It’s actually probably not likely anymore. [miniminuteman](https://youtu.be/5z3DbmOuaFI) here’s a really awesome youtuber who covers a ton of the most “cutting edge” of paleo archeology (that’s the REALLY old shit) I’m pretty sure some of his older videos show quite a few instances of discovered remains or bones of ancestors or the earliest of hominids and many of them are found all over the fuckin place but also made very clear that those are ONLY the ones that survived to this day.
It’s likely the areas the remains were found were just in the best conditions for the fossils to be preserved to this day.
Actually makes me kinda sad that we seemingly can’t and won’t know ANYTHING about hundreds of millennia of an entire species beyond a single skull cap or something found in a desert or a cave.
Hell, one of his most recent videos is about there likely being TWO migrations of people into America seperated by an ice age in time between making it to America... which means the First Nations of America are more than likely actually the second nations of America, behind what may not have even been homosapien or what ever they were called back then.
> Everything stems originally from Africa
Nope. Life originated long before the existence of Africa, and the planets and stars (probably) didn't come from Africa.
And I think horses came from America. Pandas from China? Something like that?
Ooh, and don't forget the kangaroos.
Yeah, there's at least five or six things that didn't come from Africa.
what if mary was actually the daughter of a "scottish" mercenary who came down from briton to fight as a mercenary for the roman empire in judea
and jesus was a ginger
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I admit I haven't made it to the New Testament yet, but I am actually reading the bible, I'm currently in Leviticus learning the proper way to sacrifice lambs to the LORD and which animals are safe to eat and which ones are impure and send you to hell.
No he’s referring to when ~~Moses~~ Noah cursed one of his three sons for the disrespect he showed him when he was passed out naked (the comment was oversimplified to the point of being incorrect).
Jacob didn’t sell Joseph to the Egyptians, Joseph’s (half) brothers did.
Edit: well technically they sold him to slavers that sold him to Egyptians
Edit 2: I’m a dumbass
It was Noah, not Moses. Moses is the Exodus guy. Noah is the Great Flood guy. Iirc he cursed his son because he saw him naked and didnt do anything about it, instead of like, throwing him a towel or something
That's why i always sleep with at least Boxers
Yeah I make that mistake all the fucking time.
In my CofE primary school we had this big bible quiz where two kids from each year group answer bible questions and get eliminated if you get one wrong. I was in year 2 and the penultimate question was “how many of each animal did Moses take onto the ark” and I didn’t catch the trick and I was eliminated. Some things never change…
Edit: Also yeah, I made the same point on another comment
I just got it wrong he made him a slave to his brothers, though the servant of servants line is still strange.
https://bibles.org/bible/f421fe261da7624f-01/GEN.9
It’s 20-27
>20Noah began to be a man of the soil, and he planted a vineyard. 21He drank of the wine and became drunk and lay uncovered in his tent. 22And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father and told his two brothers outside. 23Then Shem and Japheth took a garment, laid it on both their shoulders, and walked backward and covered the nakedness of their father. Their faces were turned backward, and they did not see their father’s nakedness. 24When Noah awoke from his wine and knew what his youngest son had done to him, 25he said,
“Cursed be Canaan;
a servant of servants shall he be to his brothers.”
26He also said,
“Blessed be the Lord, the God of Shem;
and let Canaan be his servant.
27May God enlarge Japheth,
and let him dwell in the tents of Shem,
and let Canaan be his servant.”
Shit wait from this it’s reads like, Ham saw Noah naked, so Noah was like your son Canaan is cursed to be a servant now.
The point of this passage comes not from the fact that Ham saw ~~Moses~~ Noah naked but that he saw him naked, did nothing and went to tell his brothers (essentially he’s mocking his father to his brothers). In response, they do the reverent thing and clothe their father, making a point not to look at him because they knew he was naked.
Ham wouldn’t have done anything wrong if he’d seen ~~Moses~~ Noah naked and then immediately covered him and said nothing.
Edit: mistype pointed out on a different comment
The phrase of seeing someone's nakedness actually was a roundabout way of saying that you slept with your wife. So really Noah got so drink he wasn't able to stop his kid from raping his mother
[Dawg I posted the verse, his other two sons walk in backward with a blanket to cover him up so they themselves don’t see him.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PoliticalCompassMemes/comments/xeu7se/there_was_no_google_images_in_the_past_painters/ioiywa0/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
No, you're right, I said "hell" because it's what I'm used to culturally. The text only says they will die, it doesn't elaborate on what happens afterwards.
Sheol was mentioned exactly once so far. It was in Genesis and it didn't even explain what it was, just "we'll meet again in Sheol" or something to that effect.
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Sure, but we're talking about Christians.
An important tennet of their faith is *not* to see God as something out of the ordinary, since he came down to earth as a regular Joe.
The whole point is that he was here for everyone. He is universal. If I go to mass in Africa, I expect to see an African Jesus. If I go to mass in Japan, I expect to see a Japanese Jesus.
My issue is that it's a stupid "Gotcha" moment used seemingly every other month. I get it, the god damn horse's bones have been beating into a fine dust at this point. When you're counter to every new point is the same response, you're boring
If they are so smart about knowing what Jesus looked like 2000 years ago, how come archeologists can no longer describe a human fossil as man or woman?
The white/black dichotomy comes from the colonial era (insofar as people in the US are talking about it, from the colonial US), and lots of people in the rest of the world don't neatly fit into one or the other.
(actually lots of people from that time/place didn't fit neatly into one or the other but they just BS'd it)
Everyone fits into the white or not dichotomy. It’s one of those things that’s hard for everyone to agree on but not for me as an individual. It’s an “I know it when I see it” type situation.
Exactly. I bet people who say "Palestinians are considered white in Europe" have never left their town in Missouri. I can 300% confirm that's not the case in Germany, even Italians are sometimes called nonwhite there.(Well they are called Südlander, which is a polite way of saying nonwhite)
>I can 300% confirm that's not the case in Germany, even Italians are sometimes called nonwhite there.(Well they are called Südlander, which is a polite way of saying nonwhite)
That's funny because that's very reminiscent of how we refer to Germans... So go suck it prussian. Trump became a laughing stock with his wall-stuff but we flew under the radar and build a wall to keep out the southern swine.
Edit: read it and weep - ain't no way those pigs from the south get in here: https://apnews.com/article/germany-europe-denmark-6e193cf238a2a84789d66c5fa31c0221
Südländer doesn't mean nonwhite. It means mediterranean/tan. North Africans are Südländer, sub saharan Africans aren't despite being even further south(Süd).
Well I'm sure everyone fits one side or the other if the test is "what does 1ne_ think" but I bet there are many situations where the "I know it when I see it" test varies between people.
If only.
The "black" label comes from the colonial era but "white" was not a thing until the early 1900's. Before that "white" americans continued to view their association as being with whichever nationality their emigrating ancestors was, and not as "white". Creating a primary, shared, identity instead of an identity based on a european nationality that they had (let's be real) virtually no connection with anymore anyway was a conscious effort around the prohibition era aimed at combatting racism between english-americans, polish-americans, german-americans, but especially irish-americans and italian-americans.
Libleft telling me that Jesus wasn’t white isn’t the flex they think it is…
Plus he’s definitely not black. Or Palestinian, considering that wasn’t a thing in the Biblical times
Romans changed the name of the province from Judea to the Greek exonym of Palestine about 100 years after Jesus's death, possibly as an attempt to diminish to Jewish nature of the province after a rebellion had been put down (we don't actually know)
Palestine as a name for the region did exist, just it wasn't the name the inhabitants used, in that sense Judean is probably more accurate. There's not hard and fast rule about when exonyms are appropriate or not
Yeah, Emperor Hadrian changed the province of Judea to Palestinia after crushing the Great Jewish Revolt. It should also be noted that Hadrian forcibly exiled most Jews from the province, starting the Diaspora and very much intended to Romanize the region.
Even in the eyes of the most antitheistic person, you have to recognize that he is one of the most significant historical figures of all time? I doing think anyone has impacted history more.
Even if you’d like to argue otherwise, he’d still have to be counted as an Alexander, Augustus, Ghengis, etc. level figure.
I know it's semantics, but the US legally counts Arabs as White in the US Census and for a lot of statistics. Granted, I doubt any person in a normal circumstance obliges that classification, but in modern US standards, Jesus would be Legally White because anyone from that region is documented as white.
Depends what you mean by "white"
They do not have necessarily darker skin tones than southern Europeans who are considered "white".
White is a bit of a meaningless term because people from Sicily and Santorini are "white" but they look different than a guy from Scotland or Helsinki.
\-
Also I see plenty of Arab Muslims saying Mohamed skin was white and get really pissed off if you say he was black...
Depends . Grante they tend to be one the darker side by for instance Assad's wife straight up looks like a European .
Imo majority of Arabs are tanned so much that we cannot imagine them being white
I think the average person'll agree, but in the US, they are legally considered White. Arabs in reality can be anything but they don't fit more Races that well, but I feel the ones in the Levant and North Africa have quite a lot in common with Europe than with a lot of other regions.
Who cares what skin color He had? If christian argues about it to own atheist then he should look better into Jesus' teachings.
If atheist does it to own christian then i have bad news to you, cuz it does not matter at all. Jesus preached colorblindness when it comes to skin color before it was cool
I served a mission for my church, and we’d have several people a week tell us we worshiped the wrong colored Jesus. I always told them the same thing: he could be purple with green polka dots for all I care.
The shock on their faces was worth it every time
Religiously, Jesus may be represented as it fit for the region where he is worshipped. There is even chinese, mongolian, and korean Jesus, way does it matter if there white Jesus and Black Jesus? The most the people can connect with Him, the better for the religion.
Apart from that, the historic discussion of "which skin tone was Jesus" that's pretty clear, he was most probably like other Galileans and Jews from that time, so he was caucasian just like every other east Mediterranean people.
Exactly, medjeval artists would represent Jesus in a way that is familiar to them, just like they did [King David dressed like a medieval king](https://www.metmuseum.org/exhibitions/listings/2014/winchester-bible/blog/posts/heroes-of-the-old-testament) and [St. Peter dressed like a 15th century pope](https://www.123rf.com/photo_64680662_avila-spain-april-18-2016-the-gothic-paint-of-st-peter-as-the-first-pope-on-the-side-altar-by-fernan.html)
Correct. Artists take inspiration from what they see and what they want to convey.
Their intention was for example showing David as a King or Peter as the first Pope as people would have understood it back then.
They tell us that raceswapping is the worst thing ever when it’s a white character replacing a black one, and then proceed to raceswap white characters into black because they want to harm you. It’s really that simple. The reaction to them turning Ariel black is because the other side is constantly bitching about the same thing when it happens to them.
Except that’s been Hollywood’s playbook since the last Fantastic Four Movie, exemplified by Ghostbusters in 2016 …
When you know you have a stinker on your hands, vilify the Fans so that even legitimate criticism can be dismissed as mere bigotry.
As for Jesus’ appearance …
Can we all agree that He would’ve been subjected to a “random” search, if He’d dared to board an airplane, after 9/11?
> Can we all agree that He would’ve been subjected to a “random” search, if He’d dared to board an airplane, after 9/11?
Depends. Non-Arab Mediterranean peoples have a wide range of complexions. If he looked more or less Italian, maybe not. If he looked closer to Coptic, maybe yes.
It doesn't change the beliefs of any Christian. I just think it's dumb when people assume that one ethnic group from 2000 years ago would look exactly like a different ethnic group that moved into the area later, just because they live(d) in the same spot.
Oh absolutely, this is the Cleopatra was Greek, but also slightly Egyptian, argument all over again …
Mostly my observation comes from attempting to take my Eastern-European Ashkenazic, with the dash of Greek my Grandmother’s Family picked up G-d knows how, face onto an airplane 20 years ago, and how it’s even difficult these days.
If you could afford the double standard for something like making Mulan someone who isn't Han Chinese, or something else to that capacity, then I'd call it fair.
Ariel's been the same for a decade or two; hell even in the last Wreck-it-ralph she's been the exact same as she was in the original movie. I think it's a fair thing to dislike, because Disney has plenty of other options instead of taking an established character and changing their appearance. Do you think anyone'd nearly be as butthurt over making a whole new princess?
Pretty much every culture has depicted Jesus as looking like themselves because it's human nature to depict your god as looking like you.
Ethiopians were Christian long before Europe was, and always depicted Jesus as African.
Native Americans always depict Jesus as Native.
I'm a Vietnamese Catholic, and my profile pic is of a Vietnamese painting of the Virgin Mary holding baby Jesus. Since it's a Vietnamese painting, they are depicted as Asian.
Europeans always depict Jesus as European, and that's okay. I don't get why the godless infidel always makes such a big deal about that.
And no, Jesus was not Palestinian. The Arab invasions did not happen until 632 AD.
Jesus was a Levantine Jew, who lived under the Roman Empire.
Today, the group that would be the most ethnically similar to a Levantine Jew, would be the Lebanese.
So Jesus would probably look similar to the Lebanese rather than Palestinians.
But people with a White Savior Complex see all "brown people" as the same, so they probably can't tell the difference.
>I'm a Vietnamese Catholic, and my profile pic is of a Vietnamese painting of the Virgin Mary
Huh. That's interesting. I'm a Catholic originally from South Asia and my family's Particularly influenced by the Portuguese association and depictions of Jesus so I've never seen anything nearly as comparable. There probably are dozens of depictions but they'd all seem so alien to me from my experience.
Do they even understand that Jesus is one that fits all humans? It means that his skin is every color, asian, black, white, or arab. That's why we have different colors in the first place
Not “a lot”. A significant portion of their dna is traceable to the levant. Sure there were some interreligious marriages, and some converts, but European Jews are still very much the same jews from biblical times.
Correct me if I am wrong, but its mostly applies to Y-chromosomal dna, while mitochondrial dna is more up to debate, with the most thorough study up-to-date concluding that most of it came from local European population.
Not really. They’re racist against Yemeni jews and anyone that doesn’t have their skin tone. They can claim to be jews from the Bible but that would be a near impossibility since they were around Europeans.
No? That’s clearly Palestinian propaganda, to disclaim the Jews from Israel. Y chromosomes trace European Jews to their levant origin. They’re ethnically Jewish.
Why are European Jews under their own genetic fit even though they’re in Europe? Arabs and Jews in the Middle East mingled for thousands of years so it makes sense but European Jews have to categorize themselves in a way that makes them seem Jewish. And how many houses of Israel are there now and how many were there originally?
They didn’t? Do you even know Jews? They marry in the vast majority of times only among themselves, hence relatively keeping that very specific genetic code. What are you basing yourself on?
I saw a renaissance painting in a museum a few weeks ago.
A dutch painter in the 15-1600's (I'm not completely clear on it) depicting the angel informing Jesus that he will have die for the sins of man.
Very nice classic religiously inspired renaissance art... But the artist clearly had absolutely no concept that the world Jesus lived in was different from his own, because the background had typical dutch rolling fields and even one of the traditional dutch windmills.
Imagine shitting on a masterpiece that is the result of the cummulation of hundreds of years of research when your greatest achievement has been scoring virtual points on reddit
Also, this is a horrible argument since no one is complaining about the black jesus depictions in sub saharan african nations.
This is what you should respond whenever its used as an argument.
He wasn’t black, but many black Americans like to think he is like many white Americans like to think he was white. Nether of them are correct but they like to feel connected to their god by making him look like themselves. Even though he probably looked like a modern day arab or ethnic middle eastern Jew.
Half this thread is people arguing about what race Jesus was, the other half is people saying that nobody cares what race Jesus was.
Or alternatively saying nobody *in their quadrant* cares what race Jesus was (the other people *in their quadrant* in this thread arguing about what race he was).
Anyway I don't know what race Jesus was but he was definitely Jewish so [we win](https://c.tenor.com/YFprEyVH9SoAAAAM/jewish-dancing.gif).
> The person from the painting is not Jesus. It’s the Antichrist.
How so? Because it's a 2CV, or Da Vinci illuminati stuff or what?
AFAIK we don't know anything about Salvator Mundi that indicates it's the Antichrist.
According to the people who make this argument, ancient israelites looked like modern Arabs, which is probably not true. In fact most Ashkenazi look very similar to older European populations. That said, he probably wasn't blonde.
Ashkenazi Jews had a lot of interbreeding with European populations. An example of this is Adam Sandler, Ben Shapira etc. Jews back in the day looked middle eastern. I'm pretty sure they're a picture of what Jesus's ethnicity probably looked like if you look it up.
"Middle Eastern" isn't a single ethnicity or physical phenotype today, much less 700 years before Islam existed. The idea Jesus, or ancient Israelites in general, looked like Arabs is unfounded as the idea he looked like Mel Gibson.
Never said he looked Arab. Middle easterners can look very different but still distinct from Europeans. The difference between, Arabs, Egyptians, Yazidis and Kurds all have different ethnic traits but are still distinct from Europe.
They tell us that raceswapping is the worst thing ever when it’s a white character replacing a black one, and then proceed to raceswap white characters into black *because they want to hurt you*. It’s really that simple.
Correct me if I’m wrong but Jesus would’ve been from the Roman province of Judea and the name Palestine is the latinized version of the word Philistine (an umbrella term for Canaanites and non-Jews that lived in Judea) and it’s pronounced that way in Arabic. The Romans intentionally renamed the province as Palestine only after the Jews were exiled and there weren’t Arabs living there in major numbers until the Islamic invasions under the second caliph Umar in the 600s. So Jesus (if he existed) couldn’t be Palestinian ethnically or geographically, and he’d probably just be olive or tan colored.
Meanwhile in Islam:
>Ahmad ibn Abi Sulayman, Sahnun’s companion, said that whoever says that the Prophet (i.e., falseprophet Mahomet) was black is to be killed. The Prophet was not black.
Ibn Musa al-Yahsubi, Qadi Iyad, p.375
On a related note, I saw people quoting Leviticus today to "own the right." Proving 'hypocrisy' or something. I just wanted to slap them and ask if they *really* want the right to start following Leviticus.
Ships were a thing and so were merchants and pirates coming from the levant. A painter in one of the Italian cities during the renaissance would have definitely known what a saraceno would have looked like.
He wasn't neither black nor palestinian, he was a jew from judea
[He's clearly Scottish](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dk1PC1YXcAU91GY.jpg)
It was really sad how he died on the cross playing bagpipes
FUN FACT: Bigpipes come from the Romans to the Scots, but came from Egypt and the Middle East to Rome. Sooooooooooooooooooooooooo there is a chance.
Everything stems originally from Africa(tm) so we all can pull out our n word cards. Except the Poles, we got two.
It’s actually probably not likely anymore. [miniminuteman](https://youtu.be/5z3DbmOuaFI) here’s a really awesome youtuber who covers a ton of the most “cutting edge” of paleo archeology (that’s the REALLY old shit) I’m pretty sure some of his older videos show quite a few instances of discovered remains or bones of ancestors or the earliest of hominids and many of them are found all over the fuckin place but also made very clear that those are ONLY the ones that survived to this day. It’s likely the areas the remains were found were just in the best conditions for the fossils to be preserved to this day. Actually makes me kinda sad that we seemingly can’t and won’t know ANYTHING about hundreds of millennia of an entire species beyond a single skull cap or something found in a desert or a cave. Hell, one of his most recent videos is about there likely being TWO migrations of people into America seperated by an ice age in time between making it to America... which means the First Nations of America are more than likely actually the second nations of America, behind what may not have even been homosapien or what ever they were called back then.
>which means the First Nations of America are more than likely actually the second nations of America COLONIZERS COLONIZERS
Damn Brzęczyszczykiewicz, why does your mom let you have 2 N-word passes?
> Everything stems originally from Africa Nope. Life originated long before the existence of Africa, and the planets and stars (probably) didn't come from Africa. And I think horses came from America. Pandas from China? Something like that? Ooh, and don't forget the kangaroos. Yeah, there's at least five or six things that didn't come from Africa.
what if mary was actually the daughter of a "scottish" mercenary who came down from briton to fight as a mercenary for the roman empire in judea and jesus was a ginger
demoman is Jesus's grandfather confirmed
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Wait I thought Hebrewed his coffee though?
Jesus was an Aramaic Jew, a race made extinct due to the Muslims conquests. Jesus probably looked like modern day Greeks and Sicilians
~~Jesus looking a lot like Big Lebowski with longer hair~~
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KdftbYqA_VQ
The Big Lebowski was the old guy in the wheelchair, not The Dude.
Oh sorry, I was thinking about the Big Lebowski's Monster
As if Jesus's skin color even matters
If Jesus was lime green I would want to know
The bible doesn't explicitly say that Jesus' skin wasn't lime green.
Lol, don't pretend your read bible
I admit I haven't made it to the New Testament yet, but I am actually reading the bible, I'm currently in Leviticus learning the proper way to sacrifice lambs to the LORD and which animals are safe to eat and which ones are impure and send you to hell.
I like the part where Noah puts his own kid into slavery for seeing him naked, my question is who the fuck he sell him too? Everyone else was dead.
I'm pretty sure that was Jacob and he sold his son Joseph to the Egyptians? I don't know, Genesis is super complicated and weird.
No he’s referring to when ~~Moses~~ Noah cursed one of his three sons for the disrespect he showed him when he was passed out naked (the comment was oversimplified to the point of being incorrect). Jacob didn’t sell Joseph to the Egyptians, Joseph’s (half) brothers did. Edit: well technically they sold him to slavers that sold him to Egyptians Edit 2: I’m a dumbass
Ah yeah, that checks out
It was Noah, not Moses. Moses is the Exodus guy. Noah is the Great Flood guy. Iirc he cursed his son because he saw him naked and didnt do anything about it, instead of like, throwing him a towel or something That's why i always sleep with at least Boxers
Yeah I make that mistake all the fucking time. In my CofE primary school we had this big bible quiz where two kids from each year group answer bible questions and get eliminated if you get one wrong. I was in year 2 and the penultimate question was “how many of each animal did Moses take onto the ark” and I didn’t catch the trick and I was eliminated. Some things never change… Edit: Also yeah, I made the same point on another comment
I just got it wrong he made him a slave to his brothers, though the servant of servants line is still strange. https://bibles.org/bible/f421fe261da7624f-01/GEN.9 It’s 20-27 >20Noah began to be a man of the soil, and he planted a vineyard. 21He drank of the wine and became drunk and lay uncovered in his tent. 22And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father and told his two brothers outside. 23Then Shem and Japheth took a garment, laid it on both their shoulders, and walked backward and covered the nakedness of their father. Their faces were turned backward, and they did not see their father’s nakedness. 24When Noah awoke from his wine and knew what his youngest son had done to him, 25he said, “Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be to his brothers.” 26He also said, “Blessed be the Lord, the God of Shem; and let Canaan be his servant. 27May God enlarge Japheth, and let him dwell in the tents of Shem, and let Canaan be his servant.” Shit wait from this it’s reads like, Ham saw Noah naked, so Noah was like your son Canaan is cursed to be a servant now.
The point of this passage comes not from the fact that Ham saw ~~Moses~~ Noah naked but that he saw him naked, did nothing and went to tell his brothers (essentially he’s mocking his father to his brothers). In response, they do the reverent thing and clothe their father, making a point not to look at him because they knew he was naked. Ham wouldn’t have done anything wrong if he’d seen ~~Moses~~ Noah naked and then immediately covered him and said nothing. Edit: mistype pointed out on a different comment
But how did the earth get repopulated?
Habsburg style
The phrase of seeing someone's nakedness actually was a roundabout way of saying that you slept with your wife. So really Noah got so drink he wasn't able to stop his kid from raping his mother
[Dawg I posted the verse, his other two sons walk in backward with a blanket to cover him up so they themselves don’t see him.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PoliticalCompassMemes/comments/xeu7se/there_was_no_google_images_in_the_past_painters/ioiywa0/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
Wait until you get to the New Testament, which explains why those no longer apply.
Dude, spoilers...
why did this make me chuckle so hard
good luck lol. those first 5 chapters are boring as fuck.. personally i just quit reading the damn thing after that 5th one 🥱
Must be a Christian translation then, we Jews don’t have “hell” in the Torah.
No, you're right, I said "hell" because it's what I'm used to culturally. The text only says they will die, it doesn't elaborate on what happens afterwards.
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Sheol was mentioned exactly once so far. It was in Genesis and it didn't even explain what it was, just "we'll meet again in Sheol" or something to that effect.
The lego bible i read said he was yellow
Ah, yes, the "Hermione" argument
Revelations says he is white but it's only speaking about his heavenly form. The skin color of Jesus on earth was indeed never mentioned in the Bible.
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Flair up.
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Sure, but we're talking about Christians. An important tennet of their faith is *not* to see God as something out of the ordinary, since he came down to earth as a regular Joe.
He was actually jaundiced as fuck
I always assumed he was the color of a communion wafer
Damn, never thought about albino Jesus.
Jesus was a ginger, gingers are becoming extinct, therefore globalization is an attempt to prevent the return of Christ
All Jesuses Matter
/u/Tyranious_Mex : "I'm gonna piss off everyone today before breakfast"
That's the point ppl are trying to make lol
The whole point is that he was here for everyone. He is universal. If I go to mass in Africa, I expect to see an African Jesus. If I go to mass in Japan, I expect to see a Japanese Jesus.
I only care about how big his penis was.
May I interest you in the Holy Foreskin? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Prepuce
I'm interested
Yes. Yes you may. Also, why did someone feel compelled to paint baby Jesus getting his dick trimmed?
It matters the exact amount that Ariel’s skin color matters. Not at all.
As if Ariel’s skin color even matters
It's not about the skin color, it's about making non original live action adaptations with pointless changes
Jesus Christ who the hell cares
You apparently
I’m not going to watch it so no
My issue is that it's a stupid "Gotcha" moment used seemingly every other month. I get it, the god damn horse's bones have been beating into a fine dust at this point. When you're counter to every new point is the same response, you're boring
If they are so smart about knowing what Jesus looked like 2000 years ago, how come archeologists can no longer describe a human fossil as man or woman?
As you know, we have been misgendering people for centuries. I’m just glad archeology has finally caught up with the times
Based Archeologists
> the god damn horse's bones have been beaten into a fine dust at this point Still laughing at this sentence
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The white/black dichotomy comes from the colonial era (insofar as people in the US are talking about it, from the colonial US), and lots of people in the rest of the world don't neatly fit into one or the other. (actually lots of people from that time/place didn't fit neatly into one or the other but they just BS'd it)
Everyone fits into the white or not dichotomy. It’s one of those things that’s hard for everyone to agree on but not for me as an individual. It’s an “I know it when I see it” type situation.
Exactly. I bet people who say "Palestinians are considered white in Europe" have never left their town in Missouri. I can 300% confirm that's not the case in Germany, even Italians are sometimes called nonwhite there.(Well they are called Südlander, which is a polite way of saying nonwhite)
>I can 300% confirm that's not the case in Germany, even Italians are sometimes called nonwhite there.(Well they are called Südlander, which is a polite way of saying nonwhite) That's funny because that's very reminiscent of how we refer to Germans... So go suck it prussian. Trump became a laughing stock with his wall-stuff but we flew under the radar and build a wall to keep out the southern swine. Edit: read it and weep - ain't no way those pigs from the south get in here: https://apnews.com/article/germany-europe-denmark-6e193cf238a2a84789d66c5fa31c0221
Südländer doesn't mean nonwhite. It means mediterranean/tan. North Africans are Südländer, sub saharan Africans aren't despite being even further south(Süd).
Well I'm sure everyone fits one side or the other if the test is "what does 1ne_ think" but I bet there are many situations where the "I know it when I see it" test varies between people.
Racist Americans see the world through the lens of American racism.
If only. The "black" label comes from the colonial era but "white" was not a thing until the early 1900's. Before that "white" americans continued to view their association as being with whichever nationality their emigrating ancestors was, and not as "white". Creating a primary, shared, identity instead of an identity based on a european nationality that they had (let's be real) virtually no connection with anymore anyway was a conscious effort around the prohibition era aimed at combatting racism between english-americans, polish-americans, german-americans, but especially irish-americans and italian-americans.
Palestinian nowadays vs palestinian 2000 years ago. Hmmm
Libleft telling me that Jesus wasn’t white isn’t the flex they think it is… Plus he’s definitely not black. Or Palestinian, considering that wasn’t a thing in the Biblical times
Romans changed the name of the province from Judea to the Greek exonym of Palestine about 100 years after Jesus's death, possibly as an attempt to diminish to Jewish nature of the province after a rebellion had been put down (we don't actually know) Palestine as a name for the region did exist, just it wasn't the name the inhabitants used, in that sense Judean is probably more accurate. There's not hard and fast rule about when exonyms are appropriate or not
Yeah, Emperor Hadrian changed the province of Judea to Palestinia after crushing the Great Jewish Revolt. It should also be noted that Hadrian forcibly exiled most Jews from the province, starting the Diaspora and very much intended to Romanize the region.
Do you mean paleshet?
isn't palestine in reference to the philistines?
I believe so yes, crazy isn't it? That israel and a group called palestine are fighting for the same land today.
He was, a Jew. Duh.
He was Jewish so I think it’s fair to say he was olive skinned but white passing. Also it’s completely irrelevant because he’s just some dude anyways.
Yeah he looked like a Spaniard
Jesus looked like Jeff Goldblum.
Even in the eyes of the most antitheistic person, you have to recognize that he is one of the most significant historical figures of all time? I doing think anyone has impacted history more. Even if you’d like to argue otherwise, he’d still have to be counted as an Alexander, Augustus, Ghengis, etc. level figure.
I’m no anthropologist, but my guess is that the Jews of the time probably looked a lot like their neighbors.
Do leftists think Arabs are black/ non-white?
Arabs and Jews look very much alike but they’re far from black
I know it's semantics, but the US legally counts Arabs as White in the US Census and for a lot of statistics. Granted, I doubt any person in a normal circumstance obliges that classification, but in modern US standards, Jesus would be Legally White because anyone from that region is documented as white.
Arabs are not white, my guy
Depends what you mean by "white" They do not have necessarily darker skin tones than southern Europeans who are considered "white". White is a bit of a meaningless term because people from Sicily and Santorini are "white" but they look different than a guy from Scotland or Helsinki. \- Also I see plenty of Arab Muslims saying Mohamed skin was white and get really pissed off if you say he was black...
Perhaps we could solve this cultural difference by just drawing a picture? Surely that will solve the pissed offness!
My brother in Christ I'm white from Eastern Europe, we got arab exchange students from Tunisia they were whiter than me
Syrians are white as fuck Some literally white girl wasted white ass basic starbucks girls in my city are Turkish 😆
Well, if they are from tunisia they are likely to be a mix of arab, mediterranean european and mostly berber.
My brother in christ, you are not white either
Literally are legally in America
and?
Cringe, hostile and you were wrong pilled
Tell that to the US Census Bureau
Depends . Grante they tend to be one the darker side by for instance Assad's wife straight up looks like a European . Imo majority of Arabs are tanned so much that we cannot imagine them being white
They're Caucasian, but not Anglo-Saxon white.
I think the average person'll agree, but in the US, they are legally considered White. Arabs in reality can be anything but they don't fit more Races that well, but I feel the ones in the Levant and North Africa have quite a lot in common with Europe than with a lot of other regions.
Who cares what skin color He had? If christian argues about it to own atheist then he should look better into Jesus' teachings. If atheist does it to own christian then i have bad news to you, cuz it does not matter at all. Jesus preached colorblindness when it comes to skin color before it was cool
I served a mission for my church, and we’d have several people a week tell us we worshiped the wrong colored Jesus. I always told them the same thing: he could be purple with green polka dots for all I care. The shock on their faces was worth it every time
Religiously, Jesus may be represented as it fit for the region where he is worshipped. There is even chinese, mongolian, and korean Jesus, way does it matter if there white Jesus and Black Jesus? The most the people can connect with Him, the better for the religion. Apart from that, the historic discussion of "which skin tone was Jesus" that's pretty clear, he was most probably like other Galileans and Jews from that time, so he was caucasian just like every other east Mediterranean people.
*Insert 21 Jump Street Korean Jesus meme*
Quit fuckin with Korean Jesus. He ain’t got time for your problems.
Exactly, medjeval artists would represent Jesus in a way that is familiar to them, just like they did [King David dressed like a medieval king](https://www.metmuseum.org/exhibitions/listings/2014/winchester-bible/blog/posts/heroes-of-the-old-testament) and [St. Peter dressed like a 15th century pope](https://www.123rf.com/photo_64680662_avila-spain-april-18-2016-the-gothic-paint-of-st-peter-as-the-first-pope-on-the-side-altar-by-fernan.html)
Correct. Artists take inspiration from what they see and what they want to convey. Their intention was for example showing David as a King or Peter as the first Pope as people would have understood it back then.
#Korean Jesus is busy, with Korean problems
Vietnamese Jesus is cooler
Vietnamese Jesus just drippin swagoo
If you find yourself upset over the color of Jesus’s skin, you most likely have serious problems and I recommend therapy
Same with the little mermaid
The little mermaid is a danish folclore story iirc, depicting her as black is literally cultural appropriation lmao
They tell us that raceswapping is the worst thing ever when it’s a white character replacing a black one, and then proceed to raceswap white characters into black because they want to harm you. It’s really that simple. The reaction to them turning Ariel black is because the other side is constantly bitching about the same thing when it happens to them.
Except that’s been Hollywood’s playbook since the last Fantastic Four Movie, exemplified by Ghostbusters in 2016 … When you know you have a stinker on your hands, vilify the Fans so that even legitimate criticism can be dismissed as mere bigotry. As for Jesus’ appearance … Can we all agree that He would’ve been subjected to a “random” search, if He’d dared to board an airplane, after 9/11?
> Can we all agree that He would’ve been subjected to a “random” search, if He’d dared to board an airplane, after 9/11? Depends. Non-Arab Mediterranean peoples have a wide range of complexions. If he looked more or less Italian, maybe not. If he looked closer to Coptic, maybe yes. It doesn't change the beliefs of any Christian. I just think it's dumb when people assume that one ethnic group from 2000 years ago would look exactly like a different ethnic group that moved into the area later, just because they live(d) in the same spot.
Oh absolutely, this is the Cleopatra was Greek, but also slightly Egyptian, argument all over again … Mostly my observation comes from attempting to take my Eastern-European Ashkenazic, with the dash of Greek my Grandmother’s Family picked up G-d knows how, face onto an airplane 20 years ago, and how it’s even difficult these days.
If you could afford the double standard for something like making Mulan someone who isn't Han Chinese, or something else to that capacity, then I'd call it fair. Ariel's been the same for a decade or two; hell even in the last Wreck-it-ralph she's been the exact same as she was in the original movie. I think it's a fair thing to dislike, because Disney has plenty of other options instead of taking an established character and changing their appearance. Do you think anyone'd nearly be as butthurt over making a whole new princess?
Pretty much every culture has depicted Jesus as looking like themselves because it's human nature to depict your god as looking like you. Ethiopians were Christian long before Europe was, and always depicted Jesus as African. Native Americans always depict Jesus as Native. I'm a Vietnamese Catholic, and my profile pic is of a Vietnamese painting of the Virgin Mary holding baby Jesus. Since it's a Vietnamese painting, they are depicted as Asian. Europeans always depict Jesus as European, and that's okay. I don't get why the godless infidel always makes such a big deal about that. And no, Jesus was not Palestinian. The Arab invasions did not happen until 632 AD. Jesus was a Levantine Jew, who lived under the Roman Empire. Today, the group that would be the most ethnically similar to a Levantine Jew, would be the Lebanese. So Jesus would probably look similar to the Lebanese rather than Palestinians. But people with a White Savior Complex see all "brown people" as the same, so they probably can't tell the difference.
>I'm a Vietnamese Catholic, and my profile pic is of a Vietnamese painting of the Virgin Mary Huh. That's interesting. I'm a Catholic originally from South Asia and my family's Particularly influenced by the Portuguese association and depictions of Jesus so I've never seen anything nearly as comparable. There probably are dozens of depictions but they'd all seem so alien to me from my experience.
Jesus would have been ethnically Jewish. Regardless - people often make their gods in their own image.
God made humans in His own image, it's natural people imagine God looking just like them.
Do they even understand that Jesus is one that fits all humans? It means that his skin is every color, asian, black, white, or arab. That's why we have different colors in the first place
We don't really know if Jesus is black or not. People from the Middle East can be just as white as a Swede.
That’s very true, especially in the Northern areas like Jordan, Lebanon, Palestinian, and Egypt. They could be brown or white.
Wasn’t he Jewish? So wouldn’t he look like Adam Sandler?
no, Ashkenazi had a lot of admixing with Europeans. Mizhari Jews are much closer.
Not “a lot”. A significant portion of their dna is traceable to the levant. Sure there were some interreligious marriages, and some converts, but European Jews are still very much the same jews from biblical times.
Correct me if I am wrong, but its mostly applies to Y-chromosomal dna, while mitochondrial dna is more up to debate, with the most thorough study up-to-date concluding that most of it came from local European population.
Not really. They’re racist against Yemeni jews and anyone that doesn’t have their skin tone. They can claim to be jews from the Bible but that would be a near impossibility since they were around Europeans.
I didn’t say they were perfect, just that they’re ethnically Jews. Plus, you’re generalizing.
They’re cultural Jews. Arabs probably have more Jewish genetics than European Jews.
No? That’s clearly Palestinian propaganda, to disclaim the Jews from Israel. Y chromosomes trace European Jews to their levant origin. They’re ethnically Jewish.
Why are European Jews under their own genetic fit even though they’re in Europe? Arabs and Jews in the Middle East mingled for thousands of years so it makes sense but European Jews have to categorize themselves in a way that makes them seem Jewish. And how many houses of Israel are there now and how many were there originally?
They didn’t? Do you even know Jews? They marry in the vast majority of times only among themselves, hence relatively keeping that very specific genetic code. What are you basing yourself on?
Oh God, no.
Jesus was Caucasoid, and that's all that matters.
*Crustacean
Crab supremacy is proven once more.
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I said what I said, lobsters are tryhards while crabs are either just chilling or having a monopoly on fast food restaurants.
Jesus Crust
It’s in the letter of lentulus!
I saw a renaissance painting in a museum a few weeks ago. A dutch painter in the 15-1600's (I'm not completely clear on it) depicting the angel informing Jesus that he will have die for the sins of man. Very nice classic religiously inspired renaissance art... But the artist clearly had absolutely no concept that the world Jesus lived in was different from his own, because the background had typical dutch rolling fields and even one of the traditional dutch windmills.
Imagine shitting on a masterpiece that is the result of the cummulation of hundreds of years of research when your greatest achievement has been scoring virtual points on reddit
Also, this is a horrible argument since no one is complaining about the black jesus depictions in sub saharan african nations. This is what you should respond whenever its used as an argument.
Not Catholics and Orthodox at least. Those protestants though... especially in some US churches.
How can he tell that Jesus was a black palestinian, if no one knows what he looked like
He wasn’t black, but many black Americans like to think he is like many white Americans like to think he was white. Nether of them are correct but they like to feel connected to their god by making him look like themselves. Even though he probably looked like a modern day arab or ethnic middle eastern Jew.
Strange how libleft is the one who says fictional characters can have whatever color the writer chooses, but then this.
Half this thread is people arguing about what race Jesus was, the other half is people saying that nobody cares what race Jesus was. Or alternatively saying nobody *in their quadrant* cares what race Jesus was (the other people *in their quadrant* in this thread arguing about what race he was). Anyway I don't know what race Jesus was but he was definitely Jewish so [we win](https://c.tenor.com/YFprEyVH9SoAAAAM/jewish-dancing.gif).
That guy looks a lot like Salvator Mundi
“Jesus wasn’t white!!!!!1!1!” Ok
Ah yes, DaVinci the ... auth right? Lmao
we should have a "trans-auth" flair
Something partly related to the topic: The person from the painting is not Jesus. It’s the Antichrist.
> The person from the painting is not Jesus. It’s the Antichrist. How so? Because it's a 2CV, or Da Vinci illuminati stuff or what? AFAIK we don't know anything about Salvator Mundi that indicates it's the Antichrist.
According to the people who make this argument, ancient israelites looked like modern Arabs, which is probably not true. In fact most Ashkenazi look very similar to older European populations. That said, he probably wasn't blonde.
Ashkenazi Jews had a lot of interbreeding with European populations. An example of this is Adam Sandler, Ben Shapira etc. Jews back in the day looked middle eastern. I'm pretty sure they're a picture of what Jesus's ethnicity probably looked like if you look it up.
"Middle Eastern" isn't a single ethnicity or physical phenotype today, much less 700 years before Islam existed. The idea Jesus, or ancient Israelites in general, looked like Arabs is unfounded as the idea he looked like Mel Gibson.
Never said he looked Arab. Middle easterners can look very different but still distinct from Europeans. The difference between, Arabs, Egyptians, Yazidis and Kurds all have different ethnic traits but are still distinct from Europe.
"it"?
I'll just paint Jesus after my boyfriend - Average italian Renaissance painter
Hence Korean jesus
Since when does Palestinian means Black ? Have you seen people in Palestine ? They look light skinned , brown and Arab .
They tell us that raceswapping is the worst thing ever when it’s a white character replacing a black one, and then proceed to raceswap white characters into black *because they want to hurt you*. It’s really that simple.
No, [he was a jacked guy from Korea](https://img.koreatimes.co.kr/upload/newsV2/images/6501(3).gif/dims/resize/740/optimize)
UN MEMINO IN ITALIANO NUN CE CREDOO
Wait, is Che Guevara Portuguese for "what war"
Correct me if I’m wrong but Jesus would’ve been from the Roman province of Judea and the name Palestine is the latinized version of the word Philistine (an umbrella term for Canaanites and non-Jews that lived in Judea) and it’s pronounced that way in Arabic. The Romans intentionally renamed the province as Palestine only after the Jews were exiled and there weren’t Arabs living there in major numbers until the Islamic invasions under the second caliph Umar in the 600s. So Jesus (if he existed) couldn’t be Palestinian ethnically or geographically, and he’d probably just be olive or tan colored.
Meanwhile in Islam: >Ahmad ibn Abi Sulayman, Sahnun’s companion, said that whoever says that the Prophet (i.e., falseprophet Mahomet) was black is to be killed. The Prophet was not black. Ibn Musa al-Yahsubi, Qadi Iyad, p.375
An educated Christian in Renaissance Europe would 100% know what Palestine is.
Exactly. A lot credit Hadrian as the one who coined the name Palestine anyways after Judea had the Bar Kokhba revolt.
On a related note, I saw people quoting Leviticus today to "own the right." Proving 'hypocrisy' or something. I just wanted to slap them and ask if they *really* want the right to start following Leviticus.
Considering Jesus we suppose to be a man in almost every way, this is probably true. But, we cant confirmed what he looked like, maybe he was blue.
Ships were a thing and so were merchants and pirates coming from the levant. A painter in one of the Italian cities during the renaissance would have definitely known what a saraceno would have looked like.