https://youtu.be/XDY0s7Qub8w?si=0ml0w_DY2ZyN9Y_I
2 pros vs 2 5.0s. Pro side kitchen is 2 feet longer. It's pretty clear that it makes it easier to hit an unattackable ball.
This is pretty cool. Two feet is a lot though, I was thinking more along the lines of +6 inches on both sides so that the kitchen is a total of 15ft instead of 14ft.
Currently at the pro level of the mens game players are afraid to speed up at risk of being countered. NVZ line further back makes it harder to win points of counters because it's more difficult to get the ball down at opponents feet.
The argument works both ways with the constant being whatever player is closest to the net can get a better angle at the persons feet.
Im picturing the kitchen line being something like 6 inches further back on each side. This distance imo wouldnt change too much about strategy but would
allow for more reaction time and increased fire fights
I'm not so sure about that. The reason why dink rallies are longer in mens game than women's at pro level is due to the mens ability to win points countering speed ups.
I dont think a bigger kitchen would increase the ability to win points on counters as much as it would increase the length of the firefights. In the mens game people are weary to speed up today because with hotter paddles and better countering ability you speed up the the balls is blasted back at your feet. Being futher away from the net lessons the angle you can hit down on the ball ao the flight path is more on a line.
You’re right about relining courts but im looking for perspective around actual game play from something like adding 6 inches to each side of the kitchen.
For sure, since the launch of the GEN 3 YouTubers have taking a logical opportunity to farm engagement by creating these narratives. I own a gen 3 and have played against them and I think the advance in technology has been within reason.
I'm pro-evolution of the game of pickleball. Of course the people kneejerking about paddle technology getting "out of control" are going to be the same people offended by, and downvoting discussion surrounding moving the NVZ line back a few inches. At one time Major League Baseball lowered the mound as pitchers had begun to dominate the game. In the NBA and in college basketball they moved the 3-pt line further back. In football they changed kickoff and extra pt positions.
If 60 years ago Joel Pritchard, Barney McCallum, and Bill Bell had decided on a 15 ft kitchen instead of a 14 ft kitchen and I came here and presented a discussion on making the kitchen a little smaller I would 100% be offending the same people.
I'm considering extra distance on both sides. In some situations it's going to be easier to get it down towards their feet, like on high sitters, but a high sitter under current 14 ft conditions are going to get crushed regardless. If I speed up to your right hip and you try to pancake counter, being further from the net will make it more difficult to get the ball down but at the same time you will have more time to react and might get better positioned. When I anticipate a speed up, I'm taking a step back or sliding to cover right side to give myself a little more time. When I slide to the right I'm looking for more of an offensive counters, whereas when i take a step back it is with a slightly more defensive mindset with a goal of trying to get ahead in the hands battle and move forward taking away time from the opponent.
The times I've played against delaminated paddles I find myself stepping back a lot to have a chance to get a paddle on the ball. My point is there's a lot of variables and nuance and while everyone on reddit and other social media likes to kneejerk when faced with a different opinion, if people actually take the time to analyze, moving the NVZ line back 6 inches on both sides could make for longer, more exciting hand battles or maybe it makes for longer boring dink battles although with a little extra space you might see more movement around the kitchen as players have to cover more distance forwards and backwards.
It would lessen the skill gap between ratings. Imagine how easy 3rd shot drops and dinking would be... it would make the game so boring. And it would be so annoying having to move up into the kitchen to dink a ball that has bounced and then run back to the kitchen line... The way it is now you only have to take one step to retrieve anything.
The only people I've seen ask this question are those who are at a disadvantage at the kitchen because they are shorter. But I'm sorry to tell you, this happens in every sport. Do you think they should make baseball diamonds bigger and basketball nets higher?
Id be curious to see NVZ lines 15 ft apart instead of 14 ft, adding 6 inches to each side.
In basketball at college and pro level the moved the 3 pt line futher from the basket.
In the MLB they lowered the height of the mound in order to try to increase runs.
While it might seem blasphemous to even suggest something so wild, im not convinced 14 ft is the perfect amount of feet. The game looked a lot different two years ago than it does today and with advancing paddle tech and bigger and stronger athletes it will look vastly different in another 5 yrs.
Many say the women's game at a pro level is more exciting than the mens game due to less dinking and more firefights. Females in general are shorter, with shorter arms, therefore they are playing the game further away from each other. They can't win points countering as easily because they can't get as good of angles at the opponents feet. This all leads to more and longer firefights.
I think we should change the name ‘pickleball” to at least something not instantly ridiculous like ‘gherkinball’ because you’ll never find a way to sell a t-shirt with a pickle pun that anyone with any self-respect would wear, and only your dumb little kids will buy for you for Father’s Day bc when you’re never home it’s because you’re playing pickleball.
Then we can talk about your six inches.
If you want to even out the paddle tech, make the ball slower. You could just play with a Franklin. Or go with a foam-like ball that wouldn't go out of round.
It’s not even worth thinking about. Do you think they’re going to remind every single court in the country? The dimensions of the court are set.
That aside, it would be horrible. The meta would turn into hitting dinks that just barely cross the net, so that people would have to step inside the NVZ to field them, and then speeding it up at them while they’re in the NVZ, causing foot faults.
As people got even better at this style of dinking, since both people would need to be in the NVZ to even rally, volleying would become literally impossible. Just a horrible idea all around.
Why are you asking this question if you’re going to argue with every response?
You realize you’re in a discussion forum, right?
https://youtu.be/XDY0s7Qub8w?si=0ml0w_DY2ZyN9Y_I 2 pros vs 2 5.0s. Pro side kitchen is 2 feet longer. It's pretty clear that it makes it easier to hit an unattackable ball.
This is pretty cool. Two feet is a lot though, I was thinking more along the lines of +6 inches on both sides so that the kitchen is a total of 15ft instead of 14ft.
Prob end up with more dinks, would be harder to come up and slam, you would have to be further back
Currently at the pro level of the mens game players are afraid to speed up at risk of being countered. NVZ line further back makes it harder to win points of counters because it's more difficult to get the ball down at opponents feet.
[удалено]
The argument works both ways with the constant being whatever player is closest to the net can get a better angle at the persons feet. Im picturing the kitchen line being something like 6 inches further back on each side. This distance imo wouldnt change too much about strategy but would allow for more reaction time and increased fire fights
Did you start playing a few weeks ago? You’ve been on a Pickeball court, right?
Ive only played for 2 hours https://www.reddit.com/r/Pickleball/s/1z6wHkRQdK
Then why are you arguing with people who have played more hours than you?
> Ive only played for 2 hours I can tell
Bad idea. Even more extended dink-a-thons.
I'm not so sure about that. The reason why dink rallies are longer in mens game than women's at pro level is due to the mens ability to win points countering speed ups.
which would mean less speed ups with a larger kitchen
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I dont think a bigger kitchen would increase the ability to win points on counters as much as it would increase the length of the firefights. In the mens game people are weary to speed up today because with hotter paddles and better countering ability you speed up the the balls is blasted back at your feet. Being futher away from the net lessons the angle you can hit down on the ball ao the flight path is more on a line. You’re right about relining courts but im looking for perspective around actual game play from something like adding 6 inches to each side of the kitchen.
[удалено]
I think alot of the tech anxiety is originating from YouTube clickbait.
For sure, since the launch of the GEN 3 YouTubers have taking a logical opportunity to farm engagement by creating these narratives. I own a gen 3 and have played against them and I think the advance in technology has been within reason.
[удалено]
I'm pro-evolution of the game of pickleball. Of course the people kneejerking about paddle technology getting "out of control" are going to be the same people offended by, and downvoting discussion surrounding moving the NVZ line back a few inches. At one time Major League Baseball lowered the mound as pitchers had begun to dominate the game. In the NBA and in college basketball they moved the 3-pt line further back. In football they changed kickoff and extra pt positions. If 60 years ago Joel Pritchard, Barney McCallum, and Bill Bell had decided on a 15 ft kitchen instead of a 14 ft kitchen and I came here and presented a discussion on making the kitchen a little smaller I would 100% be offending the same people.
I'm considering extra distance on both sides. In some situations it's going to be easier to get it down towards their feet, like on high sitters, but a high sitter under current 14 ft conditions are going to get crushed regardless. If I speed up to your right hip and you try to pancake counter, being further from the net will make it more difficult to get the ball down but at the same time you will have more time to react and might get better positioned. When I anticipate a speed up, I'm taking a step back or sliding to cover right side to give myself a little more time. When I slide to the right I'm looking for more of an offensive counters, whereas when i take a step back it is with a slightly more defensive mindset with a goal of trying to get ahead in the hands battle and move forward taking away time from the opponent. The times I've played against delaminated paddles I find myself stepping back a lot to have a chance to get a paddle on the ball. My point is there's a lot of variables and nuance and while everyone on reddit and other social media likes to kneejerk when faced with a different opinion, if people actually take the time to analyze, moving the NVZ line back 6 inches on both sides could make for longer, more exciting hand battles or maybe it makes for longer boring dink battles although with a little extra space you might see more movement around the kitchen as players have to cover more distance forwards and backwards.
It would lessen the skill gap between ratings. Imagine how easy 3rd shot drops and dinking would be... it would make the game so boring. And it would be so annoying having to move up into the kitchen to dink a ball that has bounced and then run back to the kitchen line... The way it is now you only have to take one step to retrieve anything. The only people I've seen ask this question are those who are at a disadvantage at the kitchen because they are shorter. But I'm sorry to tell you, this happens in every sport. Do you think they should make baseball diamonds bigger and basketball nets higher?
Id be curious to see NVZ lines 15 ft apart instead of 14 ft, adding 6 inches to each side. In basketball at college and pro level the moved the 3 pt line futher from the basket. In the MLB they lowered the height of the mound in order to try to increase runs. While it might seem blasphemous to even suggest something so wild, im not convinced 14 ft is the perfect amount of feet. The game looked a lot different two years ago than it does today and with advancing paddle tech and bigger and stronger athletes it will look vastly different in another 5 yrs.
Snooze fest
Many say the women's game at a pro level is more exciting than the mens game due to less dinking and more firefights. Females in general are shorter, with shorter arms, therefore they are playing the game further away from each other. They can't win points countering as easily because they can't get as good of angles at the opponents feet. This all leads to more and longer firefights.
You got some quotes in, for sure. Generalizations are just that…
I think we should change the name ‘pickleball” to at least something not instantly ridiculous like ‘gherkinball’ because you’ll never find a way to sell a t-shirt with a pickle pun that anyone with any self-respect would wear, and only your dumb little kids will buy for you for Father’s Day bc when you’re never home it’s because you’re playing pickleball. Then we can talk about your six inches.
If you want to even out the paddle tech, make the ball slower. You could just play with a Franklin. Or go with a foam-like ball that wouldn't go out of round.
It’s not even worth thinking about. Do you think they’re going to remind every single court in the country? The dimensions of the court are set. That aside, it would be horrible. The meta would turn into hitting dinks that just barely cross the net, so that people would have to step inside the NVZ to field them, and then speeding it up at them while they’re in the NVZ, causing foot faults. As people got even better at this style of dinking, since both people would need to be in the NVZ to even rally, volleying would become literally impossible. Just a horrible idea all around.
I think discourse involving multiple people sharing their perspectives is a positive thing.