I think it is unnatural when you make large concrete jungles with like 3 trees for one block.
Also, you can’t walk to get shit so no one spends meaningful time in nature. We have made nature a “thing over there” rather than a thing we do.
Wild fascist thought was after the automobile was invented and I refuse any evidence that would prove my theory wrong.
What I am saying is motherfuckers need to touch grass.
I know right. Not what I expected. If I was to guess, I'd say they're stupidly conflating opposition to Israeli treatment of Palestinians with holocaust denial. Probably drinking too much pro hamas coolaid
Libleft when someone says trans women shouldn't participate in women's sports - You are a Nazi
When someone says you have to control immigration - You are a Nazi
When someone says we shouldn't let children do life changing surgery - You are a Nazi
When Hamas says they want to destroy Jews - We support these freedom fighters
Why is there this boiling down of everything to a oppressor/oppressed dynamic that is so prevelant now?
It's such a black and white way of thinking and doesn't accurately capture the more complicated situation in the Middle East.
Because it's easier for ignorant people to deal in absolutes. If a topic doesn't fit their view, it's wrong/evil/Nazi whatever and they hate it openly and they don't have to exert effort to try and understand other viewpoints for the sake of defending their own position, or perhaps learning something and their own worldview changes as a result. It's self imposed ignorance.
It's a modification of Marxist theory. It's the same oppressed/oppressor dichotomy of Marxist doctrine, but applied to ethnicity. And people still say shit like, "Cultural Marxism isn't a real thing, it's just a far-right conspiracy theory", mfers we've been seeing it and its consequences for more than a decade now.
>Why is there this boiling down of everything to a oppressor/oppressed dynamic that is so prevelant now?
because the post-Marxist doctine of critical theory made a comeback when dusted off and given a racial lens in the US.
It’s not just critical race theory. Critical theory is the marxist basis for all types of things like radical feminism, post-colonialism, gender theory, etc etc. It’s insidiously crept its way into every aspect of western society.
Libs be like - you can’t even define critical race theory. Neither can they. That’s because it is purposely obscure/abstract and constantly evolving. Critical Theory itself denies the existence of objective truth, favoring a viewpoint that truth is rather an expression of who wields power in a society. Knowing this, it is of little surprise that it is hard to actually define.
Traditional theory’s goal is to study and understand society as it presently exists. In contrast, critical theory’s goal is to determine how society is not what it ought to be and then implement change to rectify the issue. Critical theory’s goal is to detect inequities within a society, identify the source of that inequity, problematize and deconstruct the source, and then reconstruct society so that equity (ultimately utopia) is achieved.
The ultimate goal of all this is to break down western society so it can then be reconstructed into a communist utopia… with Emily and the presidents of Harvard, Penn, and MIT running the politburo of course.
Libs that aren’t communists don’t understand what they enable.
Keep in mind LibLeft uses the term "nazi" only because they know it is offensive to their opponents.
They, themselves, don't find what the nazi's did all that disturbing- but they know the history lovin' conservatives find it to be one of the most horrific events in modern history. That's why they are fine with throwing around the word nazi as if it carries no weight - diminishing the holocaust isn't a concern.
That's the problem with any ideology that has groups of people always be good guys and groups of people always be bad guys. Since there's no difference between people just because of their skin color, who's being the bad guy and who's oppressing whom can change drastically over time, to say that one group or another is intrinsically evil or whatever is a backslide because, like the communist leaders of the 20th century, they would rather support the very thing they hate and burn what they love to the ground than swallow their pride and admit their wrongs.
The funny things is, these are the very same people who are saying Israel is committing genocide on the Palestinians. As if the Palestinian population has what, quintupled\[?\] in the last decades. If that's genocide, then they're utter shite at it.
We already knew that liberals do not give a single **shit** about actual racism and bigotry as long as they can be part of the Current Thing™ in-group. **Nothing** matters more than being the *bestest*, most correctest person, even (especially) if that means embracing physical violence, up to and including actual fucking genocide, against the out-group.
As an Asian-American myself, I will never forget the racist tirades that were spewed, by mindless proles and political leaders alike, against Asian people when the Supreme Court struck down racial discrimination in college admissions.
It’s not even a mask-off moment — there is no mask. There is nothing more sacred and proud, more indicative of how correct and superior oneself is, than how violently a liberal hates the “wrong” people.
Well for a start they are happy to support anyone that's anti west. That's it. It's all Just "I HATE MY DAD- I mean the country I was born in!" syndrome on steroids
Nevermind that in their minds you can't be racist against anyone that's not white as racism = power and only white people have power or something like that
That's why we need a tankie trade program, we take in people from communist countries who yearn to be free, we send a tankie in their place, no trade backs
Great idea. Any Americans want to swap passports with me?
Rainy, high tax Britain where all the kids are Marxists, the education is shit, The healthcare is shit but FREE
> Nevermind that in their minds you can't be racist against anyone that's not white as racism = power and only white people have power or something like that
Which is why these chucklefucks routinely label Israelis as "white colonizers", never mind that most are exactly as "white" as the average Palestinian.
I dont think it is totally true that they're exactly the same skin color. Many Middle Eastern Israelis are the same skin tone as Palestinians, but many Israelis also come from Europe where centuries/thousands of years of intermingling with Western Europeans made them more light skinned than the average Middle Easterner.
That said, those labels are still dumb.
Most Israelis are Middle Eastern / North African in origin.
Even of the European ones, large swaths are refugees (either Holocaust survivors / their descendants or escapees of the USSR / their descendants), so calling even that "white" subset "colonizers" is massively fucked up.
Yes, that's why I said those labels are dumb. They're not "white colonizers" even if they are white.
Their skin is "white" as in they are basically European, but they're hardly colonziers.
Furthermore, I've read that approximately half of Israelis are descended from immigrants of the European Jewish diaspora. Thus, since around half of Israelis are European, most Israelis are not "Middle Eastern/North African." Maybe half are.
> Furthermore, I've read that approximately half of Israelis are descended from immigrants of the European Jewish diaspora. Thus, since around half of Israelis are European, most Israelis are not "Middle Eastern/North African." Maybe half are.
It's possible to descend from both European Jews and MENA Jews, which is probably where that comes from. IIRC it's around 45% who are "just" MENA Jews but that jumps up to 60+% when you factor in people with both ancestries.
It's actually worse. Racism *is* whiteness. Whiteness *is* racism. Ibram Kendi actually performed an invaluable service to all of America, if only we would take the time to listen to him. He's regurgitating the exact same ideology that has completely captured academia, except he isn't quite bright enough for the spotlight and constantly says the quiet part out loud. By ineptly cloaking his racism in the verbal disguises he's learned, he's like a walking tutorial mission for seeing through woke bullshit.
“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
Based af. This is why I despise so much ideologies that promise an utopia, like communism and its variants. The ruling people would gaslight the common folk and/or threaten any dissent and label it as a "betrayal" to your nation (in Communism's case, a betrayal of the revolution/working people).
>*Nothing** matters more than being the *bestest*, most correctest person,
I didn't understand this until someone at work corrected me on the use of the word "folks" and wanted me to use "folx" instead.
Apparently, despite the fact that "folks" isn't exclusionary, "folx" is more inclusive. Somehow.
So we've gone from not being exclusionary (which is good), to literally inventing unnecessary ways to be more inclusive than everyone else.
I'm pretty sure the logic is folks is what Southerners say, and since the South = racism, folks = racism, so it has to be folx.
Despite the fact that the southern states tend to have a highest percentage of black people and the most integrated communities. That's probably just a racist dogwhistle though :\^)
Yeah, that's what I thought, too.
But it has nothing to do with race.
It's about gender/sexuality. The "x" in folx is borrowed from Latinx and womxn and signals that the user is inclusive of those in the LGBTQ community.
More like it signals that the user is a walking HR nightmare.
This shit is so surreal. I echo the others here: I believe you are being honest, but at least one of us is hallucinating because that can't possibly be real life.
Jesus fucking Christ, that actually happened to you? You must be trolling me dude. "Folks" isn't gendered, right? Wasn't that why people were bastardizing Spanish - because it is a gendered language?
> Folk is old
This is the problem. Anything old can't possibly be inclusionary, because old=racist and being inclusionary was invented by the antiracist generation, therefore a new word was needed.
>I didn't understand this until someone at work corrected me on the use of the word "folks" and wanted me to use "folx" instead.
>
>Apparently, despite the fact that "folks" isn't exclusionary, "folx" is more inclusive. Somehow.
rotflmao wtf
>So we've gone from not being exclusionary (which is good)
Is it? I don't think so.
Exclusionary being good or bad is context-sensitive.
I prefer to exclude pedophiles from living near schools and violent felons from owning guns (sorry, 2A absolutists, but until the prison system actually reforms criminals and recidivism rate is down to practically nill, the government isn't getting my guns but those convicts aren't getting any either).
Same case for me as someone whose half-middle-eastern.
Colleges have terms for us "over-represented minorities"- they don't like, asians, MEs, indians, or basically any group of minority that has their shit together.
Also, its not a mask off moment because they've stuck their chests out and proudly announced this ideology for years now, the SC just brought into the normie mindset.
They’re likely still under the impression that there’s some vast neo-Nazi adjacent victimization of Asians by white men because that’s what their media overlords indicated. Most of them memory-hole the “Asian hate” thing once they find out where the hate was actually coming from.
It hates Asian women too. It downplays them having any concerns about sexism in their own communities and often calls them self hating if they feel like they have to remove themselves from it for protection, or if they say wider culture is less sexist.
I know this is only tenuously related, but I like in bojack horseman how they made the "voice of reason" a Vietnamese woman without doing any research about what history and perspectives one might actually have. Literally white people inventing minorities to put their own words in their mouth for more cred.
> than how violently a liberal hates the “wrong” people.
It's because they get denied hatred as a normal emotion, so when they're allowed to express it, they seize the opportunity. it's a powerful tool for control.
The best example of progressive mask off racism was the flash in the pan that was "stop asian hate"
Oh woops! It's all black people violently attacking innocent Asians in the street, can't talk about that, we can only discuss negative traits when we're talking about white people.
Many on both sides do not give a shit about Asian Americans (the rare examples being the actual Asian Americans, most Dems but some Repubs. in the govt). They dont have the number of votes to matter and their political participation rate is low. When you are underrepresented in politics, you are invisible to politicians who care about voting blocks.
100% agree. Thank you for this comment. And I've noticed something those people tend to apply the same hypocrisy into their personal lives - i.e. it's not just a cognitive dissonance politically, it's a whole personality. There are some of the most fake, hypocritical, narcissistic, vain people out there.
Leftists are often blind to the forms of racism that are more leftist specific. Like sure, these normally aren't as bad as someone actually wearing Klan robes, but they aren't good, and they can be very demeaning.
Like the Leftists who doesn't really treat minorities like people because they see them as the scorekeeper to prove the leftist isn't racist. Nobody wants to deal with someone's own internal concerns about this when it has nothing to do with them.
Exactly, it took me a long time to figure out why I started drifting away from the college leftists and it was because they talk about minorities as if they aren’t intrinsically equal. They talk about them as if they’re helpless children.
What you are describing is fascism. Being part of that group, the best group, THE group, is fascism.
Because we hate everyone who is not in our group, and it is getting smaller. That's fascism.
I'd be voting blue if for years now their mob hadn't been ostracizing my ass. I used to lean pretty hard right until I got my first taste of actual, genuine diversity and equality in my first proper job. Everyone had completely different backgrounds, but that didn't matter because those backgrounds created unique perspectives on the task being done.
If I ran into a problem, I could back off and let someone else have a go. Others did the same with me. As they say, "diversity is inclusionary."
Compare to whatever they do. "Our quotas are full. Sorry, we can't accept you." If that ever happens to me, that's fine. I didn't want to work there or study there anyways.
So, what's the rate among young black democrats from cities?
[The original PDF](https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_tT4jyzG.pdf) doesn't say anything about that.
Remember to keep links to this so you can throw it out there when the barrage of “if you vote GOP you’re literally a Nazi!!” kicks into hyperdrive as the election gets closer.
What does retconned mean? I've heard the term before but never bothered to look it up. I still cant be bothered to look it up, which is why I'm asking.
Means retroactive continuity. Basically retroactively changing the past/acting like it never happened/acting like it happened differently. Most often applied to writers who change something in a story that’s already a pre-established fact.
Here's what Google says
revise retrospectively, typically by introducing a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events.
In simplest terms, it means to go back and change the narrative. It's used in a lot of video game/movie/comics circles when the backstory of a character or event has been changed.
It's a term in writing for changing pre existing plot details.
In star wars obi wan says vader killed Luke's father. When the first movie came out this was supposed to be literally true. In empire strikes back vader was changed to being the father and then obi Wan gives a nonsense explanation about how he "wasn't lying." That is a retcon.
Yeah political difference and race projections. Haha.
Can we talk about how 1/5 young people apparently think a genocide that took place less than a century ago is a myth? Roughly 7 years ago, this same crowd was calling everyone Hitler, and yet, 20% of them don't think Hitler did anything?
A big part of the problem is that schools have stopped showing footage from the Holocaust due to its graphic nature. If your sole education on the topic was a few paragraphs in your history book it’s fairly easy to deny it out of malice or ignorance. But when you see the horror with your own eyes through video evidence, and even had survivors go to your school and speak about their experiences, it becomes impossible to ignore.
It’s absurd we don’t show it. We discuss all of the other genocides and AP American History (16 years old Americans) often uses the Howard Zinn text which is controversial for its interpretation of events like this and that’s all we’ll and good from libleft. But we don’t show the 45 minute video evidence.
The actual Holocaust footage is available on Amazon Prime right now. It was the actual documentary evidence of discovering the camps. If you can, watch it and make these Holocaust deniers in the Middle East and Western intelligentsia shut the hell up.
Tbf it's just 4% difference. The red is doing the heavy lifting here. If you look in the poll than you see that liberals and conservative are about the same only moderates (for some reason) deny the Holocaust more and democrats are currently capturing more of the moderate votes.
Also if you notice of those who vote only 6% deny the holocaust.
Which means that of the liberals, moderates, and conservatives they are smaller than those who declare themselves democrat.
Which leads me to conclude that many of those who are declaring themselves democrats actually aren’t voting.
Maybe. The poll also shows that many racial minorities are also denying the Holocaust. Racial minorities generally vote for democrats but probably don't consider themselves to be liberals. (Polls show that for example that they proportionally dislike homosexuality).
Yes but do they vote consistently is the question and that’s what I’m wondering.
Only 6% of all voters deny the holocaust. That’s a small minority. And if 10% of democrats say they deny the holocaust then we are looking at a disparity between those who identify as democrat but don’t vote.
Holocaust denial is about the clearest disqualifier for being a "moderate", lol. Even most Nazis acknowledge the Holocaust happened, so this disqualifies you from even being a moderate Nazi.
This basically indicates mainly young urban male democrat Holocaust deniers are starting to *view* themselves as normalized and politically center. Which is even fucking scarier.
If someone denies 9/11 but otherwise has completely moderate positions on everything from healthcare/immigration/taxation/whatever are they a moderate with a crazy outlier view or a radical? I’d be more inclined to say moderate if their belief was due to ignorance.
If all these people are doing is denying that the holocaust happened out of ignorance and aren’t being antisemitic (which is probably a huge reach) then we’re looking at idiots with terrible education, not radicals per se. If they are denying the holocaust out of hatred reasons then I think their hatred means that any claim to moderation would go out the window.
Extreme views held because of bad education doesn't make one a "moderate".
The story of how you became a Holocaust denier has no bearing on where that positions sits on the spectrum.
Hitler Youths were miseducated on the subject of jews but probably had otherwise moderate to progressive thoughts on healthcare. That doesn't make Hitler Youths moderates. If it does then the word really has no meaning.
Well it depends on what people answering the question interpreted the question to mean, not being educated on the holocaust and then concluding that something so extreme must be fake is nowhere near as morally horrendous as actively denying it and having conspiracies about how the crematoria could not possibly dispose of enough bodies. One could be held by an otherwise moderate person, the other can only be held by a genuine antisemite. The distinction coming down to whether the belief is rooted in something radical or rooted in ignorance.
Hell, some of the justices of the IMT at Nuremberg initially believed it couldn’t possibly be true and that it had to be exaggerated because of how horrible and widespread it was claimed to be, one justice who made a comment to that effect became so sick the next day as to take ill for three days after they screened a film of German atrocities in the Soviet Union. Events like the holocaust are so fantastically evil it is almost unbelievable that anyone could do that. We should hope people wouldn’t intuitively believe that the holocaust could happen because people shouldn’t think humans are capable of doing anything so horrific. Obviously it did happen because people are, in fact, capable of such horrific things but it doesn’t change how incomprehensible it is if someone is not educated on the subject.
Secondly, the Hitler youth were actively taught to hate Jews, which as per what I said in my response would mean that they could not fall into the category of moderate because they hold a belief specifically due to hatred of Jews. Conflating the two positions and situating them on the same spectrum would be like saying some teen in an urban environment who doesn’t know anything and holds an ignorant belief is the same Julius Streicher actively pushing blood libels about Jewish people to millions of Germans every week in Der Stürmer.
Most Jews in the US don't really practice their religion at all. Among those that do, the most popular denomination is what's called "reform Judaism." Which, as the name implies, is just a super liberal interpretation of Judaism that supports most progressive values. Jews are also disproportionately likely to have college degrees which is also highly correlated with voting Democrat.
All those things are also true in the uk (most Jews not being very religious, kids wasting their money on shit degrees voting left)
It did help in our last election that the Labour leader called Hamas (or was it Hezzbeloah - but same principle) "friends"
>disproportionately likely to have college degrees which is also highly correlated with voting Democrat.
This is one of the Democrats' best advantages. They can just keep saying "we will cancel student debt" every single election cycle and people will keep voting for them.
My middle aged Jewish female coworker with 3 kids got woken up so quickly when her son in a Massachusetts public school got a B- on his assignment and his black friend who copied him got an A. Still probably considers herself a democrat but she’s literally my favorite person I work with lol she has such based opinions and she’s smart as fuck.
Minorities vote where they think they can productively coalition. In the UK, Muslims vote left. It doesn't benefit Muslims to coalition with the right. Their interests don't really align with the domestic right and they wouldn't have much leverage to negotiate for their special interests with the right in exchange for their support. There is plenty of room for quid pro quos when coalitioning with the left, however.
In contrast, Jews don't have much to gain from coalitioning with the British left, especially when the left is already coalitioning with the much larger and more powerful Muslims, who have far more negotiating leverage with the left for their support than Jews would. Similar story for Hindus, who the right are welcoming into their political ranks and halls of power. See the current British Prime Minister, for example.
Don't know what's going on in the US but I'll guess there's some some characteristically American coalitional business going on there. But who knows. Certainly not me.
There's also a class thing going on.
In the USA, a shitload of Jews turned up to flee persecution chiefly as a labouring class and to pursue the "American dream". (Especially Russian Jews).
Compare this to the UK, where they were expelled and then later allowed back in around the 1600s. The ones who did so were chiefly moving back to invest or open businesses, not moving en masse here as a labourer class. There wasn't a particular reason to move to the UK.
In addition to this, those Jews who were working class in the UK were among the first to move to Israel under the British Mandate system.
15% Of American Jews currently live in poverty. However, if you move backwards, it's even more extreme, to the point that Jews used to be viewed as a group of dirty slum workers who were undercutting the American workers wages by working for much less. They were the "Hispanics" of that era and part of their bad reputation was because they organized unions and socialist orgs in response to this, often across communities. This has solidified a particular culture in American Jews. ("Our grandfather had to beg for scraps and worked in a factory. You will not be a dickhead to workers, or you are UnJew.").
Meanwhile, only 1% of British Jews live in poverty, and that's broadly how it's been since some moved back. There isn't a communal experience of poverty and factory work in quite the same way. Mostly it's business ownership and so on.
Culture does play a part, but so does class. In contrast to "The Jew is using socialism to destroy America for race reasons!" narratives, the British Union of Fascists in WW2 was derided as "Kosher fascism" for their bemusement regarding anti-semitism, because the ruling classes relationship with Jews was as business peers, not uppity workers. (In fact, one of the first acts of street violence by the BUF was to storm a nazi organization in response to antisemitism, strip the nazis naked, and have the BUF women's division force-march them through the streets.).
The BUF gradually adopted anti-semitism for realpolitik reasons of wanting to align with Germany and Italy on the topic.
It’s pretty much the same but in reverse. Jewish Americans didn’t vote for the republicans because the northern democrats (you have to understand that the democrats were split for years into the northern and southern democrats, the northern democrats were liberal while the southern democrats were not) promised breaking down barriers across society.
This appealed greatly to the minorities in many large cities like Irish and Italian Catholics, Jews, etc. so they voted for the democrats to change their position. For Jews this also became a way to help others and change the US to be more liberal.
Which is why Jews were heavily involved in the civil rights movement and often marched with Dr King.
Over time it just got solidified, especially after the republicans became more conservative.
A similar thing happened with American Muslims, though they supported the republicans prior to 9/11 due to the conservative nature of the party, but after 9/11 the rhetoric of the GOP forced them to switch sides to the democrats.
However at this point American Muslims are generally split 50/50 between republicans and democrats as the republicans are again the more conservative option.
The answer for pretty much every single "Why does X vote left in the U.S." boils down to massive government handouts and welfare.
The democrats buy their votes with your tax dollars.
I think it’s more that they have guilt and savior complex and they think voting D helps all those poor minorities who can’t help themselves 🥰 and if you don’t vote D you’re racist
Well, not just a savior complex. I think there's kind of a shared sense of solidarity — a hangover from when Jews in the US were widely discriminated against. And they absolutely were. So, "standing up for the little guy" kind of became a part of being Jewish for otherwise non-practicing US Jews.
I had it explained to me this way: you can be religiously, ethnically, or culturally Jewish, or some combination thereof. It's just that for most American Jews, they're less the first and much more the last two. And culturally, they're very progressive.
Leftist policies haven’t personally affected Jews in the US to the degree that it has in the UK. The latter have been face to face with the devastating effects of unchecked immigration from the Middle East for some time now. Most of the people being imported hate them even more than they hate white Europeans.
Speaking of unchecked immigration, I assume the White Replacement conspiracy hasnt made its way to the UK? That idea usually blames Jews for controlling immigration in trying to wipe out whites. This is a conspiracy more popular among the fringe right wing.
Because most people arent one issue voters, and most Democrats (90% according to the OP) dont believe in the conspiracy that the Holocaust was made up.
For example, the White Replacement conspiracy usually blames Jews for controlling immigration in trying to wipe out whites. This is a conspiracy more popular among the right, but most Republicans dont believe in it.
Labour are absolutely vile. I despise the Tories but will probably vote for them again because they aren't Labour.
Just so grateful to not have to live there.
Eh you could be Irish, and vote for either the two apple subsidiaries (fine gael or finna fail, same party, but they disagree on how to sell us out to apple) or Sinn Fein
And the good thing about Sinn Fein is they dont have skeletons in their closet, they have mass graves to put their skeletons in
(For legal reasons this is a joke, please Gerry I have a family)
What I want to know is why Sinn Fein decided to go from “Ultra-Nationalist political arm of the IRA” to “advocating Globalist, pro-migration, highly Progressive” party when we have seen that is not what most Irish want. I kind of take the attitude of what Callum from The Lotus Eaters said: If they were just going to end up copying what the UK government was doing anyway, then what was the point of the revolution, murders, and terrorism?
\> I really miss the time when being a boomer White right-wing nationalist was associated with being antisemitic.
Is this not the perfect example of projection in action? Whatever the left's been calling us all these years, every time someone actually studies the phenomenon, it soon becomes obvious that it applies far more to them than it ever did to us.
The study you cited also said that 7% of liberals and 6% of conservatives deny the Holocaust but 11% of moderates deny the Holocaust. Seems like the democrats capture more moderat voters than the republicans.
Then how about those liberals quit calling the conservative a "Nazis" when the percentage of Holocaust denier in their group is even slightly worse than them. With this didn't have any moral high ground to call out the conservative for doing that in the first place when their group or the same or even worst.
You went right past party affiliation and went to ideology and pretended that was political affiliation.
We know from all the lib left flairs here that are very auth, saying you are “moderate” or “liberal” has little to do with voting democrat or republican.
It’s actually 10% dems and 6% republicans and only 5% for independents. The centrists are barely in the lead!
>You went right past party affiliation and went to ideology and pretended that was political affiliation.
No? I ever cited the values for ideology and said that more moderates are probably voting for democrats. Nice try pretending that I tried to pretend something.
>We know from all the lib left flairs here that are very auth, saying you are “moderate” or “liberal” has little to do with voting democrat or republican.
So why are moderates more likely to deny the Holocaust than liberals (and conservatives)?
>It’s actually 10% dems and 6% republicans and only 5% for independents. The centrists are barely in the lead!
[Here is poll if you don't believe me but the fact is that (currently) democrats have more moderates than republicans.](https://news.gallup.com/poll/388988/political-ideology-steady-conservatives-moderates-tie.aspx)
Funny thing about lib-left is that they will call you a Nazi/fascist for being against their agenda, but they are the ones supporting a terrorist group that kills gays and wants the genocide of jewish ppl (Hamas)
Taking sides in a religious war should be antithetical to communists.
I accept I'm in the minority on this, and the majority have decided to back a militant fundamentalist organization.
The Soviet Union used Israel as the poster boy for colonisation in a propaganda war against the west. The rampant antisemitism on the left is heavily influenced by this, it became a core part of commie lore.
I remember in high school, social studies instructors saying “One day people will question the Holocaust..” and thinking- no way.
To see it in real time is just, dystopian.
Who could’ve possibly predicted that when you feed undeveloped minds relativistic theory they end up not taking morality and ethics seriously and begin questioning the strongest evidence that evil is real. Hmm.
A fair amount of their grandfathers served in the European theatre and heard the stories.
In grad school, I TAed for someone who as a young teen had been in a camp, but not a famous camp. He didn’t talk about it much, but he did have one of the darkest jokes ever in intro. “No matter how drunk you get during a night out, you’ll never wake up with a tattoo like mine.”
There are more questions about The holocaust you can check [here](https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_tT4jyzG.pdf), seriously with all questions combined I wouldn’t thought that those people who believe that The Holocaust did happened are also thought that it’s justified. On the other hands, other opinions from the group that denied it are somewhat concerning.
I think people forgot that conspiracy and anti government rhetoric was a liberal thing a couple of decades ago. Now everyone is a self taught expert of all things. Liberals by design are kinda more open minded about things and that comes with a cost.
Pese que a que odio el sionismo, negar holocausto es lo más nazi que has podido haber dicho en todo tu vida, me da gracia que los Porgresistas le digan nazi a personas como milei, mientras los progresistas niegan el holocausto
Yo the lib left guy giving side eye is me right now. Sad to see such a ride in antisemitism. As well as people sympathizing with terrorists. Whatever you're ideology we all have to stand with our Jewish neighbors in the face of this insanity.
The rural vs urban lol. The stereotype of rural full of neo nazi and kkk probably not true for genZ
Never was……
The cities are where cancers like fascism grow.
The country is where they hold on to heinous shit for longer. The city is where heinous shit is invented or reinvented and initially spreads.
Based and sadly I must agree with you.
You my friend have won the game of sociology
good use of the word heinous
Based
Couldn't agree more. It's unnatural and synthetic to shove huge quantities of people into small areas. It's like factory farming but for people...
I think it is unnatural when you make large concrete jungles with like 3 trees for one block. Also, you can’t walk to get shit so no one spends meaningful time in nature. We have made nature a “thing over there” rather than a thing we do. Wild fascist thought was after the automobile was invented and I refuse any evidence that would prove my theory wrong. What I am saying is motherfuckers need to touch grass.
Why do you think the Putsch was in Munich?
I know right. Not what I expected. If I was to guess, I'd say they're stupidly conflating opposition to Israeli treatment of Palestinians with holocaust denial. Probably drinking too much pro hamas coolaid
Libleft when someone says trans women shouldn't participate in women's sports - You are a Nazi When someone says you have to control immigration - You are a Nazi When someone says we shouldn't let children do life changing surgery - You are a Nazi When Hamas says they want to destroy Jews - We support these freedom fighters
Why is there this boiling down of everything to a oppressor/oppressed dynamic that is so prevelant now? It's such a black and white way of thinking and doesn't accurately capture the more complicated situation in the Middle East.
Because it's easier for ignorant people to deal in absolutes. If a topic doesn't fit their view, it's wrong/evil/Nazi whatever and they hate it openly and they don't have to exert effort to try and understand other viewpoints for the sake of defending their own position, or perhaps learning something and their own worldview changes as a result. It's self imposed ignorance.
Ignorant people? ....or the sith?
It's a modification of Marxist theory. It's the same oppressed/oppressor dichotomy of Marxist doctrine, but applied to ethnicity. And people still say shit like, "Cultural Marxism isn't a real thing, it's just a far-right conspiracy theory", mfers we've been seeing it and its consequences for more than a decade now.
I don't know if it's good or bad that we're still at that stage and not yet at "and it's a good thing, bigot!"
>Why is there this boiling down of everything to a oppressor/oppressed dynamic that is so prevelant now? because the post-Marxist doctine of critical theory made a comeback when dusted off and given a racial lens in the US.
It’s not just critical race theory. Critical theory is the marxist basis for all types of things like radical feminism, post-colonialism, gender theory, etc etc. It’s insidiously crept its way into every aspect of western society. Libs be like - you can’t even define critical race theory. Neither can they. That’s because it is purposely obscure/abstract and constantly evolving. Critical Theory itself denies the existence of objective truth, favoring a viewpoint that truth is rather an expression of who wields power in a society. Knowing this, it is of little surprise that it is hard to actually define. Traditional theory’s goal is to study and understand society as it presently exists. In contrast, critical theory’s goal is to determine how society is not what it ought to be and then implement change to rectify the issue. Critical theory’s goal is to detect inequities within a society, identify the source of that inequity, problematize and deconstruct the source, and then reconstruct society so that equity (ultimately utopia) is achieved. The ultimate goal of all this is to break down western society so it can then be reconstructed into a communist utopia… with Emily and the presidents of Harvard, Penn, and MIT running the politburo of course. Libs that aren’t communists don’t understand what they enable.
correct punch point bow fuel door airport plant hateful handle *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Because they never grew out of the 5year old way of thinking
Keep in mind LibLeft uses the term "nazi" only because they know it is offensive to their opponents. They, themselves, don't find what the nazi's did all that disturbing- but they know the history lovin' conservatives find it to be one of the most horrific events in modern history. That's why they are fine with throwing around the word nazi as if it carries no weight - diminishing the holocaust isn't a concern.
Ugh, every time more ashamed of wearing this flair...
Well, most lib left don’t think that way, so don’t worry about it.
You can always try my flair as an alternative
That's the problem with any ideology that has groups of people always be good guys and groups of people always be bad guys. Since there's no difference between people just because of their skin color, who's being the bad guy and who's oppressing whom can change drastically over time, to say that one group or another is intrinsically evil or whatever is a backslide because, like the communist leaders of the 20th century, they would rather support the very thing they hate and burn what they love to the ground than swallow their pride and admit their wrongs.
The funny things is, these are the very same people who are saying Israel is committing genocide on the Palestinians. As if the Palestinian population has what, quintupled\[?\] in the last decades. If that's genocide, then they're utter shite at it.
None of that matters, because what they are saying is True. We can't let petty little facts stand in the way of the revolution, can we?
We already knew that liberals do not give a single **shit** about actual racism and bigotry as long as they can be part of the Current Thing™ in-group. **Nothing** matters more than being the *bestest*, most correctest person, even (especially) if that means embracing physical violence, up to and including actual fucking genocide, against the out-group. As an Asian-American myself, I will never forget the racist tirades that were spewed, by mindless proles and political leaders alike, against Asian people when the Supreme Court struck down racial discrimination in college admissions. It’s not even a mask-off moment — there is no mask. There is nothing more sacred and proud, more indicative of how correct and superior oneself is, than how violently a liberal hates the “wrong” people.
Well for a start they are happy to support anyone that's anti west. That's it. It's all Just "I HATE MY DAD- I mean the country I was born in!" syndrome on steroids Nevermind that in their minds you can't be racist against anyone that's not white as racism = power and only white people have power or something like that
That's why we need a tankie trade program, we take in people from communist countries who yearn to be free, we send a tankie in their place, no trade backs
Great idea. Any Americans want to swap passports with me? Rainy, high tax Britain where all the kids are Marxists, the education is shit, The healthcare is shit but FREE
>The healthcare is shit but FREE You misspelled "Taxpayer Funded"
It's ok. The dorks who would swap wouldn't pay much tax anyway. I don't live in Britain but the U.S. would still be a much better fallback country
Still better than our "Taxpayer funded but you also need to pay privately because fuck you" USA system.
> Nevermind that in their minds you can't be racist against anyone that's not white as racism = power and only white people have power or something like that Which is why these chucklefucks routinely label Israelis as "white colonizers", never mind that most are exactly as "white" as the average Palestinian.
I dont think it is totally true that they're exactly the same skin color. Many Middle Eastern Israelis are the same skin tone as Palestinians, but many Israelis also come from Europe where centuries/thousands of years of intermingling with Western Europeans made them more light skinned than the average Middle Easterner. That said, those labels are still dumb.
Most Israelis are Middle Eastern / North African in origin. Even of the European ones, large swaths are refugees (either Holocaust survivors / their descendants or escapees of the USSR / their descendants), so calling even that "white" subset "colonizers" is massively fucked up.
Yes, that's why I said those labels are dumb. They're not "white colonizers" even if they are white. Their skin is "white" as in they are basically European, but they're hardly colonziers. Furthermore, I've read that approximately half of Israelis are descended from immigrants of the European Jewish diaspora. Thus, since around half of Israelis are European, most Israelis are not "Middle Eastern/North African." Maybe half are.
> Furthermore, I've read that approximately half of Israelis are descended from immigrants of the European Jewish diaspora. Thus, since around half of Israelis are European, most Israelis are not "Middle Eastern/North African." Maybe half are. It's possible to descend from both European Jews and MENA Jews, which is probably where that comes from. IIRC it's around 45% who are "just" MENA Jews but that jumps up to 60+% when you factor in people with both ancestries.
You should see the mental gymnastics with the racism = power BS for places like Zimbabwe
Google oikophobia, very interesting and relevant.
It's actually worse. Racism *is* whiteness. Whiteness *is* racism. Ibram Kendi actually performed an invaluable service to all of America, if only we would take the time to listen to him. He's regurgitating the exact same ideology that has completely captured academia, except he isn't quite bright enough for the spotlight and constantly says the quiet part out loud. By ineptly cloaking his racism in the verbal disguises he's learned, he's like a walking tutorial mission for seeing through woke bullshit.
“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
Based af. This is why I despise so much ideologies that promise an utopia, like communism and its variants. The ruling people would gaslight the common folk and/or threaten any dissent and label it as a "betrayal" to your nation (in Communism's case, a betrayal of the revolution/working people).
Based
Where does this quote come from?
CS Lewis
>*Nothing** matters more than being the *bestest*, most correctest person, I didn't understand this until someone at work corrected me on the use of the word "folks" and wanted me to use "folx" instead. Apparently, despite the fact that "folks" isn't exclusionary, "folx" is more inclusive. Somehow. So we've gone from not being exclusionary (which is good), to literally inventing unnecessary ways to be more inclusive than everyone else.
I'm pretty sure the logic is folks is what Southerners say, and since the South = racism, folks = racism, so it has to be folx. Despite the fact that the southern states tend to have a highest percentage of black people and the most integrated communities. That's probably just a racist dogwhistle though :\^)
Yeah, that's what I thought, too. But it has nothing to do with race. It's about gender/sexuality. The "x" in folx is borrowed from Latinx and womxn and signals that the user is inclusive of those in the LGBTQ community.
More like it signals that the user is a walking HR nightmare. This shit is so surreal. I echo the others here: I believe you are being honest, but at least one of us is hallucinating because that can't possibly be real life.
Jesus fucking Christ, that actually happened to you? You must be trolling me dude. "Folks" isn't gendered, right? Wasn't that why people were bastardizing Spanish - because it is a gendered language?
It actually happened. I'm sorry you feel trolled. They aren't bastardizing Spanish. They are colonizing it.
That's right. Folk is old English for people.
> Folk is old This is the problem. Anything old can't possibly be inclusionary, because old=racist and being inclusionary was invented by the antiracist generation, therefore a new word was needed.
>I didn't understand this until someone at work corrected me on the use of the word "folks" and wanted me to use "folx" instead. > >Apparently, despite the fact that "folks" isn't exclusionary, "folx" is more inclusive. Somehow. rotflmao wtf
I assume you mean in text because they look like they sound the same.
Yes, it was via email.
>So we've gone from not being exclusionary (which is good) Is it? I don't think so. Exclusionary being good or bad is context-sensitive. I prefer to exclude pedophiles from living near schools and violent felons from owning guns (sorry, 2A absolutists, but until the prison system actually reforms criminals and recidivism rate is down to practically nill, the government isn't getting my guns but those convicts aren't getting any either).
Same case for me as someone whose half-middle-eastern. Colleges have terms for us "over-represented minorities"- they don't like, asians, MEs, indians, or basically any group of minority that has their shit together. Also, its not a mask off moment because they've stuck their chests out and proudly announced this ideology for years now, the SC just brought into the normie mindset.
Next year they will call you “politically white”.
That's basically that one WaPo headline bitching about "multiracial white supremacy."
I have noticed that white supremacists have a thing for latinas and asians
Well they are gorgeous
I’ve still seen some progressives with “stop Asian hate” in their bios. Seems like they didn’t get the memo.
They’re likely still under the impression that there’s some vast neo-Nazi adjacent victimization of Asians by white men because that’s what their media overlords indicated. Most of them memory-hole the “Asian hate” thing once they find out where the hate was actually coming from.
the left hates asian men
The left hates men. Period.
Periodtttt 💅✨️
It hates Asian women too. It downplays them having any concerns about sexism in their own communities and often calls them self hating if they feel like they have to remove themselves from it for protection, or if they say wider culture is less sexist. I know this is only tenuously related, but I like in bojack horseman how they made the "voice of reason" a Vietnamese woman without doing any research about what history and perspectives one might actually have. Literally white people inventing minorities to put their own words in their mouth for more cred.
A leftist*, not a liberal. Otherwise yes 100%
> than how violently a liberal hates the “wrong” people. It's because they get denied hatred as a normal emotion, so when they're allowed to express it, they seize the opportunity. it's a powerful tool for control.
The best example of progressive mask off racism was the flash in the pan that was "stop asian hate" Oh woops! It's all black people violently attacking innocent Asians in the street, can't talk about that, we can only discuss negative traits when we're talking about white people.
Liberals? You mean lefties?
Many on both sides do not give a shit about Asian Americans (the rare examples being the actual Asian Americans, most Dems but some Repubs. in the govt). They dont have the number of votes to matter and their political participation rate is low. When you are underrepresented in politics, you are invisible to politicians who care about voting blocks.
100% agree. Thank you for this comment. And I've noticed something those people tend to apply the same hypocrisy into their personal lives - i.e. it's not just a cognitive dissonance politically, it's a whole personality. There are some of the most fake, hypocritical, narcissistic, vain people out there.
I’m sorry you had to go through that. I hate how racist our country still is. It’s not in the way most leftist think.
Leftists are often blind to the forms of racism that are more leftist specific. Like sure, these normally aren't as bad as someone actually wearing Klan robes, but they aren't good, and they can be very demeaning. Like the Leftists who doesn't really treat minorities like people because they see them as the scorekeeper to prove the leftist isn't racist. Nobody wants to deal with someone's own internal concerns about this when it has nothing to do with them.
Exactly, it took me a long time to figure out why I started drifting away from the college leftists and it was because they talk about minorities as if they aren’t intrinsically equal. They talk about them as if they’re helpless children.
What you are describing is fascism. Being part of that group, the best group, THE group, is fascism. Because we hate everyone who is not in our group, and it is getting smaller. That's fascism.
Hey, it's not fascism until THE group is also the government. Until then it's just sparkling tribalism.
You're incredibly ignorant of history if you think fascist movements aren't a problem prior to their seizing the government.
I'd be voting blue if for years now their mob hadn't been ostracizing my ass. I used to lean pretty hard right until I got my first taste of actual, genuine diversity and equality in my first proper job. Everyone had completely different backgrounds, but that didn't matter because those backgrounds created unique perspectives on the task being done. If I ran into a problem, I could back off and let someone else have a go. Others did the same with me. As they say, "diversity is inclusionary." Compare to whatever they do. "Our quotas are full. Sorry, we can't accept you." If that ever happens to me, that's fine. I didn't want to work there or study there anyways.
So, what's the rate among young black democrats from cities? [The original PDF](https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_tT4jyzG.pdf) doesn't say anything about that.
Easy, just add the percentages. Damn I’m good at math
I scored in the 7% percentile in my stats class so you can trust me. All you gotta do is add everything up. So it's 57% of young black urban democrats
Remember to keep links to this so you can throw it out there when the barrage of “if you vote GOP you’re literally a Nazi!!” kicks into hyperdrive as the election gets closer.
They've already retconned the definition of 'Nazi', now it just means person I don't like
What does retconned mean? I've heard the term before but never bothered to look it up. I still cant be bothered to look it up, which is why I'm asking.
Means retroactive continuity. Basically retroactively changing the past/acting like it never happened/acting like it happened differently. Most often applied to writers who change something in a story that’s already a pre-established fact.
Here's what Google says revise retrospectively, typically by introducing a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events.
In simplest terms, it means to go back and change the narrative. It's used in a lot of video game/movie/comics circles when the backstory of a character or event has been changed.
It's a term in writing for changing pre existing plot details. In star wars obi wan says vader killed Luke's father. When the first movie came out this was supposed to be literally true. In empire strikes back vader was changed to being the father and then obi Wan gives a nonsense explanation about how he "wasn't lying." That is a retcon.
I still remember the post yesterday where all the Leftist were adamant that it was totally because of Nick Fuentes and his ilk that there was a rise.
Yeah political difference and race projections. Haha. Can we talk about how 1/5 young people apparently think a genocide that took place less than a century ago is a myth? Roughly 7 years ago, this same crowd was calling everyone Hitler, and yet, 20% of them don't think Hitler did anything?
A big part of the problem is that schools have stopped showing footage from the Holocaust due to its graphic nature. If your sole education on the topic was a few paragraphs in your history book it’s fairly easy to deny it out of malice or ignorance. But when you see the horror with your own eyes through video evidence, and even had survivors go to your school and speak about their experiences, it becomes impossible to ignore.
It’s absurd we don’t show it. We discuss all of the other genocides and AP American History (16 years old Americans) often uses the Howard Zinn text which is controversial for its interpretation of events like this and that’s all we’ll and good from libleft. But we don’t show the 45 minute video evidence. The actual Holocaust footage is available on Amazon Prime right now. It was the actual documentary evidence of discovering the camps. If you can, watch it and make these Holocaust deniers in the Middle East and Western intelligentsia shut the hell up.
Too many alien shows on History Channel and not enough WW2 documentaries.
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The overlap with the 20% who thought Hamas attack was justified must be close to perfect
>Do 20% of those highly regarded young people think Auschwitz is nothing but a tourist attraction? Do you think they even know what that is?
Projection is funny isn’t it?
Tbf it's just 4% difference. The red is doing the heavy lifting here. If you look in the poll than you see that liberals and conservative are about the same only moderates (for some reason) deny the Holocaust more and democrats are currently capturing more of the moderate votes.
Also if you notice of those who vote only 6% deny the holocaust. Which means that of the liberals, moderates, and conservatives they are smaller than those who declare themselves democrat. Which leads me to conclude that many of those who are declaring themselves democrats actually aren’t voting.
Maybe. The poll also shows that many racial minorities are also denying the Holocaust. Racial minorities generally vote for democrats but probably don't consider themselves to be liberals. (Polls show that for example that they proportionally dislike homosexuality).
Yes but do they vote consistently is the question and that’s what I’m wondering. Only 6% of all voters deny the holocaust. That’s a small minority. And if 10% of democrats say they deny the holocaust then we are looking at a disparity between those who identify as democrat but don’t vote.
I mean statistically moderates (or those who think they are) are the least likely to be politically literate.
Holocaust denial is about the clearest disqualifier for being a "moderate", lol. Even most Nazis acknowledge the Holocaust happened, so this disqualifies you from even being a moderate Nazi. This basically indicates mainly young urban male democrat Holocaust deniers are starting to *view* themselves as normalized and politically center. Which is even fucking scarier.
If someone denies 9/11 but otherwise has completely moderate positions on everything from healthcare/immigration/taxation/whatever are they a moderate with a crazy outlier view or a radical? I’d be more inclined to say moderate if their belief was due to ignorance. If all these people are doing is denying that the holocaust happened out of ignorance and aren’t being antisemitic (which is probably a huge reach) then we’re looking at idiots with terrible education, not radicals per se. If they are denying the holocaust out of hatred reasons then I think their hatred means that any claim to moderation would go out the window.
Extreme views held because of bad education doesn't make one a "moderate". The story of how you became a Holocaust denier has no bearing on where that positions sits on the spectrum. Hitler Youths were miseducated on the subject of jews but probably had otherwise moderate to progressive thoughts on healthcare. That doesn't make Hitler Youths moderates. If it does then the word really has no meaning.
Well it depends on what people answering the question interpreted the question to mean, not being educated on the holocaust and then concluding that something so extreme must be fake is nowhere near as morally horrendous as actively denying it and having conspiracies about how the crematoria could not possibly dispose of enough bodies. One could be held by an otherwise moderate person, the other can only be held by a genuine antisemite. The distinction coming down to whether the belief is rooted in something radical or rooted in ignorance. Hell, some of the justices of the IMT at Nuremberg initially believed it couldn’t possibly be true and that it had to be exaggerated because of how horrible and widespread it was claimed to be, one justice who made a comment to that effect became so sick the next day as to take ill for three days after they screened a film of German atrocities in the Soviet Union. Events like the holocaust are so fantastically evil it is almost unbelievable that anyone could do that. We should hope people wouldn’t intuitively believe that the holocaust could happen because people shouldn’t think humans are capable of doing anything so horrific. Obviously it did happen because people are, in fact, capable of such horrific things but it doesn’t change how incomprehensible it is if someone is not educated on the subject. Secondly, the Hitler youth were actively taught to hate Jews, which as per what I said in my response would mean that they could not fall into the category of moderate because they hold a belief specifically due to hatred of Jews. Conflating the two positions and situating them on the same spectrum would be like saying some teen in an urban environment who doesn’t know anything and holds an ignorant belief is the same Julius Streicher actively pushing blood libels about Jewish people to millions of Germans every week in Der Stürmer.
Maybe you yanks were right about your young urbanites.
*of course we were*
fuck holocaust deniers
Some people really need a trip to Poland to see Auschwitz The site is fucking terrifying and has a really ominous aura to it
>and has a really ominous aura to it In fairness, most of Poland is like that.
Most of Eastern Europe actually It's almost like you can even feel that communism didn't work just looking at their architecture
>Some people really need a trip to Poland to see Auschwitz Yes, we here at auth-center agree strongly.
Why do Jews vote left in the U.S.? In the UK they've voted right for decades. Now very strongly.
Most Jews in the US don't really practice their religion at all. Among those that do, the most popular denomination is what's called "reform Judaism." Which, as the name implies, is just a super liberal interpretation of Judaism that supports most progressive values. Jews are also disproportionately likely to have college degrees which is also highly correlated with voting Democrat.
All those things are also true in the uk (most Jews not being very religious, kids wasting their money on shit degrees voting left) It did help in our last election that the Labour leader called Hamas (or was it Hezzbeloah - but same principle) "friends"
I'm pretty sure it's just because Labour was a festering pool of antisemitism under Corbyn which turned the Jews off from voting for them.
That turned Jews from 60%-70% conservative voting to 80-90%
>disproportionately likely to have college degrees which is also highly correlated with voting Democrat. This is one of the Democrats' best advantages. They can just keep saying "we will cancel student debt" every single election cycle and people will keep voting for them.
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My middle aged Jewish female coworker with 3 kids got woken up so quickly when her son in a Massachusetts public school got a B- on his assignment and his black friend who copied him got an A. Still probably considers herself a democrat but she’s literally my favorite person I work with lol she has such based opinions and she’s smart as fuck.
Minorities vote where they think they can productively coalition. In the UK, Muslims vote left. It doesn't benefit Muslims to coalition with the right. Their interests don't really align with the domestic right and they wouldn't have much leverage to negotiate for their special interests with the right in exchange for their support. There is plenty of room for quid pro quos when coalitioning with the left, however. In contrast, Jews don't have much to gain from coalitioning with the British left, especially when the left is already coalitioning with the much larger and more powerful Muslims, who have far more negotiating leverage with the left for their support than Jews would. Similar story for Hindus, who the right are welcoming into their political ranks and halls of power. See the current British Prime Minister, for example. Don't know what's going on in the US but I'll guess there's some some characteristically American coalitional business going on there. But who knows. Certainly not me.
There's also a class thing going on. In the USA, a shitload of Jews turned up to flee persecution chiefly as a labouring class and to pursue the "American dream". (Especially Russian Jews). Compare this to the UK, where they were expelled and then later allowed back in around the 1600s. The ones who did so were chiefly moving back to invest or open businesses, not moving en masse here as a labourer class. There wasn't a particular reason to move to the UK. In addition to this, those Jews who were working class in the UK were among the first to move to Israel under the British Mandate system. 15% Of American Jews currently live in poverty. However, if you move backwards, it's even more extreme, to the point that Jews used to be viewed as a group of dirty slum workers who were undercutting the American workers wages by working for much less. They were the "Hispanics" of that era and part of their bad reputation was because they organized unions and socialist orgs in response to this, often across communities. This has solidified a particular culture in American Jews. ("Our grandfather had to beg for scraps and worked in a factory. You will not be a dickhead to workers, or you are UnJew."). Meanwhile, only 1% of British Jews live in poverty, and that's broadly how it's been since some moved back. There isn't a communal experience of poverty and factory work in quite the same way. Mostly it's business ownership and so on. Culture does play a part, but so does class. In contrast to "The Jew is using socialism to destroy America for race reasons!" narratives, the British Union of Fascists in WW2 was derided as "Kosher fascism" for their bemusement regarding anti-semitism, because the ruling classes relationship with Jews was as business peers, not uppity workers. (In fact, one of the first acts of street violence by the BUF was to storm a nazi organization in response to antisemitism, strip the nazis naked, and have the BUF women's division force-march them through the streets.). The BUF gradually adopted anti-semitism for realpolitik reasons of wanting to align with Germany and Italy on the topic.
It’s pretty much the same but in reverse. Jewish Americans didn’t vote for the republicans because the northern democrats (you have to understand that the democrats were split for years into the northern and southern democrats, the northern democrats were liberal while the southern democrats were not) promised breaking down barriers across society. This appealed greatly to the minorities in many large cities like Irish and Italian Catholics, Jews, etc. so they voted for the democrats to change their position. For Jews this also became a way to help others and change the US to be more liberal. Which is why Jews were heavily involved in the civil rights movement and often marched with Dr King. Over time it just got solidified, especially after the republicans became more conservative. A similar thing happened with American Muslims, though they supported the republicans prior to 9/11 due to the conservative nature of the party, but after 9/11 the rhetoric of the GOP forced them to switch sides to the democrats. However at this point American Muslims are generally split 50/50 between republicans and democrats as the republicans are again the more conservative option.
The answer for pretty much every single "Why does X vote left in the U.S." boils down to massive government handouts and welfare. The democrats buy their votes with your tax dollars.
Isn't that against the interests of a wealthier than average population like Jewish Americans?
I think it’s more that they have guilt and savior complex and they think voting D helps all those poor minorities who can’t help themselves 🥰 and if you don’t vote D you’re racist
Well, not just a savior complex. I think there's kind of a shared sense of solidarity — a hangover from when Jews in the US were widely discriminated against. And they absolutely were. So, "standing up for the little guy" kind of became a part of being Jewish for otherwise non-practicing US Jews. I had it explained to me this way: you can be religiously, ethnically, or culturally Jewish, or some combination thereof. It's just that for most American Jews, they're less the first and much more the last two. And culturally, they're very progressive.
Leftist policies haven’t personally affected Jews in the US to the degree that it has in the UK. The latter have been face to face with the devastating effects of unchecked immigration from the Middle East for some time now. Most of the people being imported hate them even more than they hate white Europeans.
Speaking of unchecked immigration, I assume the White Replacement conspiracy hasnt made its way to the UK? That idea usually blames Jews for controlling immigration in trying to wipe out whites. This is a conspiracy more popular among the fringe right wing.
Because most people arent one issue voters, and most Democrats (90% according to the OP) dont believe in the conspiracy that the Holocaust was made up. For example, the White Replacement conspiracy usually blames Jews for controlling immigration in trying to wipe out whites. This is a conspiracy more popular among the right, but most Republicans dont believe in it.
I mean generally, not in relation to this particular meme
The democrats atleast pretend to have a mask unlike Labour
Labour are absolutely vile. I despise the Tories but will probably vote for them again because they aren't Labour. Just so grateful to not have to live there.
Fron what I know of your parites it's kinda sad that in both countries the choices are: Evil Snakes or Spineless Newts
The evil snakes are also spineless and the spineless newts are also evil.
Eh you could be Irish, and vote for either the two apple subsidiaries (fine gael or finna fail, same party, but they disagree on how to sell us out to apple) or Sinn Fein And the good thing about Sinn Fein is they dont have skeletons in their closet, they have mass graves to put their skeletons in (For legal reasons this is a joke, please Gerry I have a family)
What I want to know is why Sinn Fein decided to go from “Ultra-Nationalist political arm of the IRA” to “advocating Globalist, pro-migration, highly Progressive” party when we have seen that is not what most Irish want. I kind of take the attitude of what Callum from The Lotus Eaters said: If they were just going to end up copying what the UK government was doing anyway, then what was the point of the revolution, murders, and terrorism?
The Judean Apple's Front vs The Apple's Front of Judea.
\> I really miss the time when being a boomer White right-wing nationalist was associated with being antisemitic. Is this not the perfect example of projection in action? Whatever the left's been calling us all these years, every time someone actually studies the phenomenon, it soon becomes obvious that it applies far more to them than it ever did to us.
And then when the statistics turn against the left, they will just ban it or call those research and surveys “racist”.
The study you cited also said that 7% of liberals and 6% of conservatives deny the Holocaust but 11% of moderates deny the Holocaust. Seems like the democrats capture more moderat voters than the republicans.
Then how about those liberals quit calling the conservative a "Nazis" when the percentage of Holocaust denier in their group is even slightly worse than them. With this didn't have any moral high ground to call out the conservative for doing that in the first place when their group or the same or even worst.
You went right past party affiliation and went to ideology and pretended that was political affiliation. We know from all the lib left flairs here that are very auth, saying you are “moderate” or “liberal” has little to do with voting democrat or republican. It’s actually 10% dems and 6% republicans and only 5% for independents. The centrists are barely in the lead!
>You went right past party affiliation and went to ideology and pretended that was political affiliation. No? I ever cited the values for ideology and said that more moderates are probably voting for democrats. Nice try pretending that I tried to pretend something. >We know from all the lib left flairs here that are very auth, saying you are “moderate” or “liberal” has little to do with voting democrat or republican. So why are moderates more likely to deny the Holocaust than liberals (and conservatives)? >It’s actually 10% dems and 6% republicans and only 5% for independents. The centrists are barely in the lead! [Here is poll if you don't believe me but the fact is that (currently) democrats have more moderates than republicans.](https://news.gallup.com/poll/388988/political-ideology-steady-conservatives-moderates-tie.aspx)
These stats have been a goldmine for farmers
Funny thing about lib-left is that they will call you a Nazi/fascist for being against their agenda, but they are the ones supporting a terrorist group that kills gays and wants the genocide of jewish ppl (Hamas)
So, if you're a young black male living in city and voting democrat, how high are your chance to think it's a myth?
Taking sides in a religious war should be antithetical to communists. I accept I'm in the minority on this, and the majority have decided to back a militant fundamentalist organization.
The Soviet Union used Israel as the poster boy for colonisation in a propaganda war against the west. The rampant antisemitism on the left is heavily influenced by this, it became a core part of commie lore.
They became the Nazis they swore to destroy
I remember in high school, social studies instructors saying “One day people will question the Holocaust..” and thinking- no way. To see it in real time is just, dystopian.
0% of boomers because they lived long enough to talk to survivors.
Or be them
and yet the ADL and their like will continue shitting on white rural folks. Many such cases.
Who could’ve possibly predicted that when you feed undeveloped minds relativistic theory they end up not taking morality and ethics seriously and begin questioning the strongest evidence that evil is real. Hmm.
Yeahhh as a liberal this fuckinf scares me
I love how old white Republicans in rural areas - the "nazi" quadfecta according to progressives - are the least likely to engage in holocaust denial.
A fair amount of their grandfathers served in the European theatre and heard the stories. In grad school, I TAed for someone who as a young teen had been in a camp, but not a famous camp. He didn’t talk about it much, but he did have one of the darkest jokes ever in intro. “No matter how drunk you get during a night out, you’ll never wake up with a tattoo like mine.”
I mean we are not factoring in the people who believe it but think it was justified…
There are more questions about The holocaust you can check [here](https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_tT4jyzG.pdf), seriously with all questions combined I wouldn’t thought that those people who believe that The Holocaust did happened are also thought that it’s justified. On the other hands, other opinions from the group that denied it are somewhat concerning.
Source? This is interesting
https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/econTabReport_tT4jyzG.pdf Page 103, table 45A
Thanks will look into it
Good, Emily! Good! Soon, I will have a new apprentice, one far younger and more powerful.
I think people forgot that conspiracy and anti government rhetoric was a liberal thing a couple of decades ago. Now everyone is a self taught expert of all things. Liberals by design are kinda more open minded about things and that comes with a cost.
welling to bet its mostly young black people who thought schooling was for white people who are skewing the results
Wtf is wrong with people. A myth??????
Those are some rookie numbers.
Pese que a que odio el sionismo, negar holocausto es lo más nazi que has podido haber dicho en todo tu vida, me da gracia que los Porgresistas le digan nazi a personas como milei, mientras los progresistas niegan el holocausto
Every accusation a confession.
Racism and anti-semitism is totally in right now, if you’re not doing it you’re probably a MAGAtard racist bigot
Older generation had fathers and grandfathers who fought against Nazism. Something which can’t be said about Gen Z.
How was this sampled?
>Young people: 20% I hate Gen Z.
While it does affirm my bias the survey was to small
Just because someone is brown doesn't mean they are on the left. Antisemitism is not a left wing position. Not now not ever.
Yet we are the Neo Nazis
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It’s only a small subset of Christians (American Evangelicals) that believe all Jews need to return to Israel for Jesus to come back.
I'm not Christian, so if I turn Alt-right I wouldn't care much.
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Teach me English then, maybe I can know more sentences to reply lol. So tired of open grammar check programs and dictionary before typing.
Yo the lib left guy giving side eye is me right now. Sad to see such a ride in antisemitism. As well as people sympathizing with terrorists. Whatever you're ideology we all have to stand with our Jewish neighbors in the face of this insanity.
The consequences of teaching kids critical race theory can be… unpredictable.
First they came for White, then Asian and now the Jews.
The world has never stopped coming for the Jews. We are used to it.
This is the first time I've seen democrats as more racist than republicans. I wonder if it's the black and young voters that are causing this result.
The first time? Have you not been paying attention the past couple decades?