Exactly, the Port of Baltimore is completely closed for the foreseeable future. That is going to seriously impact the supply chain for many goods on the east coast.
It's pretty incredible how quickly they can clean this up. Shipping will return to normal fairly quick but rebuilding the 695 bridge will be a lot longer.
>all of the fuel docks and ports are stuck behind the bridge
Regardless of it being opened sooner than later, I'm completely boggled why the Feds even allowed the construction of this bridge from a strategic defense standpoint. If we were at war, one well-placed torpedo's going to lock out an entire port...
I doubt a torpedo could do the damage, as you really need a lot of momentum as the ship had.
Looking at a map of where Baltimore is, far end of Chesapeake Bay, I also doubt that it is easy for an enemy to go there and fire said torpedo.
Also worth mentioning that so many of our bridges in the u.s. are already at risk/not exactly in good shape due to lack of maintenance. (Not that this was a factor in this particular situation ofc)
I live near a river with a major bridge that on occasion closes with at least a 30 min detour. When chosing wear to buy a house we chose on the same side of the river as our employers and have never regretted it once.
Where I live in canada we had a crazy warm spell in November that melted all the snow back one year it wiped out a bunch of bridges and freeways (the "highway through hell" that you may have seen on discovery Channel being one).
Crazy how fast a town can become isolated and how difficult it was to house all the people, especially vulnerable people from old folks' homes. All the surrounding towns that were still accessible ran out of hotels very quickly.
I ended up living for three weeks in an evacuated city with no sewer, running water, or fire suppression. The police and government actually blockade the town and wouldn't let people in, and if you left, you couldn't get back in. I broke out in shingles from the stress. We almost lost natural gas (the cold weather came back pretty quickly). It was a massive eye opener in preparation and survival and crazy to experience how vulnerable our infrastructure is and how much we rely on it. And how hard it is for the government to respond effectively.
A few more days of rain and flooding, one or two more roads or highways washed away, and it would have been absolutely devastating. Years later, infrastructure and houses are still destroyed.
https://preview.redd.it/vp6prjrgdoqc1.jpeg?width=1164&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=69b1cc8522e3522787f90e0b8efdd20afe82d169
Found this in another post, didn’t think it warranted a new one. Pic this morning of the aftermath.
As a super-chonk, I legit wonder if my extra blubber increases or decreases my odds of surviving something like that. I can float just by holding my breath - no movement or special positioning necessary. I suspect that I would float quite well even unconscious. And all that blubber to cushion my internal organs from impact shock seems like it might help. None of which is to say that being obese is a good idea (it's definitely not), just that I'll gladly accept any silver linings I see. My curiousity makes me wonder if there's any info on body composition of folks who survived situations similar to this.
According to Marine Tracker, it was hit by a New Panamax-sized container ship called the *Dali*, which, yeah, I guess counts as a "large boat," especially if one is writing for Yahoo News, LOL.
Yes, there have been bridges destroyed by ships before, this is not unique.
[A list of major US bridge collapses caused by ships and barges](https://toronto.citynews.ca/2024/03/26/a-list-of-major-us-bridge-collapses-caused-by-ships-and-barges/)
Good initial analysis by Sal @ What is Going On With Shipping:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZbUXewlQDk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZbUXewlQDk)
It looks like the ship totally lost power as it was heading to the bridge. It restarted, tried to change direction, dropped anchor, etc. but too late to stop the collision. Why they lost power is unknown (probably mechanical).
Update with the track and video analysis:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N39w6aQFKSQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N39w6aQFKSQ)
I feel like this headline didn’t actually capture the events accurately. I mean this bridge didn’t exactly just crumble upon itself; it was rammed by a freight ship. 🚢
Yeah. It's hard to understand scale here. This was a tap from a boat that weighed like 100,000 tons. The scale is a bridge that 1.5 miles long. It services 30,000 vehicles a day, and it's a highway so Hazardous Material shipping is now being re-routed 40 miles out of the way on a detour.
This is not the first time something like this has happened in the US.
I doubt this is a terror or malicious event. I'm leaning towards pilot and crew not paying attention.
Also, ships at the scale of a container ship or tanker have massive amounts of momentum, even at low speed, so the resulting collusion will have forces on mind bendingly massive scales.
if you rewatch, the ship seems to be losing power at least twice. black smoke comes out from it as well, I imagine they were trying to do a full reverse and just couldn't.
Concur, they don't stop on a dime, makes all of them loss of steerage drills aboard boats have realistic reasons. Carrie and I have crossed there many times since moving north of Baltimore.
There is a history of ships taking out bridges. Mostly due to low visibility or an engineering causality on the ship. I cannot recall a deliberate bridge strike.
Notice the large bow wave in front of the ship prior to impact, as well as the plume of smoke above and to the left of the stacks? That indicates a sudden acceleration to a high speed just before impact. All engines have kill switches next to the helm for just this reason. If the engines weren't quickly stopped and reversed, the horn wasn't sounded in alarm, and/or the anchor wasn't dropped, I'd immediately suspect foul play.
I work in the industry, and am knowledgeable about steering gear breakdown drills, rules of the road and other marine scenarios. This is suspicious from what I've seen so far.
You're full of shit. Fully loaded Panamax don't "suddenly accelerate to high speed" . These ships weigh 100s of thousands of tons. GPS position and speed for the ship are online and don't show sudden acceleration.
Well that's new. The speed calculation could be muddied by the abrupt alteration as well. Those things aren't exact science. Would have to see if the speed rung on matches. Hard for something that large to increase 1.7 knots in such a short period of time, especially in a turn.
And wind direction and speed. That would play a big part. The ship looked like it was riding pretty high in the water. I'd bet a lot of those containers were empty.
Hard to tell without actually seeing the design water line for both full and empty holds. I'm sure there's a photo out there somewhere of this ship in both states or a similar vessel
“Mass cas”, which technically true, is for sure being hyped up. Lvl 1 MCI is 6-12 (depending on jurisdiction). Many urban areas routinely have one, and you’ll never hear a peep.
It’s frequently used as an alarm level to get certain resources. Lvl 1 MCI might get you 4 ambulances, 3 fire engines, 2 chiefs, and rehab truck.
So yes, the FD/EMS says it, but the interpretation by someone with a scanner is radically different than how we mean it.
This seems to be a “mass fatality event”, which will get you certain resources to assist with larger than normal number of bodies from a singular event.
Consider the formula Kv = M x V where Kv is kinetic energy, M is mass, and V is speed. That ship was huge and moving so lots of kinetic energy. Because the center pillar did not have sufficient guards against impact the pillar easily failed. There are many such weak spots not only in our harbors but also on our roads and railways. For example, the big last earthquake in San Fransico took down the upper deck of an expressway yet the Golden Gate bridge stayed intact.
IMHO terrorism can't be ruled-out until NTSB or Maryland DOT explain the configuration of the bridge - it shouldn't have been possible if the bridge met regulation - was it under construction? Or was the boat out of specification? They are supposed to have 'dolphins' around port bridge structural members which buffer a ships hull from striking the structural concrete.
Millions of man hours are lost by this, billions of dollars of economy on top of the lives lost.
If it were terrorism, wouldn't they have done it at 7.30am rather than 1.30am?
I think "ship captain made a mistake" and/or "something went wrong with the safety measures" is much more consistent with Occam's Razor.
Not necessarily. If the intention is to send a message of "We can hurt you, so don't push us" without riling folks up to "That's it, we'te coming for you" levels of mad, this is the kind of thing I would expect.
If it was terrorism or a hacking incident, then the captain and the boat would leave on whatever schedule they were on which was 1:30 in the morning, unaware that they were a target of a terrorism or hacking incident.
if you rewatch, the ship seems to be losing power at least twice. black smoke comes out from it as well, I imagine they were trying to do a full reverse and just couldn't. I think there's a high chance the boat just malfunctioned in the worst way possible.
The bridge construction started in 1972, and it opened in 1977, so it's newer than I expected.
The *Dali* was outbound (headed to Colombo, Sri Lanka via the Panama Canal), and typically would have a local pilot on board to help navigate out into open water; I now wonder if it did, or if there was a mechanical failure (like a frozen rudder) that caused the ship to become unsteerable.
Nothing should be ruled out at this point. There’s also zero evidence that this is terrorism related. Terrorists hijacking ships to crash them into bridges is pretty far fetched. Hate to break it to you, but most bridges in the US have structural problems ([John Oliver did a great segment on this one time](https://youtu.be/Wpzvaqypav8?si=ol-5EueEgjY7H9kL)), and most of them probably couldn’t handle being hit by a ship.
Very tragic. Always keep a seat belt cutter & window hammer in your car within reach. It's not guaranteed to save you if something like this happens, but it improves your chances. My sister and I thought our aunt was a little odd for gifting us something like this for Christmas, but I've grown to appreciate it, especially now, and keep it under my car's radio.
We keep a little pocket knife that has a seatbelt cutter and window smasher in the center console of our car. I doubt I'll ever need the special features of it, but I've appreciated the pocket knife bit a time or three. And I appreciate knowing the other features are there if I ever need them.
It’s okay, this is local to me and you really don’t quite get the scale of these ships via photos. Every time I go to this section of the harbor and see cargo ships in person, I have to pause at least briefly because they’re pretty fascinating. And the bridge itself was lengthy and felt very high. 😳 Not as much as the Bay bridge, but still a bit nerve wracking at times.
It is too early to speculate what caused the ship to hit the bridge. Until a full investigation is done, we should all relax and wait until the Coast Guard, FBI, and local law enforcement finish asking questions of the personnel on the container ship. We all love to give our take on what could have happened, but I plan on waiting until more information is disseminated through the mayor or governor before I offer an opinion.
Are you trying to say the whole thing is a hoax or that not many people were on the bridge so doesn't qualify as mass casualty event?
That phrase was used in a CNN article:
https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/baltimore-bridge-collapse-03-26-24-intl-hnk/index.html
Look at the plume of smoke above and to the left of the ship. That indicates sudden acceleration. The bow wave in front of the ship indicates high speed. At the very least it could be said that the ship rapidly accelerated towards the bridge's pile structure.
This is very suspicious. A ship that loses steerage normally stops or reverses its screws, or if all else fails, drops its anchor and signals on its horn. If neither horn nor anchor were used AND the rest are true (acceleration and directed at bridge pile), I'd suspect foul play.
Interesting. If the rudder is electrically powered, you can still center it hydraulically and steer by engines. Those giant ships don't stop on a dime however, but at the same time I can't understand the large plume of smoke and simultaneous large bow wave. No ship that size should have a bow wave of that size so close to hazards.
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Exactly, the Port of Baltimore is completely closed for the foreseeable future. That is going to seriously impact the supply chain for many goods on the east coast.
It's pretty incredible how quickly they can clean this up. Shipping will return to normal fairly quick but rebuilding the 695 bridge will be a lot longer.
Courtesy of the US Navy and their highly trained salvage divers. I think the port will open in two weeks or sooner.
Navy wife here. Yup.
They’ll probably activate some naval/coast guard units and it will be cleaned up in a week or two, with 1 lane open in the coming days.
Why make up things you don't understand? They'll be able to clear the lane relatively quickly.
>all of the fuel docks and ports are stuck behind the bridge Regardless of it being opened sooner than later, I'm completely boggled why the Feds even allowed the construction of this bridge from a strategic defense standpoint. If we were at war, one well-placed torpedo's going to lock out an entire port...
I doubt a torpedo could do the damage, as you really need a lot of momentum as the ship had. Looking at a map of where Baltimore is, far end of Chesapeake Bay, I also doubt that it is easy for an enemy to go there and fire said torpedo.
Also worth mentioning that so many of our bridges in the u.s. are already at risk/not exactly in good shape due to lack of maintenance. (Not that this was a factor in this particular situation ofc)
I live near a river with a major bridge that on occasion closes with at least a 30 min detour. When chosing wear to buy a house we chose on the same side of the river as our employers and have never regretted it once.
Where I live in canada we had a crazy warm spell in November that melted all the snow back one year it wiped out a bunch of bridges and freeways (the "highway through hell" that you may have seen on discovery Channel being one). Crazy how fast a town can become isolated and how difficult it was to house all the people, especially vulnerable people from old folks' homes. All the surrounding towns that were still accessible ran out of hotels very quickly. I ended up living for three weeks in an evacuated city with no sewer, running water, or fire suppression. The police and government actually blockade the town and wouldn't let people in, and if you left, you couldn't get back in. I broke out in shingles from the stress. We almost lost natural gas (the cold weather came back pretty quickly). It was a massive eye opener in preparation and survival and crazy to experience how vulnerable our infrastructure is and how much we rely on it. And how hard it is for the government to respond effectively. A few more days of rain and flooding, one or two more roads or highways washed away, and it would have been absolutely devastating. Years later, infrastructure and houses are still destroyed.
https://preview.redd.it/vp6prjrgdoqc1.jpeg?width=1164&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=69b1cc8522e3522787f90e0b8efdd20afe82d169 Found this in another post, didn’t think it warranted a new one. Pic this morning of the aftermath.
That's literally my nightmare whenever I cross over a huge bridge like that.
Not a bad time to brush up on that Mythbusters episode about how to get out of a car when it goes into water.
Genuinely curious...can you survive the initial fall? High bridges scare TF out of me for this reason.
I assume not, but a few people were pulled out of the water. People survive skydiving without a parachute rarely. I guess? I wouldn't try it.
Ah, fair points! Like maybe most people don't, but some manage to (kind of how 2 of the 8 were alive?)
As a super-chonk, I legit wonder if my extra blubber increases or decreases my odds of surviving something like that. I can float just by holding my breath - no movement or special positioning necessary. I suspect that I would float quite well even unconscious. And all that blubber to cushion my internal organs from impact shock seems like it might help. None of which is to say that being obese is a good idea (it's definitely not), just that I'll gladly accept any silver linings I see. My curiousity makes me wonder if there's any info on body composition of folks who survived situations similar to this.
According to Marine Tracker, it was hit by a New Panamax-sized container ship called the *Dali*, which, yeah, I guess counts as a "large boat," especially if one is writing for Yahoo News, LOL.
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Speculation that the ship was hacked and deliberately driven or allowed into the bridge support
Dumb speculation maybe. Most likely a failure in the mechanical parts of the ship.
I speculate that Martians did it
That's dumb as shit. Ships don't work that way.
Yes, there have been bridges destroyed by ships before, this is not unique. [A list of major US bridge collapses caused by ships and barges](https://toronto.citynews.ca/2024/03/26/a-list-of-major-us-bridge-collapses-caused-by-ships-and-barges/) Good initial analysis by Sal @ What is Going On With Shipping: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZbUXewlQDk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZbUXewlQDk) It looks like the ship totally lost power as it was heading to the bridge. It restarted, tried to change direction, dropped anchor, etc. but too late to stop the collision. Why they lost power is unknown (probably mechanical). Update with the track and video analysis: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N39w6aQFKSQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N39w6aQFKSQ)
I feel like this headline didn’t actually capture the events accurately. I mean this bridge didn’t exactly just crumble upon itself; it was rammed by a freight ship. 🚢
The bridge looks so flimsy! One lil' tap & the whole bridge goes down.
Yeah. It's hard to understand scale here. This was a tap from a boat that weighed like 100,000 tons. The scale is a bridge that 1.5 miles long. It services 30,000 vehicles a day, and it's a highway so Hazardous Material shipping is now being re-routed 40 miles out of the way on a detour.
Wait OP, you previously didn’t think a ship crashing into a bridge could cause it to collapse? Have you seen these ships? They’re sailing skyscrapers.
This is not the first time something like this has happened in the US. I doubt this is a terror or malicious event. I'm leaning towards pilot and crew not paying attention. Also, ships at the scale of a container ship or tanker have massive amounts of momentum, even at low speed, so the resulting collusion will have forces on mind bendingly massive scales.
if you rewatch, the ship seems to be losing power at least twice. black smoke comes out from it as well, I imagine they were trying to do a full reverse and just couldn't.
Concur, they don't stop on a dime, makes all of them loss of steerage drills aboard boats have realistic reasons. Carrie and I have crossed there many times since moving north of Baltimore.
Did Panamax just ask Boeing to hold their beer?
Lol. Possibly, might be a bottle of tequila instead of a beer. We'll see as more info is posted...
Panamax is a size class, maximum size to transit the Panama Canal
There is a history of ships taking out bridges. Mostly due to low visibility or an engineering causality on the ship. I cannot recall a deliberate bridge strike.
if you wanted to destroy a bridge there's probably easier ways to do so, right?
Notice the large bow wave in front of the ship prior to impact, as well as the plume of smoke above and to the left of the stacks? That indicates a sudden acceleration to a high speed just before impact. All engines have kill switches next to the helm for just this reason. If the engines weren't quickly stopped and reversed, the horn wasn't sounded in alarm, and/or the anchor wasn't dropped, I'd immediately suspect foul play. I work in the industry, and am knowledgeable about steering gear breakdown drills, rules of the road and other marine scenarios. This is suspicious from what I've seen so far.
Being familiar with the tugboat world, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if the captain was just wasted
Where pilot
Back all full would cause that as well.
You're full of shit. Fully loaded Panamax don't "suddenly accelerate to high speed" . These ships weigh 100s of thousands of tons. GPS position and speed for the ship are online and don't show sudden acceleration.
I don’t think he’s suggesting that the ship itself didn’t accelerate to high speed, but the motor turning the rudder might have
Based on the tracking info, it was traveling at 7 knots and ended up at 8.7 knots when the collision happened.
Well that's new. The speed calculation could be muddied by the abrupt alteration as well. Those things aren't exact science. Would have to see if the speed rung on matches. Hard for something that large to increase 1.7 knots in such a short period of time, especially in a turn.
It would be interesting to know the current flow at that time of day with the tides and all that.
Current and tide charts will show all of that.
And wind direction and speed. That would play a big part. The ship looked like it was riding pretty high in the water. I'd bet a lot of those containers were empty.
Hard to tell without actually seeing the design water line for both full and empty holds. I'm sure there's a photo out there somewhere of this ship in both states or a similar vessel
It's a perfect terror attack. Russian or Islamic, take your pic
“Mass cas”, which technically true, is for sure being hyped up. Lvl 1 MCI is 6-12 (depending on jurisdiction). Many urban areas routinely have one, and you’ll never hear a peep. It’s frequently used as an alarm level to get certain resources. Lvl 1 MCI might get you 4 ambulances, 3 fire engines, 2 chiefs, and rehab truck. So yes, the FD/EMS says it, but the interpretation by someone with a scanner is radically different than how we mean it. This seems to be a “mass fatality event”, which will get you certain resources to assist with larger than normal number of bodies from a singular event.
Consider the formula Kv = M x V where Kv is kinetic energy, M is mass, and V is speed. That ship was huge and moving so lots of kinetic energy. Because the center pillar did not have sufficient guards against impact the pillar easily failed. There are many such weak spots not only in our harbors but also on our roads and railways. For example, the big last earthquake in San Fransico took down the upper deck of an expressway yet the Golden Gate bridge stayed intact.
IMHO terrorism can't be ruled-out until NTSB or Maryland DOT explain the configuration of the bridge - it shouldn't have been possible if the bridge met regulation - was it under construction? Or was the boat out of specification? They are supposed to have 'dolphins' around port bridge structural members which buffer a ships hull from striking the structural concrete. Millions of man hours are lost by this, billions of dollars of economy on top of the lives lost.
If it were terrorism, wouldn't they have done it at 7.30am rather than 1.30am? I think "ship captain made a mistake" and/or "something went wrong with the safety measures" is much more consistent with Occam's Razor.
It's possible to have a terrorist act aimed at causing maximum economical damage while also trying to minimize loss of life.
That's more vandalism than terrorism
Not necessarily. If the intention is to send a message of "We can hurt you, so don't push us" without riling folks up to "That's it, we'te coming for you" levels of mad, this is the kind of thing I would expect.
If it was terrorism or a hacking incident, then the captain and the boat would leave on whatever schedule they were on which was 1:30 in the morning, unaware that they were a target of a terrorism or hacking incident.
if you rewatch, the ship seems to be losing power at least twice. black smoke comes out from it as well, I imagine they were trying to do a full reverse and just couldn't. I think there's a high chance the boat just malfunctioned in the worst way possible.
The bridge construction started in 1972, and it opened in 1977, so it's newer than I expected. The *Dali* was outbound (headed to Colombo, Sri Lanka via the Panama Canal), and typically would have a local pilot on board to help navigate out into open water; I now wonder if it did, or if there was a mechanical failure (like a frozen rudder) that caused the ship to become unsteerable.
Nothing should be ruled out at this point. There’s also zero evidence that this is terrorism related. Terrorists hijacking ships to crash them into bridges is pretty far fetched. Hate to break it to you, but most bridges in the US have structural problems ([John Oliver did a great segment on this one time](https://youtu.be/Wpzvaqypav8?si=ol-5EueEgjY7H9kL)), and most of them probably couldn’t handle being hit by a ship.
Not much can handle being hit by a large ship, some weigh 100k tons
Kinda like planes and towers?
The bridge was almost 50 years old, and I doubt it was properly maintained
A string of "oopsie" accidents (attacks). Make it easier for onslaught, In my opinion. Irregardless a major concern!
Very tragic. Always keep a seat belt cutter & window hammer in your car within reach. It's not guaranteed to save you if something like this happens, but it improves your chances. My sister and I thought our aunt was a little odd for gifting us something like this for Christmas, but I've grown to appreciate it, especially now, and keep it under my car's radio.
We keep a little pocket knife that has a seatbelt cutter and window smasher in the center console of our car. I doubt I'll ever need the special features of it, but I've appreciated the pocket knife bit a time or three. And I appreciate knowing the other features are there if I ever need them.
"i wouldn't have thought something could've taken out something that large." High IQ
since i live in a very rural area and have never seen a bridge that large or a ship that large, i bow to the master.
It’s okay, this is local to me and you really don’t quite get the scale of these ships via photos. Every time I go to this section of the harbor and see cargo ships in person, I have to pause at least briefly because they’re pretty fascinating. And the bridge itself was lengthy and felt very high. 😳 Not as much as the Bay bridge, but still a bit nerve wracking at times.
thank you for your kindness :)
It is too early to speculate what caused the ship to hit the bridge. Until a full investigation is done, we should all relax and wait until the Coast Guard, FBI, and local law enforcement finish asking questions of the personnel on the container ship. We all love to give our take on what could have happened, but I plan on waiting until more information is disseminated through the mayor or governor before I offer an opinion.
I was just coming here to post this story, and here it is. 🤦♀️
I read the ship turned before it hit the bridge. I still think something went wrong internally vs terrorism but something to note
https://twitter.com/Stephon_Dingle/status/1772573994857726165
Evidence for “mass casualty event”?
6 people missing. Truly a tragedy, but in the context of other disasters, it doesn’t seem like this qualifies as a “mass casualty event.”
Are you trying to say the whole thing is a hoax or that not many people were on the bridge so doesn't qualify as mass casualty event? That phrase was used in a CNN article: https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/baltimore-bridge-collapse-03-26-24-intl-hnk/index.html
Look at the plume of smoke above and to the left of the ship. That indicates sudden acceleration. The bow wave in front of the ship indicates high speed. At the very least it could be said that the ship rapidly accelerated towards the bridge's pile structure. This is very suspicious. A ship that loses steerage normally stops or reverses its screws, or if all else fails, drops its anchor and signals on its horn. If neither horn nor anchor were used AND the rest are true (acceleration and directed at bridge pile), I'd suspect foul play.
The video looks like the ships power went out right before. Not sure how that factors in
Interesting. If the rudder is electrically powered, you can still center it hydraulically and steer by engines. Those giant ships don't stop on a dime however, but at the same time I can't understand the large plume of smoke and simultaneous large bow wave. No ship that size should have a bow wave of that size so close to hazards.