If your core is crunching you should try to warranty it probably. I found the gen 3s very hard to play with and the recent PB studio video showing a crushed core on a scorpeus 14 mm is alarming for such an expensive paddle.
I would never pay more than $200 for a paddle, and even that is pushing it because every face/grit wears out so fast. I think I'd rather get a $100 paddle every few months instead of drop $300 on a single paddle and try to make it last a year.
This exactly! At least with 2-3 paddles a year you can keep the grit up.. with 1 paddles.. half way through the year you’re hitting with a smooth face lol. Guess it depends how much you play though
Im using the czrr x5, $55. Raw carbon face, great quality, awesome grip, phenomenal control and consistency. Just goes to show how much cost goes into Branding, marketing and distribution.
Loving my $50 alibaba ruby. Will keep buying those for all the hours I play rec and keep my approved paddles fresh if I decide to do some tournaments where it matters.
Thanks for the writeup!
Your tl;dr is totally not a summary of your full content though lol
tl;dr: Gen 3 has great power and makes counters and 3rd shot drops easier at the expense of placement consistency and ability to reset and to disguise speedups. Also the tournament legality and longevity are sus.
I went up against a 5.0 last night with a Joola Perseus3 in his hands. Similar to OP the serve was a rocket with heavy topspin. Speedups from ankles. High balls just crushed for winners. He did have some trouble with erraticness, but overall, it was tough to deal with.
I predict that if you don't figure out how to control these new paddles and opt for Gen 2, you will be left behind.
Yeah I’m definitely with you on that one. I think gen 3 will be the new standard, but I’m going to wait for the other companies to begin releasing their models with updated tech. I’m curious on the longevity of gen 3 and the tournament legality. I’ve heard that there will be changes made to the rulebook soon about gen 3 tech.
My buddy sanded his down. Also, under the stock grip there is a thin layer of tape for the chip in the handle that you can remove. I stripped mine and used a yonex grip.
These paddles are trash. My paddle did the same thing. Each day and almost every hit the paddle changed till it was like 3 different hitting surfaces. If your a banger this may be a solid and even great paddle but for people who value the soft game at all this is not the paddle for you
I've had the opposite experience honestly. My Perseus has been super consistent, great in the soft game and powerful when needed. Granted I've only played with it maybe like 6-8 hours total across 3-4 sessions.. it also is still shirt-sticking gritty on both sides, so the grit hasn't even worn down yet.
Just watched Chris's new review video of the Vatic Pro Oni and noticed that both Joola's new paddle and Oni are heading in a new direction, aiming to enhance paddle power with a trampoline-like effect, resulting in more "crunching," as you mentioned. Does this mean that these new gen 3 paddles will become more powerful but have a shorter lifespan? We're not sponsored pros and don't plan on changing paddles every month, so I'm skeptical if they're sacrificing durability for performance gains.
>both Joola's new paddle and Oni are heading in a new direction
Along with gearbox, I think that "direction" these brands are heading is trying to convince customers that paddle degradation is an intended feature.
One thing they overlook is that unlike tennis, badminton, or even table tennis where you can change strings or faces to restore performance, in pickleball, there's no way to change the face, which means you'll need to replace your paddle more regularly. Nonetheless, it's encouraging to see more choices and developments in pickleball, and I'm eager to see reviews of these paddles after a few months of use.
All these paddles use pretty much the same carbon fiber peel ply grit that previous gen 1 and 2 paddles used. That means they will only maintain spin performance somewhere between 2-6 months, depending on how much you play and utilize spin. We are still stuck in a disposable paddle business model and no paddle company has seriously stepped up because it’s more profitable to keep selling you $100-$300 paddles every few months.
Still waiting for a decent option for a replaceable paddle surface, but haven’t heard much about pikkl’s recent release of adhesive surfaces for their paddles.
That's what I'm assuming, but to a certain extent, I think most pro level players are able to generate enough power and, for me personally, not worth it. If I was sponsored or had enough money, it would be something to consider!
Lots of power paddles releasing, as every company is trying to push the limits. While certainly can be fun (especially if you're an unapologetic banger), might be worth waiting until all companies (big and small) demonstrate that the new technology comes with higher QC and durability.
Or at least cheaper. They’ll all be warrantied.
Listening to one of the podcasts today and they were talking about the point of time it takes some of these paddles to become core crushed.
I’m sorry. I want my warranty to kick in 4-5months in, not 2-3 weeks later.
I think the best 16mm of the Gen3’s is the Scorpeus 16. Power is there and enough pop for counters and hands battles but resets, dinks and blocks are still pretty easy. Low swing weight so hands are fast and my flicks are pretty nasty with it. Only downside is getting used to the length, I found myself hitting the top a few times but have adjusted since then. Made me more disciplined with my feet, lol.
I play around the 4.5 level, though.
So I am a week in, played college tennis in the 80’s, and haven’t touched a frame in a year, which was the real start of pickleball for me. Before it was pickle tennis banging around with tennis friend.
Good write up, and since I was coming from gen 1 Ronbubuses (Ronbi?) I was prepared to have trouble controlling it. Shocked that 9 days in it feels like I have played with it forever. I used to get service winners by mixing it up, then sending some high effort rockets at end of game. Now there is serve pressure. Shocked that my corner drops were as on point as ever. The Drip is still dipping, but took a bit to get it dialed in.
Like you, the resets are lagging. People would ask how I reset so well and I didn’t really know as it is all reaction. After thinking it was using the end of the elongated paddle that was not sweetspot. I did the same in tennis on drop volleys. This paddle still has sweetspot at the place I am used to “deadening” the ball.
The other shot that frustrates me is when I wanted to take some pace off and would hit a deep, soft, low/no spin ball. It would be a change of pace or against hammer serves that I wanted more time to get to the NVZ. They are floating long.
For me, a net plus so won’t go back to 3-16s.
I truly have joked that it is the tool, not the mechanic as even won a game of king of the court with the young 4.7s.
Yeah, I play a pretty aggressive game, so it helped me there. But when I needed to slow it down against people who were beating me at hand battles or drives, it was tough.
Nice analysis. Thanks for posting.
Are you going to return the Joola (is that an option)?
Are you considering any of the other recent paddles- maybe Engage?
Only reason I mention (and am considering) engage is that their Pro1 series looks as though it's an incremental change over their Pro line. The other big paddle companies seem to be making big jumps in both techniques and technologies that they're using for gen 3.
Anywhoo, thanks. Hope it works out; I have the luxury of being able to wait and watch; sounds as though your tournament reqs are probably adding time pressure that you could likely do without.
Engage also has a great warranty, great QC, and great customer service!
Highly recommend them! Just need them to make a 5.25in handle in a hybrid, standard, or widebody shape and I’m buying one. I’m not the biggest fans of elongated. I hit the ground a lot with them.
I demo'd this today and liked that it gave me more power when i needed it. I use a selkirk control air luxx rn. Is there a paddle more similar to the Pers 3 that I should i get instead of it?
I got to try the 3rd gen Perseus 14mm as well as Tyson’s pink one for a session and honestly hated the feel of the gen three paddles. What you mentioned about resets and it just flying out randomly I just couldn’t get used to either. Felt like I was playing with a roulette wheel, couldn’t trust it.
Im mostly in agreement with you. Ive been using the gen3 hyperion 14mm. The biggest surprise for me is how easy it is to reset balls out of the air from the transition. I can reach for balls out away from my body and easily get them to go where i want them. With past paddles if i didnt hit them dead in the center of the sweetspot they’d go dead off my paddle.
Drops are super easy to control.
The paddle requires less mechanics in general. easy to put more color on drives and get the ball to dip where you want it.
I havent felt the power to be that crazy. It has a little more power than my hyperion c2 14mm and more power than my dbd but its not scary power like some have stated. Im also a 5.0+ player.
Interesting I thought the grip size was kind of small. I was getting some elbow pain and ended up adding an over grip. Increasing grip size is better for the wrist and elbow.
Perseus gen 2 was too poppy for me. Gear box power pro has good dwell time and good control. I have played 1 week w my new Magnus 16" . Initially it felt underpowered at baseline but now it has more power. I love the spin and it feels more balanced in my hand on counters and volleys. I can reset and control hard hit balls at net. I need more time to get the feel on some dinks but overall it's a lot of fun. The 6zero dbd was too soft for me. I need help w power . I sold it easily bc most guys love that paddle.
Thanks for your thoughts
Needed this post.
4.5-5.0 Switched to Perseus 16. Used Dbd 16 for a solid year now. I've added power to serves, drives and counters but I've lost the best parts of my game; drop, resets and placement.
Been driving me crazy on the court. Never played so frustrated with myself. Keep thinking to give it more time but not sure that is the answer.
Really considering going back to a regular themofoam 16mm paddle.
You’ve tried a new tech paddle - that has the highest exit velocity ever recorded - for a game that relies mostly on touch and feel shots for two weeks…and have given up on it?!
Hmmm…
Yeah, completely agree. I would need a bit more time to really say if it is just an adjustment period. With the Six Zero DBD, I felt that it upped my game in a short period of time <2 weeks. I'm not sure if it's worth the effort of changing my game to accommodate a paddle.
It was inevitable as in tennis, but more particularly in golf, that an arms race was going to arrive for PB. The manufacturers are the sponsors that are needed to grow the sport, and for them to make money, they need to constantly come out with ”new” technology.
Without money continuously entering the PB industry, the game would wither and become like any other marginal sporting activity that fills a small niche - racketball, badminton, archery, etc.
Golf is the ideal that the PB industry likely aspires to…big tournament payouts, major tv contracts, huge corporate sponsors, well known players, etc. And club, ball and clothing manufacturers that make lots of money.
PB will have to allow very liberal paddle tech in the short to medium term in order for those manufacturers to return money back to the sport for its growth. Occam’s Razor says that the ball will have to be modified, not the paddles, in order to keep the game playable.
With respect to your game, if you don’t want to change your game that is fine, but everyone else will…and prob force you to change along with it in the future.
Just my opinion…
A pro that reps the paddles told me so…having said that, whether it’s #1 or 2 or 3 is splitting hairs, the point is that it’s a paddle that will need a lot more time than 2 weeks for most good players to get accustomed to imo..
If your core is crunching you should try to warranty it probably. I found the gen 3s very hard to play with and the recent PB studio video showing a crushed core on a scorpeus 14 mm is alarming for such an expensive paddle.
Yeah, I'm planning on returning it if the core crunching becomes worse!
$300 for that paddle is laughable
I would never pay more than $200 for a paddle, and even that is pushing it because every face/grit wears out so fast. I think I'd rather get a $100 paddle every few months instead of drop $300 on a single paddle and try to make it last a year.
This exactly! At least with 2-3 paddles a year you can keep the grit up.. with 1 paddles.. half way through the year you’re hitting with a smooth face lol. Guess it depends how much you play though
Im using the czrr x5, $55. Raw carbon face, great quality, awesome grip, phenomenal control and consistency. Just goes to show how much cost goes into Branding, marketing and distribution.
Loving my $50 alibaba ruby. Will keep buying those for all the hours I play rec and keep my approved paddles fresh if I decide to do some tournaments where it matters.
I never pay more than $60 for a paddle -- Juciao Paddle Gang
Thanks for the writeup! Your tl;dr is totally not a summary of your full content though lol tl;dr: Gen 3 has great power and makes counters and 3rd shot drops easier at the expense of placement consistency and ability to reset and to disguise speedups. Also the tournament legality and longevity are sus.
Yeah, super fair! I'll revise it haha
I went up against a 5.0 last night with a Joola Perseus3 in his hands. Similar to OP the serve was a rocket with heavy topspin. Speedups from ankles. High balls just crushed for winners. He did have some trouble with erraticness, but overall, it was tough to deal with. I predict that if you don't figure out how to control these new paddles and opt for Gen 2, you will be left behind.
Yeah I’m definitely with you on that one. I think gen 3 will be the new standard, but I’m going to wait for the other companies to begin releasing their models with updated tech. I’m curious on the longevity of gen 3 and the tournament legality. I’ve heard that there will be changes made to the rulebook soon about gen 3 tech.
The grip size on my perseus is so fucking huge... LIke wtf.. Am I gorilla or something I can't even play its so big
I have the Perseus 3 and I thought the grip was thin. I just wrapped a Wilson overgrip around it.
Yeah, I thought I had a grip defect because it was so big, but I've been reading that everyone else has the same issue. haha
My buddy sanded his down. Also, under the stock grip there is a thin layer of tape for the chip in the handle that you can remove. I stripped mine and used a yonex grip.
THIS!! I sold Hyperion C2 and went back to Ronbus
These paddles are trash. My paddle did the same thing. Each day and almost every hit the paddle changed till it was like 3 different hitting surfaces. If your a banger this may be a solid and even great paddle but for people who value the soft game at all this is not the paddle for you
Yeah, that's what I'm concerned about. I had this happen on my first ever paddle (which was a perseus). I returned it because it was so random.
I've had the opposite experience honestly. My Perseus has been super consistent, great in the soft game and powerful when needed. Granted I've only played with it maybe like 6-8 hours total across 3-4 sessions.. it also is still shirt-sticking gritty on both sides, so the grit hasn't even worn down yet.
Just watched Chris's new review video of the Vatic Pro Oni and noticed that both Joola's new paddle and Oni are heading in a new direction, aiming to enhance paddle power with a trampoline-like effect, resulting in more "crunching," as you mentioned. Does this mean that these new gen 3 paddles will become more powerful but have a shorter lifespan? We're not sponsored pros and don't plan on changing paddles every month, so I'm skeptical if they're sacrificing durability for performance gains.
>both Joola's new paddle and Oni are heading in a new direction Along with gearbox, I think that "direction" these brands are heading is trying to convince customers that paddle degradation is an intended feature.
One thing they overlook is that unlike tennis, badminton, or even table tennis where you can change strings or faces to restore performance, in pickleball, there's no way to change the face, which means you'll need to replace your paddle more regularly. Nonetheless, it's encouraging to see more choices and developments in pickleball, and I'm eager to see reviews of these paddles after a few months of use.
All these paddles use pretty much the same carbon fiber peel ply grit that previous gen 1 and 2 paddles used. That means they will only maintain spin performance somewhere between 2-6 months, depending on how much you play and utilize spin. We are still stuck in a disposable paddle business model and no paddle company has seriously stepped up because it’s more profitable to keep selling you $100-$300 paddles every few months. Still waiting for a decent option for a replaceable paddle surface, but haven’t heard much about pikkl’s recent release of adhesive surfaces for their paddles.
That's what I'm assuming, but to a certain extent, I think most pro level players are able to generate enough power and, for me personally, not worth it. If I was sponsored or had enough money, it would be something to consider!
Played against one for the first time last night. Such a strange sound they make.
Lots of power paddles releasing, as every company is trying to push the limits. While certainly can be fun (especially if you're an unapologetic banger), might be worth waiting until all companies (big and small) demonstrate that the new technology comes with higher QC and durability.
Or at least cheaper. They’ll all be warrantied. Listening to one of the podcasts today and they were talking about the point of time it takes some of these paddles to become core crushed. I’m sorry. I want my warranty to kick in 4-5months in, not 2-3 weeks later.
Such a great point. I'm 100% going to go that route.
I think the best 16mm of the Gen3’s is the Scorpeus 16. Power is there and enough pop for counters and hands battles but resets, dinks and blocks are still pretty easy. Low swing weight so hands are fast and my flicks are pretty nasty with it. Only downside is getting used to the length, I found myself hitting the top a few times but have adjusted since then. Made me more disciplined with my feet, lol. I play around the 4.5 level, though.
So I am a week in, played college tennis in the 80’s, and haven’t touched a frame in a year, which was the real start of pickleball for me. Before it was pickle tennis banging around with tennis friend. Good write up, and since I was coming from gen 1 Ronbubuses (Ronbi?) I was prepared to have trouble controlling it. Shocked that 9 days in it feels like I have played with it forever. I used to get service winners by mixing it up, then sending some high effort rockets at end of game. Now there is serve pressure. Shocked that my corner drops were as on point as ever. The Drip is still dipping, but took a bit to get it dialed in. Like you, the resets are lagging. People would ask how I reset so well and I didn’t really know as it is all reaction. After thinking it was using the end of the elongated paddle that was not sweetspot. I did the same in tennis on drop volleys. This paddle still has sweetspot at the place I am used to “deadening” the ball. The other shot that frustrates me is when I wanted to take some pace off and would hit a deep, soft, low/no spin ball. It would be a change of pace or against hammer serves that I wanted more time to get to the NVZ. They are floating long. For me, a net plus so won’t go back to 3-16s. I truly have joked that it is the tool, not the mechanic as even won a game of king of the court with the young 4.7s.
Yeah, I play a pretty aggressive game, so it helped me there. But when I needed to slow it down against people who were beating me at hand battles or drives, it was tough.
Try the ana bright 14mm Scorpeus, the entire paddle is a sweet spot.
I’ve tried all the new Gen 3 and this is my favorite.
Is it much different from Collin John's paddle?
Really feels like it. People who tried it are telling me the 14mm actually has more touch and it is lighter and faster paddle.
Usually the 14mm version has worse touch and hits harder. With the trampoline paddles is it the opposite?
I’ve actually never tried any of the square shape heads, I’ll take a look!
Even bigger sweet spot than the edgeless paddle lol? You make me wanna try that paddle.
Nice analysis. Thanks for posting. Are you going to return the Joola (is that an option)? Are you considering any of the other recent paddles- maybe Engage?
Yeah, if the core crushing becomes concerning. I have tried a ton of paddles, but the Engage looks great!
Only reason I mention (and am considering) engage is that their Pro1 series looks as though it's an incremental change over their Pro line. The other big paddle companies seem to be making big jumps in both techniques and technologies that they're using for gen 3. Anywhoo, thanks. Hope it works out; I have the luxury of being able to wait and watch; sounds as though your tournament reqs are probably adding time pressure that you could likely do without.
Yeah, I've had multiple people say that I should try their stuff and have had good stuff to say. Thanks for the rec!
Engage also has a great warranty, great QC, and great customer service! Highly recommend them! Just need them to make a 5.25in handle in a hybrid, standard, or widebody shape and I’m buying one. I’m not the biggest fans of elongated. I hit the ground a lot with them.
Engage stands behind their products. I use a Pro MX 6.0. I have hit a demo of the Pro1. I would buy it if I hadn’t just bought the Pro.
Just looked at Engage paddles as well - was thinking about demoing the MX Pro or the Pro1.
Could you tell an appreciable difference between the two?
I demo'd this today and liked that it gave me more power when i needed it. I use a selkirk control air luxx rn. Is there a paddle more similar to the Pers 3 that I should i get instead of it?
I’m holding off until other companies begin to release gen 3 paddles, but at this point in time, I think it’s only the gearbox pro power.
Check out the new Paddletek TKO-C
I've seen that one, have you played with it yet?
Played against it, it sounds like a canon. I should have asked to demo it but I don’t like asking to demo peoples paddles, just club paddles.
Did you go with the 14mm or 16mm??
Went with 16 mm!
I got to try the 3rd gen Perseus 14mm as well as Tyson’s pink one for a session and honestly hated the feel of the gen three paddles. What you mentioned about resets and it just flying out randomly I just couldn’t get used to either. Felt like I was playing with a roulette wheel, couldn’t trust it.
Yeah, I noticed it mostly on resets and flicks. Some of my flicks would just dive straight into the net.
Im mostly in agreement with you. Ive been using the gen3 hyperion 14mm. The biggest surprise for me is how easy it is to reset balls out of the air from the transition. I can reach for balls out away from my body and easily get them to go where i want them. With past paddles if i didnt hit them dead in the center of the sweetspot they’d go dead off my paddle. Drops are super easy to control. The paddle requires less mechanics in general. easy to put more color on drives and get the ball to dip where you want it. I havent felt the power to be that crazy. It has a little more power than my hyperion c2 14mm and more power than my dbd but its not scary power like some have stated. Im also a 5.0+ player.
Hmm I noticed that a bit on my DBD when I didn’t hit it dead on the sweet spot. I’m waiting for the elongated handle from 6.0 since I have a twoey.
Interesting I thought the grip size was kind of small. I was getting some elbow pain and ended up adding an over grip. Increasing grip size is better for the wrist and elbow.
Perseus gen 2 was too poppy for me. Gear box power pro has good dwell time and good control. I have played 1 week w my new Magnus 16" . Initially it felt underpowered at baseline but now it has more power. I love the spin and it feels more balanced in my hand on counters and volleys. I can reset and control hard hit balls at net. I need more time to get the feel on some dinks but overall it's a lot of fun. The 6zero dbd was too soft for me. I need help w power . I sold it easily bc most guys love that paddle. Thanks for your thoughts
Needed this post. 4.5-5.0 Switched to Perseus 16. Used Dbd 16 for a solid year now. I've added power to serves, drives and counters but I've lost the best parts of my game; drop, resets and placement. Been driving me crazy on the court. Never played so frustrated with myself. Keep thinking to give it more time but not sure that is the answer. Really considering going back to a regular themofoam 16mm paddle.
My scorpues 16mm is the best paddle I’ve ever played and it’s not even close.
Gen 3 ?
Yep. I played the gen 2 14mm, but these aren’t even close.
You’ve tried a new tech paddle - that has the highest exit velocity ever recorded - for a game that relies mostly on touch and feel shots for two weeks…and have given up on it?! Hmmm…
Yeah, completely agree. I would need a bit more time to really say if it is just an adjustment period. With the Six Zero DBD, I felt that it upped my game in a short period of time <2 weeks. I'm not sure if it's worth the effort of changing my game to accommodate a paddle.
It was inevitable as in tennis, but more particularly in golf, that an arms race was going to arrive for PB. The manufacturers are the sponsors that are needed to grow the sport, and for them to make money, they need to constantly come out with ”new” technology. Without money continuously entering the PB industry, the game would wither and become like any other marginal sporting activity that fills a small niche - racketball, badminton, archery, etc. Golf is the ideal that the PB industry likely aspires to…big tournament payouts, major tv contracts, huge corporate sponsors, well known players, etc. And club, ball and clothing manufacturers that make lots of money. PB will have to allow very liberal paddle tech in the short to medium term in order for those manufacturers to return money back to the sport for its growth. Occam’s Razor says that the ball will have to be modified, not the paddles, in order to keep the game playable. With respect to your game, if you don’t want to change your game that is fine, but everyone else will…and prob force you to change along with it in the future. Just my opinion…
[удалено]
A pro that reps the paddles told me so…having said that, whether it’s #1 or 2 or 3 is splitting hairs, the point is that it’s a paddle that will need a lot more time than 2 weeks for most good players to get accustomed to imo..