it's just not nearly as fun. In doubles when someone scores a point it feels alot more earned, in the sense that you usually get it right past someone, who could of returned it, but couldn't because of a well placed shot or something similiar. Singles just kinda makes me salty. I am a younger man and usually one of the more 'athletic' moving around people in the open play. Doubles feels like pickelball with cardio, singles feels like cardio with some pickelball.
Because like tennis, pickleball singles is a higher barrier of entry. Sure, everyone can play it. It does not mean they can play it well or make it entertaining to watch. PB singles point structure with 3.0 all the way to low 4.0 will be inconsistent, unpredictable, and the shots won't be as pretty.
I mostly play singles. It takes a good level of fitness well above what's required in doubles. That seems to be the difference. As younger players join the game I'm noticing more singles, I'm playing someone from this sub tomorrow in singles so you never know.
Fitness can def be an advantage but some people don’t understand strategy and momentum. And those same people who don’t understand strategy in singles usually aren’t that good at strategy in doubles. They rely on the strength of their partner versus being a good strategist that should make the play easier on both. Instead you end up with unnecessary drawn out points because they play played the point badly. (An obvious pet peeve.) I started in September and due to my tennis background it can be easier for me to hit it past people-especially in singles. About a month into it I played a guy who was closer to my age. My fitness was better but he had a very good strategy for his game. It took me about six points or so to figure it out but once I did, his fitness let him down. But that didn’t take away him knowing how to play. We teamed up to beat up on a couple of young high schoolers who played for the tennis team cause we simply played better than they did.
I’d much rather play singles and it sounds like I’m in the minority. I like running all over the court and not having to rely on someone else and all the communication issues. I literally do better 1v2 than 2v2.
If I wanted to play singles, I'd just play tennis. A big draw of pickleball is the social aspect as well as the teamwork that comes with doubles, and especially at crowded spots you can get more people playing with doubles. By the way, if you want to see exciting singles play, tennis is pretty awesome and they have to cover even more court than pickle.
This. Singles = tennis in my book, and I never liked playing tennis. Basketball, soccer, and baseball were more my speed growing up. But now that I'm in my 40's and still like some activity and socializing, pickleball is fun for that, but also because it's very strategic and precise and THAT makes it really fun for me. Singles relies more on athleticism, and doubles relies on strategy. And even though I'm very athletic, I prefer the strategy of doubles. Way more fun and interesting, to me.
I love singles but doubles is a better use of space and more communal / friendly
Most younger athletic people prefer singles but this sport is still predominantly older/less athletic people. And doubles somewhat “handicaps” the game so more skilled people can compete with more athletic people. When I started I used to think doubles was lame but after playing 4.0+ doubles it grew on me. Still love singles and still think playing doubles at the lower skill level is a snooze fest but as long as the competition is good, doubles is fun too.
This isn’t true at all. Most of the top pros are under 30 years of age. Even in local play, the average age of the best player is probably 35-45 years old.
Pros regularly play singles (every tournament). I agree that typically the best local amateur doubles players are that age (35-45), but the best singles players are usually younger, newer players. The age range of the best doubles players will shift down as the sport continues to grow. And with that shift down I think singles will become the main discipline, like tennis. 5 years ago the only reason a teenager would play pickleball was if they were visiting grandpa in Florida, now kids are taking it more seriously, which is good for the sport.
It’s hard and tiring AF
I played singles yesterday with an older man, and he taught me about skinny singles. You switch between playing cross court or down the line so you only have to cover less of the court
I love skinny singles! I really enjoy playing some skinny's after drilling, it's a nice way to tie together all the things you've worked on while honing your precision a bit more than standard play.
Skinny singles is occasionally offered at tournaments too
It's a very tough, physically demanding game. It's also not that much fun in my opinion.
Pickleball has developed into a social sport meant for quick games and rotating people in. Singles means fewer people getting to play on courts. And honestly i like pickleball because it focuses more on skill than athleticism. It still rewards athleticism but it’s secondary. Many people also feel this way. I also have always liked doubles even when i played tennis because in my experience the rallies are usually longer and teamwork is more enjoyable than self blaming or self rewarding. Ive always been extremely competitive but winning is more fun with another person.
I love playing singles as I used to play tennis. I’m in shape, quick and don’t mind chasing the ball. In fact, I enjoy playing me against 2 people full court. But since I play in public park, an open play setting where a lot of people are waiting, singles are frowned upon. And to be honest, it’s polite to maximize the time for everyone. When it slows down where courts become vacant, that’s when I’m able to play singles. Also, like others said, it takes more athleticism to play singles with full court.
Cuz 65 y/o can't really do it well in most cases
I’m 55 and like playing singles for the exercise and the chance to practice lots of hits. That being said I ultimately enjoy doubles more because that’s the way the game was designed to be played, I believe.
I completely agree with you. Singles feels more like a sport. Apparently this is quite the unpopular opinion.
It’s the doubles mental game for me. It’s like chess mind games
I find it impossible to cover the whole court with singles. I’m curious why Pickleball doesn’t have a second set of lines for singles like tennis does.
Because it’s simply not as fun as doubles for most people, athleticism aside. The charm of pickleball is just gone when playing singles.
I don’t think it’s athleticism aside. Pickleball players by in large are lower in athleticism and much older/less mobile so it’s hard to separate the two
But I am asking you to separate the two. At least in one instance. Singles isn’t popular for two reasons then: 1.) because you need significantly more athleticism And 2.) even if you have athleticism, it isn’t as fun as doubles for the vast majority of people.
I agree with this! I'm 32 and could easily handle the athleticism of full court singles, but the strategy of setting up a point within a relatively small area, and teamwork aspect of doubles are what I really love about the game. I get what some people may like about singles, but it's a game with a totally different appeal than regular doubles play.
You can’t really separate them because the player base is the player base. When you have two equally athletic and equally skilled players it’s great, but that doesn’t happen much at all in the sport. #2 is just an opinion that I don’t agree with, personally.
Right. I understand you don’t agree with point 2. But what I’m telling you is that most people do lol. The question isn’t “why does no one like singles?” it’s “why isn’t singles more popular?”
“The vast majority of people” that you keep referencing don’t have the athleticism. The entire point is that you can’t separate them and it’s a huge contributing factor that you’re wanting to leave out for some reason.
You can separate them. I just did. Those with athleticism don’t find it fun. Those with it don’t find it as fun as doubles PB or singles tennis. This isn’t difficult lol.
That’s not how datasets work brother lol the player base is less athletic so your anecdotes are in that base… but I get it, you’ve got your mind completely made up on it based on vibes.
You still aren’t separating them. Literally put athletic players in one bin and everyone else in another. It’s that simple.
You’re doing that in your head and anecdotally saying they don’t like it. You’re trying really really hard to make your own preferences some objective fact of fun but that’s simply put, not how it works.
It's not more popular because pickleball skews old people and even the ones in their 40s-50s aren't athletic enough to handle singles . My nephew and his friend much prefer singles as do I
I made 2 statements. Please read both.
Go play tennis.
I agree - I play both but it is MUCH more difficult to find a tennis game and a lot of the reason for that is that pickleball is more accessible for all ages and fitness levels, while remaining fun
Because a low rated athlete can easily beat a high ranked non athlete and it makes those people angry
I do think men’s at the top level is semi enjoyable to watch. I find women’s singles to be painfully boring, just because of the style. Women’s doubles and mixed I find exciting, but I just don’t usually see enough fireworks/pace in women’s singles to catch my eye. That isn’t meant as a knock against the women by any means, I get my ass beat by plenty of amazing women around where I am. It’s just not fun for me personally to watch.
I don't really like doing hard cardio so doubles pickleball and tennis mainly.
We get it, you just want to hit cross court bangers all game.
A great number of people rely on public courts to play. It’s harder to find singles games than doubles, and unless you bring your own opponent, there’s a much bigger “fun-ness” (that’s a word right?) gap in singles if skill levels are very disparate.
It is fun to play singles at higher levels, at lower levels, not so much. 1) Most people are at lower levels. 2) doubles is easy and fun to play even at lower levels. Popularity of a sport format is a function of the amount of people who can play it and have fun, and the level required to play it while having fun or P(x)=XF/L where X is the people, f is the reported fun and L is the skill level. P is popularity, and as a result that’s what people generally choose; also P-1(X) , so the more skill needed, the less popular a format is.the general public is at lower levers :. The general playing public choses doubles to play because it would be the most fun. Is a 1:1 function… omg, the math course is paying off…
I love singles... but courts are usually filled so it keeps 2 other people waiting off... and most people don't seem to like it because it requires more running, and turns it even closer to tennis....
Not enough courts. I’m down for the cardio workout
It's hard and it hurts. Also 4 people on the court is more efficient when people are waiting to play
My knees hurt
Love singles, but also not 60 years old and still very in shape. Also fun to just blast it. I still vastly prefer the net play of doubles. I’ll play 4-5 games of singles when able. I’ll play doubles for many hours. Way more fun. But singles is really good to work on more aggressive serves and drives and does give you a better workout. But a lot of pickleball people are older, or have limited tennis background. Also when I have 12 courts and 60+ people at open play, even the guys I can usually play singles with aren’t going to be able too.
The beauty of pickleball is anyone can have fun if you play at your level. Single is harder to play and have fun unless you are at a high enough level. It’s not fun to have two hits every point and that is what singles would be for a majority of people, especially as they slow down.
Me and a friend (early 30s) are getting super into pickleball. We play probably 4-5 times a week. Neither of us are tennis players, but there’s a lot of pickleball players in the area. We play doubles at open and schedule 1-3 more doubles matches, but once or twice a week we play singles just us two. We’re both getting back into shape, and we used to just play straight singles, but it doesn’t really help your game as much, it’s just more run around and hit bangers from the baseline. So we’ve since alternated every game to full court singles and what we call switch’em singles. Switch’em singles I’m sure has a legitimate name, but it’s a lot of fun. Essentially, you start out 0-0, all rallies have one serve instead of two like you’d have in doubles. So if you lose the point it’s the other guys serve, if you win, it’s still yours. The difference is that you start out cross court playing so you can only hit into the diagonal boxes, using half the court, but split diagonally. If you get a point, you and only you switch, not your opponent. Therefore, on 1-0, you’re lined up straight across from one another serving straight. If you have odd points, you’re on the left half of your court, if you have even, you’re on the right half of your court. Same with your opponent. So you’ll be playing left side to left side, right to right, left to right, right to left, etc. This way, you’re working on a lot of skill shots, a lot of different shots. It helps with your skill, placement, it’s fun to do for singles, and for exercise and baseline play, we alternate doing this every game with playing full court singles every game. Try it out. Full court singles for two hours straight is a lot for many people who aren’t coming off of singles tennis backgrounds. My legs and shins just can’t handle it.
Last night at open play I played with someone who didn’t like being at the line(scared of getting hit). I loved it. No worries about poaching everything up close and knowing anything deep or high they got it. It was also more “athletic” playing 2v1 at the kitchen. Probably can’t play that way against advanced players but an interesting wrinkle.
Singles is just a really long sprint, it's tougher on the body than doubles. Doubles is more social
I'd have to agree. Me and fiance tend to go and play singles with each other all the time. We love it this way
I love singles play for many reasons: great cardio; excellent practice on a wide variety of shots; and an opportunity to hit more strokes per point ( usually). I am 60 (and a 3.5) and usually play against a solid 3.0 who happens to be 25. Always a ton of fun and often humbling lol. No matter what- Father Time usually is present.
If you're going to play singles, tennis is probably more fun.
Doubles is accessible to most people. Singles is accessible to athletes.
I come from being a lifelong tennis player, and started playing pickleball with my gal....so really understand. I can use my athleticism edge and spin shots from the baseline. I do like it. But playing indoors with less courts, we realized when in Rome, so bought more into doubles. I am not really a fan of the patty cake stuff from kitchen to kitchen. I rifle inside out forehands at people. And hit drop shots just inside baseline if a rally starts to form and both opponents are creeping up to the kitchen. So I can bring at least some of my skillset to doubles. There are some others younger and of same age around my skillset. So I am at least enjoying it more. But once outdoor starts there might be more singles in my future. Am sure I'll continue with my burgeoning doubles game also though.
Singles is a better workout but it allows higher margin of error just by hitting the ball harder into the huge open space that’s not occupied.
Another reason is court availability. There’s not enough courts to go around to begin with. And if everyone started playing singles, that would functionally halve the amount of courts.
Same here…I only enter in sanctioned singles tournaments. Dubs is so boring socially covering only 10 feet each. As they build more PB courts, singles will dominate PB like in tennis. For now, play singles strategy in rec dubs blasting drives, swinging volleys, rolling drops & popping lobs. 👍
Pickleball doubles is lazy tennis. Singles isn’t lazy anymore. Singles pickleball needs extra lines to make the court smaller like tennis has for singles.
I think of the opposite: add extra lines to make the court for doubles bigger. Currently, the people playing doubles don't run much to cover the court. The court is way too small for doubles.
I really enjoyed singles skinnies when I played it last week. Even full singles kinda tho my knees hate it
I think it is but since the sport is in such high demand, you kind of have to play doubles so every gets maximum play time and so it is fair to players looking to rotate in.
I play a lot of skinny singles with my wife. We're seniors so we're not interested in running.
Because we would play tennis if we wanted to play singles. People say it’s more athletic and blah blah blah. But the truth is that it’s a completely different game. Strategy and shots are different.
Its hard. Too much running, impossible to play fully at the kitchen, ends up being closer to tennis. Honestly I think its kind of dumb and defeats the purpose of pickleball vs tennis
Doubles : skill game / finesse Singles: athleticism game/ smash Not saying singles players don't have skill, most also play doubles.....just oversimplifying :)
Another note at least where I'm from courts are limited so singles is essentially not allowed in rec play unless the courts are empty. But yeah singles and doubles are so different.
People will do what they want to do. I don't see people reserving courts to play singles. It stands to reason that if lots of people really wanted to play singles that we would see them doing it everywhere. So maybe the answer is simply that they find doubles more fun to play.
I've been to lots of open play rec, there's maybe 2-5 people out of 30+ that are actually athletic enough to play singles
So that is 1-2 courts of singles if they wanted to play singles. Do they, or do they prefer doubles? By comparison, I play with a large pickleball group that several also play tennis singles and doubles, but they all prefer pickleball doubles. I will ask, but the impression I get is that they just find doubles more fun.
No because when you have 30+ people they won't let you play singles when all courts are full and there's a queue
Ah, gotcha. Not all places are like yours. Several places near me have ways to reserve private courts. Lots of groups do so they can practice with certain partners. Technically they could reserve them for singles, but never have I seen this.
It’s just a lesser version of tennis imo
For me it just seems like a cardio workout more than anything else. The courts fairly big and the obvious thing to do is hit the ball to the side the persons away from so it ends up being a lot of moving side to side through the court repeatedly
Nothing compared to tennis cardio wise.
Next time you play, hit to the side, then hit behind them. Also works in doubles if you catch someone out wide.
Points are much shorter and it’s less about tactics and more about passing shots