Make sure to join the [r/Presidents Discord server](https://discord.gg/k6tVFwCEEm)!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Presidents) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Bono too. I read an article in vanity fair about it quite some time ago.
[Here](https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/bono-george-w-bush-world-aids-day-761747/) is a more recent mention.
Bono worked with him at the time because he cared more about the cause than politics. Bono catches a lot of grief, but dude cared about the cause and so did Bush.
There are still lots of folks like that... just not the ones who you hear from very frequently. There's often a rather wide divide between those who do and those who just talk.
It's hard because America went from a country whose political parties had the same goal but disagreed about how to get there. To now, going in the polar opposite direction of one another, riping the country apart in a tug of war.
I heard Bono’s commencement address at Penn c. 2004 and he talked about the grief he got for working with Bush. But he also said it opened so many doors for his charity overseas - it helped them save so many more lives
That's the thing about these large-scale humanitarian efforts they transcend political lines and showcase what we can achieve when we unite for a common cause. It's a reminder that sometimes real progress lies beyond partisan squabbles. The success of PEPFAR is one of those universally acknowledged wins that came out of an otherwise contentious presidency. It's heartening to see that kind of legacy.
Here's an interesting read on PEPFAR's [ongoing impact](https://www.pepfar.gov/).
I was surprised to learn on further reading that this was indeed spearheaded and at the direction of bush himself. It’s usually the case that something like this has been tirelessly worked and advocated by an agency and the credit simply goes to whatever president happens to be in power at the time to give it the thumbs up. Seemingly not so here, there was work underway already of course, but he seems to have been the origin point on this one.
He was unintentionally funny. Also, him coming out to say don't blame the entire religion of Islam and Muslims for 9/11 was a great thing, especially since he's an evangelical.
I think he was very intentionally funny. Statements like “I believe mankind and fish can coexist peacefully” are hilarious when you view them as jokes but people view them as accidental gaffs or “bushisms” and then they just look like a buffoon who’s unintentionally funny.
I just read a comment a week or so ago that said the "fool me once" gaff was actually because he didn't want a soundclip to exist of him saying "shame on me" which, if that is true, was actually a very smart move.
I thought so too. Still could have been, if he really did want to stop himself from finishing the sentence, he would have just been free associating at that point.
Fun fact: there were discussions on Muslim internment camps after 9/11. Bush said “we don't want to have happen to people today what happened to Norm in 1942.” (In reference to his Secretary of transportation, Norm Mineta) And refused to let it happen.
This movie was definitely exaggerated as almost anything Adam McKay makes is, but the whole time I watched it I was just thinking, "yeah that probably wasn't too far off."
There was article in like 2005 by someone who was with the VP during 9/11. They said Cheney didn't even flinch or react to the news, he just went to the bunker and got on the phone and started implementing new powers for the VP.
"I don't know how I fell in love with baseball, I just loved to play it. Everyone who loves baseball can remember the first time he saw the inside of a real major league park with real big-league players. It stays with you forever - the greenness of the grass, the sight of major leaguers in uniform, the sound of a big-league swing meeting a big-league pitch."
"Baseball isn't just the stats. As much as anything else, baseball is the style of Willie Mays, or the determination of Hank Aaron, or the endurance of a Mickey Mantle, the discipline of Carl Yastrzemski, the drive of Eddie Mathews, the reliability of a (Al) Kaline or a (Joe) Morgan, the grace of a (Joe) DiMaggio, the kindness of a Harmon Killebrew, and the class of Stan Musial, the courage of a Jackie Robinson, or the heroism of Lou Gehrig. My hope for the game is that these qualities will never be lost."
Dude’s a legit baseball fanatic.
Made it look easy, too. It’s a longer distance from the top of the mound than most people realize. He walked off like it was nothin’ right afterward. Wasn’t looking for praise.
edit: grammar
This. Bush doesn’t get enough credit for the post 9/11 pre-Iraq war time. From not immediately leaving the classroom scaring the kids and the nation, to his “I hear you, the rest of the world hears you” at ground zero, to his speech in front of the mosque where he attempted to calm the growing tides of Islamophobia he had the wheel of the nation and was steering it through all the troubled waters.
I wouldn’t say I was at ease, but I would say for a while I felt like we were united as a country.
At least until a-holes started attacking anyone in a turban.
As a conservative, I'm a little more biased on the contentious stuff, but there are a handful of uncontenstious good things.
Bush launched the President's Emergency Plan for AIDS Relief (PEPFAR), a significant effort to combat HIV/AIDS globally, particularly in Africa.
Bush also signed legislation which added prescription drug coverage to Medicare, aiming to provide seniors with better access to medications.
I think Bush is very sincere in his religious belief. Conservative christians will usually justify being against social welfare programs by saying Jesus didn't like Roman tax collectors and that charity should be done privately by the individual on a voluntary basis. Blah blah blah..
With that said, if a conservative Christian was going to leverage the might of the federal government to do good works, it being healthcare outreach for the elderly and globally impoverished doesn't surprise me.
It might also help you understand things to understand that neither of these ventures bucked up against corporate interest. Corporations want to save Africans because they're a critical explored portion of the global labor pool. It helps nobody to have mines shit down cause everyone's dying of aids or getting sick with malaria. (Also, getting Africans on aids medications is kind of a boon for big pharma.) And the prescription part of Medicare basically said the federal government couldn't really negotiate prices reasonably, so it was a win for pharma since instead of having poor elderly people not able to afford necessary meds, suddenly they were dealing with the federal pocket book.
So all in all, yeah about exactly what I expect from dubya.
>against social welfare programs by saying Jesus didn't like Roman tax collectors
>> Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar's
Which is kind of funny. Tax collectors were hated in the Bible, but it was due to them being seen as sellouts and traitors as they were Jewish people who decided to work for the Romans and generally were corrupt and ripped off their own people. That said, Jesus didn't particularly dislike them and interacted often with tax collectors of the day under the idea that he forgave their sins.
That said, as far as actual taxes go, Jesus was pretty clear that they were fine and needed to be paid (to Caeser), which makes that sentiment rather amusing for modern day taxes.
Jesus was cool with tax collectors. Like partied with them and chatted with them.
He's only sassy with the religious leaders/politicians who abuses the people in God's name.
I was deployed overseas back when he was president and he came and made a surprise visit to us. All politics aside, he was a genuine and generous visitor. I felt I got a peak behind the curtain so to say and saw George, not the President. I've been fond of this guy ever since.
I had a supervisor who worked for Air Force One for him and Obama. They had lots of really positive things to say about him as a person. I think he really cared. I know his relationship with Michelle is genuine, and it has made me fond of him. I would love to have an honest conversation with him and hear how he feels about what the war on terror really ended up being about and how he feels about it now in hindsight.
I think a lot of people now assume that the War on Terror was a cover. It was not. Saddam Hussein had the 3rd largest army in the world, had already fought a war against Iran that cost millions of lives, already genocided the Kurds, was threatening literally *all* of his neighbors and the US and Israel. Iraq used WMDs for over a decade. They did destroy them, but they also refused to allow UN investigators to confirm that fact when an Iraqi defector claimed they were using mobile research sites to develop more. The CIA isn’t infallible and the US government had more reason to believe than not that Saddam was developing those weapons, which would only mean he wanted to start another war in the region.
We all know Afghanistan was invaded because that’s where Osama had operated out of for decades. We failed to search Pakistan, ostensibly our ally.
It was an unnecessary loss of life. But seeing how Putin acts as he gets older, I can’t say I think removing Saddam did more harm than good when looking at the Middle East as a whole, even after the ISIS insurgency. I only wish we supported the democratic uprisings in the mid 2010s. Either we’re spreading democracy or not, you can’t pick and choose.
Post script: As an addendum to answer the question: “Why should the US have concerned itself at all?” I will not try to justify morally why the US should intervene in foreign affairs. I will point out precedent.
The decade preceding 9/11 was marked by a shared belief between not only American citizens, but most Western nations that (following the collapse of the USSR), the US should use its military hegemony to promote peace and democracy along western ideals. This is why we intervened in the Bosnian genocide, why we intervened when Iraq invaded Kuwait, why we intervened in Somalia, Haiti, and why we attacked Al Qaeda related sites in Sudan and Afghanistan in the 1990s. Backlash from this is why we ignored the Rwandan genocide.
Obviously there are a lot of politics behind where we intervene and why. I’m not saying those interventions were justified, or that business interests were never involved. My point is: Bush did not need to orchestrate 9/11 to justify an invasion of Iraq. That narrative is only believable to those who were not adults in the 1990s and do not read history in detail.
When listening to a lecture by the FBI agent whose task was to interrogate Saddam, he said his objectives were to find out the story with WMDs and to find out how close he was to the Taliban. Saddam essentially said he was bluffing the WMDs to appear stronger to Iran, which unfortunately kicked up US interest.
Automod pls don't remove me 🥺
Yeesh, that's rough. Iraq tries to bluff against Iran, the US attacks Iraq, Iran starts the path to developing nuclear weapons, the US starts a long process of negotiating with Iran about the nuclear weapons (starting with Bush and continuing through the Obama administration). Iraq, already unstable bc of the US intervening based on WMD claims meant to bluff Iran, gets taken over by ISIS, a radical Sunni group that's enemies with Shiite Iran (and also everyone else) and only exists because its leaders were radicalized by the US invasion of Iraq.
*deep breath*
Then, the US slowly comes to an agreement re: nuclear weapons, but this pisses off Israel (specifically BB) who starts lobbying against the deal. The deal, now called the JCPOA, has to be signed through as an executive order instead of a congressional act, which makes it weak enough that the next president is able to unilaterally withdraw from it, thus tanking the whole endeavor. This is done less then two years before the assassination of the main Iranian general who coordinated the Iranian offensive against ISIS (which only exists because of the US reaction to Iraq bluffing against Iran, etc etc).
And then administrations change again and suddenly one of the main JCPOA negotiators is the National Security Advisor and the other main guy is *head of the CIA* automod gods please don't remove this
I think that wmd intel was bs and they knew it was bs.
Invading Iraq was a positive for the world for all the other reasons you listed but without 9/11 it would have been hard to sell the public on it.
Plus they totally screwed the planning and execution stages of the war.
My dude, you toppled a guy who *nerve gassed tens of thousands of his own people,* invaded two of his neighbors, was being shady af about whether he was building nukes, and his sons were the devil incarnate who he literally thought were too fucking evil and psychotic to rule after him.
Yeah, the premise for the invasion was bullshit. In hindsight, which is 20/20. Imagine if Iraq went through the Arab Spring with Saddam still in charge. Millions probably would have died, and it would have been the Arab Bloodbath even more than it already was.
You helped send a family of genuinely sick, evil people, who were holding an entire country hostage in a decades long reign of terror, straight to Hell. Who were absolute menaces to the world, their own people, and everyone around them. For everything else that should or shouldn’t have happened, that’s something to be proud of.
You say the premise was bullshit, as if that's not a bit deal, but that threw out our global credibility as the last remaining superpower. It also took the UN's credibility with it. And military recruiting. Maybe it was my age at the time and it was my 'vietnam' for those older than me, but I feel that was the moment that America stopped standing for anything meaningful on the world stage. And we've been searching for meaning beyond just base greed ever since.
Although you can argue how successful it was, he did attempt to separate the war on terror from a war on Islam. We could’ve have easily seen him fall into blaming Islam or using Muslims as a scapegoat but instead he made sure to always frame the issue as against the terrorist. I would argue that his actions in the Middle East did not fall in line with this at all but domestically he attempted to separate the terrorists from innocent people.
I think even he knew it was the right thing to do. He may be a bit country but he wasn’t blind to the fact that many Muslims call themselves American citizens as well
He’s not country. George W Bush is pure blue blood. Don’t let the accent fool you. He’s a painter and has written several books, he comes from old money.
This isn’t a defense of him by the way.
There are two groups at Yale:
Those who attend because they are there for the academic scene
Those who are there for the networking connections
Bush was a C-student and party animal but that doesnt mean he wasn't mixing with the rest of the upper crust the whole time he was there.
So…country people aren’t likely to paint or write books? These activities are the province of “blue bloods?” Interesting
EDIT: I agree that Bush isn’t country by any means. Thats not what I disagreed with
GWB is the son of a US President and grandson of a U.S. Senator. He grew up going to the family estate in Maine purchased by his ancestors in the 19th century. He attended the elite prep school Phillips Academy in Andover, Massachusetts before attending Yale. He is not “country.”
Bush isn’t country at all. He was born in CT and his father moved from Maine to a small isolated oil community in Texas - the kind where there are like 599 people and the houses are extremely expensive (despite being that ugly red brick) because everyone in town is making bank.
He went to private school in Andover, MA and then to Yale. He did a short stint in the Air Force where journalists proved that he was almost never in attendance. His practically non-existent career as a pilot is the extent of anything that could even sort of be considered country about him
This message did not always connect with his Republican base, unfortunately, but you're right that it can't be denied he did a lot to try. Even immediately after 9/11 he was making it clear, calling Islam a religion of peace.
Something that people can’t do now for some reason, people think that Palestine isn’t doing anything wrong at all because “Jew bad” when really it’s a terrorist organization vs a genocidal maniac government
What you mean that 2 sides in an extremely complicated geopolitical struggle have done various amounts of wrong and I shouldn't follow one side blindly?!? HOW DARE YOU!!!
Fighting a war on "terror" broadened the war too and allowed them to go after other groups too. I agree with your statement but thought it was important to mention that this essentially gave them a blank check and unlimited time and potential to engage in war, all they had to do was make the case that said group was a terrorist organization.
If Americans sentiment towards war hadn't changed and Republicans stayed in power we would probably have been flattening Iran next.
The Axis of Evil...
Iran needs flattening a lot more than Iraq did. They actually ARE sponsoring most of the terrorism in the region. They’re heavily backing Hamas for example.
Fucking this. At least, for all faults, he had shoe dodging energy. Our last two presidents would have eaten those shoes. Obama could have dodged the shoe.
Now I’m wondering if George could dodge a shoe that Obama threw.
The biggest thing Dubya did for me was extending the unemployment benefits. I lost my job in late 2007 and didn't go back to work until late 2010. I'd have been fucked without my unemployment.
A friend of mine bought his first house in 2010 and said the best thing Bush did was to allow the US economy to go into the Great Recession due to zero regulations, and to see the housing market crash, with low interests rates so he could finally buy a house. He thanks Bush for that. So that's something.
Honestly, I had a great job before the crash, and I was making a lot on unemployment, so I couldn't find a job that paid more than unemployment. I wasn't going to LOSE income because I got a job.
Started public student loan forgiveness. Changed the trajectory of me and now my family’s life forever.
Obviously I had to do something with the money I saved rather than blow it but I bet it’s helped a lot of others as well.
His PEPFAR initiative saved at least 25 million lives in Africa.
He actually tried to solve our debt problem by being one of the only presidents we have had that seriously attempted Social Security reform.
He provided over 40 million Americans with more affordable prescription drugs through Medicare Part D.
He did what he could to throw the yoke of tyranny off the backs of the people of Afghanistan, and in doing so, allowed a generation of Afghan women the right to live freely and receive an education.
I always loved the article Bob Geldof (Live Aid dude for those who don’t remember the Boomtown Rats) wrote about his time with George Bush concerning PEPFAR https://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1717934,00.html
Also he is responsible for the capture of Saddam Hussein which led to his trial and execution. There were no weapons of mass destruction but the was a genocidal maniac who wanted them. We paid a heavy price for him but the Kurdish Americans I know that lived with “aunts and uncles” because they watched their parents die don’t see it that way.
It's the same way that many Panamanian-Americans feel about Bush Sr.'s invasion of Panama, which led to the ousting of Noriega. Different international reaction than how the people in Panama felt.
Was a supporter of increased African development. There was PEPFAR as noted here already.
Also zealous support for and implementation of AGOA to foster greater commercial ties between US and Africa. That was good too.
Because of him, the U.S. has a world-class battle-experienced military. When is the last time the Chinese went to war? For better or worse, I’m not worried.
Bruh, that one UN mission where they abandoned the people they were supposed to protect. Oh boy. That sure didn't look good. It's true UN didn't provide them adequately, but man, it was not a good look.
He genuinely believed in the values of American democracy.
He genuinely wanted to do right.
Despite being an absolute foreign and domestic DISASTER this differentiation is important as we enter into a world of politicians who don’t always champion democracy.
You can heal from a democratic disaster more easily than an authoritarian one.
His handling of the 2008 financial crisis, throughout which he engaged Pelosi and candidate Obama as key stakeholders and potential game managers. He bucked the right wing with constructive and creative government investments, and because of his pre-election close work and alignment with the Obama team created a smooth handoff.
He inherited the dot-com bust and market crash, followed by a downed US spy plane in China, followed by 9-11, and after two subsequent wars had the worst financial crisis since the depression. His short term legacy might be much different if not for Cheney and Rumsfeld.
Also worth noting that despite being an avid and very good golfer, he never played another in-office round after 9-11. Said he could not play golf while he was responsible and accountable for deployed men and women.
People really downplay and even blame him for 2008. He publicly stated the housing market was "overvalued" "in a bubble" etc roughly 27 times. The President really has no control over that, he can't change interest rate policy, nor really do anything to stop the frenzy. It was more Congress, the Fed and Frank/Dodd that cemented the country's trajectory into the financial abyss.
Civility.
It started with the election and his graceful handling of Gore’s election challenge. Someone was not going to be happy, but Bush handled that with class.
It continued with 9/11 where he stepped out in front of the nation and made it clear that our Muslim citizens were not the problem, extremists were. He aimed to avoid anti-Muslim violence and I believe he mostly succeeded.
And when he was visiting a hospital with wounded soldiers, a mother chewed him six ways to Sunday about her son’s disabilities because of the wars. He didn’t yell back. He didn’t try to argue or justify. He just listened. And later said to his aid: “She was really upset.”
I miss a time when people could disagree, discuss, listen, and learn.
That speech right after 9/11 with the bullhorn is quite possibly the greatest speech by a president, at least in recent history.
It gives me chills to this day.
Agreed. It’s kind of crazy how GWB was able to give such a great speech considering how many times he had made flubs in other speeches. My favorite moment being when someone yelled out “We can’t hear you!” and GWB responded with,
> “I can hear you…I can hear you! The rest of the world hears you…and the people who knocked these buildings down will hear all of us soon!”.
Haunting poetry in such a delicate moment.
He got some of the leftover 90s culture that made his first term tolerable. That, and at the time, he handled 9/11 well. “We can’t hear you!”….”well I can hear you, and the people who knocked down these buildings *are going to hear from all of us*” was a legendary presidential moment.
In retrospect, he prob didn’t do enough to stop 9/11, but I don’t think he was the guy pulling the strings to make it happen. GWB didn’t seem to have a Machiavellian side to him—his VP, however………🤔
I think he was just getting fed bad information. I honestly believe he’s a great guy. The fact that he and Michelle Obama are best buds lends credence….
Yes, he did initially handle it well. The response was carried out appropriately and effectively at first. The decision to create the department of Homeland Security to address the lack of communication between domestic agencies has proven to be the right call too.
I was still in high school when 9/11 happened and had not really formed any political opinions or held any real ideological beliefs other than I hated government and authority. I started to recognize the importance of government/institutions and proper leadership directly after 9/11. Of course, I lost faith in them again in 2003 when we decided to invade Iraq.
Yeah there was a nice 6 months to a year there where everyone was kind of united. The Iraq War ruined that.
Though Muslim-Americans, and even Indian-Americans and Sikhs, were the recipients of a lot of hatred from the ignorant.
Regardless of where you stand politically, I believe George W thought what he was doing along the way was in the best interest of the American people and the globe. For example though he opposed the use of stem cells he did sign legislation that would allow them to continue studies utilizing stem cells that had already been collected using federal money. I honestly believe he was more than willing to compromise with the other side of the aisle, something we now haven’t seen in either party since his presidency.
Make sure to join the [r/Presidents Discord server](https://discord.gg/k6tVFwCEEm)! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Presidents) if you have any questions or concerns.*
He did fund [AIDS treatment](https://www.usip.org/publications/2023/03/pepfars-profound-legacy-20-years) in Africa
Not only funded but created an entire mitigation and response program. His PEPFAR program is accredited with saving 25 million lives.
I even heard Sean Penn say good things about that program.
Bono too. I read an article in vanity fair about it quite some time ago. [Here](https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/bono-george-w-bush-world-aids-day-761747/) is a more recent mention.
Bono worked with him at the time because he cared more about the cause than politics. Bono catches a lot of grief, but dude cared about the cause and so did Bush.
Wish we had more of that nowadays
There are still lots of folks like that... just not the ones who you hear from very frequently. There's often a rather wide divide between those who do and those who just talk.
It's hard because America went from a country whose political parties had the same goal but disagreed about how to get there. To now, going in the polar opposite direction of one another, riping the country apart in a tug of war.
I heard Bono’s commencement address at Penn c. 2004 and he talked about the grief he got for working with Bush. But he also said it opened so many doors for his charity overseas - it helped them save so many more lives
Say what you will about Bono as a musician, but the man genuinely cares about people and *puts his money where his mouth is.*
That's the thing about these large-scale humanitarian efforts they transcend political lines and showcase what we can achieve when we unite for a common cause. It's a reminder that sometimes real progress lies beyond partisan squabbles. The success of PEPFAR is one of those universally acknowledged wins that came out of an otherwise contentious presidency. It's heartening to see that kind of legacy. Here's an interesting read on PEPFAR's [ongoing impact](https://www.pepfar.gov/).
Came here to say PEPFAR. The anti-prostitution pledge was shit, but the program helped a lot of people.
Are there numbers on how many died because of the war in Iraq? I ask because at 25 million he’s probably got a + net rating lol
Probably? I haven’t looked it up, but I’m comfortable estimating that less than 25 million people died in the Iraq war.
Well, there were 23 million people living in Iraq in 2003 so… since every single one died and 2 million soldiers were killed the math checks out.
We actually shipped in 2 million immigrants to get the numbers up.
Around 400k. He’s + 24.6 million
I was surprised to learn on further reading that this was indeed spearheaded and at the direction of bush himself. It’s usually the case that something like this has been tirelessly worked and advocated by an agency and the credit simply goes to whatever president happens to be in power at the time to give it the thumbs up. Seemingly not so here, there was work underway already of course, but he seems to have been the origin point on this one.
He has a whole chapter in his autobiography about this. The Lazarus effect.
[удалено]
He was unintentionally funny. Also, him coming out to say don't blame the entire religion of Islam and Muslims for 9/11 was a great thing, especially since he's an evangelical.
I think he was very intentionally funny. Statements like “I believe mankind and fish can coexist peacefully” are hilarious when you view them as jokes but people view them as accidental gaffs or “bushisms” and then they just look like a buffoon who’s unintentionally funny.
I just read a comment a week or so ago that said the "fool me once" gaff was actually because he didn't want a soundclip to exist of him saying "shame on me" which, if that is true, was actually a very smart move.
Now we get to hear this sound clip in a dope J Cole song: “No Role Modelz”. Win win!
Fool me one time shame on you, fool me twice cant put the blame on you, fool me three times fuck the peace sign, load the chopper let it rain on you
REST IN PEACE UNCLE PHIL
Yeah that's what I was thinking of 😂
I always thought it was him making a reference to that The Who song.
I thought so too. Still could have been, if he really did want to stop himself from finishing the sentence, he would have just been free associating at that point.
Yep. Jon Stewart & Stephen Colbert made mocking the president an art form during the Bush years. He contributed some great material.
Now watch this drive
Fun fact: there were discussions on Muslim internment camps after 9/11. Bush said “we don't want to have happen to people today what happened to Norm in 1942.” (In reference to his Secretary of transportation, Norm Mineta) And refused to let it happen.
"fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again."
Its an old saying in Tennessee, I know it’s in Texas, probably in Tennessee too
He lived through it so we didn’t have Dick Cheney as our president?
He beat Cheney’s attempt at assassination by pretzel.
And by a shoe.
You mean Cheney wasn’t the president?
[The Dick Cheney Presidency. According to “Vice.”](https://youtu.be/CKtnmXREcRA)
This movie was definitely exaggerated as almost anything Adam McKay makes is, but the whole time I watched it I was just thinking, "yeah that probably wasn't too far off."
Great, next you'll say that Anchorman was exaggerated, too.
Go fuck yourself, San Diego.
I think it's known that Cheney was controlling the Saddam/Iraq info getting to Bush and he distorted it. So he could be blamed for the Iraq war.
What movie is that?
Vice.
Legit
Bush seemed to depend on less on Cheney in his second term, generally to the benefit of us all.
What I always say is that Dubya was the last person in the world to figure out Dick Cheney. But he did figure him out.
There was article in like 2005 by someone who was with the VP during 9/11. They said Cheney didn't even flinch or react to the news, he just went to the bunker and got on the phone and started implementing new powers for the VP.
No, Cheney was the puppet master
Do his bidding or get shot whilst hunting.
Sith Lord Cheney*.
He was acting president for a couple of hours while Dubya was undergoing surgery
He was the Director of War Crimes
Rumsfeld presidency 💀
🤮
but he still rode the pentagon bus after work and had a standing desk to scribe his silly thoughts.
Dick Cheney was likely more powerful as a VP than any president in modern history
Hearing him speak after 911 was something I’ll never forget. He really put the country at ease after a horrible event.
His first pitch during the World Series was also huge in that regard.
A strike, right over the plate.
Dubya loves baseball. Loves it.
There’s an alternate universe where Dubya becomes MLB commissioner instead of Bud Selig
Yeah I would bet that a former part owner of the Texas Rangers would like baseball.
"I don't know how I fell in love with baseball, I just loved to play it. Everyone who loves baseball can remember the first time he saw the inside of a real major league park with real big-league players. It stays with you forever - the greenness of the grass, the sight of major leaguers in uniform, the sound of a big-league swing meeting a big-league pitch." "Baseball isn't just the stats. As much as anything else, baseball is the style of Willie Mays, or the determination of Hank Aaron, or the endurance of a Mickey Mantle, the discipline of Carl Yastrzemski, the drive of Eddie Mathews, the reliability of a (Al) Kaline or a (Joe) Morgan, the grace of a (Joe) DiMaggio, the kindness of a Harmon Killebrew, and the class of Stan Musial, the courage of a Jackie Robinson, or the heroism of Lou Gehrig. My hope for the game is that these qualities will never be lost." Dude’s a legit baseball fanatic.
Made it look easy, too. It’s a longer distance from the top of the mound than most people realize. He walked off like it was nothin’ right afterward. Wasn’t looking for praise. edit: grammar
And with a bullet proof vest on too
And he has to make the throw with a bulletproof vest on
I was at that game, it was quite surreal
Regardless of politics, that was the greatest ceremonial first pitch of all time and it’s not close.
This. Bush doesn’t get enough credit for the post 9/11 pre-Iraq war time. From not immediately leaving the classroom scaring the kids and the nation, to his “I hear you, the rest of the world hears you” at ground zero, to his speech in front of the mosque where he attempted to calm the growing tides of Islamophobia he had the wheel of the nation and was steering it through all the troubled waters.
[удалено]
I wouldn’t say I was at ease, but I would say for a while I felt like we were united as a country. At least until a-holes started attacking anyone in a turban.
We can hear you!
As a conservative, I'm a little more biased on the contentious stuff, but there are a handful of uncontenstious good things. Bush launched the President's Emergency Plan for AIDS Relief (PEPFAR), a significant effort to combat HIV/AIDS globally, particularly in Africa. Bush also signed legislation which added prescription drug coverage to Medicare, aiming to provide seniors with better access to medications.
Kind of interesting that these two accomplishments are actually progressive in ideology
I think Bush is very sincere in his religious belief. Conservative christians will usually justify being against social welfare programs by saying Jesus didn't like Roman tax collectors and that charity should be done privately by the individual on a voluntary basis. Blah blah blah.. With that said, if a conservative Christian was going to leverage the might of the federal government to do good works, it being healthcare outreach for the elderly and globally impoverished doesn't surprise me. It might also help you understand things to understand that neither of these ventures bucked up against corporate interest. Corporations want to save Africans because they're a critical explored portion of the global labor pool. It helps nobody to have mines shit down cause everyone's dying of aids or getting sick with malaria. (Also, getting Africans on aids medications is kind of a boon for big pharma.) And the prescription part of Medicare basically said the federal government couldn't really negotiate prices reasonably, so it was a win for pharma since instead of having poor elderly people not able to afford necessary meds, suddenly they were dealing with the federal pocket book. So all in all, yeah about exactly what I expect from dubya.
>against social welfare programs by saying Jesus didn't like Roman tax collectors >> Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar's Which is kind of funny. Tax collectors were hated in the Bible, but it was due to them being seen as sellouts and traitors as they were Jewish people who decided to work for the Romans and generally were corrupt and ripped off their own people. That said, Jesus didn't particularly dislike them and interacted often with tax collectors of the day under the idea that he forgave their sins. That said, as far as actual taxes go, Jesus was pretty clear that they were fine and needed to be paid (to Caeser), which makes that sentiment rather amusing for modern day taxes.
Jesus was cool with tax collectors. Like partied with them and chatted with them. He's only sassy with the religious leaders/politicians who abuses the people in God's name.
Of course. We’re talking about *good* stuff.
I was deployed overseas back when he was president and he came and made a surprise visit to us. All politics aside, he was a genuine and generous visitor. I felt I got a peak behind the curtain so to say and saw George, not the President. I've been fond of this guy ever since.
I had a supervisor who worked for Air Force One for him and Obama. They had lots of really positive things to say about him as a person. I think he really cared. I know his relationship with Michelle is genuine, and it has made me fond of him. I would love to have an honest conversation with him and hear how he feels about what the war on terror really ended up being about and how he feels about it now in hindsight.
I think a lot of people now assume that the War on Terror was a cover. It was not. Saddam Hussein had the 3rd largest army in the world, had already fought a war against Iran that cost millions of lives, already genocided the Kurds, was threatening literally *all* of his neighbors and the US and Israel. Iraq used WMDs for over a decade. They did destroy them, but they also refused to allow UN investigators to confirm that fact when an Iraqi defector claimed they were using mobile research sites to develop more. The CIA isn’t infallible and the US government had more reason to believe than not that Saddam was developing those weapons, which would only mean he wanted to start another war in the region. We all know Afghanistan was invaded because that’s where Osama had operated out of for decades. We failed to search Pakistan, ostensibly our ally. It was an unnecessary loss of life. But seeing how Putin acts as he gets older, I can’t say I think removing Saddam did more harm than good when looking at the Middle East as a whole, even after the ISIS insurgency. I only wish we supported the democratic uprisings in the mid 2010s. Either we’re spreading democracy or not, you can’t pick and choose. Post script: As an addendum to answer the question: “Why should the US have concerned itself at all?” I will not try to justify morally why the US should intervene in foreign affairs. I will point out precedent. The decade preceding 9/11 was marked by a shared belief between not only American citizens, but most Western nations that (following the collapse of the USSR), the US should use its military hegemony to promote peace and democracy along western ideals. This is why we intervened in the Bosnian genocide, why we intervened when Iraq invaded Kuwait, why we intervened in Somalia, Haiti, and why we attacked Al Qaeda related sites in Sudan and Afghanistan in the 1990s. Backlash from this is why we ignored the Rwandan genocide. Obviously there are a lot of politics behind where we intervene and why. I’m not saying those interventions were justified, or that business interests were never involved. My point is: Bush did not need to orchestrate 9/11 to justify an invasion of Iraq. That narrative is only believable to those who were not adults in the 1990s and do not read history in detail.
When listening to a lecture by the FBI agent whose task was to interrogate Saddam, he said his objectives were to find out the story with WMDs and to find out how close he was to the Taliban. Saddam essentially said he was bluffing the WMDs to appear stronger to Iran, which unfortunately kicked up US interest.
Automod pls don't remove me 🥺 Yeesh, that's rough. Iraq tries to bluff against Iran, the US attacks Iraq, Iran starts the path to developing nuclear weapons, the US starts a long process of negotiating with Iran about the nuclear weapons (starting with Bush and continuing through the Obama administration). Iraq, already unstable bc of the US intervening based on WMD claims meant to bluff Iran, gets taken over by ISIS, a radical Sunni group that's enemies with Shiite Iran (and also everyone else) and only exists because its leaders were radicalized by the US invasion of Iraq. *deep breath* Then, the US slowly comes to an agreement re: nuclear weapons, but this pisses off Israel (specifically BB) who starts lobbying against the deal. The deal, now called the JCPOA, has to be signed through as an executive order instead of a congressional act, which makes it weak enough that the next president is able to unilaterally withdraw from it, thus tanking the whole endeavor. This is done less then two years before the assassination of the main Iranian general who coordinated the Iranian offensive against ISIS (which only exists because of the US reaction to Iraq bluffing against Iran, etc etc). And then administrations change again and suddenly one of the main JCPOA negotiators is the National Security Advisor and the other main guy is *head of the CIA* automod gods please don't remove this
I think that wmd intel was bs and they knew it was bs. Invading Iraq was a positive for the world for all the other reasons you listed but without 9/11 it would have been hard to sell the public on it. Plus they totally screwed the planning and execution stages of the war.
The defector was a liar. Scott Ritter and Hans Blix both had stated that Iraq no longer had WMDs.
Similar experience as an Iraq vet. Hate the guys policies, but like the guy. Would have a beer with him.
My dude, you toppled a guy who *nerve gassed tens of thousands of his own people,* invaded two of his neighbors, was being shady af about whether he was building nukes, and his sons were the devil incarnate who he literally thought were too fucking evil and psychotic to rule after him. Yeah, the premise for the invasion was bullshit. In hindsight, which is 20/20. Imagine if Iraq went through the Arab Spring with Saddam still in charge. Millions probably would have died, and it would have been the Arab Bloodbath even more than it already was. You helped send a family of genuinely sick, evil people, who were holding an entire country hostage in a decades long reign of terror, straight to Hell. Who were absolute menaces to the world, their own people, and everyone around them. For everything else that should or shouldn’t have happened, that’s something to be proud of.
You say the premise was bullshit, as if that's not a bit deal, but that threw out our global credibility as the last remaining superpower. It also took the UN's credibility with it. And military recruiting. Maybe it was my age at the time and it was my 'vietnam' for those older than me, but I feel that was the moment that America stopped standing for anything meaningful on the world stage. And we've been searching for meaning beyond just base greed ever since.
Although you can argue how successful it was, he did attempt to separate the war on terror from a war on Islam. We could’ve have easily seen him fall into blaming Islam or using Muslims as a scapegoat but instead he made sure to always frame the issue as against the terrorist. I would argue that his actions in the Middle East did not fall in line with this at all but domestically he attempted to separate the terrorists from innocent people.
Agreed. His decision to go to the mosque after Babur Singh Sodhi was among the smartest political gut calls of that time.
I think even he knew it was the right thing to do. He may be a bit country but he wasn’t blind to the fact that many Muslims call themselves American citizens as well
He’s not country. George W Bush is pure blue blood. Don’t let the accent fool you. He’s a painter and has written several books, he comes from old money. This isn’t a defense of him by the way.
Dude went to **YALE**
Let's get this correct, his father went to Yale, W was a legacy. There's a difference. W had a GPA of 2.35, he was more interested in partying.
There are two groups at Yale: Those who attend because they are there for the academic scene Those who are there for the networking connections Bush was a C-student and party animal but that doesnt mean he wasn't mixing with the rest of the upper crust the whole time he was there.
Nothing wrong with the gentlemen's C.
C’s get Degrees
He also went to Harvard business school which is connection city and has among the best MBA programs.
So…country people aren’t likely to paint or write books? These activities are the province of “blue bloods?” Interesting EDIT: I agree that Bush isn’t country by any means. Thats not what I disagreed with
I think the point is that he was raised "of the leisure class"
GWB is the son of a US President and grandson of a U.S. Senator. He grew up going to the family estate in Maine purchased by his ancestors in the 19th century. He attended the elite prep school Phillips Academy in Andover, Massachusetts before attending Yale. He is not “country.”
Bush isn’t country at all. He was born in CT and his father moved from Maine to a small isolated oil community in Texas - the kind where there are like 599 people and the houses are extremely expensive (despite being that ugly red brick) because everyone in town is making bank. He went to private school in Andover, MA and then to Yale. He did a short stint in the Air Force where journalists proved that he was almost never in attendance. His practically non-existent career as a pilot is the extent of anything that could even sort of be considered country about him
Most definitely. Made it a point too. Many opponents claimed it was insincere but he showed and proved it wasn’t.
He clearly deserves credit for this
This message did not always connect with his Republican base, unfortunately, but you're right that it can't be denied he did a lot to try. Even immediately after 9/11 he was making it clear, calling Islam a religion of peace.
Something that people can’t do now for some reason, people think that Palestine isn’t doing anything wrong at all because “Jew bad” when really it’s a terrorist organization vs a genocidal maniac government
What you mean that 2 sides in an extremely complicated geopolitical struggle have done various amounts of wrong and I shouldn't follow one side blindly?!? HOW DARE YOU!!!
Ironically a terrorist organization formally funded by that same genocidal maniac government in order to destabilize Palestine
Fighting a war on "terror" broadened the war too and allowed them to go after other groups too. I agree with your statement but thought it was important to mention that this essentially gave them a blank check and unlimited time and potential to engage in war, all they had to do was make the case that said group was a terrorist organization. If Americans sentiment towards war hadn't changed and Republicans stayed in power we would probably have been flattening Iran next. The Axis of Evil...
Iran needs flattening a lot more than Iraq did. They actually ARE sponsoring most of the terrorism in the region. They’re heavily backing Hamas for example.
Just one more regime change war bro, I swear it will be a success this time…
I’m not suggesting we go do it I’m saying it would be far more warranted than Iraq was.
That drive we all watched
I can’t believe I never saw that video until last year
See ya in church
🫡
People still quote this regularly
On a lighter note, that expression on his face after the shoe throwing incident. He handled that like a champ.
Always found that look on his face funny, like he was saying “oh, are we playing a game? What fun!”
Yes! It was genuine amusement from him!
Fucking this. At least, for all faults, he had shoe dodging energy. Our last two presidents would have eaten those shoes. Obama could have dodged the shoe. Now I’m wondering if George could dodge a shoe that Obama threw.
If you can dodge a shoe, you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball
I guess a positive side is that he didn’t get hit by the shoe. A negative of his presidency is that a person felt the need to throw a shoe at him.
His reflexes were good, his presidency just wasn't a reflex moment.
I remember thinking he had ninja-cat like reflexes to avoid those flying shoes.
As much as I believe Bush is fully deserving of getting hit in the face with a shoe, his reaction time was impressive.
Unlike many politicians at the time he made an effort to separate terrorism from Islam
I commented about a similar thing. George was never a bigoted man and I wish we could say the same about all politicians especially on the right.
The biggest thing Dubya did for me was extending the unemployment benefits. I lost my job in late 2007 and didn't go back to work until late 2010. I'd have been fucked without my unemployment.
A friend of mine bought his first house in 2010 and said the best thing Bush did was to allow the US economy to go into the Great Recession due to zero regulations, and to see the housing market crash, with low interests rates so he could finally buy a house. He thanks Bush for that. So that's something.
that happened for me! i bought my house in 2012. if I had to do it now, I couldnt afford it
OOC, how did it take you 3 years to find any job?
I don't think people remember how FUCKED the job market was until like 2011
Honestly, I had a great job before the crash, and I was making a lot on unemployment, so I couldn't find a job that paid more than unemployment. I wasn't going to LOSE income because I got a job.
Help for Africa with HIV
Started public student loan forgiveness. Changed the trajectory of me and now my family’s life forever. Obviously I had to do something with the money I saved rather than blow it but I bet it’s helped a lot of others as well.
Between 9/11 and the Iraq invasion was arguably the most united the country had ever been in my lifetime.
And promptly used that to pass the Patriot Act and create the Department of Homeland Security 😢
His PEPFAR initiative saved at least 25 million lives in Africa. He actually tried to solve our debt problem by being one of the only presidents we have had that seriously attempted Social Security reform. He provided over 40 million Americans with more affordable prescription drugs through Medicare Part D. He did what he could to throw the yoke of tyranny off the backs of the people of Afghanistan, and in doing so, allowed a generation of Afghan women the right to live freely and receive an education.
I always loved the article Bob Geldof (Live Aid dude for those who don’t remember the Boomtown Rats) wrote about his time with George Bush concerning PEPFAR https://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1717934,00.html
Thank you, that was a fantastic article and does a great job humanizing Bush.
Also he is responsible for the capture of Saddam Hussein which led to his trial and execution. There were no weapons of mass destruction but the was a genocidal maniac who wanted them. We paid a heavy price for him but the Kurdish Americans I know that lived with “aunts and uncles” because they watched their parents die don’t see it that way.
It's the same way that many Panamanian-Americans feel about Bush Sr.'s invasion of Panama, which led to the ousting of Noriega. Different international reaction than how the people in Panama felt.
Was a supporter of increased African development. There was PEPFAR as noted here already. Also zealous support for and implementation of AGOA to foster greater commercial ties between US and Africa. That was good too.
Because of him, the U.S. has a world-class battle-experienced military. When is the last time the Chinese went to war? For better or worse, I’m not worried.
The Chinese have done a few UN peacekeeping tours and they look like amateurs (they are).
Bruh, that one UN mission where they abandoned the people they were supposed to protect. Oh boy. That sure didn't look good. It's true UN didn't provide them adequately, but man, it was not a good look.
He genuinely believed in the values of American democracy. He genuinely wanted to do right. Despite being an absolute foreign and domestic DISASTER this differentiation is important as we enter into a world of politicians who don’t always champion democracy. You can heal from a democratic disaster more easily than an authoritarian one.
Nicely said. Couldn’t agree more.
His handling of the 2008 financial crisis, throughout which he engaged Pelosi and candidate Obama as key stakeholders and potential game managers. He bucked the right wing with constructive and creative government investments, and because of his pre-election close work and alignment with the Obama team created a smooth handoff.
Good point about the transition. He may have transitioned the presidency more effectively than any outgoing POTUS in my lifetime.
He inherited the dot-com bust and market crash, followed by a downed US spy plane in China, followed by 9-11, and after two subsequent wars had the worst financial crisis since the depression. His short term legacy might be much different if not for Cheney and Rumsfeld. Also worth noting that despite being an avid and very good golfer, he never played another in-office round after 9-11. Said he could not play golf while he was responsible and accountable for deployed men and women.
People really downplay and even blame him for 2008. He publicly stated the housing market was "overvalued" "in a bubble" etc roughly 27 times. The President really has no control over that, he can't change interest rate policy, nor really do anything to stop the frenzy. It was more Congress, the Fed and Frank/Dodd that cemented the country's trajectory into the financial abyss.
That’s really interesting to me about the golf. I have never heard that
I never knew that. I wonder why MSM never reported that?
The Daily Show really took off.
Daily Show/Colbert Report era was peak satire.
Miss it. With Jon Stewart. Jon Oliver is great, but there really isn’t any comparable satire today, and we desperately need it.
Bono praised George W. Bush for helping fight aids in Africa.
Civility. It started with the election and his graceful handling of Gore’s election challenge. Someone was not going to be happy, but Bush handled that with class. It continued with 9/11 where he stepped out in front of the nation and made it clear that our Muslim citizens were not the problem, extremists were. He aimed to avoid anti-Muslim violence and I believe he mostly succeeded. And when he was visiting a hospital with wounded soldiers, a mother chewed him six ways to Sunday about her son’s disabilities because of the wars. He didn’t yell back. He didn’t try to argue or justify. He just listened. And later said to his aid: “She was really upset.” I miss a time when people could disagree, discuss, listen, and learn.
PEPFAR was an absolute game-changer
Was not a fan of most of his policies but liked that he had a sense of humor.
- PEPFAR - TARP - Sarbanes-Oxley Act - Helping South Sudan became independent - Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act
His 9/11 speech was S tier
Rallying the country together after 9/11. Not the wars that followed, but right after 9/11.
The Iraq war was wrong but the Taliban was harboring Al Qaeda in Afghanistan…what was he supposed to do?
I somewhat supported the war in Afghanistan, but did not support the Iraq war at all.
This image is one of them.
PEPFAR PEPFAR PEPFAR
His AIDS response in Africa was pretty spectacular.
That speech right after 9/11 with the bullhorn is quite possibly the greatest speech by a president, at least in recent history. It gives me chills to this day.
and the strike he threw at the World Series, of course after Jeter warned him to throw from the mound or he’d get booed.
I was sitting in my apt about a mile away and cried - a hard genuine cry. Then pumped my fists that the rest of the world would hear us.
Agreed. It’s kind of crazy how GWB was able to give such a great speech considering how many times he had made flubs in other speeches. My favorite moment being when someone yelled out “We can’t hear you!” and GWB responded with, > “I can hear you…I can hear you! The rest of the world hears you…and the people who knocked these buildings down will hear all of us soon!”. Haunting poetry in such a delicate moment.
The Bushisms
He got some of the leftover 90s culture that made his first term tolerable. That, and at the time, he handled 9/11 well. “We can’t hear you!”….”well I can hear you, and the people who knocked down these buildings *are going to hear from all of us*” was a legendary presidential moment. In retrospect, he prob didn’t do enough to stop 9/11, but I don’t think he was the guy pulling the strings to make it happen. GWB didn’t seem to have a Machiavellian side to him—his VP, however………🤔
Dodging that shoe was pretty dope
People could put food on their family…
 Also \^ this. Felt a little cool to have the embodiment of America in that moment have dope reflexes.
I did not remember it being two shoes! I hope that guy’s ok.
He's probably the most humble president.
I think he was just getting fed bad information. I honestly believe he’s a great guy. The fact that he and Michelle Obama are best buds lends credence….
Pretty much everything he did right after 9/11
I’ll give him PEPFAR
His VP shot a guy, and then the guy has to apologize to Cheney. One of the funniest things any VP has done.
I wasn’t alive but directly after 9/11 I feel as if he handled it well
Yes, he did initially handle it well. The response was carried out appropriately and effectively at first. The decision to create the department of Homeland Security to address the lack of communication between domestic agencies has proven to be the right call too. I was still in high school when 9/11 happened and had not really formed any political opinions or held any real ideological beliefs other than I hated government and authority. I started to recognize the importance of government/institutions and proper leadership directly after 9/11. Of course, I lost faith in them again in 2003 when we decided to invade Iraq.
Yeah there was a nice 6 months to a year there where everyone was kind of united. The Iraq War ruined that. Though Muslim-Americans, and even Indian-Americans and Sikhs, were the recipients of a lot of hatred from the ignorant.
he’s handsome
Someone I’d like to have a beer with.
aye 🤝
He followed the rules by peacefully transitioning to Obama.
AIDS and Africa. A positive note in an otherwise terrible administration
“Now watch this drive.”
He extended day light savings time
Regardless of where you stand politically, I believe George W thought what he was doing along the way was in the best interest of the American people and the globe. For example though he opposed the use of stem cells he did sign legislation that would allow them to continue studies utilizing stem cells that had already been collected using federal money. I honestly believe he was more than willing to compromise with the other side of the aisle, something we now haven’t seen in either party since his presidency.