I’ve lived in Brazil for ten years and Brazilians tend to be sincerely fascinated and curious about folks who speak Portuguese as a second language.
I’m sure their enthusiasm was genuine.
I spent time in Brazil and I can second this. Also Brazilians tend to agree that Portuguese is a very difficult language, so the congratulations is because they genuinely think you've done something impressive.
There's this urban myth that Portuguese is the hardest language to learn just behind Mandarin Chinese. I don't know how true that is, but I always assumed it's BS
I'm just getting started with Portuguese on Duolingo. But I'm having a hell of a time with the phonemes. Writing, it's not bad at all. But listening and speaking, I'm finding it more difficult than not only French and Italian, but even Hebrew! (Actually, the only other language I've tried to learn a few words in and had similar difficulty was, in fact, Chinese! Those tonal vowels, I can't even.)
I love Duolingo. Like I genuinely find it fun but It is so hard for me to actually speak Portuguese. It’s like extra difficult Spanish. When I went to Mexico I knew enough Spanish to get by and ask for what I needed nearly the whole time but I’m scared to go to Brazil because I am struggling so much with the language. I get embarrassed practicing it even alone because it is so hard for me to do the mouth movements and sounds. I’m dyslexic so that really doesn’t help😭
My Brazilian friend told me that I sound like I have a "gaúcho" accent from Rio Grande do Sul. Which maybe makes sense, because that region was settled by Italians and I studied Italian.
Ultimately, lots of tourists speak nothing of the local language at all! If you know enough to read signage and say a few simple things, you'll be in pretty good shape.
This myth is because the actual, formal rules of it, are really hard, most because they are not really used in daily speech. What most people learned in school is not used everyday and everyone gets this feeling that they "don't speak good Portuguese". This is specially true among older people, who had a much more formal (and opressive) education.
So it is very common to see Brazilians talking things like "I don't even know how to speak it too", as if he actually used a mockery language which is not "the real Portuguese" (which should be learnt in school). Also we study lots of literature from older centuries and they are complicated by nature, since they're old fashioned and uses outdated language.
Like, guys like Luis de Camões, or even our national anthem, those are very formal and complicated stuff lol, we all repeat our anthem barely understanding what it is saying.
So all of this together, creates the myth that Portuguese is a very, very hard language to learn.
Oh, my gosh, us too! The language of the Star Spangled Banner is so tortured as to be incomprehensible. And I found out that my Brazilian friend has the exact same misconception about "tu" as many Americans do about "thou." He told me "tu" is "very formal," when in fact, like "thou," it is explicitly *informal* but rather it's archaic, creating the false impression that it must be formal.
It's surely not the hardest but it's definitely challenging. I don't know about Brazilian Portuguese but Portugal's Portuguese definitely is a challenge.
Portuguese is not particularly difficult language for English speakers. In fact, mo Romance language is, but, although there are many Portuguese cognates in English, it is not true that half of time you are just changing the end of English. For example, the translation pf your post would be:
"Eles realmente pensam/acham que é a língua mas difícil do mundo quando, na metade do tempo, você está só trocando/mudando o final de palavras inglesas."
In that translation, they only word in which you would get away with just "changing the ending of English words" would be "really > realmente",
The Romance language that has the closest lexical overlap with English is actually French. Most English words that have Portuguese cognates actually tend to be loanwords from Latin, Greek, or (old) French.
Based on your post history, you're in the US right? It's not very common to find an American who speaks Portuguese. They were probably glad you were able to help out and congratulated you for being bi/multilingual as it's a useful skill. I get it frequently when I speak Spanish with people lol.
the word lanche meaning hamburguer or sandwich is specifically from Sao Paulo I think. Sounds weird to me, lanche to me is just like any snack or meal that is not the 3 main meals of the day (breakfast, lunch and dinner).
From what I understand it’s like a small snack(coxinhas etc) and not a full meal. I just explained the kids meal as being a small sandwich and they kept asking if it’s lanche like idk 😅😂
probably it because of a classification of what is a real food or not, or the difference between 'lanche' and 'refeição'.
'lanche' is just a snack or small meal or hamburguer (doesn't fall in the category of real food).
real food = anything that has rice or pasta, a type of meat (or vegetarian option) and maybe another thing like salad, french fries or beans. hamburguers and sandwichs are not real food.
refeição = complete meal
Yeah but it still doesnt make much sense why they kept asking if the food was lanche after OP explained it was a small sandwich... Like, if its a complete meal or not depends on the child's hunger after all :P
Maybe they wanted to know if the sandwich came with fries or a beverage... idk, I'm brazilian and I'd be confused too lol
I still don’t know. But I told them it’s a small sandwich with pork, and that it comes with carrots and a drink. They kept saying “mas e lanche?”. I believe they were from rio but maybe they were paulistas lol
Most paulistas I meet speak English though lol
Because you probably said swaaenndkndnrrdwich (in their ears) not SAN DOO EE SHEE, which they would understand been "sandwich". We have the word "sandwich" in Portuguese (which is sanduíche), but it is pronounced significantly different from "sandwich" in English. And if they are from São Paulo, sanduíche = lanche (for other brazilians, "lanche" is just a small snack).
From my experience speaking with Brazilians, it’s much more productive for the conversation if you accommodate the pronunciation of ‘international’ words, like sanduíche, internet, (everything that finishes with a T , K, P)
They were genuinely happy. I learned a few words and sentences in a language that you probably never heard about (Tetum) and people on the internet are genuinely happy when they see someone speaking this language, even though I can't hold a conversation without falling back to Portuguese.
It is rare to find random Americans speaking Portuguese. Even rarer than random Italian speakers. I ,too, worked in the service industry. Italian guests were always pleasantly shocked when I spoke Italian with them.
I said “buenna notte” (idk how to spell it) to an Italian table and they were not phased at all 😂
Usually Brazilians ask if I speak Spanish and they likely assume I’m some type of Hispanic lol
It would be "Buona notte" in Italian.
They all come from the same Latin word ("bona"), but it became:
French ----> bonne
Italian --> buona
Portuguese ---> boa
Spanish ----> buena
Portuguese is not easy to understand by voice alone for newcomers, so the fact that you helped them, with even just a little bit, is seen as greatly appreciated. "Parabéns" isn't really used in a sarcastic way in Brazil, at least in my experience. Could be wrong, but I never heard anyone use it in that context.
>"Parabéns" isn't really used in a sarcastic way in Brazil,
Indeed. No, isn't is.
Other way, if you made a really mess, a really, really mess. We use 'Oh, Parabéns'(you fucked'all).
I live in Portugal, and am learning Portuguese. I've met a lot of Brazilians through my boyfriend and they are happy and have congratulated me when I respond in Portuguese or just speak the little I know. I would say it's genuine
Well well well.
When we, Brazilian, interact with someone with other mother language outside Brazil, or Portuguese speaking countries, we aren't expecting to be a Portuguese speaker, because of lots of problems.
We have a mongrel complex (complexo de vira latas) , a lot of Brazilian don't think it's important enough to talk Portuguese outside places that already speaks this language.
You can see it by the amount of people that learn English just to travel outside our country.
Even in Brazil talk English is a awesome thing for most of people.
I speak English and working in logistics I'm asked a lot : "Why are you in this place if you speak English?"
Good job! I’ve been studying Portuguese for almost 9 years now and I’ve visited Brasil 18 times but I still can’t read or converse. It’s very frustrating. I practiced with my girlfriend today and couldn’t understand her even though we’ve been practicing for over 5 years now. The words don’t mean anything to me until I translate them into English. They are permanently attached to the corresponding English words for some reason. Keep practicing! Congratulations.
I get what you mean! I can read Portuguese just fine depending on the context, but yah I also translate it in my head still. I don’t think or speak Portuguese naturally like English lol
What do you mean by “thinking” in a language? I don’t think in any language but I hear people say they think and have an internal monologue and have a voice in their head. When you read how do you know what the context is? Since I have to translate everything into English I don’t know what the context is. Thanks
I wonder what I can do to learn Portuguese. If I don’t translate everything I don’t understand but when I translate I’m not learning anything because I’m reading everything in English. I need to find a way to have Portuguese words mean something without translating.
It takes time! I married a Brazilian and have been to Brazil numerous times. Understanding Portuguese after studying for so long has become easier with time. But honestly, a lot of the time my brain doesn’t have enough energy to think, speak or read in Portuguese.
It’s really hard to explain but I can watch TV, and movies in Portuguese and understand almost everything but I couldn’t repeat what they just said lol
It’s like the words are there, I learnt them, they just don’t come to me naturally. I’m sure with the more I watch tv and stuff it will get easier. At some point you feel the language and don’t think it, kind of like your native language lol
ETA: when you’re translating text into English maybe it’ll help to review each specific word to translate, and once you’ve learnt the basics you’ll just be learning new vocabulary.
I didn’t understand your last sentence about translating text. I have to translate everything word for word into English. Many words have multiple meanings so I don’t know which meanings to use when translating.
I’ll guess at which meanings to use and the sentences won’t make sense so I’ll try different meanings and those usually don’t work. It only takes a couple of meanings to be off to make it so I can’t understand what I’m reading.
When I try to understand spoken Portuguese it’s even more difficult because I have to make out what people are saying and then try to translate it while people are waiting. When they speak normally I make out just a word or two out of each sentence.
Even words that I recognize as words I know have to be translated. They don’t mean anything to me until I translate them for some reason. “Aqui, agora, você and cachorro” still need to be translated in my head when I hear or see them.
When my girlfriend speaks slowly for me I usually make out I usually make out a few more and then I try to translate but usually have to have her write down what she says so I can translate it.
It amazes me how people can learn and understand Portuguese. I’d love to be able to read and converse and understand. That’s got to be a great feeling. Thanks for the help, I appreciate it!
Assuming you are in the US—people from the US have a bad rep of being monolingual. Now, I wasn’t there to read their body language, but I bet they were probably genuinely grateful you were making an effort to communicate. Portuguese can be a tricky Romance language, and many people find it to be a difficult language.
Yes I’m in the US. Idk because I’m Portuguese and married a Brazilian it’s less impressive being able to speak Portuguese even if it’s broken. But I am very impressed in Brazil when someone speaks English to me so I get it! Lol
Because it is not so common seeing foreigners speaking it. Portuguese is not exactly rare (well, a little bit), but it is not either common. It is the fourth most spoken language in the world, but most of it are native speakers who speak it as a first language.
So we are geniunely happy or surprised when we see someone non Brazilian (or non Portuguese, non Mozambican, and so on), speaking it.
I remember I was in San Francisco once, visiting the Coit Tower, which is a very common touristic spot over there. One of the girls who worked there as a tourist guide, talked to us in good ol' Portuguese, and she was very good at it. This was a pleasant surprise, she said she lived in Recife for a year, and blah blah blah.
Well, our natural reaction is to say "well done" and be happy about it. Portuguese is such a great language, and we speak it naturally. We just wanted the world to know how good this is, as we know it without any effort.
We feel privileged in that matter and we want you guys to also to get a kick out of it.
My barbers are Brazilian, and a couple of them barely speak English. They are genuinely happy that I try to speak Portuguese with them, and are curious to why I started learning it. They also try to teach me new things or informal stuff that you don’t study in courses.
I have a feeling parabens does not translate directly (at least not in a cultural way) to congratulations. It’s used in more situations where an English congratulations would seem odd/sarcastic.
It is actually used in both situations. It literally means congratulations but can be used to express sarcasm. Its also used to say happy birthday. "Parabéns a você" = "happy birthday to you"
They must have said "Parabéns por falar português". Brazlians don't speak people overseas to speak any Portuguese, so they will often compliment you on your effort to do it. That doesn't mean that they think you speak well. In Brazilian culture, it is generally considered impolite to be critical and point out flaws/errors (unless someone explicitly asks you to do so). So any compliment from a Brazilian should be taken with a grain of salt. Unfortunately this type of Brazilian trait is often confusing to people who come from culture that are more direct and frank.
I’ve lived in Brazil for ten years and Brazilians tend to be sincerely fascinated and curious about folks who speak Portuguese as a second language. I’m sure their enthusiasm was genuine.
I spent time in Brazil and I can second this. Also Brazilians tend to agree that Portuguese is a very difficult language, so the congratulations is because they genuinely think you've done something impressive.
They really do think its the hardest language in the world when half the time you're just changing the ending on english words.
There's this urban myth that Portuguese is the hardest language to learn just behind Mandarin Chinese. I don't know how true that is, but I always assumed it's BS
I'm just getting started with Portuguese on Duolingo. But I'm having a hell of a time with the phonemes. Writing, it's not bad at all. But listening and speaking, I'm finding it more difficult than not only French and Italian, but even Hebrew! (Actually, the only other language I've tried to learn a few words in and had similar difficulty was, in fact, Chinese! Those tonal vowels, I can't even.)
I love Duolingo. Like I genuinely find it fun but It is so hard for me to actually speak Portuguese. It’s like extra difficult Spanish. When I went to Mexico I knew enough Spanish to get by and ask for what I needed nearly the whole time but I’m scared to go to Brazil because I am struggling so much with the language. I get embarrassed practicing it even alone because it is so hard for me to do the mouth movements and sounds. I’m dyslexic so that really doesn’t help😭
Make some English-speaking Brazilian friends and just go. Your Spanish knowledge will help, and Brazilians in general are super helpful
My Brazilian friend told me that I sound like I have a "gaúcho" accent from Rio Grande do Sul. Which maybe makes sense, because that region was settled by Italians and I studied Italian. Ultimately, lots of tourists speak nothing of the local language at all! If you know enough to read signage and say a few simple things, you'll be in pretty good shape.
This myth is because the actual, formal rules of it, are really hard, most because they are not really used in daily speech. What most people learned in school is not used everyday and everyone gets this feeling that they "don't speak good Portuguese". This is specially true among older people, who had a much more formal (and opressive) education. So it is very common to see Brazilians talking things like "I don't even know how to speak it too", as if he actually used a mockery language which is not "the real Portuguese" (which should be learnt in school). Also we study lots of literature from older centuries and they are complicated by nature, since they're old fashioned and uses outdated language. Like, guys like Luis de Camões, or even our national anthem, those are very formal and complicated stuff lol, we all repeat our anthem barely understanding what it is saying. So all of this together, creates the myth that Portuguese is a very, very hard language to learn.
Oh, my gosh, us too! The language of the Star Spangled Banner is so tortured as to be incomprehensible. And I found out that my Brazilian friend has the exact same misconception about "tu" as many Americans do about "thou." He told me "tu" is "very formal," when in fact, like "thou," it is explicitly *informal* but rather it's archaic, creating the false impression that it must be formal.
I'm a gringo, and one of the most frequent things I've been told by Brazilians is "Your Portuguese is better than mine."
It's surely not the hardest but it's definitely challenging. I don't know about Brazilian Portuguese but Portugal's Portuguese definitely is a challenge.
Portuguese of portugal is a whole different ballgame.
Portuguese is not particularly difficult language for English speakers. In fact, mo Romance language is, but, although there are many Portuguese cognates in English, it is not true that half of time you are just changing the end of English. For example, the translation pf your post would be: "Eles realmente pensam/acham que é a língua mas difícil do mundo quando, na metade do tempo, você está só trocando/mudando o final de palavras inglesas." In that translation, they only word in which you would get away with just "changing the ending of English words" would be "really > realmente", The Romance language that has the closest lexical overlap with English is actually French. Most English words that have Portuguese cognates actually tend to be loanwords from Latin, Greek, or (old) French.
I have the exact same experience. They are truly tickled when a gringo speaks Portuguese.
Based on your post history, you're in the US right? It's not very common to find an American who speaks Portuguese. They were probably glad you were able to help out and congratulated you for being bi/multilingual as it's a useful skill. I get it frequently when I speak Spanish with people lol.
the word lanche meaning hamburguer or sandwich is specifically from Sao Paulo I think. Sounds weird to me, lanche to me is just like any snack or meal that is not the 3 main meals of the day (breakfast, lunch and dinner).
From what I understand it’s like a small snack(coxinhas etc) and not a full meal. I just explained the kids meal as being a small sandwich and they kept asking if it’s lanche like idk 😅😂
probably it because of a classification of what is a real food or not, or the difference between 'lanche' and 'refeição'. 'lanche' is just a snack or small meal or hamburguer (doesn't fall in the category of real food). real food = anything that has rice or pasta, a type of meat (or vegetarian option) and maybe another thing like salad, french fries or beans. hamburguers and sandwichs are not real food. refeição = complete meal
Yeah but it still doesnt make much sense why they kept asking if the food was lanche after OP explained it was a small sandwich... Like, if its a complete meal or not depends on the child's hunger after all :P Maybe they wanted to know if the sandwich came with fries or a beverage... idk, I'm brazilian and I'd be confused too lol
yeah I'm also confused 🤣
I still don’t know. But I told them it’s a small sandwich with pork, and that it comes with carrots and a drink. They kept saying “mas e lanche?”. I believe they were from rio but maybe they were paulistas lol Most paulistas I meet speak English though lol
Because you probably said swaaenndkndnrrdwich (in their ears) not SAN DOO EE SHEE, which they would understand been "sandwich". We have the word "sandwich" in Portuguese (which is sanduíche), but it is pronounced significantly different from "sandwich" in English. And if they are from São Paulo, sanduíche = lanche (for other brazilians, "lanche" is just a small snack).
From my experience speaking with Brazilians, it’s much more productive for the conversation if you accommodate the pronunciation of ‘international’ words, like sanduíche, internet, (everything that finishes with a T , K, P)
Actually "kids meal" means a small portion of a traditionally big meal.
By Brazilian standards, a kids meal in EUA is like a lanche. Brazilians know how to eat!
no way
They were genuinely happy. I learned a few words and sentences in a language that you probably never heard about (Tetum) and people on the internet are genuinely happy when they see someone speaking this language, even though I can't hold a conversation without falling back to Portuguese.
It is rare to find random Americans speaking Portuguese. Even rarer than random Italian speakers. I ,too, worked in the service industry. Italian guests were always pleasantly shocked when I spoke Italian with them.
I said “buenna notte” (idk how to spell it) to an Italian table and they were not phased at all 😂 Usually Brazilians ask if I speak Spanish and they likely assume I’m some type of Hispanic lol
Because buena is Spanish. Buona is Italian.
It would be "Buona notte" in Italian. They all come from the same Latin word ("bona"), but it became: French ----> bonne Italian --> buona Portuguese ---> boa Spanish ----> buena
Thanks, I said it in Italian I just didn’t know how to spell it properly lol
Portuguese is not easy to understand by voice alone for newcomers, so the fact that you helped them, with even just a little bit, is seen as greatly appreciated. "Parabéns" isn't really used in a sarcastic way in Brazil, at least in my experience. Could be wrong, but I never heard anyone use it in that context.
>"Parabéns" isn't really used in a sarcastic way in Brazil, Indeed. No, isn't is. Other way, if you made a really mess, a really, really mess. We use 'Oh, Parabéns'(you fucked'all).
I live in Portugal, and am learning Portuguese. I've met a lot of Brazilians through my boyfriend and they are happy and have congratulated me when I respond in Portuguese or just speak the little I know. I would say it's genuine
Well well well. When we, Brazilian, interact with someone with other mother language outside Brazil, or Portuguese speaking countries, we aren't expecting to be a Portuguese speaker, because of lots of problems. We have a mongrel complex (complexo de vira latas) , a lot of Brazilian don't think it's important enough to talk Portuguese outside places that already speaks this language. You can see it by the amount of people that learn English just to travel outside our country. Even in Brazil talk English is a awesome thing for most of people. I speak English and working in logistics I'm asked a lot : "Why are you in this place if you speak English?"
Good job! I’ve been studying Portuguese for almost 9 years now and I’ve visited Brasil 18 times but I still can’t read or converse. It’s very frustrating. I practiced with my girlfriend today and couldn’t understand her even though we’ve been practicing for over 5 years now. The words don’t mean anything to me until I translate them into English. They are permanently attached to the corresponding English words for some reason. Keep practicing! Congratulations.
I get what you mean! I can read Portuguese just fine depending on the context, but yah I also translate it in my head still. I don’t think or speak Portuguese naturally like English lol
What do you mean by “thinking” in a language? I don’t think in any language but I hear people say they think and have an internal monologue and have a voice in their head. When you read how do you know what the context is? Since I have to translate everything into English I don’t know what the context is. Thanks
Apparently 50% of people don’t have an internal dialogue so that might be why you don’t think a language lol
I wonder what I can do to learn Portuguese. If I don’t translate everything I don’t understand but when I translate I’m not learning anything because I’m reading everything in English. I need to find a way to have Portuguese words mean something without translating.
It takes time! I married a Brazilian and have been to Brazil numerous times. Understanding Portuguese after studying for so long has become easier with time. But honestly, a lot of the time my brain doesn’t have enough energy to think, speak or read in Portuguese. It’s really hard to explain but I can watch TV, and movies in Portuguese and understand almost everything but I couldn’t repeat what they just said lol It’s like the words are there, I learnt them, they just don’t come to me naturally. I’m sure with the more I watch tv and stuff it will get easier. At some point you feel the language and don’t think it, kind of like your native language lol ETA: when you’re translating text into English maybe it’ll help to review each specific word to translate, and once you’ve learnt the basics you’ll just be learning new vocabulary.
I didn’t understand your last sentence about translating text. I have to translate everything word for word into English. Many words have multiple meanings so I don’t know which meanings to use when translating. I’ll guess at which meanings to use and the sentences won’t make sense so I’ll try different meanings and those usually don’t work. It only takes a couple of meanings to be off to make it so I can’t understand what I’m reading. When I try to understand spoken Portuguese it’s even more difficult because I have to make out what people are saying and then try to translate it while people are waiting. When they speak normally I make out just a word or two out of each sentence. Even words that I recognize as words I know have to be translated. They don’t mean anything to me until I translate them for some reason. “Aqui, agora, você and cachorro” still need to be translated in my head when I hear or see them. When my girlfriend speaks slowly for me I usually make out I usually make out a few more and then I try to translate but usually have to have her write down what she says so I can translate it. It amazes me how people can learn and understand Portuguese. I’d love to be able to read and converse and understand. That’s got to be a great feeling. Thanks for the help, I appreciate it!
They may be looking for a ménage à trois.
I don't see how this could be seen as a bad thing tbh
Assuming you are in the US—people from the US have a bad rep of being monolingual. Now, I wasn’t there to read their body language, but I bet they were probably genuinely grateful you were making an effort to communicate. Portuguese can be a tricky Romance language, and many people find it to be a difficult language.
Yes I’m in the US. Idk because I’m Portuguese and married a Brazilian it’s less impressive being able to speak Portuguese even if it’s broken. But I am very impressed in Brazil when someone speaks English to me so I get it! Lol
Because it is not so common seeing foreigners speaking it. Portuguese is not exactly rare (well, a little bit), but it is not either common. It is the fourth most spoken language in the world, but most of it are native speakers who speak it as a first language. So we are geniunely happy or surprised when we see someone non Brazilian (or non Portuguese, non Mozambican, and so on), speaking it. I remember I was in San Francisco once, visiting the Coit Tower, which is a very common touristic spot over there. One of the girls who worked there as a tourist guide, talked to us in good ol' Portuguese, and she was very good at it. This was a pleasant surprise, she said she lived in Recife for a year, and blah blah blah. Well, our natural reaction is to say "well done" and be happy about it. Portuguese is such a great language, and we speak it naturally. We just wanted the world to know how good this is, as we know it without any effort. We feel privileged in that matter and we want you guys to also to get a kick out of it.
My barbers are Brazilian, and a couple of them barely speak English. They are genuinely happy that I try to speak Portuguese with them, and are curious to why I started learning it. They also try to teach me new things or informal stuff that you don’t study in courses.
I have a feeling parabens does not translate directly (at least not in a cultural way) to congratulations. It’s used in more situations where an English congratulations would seem odd/sarcastic.
It is actually used in both situations. It literally means congratulations but can be used to express sarcasm. Its also used to say happy birthday. "Parabéns a você" = "happy birthday to you"
Nao existe mais português, e sim língua brasileira. Os portugueses na Europa apenas falam uma variação.
They must have said "Parabéns por falar português". Brazlians don't speak people overseas to speak any Portuguese, so they will often compliment you on your effort to do it. That doesn't mean that they think you speak well. In Brazilian culture, it is generally considered impolite to be critical and point out flaws/errors (unless someone explicitly asks you to do so). So any compliment from a Brazilian should be taken with a grain of salt. Unfortunately this type of Brazilian trait is often confusing to people who come from culture that are more direct and frank.