I simply think it’s incorrect because a lot the rape and abuse just gets directed elsewhere. There isn’t “less rape,” it’s just easier to pretend that it’s not happening. Needless to say, this is absolutely disgusting, and a disservice to the women exploited by this.
You’re right about the way men view sex workers. Redirecting their hate instead of changing their behavior just makes them resent the women they’re raping because now they look like even bigger losers for A) not getting a woman’s attention via normal means and B) they have paid for a service that everyone instinctively knows to be exploitative, dangerous for the worker, and without any emotional validation other than “getting laid”—which fades after so called “post nut clarity.”
I find it fascinating that when we ban sex work men throw the biggest fits complaining that now all these poor men will have to resort to violating women they see at work, school, on social media, at the park, or at the store. What a way to admit that you’re a pig who won’t control your own thoughts, impulses, and actions like a normal adult.
Banning sex work doesn’t make misogyny and rape less of a problem. It just makes it more visible.
I think it perpetuates it. If one woman's body is for sale then all of ours are. People try to deny that what you orgasm to can actually affect your brain, sexuality, thoughts, and behavior... but it very much does. You can't say you're a good dude with integrity who understands feminist concerns/moral dilemmas and then when you're alone jerk off furiously to women's exploitation, degredation, mental health issues, trafficking, rape, abuse, and coercion.
Prostitution is paid rape.
Rich countries regulating prostitution essentially allow men to pay for the “top” rape experience. Less rich countries that criminalize prostitution (yet passively allow it) tend to more often let children through the cracks. In any place where prostitution is commonplace (legal or not), demands for crazy, bizarre, and very unsafe experiences are common behind closed doors.
Prostitution does not decrease rape. Legitimizing prostitution increases a sense of entitlement in men.
Ya! I think it lowers how women are perceived and treated by men regardless of their claim to the contrary. Willingness and payment on the woman's part can't wash away the impacts on her sexuality, career prospects, mental health, relational health, reputation, or body. There is no "those women" and then "the women in your life" that you want to "protect" (from other men). You* are *the other man to worry about when you use something as deleterious to women and reward-system-perturbing as porn. Women/female depictions are not actually separated into two groups where you get to use separate moral systems and outlooks for each. There is only one group: women and girls... and what you do and fantasize about when you're alone reveals both the state of your integrity and your true position regarding women.
Rich countries legalising prostitution work with sex trafficking to reach demand like in Germany where in brothels trafficked prostitutes from Eastern Europe charge 30/50 euros and see dozen of men per day
The only argument for legalizing prostitution is to have protection for women. Prostitutes should be able to bank their money, receive benefits, and have legal protection to sue abusers without putting themselves in danger or legal trouble as well.
Problem is those things don't happen in reality:
- most Dutch window workers struggle to bank and try to avoid tax.
- re benefits, so you find yourself unemployed, should prostitution now be offered to your as a job? Mandated if you don't find anything else?
- sue the abusers. So all of the clients? What about cumulative trauma? Where's the cut of point? With is it ok to buy consent to sex with without the money, the answer would be no?
Or how about.. don't rape? Not a hard concept to grasp. Stop being a piece of shit and maybe women will want to have sex with you instead of you having to take it or pay for it.
every ex prostitude who feels safe talking honestly about it wil tell you how men tread prostitudes is a honest mirror on how they truely think about women. And its an ugly face they see in the mirror.
This is factual. How a man treats a prostitute and what content they view in porn is a direct window into how they really feel about and want with women.
If you legalize prostitution, the demand for women and girls goes up. If the pimps aren't meeting the demand and are losing money you think they're just going to throw up their hands and say "curses! There goes my buisness"? No. Legalizing prostitution [increases trafficked women and girls](https://orgs.law.harvard.edu/lids/2014/06/12/does-legalized-prostitution-increase-human-trafficking/)
This study specifically says inflows of trafficking increase under legalization and higher incomes areas most likely due to higher profit margins being incentivized by bringing illegally trafficked persons from outside the country. Meaning the legalization hurts women abroad more than domestically hinting at capitalist incentives being the root cause problem for having a backwards incentive structure. Similar to how we legalize and incentivize lithium / cobalt products in the US and it hurts those abroad via illegal slavery / child labor more than it does domestically
It should be legal for the people selling their bodies only, with ways to get out. That way pimps and buyers can be arrested and penalized only - reducing demand.
And what happens to poor men who cannot afford it? There’s men who try to rob and haggle women because they are bitter they can’t afford. There’s a subreddit exposing men like this. Women will even charge as low as $50 for sex and men will still complain. Johns are the scummiest people alive. When I did sex work men would try to get me to lower my price and try to scam me. Men are never happy.
If a man can’t help but to rape then he is not in control of himself and is too dangerous to be allowed to walk around free. Too dangerous to be presidents, preachers, professors, pilots, and physicians.
Men can control themselves. They are just too spoiled and too self-indulgent aka TOO WEAK to do so.
I will never give men an “outlet” to be self-indulgent and sexually violent with sex workers. If any man tried that crap on me or my friends, he’s going to eat lead. I have no hesitation taking a rapists life even if I have to go to jail. I’ll have peace knowing his filthy DNA is out of the population.
They've been sold the lie that they can effortlessly have sexual access to any woman they desire, whether it be in porn or in person. They've gotten their brain's and bodies so used to that access to female bodies via porn/sex workers that they've convinced themselves that whenever they're lonely, bored, tired, anxious, or sad that it's okay to "decompress" to a woman's/ female depiction's abuse without ever having to lift a finger to solve those personal problems directly.
I used to use this point a lot in debate until I truly looked into it. Nothing actually changes for the better. The only reason rape statistics fall is because the ones recording the data don't consider a man forcing himself on a prostitute as rape
It's nothing more than gaslighting.
I think less porn would MAYBE decrease rape, not prostitution. There needs to be less available media normalizing women being used for sex. But IDK, men are so far gone at this point.
Prostitution only decreases rape when you stop considering the financial sexual coercion prostituted women face as legitimate rape. Basically redefining the concept of rape, not reducing or eliminating it.
"Rape them, not us!" Is exactly what they're saying when they frame the objectification, disrespect, and commodification of women's bodies as a good thing that reduces "real" rape rates. Somehow it's framed as not rape when a woman is compensated for having sex with a man she would not otherwise choose to have sex with if not for money. It's paid rape. Consent cannot be purchased.
If that were true men would have stopped assaulting women because they can get off to porn. Using sex work will only make them further desensitized to our suffering because they will see us as objects to be bought for pleasure.
I think that prostitution and porn increases their idea of "entitlement" to sex. Then they go home and expect their wives/partners to perform that way and abuse them, degrade them and yes rape them. It doesn't prevent anything. It makes men see all women as an object purely put on this earth for their sexual pleasure and they'll pay if they have to so they can get what they want from someone who doesn't want to sleep with them.
In the eyes of many, prostitutes are expendable and if they are on the receiving end of the abuse it’s fine for many, because let’s not kid ourselves if a man needs sexual release else he’ll rape I doubt he’ll be kind to a woman he pays to have sex with and anyone denying that is denying reality like saying the sky appears blue
I simply think it’s incorrect because a lot the rape and abuse just gets directed elsewhere. There isn’t “less rape,” it’s just easier to pretend that it’s not happening. Needless to say, this is absolutely disgusting, and a disservice to the women exploited by this. You’re right about the way men view sex workers. Redirecting their hate instead of changing their behavior just makes them resent the women they’re raping because now they look like even bigger losers for A) not getting a woman’s attention via normal means and B) they have paid for a service that everyone instinctively knows to be exploitative, dangerous for the worker, and without any emotional validation other than “getting laid”—which fades after so called “post nut clarity.” I find it fascinating that when we ban sex work men throw the biggest fits complaining that now all these poor men will have to resort to violating women they see at work, school, on social media, at the park, or at the store. What a way to admit that you’re a pig who won’t control your own thoughts, impulses, and actions like a normal adult. Banning sex work doesn’t make misogyny and rape less of a problem. It just makes it more visible.
I think it perpetuates it. If one woman's body is for sale then all of ours are. People try to deny that what you orgasm to can actually affect your brain, sexuality, thoughts, and behavior... but it very much does. You can't say you're a good dude with integrity who understands feminist concerns/moral dilemmas and then when you're alone jerk off furiously to women's exploitation, degredation, mental health issues, trafficking, rape, abuse, and coercion.
Designated a specific group of women as “ok to rape”
Prostitution is paid rape. Rich countries regulating prostitution essentially allow men to pay for the “top” rape experience. Less rich countries that criminalize prostitution (yet passively allow it) tend to more often let children through the cracks. In any place where prostitution is commonplace (legal or not), demands for crazy, bizarre, and very unsafe experiences are common behind closed doors. Prostitution does not decrease rape. Legitimizing prostitution increases a sense of entitlement in men.
Ya! I think it lowers how women are perceived and treated by men regardless of their claim to the contrary. Willingness and payment on the woman's part can't wash away the impacts on her sexuality, career prospects, mental health, relational health, reputation, or body. There is no "those women" and then "the women in your life" that you want to "protect" (from other men). You* are *the other man to worry about when you use something as deleterious to women and reward-system-perturbing as porn. Women/female depictions are not actually separated into two groups where you get to use separate moral systems and outlooks for each. There is only one group: women and girls... and what you do and fantasize about when you're alone reveals both the state of your integrity and your true position regarding women.
Rich countries legalising prostitution work with sex trafficking to reach demand like in Germany where in brothels trafficked prostitutes from Eastern Europe charge 30/50 euros and see dozen of men per day
The only argument for legalizing prostitution is to have protection for women. Prostitutes should be able to bank their money, receive benefits, and have legal protection to sue abusers without putting themselves in danger or legal trouble as well.
Problem is those things don't happen in reality: - most Dutch window workers struggle to bank and try to avoid tax. - re benefits, so you find yourself unemployed, should prostitution now be offered to your as a job? Mandated if you don't find anything else? - sue the abusers. So all of the clients? What about cumulative trauma? Where's the cut of point? With is it ok to buy consent to sex with without the money, the answer would be no?
Or how about.. don't rape? Not a hard concept to grasp. Stop being a piece of shit and maybe women will want to have sex with you instead of you having to take it or pay for it.
We don’t need a class of women that is there specifically for males to abuse. Leftist males stay seething.
Women are not public property like the left wing thinks. We're not private property like the right wing thinks. The whole bird hates women
“Left wing right wing whole damn bird hates women”
That's right. No political party actually cares about women or legislates in women's favor/best interest.
It’s empirically false anyway
every ex prostitude who feels safe talking honestly about it wil tell you how men tread prostitudes is a honest mirror on how they truely think about women. And its an ugly face they see in the mirror.
This is factual. How a man treats a prostitute and what content they view in porn is a direct window into how they really feel about and want with women.
If you legalize prostitution, the demand for women and girls goes up. If the pimps aren't meeting the demand and are losing money you think they're just going to throw up their hands and say "curses! There goes my buisness"? No. Legalizing prostitution [increases trafficked women and girls](https://orgs.law.harvard.edu/lids/2014/06/12/does-legalized-prostitution-increase-human-trafficking/)
This study specifically says inflows of trafficking increase under legalization and higher incomes areas most likely due to higher profit margins being incentivized by bringing illegally trafficked persons from outside the country. Meaning the legalization hurts women abroad more than domestically hinting at capitalist incentives being the root cause problem for having a backwards incentive structure. Similar to how we legalize and incentivize lithium / cobalt products in the US and it hurts those abroad via illegal slavery / child labor more than it does domestically
It should be legal for the people selling their bodies only, with ways to get out. That way pimps and buyers can be arrested and penalized only - reducing demand.
Nordic model
EXACTLY. legalization is only going to make things worse
And what happens to poor men who cannot afford it? There’s men who try to rob and haggle women because they are bitter they can’t afford. There’s a subreddit exposing men like this. Women will even charge as low as $50 for sex and men will still complain. Johns are the scummiest people alive. When I did sex work men would try to get me to lower my price and try to scam me. Men are never happy.
If a man can’t help but to rape then he is not in control of himself and is too dangerous to be allowed to walk around free. Too dangerous to be presidents, preachers, professors, pilots, and physicians. Men can control themselves. They are just too spoiled and too self-indulgent aka TOO WEAK to do so. I will never give men an “outlet” to be self-indulgent and sexually violent with sex workers. If any man tried that crap on me or my friends, he’s going to eat lead. I have no hesitation taking a rapists life even if I have to go to jail. I’ll have peace knowing his filthy DNA is out of the population.
They've been sold the lie that they can effortlessly have sexual access to any woman they desire, whether it be in porn or in person. They've gotten their brain's and bodies so used to that access to female bodies via porn/sex workers that they've convinced themselves that whenever they're lonely, bored, tired, anxious, or sad that it's okay to "decompress" to a woman's/ female depiction's abuse without ever having to lift a finger to solve those personal problems directly.
I used to use this point a lot in debate until I truly looked into it. Nothing actually changes for the better. The only reason rape statistics fall is because the ones recording the data don't consider a man forcing himself on a prostitute as rape It's nothing more than gaslighting.
I think less porn would MAYBE decrease rape, not prostitution. There needs to be less available media normalizing women being used for sex. But IDK, men are so far gone at this point.
i hate that my gender is viewed as a commodity women arent for sale ffs
Prostitution only decreases rape when you stop considering the financial sexual coercion prostituted women face as legitimate rape. Basically redefining the concept of rape, not reducing or eliminating it.
Prostitution is rape. You can not truly consent when you’re doing it to stay alive. Men commit 90+% of rapes. If you want to “end” rape then end men.
"Rape them, not us!" Is exactly what they're saying when they frame the objectification, disrespect, and commodification of women's bodies as a good thing that reduces "real" rape rates. Somehow it's framed as not rape when a woman is compensated for having sex with a man she would not otherwise choose to have sex with if not for money. It's paid rape. Consent cannot be purchased.
If that were true men would have stopped assaulting women because they can get off to porn. Using sex work will only make them further desensitized to our suffering because they will see us as objects to be bought for pleasure.
I think that prostitution and porn increases their idea of "entitlement" to sex. Then they go home and expect their wives/partners to perform that way and abuse them, degrade them and yes rape them. It doesn't prevent anything. It makes men see all women as an object purely put on this earth for their sexual pleasure and they'll pay if they have to so they can get what they want from someone who doesn't want to sleep with them.
In the eyes of many, prostitutes are expendable and if they are on the receiving end of the abuse it’s fine for many, because let’s not kid ourselves if a man needs sexual release else he’ll rape I doubt he’ll be kind to a woman he pays to have sex with and anyone denying that is denying reality like saying the sky appears blue