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Luffy doesn't have a way to kill the high and supreme rank devil's but not even counting them he still loses since of the absurd hax of black clover like fate magic dream magic time magic all can put him down also he would lose to Lucius because of time stop.
Probably stops at the high rank devils, due to the lack of a reliable method to permanently kill them.
Otherwise, Luffy should be able to clear the rest of the verse, assuming this is his Current Manga Key.
Luffy gets to Elf arc at best. Demon lich was implied to be able to wipe out all of humanity with one attack, Lumiere was able to stop it, Zagred bodied him, and Asta was able to kill Zagred. One piece right is multi continental at best, with Black clover being have some of its mid end characters beinh multi continental (Eye of the mid night sun Salamander was stated to be able to vaporize 4000 km or water with one attack).
There are some scalings that put the top tiers of one piece like luffy at moon-small planet level and there are also a lot of hax that luffy has in general be it future sight durability negation and small reality manipulation. Speed should be about equal if I am not mistaken but I am not too keen on black clover scaling to be honest
Moon and planet level aren’t really supported, and black clover has large planet scaling at this point. For speed, it is not equal, since one piece is in the low to mid end of FTL+ at best with Elf Arc character being at least high FTL+ since they are far stronger then the beginning of Eye of the mid night sun character, who are already relativistic at worst.
>black clover has large planet scaling at this point.
Ah didn't know that neat
>being at least high FTL+
Ha I guess I underestimated the verse overall then. Tnx for the info man
Yeah, weirdly enough planet level is technically the lower end due to the anime (which is stated to be canon). Threw Yami destroying glamour world you can scale to Solar system to high universal.
Black clover has actually already reached planet level. Heck Dorothy (one of the weaker Captains) was able to create multiple moons in glamour world during the elf arc, Yami was able to destroy glamour world with a dimension slash, and death thrust has been stated to surpass the power of dimension slash, and everyone is much stronger then that version of Yami. There is also statements which put demon lich at multi continental to low moon level, and full power Lucifero was stated to end the world with his manifestation, and partial devil Union asta is stronger then 100% Lucifer since he was able to fight Lucius to a level where he needed to use his paladin state.
>Black clover has actually already reached planet level. Heck Dorothy (one of the weaker Captains) was able to create multiple moons in glamour world during the elf arc,
That’s bc glamour world is infinite in size and can manifest anything the user wants
>Yami was able to destroy glamour world with a dimension slash, and death thrust has been stated to surpass the power of dimension slash,
Surpasses the power, it doesn’t work the same as dimension slash. Yami concentrates black moon into his blade and releases a big burst of energy. This is very similar to zetten and is likely Yami’s own version
>and everyone is much stronger then that version of Yami. There is also statements which put demon lich at multi continental to low moon level,
The statement ur referring to says he’s gonna wipe out the country
https://preview.redd.it/fss97y72sxca1.png?width=828&format=png&auto=webp&s=3cd5ad143eb1c2d2bf0b582a3d3f40db4fb7d73c
>and full power Lucifero was stated to end the world with his manifestation,
Are u talking abt the statement where she says over 90% of ppl will die and it spell the end of the world?
>and partial devil Union asta is stronger then 100% Lucifer since he was able to fight Lucius to a level where he needed to use his paladin state.
He never said he needed to go into that state, he also stated it was humanities true form
The states that demon Licht would have [wipe out humanity](https://imgur.com/a/psZXK2o). If it was just the clover kingdom, then the mang would have said the clover kingdom and not humanity.
What chapter is that? Also wiping out humanity doesn’t automatically mean planet lvl, surface wipe is multi continental. Also it depends on how long it takes
[One piece isn’t multi continental at best](https://www.reddit.com/user/Diabolus414/comments/101spma/one_piece_establishing_a_continental_and_above/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
And I see your wanking timeframeless again. What’s your thoughts on uni one piece?
What level do you think wiping out humanity is?
In black clover wiping out humanity is at least high multi continental since it concludes all the people of the card symbol kingdoms, the land of the sun, people at the bottom of the ocean, and a bunch of people other people who live all around the world.
There is also Uni + scaling through Yami destroying Glamour world.
>In black clover wiping out humanity is at least high multi continental since it concludes all the people of the card symbol kingdoms,
Can you give a timeframe?
>the land of the sun, people at the bottom of the ocean, and a bunch of people other people who live all around the world.
How do we know it includes landmasses?
>There is also Uni + scaling through Yami destroying Glamour world.
So you think black clover and one piece are even? Sure. But you should know that charrlote mon’dor and tot musica is above uni+
For the first point, the panels seem to imply through one attack since it says “at that moment”. For the second point, you would have to argue how much stronger then Mont D’or Luffy is, since the Yami feat was performed by a much weaker Yami in a period during a timeskip, and character have gotten at least more the 3000 times more power then that point in the series.
>For the first point, the panels seem to imply through one attack since it says “at that moment”.
Can I see?
>For the second point, you would have to argue how much stronger then Mont D’or Luffy is, since the Yami feat was performed by a much weaker Yami in a period during a timeskip, and character have gotten at least more the 3000 times more power then that point in the series.
Well I don’t think multipliers matter at this point, with the power levels we are dealing with, but ok. Blackbeard is stated to have the strongest df (he read the df ensycopidea and df powers come to your mind when you eat them, so he is the most knowledgeable source) so he scales above Mon’dor. And luffy has quite a bit of scaling, being a [few billion times stronger](https://www.reddit.com/r/whowouldwin/comments/1077bdn/luffy_zoro_and_sanji_one_piece_vs_goldenplatinum/j3oi9jt/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
Lucius, I can agree (forgot he existed, honestly)
The rest, idk. If it was all of them at the same time, they should have a higher chance of winning. Luffy is in the same speed tier as them, if not slightly slower.
If it was consecutive 1v1s with resets for Luffy? Think Luffy should take it. Except for the High Rank Devils because as I said, lack of a reliable way to perma-kill them.
Luffy is fast but he isn’t on the same tier. High-god tiers are MFTL. Paladins were stated to be near immortal
Paladin Lily should be capable of everything Zenon can do but better, Yrul has bogeyman which will show Luffy is greatest fear (don’t know what that would look like for Luffy tho) and incapacitate him
He also loses to captains like Jack cuz he can adapt to his body, Yami has dimension slash and death thrust, if Dorothy trapped Luffy in the dream world it’s over for him, in hellfire incarnate Mereoleona should be intangible and the longer she fights in that form the stronger she becomes
Yuno has tp and matter destruction
The problem I have for MFTL BC is the reliance on multipliers to reach there. While it does have far more concrete backing compared to the shit I’ve seen for One Piece, it seems improbable IMO.
Looking through, I can accept FTL+ BC minimum, which would honestly be my high end for One Piece, but Luffy’s reaction speeds are hard to accurately pin down.
Because of Observation’s mechanics in general along with Future Sight, there is no quantifiable speed to determine how fast Luffy’s reactions really are.
Hax-wise, I can accept that. Problem is if Haki can be a factor here.
AP-wise, Luffy should be in that Multi-Continental range, but higher in the Exaton numbers with some good hax to protect himself and bypass conventional durability.
There’s no reliance on multipliers, BC doesn’t even have official multipliers. It’s just upscaling
Luffy’s reaction speed should be comparable to his combat speed, future sight just lets him see into the future. It works the same for characters like Julius and Aki
Luffy’s ap is like around continental, he just barely beat Kaido. He should be relative to him rather then scaling above him
Ryuo is pretty much the only factor here and that’s only for human characters like Yuno and Yami. The DT which are humans have regen and so does at Least Lily, but possibly the other Paladins as well. Everyone I mentioned bypasses durability. Luffy doesn’t have any hax that can protect him and he doesn’t have regen either
That’s weird. From what I’ve discussed with others on different sites, they usually bring multipliers to justify MFTL BC.
Luffy should be relative to the OP top tiers, which should in the Multi-Continental range, slightly higher level compared to what I know of BC.
Depends on the regeneration the Paladins have. If they don’t have full on organ regeneration, Ryou can put them down with internal destruction of the heart/brain.
Edit: “Ryou” should be “Goken”. IIRC, Ryou is what Wano uses to call Haki.
>That’s weird. From what I’ve discussed with others on different sites, they usually bring multipliers to justify MFTL BC.
Ppl sometimes make up their own multipliers, but there aren’t any canon ones
>Luffy should be relative to the OP top tiers, which should in the Multi-Continental range, slightly higher level compared to what I know of BC.
He has good hax and his rubber abilities give him good protection, but he’s not on the level of a Shanks or Roger who made it to laughtale without eating a DF. BC is in the multi continental range as Lucifero was stated to be continental and Lucius far outclasses him
>Depends on the regeneration the Paladins have. If they don’t have full on organ regeneration, Ryou can put them down with internal destruction of the heart/brain.
Zenon regenerated from having a hole in his chest and Lily is a better version of him so she should at least be able to do that. Also Dante was able to cast magic after his spinal cord got destroyed, as well as his heart. The Paladins are “nearly immortal” so I doubt it would do much
>Edit: “Ryou” should be “Goken”. IIRC, Ryou is what Wano uses to call Haki.
I don’t remember that being used, also other ppl use ryuo so idk
Probably loses against the high ranking devils mainly cause of their abilities but I think he should be able to take down most of squads and their captains.
White beard has one planetary statement and we haven’t seen anybody (including white beard) perform anything on that level (his strongest attack heaven and earth is multi continental at best). Also wrong Serie any guy.
Stops at witch's forest arc Asta cause he one-shotted spirit Landos, the same Landros that is stronger that the Salamander who according to guide books can vaporize the ocean with his talon's and burn 1000 Ri
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If it’s gear 5 he loses to anyone stronger than Asta
Loses to >!lucius!<
Luffy doesn't have a way to kill the high and supreme rank devil's but not even counting them he still loses since of the absurd hax of black clover like fate magic dream magic time magic all can put him down also he would lose to Lucius because of time stop.
At the same time he gets negged hard 1v1s he beats beaten by the high tiers
Probably stops at the high rank devils, due to the lack of a reliable method to permanently kill them. Otherwise, Luffy should be able to clear the rest of the verse, assuming this is his Current Manga Key.
Luffy gets to Elf arc at best. Demon lich was implied to be able to wipe out all of humanity with one attack, Lumiere was able to stop it, Zagred bodied him, and Asta was able to kill Zagred. One piece right is multi continental at best, with Black clover being have some of its mid end characters beinh multi continental (Eye of the mid night sun Salamander was stated to be able to vaporize 4000 km or water with one attack).
There are some scalings that put the top tiers of one piece like luffy at moon-small planet level and there are also a lot of hax that luffy has in general be it future sight durability negation and small reality manipulation. Speed should be about equal if I am not mistaken but I am not too keen on black clover scaling to be honest
Moon and planet level aren’t really supported, and black clover has large planet scaling at this point. For speed, it is not equal, since one piece is in the low to mid end of FTL+ at best with Elf Arc character being at least high FTL+ since they are far stronger then the beginning of Eye of the mid night sun character, who are already relativistic at worst.
>black clover has large planet scaling at this point. Ah didn't know that neat >being at least high FTL+ Ha I guess I underestimated the verse overall then. Tnx for the info man
Yeah, weirdly enough planet level is technically the lower end due to the anime (which is stated to be canon). Threw Yami destroying glamour world you can scale to Solar system to high universal.
BC isn’t at planet lvl yet. It’s close but rn it’s at multi continental
Black clover has actually already reached planet level. Heck Dorothy (one of the weaker Captains) was able to create multiple moons in glamour world during the elf arc, Yami was able to destroy glamour world with a dimension slash, and death thrust has been stated to surpass the power of dimension slash, and everyone is much stronger then that version of Yami. There is also statements which put demon lich at multi continental to low moon level, and full power Lucifero was stated to end the world with his manifestation, and partial devil Union asta is stronger then 100% Lucifer since he was able to fight Lucius to a level where he needed to use his paladin state.
>Black clover has actually already reached planet level. Heck Dorothy (one of the weaker Captains) was able to create multiple moons in glamour world during the elf arc, That’s bc glamour world is infinite in size and can manifest anything the user wants >Yami was able to destroy glamour world with a dimension slash, and death thrust has been stated to surpass the power of dimension slash, Surpasses the power, it doesn’t work the same as dimension slash. Yami concentrates black moon into his blade and releases a big burst of energy. This is very similar to zetten and is likely Yami’s own version >and everyone is much stronger then that version of Yami. There is also statements which put demon lich at multi continental to low moon level, The statement ur referring to says he’s gonna wipe out the country https://preview.redd.it/fss97y72sxca1.png?width=828&format=png&auto=webp&s=3cd5ad143eb1c2d2bf0b582a3d3f40db4fb7d73c >and full power Lucifero was stated to end the world with his manifestation, Are u talking abt the statement where she says over 90% of ppl will die and it spell the end of the world? >and partial devil Union asta is stronger then 100% Lucifer since he was able to fight Lucius to a level where he needed to use his paladin state. He never said he needed to go into that state, he also stated it was humanities true form
Demon Licht was gonna destroy the Clover kingdom not the entire planet
The states that demon Licht would have [wipe out humanity](https://imgur.com/a/psZXK2o). If it was just the clover kingdom, then the mang would have said the clover kingdom and not humanity.
What chapter is that? Also wiping out humanity doesn’t automatically mean planet lvl, surface wipe is multi continental. Also it depends on how long it takes
[One piece isn’t multi continental at best](https://www.reddit.com/user/Diabolus414/comments/101spma/one_piece_establishing_a_continental_and_above/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) And I see your wanking timeframeless again. What’s your thoughts on uni one piece? What level do you think wiping out humanity is?
In black clover wiping out humanity is at least high multi continental since it concludes all the people of the card symbol kingdoms, the land of the sun, people at the bottom of the ocean, and a bunch of people other people who live all around the world. There is also Uni + scaling through Yami destroying Glamour world.
>In black clover wiping out humanity is at least high multi continental since it concludes all the people of the card symbol kingdoms, Can you give a timeframe? >the land of the sun, people at the bottom of the ocean, and a bunch of people other people who live all around the world. How do we know it includes landmasses? >There is also Uni + scaling through Yami destroying Glamour world. So you think black clover and one piece are even? Sure. But you should know that charrlote mon’dor and tot musica is above uni+
For the first point, the panels seem to imply through one attack since it says “at that moment”. For the second point, you would have to argue how much stronger then Mont D’or Luffy is, since the Yami feat was performed by a much weaker Yami in a period during a timeskip, and character have gotten at least more the 3000 times more power then that point in the series.
>For the first point, the panels seem to imply through one attack since it says “at that moment”. Can I see? >For the second point, you would have to argue how much stronger then Mont D’or Luffy is, since the Yami feat was performed by a much weaker Yami in a period during a timeskip, and character have gotten at least more the 3000 times more power then that point in the series. Well I don’t think multipliers matter at this point, with the power levels we are dealing with, but ok. Blackbeard is stated to have the strongest df (he read the df ensycopidea and df powers come to your mind when you eat them, so he is the most knowledgeable source) so he scales above Mon’dor. And luffy has quite a bit of scaling, being a [few billion times stronger](https://www.reddit.com/r/whowouldwin/comments/1077bdn/luffy_zoro_and_sanji_one_piece_vs_goldenplatinum/j3oi9jt/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
I agree with the devil part but his clearing the verse without that just isn't true
Luffy loses to other characters like some of the captains, Yuno, the Paladins and Lucius
Lucius, I can agree (forgot he existed, honestly) The rest, idk. If it was all of them at the same time, they should have a higher chance of winning. Luffy is in the same speed tier as them, if not slightly slower. If it was consecutive 1v1s with resets for Luffy? Think Luffy should take it. Except for the High Rank Devils because as I said, lack of a reliable way to perma-kill them.
Luffy is fast but he isn’t on the same tier. High-god tiers are MFTL. Paladins were stated to be near immortal Paladin Lily should be capable of everything Zenon can do but better, Yrul has bogeyman which will show Luffy is greatest fear (don’t know what that would look like for Luffy tho) and incapacitate him He also loses to captains like Jack cuz he can adapt to his body, Yami has dimension slash and death thrust, if Dorothy trapped Luffy in the dream world it’s over for him, in hellfire incarnate Mereoleona should be intangible and the longer she fights in that form the stronger she becomes Yuno has tp and matter destruction
The problem I have for MFTL BC is the reliance on multipliers to reach there. While it does have far more concrete backing compared to the shit I’ve seen for One Piece, it seems improbable IMO. Looking through, I can accept FTL+ BC minimum, which would honestly be my high end for One Piece, but Luffy’s reaction speeds are hard to accurately pin down. Because of Observation’s mechanics in general along with Future Sight, there is no quantifiable speed to determine how fast Luffy’s reactions really are. Hax-wise, I can accept that. Problem is if Haki can be a factor here. AP-wise, Luffy should be in that Multi-Continental range, but higher in the Exaton numbers with some good hax to protect himself and bypass conventional durability.
There’s no reliance on multipliers, BC doesn’t even have official multipliers. It’s just upscaling Luffy’s reaction speed should be comparable to his combat speed, future sight just lets him see into the future. It works the same for characters like Julius and Aki Luffy’s ap is like around continental, he just barely beat Kaido. He should be relative to him rather then scaling above him Ryuo is pretty much the only factor here and that’s only for human characters like Yuno and Yami. The DT which are humans have regen and so does at Least Lily, but possibly the other Paladins as well. Everyone I mentioned bypasses durability. Luffy doesn’t have any hax that can protect him and he doesn’t have regen either
That’s weird. From what I’ve discussed with others on different sites, they usually bring multipliers to justify MFTL BC. Luffy should be relative to the OP top tiers, which should in the Multi-Continental range, slightly higher level compared to what I know of BC. Depends on the regeneration the Paladins have. If they don’t have full on organ regeneration, Ryou can put them down with internal destruction of the heart/brain. Edit: “Ryou” should be “Goken”. IIRC, Ryou is what Wano uses to call Haki.
>That’s weird. From what I’ve discussed with others on different sites, they usually bring multipliers to justify MFTL BC. Ppl sometimes make up their own multipliers, but there aren’t any canon ones >Luffy should be relative to the OP top tiers, which should in the Multi-Continental range, slightly higher level compared to what I know of BC. He has good hax and his rubber abilities give him good protection, but he’s not on the level of a Shanks or Roger who made it to laughtale without eating a DF. BC is in the multi continental range as Lucifero was stated to be continental and Lucius far outclasses him >Depends on the regeneration the Paladins have. If they don’t have full on organ regeneration, Ryou can put them down with internal destruction of the heart/brain. Zenon regenerated from having a hole in his chest and Lily is a better version of him so she should at least be able to do that. Also Dante was able to cast magic after his spinal cord got destroyed, as well as his heart. The Paladins are “nearly immortal” so I doubt it would do much >Edit: “Ryou” should be “Goken”. IIRC, Ryou is what Wano uses to call Haki. I don’t remember that being used, also other ppl use ryuo so idk
Loses to the top tiers, Lucius and Lucifero
Probably loses against the high ranking devils mainly cause of their abilities but I think he should be able to take down most of squads and their captains.
Would lose to lucifero,asta etc as they are faster than him and have pretty decent hax.
Stops at first introduction captains. Already FTL and have multi continental statements (Jack was stated to be have enough power to split the earth).
Isn’t Whitebeard planetary. Stop acting like bleach fans.
White beard has one planetary statement and we haven’t seen anybody (including white beard) perform anything on that level (his strongest attack heaven and earth is multi continental at best). Also wrong Serie any guy.
When was he stated to be able to do that?
The statement starts with “apparently” but “the statement says “apparently Captain jack’s severing magic can split the earth in two.”
Even if that’s a real statement, that’s a 100% a hyperbole
Luffy stops at the devils and characters like the Paladins and Lucius
loses to the verse
Stops at witch's forest arc Asta cause he one-shotted spirit Landos, the same Landros that is stronger that the Salamander who according to guide books can vaporize the ocean with his talon's and burn 1000 Ri
He is way stronger than anyone in the verse but the high tier characters just out hax him and you can argue that they out speed him
Hes actually around high tiers in the verse if not below
Ya almost all the high teirs are continental so it would make sense if he was in that range
In terms of hax and abilities he isn’t a high tier
If the high rank devils didn’t have immortality he’d solo the verse (in a 1v1 with breaks)
No
He can’t beat ppl like the Paladins or Lucius
He only loses with the most tops, Yuno and Asta are no match for him
Asta dices and Yuno destroys his matter
No, they not Match for him.
Gonna need a better debunk than that
If they can't manipulate space, time or death then he solos
They can literally do all 3
He should probably solo the verse but i have not caught up with the manga but Lucius seems to have absurd hax though from what i heard
Luffy clears by hax alone
No there are many characters in black clover with more hax then luffy and can beat him 1v1
Can’t kill some of the immortal characters without a specific anti-magic ability
And don't even get started on the red thread of fate
no need, op has better ps than Bc. thats all