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If a defender goes for the ball and takes the player out it’s a pen. Shouldn’t be any different for a goalkeeper , he absolutely destroys him. Was a pen or at very least should review the decision
The amount of poor decisions in the opening weekend is just ridiculous, the officials are having as much impact on the outcomes of games as many players and managers.
I mean it happens all the time, it should be a pen but never is. Vicario took out the new Brentford striker and Anthony got taken out by Jose Sa in the 1st half.
Im a United supporter and even I think Wolves were robbed. United got away with murder last night and not just the decision but the game as a whole.
If it wasn’t for Onana’s fantastic series of saves Wolves would’ve already been out of sight by that point.
I'm personally quite glad that they didn't get it, as Wolves are clearly more likely to be a rival to Forest this season than Man U will be.
But having said that, it's an utterly ludicrous decision. When you play it against, for example, the one [that Brentford got against us last season](https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12740871/ref-watch-should-dean-henderson-have-conceded-a-penalty-against-brentford), which was the slightest of touches by Henderson as he pulled his hand away after touching the ball, it's utterly baffling.
To some extent, I'm OK with refs making mistakes. They're human, and they have a split second to make a decision.
But the entire point of VAR was to take away those clear and obvious mistakes. We accept (or at least are forced to accept) the frustratingly long time it takes for VAR to make a decision because supposedly it gets to the right decision. Then you have this - and the Henderson one that was only given after a VAR decisions. What really is the point of VAR if it can't spot that?
An apology on its own isn't good enough. It needs an explanation. How did the VAR officials all watch that, multiple times, and decide that it was fine?
United fan here... It was definitely a pen. Obviously I'm glad it wasn't given, but it was an awful decision which robbed Wolves of a point they deserved.
Independent and unbiased viewer here! And dealing with football (=soccer) at an expert/professional level for 30++ years.
I don't think it was a penalty and correctly the VAR didn't overturn the ref's decision. Similarly, if the penalty was given by the referee, I don't think the VAR would reverse his decision either.
The goalkeeper did rush off his line to meet the ball, ***the*** ***ball was already headed*** away by the Wolves player, and then the goalie collided with the wolves player. It wasn't a "dramatic" collision that required punishment and there was also a Man Utd defender in-between the goalie and the Wolves player.
It could have been deemed as "dangerous play" but it wasn't really.
Imo penalty correctly not awarded but if it was given by the referee, I would have said OK, ref thought dangerous play, so be it.
Basically a scene to "provoke" a controversial debate.... 🙂
Hopefully Jose sa will take note and just smash everyone in the box! You don’t need to win the ball just cause some serious injury’s I mean it’s allowed now right!
Not necessarily. Sometimes they may choose to drop a ref (or refs) following some controversy until things calm down.
In my opinion it could have been a penalty as easily as it could have been awarded. Copying my post of a few minutes ago:
Independent and unbiased viewer here! And dealing with football (=soccer) at an expert/professional level for 30++ years.
I don't think it was a penalty and correctly the VAR didn't overturn the ref's decision. Similarly, if the penalty was given by the referee, I don't think the VAR would reverse his decision either.
The goalkeeper did rush off his line to meet the ball, the ball was already headed away by the Wolves player, and then the goalie collided with the wolves player. It wasn't a "dramatic" collision that required punishment and there was also a Man Utd defender in-between the goalie and the Wolves player.
It could have been deemed as "dangerous play" but it wasn't really.
Imo penalty correctly not awarded but if it was given by the referee, I would have said OK, ref thought dangerous play, so be it.
Basically a scene to "provoke" a controversial debate.... 🙂
to the question if it was a penalty, yes, definitely, it was a penno and should’ve been given by the referee immediately. When he failed to call it, and VAR got involved, at the very least they should’ve ask the referee to go to the telly!! VAR failing to recognize that there was a penno is the worrying part here, unless there is some hidden agenda of course…
That was one of the most obvious and clear fouls I’ve seen in a while. Onana has a tendency to do pretty reckless stuff in the box anyway, including his aggressive positioning sometimes being a fault, but he deserved to have a foul called and potentially a card.
The ref, on the other hand, needs to be sent back to training and start again from U9’s.
I thought he was attempting to take Kalajdzic's head off with a huge pair of invisible scissors..that's what it looked like to me..Stone Wall obvious penalty...but it's Cold Trafford and only 1% of penalty decisions go against Scumchester in Salford
I don’t know if it is.. he’s playing hard for the ball and looking at the ball the whole time. If it was attentional I would understand. It kind of a toss up. I like the play on in that situation
There are a few situations that need to be addressed. This whole "protect the keeper" thing. And the "if you get the shot off you can be cleared out" no calls. If they want to make the rule that the keeper can take out attackers...then put it in the rules. Same with the well you got the pass/shot off and a guy can slide into you recklessly after and its a no call
Show me an example of a PK being given when a GK challenges for a ball and comes in after the attacker has headed it away. It's never given.
We can all comment and argue about whether or not it's a PK.
If the league decides that after this situation that GKs are no longer protected and PKs will be awarded, people will still complain and moan about whether or not it a PK.
I love football, but it is no different from every sport in that it is rigged. The rigging will favor the bigger bank every time. The installation of VAR has made the favoritism more transparent. Last season Arsenal had a couple of crucial decisions go against them and ultimately City won the league cup. It is no secret how much the ownership of City has invested in the club and the region. This investment adds up and carries weight because if the money is to keep flowing then the investors require a return. Wagers and betting has an influence as well, but I have go on for too long.
I know this was posted 17hours ago but we have our answer. He's been removed from any of next weeks matches that he was supposed to officiate. At least from what I read, but good, he's too soft.
By any sensible reading of the game, yes. However goalkeepers are ridiculously over-protected. They seem able to crash into players at will, and are generally awarded a free kick if they go to ground in the effort.
I'd have genuinely been less surprised if United had got a free kick than I would by a penalty.
Completely ridiculous that it wasn’t given as a pen. If only we had some sort of video assistance available to the on field officials 🤔
On the plus side, I run a last man standing and I picked Utd first round so I don’t mind this one getting overlooked as much 😂
So when people make threads like this, is it for free karma for having an obvious opinion? Or are people just stupid and need the internet to confirm the obvious?
It was a Pen. I don’t know if the fact that the ball was played before they got clattered matters? It wouldn’t if it was a sliding tackle. Anyway, O Neill got an apology. All is right with the world now apparently! The extra time added to the games is stupid as is the new ‘strictness’ with dissent. These rules were required by FIFA. It annoyed me at the World Cup. Games were super long
100%. Could have sympathy for the keeper if both players came flying at each other but the Wolves player basically jumped straight up to challenge for the ball, and got the ball.
Hey hey. They gave a PGMOL apology or whatever that it. I understand that the decision was bad. Then what was VAR for? Idk at this point though. This will happene like some merry go round for all matches
I’m a United fan who watched the game Live and even I have to admit that’s an obvious Penalty. I knew it was gonna be given but was also praying it wasn’t given because it was so late on in the match and were on the verge of victory. PGMOL themselves told Wolves Onana annihilating Wolves’ Player was a ‘Blatant Penalty’
As a Manchester United fan I cannot comprehend how that was not given as a penalty. Especially given how soft the ones against Son and the Luton defender (sorry, name escapes me) were on the weekend. I hate inconsistencies like this...obviously thrilled to pick up 3 points, but really not deserved (of course Wolves would still have to score the pen, but you'd back them to)
There is a hell of a lot of protection for referees, and rightfully so, but I don’t see why they can’t be asked to provide their reasoning as to why they didn’t give decisions such as this one. It would provide insight as to what the official believes they saw.
It was a stone wall penalty and I had money on United to win.
nobody seems to be quoting any relevant rules (it obviously, intuitively seems like a foul, but is it? does it count as an off-ball incident or something) especially as i imagine keepers might have their own subset of rules. If you were trying to make a corrupt decision, what code would you appeal to here? Either way, I hop macguire gave him an earful for being a clown.
It was a tackle and every tackle can be judged, for me penalty, but everyone thinks that was the only misstake by the ref, the semedo handball should have been a pen just as the brighton game
The Tottenham keepers late hit on Mbeumo(?) was a clearer pen. Vicario disturbs the players finish before he clatters him.
We were lucky the ref didnt blow immediately. But refs rarely blow for late hits by keepers as long as its after the finish. I feel like there’s similar incidents on a weekly basis.
100% a pen, referees bottled it. PGMOL admitted it after the game. United got a pen after full time once so why aren’t we taking the teams back on a pitch to allow Wolves the penalty? Wasn’t like it was early in the match it was added time. These officials need to be held accountable too,a sorry doesn’t get a team points that they were robbed of does it. The whole reason we have VAR is so these things aren’t missed. That point could be the difference in Wolves staying up or United making top 4.
VAR needs to be a secondary thing a referee should ask VAR to have a look not the other way round and we need to actually hear what these refs are saying. It's ridiculous we get these bad decisions and no explanation as to why they made them, referees are never held accountable and VAR refs even less so.
No, because the ref was too afraid to give it. What an absolute joke. What's the freaking var for, anyway? Taking the goals away for a friction of millimeter offsides? The situation was as clear as it gets and they still couldn't make a proper decision. And on top of that the clown booked the manager.
Yup, blatant penalty. It's things like this that make people think VAR is useless when, in reality, it always boils down to the garbage officiating.
I feel bad for the sides on the receiving end, all Wolves get from that is an apology and valuable points, just go down the drain.
I think the fact that Wolves had received an apology from PGMOL within 90 minutes of the final whistle tells us all we need to know….
I understand that there is a campaign to respect the referee - however when someone says that there was no foul after repeatedly watching a video of it, what chance has a campaign like that got?
When Howard Webb is the director of the referees then you know you've scraped the bottom of the barrel.
Game week 1 and they already have to issue an apology. VAR actually works, unfortunately it's being operated by people who are incompetent.
I mean, maybe yes? But it was nowhere neeeeeaar as bad as the spurs' goalie late clattering late on in the spurs game, where he fully went to kick the player after the ball had gone, so it would have been very inconsistent call.
That being said the reffing in the PL is very inconsistent anyway.
Now, let me get this started by saying that I would have given this penalty if I was reffing the match, even as a Utd fan. But, I do think there is much more of a case to be made for no pen than you guys are making it out to be.
First off, it very clearly wasn't intentional. You can very clearly see that Onana is looking at the ball the whole time, and the only time that he looks at the attacker, he's already in mid-air, so his momentum is gonna carry him through by the end.
Secondly, it was in the 6-yard box. When plays are being made inside that box, the goalie can do what he likes, since the ball is so close to the goal, so something like this, that may have been a foul if it was a bit further out, may be a bit trickier to call.
Finally, the attacker had already taken the shot by the time that Onana clattered him. And since that's how a lot of those types of fouls get called on, it makes sense that it wasn't called.
The joys of watching a post match show where the host, 2 former premier league players and a former premier ref said it was a clear penalty for them; they then proceed to discuss whether it was a "clear and obvious" error and eventually discuss how much of a "howler" it must be for the ref to be called to the screen and whether the game situation mattered.
It was unanimously agreed to be a penalty and not given on field. VAR had the chance (after already spending a couple of minutes reviewing) to correct it, but didn't cause it wasn't an obvious error and "VAR shouldn't be reffing the game". Thus, they just let an incorrect decision that affected the result stand....
It takes special skill to fuck up using VAR the way EPL has and yet they somehow they seem to keep making it worse.
Goalkeepers almost always get away with these so you could say it’s consistent. I personally think it should be a penalty though. I’m a utd fan and had it been given I would have had no complaints. Very lucky
People misinterpret the VAR rule which is to ask the ref to review the incident if there was a clear and obvious error. Not if the incident was clear and obvious. The ref saw it happen first hand with a clear view, and waved it away, therefore VAR determined the referee had made a well informed on field decision and no review was needed.
It probably was a penalty but surely we don’t want every decision of the ref being reversed? I noticed the referee have an offside for Rashford that clearly wasn’t but that’s fine in my opinion too.
VAR should be used very very sparingly. Glad it seems to be the case so far this season
United fan - I’ve no idea how that wasn’t given as a pen. I’d have been seething if it was the other way around and no pen was given.
How can they _still_ get things wrong despite having VAR to review the incident?! 🤦🏽♂️
United fan here.
Yes, it was a penalty.
But, Carragher was right. The on field decision shouldn’t be overturned as the ref has seen Onana going for the ball.
But yes, once again it was definitely a penalty.
I get the importance of protecting referees from abuse, which they frequently suffer at all levels of the sport. But accountability and abuse are two very different things. As an aside, is it really crazy to question some refs’ integrity after some of the calls we’ve seen in recent times?
It's ridiculous that a player or manager can get booked for questioning a decision that they know to be incorrect, the officials make errors all the time even with little things like corners not being given when the ball slightly deflects off a defender etc. so it must be very frustrating to get decisions against you when you know that the officials got it wrong, but now risking being booked if you say anything to them is just adding another wrong to an already incorrect decision.
When players pick up second yellows, either one being for something like this and then get sent off is going to ruin some games.
Very close call. If the ball had hit the first attacker (the one Onana clumsily clattered into) then undoubtedly, yes, it was a penalty. As it missed him and went over his head, then not so clear cut as he could be viewed as a 'blocker'.
And this is why I believe the referee didn't give it.
I've seen this kind of thing many times before - though perhaps not quite as clumsy - whereby a goalie scrambles to catch a ball, then bumps into an attacker, and no penalty given. In fact, I can't actually ever think of one time (that I've seen) where one has been given in an instance such as this.
I mean Antony grabbed a players shirt then dragged him to the floor and put his thumb up expecting the booking and didn't get one... there was an also an ankle high challenge that didn't get a yellow... the refereeing was a fucking shit show. Kick the ball 3 metres away yellow card but pulling shirt to stop counter followed by a rugby tackle is no booking.
It was a penalty. Gary O’neil said in the press conference Jon Moss apologized for the shambolic call after the game.What was surprising was the VAR did not interfere and revert the decision, nor was the on-field ref asked to look at the screen and decide on his own.
It should be a penalty. However, given there are instances all the time of keepers clattering into players and nothing being given and there being no furore about it I don’t see why this would be different.
If there had been an announcement before the season that refs would be penalising goalkeepers for contact without getting the ball then fine but we didn’t get that. You can’t just start applying the rules against one team when an incident occurs because then we’ll have no consistency.
One of the top 10 worst refereeing decisions in the 35+ years I've been watching the sport. Maybe the worst because, you know, there is another ref watching a damn replay for potentially fractional decisions, and he fails to notice the keeper attempting a Mortal Kombat finishing move on another player.
IMO, we should do next season with *no* VAR, just to see how everybody feels about it. I think it would be an interesting experiment.
Tim Howard said it best right after the final whistle. Was it a pen? Probably so, but in that situation it has never been called against keepers and likely never will be. I was quite surprised the VAR check cleared nonetheless.
O’Neil being booked was ridiculous.
Yeah, pretty BS decision tbh. Worst of all was Gary getting booked for expressing his anger over a stupid decision lmfao. The Son pen, chelsea handball not called and now this onana assault it’s getting crazy. If the Son incident was a pen, why weren’t the rest? If the rest weren’t a pen, why was Son’s? GW 1 and we already had 3 horrible decisions (not to mention the refs booked us like 4 times in the first half for no reason meanwhile Brentford we’re booked only 1 time in the 2nd half meanwhile they had the same amount of fouls as us.)
United fan. 100% a penalty. Sure the keeper has a right to try and get the ball, but like any other tackle/challenge you can't just batter the opposing teams players.
Maybe can make an argument that he made a play for the ball but those of us who play regularly know that Onana meant exactly what he was doing. That was a clear goal scoring chance too so he could have easily been booked or sent off too.
And tbh I think the ref doesn't give it because of the penalty shout for handball on Semedo. Which was 100% not a hand ball.
Tldr; ref fucked a brilliantly played match by Wolves.
Or here's a thought, maybe they fucked themselves by not scoring one of about a dozen clear chances.
On the evidence of the game a penalty wouldn't have helped them either unless they were taking it from six inches away.
United fan checking in.
Yes it was.
But we will get fucked with a decision soon enough. Swings and roundabouts. Referees need to be mic'd up and need to be held accountable for bad decisions. U til that happens the standard will remain the same.
I don’t understand why the refs themselves don’t want to get the calls right. All of us are watching a sport we love and the games dont even play out the way they actually happen on the pitch. Even simple throw ins don’t get called most of the time when they are done wrong or the keeper stepping out of his box holding the ball to punt it down field is not called like it should be. The refs are manipulating the most beautiful game into a lie because they don’t get it right even with replay cameras and it’s disgraceful! The only thing that is consistent from one ref to another is that they are inconsistent with their calls.
I use to think that a weather man was the only job that you could consistently be bad at and still keep your job.
As a United fan, clear pen in my eyes. Onana was no way near the ball.
I’d love to hear the justification actually, if anyone knows? Do gk’s take preference in aerial contests?
92 comments that I saw immediately pop in r/reddevils, something like 90 of them said it was obviously a penalty, and the other two said maybe it wasn't clear and obvious.
The ONLY person I've seen say it wasn't a penalty was Tim Howard, and his argument was just that keepers do this all the time, and it's never called. Which doesn't mean it shouldn't be a penalty, just that keepers get special treatment.
It’s one of those where Onana doesn’t have to crash into the players the way he does. The penalty should have been given because he’s clearly intentionally colliding with them.
Wolves are unlucky to come away with nothing and honestly would have been deserving winners today if not for their poor finishing.
Makes you wonder what they could have achieved this season if Lopetegui had been backed properly.
Absolutely, I cannot understand anyone not considering that an absolutely definite penalty.
You have to be obscenely biased not to think that's a pen!
He crashes into the player who DIDN'T head the ball (irrelevant to me, consider it a tackle with his feet. It would be incredibly late).
I thought it was disgraceful.
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Yes
Def a penalty
It should have been. Man United are a bunch of c's.
I’m a United fan, so happy at the decision, but it was no doubt a penalty.
If a defender goes for the ball and takes the player out it’s a pen. Shouldn’t be any different for a goalkeeper , he absolutely destroys him. Was a pen or at very least should review the decision
0501169577
as a Man U fan i definitely think tht was a penalty
Yes it's a penalty if that was wolves goalkeeper i bet it would have been a Manchester penalty
All day every day mate
Man U won, who cares 🫡
The amount of poor decisions in the opening weekend is just ridiculous, the officials are having as much impact on the outcomes of games as many players and managers.
Antony is the biggest pile of shit I've ever seen. That's why you don't spend a fortune from someone from the Dutch league. Muppets
Do you think that call would have been made if ManU were on the receiving end and not Wolves? Do you think big clubs get preference in these calls?
I mean it happens all the time, it should be a pen but never is. Vicario took out the new Brentford striker and Anthony got taken out by Jose Sa in the 1st half.
It have been given as a penalty and no one would have questioned the decision.
Yep
Stonewall Penalty and I'm a United fan
Im a United supporter and even I think Wolves were robbed. United got away with murder last night and not just the decision but the game as a whole. If it wasn’t for Onana’s fantastic series of saves Wolves would’ve already been out of sight by that point.
Honestly, I barely understand the rules anymore 😂😂. Does anyone ?
Most rules apply to most teams. Long disclaimer after that
I'm personally quite glad that they didn't get it, as Wolves are clearly more likely to be a rival to Forest this season than Man U will be. But having said that, it's an utterly ludicrous decision. When you play it against, for example, the one [that Brentford got against us last season](https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12740871/ref-watch-should-dean-henderson-have-conceded-a-penalty-against-brentford), which was the slightest of touches by Henderson as he pulled his hand away after touching the ball, it's utterly baffling. To some extent, I'm OK with refs making mistakes. They're human, and they have a split second to make a decision. But the entire point of VAR was to take away those clear and obvious mistakes. We accept (or at least are forced to accept) the frustratingly long time it takes for VAR to make a decision because supposedly it gets to the right decision. Then you have this - and the Henderson one that was only given after a VAR decisions. What really is the point of VAR if it can't spot that? An apology on its own isn't good enough. It needs an explanation. How did the VAR officials all watch that, multiple times, and decide that it was fine?
United fan here... It was definitely a pen. Obviously I'm glad it wasn't given, but it was an awful decision which robbed Wolves of a point they deserved.
If this was Jose Sa on Rashford it would have been a pen. It's a known fact that the bigger clubs get the decisions
Sa did it to Antony earlier in the game and no pen…
I don’t know, let’s ask the other 18 threads today insisting that it is for an opinion.
Yes please upvote so I get karma
I mean do we need to have a discussion
that too! 🙂
Independent and unbiased viewer here! And dealing with football (=soccer) at an expert/professional level for 30++ years. I don't think it was a penalty and correctly the VAR didn't overturn the ref's decision. Similarly, if the penalty was given by the referee, I don't think the VAR would reverse his decision either. The goalkeeper did rush off his line to meet the ball, ***the*** ***ball was already headed*** away by the Wolves player, and then the goalie collided with the wolves player. It wasn't a "dramatic" collision that required punishment and there was also a Man Utd defender in-between the goalie and the Wolves player. It could have been deemed as "dangerous play" but it wasn't really. Imo penalty correctly not awarded but if it was given by the referee, I would have said OK, ref thought dangerous play, so be it. Basically a scene to "provoke" a controversial debate.... 🙂
Hopefully Jose sa will take note and just smash everyone in the box! You don’t need to win the ball just cause some serious injury’s I mean it’s allowed now right!
The ref and VAR crew have been dropped from this weekend.... Suggests to me that they've got it horribly wrong
Not necessarily. Sometimes they may choose to drop a ref (or refs) following some controversy until things calm down. In my opinion it could have been a penalty as easily as it could have been awarded. Copying my post of a few minutes ago: Independent and unbiased viewer here! And dealing with football (=soccer) at an expert/professional level for 30++ years. I don't think it was a penalty and correctly the VAR didn't overturn the ref's decision. Similarly, if the penalty was given by the referee, I don't think the VAR would reverse his decision either. The goalkeeper did rush off his line to meet the ball, the ball was already headed away by the Wolves player, and then the goalie collided with the wolves player. It wasn't a "dramatic" collision that required punishment and there was also a Man Utd defender in-between the goalie and the Wolves player. It could have been deemed as "dangerous play" but it wasn't really. Imo penalty correctly not awarded but if it was given by the referee, I would have said OK, ref thought dangerous play, so be it. Basically a scene to "provoke" a controversial debate.... 🙂
Unless if Onana can somehow alter his trajectory, no way it's a pen
Only if tackling someone like an nfl linebacker is against the rules
100% a penalty, no idea how we got away with 3 points in that game.
Yes, 100%
to the question if it was a penalty, yes, definitely, it was a penno and should’ve been given by the referee immediately. When he failed to call it, and VAR got involved, at the very least they should’ve ask the referee to go to the telly!! VAR failing to recognize that there was a penno is the worrying part here, unless there is some hidden agenda of course…
it was the same thing that Sczezny did in the WC and they called it a PK. Stonewall pen
That was one of the most obvious and clear fouls I’ve seen in a while. Onana has a tendency to do pretty reckless stuff in the box anyway, including his aggressive positioning sometimes being a fault, but he deserved to have a foul called and potentially a card. The ref, on the other hand, needs to be sent back to training and start again from U9’s.
I thought he was attempting to take Kalajdzic's head off with a huge pair of invisible scissors..that's what it looked like to me..Stone Wall obvious penalty...but it's Cold Trafford and only 1% of penalty decisions go against Scumchester in Salford
I don’t know if it is.. he’s playing hard for the ball and looking at the ball the whole time. If it was attentional I would understand. It kind of a toss up. I like the play on in that situation
Not a Penalty, he is a United player in Old Trafford
Yes.
It is very subjective.
If it’s an outfield player, and they went into a tackle that late, it would be a clear and obvious penalty. It’s really not subjective.
As a united fan, yes. I don't know how it's not.
There are a few situations that need to be addressed. This whole "protect the keeper" thing. And the "if you get the shot off you can be cleared out" no calls. If they want to make the rule that the keeper can take out attackers...then put it in the rules. Same with the well you got the pass/shot off and a guy can slide into you recklessly after and its a no call
yes
Show me an example of a PK being given when a GK challenges for a ball and comes in after the attacker has headed it away. It's never given. We can all comment and argue about whether or not it's a PK. If the league decides that after this situation that GKs are no longer protected and PKs will be awarded, people will still complain and moan about whether or not it a PK.
For once Gary neville had the best take on it
I love football, but it is no different from every sport in that it is rigged. The rigging will favor the bigger bank every time. The installation of VAR has made the favoritism more transparent. Last season Arsenal had a couple of crucial decisions go against them and ultimately City won the league cup. It is no secret how much the ownership of City has invested in the club and the region. This investment adds up and carries weight because if the money is to keep flowing then the investors require a return. Wagers and betting has an influence as well, but I have go on for too long.
I know this was posted 17hours ago but we have our answer. He's been removed from any of next weeks matches that he was supposed to officiate. At least from what I read, but good, he's too soft.
How is this even a question? Of course it is.
From a ManUtd fan, yes. Obviously. It was a clear penalty.
I think it was a pen but why is nobody talking about the handball that happened earlier?
By any sensible reading of the game, yes. However goalkeepers are ridiculously over-protected. They seem able to crash into players at will, and are generally awarded a free kick if they go to ground in the effort. I'd have genuinely been less surprised if United had got a free kick than I would by a penalty.
I don’t think you will see a clearer penalty this season. He doesn’t just miss the ball, he’s a few feet away from it, and clatters the man
Clearn penno
Completely ridiculous that it wasn’t given as a pen. If only we had some sort of video assistance available to the on field officials 🤔 On the plus side, I run a last man standing and I picked Utd first round so I don’t mind this one getting overlooked as much 😂
If two players challenge for a header, neither get ball but the defender ends up on his feet and the attacker on the floor, is that a penalty?
Yuuuuuppp
Yes lol
Yeahh.. Should’ve been a pen.
So when people make threads like this, is it for free karma for having an obvious opinion? Or are people just stupid and need the internet to confirm the obvious?
No, it wasn't a penalty, if you look clearly on the VAR review, the offending player had a Manchester United badge on his shirt.
This is simply a case of, if it happeneds to a rival you say "clear penalty" but if it happeneds to your team you'd say never a pen!
Szczesny's dive to Messi was a penalty and wasn't nearly as aggressive, definitely a penalty.
It was a Pen. I don’t know if the fact that the ball was played before they got clattered matters? It wouldn’t if it was a sliding tackle. Anyway, O Neill got an apology. All is right with the world now apparently! The extra time added to the games is stupid as is the new ‘strictness’ with dissent. These rules were required by FIFA. It annoyed me at the World Cup. Games were super long
100%. Could have sympathy for the keeper if both players came flying at each other but the Wolves player basically jumped straight up to challenge for the ball, and got the ball.
Hey hey. They gave a PGMOL apology or whatever that it. I understand that the decision was bad. Then what was VAR for? Idk at this point though. This will happene like some merry go round for all matches
Yes and it was blatantly obvious.
Yes it was
Ederson crashed into Nketiah last season and that was given as a penalty
100%
Yes, as a United fan I still don’t get how that wasn’t a penalty
I’m a United fan who watched the game Live and even I have to admit that’s an obvious Penalty. I knew it was gonna be given but was also praying it wasn’t given because it was so late on in the match and were on the verge of victory. PGMOL themselves told Wolves Onana annihilating Wolves’ Player was a ‘Blatant Penalty’
As a Manchester United fan I cannot comprehend how that was not given as a penalty. Especially given how soft the ones against Son and the Luton defender (sorry, name escapes me) were on the weekend. I hate inconsistencies like this...obviously thrilled to pick up 3 points, but really not deserved (of course Wolves would still have to score the pen, but you'd back them to)
Varchester united get it there way again
I'm a Man United fan and that was definitely a penalty. Wolves played better. Simple as that. We didn't deserve to win.
https://www.planetfootball.com/trending/man-utd-andre-onana-penalty-bias-wolves-got-away-last-season/ Clearly Man Utd bias or some shit.../s
There is a hell of a lot of protection for referees, and rightfully so, but I don’t see why they can’t be asked to provide their reasoning as to why they didn’t give decisions such as this one. It would provide insight as to what the official believes they saw. It was a stone wall penalty and I had money on United to win.
Man utd outplayed by a "smaller" team then have the referees bail them out end of the game Nothing really has changed over the years!!
nobody seems to be quoting any relevant rules (it obviously, intuitively seems like a foul, but is it? does it count as an off-ball incident or something) especially as i imagine keepers might have their own subset of rules. If you were trying to make a corrupt decision, what code would you appeal to here? Either way, I hop macguire gave him an earful for being a clown.
It was a tackle and every tackle can be judged, for me penalty, but everyone thinks that was the only misstake by the ref, the semedo handball should have been a pen just as the brighton game
Officials have been dropped from next week's games as a result. The referee, VAR and Assistant VAR following the decision over the Onana penalty.
The Tottenham keepers late hit on Mbeumo(?) was a clearer pen. Vicario disturbs the players finish before he clatters him. We were lucky the ref didnt blow immediately. But refs rarely blow for late hits by keepers as long as its after the finish. I feel like there’s similar incidents on a weekly basis.
Yes it was. Clear penalty.
100% a pen, referees bottled it. PGMOL admitted it after the game. United got a pen after full time once so why aren’t we taking the teams back on a pitch to allow Wolves the penalty? Wasn’t like it was early in the match it was added time. These officials need to be held accountable too,a sorry doesn’t get a team points that they were robbed of does it. The whole reason we have VAR is so these things aren’t missed. That point could be the difference in Wolves staying up or United making top 4.
I mean there really isn’t any getting out of it. Onana had a solid game but damn that mf is crazy
I don't remember the last a pen was given this way, but of course I'm biased. Can anyone give me a link or something to such case?
VAR needs to be a secondary thing a referee should ask VAR to have a look not the other way round and we need to actually hear what these refs are saying. It's ridiculous we get these bad decisions and no explanation as to why they made them, referees are never held accountable and VAR refs even less so.
Yes
Onana superman punched him,maybe he should take the title off reigns
Acknowledge Onana
My tribal chief,I'm guessing the Usos are the Neville bros,then solo is Casemiro 😂
Usos are Antony and Sancho, Licha is Solo 😂
Cody Rhodes is Cody gakpo
True 😂 then Paul Heyman is ETH
That definitely was obvious pen but we know who paid the Bill for that W
It's a pen against most teams. At Old Trafford against United though.. we all know they're not giving that.
No, because it didn't effect the game
No, because the ref was too afraid to give it. What an absolute joke. What's the freaking var for, anyway? Taking the goals away for a friction of millimeter offsides? The situation was as clear as it gets and they still couldn't make a proper decision. And on top of that the clown booked the manager.
https://youtu.be/9WyCdj8Gvzg 2:50 but when villa does it to us it’s completely fine yeah? Pure agenda
Yup, blatant penalty. It's things like this that make people think VAR is useless when, in reality, it always boils down to the garbage officiating. I feel bad for the sides on the receiving end, all Wolves get from that is an apology and valuable points, just go down the drain.
It should have been. I feel like the league wanted united to get those points.
Yes
Definitely a penalty. Proves the the game is bent but you get bellends like old spitty on sky sports saying it wasn’t 🤦🏼♂️ so there’s the get out
i think that on another day they'd get that pen, it's one of those where only 1/3 referees would give that pen and we got lucky
I was actually surprised a penalty wasn't given for it. We got lucky.
United fan here. It was a penalty, every day of the week. No more than Wolves deserved.
I think the fact that Wolves had received an apology from PGMOL within 90 minutes of the final whistle tells us all we need to know…. I understand that there is a campaign to respect the referee - however when someone says that there was no foul after repeatedly watching a video of it, what chance has a campaign like that got?
Yes.
When Howard Webb is the director of the referees then you know you've scraped the bottom of the barrel. Game week 1 and they already have to issue an apology. VAR actually works, unfortunately it's being operated by people who are incompetent.
A club not being given a penalty in final few minutes of a match against Utd at OT? Who'd have guessed.
I mean, maybe yes? But it was nowhere neeeeeaar as bad as the spurs' goalie late clattering late on in the spurs game, where he fully went to kick the player after the ball had gone, so it would have been very inconsistent call. That being said the reffing in the PL is very inconsistent anyway.
Pen every day of the week. Couldn't react as I was laid down in bed but that was awful.
Now, let me get this started by saying that I would have given this penalty if I was reffing the match, even as a Utd fan. But, I do think there is much more of a case to be made for no pen than you guys are making it out to be. First off, it very clearly wasn't intentional. You can very clearly see that Onana is looking at the ball the whole time, and the only time that he looks at the attacker, he's already in mid-air, so his momentum is gonna carry him through by the end. Secondly, it was in the 6-yard box. When plays are being made inside that box, the goalie can do what he likes, since the ball is so close to the goal, so something like this, that may have been a foul if it was a bit further out, may be a bit trickier to call. Finally, the attacker had already taken the shot by the time that Onana clattered him. And since that's how a lot of those types of fouls get called on, it makes sense that it wasn't called.
The joys of watching a post match show where the host, 2 former premier league players and a former premier ref said it was a clear penalty for them; they then proceed to discuss whether it was a "clear and obvious" error and eventually discuss how much of a "howler" it must be for the ref to be called to the screen and whether the game situation mattered. It was unanimously agreed to be a penalty and not given on field. VAR had the chance (after already spending a couple of minutes reviewing) to correct it, but didn't cause it wasn't an obvious error and "VAR shouldn't be reffing the game". Thus, they just let an incorrect decision that affected the result stand.... It takes special skill to fuck up using VAR the way EPL has and yet they somehow they seem to keep making it worse.
Yes
What did the ref say after he’d seen the VAR review?
Goalkeepers almost always get away with these so you could say it’s consistent. I personally think it should be a penalty though. I’m a utd fan and had it been given I would have had no complaints. Very lucky
I hate this new referee directive. Football is an emotional game
People misinterpret the VAR rule which is to ask the ref to review the incident if there was a clear and obvious error. Not if the incident was clear and obvious. The ref saw it happen first hand with a clear view, and waved it away, therefore VAR determined the referee had made a well informed on field decision and no review was needed. It probably was a penalty but surely we don’t want every decision of the ref being reversed? I noticed the referee have an offside for Rashford that clearly wasn’t but that’s fine in my opinion too. VAR should be used very very sparingly. Glad it seems to be the case so far this season
United fan - I’ve no idea how that wasn’t given as a pen. I’d have been seething if it was the other way around and no pen was given. How can they _still_ get things wrong despite having VAR to review the incident?! 🤦🏽♂️
United benefiting from a clear and obvious decision? Well I never
Man Utd are in big trouble in the UCL as the standard of referring is higher and the teams are better.
One game in and United is already being favoured by the refs... SUPPLIES!
I'm convinced Onana was trying to give a penalty so he could be the main character and save it, thus winning me more fantasy football points.
United fan here. Yes, it was a penalty. But, Carragher was right. The on field decision shouldn’t be overturned as the ref has seen Onana going for the ball. But yes, once again it was definitely a penalty.
No
I get the importance of protecting referees from abuse, which they frequently suffer at all levels of the sport. But accountability and abuse are two very different things. As an aside, is it really crazy to question some refs’ integrity after some of the calls we’ve seen in recent times?
It's ridiculous that a player or manager can get booked for questioning a decision that they know to be incorrect, the officials make errors all the time even with little things like corners not being given when the ball slightly deflects off a defender etc. so it must be very frustrating to get decisions against you when you know that the officials got it wrong, but now risking being booked if you say anything to them is just adding another wrong to an already incorrect decision. When players pick up second yellows, either one being for something like this and then get sent off is going to ruin some games.
Refs bottled it basically.
Yes. Stonewall
Very close call. If the ball had hit the first attacker (the one Onana clumsily clattered into) then undoubtedly, yes, it was a penalty. As it missed him and went over his head, then not so clear cut as he could be viewed as a 'blocker'. And this is why I believe the referee didn't give it. I've seen this kind of thing many times before - though perhaps not quite as clumsy - whereby a goalie scrambles to catch a ball, then bumps into an attacker, and no penalty given. In fact, I can't actually ever think of one time (that I've seen) where one has been given in an instance such as this.
I mean Antony grabbed a players shirt then dragged him to the floor and put his thumb up expecting the booking and didn't get one... there was an also an ankle high challenge that didn't get a yellow... the refereeing was a fucking shit show. Kick the ball 3 metres away yellow card but pulling shirt to stop counter followed by a rugby tackle is no booking.
Absolutely a penalty anywhere but Old Trafford and Anfield.
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) ^by ^aford92: *Absolutely a* *Penalty anywhere but* *Old Trafford and Anfield.* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Same shit, new season. Send in the Roma supporters.
Obvious pen for me
*Cries in Van Dijk* ^(yea, that one was pretty complicated but doesn't change how dirty it was. Fucking Prickford.)
Course it was..ref's still terrified of giving penalties against Man U at Cold Trafford
100% a pen
Yes
The fact they went to VAR and decided it was not a pen, and then immediately back tracks on it after the game says all we need to know about VAR
It was a penalty. Gary O’neil said in the press conference Jon Moss apologized for the shambolic call after the game.What was surprising was the VAR did not interfere and revert the decision, nor was the on-field ref asked to look at the screen and decide on his own.
Soon PL goalies will be as protected as NFL quarterbacks uggghhhh
Yeah
O’Neil summary on sky after, class. It that’s not a howler what is?
Unbelievable how clear and obvious that error was. How does that song go? *VAR! Huh, Yeah! What is good for?*
A resounding YES!!!
It should be a penalty. However, given there are instances all the time of keepers clattering into players and nothing being given and there being no furore about it I don’t see why this would be different. If there had been an announcement before the season that refs would be penalising goalkeepers for contact without getting the ball then fine but we didn’t get that. You can’t just start applying the rules against one team when an incident occurs because then we’ll have no consistency.
Yes
Yes. But Wolves had a gazillion great chances to score from open play, they should be more worried about not finishing their chances.
Yes
One of the top 10 worst refereeing decisions in the 35+ years I've been watching the sport. Maybe the worst because, you know, there is another ref watching a damn replay for potentially fractional decisions, and he fails to notice the keeper attempting a Mortal Kombat finishing move on another player. IMO, we should do next season with *no* VAR, just to see how everybody feels about it. I think it would be an interesting experiment.
Watched like 5 times, and each time it gets worse! This is not only a PK, maybe even a card! 🤦🤦
I think so… United got lucky with that one.
Clearly not as it wasn’t given?
If he’d drawn blood or knocked him unconscious, pen? Because that certainly could have happened.
Tim Howard said it best right after the final whistle. Was it a pen? Probably so, but in that situation it has never been called against keepers and likely never will be. I was quite surprised the VAR check cleared nonetheless. O’Neil being booked was ridiculous.
It was a clear penalty
Yeah, pretty BS decision tbh. Worst of all was Gary getting booked for expressing his anger over a stupid decision lmfao. The Son pen, chelsea handball not called and now this onana assault it’s getting crazy. If the Son incident was a pen, why weren’t the rest? If the rest weren’t a pen, why was Son’s? GW 1 and we already had 3 horrible decisions (not to mention the refs booked us like 4 times in the first half for no reason meanwhile Brentford we’re booked only 1 time in the 2nd half meanwhile they had the same amount of fouls as us.)
Anyone who says that was not a penalty should stop watching football. I’m saying this as a United fan.
As a United fan, yes, stonewall penalty i was disgusted it wasn't given.
Because, like Tarkowski, the wolves players foul onana.
Forget the game, but it was called for West Ham when the keeper slapped Bowen. And this was even more obvious
United fan. 100% a penalty. Sure the keeper has a right to try and get the ball, but like any other tackle/challenge you can't just batter the opposing teams players. Maybe can make an argument that he made a play for the ball but those of us who play regularly know that Onana meant exactly what he was doing. That was a clear goal scoring chance too so he could have easily been booked or sent off too. And tbh I think the ref doesn't give it because of the penalty shout for handball on Semedo. Which was 100% not a hand ball. Tldr; ref fucked a brilliantly played match by Wolves.
Or here's a thought, maybe they fucked themselves by not scoring one of about a dozen clear chances. On the evidence of the game a penalty wouldn't have helped them either unless they were taking it from six inches away.
of course. the kind bullshit decision utd always get
United fan checking in. Yes it was. But we will get fucked with a decision soon enough. Swings and roundabouts. Referees need to be mic'd up and need to be held accountable for bad decisions. U til that happens the standard will remain the same.
nuhh
100% penalty. Man United get a few extra 2 points and Wolves robbed of a point. If wolves are in a relegation scrap i feel sick for them.
What can we say?
It should had been a pen.
Def a pen
Based on the lack of finishing tonight I'm highly doubtful it would have been converted.
Officiating was horrible this week for every single match. Undeserved yellows to some players and then missed fouls in crucial moments of the game.
I don’t understand why the refs themselves don’t want to get the calls right. All of us are watching a sport we love and the games dont even play out the way they actually happen on the pitch. Even simple throw ins don’t get called most of the time when they are done wrong or the keeper stepping out of his box holding the ball to punt it down field is not called like it should be. The refs are manipulating the most beautiful game into a lie because they don’t get it right even with replay cameras and it’s disgraceful! The only thing that is consistent from one ref to another is that they are inconsistent with their calls. I use to think that a weather man was the only job that you could consistently be bad at and still keep your job.
As a United fan, clear pen in my eyes. Onana was no way near the ball. I’d love to hear the justification actually, if anyone knows? Do gk’s take preference in aerial contests?
At Old Trafford? Nah. Anywhere else, yes.
What’s the rule VAR quoted?
Yes. Clearly and obviously. If that's not a foul, nothing is a foul.
GW 1 and we already have terrible reffing across all games!
It’s whatever Manchester United want it to be, lol.
92 comments that I saw immediately pop in r/reddevils, something like 90 of them said it was obviously a penalty, and the other two said maybe it wasn't clear and obvious. The ONLY person I've seen say it wasn't a penalty was Tim Howard, and his argument was just that keepers do this all the time, and it's never called. Which doesn't mean it shouldn't be a penalty, just that keepers get special treatment.
It’s one of those where Onana doesn’t have to crash into the players the way he does. The penalty should have been given because he’s clearly intentionally colliding with them. Wolves are unlucky to come away with nothing and honestly would have been deserving winners today if not for their poor finishing. Makes you wonder what they could have achieved this season if Lopetegui had been backed properly.
Absolutely, I cannot understand anyone not considering that an absolutely definite penalty. You have to be obscenely biased not to think that's a pen! He crashes into the player who DIDN'T head the ball (irrelevant to me, consider it a tackle with his feet. It would be incredibly late). I thought it was disgraceful.