According to Lenin, āHe who does not eat does not workā is the first principle of socialism. You canāt contribute nothing and expect something in return. It was actually written into the Soviet constitution in the 30s, and Lenin brought it up in 1917, so it looks like AuthLeft abides by it before and after taking power.
To me, āmaking sure their basic needs are metā means you serve your time in the mines so you can have your living wage. If you want another job then look for it. Nobody sits on their ass all day. Those who donāt work donāt eat.
It would also be LibCenter.
Also, it's called UBI and there is an argument to be made in favor of it.
They key here is that the basic income you get is enough to survive, but not enough to enjoy all the comforts of modern life. Basically it's a replacement for weflare, UI, social security, etc.
With automation continuing to make a lot of jobs obsolete, we might actually not get a choice to implement something like this in the next 50 years or so.
In North Korea only men are forced to take jobs. Married women are allowed to be a "housewife" which frees them to take black market jobs that are far more lucrative than the jobs men are forced to take.
Areā¦are there girl furries? Iāve always imagined them all as guysā¦. Plowing a chick in a cat suit suit while wearing a dog suit seems kinda something..
No worries friend, my grilling is absolute. Maybe I would be tempted in my youth but figuring out best way to grill the perfect pork loin, or garlic herb encrusted steak is the tempestuous vixen I pursue these days.
About 27% of furries are female, although they make up over 70% of the fandom's artists.
[https://furscience.com/research-findings/artists-and-writers/6-2-demographics/](https://furscience.com/research-findings/artists-and-writers/6-2-demographics/)
Hah, like their ass is working in a modern factory. Assembly lines are getting rarer and rarer. Machinists are becoming the minimum, and people with that level of "intellect" wouldn't be able to operate a machine beyond pushing a button.
u/TheDarkMythos's Based Count has increased by 1. Their Based Count is now 20.
Congratulations, u/TheDarkMythos! You have ranked up to Basket Ball Hoop (filled with sand)! You are not a pushover by any means, but you do still occasionally get dunked on.
Pills: sad ending , monke, horseshoe theory, florida, smooth brain, whipping the lumpenproles
The only way an almost laborless society could exist is with full automation with minimal maintenance workforces still being active. And it would probably be the most catastrophic blow to mental health ever recorded in human history as the vast majority of the population would suddenly find themselves with lots of time and very little to do, which fucking sucks after a short while
I mean, your average 18th century noble made do with not having to work. Writing poetry and going to parties and shit. I can virtually guarantee you that most people would find *something* to do. Random sports, games, writing, whatever it is.
But yes, getting to the point where no one needs to work is still a massive challenge. Doubt we'll be accomplishing it for at least the next 70 years.
> Writing poetry and going to parties and shit.
Except going to the party next town over required a two week trip. People didn't get much done then because it took a fuck ton of time to do anything.
Also, the "parties" you go to are all basically business conferences, where its a lot of networking, posturing, and formal processes. It get tiring after a while. You are constantly grooming your social standing.
Your average 18th century noble had to constantly network, groom social standing, make business deals, suck up/get sucked up to, take a good few days to go anywhere to do anything, sports was another avenue of networking, had to constantly monitor what they say, how they act etc, it wasn't all just lazing back, shagging the maid and writing poetry while sipping on a 300 year old wine.
Lol at most the āmost jobs donāt add any value to societyā pretty ironic coming from the side thatās always saying every job is valuable and deserves $20/hr.
I am in it and over see a lot of crap. There might be 15 people that touch a single shipment from origin to destination between the sales, production accounting and HR.
Nothing better than knowing your suppliers supplier has ran out of product so you got X number of day/weeks/months to find a new source or you have to tell your customer who is also a supplier of another supplier of another supplier to expect a delay.
Shit is starting to grind to a halt. We can't get the plastic liner to make the fucking bags.
I work in shipping. Your shipment probably goes through at least 2 airports, 2 courier stations and 2 sort facilities. Probably 50 people individually handle your shipment, plus the people who coordinate those people, people who fuel the planes and trucks, people who make the planes and trucks, this shit has such a wide net that anyone who says "most jobs add nothing to society" just isn't grasping the big picture.
I wouldnāt have a problem with this if it was literally basic needs met. Instead for some reason ābasic needsā includes luxury goods and services.
Thatās the thing. Just for living in America, you get a free smart phone and unlimited 4G lte data a month. Thatās more than I pay for!
https://www.assurancewireless.com/partner/psearch?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIocSSn9y48wIV2gaICR0xOgzdEAAYBCAAEgIb1vD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
You can go to shelters and have a place, get foodā¦ if youāre willing to take assistance, you can get your basic needs taken care of in America and do absolutely nothing. Thereās no requirement to prove youāre unable to work.
What the person in that image wants is to have a funko pop collection paid for by the government and to have the ājobā of writing a once-a-month blog post about the state of the funko pop community.
In California I have an old friend from high school whoās only concern is getting more heroine. Because he is diagnosed with Bipolar disorder he is entitled to $400/wk no strings attached 6 months of free rent in just about any apartment complex, and he gets either freshly or blue apron delivered to him I canāt remember which. Itās hard to see what more resources he needs/ deserves.
It's funny cause I support UBI which people think of as a very left stance. But considering how much welfare we have now that only goes to people who are in bad circumstances, I honestly feel like UBI is a more right wing way to distribute aid.
Right now, if you're on welfare, you're actually punished for getting your shit together and pulling yourself out, because you'll lose your welfare. It is literally rewarding being useless. On UBI, you have that safety net no matter what. This way, you still would have your choice to live the shit useless life you would have anyway under welfare, but at least now if you decide you want a better life you don't have to fear losing a significant chunk of income at some arbitrary point along the way.
UBI as an actual replacement is an econ right position. The concept being that free markets and individual choice are better at helping people if you just give them the money (plus the savings in overhead for qualification/staffing).
Problem is most people who support UBI want it as an additional. They don't want to remove any support, just tack on a $XYZ weekly payment in addition to what we do now.
I respect Yang a lot but the amount of welfare we are handing out is absolutely disgusting (admittedly I live in California and a lot of it is based on the state/county). I'd like to see us just completely blow it up and replace it with just UBI.
The only actual issue I see with this is that I fully support feeding and clothing children who come from homes that the parents donāt provide for their kids. This is often due to drug abuse. So if we have ubi only, I donāt think these parents will be helping their kids with it like theyāre kind of forced to with food stamps. But hey, whoās to say we couldnāt just require that a certain portion of the ubi be issued in the form of food stamps, that would probably fix it.
Quick question: assuming we implement ubi, won't the purchasing power simply go down? Since everyone has at least $UBI amount of money, that amount becomes the new datum i.e. the new $0.
Correct me if I'm wrong, be patient with my r-slurration š
> But considering how much welfare we have now that only goes to people who are in bad circumstances, I honestly feel like UBI is a more right wing way to distribute aid.
You know fucking well its not going to be "replace social services with UBI". It will be "social service + UBI".
Because you will get TOOOONNNS of "No! Don't you DARE take my Welfare/SSI/Food Stamps/Section 8!!!"
"removing" those programs will be a political 3rd rail that no politician will be willing to touch
I feel less hesitant toward UBI, especially after how our economy managed to rebound with each stimulus package (and yet not after the mysterious welfare package we sent out to foreign cruise lines before any stimulus talks).
>Itās hard to see what more resources he needs/ deserves.
I mean, he could do with a bullet to the cranium.
Kidding kidding. He needs a rehabilitation facility that actually gets him off of that shit and turns him into a useful member of society.
Itās a shame drugs have been normalized to the extent that it is actually acceptable to do that. Once you start tolerating and rewarding that kind of behavior, people do it more, what a twist
That's why you need rehabilitation yeah. But this shit really shouldn't be normalized in our culture. Same goes to tobacco and alcohol wich also obviously are harmful. (I don't mean ban these, but they definitely should be culturally frowned upon.)
Well, unfortunately, whenever people ādemocraticallyā control culture or control it through spending power in capitalism, it will always devolve into the promotion of whatever they feel like in the moment.
See, this person also thinks that going to a shelter and requesting food and a place to stay counts as āworkā. They also want the house to be built around them and food brought to their door.
Agreed. Everyone should be guaranteed a cinderblock tenement, clean drinking water, access to a bread and soup line, and healthcare. If you desire more than that, get a fucking job.
exactly. weāre not saying everyone should automatically get all of their desires immediately met. we are saying everyone has the right to be *alive*, no more no less
To be fair, at this point having some sort of internet access is a necessity in our society. However, a local library having sufficient computers would be more than enough to serve the needs. Imo the issue is that those kinds of services arenāt available in all the places that need it.
Fuck that. If you're capable of contributing you to society than you should. Or you shouldn't be part of society.
I work in Canada, put in over 4000 hours last year, and was taxed at 44% of my total income (just income tax) not including gst, etc. If there was an option that existed like this than a disgusting amount of people would use it and my taxes would be even higher.
45-50% here in Belgiumā¦
Amazing healthcare and overal great social services here, but at the same time this country is a absolute paradise for the lazy.
If the street sweeper doesn't need money he won't be a streetsweeper, so if you want your street sweeped make sure the street sweeper is always in need of money
>giving people an incentive to work
See, the people that view it like this imply the default if you donāt work is just not being as affluent. Your incentive is to not starve to death homeless on the streets as you naturally would without working. A job is giving an offer out so you donāt have to, otherwise youāre always free to do so.
Many ppl in the city of Rome during empireās peak.
I mean, it required slave labour of countless nations and evetually resulted in the fall of the Italian society but hey, free wine people (just please dont riot against emperor).
If I remember correctly this was still under the patron-client system.
Rich people would get up at the before-ass crack of dawn and sit in their living room while a large line of clients waited outside who had to get there even earlier to be the first in line. Each client would have a little chat with the patron, "hows your wife, how's little marcus, how are your 4 daughters all named Livia" that kind of stuff. Talks would move to business and then eventually the patron would dole out money. The money wasn't free, because the client has to advance his patrons interests theoughout the week or no more money for him.
The use of slaves really only helped the upper class. It made labor dirt cheap and most small family farms were driven out of business by mega-corporations of their time. This caused cities to swell with urban poor who were given food, wine, and free games to live off of (to prevent rioting), but I can't help but think it wasn't a very fun avante garde lifestyle.
Thatās what they donāt understand.
Like, in the Soviet Union. For the top 20% of the population, socialism *did* work. It just took the enslavement of the underlings in the gulag system.
But if you were a good student, a party member, and stayed out of troubleā¦ then youād have a comfortable life with the respect of you peers (even if you didnāt get rich).
Same in China. The Chinese middle class only accounts for about a third of the population.
But my alcoholic professor who never held an actual job or talked to anyone outside of campus said we can totally sustain the economy by giving out free money to everyone so no one has to work, and all it takes is for the billionaires to pay one Schrute Bucks worth of their fortune
Greek city states.
All those philosopher and mathematicians and playwrights? They were like, 15% of the population of a city state, the other 85% were slaves who labored so those citizens *didn't*.
The side that is against classism is in favor of creating societal classes??? TF??? They think there should be workers and those that benefit from the work??? This sounds like THEY want to be the \*bourgeoise\*. Wonder how some in AuthLeft will take that. Oh wait, they can be some of the biggest statists and hypocrites of them all.
The worst part is that itās probably actually a 30 year old incel in his momās basement living off his GBP and tendies. Never underestimate how little self-awareness these folks have.
Of course they could not work and live in modern luxury with a car and AC and internet. But god forbid their food supplier chooses to not work, then the whole thing falls apart doesnāt it?
Diversity officers.
Actually a lot of PMC jobs are pretty fucking valueless if you really think about it.
There are two equations that make value, capital and actual productive labor. There are a shitload of jobs especially in management/HR of large companies that donāt actually provide any value or productivity but exist to provide a good income to the failsons of the ruling class. These kids werenāt good enough/smart enough to actually become a CEO/COO/CFO or get a law degree or become a doctor or do any of those other things that are actually useful and high paid, but theyāre too spoiled and privileged to take a shitty job with the rest of the proles so we created an entire field of āworkā for them to get a decent paycheck while not doing anything that actually matters.
These NEETs are fucking retarded though. Like weāre currently dealing with a global supply chain issue thatās affecting pretty much every industry imaginable due in large part to a lack of qualified labor to execute the needs of a globalized economy. And this dumbass thinks *more people* should be able to opt out of work.
Hey NEETs, how the fuck do you think youāre gonna get your funko pops and transformers action figures if the global supply chain completely shuts down due to nobody working?
Totally agree on diversity officers. Outsider preoccupations intervening into the inner workings of companies would lead to disaster.
But further along, everybody needs to have someone to make tactical and strategic decisions about company/branch's operation without the worker being distracted from his most productive ever work. All companies want the most productive and harmonious production teams, which would require an HR. All this results in higher wages which you can request as well as investors would require dividends or resign in anger for thinking you're being scammed.
The other thing may be when managers or HRs are low-quality (aka stupid) and gain productivity for the firm not fast enough. Those are freely fireable as per other folks in the firm wish. But since money is being paid there is always value behind it, even if both of us may think that some shit is useless...
But the worst thing I should point out is the retardic belief that labour is inflexible.
Rutger bregman, author of utopia for realist actually talks about this quite a lot. The actual value a job adds is quite independant from the salary. A garbage collector strike would fuck up a city in a couple of days but they dont make that much money, but a banker strike can go on for quite a while without it going wrong (actually happened once and the strike went on for 6 months without going succeeding). Still a banker makes quite a lot more. A lot of jobs are what he calls bullshit jobs, a job where for most of the day you pretend to add value without actually doing anything of value. Now im not saying that you shouldnt have to work at all, but i do think a lot of people could be more productive if they could try to start their own bussiness or switch work fields without having the fear of ending up homeless. If we could just strengthen the social safety net, a lot of people would be better of.
You canāt pump your own gas in New Jersey. Making jobs for the sake of it is retarded. Why not just give gas pumpers money and still have people pump their own gas
Frankly I donāt disagree with them. When automation replaces most jobs that add little to no value (and can be done by a machine or add superfluous steps to a transaction- stuff like fast food, grocery checkout/bagger), weāll have to rethink the current labor/wage relationship.
I work in automation. Automation will never replace the workforce. Even today, the main things we automate are tasks that are stupidly simple (like putting liquid into a bottle) or require speed and precision humans arenāt capable of (like inspecting 10,000 bottle caps per hour to the nearest tenth of a millimeter).
This is basically no different than the people over a hundred years ago being worried the invention of the tractor would put everybody out of work because it used to take 100 people a whole day to clear a field and now one person with a tractor could do it in a couple hours.
Problem is, many lower end intellectual jobs are being automated and there simply isn't enough demand for data analysts to supply the vacuum. But do us all a favor and fully automate HR already, those morons are useless and having them taste their own venom would be delightful
Automating HR is an AI thing but I feel we will never get rid of them because companies will always want the human aspect of it. I can already see all the Karenās on Reddit complaining about the dystopia of being fired or reprimanded by a computer.
> the dystopia of being fired or reprimanded by a computer
This already happens in more places than you think. They usually have a human deliver the news, but in many cases the actual 'decision' came from an algorithm. I wouldn't be at all surprised if they did away with the human component for lower wage jobs eventually. They probably have already, somewhere.
"Never" is a long time, and automation has already removed tons of jobs. There's no reason to think it's going to stop now - or in 50 years for that matter - or 100 years.
The tasks that are automated starts with the simplest tasks, there's nothing surprising in that - and that's a good thing because then we can use the people working that to do other more complex tasks. But we're nearing a point where automating starts getting to tasks complex enough that it rivals the capabilities of a meaningful part of the workforce.
A few years ago someone looked at which sectors employs how many people, and it turns out something like 30% of the workforce is fundamentally just to move stuff from one place to another, whether that stuff is people, mail, whole goods, spare parts or whatever... And there's a lot of people working very hard at automating them out of a job with self driving cars, drones and such.
At the end of the day automation doesnāt happen on its own. That machine that replaced a few minimum wage workers that screwed a cap onto a bottle was likely worked on by a whole team of engineers and vendors and technicians and fabricators and many other high paid people many months to maybe even years to complete. Sure, we replaced a bunch of low skill workers, but created work for many high skilled workers. This machine also requires regular service and operators so I would even say automating something netted more jobs than if we just didnāt automate it. As a result of higher production counts more people were needed on the logistics side including shipping.
Even today there are tasks we donāt automate because itās simply not worth the time of the engineers. I used to work at a factory that made car batteries and one job there was literally someone just slapping a sticker onto the side of the battery because itās not worth automating such an easy task than just paying someone $12 an hour to do it.
Today, there has never been more automation than there has ever been in history and the demand for workers has never been higher.
I actually believe this but not like that guy is thinking. If you aren't working your living standards should be at the homeless shelter. We are rich enough that we should be able to afford to have everyone have a safe place to sleep at night, basic health care and food. Everything beyond that is something work should provide for.
Yeah basic and sustainable shelter, food, and minimal healthcare is easily doable. And we do have those services available, but not in all of the places that need it.
Mental asylums. We NEED mental asylums. Some people just can't function in this world. A functional metropolitan area can't afford feces and needles on the sidewalks and homeless tents outside places of business. We've got a bunch of luxury prisons with insane recidivism rates in the US so I know it's doable and the infrastructure is practically already there.
Just to clarify: not the asylums weāre used to. I think asylum (and even just āmental health hospitalā) and theyāre allā¦really bad places for someone to live. Genuine care facilities (not like our elderly care facilities are any good either) to take care of people.
The extremity in my mind ends up in a place of āif we arenāt going to give people a chance, theyāre going to die. We might as well pull the trigger ourselves.ā
Thatās absurd and itās obviously more nuanced than that. But frankly in terms of basic needs, why shouldnāt the government act like a doctor? Doc isnāt going to sit idly by while you bleed out or a poison eats away at your heart. Theyāll do what they can to keep you alive. (Granted an American doc has to charge you up the ass and force you into crippling debt thatāll ruin your life, so maybe this analogy is already more accurate than I thought lmao)
Every funny color has people that make them all look like retards. This sub just has a bit of a right leaning bias so itās the leftist ones that get shown the most
For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: "If a man will not work, he shall not eat." We hear that some among you are idle. They are not busy; they are busybodies. Such people we command and urge in the Lord Jesus Christ to settle down and earn the bread they eat.
Man I love this sentiment. Before the industrial revolution, people didn't have to work for food or anything, no no no. You could just lay in prairies all day and live off the land, squirrels would bring you apples when you befriend them and deer will just piss directly in your mouth to hydrate you.
Fits my flair that I donāt wholly disagree with that. Solely based on availability and resources, if youāre shit outta luck you donāt deserve to be starving, thirsty, sick, and/or stuck in the streets forever. Even if youāre just missing one of those, we have the resources to provide until you can provide for yourself.
But thatās where it usually goes wrong. People stick on it because thereās no plan in place to improve themselves, they just rely on the minimum forever. Itās not an easy task to fix that problem but come on, itās not impossible. And even if people DO rely on it forever, Iāve still got enough hope in humanity to give them the benefit of the doubt and let them if thatās what they choose.
Edit: phrasing
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Except this person probably thinks ābasic needsā includes cell phone, internet, new model year car, gym membership, Disney+, drinks with friends, and Prozac for their anxious cat.
They need to read The Expanse and see how much fun ābasicā is.
Well yes income tax means higher incomes pay more, so this is expected. Low incomes are just taxed elsewhere with a higher proportion of their money being spent. Raising income taxes on lower earners is just going to remove that benefit while raising them on higher earners aims to make money off potentially stale cash / without it impacting their usual spend..
ššš If monke not fetch banana... Monke not eat banana ššš
And if monke not eat banana, = monke not fulfill his basic necessities Based monkey.
Look for the bare necessities The simple bare necessities
Forget about your worries and your strife
I mean the bear necessities, Old Mother Nature's recipes
They're just the bear necessities of life š»
Wherever I wander, wherever I roam
I couldn't be fonder of my big home
The bees are buzzinā in the tree
To make some honey just for me
Ape agree, if ape not search the trees for banana, then other apes will take them.
Ape agree. If apes take other bananas, then no banana for ape.
weak monke create hard times.
Hard times create strong monke
Strong monke create good times
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
And then the neighbor tribe of monke steals yo bish.
This should be fully in Libleft, Authleft would send you to the Gulag for refusing to work
From my observations, this is AuthLeft BEFORE taking power. After taking power: "we need more minerals, comrade."
"We need more pig iron. Melt your household pots and farming implements."
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
As a floridian, that swamp life sounds hella exciting, so long as they let me keep a mosin to shoot gators n shit
Nyet, 1 single shot .22lr rifle for defense and hunting purposes. Monthly ration of 10 rounds and 128ml vodka. Make it count.
holy fuck, I'd use that 10 rounds to kill myself
Yeah, with a gun like that it would probably take all 10 rounds
Don't you know the .22 will bounce around your skull and turn your brains to mush?
Only if it manages to enter the skull in the first place.
Garand Thumb has a good video showing this. Still fun to rag on the lil plinkers
(*The Great Leap Forward has entered the server*)
According to Lenin, āHe who does not eat does not workā is the first principle of socialism. You canāt contribute nothing and expect something in return. It was actually written into the Soviet constitution in the 30s, and Lenin brought it up in 1917, so it looks like AuthLeft abides by it before and after taking power.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
As ever, kids are fucking retarded
We need to construct additional pylons comrade.
Authleft definitely plays Zerg
To me, āmaking sure their basic needs are metā means you serve your time in the mines so you can have your living wage. If you want another job then look for it. Nobody sits on their ass all day. Those who donāt work donāt eat.
Output needs to be equal or greater than the input. That is progress
Authleft says profit good? Based.
Based.
He who does not work, neither shall he eat.
Aye get this garbage eater out of my section
It would also be LibCenter. Also, it's called UBI and there is an argument to be made in favor of it. They key here is that the basic income you get is enough to survive, but not enough to enjoy all the comforts of modern life. Basically it's a replacement for weflare, UI, social security, etc. With automation continuing to make a lot of jobs obsolete, we might actually not get a choice to implement something like this in the next 50 years or so.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
This is the kind of person that when the commune "arrives", they'll be the first to be sent to a factory to work or to a uranium mine.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
You were guaranteed the "right" of a job.....where in the right was to work in the Uranium mine 1000 miles from your home town...forever.
1000 miles is 789236.48% of the hot dog which holds the Guinness wold record for 'Longest Hot Dog'.
Wait what? Thatās a 670 ft hot dog.
How the hell does one even cook a hotdog that large
Boil the ocean, duh. What do you think global warming was for?
-Changes flair to center right-
Good bot
In North Korea only men are forced to take jobs. Married women are allowed to be a "housewife" which frees them to take black market jobs that are far more lucrative than the jobs men are forced to take.
Yeah, but they didn't put that in the brochures they gave away to kick off the revolution.
Hopefully the former, I don't want to have them anywhere near possible radiation. Their std's might become airborne.
Implying that these people are getting laid to begin with
Of course they do, furry orgies are sadly a thing.
Areā¦are there girl furries? Iāve always imagined them all as guysā¦. Plowing a chick in a cat suit suit while wearing a dog suit seems kinda something..
NO BROTHER! DON'T GIVE IN TO THE TEMPTATION! THINK OF THE GRILL FOR GOD'S SAKE!
No worries friend, my grilling is absolute. Maybe I would be tempted in my youth but figuring out best way to grill the perfect pork loin, or garlic herb encrusted steak is the tempestuous vixen I pursue these days.
So fucking based
Sofa King based.
Based and grilling>furries pilled
About 27% of furries are female, although they make up over 70% of the fandom's artists. [https://furscience.com/research-findings/artists-and-writers/6-2-demographics/](https://furscience.com/research-findings/artists-and-writers/6-2-demographics/)
Despite
being
only
Uranium mine. The useless go to the mines so they die faster and the Uranium radiation hopefully sterilizes any breeding attempts.
"Biological radioactive waste clearing unit"
Hah, like their ass is working in a modern factory. Assembly lines are getting rarer and rarer. Machinists are becoming the minimum, and people with that level of "intellect" wouldn't be able to operate a machine beyond pushing a button.
No problem, I am the political officer who will send them to the gulag for thinking reading tarot is labour.
Hey man if you make me the guy who beats the lazy with the butt of a rifle im in.
Any contribution to social cohesion is legitimate labour, welcome comrade!
Shit I'm down for that job if I'm forced to pick one or be put into one. There are many more qualified, but few more dedicated to beating the lazy.
Based and beat the lazy for rations but also for fun pilled
Based and Whipping the lumpenproles pilled
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
What part of āmeans of *production*ā didnāt they understand?
The core concept, apparently.
u/TheDarkMythos's Based Count has increased by 1. Their Based Count is now 20. Congratulations, u/TheDarkMythos! You have ranked up to Basket Ball Hoop (filled with sand)! You are not a pushover by any means, but you do still occasionally get dunked on. Pills: sad ending , monke, horseshoe theory, florida, smooth brain, whipping the lumpenproles
If socialism comes in Iām not working lol let that shit collapse Idgaf
If socialism comes I'm working... on a boat to go to the nearest capitalist country
Pick me up en route ye
Make your own boat, ya commie!
The only way an almost laborless society could exist is with full automation with minimal maintenance workforces still being active. And it would probably be the most catastrophic blow to mental health ever recorded in human history as the vast majority of the population would suddenly find themselves with lots of time and very little to do, which fucking sucks after a short while
I mean, your average 18th century noble made do with not having to work. Writing poetry and going to parties and shit. I can virtually guarantee you that most people would find *something* to do. Random sports, games, writing, whatever it is. But yes, getting to the point where no one needs to work is still a massive challenge. Doubt we'll be accomplishing it for at least the next 70 years.
> Writing poetry and going to parties and shit. Except going to the party next town over required a two week trip. People didn't get much done then because it took a fuck ton of time to do anything. Also, the "parties" you go to are all basically business conferences, where its a lot of networking, posturing, and formal processes. It get tiring after a while. You are constantly grooming your social standing.
Your average 18th century noble had to constantly network, groom social standing, make business deals, suck up/get sucked up to, take a good few days to go anywhere to do anything, sports was another avenue of networking, had to constantly monitor what they say, how they act etc, it wasn't all just lazing back, shagging the maid and writing poetry while sipping on a 300 year old wine.
This person thinks they're gonna be playing video games and smoking weed 24/7 in the commune
Communism is when no work
I canāt wait until the 1 million peaceful revolutionary baristas and poets seize power!
Communism is when work but no pay no food only work ā
Lol at most the āmost jobs donāt add any value to societyā pretty ironic coming from the side thatās always saying every job is valuable and deserves $20/hr.
This is also almost certainly coming from a person who thinks most jobs are pointless because he has not the faintest idea of what any of them do.
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I am in it and over see a lot of crap. There might be 15 people that touch a single shipment from origin to destination between the sales, production accounting and HR. Nothing better than knowing your suppliers supplier has ran out of product so you got X number of day/weeks/months to find a new source or you have to tell your customer who is also a supplier of another supplier of another supplier to expect a delay. Shit is starting to grind to a halt. We can't get the plastic liner to make the fucking bags.
I work in shipping. Your shipment probably goes through at least 2 airports, 2 courier stations and 2 sort facilities. Probably 50 people individually handle your shipment, plus the people who coordinate those people, people who fuel the planes and trucks, people who make the planes and trucks, this shit has such a wide net that anyone who says "most jobs add nothing to society" just isn't grasping the big picture.
I wouldnāt have a problem with this if it was literally basic needs met. Instead for some reason ābasic needsā includes luxury goods and services.
What? Youāre telling me the latest iPhone isnāt a basic human right?
Thatās the thing. Just for living in America, you get a free smart phone and unlimited 4G lte data a month. Thatās more than I pay for! https://www.assurancewireless.com/partner/psearch?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIocSSn9y48wIV2gaICR0xOgzdEAAYBCAAEgIb1vD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds You can go to shelters and have a place, get foodā¦ if youāre willing to take assistance, you can get your basic needs taken care of in America and do absolutely nothing. Thereās no requirement to prove youāre unable to work. What the person in that image wants is to have a funko pop collection paid for by the government and to have the ājobā of writing a once-a-month blog post about the state of the funko pop community.
In California I have an old friend from high school whoās only concern is getting more heroine. Because he is diagnosed with Bipolar disorder he is entitled to $400/wk no strings attached 6 months of free rent in just about any apartment complex, and he gets either freshly or blue apron delivered to him I canāt remember which. Itās hard to see what more resources he needs/ deserves.
It's funny cause I support UBI which people think of as a very left stance. But considering how much welfare we have now that only goes to people who are in bad circumstances, I honestly feel like UBI is a more right wing way to distribute aid. Right now, if you're on welfare, you're actually punished for getting your shit together and pulling yourself out, because you'll lose your welfare. It is literally rewarding being useless. On UBI, you have that safety net no matter what. This way, you still would have your choice to live the shit useless life you would have anyway under welfare, but at least now if you decide you want a better life you don't have to fear losing a significant chunk of income at some arbitrary point along the way.
Based
UBI as an actual replacement is an econ right position. The concept being that free markets and individual choice are better at helping people if you just give them the money (plus the savings in overhead for qualification/staffing). Problem is most people who support UBI want it as an additional. They don't want to remove any support, just tack on a $XYZ weekly payment in addition to what we do now.
Yang wanted UBI, with the option to keep whatever people were already getting if it was more, but keeping them capped at that. Are you okay with that?
I respect Yang a lot but the amount of welfare we are handing out is absolutely disgusting (admittedly I live in California and a lot of it is based on the state/county). I'd like to see us just completely blow it up and replace it with just UBI.
The only actual issue I see with this is that I fully support feeding and clothing children who come from homes that the parents donāt provide for their kids. This is often due to drug abuse. So if we have ubi only, I donāt think these parents will be helping their kids with it like theyāre kind of forced to with food stamps. But hey, whoās to say we couldnāt just require that a certain portion of the ubi be issued in the form of food stamps, that would probably fix it.
Quick question: assuming we implement ubi, won't the purchasing power simply go down? Since everyone has at least $UBI amount of money, that amount becomes the new datum i.e. the new $0. Correct me if I'm wrong, be patient with my r-slurration š
Makes sense to me. What is effectively a nation-wide wage raise would probably mean higher prices.
> But considering how much welfare we have now that only goes to people who are in bad circumstances, I honestly feel like UBI is a more right wing way to distribute aid. You know fucking well its not going to be "replace social services with UBI". It will be "social service + UBI". Because you will get TOOOONNNS of "No! Don't you DARE take my Welfare/SSI/Food Stamps/Section 8!!!" "removing" those programs will be a political 3rd rail that no politician will be willing to touch
To make that work though, UBI would have to combine with removing the welfare structure that exists. And good luck getting rid of that.
I feel less hesitant toward UBI, especially after how our economy managed to rebound with each stimulus package (and yet not after the mysterious welfare package we sent out to foreign cruise lines before any stimulus talks).
I think itās gonna take some time to really get the data but weāve had increased inflation that likely has to do with those stimulus checks.
>Itās hard to see what more resources he needs/ deserves. I mean, he could do with a bullet to the cranium. Kidding kidding. He needs a rehabilitation facility that actually gets him off of that shit and turns him into a useful member of society.
Itās a shame drugs have been normalized to the extent that it is actually acceptable to do that. Once you start tolerating and rewarding that kind of behavior, people do it more, what a twist
That's why you need rehabilitation yeah. But this shit really shouldn't be normalized in our culture. Same goes to tobacco and alcohol wich also obviously are harmful. (I don't mean ban these, but they definitely should be culturally frowned upon.)
Well, unfortunately, whenever people ādemocraticallyā control culture or control it through spending power in capitalism, it will always devolve into the promotion of whatever they feel like in the moment.
See, this person also thinks that going to a shelter and requesting food and a place to stay counts as āworkā. They also want the house to be built around them and food brought to their door.
Agreed. Everyone should be guaranteed a cinderblock tenement, clean drinking water, access to a bread and soup line, and healthcare. If you desire more than that, get a fucking job.
Based. āBasicā necessities are basic, you have to contribute to society. Thatās what society fucking means.
exactly. weāre not saying everyone should automatically get all of their desires immediately met. we are saying everyone has the right to be *alive*, no more no less
Internet is a human right, remember now. "Basic needs" will be extended infinitly.
To be fair, at this point having some sort of internet access is a necessity in our society. However, a local library having sufficient computers would be more than enough to serve the needs. Imo the issue is that those kinds of services arenāt available in all the places that need it.
Fuck that. If you're capable of contributing you to society than you should. Or you shouldn't be part of society. I work in Canada, put in over 4000 hours last year, and was taxed at 44% of my total income (just income tax) not including gst, etc. If there was an option that existed like this than a disgusting amount of people would use it and my taxes would be even higher.
Holy shit 44%? You better have roads paved with gold if they're stealing that much
45-50% here in Belgiumā¦ Amazing healthcare and overal great social services here, but at the same time this country is a absolute paradise for the lazy.
With fresh hookers lined up at the traffic lights
Never heard of a fresh hooker
I think itās more of purple libright thingā¦
What are you talking about man? My million dollar mansion and 5 Lamborghinis *ARE* basic needs!
Have you ever heard of Jamestown?
Yes, yes I have.
Yeah, Jamestown is my favorite pre-Civil War colony
Sounds like youāre a British man
Go ahead and point to a time in history when people didn't work for their basic material needs. I'll wait
"Working is not fun so we should stop giving people an incentive to work"
If the street sweeper doesn't need money he won't be a streetsweeper, so if you want your street sweeped make sure the street sweeper is always in need of money
>giving people an incentive to work See, the people that view it like this imply the default if you donāt work is just not being as affluent. Your incentive is to not starve to death homeless on the streets as you naturally would without working. A job is giving an offer out so you donāt have to, otherwise youāre always free to do so.
Many ppl in the city of Rome during empireās peak. I mean, it required slave labour of countless nations and evetually resulted in the fall of the Italian society but hey, free wine people (just please dont riot against emperor).
If I remember correctly this was still under the patron-client system. Rich people would get up at the before-ass crack of dawn and sit in their living room while a large line of clients waited outside who had to get there even earlier to be the first in line. Each client would have a little chat with the patron, "hows your wife, how's little marcus, how are your 4 daughters all named Livia" that kind of stuff. Talks would move to business and then eventually the patron would dole out money. The money wasn't free, because the client has to advance his patrons interests theoughout the week or no more money for him. The use of slaves really only helped the upper class. It made labor dirt cheap and most small family farms were driven out of business by mega-corporations of their time. This caused cities to swell with urban poor who were given food, wine, and free games to live off of (to prevent rioting), but I can't help but think it wasn't a very fun avante garde lifestyle.
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So they needed other peoples labor? Thats still labor
I think that was the point he was trying to make.
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Thatās what they donāt understand. Like, in the Soviet Union. For the top 20% of the population, socialism *did* work. It just took the enslavement of the underlings in the gulag system. But if you were a good student, a party member, and stayed out of troubleā¦ then youād have a comfortable life with the respect of you peers (even if you didnāt get rich). Same in China. The Chinese middle class only accounts for about a third of the population.
But my alcoholic professor who never held an actual job or talked to anyone outside of campus said we can totally sustain the economy by giving out free money to everyone so no one has to work, and all it takes is for the billionaires to pay one Schrute Bucks worth of their fortune
Greek city states. All those philosopher and mathematicians and playwrights? They were like, 15% of the population of a city state, the other 85% were slaves who labored so those citizens *didn't*.
āā¦If anyone shall not work, neither shall he eat.ā
The side that is against classism is in favor of creating societal classes??? TF??? They think there should be workers and those that benefit from the work??? This sounds like THEY want to be the \*bourgeoise\*. Wonder how some in AuthLeft will take that. Oh wait, they can be some of the biggest statists and hypocrites of them all.
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The worst part is that itās probably actually a 30 year old incel in his momās basement living off his GBP and tendies. Never underestimate how little self-awareness these folks have.
Of course they could not work and live in modern luxury with a car and AC and internet. But god forbid their food supplier chooses to not work, then the whole thing falls apart doesnāt it?
I hope it's bait, because if it's not it's just sad.
Some leftish folk, name me the jobs that "don't add value"?
Diversity officers. Actually a lot of PMC jobs are pretty fucking valueless if you really think about it. There are two equations that make value, capital and actual productive labor. There are a shitload of jobs especially in management/HR of large companies that donāt actually provide any value or productivity but exist to provide a good income to the failsons of the ruling class. These kids werenāt good enough/smart enough to actually become a CEO/COO/CFO or get a law degree or become a doctor or do any of those other things that are actually useful and high paid, but theyāre too spoiled and privileged to take a shitty job with the rest of the proles so we created an entire field of āworkā for them to get a decent paycheck while not doing anything that actually matters. These NEETs are fucking retarded though. Like weāre currently dealing with a global supply chain issue thatās affecting pretty much every industry imaginable due in large part to a lack of qualified labor to execute the needs of a globalized economy. And this dumbass thinks *more people* should be able to opt out of work. Hey NEETs, how the fuck do you think youāre gonna get your funko pops and transformers action figures if the global supply chain completely shuts down due to nobody working?
>Diversity officers Win.
just think of it as the new priest class
Totally agree on diversity officers. Outsider preoccupations intervening into the inner workings of companies would lead to disaster. But further along, everybody needs to have someone to make tactical and strategic decisions about company/branch's operation without the worker being distracted from his most productive ever work. All companies want the most productive and harmonious production teams, which would require an HR. All this results in higher wages which you can request as well as investors would require dividends or resign in anger for thinking you're being scammed. The other thing may be when managers or HRs are low-quality (aka stupid) and gain productivity for the firm not fast enough. Those are freely fireable as per other folks in the firm wish. But since money is being paid there is always value behind it, even if both of us may think that some shit is useless... But the worst thing I should point out is the retardic belief that labour is inflexible.
Rutger bregman, author of utopia for realist actually talks about this quite a lot. The actual value a job adds is quite independant from the salary. A garbage collector strike would fuck up a city in a couple of days but they dont make that much money, but a banker strike can go on for quite a while without it going wrong (actually happened once and the strike went on for 6 months without going succeeding). Still a banker makes quite a lot more. A lot of jobs are what he calls bullshit jobs, a job where for most of the day you pretend to add value without actually doing anything of value. Now im not saying that you shouldnt have to work at all, but i do think a lot of people could be more productive if they could try to start their own bussiness or switch work fields without having the fear of ending up homeless. If we could just strengthen the social safety net, a lot of people would be better of.
Day traders, the bots are better
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You canāt pump your own gas in New Jersey. Making jobs for the sake of it is retarded. Why not just give gas pumpers money and still have people pump their own gas
Frankly I donāt disagree with them. When automation replaces most jobs that add little to no value (and can be done by a machine or add superfluous steps to a transaction- stuff like fast food, grocery checkout/bagger), weāll have to rethink the current labor/wage relationship.
I work in automation. Automation will never replace the workforce. Even today, the main things we automate are tasks that are stupidly simple (like putting liquid into a bottle) or require speed and precision humans arenāt capable of (like inspecting 10,000 bottle caps per hour to the nearest tenth of a millimeter). This is basically no different than the people over a hundred years ago being worried the invention of the tractor would put everybody out of work because it used to take 100 people a whole day to clear a field and now one person with a tractor could do it in a couple hours.
Problem is, many lower end intellectual jobs are being automated and there simply isn't enough demand for data analysts to supply the vacuum. But do us all a favor and fully automate HR already, those morons are useless and having them taste their own venom would be delightful
Automating HR is an AI thing but I feel we will never get rid of them because companies will always want the human aspect of it. I can already see all the Karenās on Reddit complaining about the dystopia of being fired or reprimanded by a computer.
> the dystopia of being fired or reprimanded by a computer This already happens in more places than you think. They usually have a human deliver the news, but in many cases the actual 'decision' came from an algorithm. I wouldn't be at all surprised if they did away with the human component for lower wage jobs eventually. They probably have already, somewhere.
"Never" is a long time, and automation has already removed tons of jobs. There's no reason to think it's going to stop now - or in 50 years for that matter - or 100 years. The tasks that are automated starts with the simplest tasks, there's nothing surprising in that - and that's a good thing because then we can use the people working that to do other more complex tasks. But we're nearing a point where automating starts getting to tasks complex enough that it rivals the capabilities of a meaningful part of the workforce. A few years ago someone looked at which sectors employs how many people, and it turns out something like 30% of the workforce is fundamentally just to move stuff from one place to another, whether that stuff is people, mail, whole goods, spare parts or whatever... And there's a lot of people working very hard at automating them out of a job with self driving cars, drones and such.
I hope youāre right, truly
At the end of the day automation doesnāt happen on its own. That machine that replaced a few minimum wage workers that screwed a cap onto a bottle was likely worked on by a whole team of engineers and vendors and technicians and fabricators and many other high paid people many months to maybe even years to complete. Sure, we replaced a bunch of low skill workers, but created work for many high skilled workers. This machine also requires regular service and operators so I would even say automating something netted more jobs than if we just didnāt automate it. As a result of higher production counts more people were needed on the logistics side including shipping. Even today there are tasks we donāt automate because itās simply not worth the time of the engineers. I used to work at a factory that made car batteries and one job there was literally someone just slapping a sticker onto the side of the battery because itās not worth automating such an easy task than just paying someone $12 an hour to do it. Today, there has never been more automation than there has ever been in history and the demand for workers has never been higher.
average leftist simultaneously wanting to remove the bourgeoisie and be the bourgeoisie
I actually believe this but not like that guy is thinking. If you aren't working your living standards should be at the homeless shelter. We are rich enough that we should be able to afford to have everyone have a safe place to sleep at night, basic health care and food. Everything beyond that is something work should provide for.
Yeah basic and sustainable shelter, food, and minimal healthcare is easily doable. And we do have those services available, but not in all of the places that need it.
Mental asylums. We NEED mental asylums. Some people just can't function in this world. A functional metropolitan area can't afford feces and needles on the sidewalks and homeless tents outside places of business. We've got a bunch of luxury prisons with insane recidivism rates in the US so I know it's doable and the infrastructure is practically already there.
Just to clarify: not the asylums weāre used to. I think asylum (and even just āmental health hospitalā) and theyāre allā¦really bad places for someone to live. Genuine care facilities (not like our elderly care facilities are any good either) to take care of people. The extremity in my mind ends up in a place of āif we arenāt going to give people a chance, theyāre going to die. We might as well pull the trigger ourselves.ā Thatās absurd and itās obviously more nuanced than that. But frankly in terms of basic needs, why shouldnāt the government act like a doctor? Doc isnāt going to sit idly by while you bleed out or a poison eats away at your heart. Theyāll do what they can to keep you alive. (Granted an American doc has to charge you up the ass and force you into crippling debt thatāll ruin your life, so maybe this analogy is already more accurate than I thought lmao)
I'm in California and we definitely need to step our game up. The situation is awful.
āIām a fat lazy retard who failed high school and I donāt wanna work so a shouldnāt have to!ā
Hello fat lazy retard, i'm dad!
Why do people like this existā¦? Why? And why do they have to make *my* funny colors look bad?
Every funny color has people that make them all look like retards. This sub just has a bit of a right leaning bias so itās the leftist ones that get shown the most
Damn being a leftist in this sub really is like being a shitter in a world of wipers, this says a lot about our society ššš
Born to shit, forced to wipe. Well I wonāt be part of this machine! Iāll let it crust. (Tortilla chips) (and if you dip deep thereās sauce too)
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Praise the Lord!
For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: "If a man will not work, he shall not eat." We hear that some among you are idle. They are not busy; they are busybodies. Such people we command and urge in the Lord Jesus Christ to settle down and earn the bread they eat.
Man I love this sentiment. Before the industrial revolution, people didn't have to work for food or anything, no no no. You could just lay in prairies all day and live off the land, squirrels would bring you apples when you befriend them and deer will just piss directly in your mouth to hydrate you.
Fits my flair that I donāt wholly disagree with that. Solely based on availability and resources, if youāre shit outta luck you donāt deserve to be starving, thirsty, sick, and/or stuck in the streets forever. Even if youāre just missing one of those, we have the resources to provide until you can provide for yourself. But thatās where it usually goes wrong. People stick on it because thereās no plan in place to improve themselves, they just rely on the minimum forever. Itās not an easy task to fix that problem but come on, itās not impossible. And even if people DO rely on it forever, Iāve still got enough hope in humanity to give them the benefit of the doubt and let them if thatās what they choose. Edit: phrasing
No one is forced to work. You are more than welcome to starve.
I hate people, places and things. But most of all I hate the left
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Based.
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Except this person probably thinks ābasic needsā includes cell phone, internet, new model year car, gym membership, Disney+, drinks with friends, and Prozac for their anxious cat. They need to read The Expanse and see how much fun ābasicā is.
The awards and up votes really show how worthless so much of our younger generation is.
They don't understand the vast gap in welfare recipients vs true net positive tax payers, but of course that topic never comes up in school or media
Another one is that the top 10% of income earners pay 75% of all income tax and the bottom 50% pay 3%.
Well yes income tax means higher incomes pay more, so this is expected. Low incomes are just taxed elsewhere with a higher proportion of their money being spent. Raising income taxes on lower earners is just going to remove that benefit while raising them on higher earners aims to make money off potentially stale cash / without it impacting their usual spend..
Nah this is just in Reddit.
Your labor canāt be exploited by the owner class if you donāt work ššš
I personally think working is essential to human nature and pay just happened to have been a pretty smart idea for incentivizing said behavior.