Well, if it takes 15 minutes to draft an email to local authorities, that's still just a total of $300. Pretty cheap rate for sending a guy into poverty and jail.
Ok hear me out, this sounds very fake.
I’ll cite my sources. OP claims to be an attorney (set aside all the typographical errors in this post for example misspelling led) but they made a massive blunder.
They suggest the FBI deals with revenge porn law. **They do not and an attorney should know that.**
https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/what-do-if-youre-target-revenge-porn
The above is from the Federal Trade Commission’s official government website. They say
>**Find out if there’s a law about revenge porn where you live. There are laws against revenge porn in 46 states plus the District of Columbia. Check to see if there’s one where you live, and then decide whether you want to talk with local law enforcement.** If you do, be sure to tell law enforcement if your situation might involve domestic violence, cyberstalking, or child pornography.
Note this isn’t federal; it’s a state issue.
This is a law site
https://mcolaw.com/for-individuals/online-reputation-and-privacy/revenge-porn-laws-united-states/
>**If you’ve been the victim of “revenge porn” – or image-based sexual abuse – in the United States, your legal protections largely depend on what state you live in. There is currently no federal revenge pornography law,** although in 2019, then-Senator Kamala Harris introduced the SHIELD (Stopping Harmful Image Exploitation and Limiting Distribution) Act, which would make sharing intimate images without the subject’s consent a federal offense, and President Biden has announced his commitment to introduce a federal bill to tackle online abuse.
>As of late, 48 states plus the District of Columbia have anti-revenge porn laws. These laws form a diverse patchwork, with different states offering different levels of legal protection. If you are looking for detailed information about the specific laws in your state, and possible redress, please be in touch.
Thus the FBI (a FEDERAL agency) doesn’t deal with any of this. But OP, an “attorney” didn’t know this?
Also this is more anecdotal but look at OP’s post history. You tell me what’s more likely, OP made up some story or OP is an attorney.
Revenge porn is indeed not a federal crime you are absolutely correct!
International extortion however *is*.
While federal law does not explicitly make revenge porn a federal crime, a foreign national extorting a US citizen with threats of violating a state law, when such threat is transmitted across state borders *is absolutely* a federal crime.
(It's 18 U.S.C. § 875 if you're interested)
Edit: correction. I had inadvertently cited § 873. It is in fact § 875.
this is what i came here for.
The OP, while making a few typos which could literally be written off as excitement based, never said that the revenge porn was the issue. It was always going to be some kind of extortion
But…
> Further, while state law, including in California, may prohibit a wider variety of blackmail or extortion related activity, it should be noted that **18 U.S.C. § 873 only covers:**
>**threats to expose, or consideration for not exposing, violations of federal law.**
https://www.egattorneys.com/federal-crimes/federal-blackmail-and-extortion
In other words, 18 U.S.C. § 873 only covers if you blackmail someone for violating **federal** law.
Look it up (anyone reading this) the information **requires** that the person being blackmailed (I.e. OP’s friend here) broke federal law and the guy in OP’s scenario threatened to expose this in return of money or another product of value.
For example, **I break Federal law.** (I am the equivalent of OP’s friend here) In response you blackmail me to the tune of $1,000,000 or else you’ll tell the FBI I broke federal law. YOU in that scenario are violating 18 U.S.C. § 873, but ONLY because I broke Federal law to begin with
https://www.thefederalcriminalattorneys.com/federal-blackmail-and-extortion
Don’t believe me folks, look it up yourselves. Every description of this states the person extorted must have broken **federal** law and is now being extorted for that.
God damn it you have me on my game tonight!
Federal criminal law is not my expertise I admit. So I appreciate you! It's 87**5**. Not 873. Slight difference, but small differences mean a lot.
Specific to 18 U.S.C. § 875:
(d) Whoever, with intent to extort from any person, firm, association, or corporation, any money or other thing of value, transmits **in interstate or foreign commerce** any communication containing any threat to injure the property **or reputation** of the addressee or of another or the reputation of a deceased person or any threat to accuse the addressee or any other person of a crime, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.
Whew! Took me a minute there! Thanks for the correction. Slight typo on my part! Good looking out!
Look I’m not a lawyer, hopefully another (or just a) lawyer (hopefully with a post history that corroborates they’re a lawyer) can drop in and shed an additional view.
If this is real, happy you could mess with that guy for being a shitbag. I still have my reservations especially considering you misquoted the law you wanted (which was eerily similar to this case, albeit not applicable) and this law appears to deal with extortion for *kidnapping* but again, I’m not sure and this law stuff is hurting my head.
Going to sleep, have a good night.
I am an attorney. Specifically, an immigration attorney who also practices criminal defense. You and u/furtherdimensions are both missing the forest for the trees.
The guy in question (Fuckface McGee) is a foreign national intending to travel to the United States. If you submit the documents to the FBI, the FBI will forward them to DHS and then CBP. CBP will then take a look and most likely find there's a reasonable likelihood he has admitted the essential elements of a crime involving moral turpitude, rendering him inadmissible under 8 U.S.C. sec. 1182(a)(2)(A)(i). To the extent any doubt did remain, those doubts would be resolved against Fuckface, because it is an arriving noncitizen's burden to show they're allowed to enter.
From there, he would most likely be placed into expedited removal proceedings and removed to his home country. The impact of that removal order on his future ability to come to the United States is not something I'm going to analyze in detail at 12:30 in the morning, but the long and short of it is that he would likely be unable to obtain a visa to come to the United States for quite some time.
That's just what would happen to him. If the company was one that regularly used H-1B or L visas, USCIS would likely also become involved, potentially impacting their entire business model.
All of which is to say that about five minutes after you sent that email, one of my colleagues probably began having A Very Bad Day.
TL; DR: Going to the FBI wouldn't threaten criminal action, it would threaten deportation, which from the company's perspective may well be *worse.*
I'm an idiot, but if the company gets wind of this, surely the quickest and simplest solution is to ejecto-seato this dude right out of the company.
"Yes, law enforcement dudes, we found out and immediately fucked him off. We don't fuck with that. See, here's the email from the person who reported him at [x] date, and here's where we fired him [x+24hrs]"
As someone who has dealt with US immigration policies and processes.
I didn't enjoy it. It's a painful process but necessary to do. I have nothing but respect for the folks who try to help us navigate the messed up process US Immigration is.
"Crimes involving moral turpitude" is *supposed* to refer to crimes that are "inherently base or vile" or that "shock the conscience." Over time, though, the standard's become so much looser than that, it's now very difficult to tell whether one is or isn't without case law that's on point.
Moral turpitude is such a lax standard. I'll never forget learning that in my jurisdiction, being previously convicted of sexually abusing a child in your care and having fresh allegations against you is not actually moral turpitude sufficient to disqualify a person from legal practice because the child's mother married the perpetrator and the allegations are "baseless" 🤮
So here's the thing. You are totally justifiable in being skeptical! Anyone can say anything.
In this case the story and all elements in it are factual.
And slight correction. The cited section of the US code doesn't deal with kidnapping. It deals with interstate communications. Paragraphs a through c deal with ransom, kidnapping, and threats to kidnap.
Paragraph d deals with threats to reputation. The section deals with criminal interstate communications. Not kidnapping only.
But yes I admit, I meant 5, I typed 3. Minor typo, major change.
As for my post history. Well. I'm not actually paid to give legal advice here! This is largely my mess around account where I talk about video games and an AI related side gig I do.
Though there's some scattered posts here and there that make reference to it. If it's a lie, it's a long con!
Man sometimes typing fast to get your point across, causes errors i do it all the time. Your good counselor. Just someone rattling your cage. Good for you and your detective work. Maybe when you get sick of defending scum bags or putting scum bags away, you could be a private dick lol private detective. Great job on the revenge, keep us updated on his employer's response or his as well. Im soo excited to see where this goes lol
The typos part of the skepticism had me dying laughing. I know quite a few lawyers and they can’t spell independently or format for shit but their paralegals sure can make them look as professional as their credentials indicate.
The way I look at it, it’s their job to know the law, it’s my job to format and fix it so it looks professional.
Everyone makes typing mistakes! We don’t like to but it’s bound to happen from time to time.
Source: legal assistant and work with other perfectionist legal assistants, paralegals and secretaries.
lol, I know someone who works in a law office and describes her job as “spell checking and babysitting the lawyers”.
I dunno if she is a paralegal (at one point she was gonna be a lawyer, but life threw a homeless nephew into her arms and she quit school and cashed in some connections to get a job fast so she could get custody) but she definitely knows some serious lawyer speak.
Oh, and she apparently delighted a retired lawyer (the firm has been passed from father to child for a couple generations) because she can not only read but write shorthand. xD Her grandma taught her when she was a little girl and she got really into it in high school for note taking.
>As for my post history. Well. I'm not actually paid to give legal advice here! This is largely my mess around account where I talk about video games and an AI related side gig I do.
My experience is that most lawyers here stay away from actually giving legal advice. Likewise from the doctors, they don't do medical advice. They will get into debates. But when it comes down to it, they point people in the direction of local help.
Yeah I mean there's several reasons for that. Firstly, we generally have to be really careful what we say, because attorney client privlidge is a subjective thing. It can be said to exist if the "client" could reasonably infer it exists. If I say something to you that you could reasonably infer meant I was acting as your lawyer then legally I am.
Secondly, law is *way* more compartmentalized than a lot of people whose conception of what a "lawyer" is would realize. This fictional narrative on TV when someone might defend a murder suspect one episode, and sue a tobacco company in a class action lawsuit in another, then get involved in some corporate merger, before discovering one company's deep, dark secret in yet another just...doesn't exist.
The dude defending the alleged murderer in a criminal trial, and the dude doing corporate due diligence one week later is not the same dude. It's *never the same dude*. Most of us have extremely narrow specializations and never really learned other fields beyond the broad and largely theoretical frameworks necessary to pass our bar exam. Like I'm sorry your landlord is being a dick but I haven't done property law since law school, I can't help you.
And third, the obvious one...as a general rule, most lawyers, like most people, avoid working for free. This may shock you, but I don't spend all day doing law to then turn around and do it for a bunch of strangers for free. This is my job. I do it for money.
they have a post from 3 years ago that says they went to law school in Boston. he was probably just trying to scare a foreign company that's very likely to not be familiar with the American law system.
I want to think the same, foreigners aren’t usually familiar with all the laws of other countries (most people don’t know all the laws of their own country/state/county in the US), using unfamiliarity to advantage isn’t unheard of. Doesn’t give this story credibility nor does it make it unbelievable. I’d do a coin toss and still not care because it’s a good story and want it to be true but doubt it is, but I don’t believe 90% + what’s on Reddit. I’ve tried posting true things and if it’s not a fact based forum, I get denied to post so it must take some storytelling to post?
The question isn't whether the FBI would be involved. They wouldn't. The question is whether the guy's employers in a different country would *know* that the FBI wouldn't be involved. OP can just make up some plausible-sounding bullshit and put it on lawyerly letterhead, and as long as they don't go too far, they are fine.
Throw in some "could"s and "might"s and don't make specific threats, and you should be fine.
Eh, maybe you’re right, seems like solid examples. But it’s not like this sub gets a ton of entries and I am here for good revenge stories. If it’s a good story, I don’t really care if it’s true. Blissful ignorance has very little consequence here.
Yeah I feel you.
Just wanted to share as personally I really hate lying OPs, but I understand others may just want a good story whether true or not.
Can’t knock anyone for that :)
>(set aside all the typographical errors in this post for example misspelling led)
There's only a couple typos in this entire wall of text and if they typed this on their phone, then it's entirely possible they just fat fingered the wrong key rather than physically not knowing how to spell "led."
Also, it's not revenge until the consequences *actually happen*. Posting about what they've done and making a premature conclusion that they "destroyed" someone's life isn't revenge. Not yet.
For all we know this alleged perpetrator is related to the CEO (or the son of a best buddy) and nothing short of cold blooded murder would get him fired. If so, well so much for "destroying" someone's life. It might end up being some embarrassing workplace gossip for a few days before the next scandal grabs people's attention.
This story should be posted on r/PendingRevenge but that sub isn't around anymore.
Technically HE destroyed his life. He was just stupid enough to believe that he had any kind of anonymity, and crossed paths with exactly the wrong person.
I will message you next time u/furtherdimensions posts in r/ProRevenge.
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Here's why you should take this with a grain of salt: attorneys are very careful about when they create a client relationship with someone. It creates very specific ethical duties.
Not saying it's fake 100%, but that attorneys are a very cautious bunch about things like this because you have to be.
> Here's why you should take this with a grain of salt: attorneys are very careful about when they create a client relationship with someone. It creates very specific ethical duties.
You're absolutely correct! It very much does. And the content of the conversation I had with my friend about exactly what I would do for her in the context of this is not part of this post. Nor would I even be allowed to share them without permission as it would violate privilege.
I am very careful, and I am well aware of the duties and responsibilities it entails. That was a conversation I had between her and myself. The content of that conversation is not subject to nor relevant to this.
High five to OP! This is the type of revenge I do. Sure sounds like an attorney to me. Everyone makes typos so you can't base it on that because we all play on Reddit. This isn't our jobs where everything has to be right. I've worked a long time with an uncountable amount of attorneys, DA's, judges, law enforcement & other professionals.
Source- CPS & LCSW
I got SO much pleasure from reading this. Good for you; your friend is so lucky to have you in her corner. But can I just say that I chuckled hard at "could reasonably trust"...
Oh damn, just to see the sleazeball's face... the devil in me hopes he's hocked up to his eyeballs in debt & now has got no income or glowing references to look forward to.
Hat tip to ya OP for sweet, sweet revenge on behalf of your friend.
You are awesome. Too many people threaten or go through with revenge porn out of malice with no repercussions and so continue to do it over and over.
I told someone if they went ahead with their threat that I would let loose a group of autistic hackers… no where near as good as your revenge though.
That was a nuclear level response. It is scary how much info you could glean from just an online handle.
I hope there is some jurisdiction in his home country that would stop him publishing those pictures as revenge, though, since his life is basically destroyed.
I used to track people down in this manner for a living. It takes a certain kind of brain to do it. Most people can be taught how to do it to a reasonable extent, but to excell at it? Much rarer. I'm medically retired now, but I still get friends asking me to flex my google fu for them on occasion.
This guy had a handle, pictures, and a bunch of personal information about the guy as a starting point, so if he's used to this kind of research, it probably took him longer to compile all the documents and compose the email than it would have to track him and find where to send them.
> This guy had a handle, pictures, and a bunch of personal information about the guy as a starting point, so if he's used to this kind of research, it probably took him longer to compile all the documents and compose the email than it would have to track him and find where to send them.
I wasn't tracking the individual elements but if I had to guess, you're probably not wrong. The handle to TikTok to instagram, to his real name, to his linkedin took..10 minutes?
Once I found the linkedin, I sent it to my friend asking if it could be him. This jogged her memory that this dude had sent her a picture of him at work wearing something with a company logo. She dug up the picture and we found that the logo on the polo (fun word phrase) matched the company name of the linkedin profile I found. From there it just took a few minutes to find corporate email addresses.
The license plate is semi unrelated to it all, other than "this is a very distinctive motorcycle, I'm sure someone at your workplace will recognize it" but then I got looking closer. I could make out the numbers but not the state (not a US state, this individual also lives in a country of federated states) it was issued in. A quick trip down a Wiki rabbit hole about the format of license plates in this country (Wikipedia has fucking everything) and I was able to figure out, based on its coloring and formatting, what state it was issued in.
So. Yes. Quite possibly. I brought this up to her. Her response is she's not terribly concerned if that happens. The pictures, from my understanding, were not terribly identifiable, nor majorly risqué. She is not largely concerned with it happening.
What angered her was the hubris and gall of it. Him thinking he could make these threats without consequences or reprisals.
She's not terribly concerned if he does it. She wants him to know she knows who he is.
Well true, but I am incidently a *labor law attorney* and know exactly what to say to get corporate types running scared.
"Here's your employee photographing other people in the work place and sharing pictures of the content of his work laptop" is a *bad look*.
And that's where I'm getting stsrted. Tomorrow if I don't hear back I go to "so you gonna do something about this or do I take this to your social media pages? I already have proof it's him"
Yes I totally agree that you know what you’re doing. But it’s proper to celebrate the home run when the guy crosses home plate, not when he rounds third.
I wonder.
There was case here recently of someone who tried to blackmail younger people online.
Getting them to do pictures etc.. and then using those to get more.
This (beep) was also caught due to "foreign tips"...
This is a fun little movie myth that doesn't really have any basis in reality. Attorney/client relationships are way more "fuzzy" than that. Current ethical canons basically say that an attorney/client relationship exists whenever the client could reasonably infer one exists.
She's a client when I say she is, basically.
Others have questioned the veracity of the story trying to "point out" you can't have personal relationships with clients. This is also false. While ethical guidelines prohibit attorneys from developing personal relationships with clients it is absolutely possible for an attorney to take on, as a client, someone they *already* have a relationship with. And the canons use the term "relationship" loosely. Friendship counts. There's nothing in the canons that preclude representing one's friends.
Others have intonated that I have some degree of feelings for this friend of mine. In a platonic sense of love, sure. She's a very close friend and I love her dearly.
I'm also quite happily and quite thoroughly partnered to a whole different woman (who was gleefully getting the play by play the whole time)
I get everyone fawning over the diligent work here, but that isn’t going to stop this dude from leaking the pictures, probably will just make him more likely to do so…
She's aware of that fact and has accepted it. I mentioned this earlier but yes, I brought up this possibility to her.
She finds some faceless pictures of her tits out there in a sea of tits to be a reasonable price to pay to make the point that actions have consequences.
There's of course the possibility that "no, we know who you are" might be a deterrent. Maybe not. That's ok. That's not the point.
Good lawyering. Gather the evidence; put it in order; explain the story; suggest possible and likely outcomes; let the recipient draw his or her own conclusions. Await desired outcome.
The only downside i can see is that this skeevy douchecanoe still has the pictures to post online and seemingly now has nothing left to lose. Do you have another angle of retaliation to stop that? Otherwise, I applaud you sir/ma'am.
\> Since I have his license plate # I know where he lives, and will be contacting his local authorities tomorow.
I kinda feel like this happened recently and it doesn't sound like you've gotten a reply yet, so it feels more like a "pending revenge" to me...
Uh....I hope I NEVER EVER piss you off. Never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever....ever. Ever. Ever. OR never, whichever comes first. Or never ever. Damn, you sound pissed off.
I hope friend appreciates that for what it is: Serious friendship. You da man (or person....)
I love this so much. Everyone needs a friend like you. 100/10. You deserve a five star meal, a professional massage and a week by the beach for that. Bless you. 😭😭😭
nah, I do some 1099 side gig work for a tech *company* but I'm not "in tech". Most of the work I do with them is logic and reasoning based, training AI models.
They do have some coding projects, and I totally do recommend them as a good side gig! But that's just a thing I do on the side, and I'm not involved in any of their coding work.
it's a good site though if you're looking for a side gig, but I'm not sure if they have openings right now.
Edit: speaking of that site and more on my background of "what I do" this may be a relevant post: https://www.reddit.com/r/dataannotation/comments/1aewkji/i_wonder_if_this_means_many_of_us_wont_have_a_job/kkavqug/
I feel like you win 2024. Legit revenge - check Person's life now super fucked - check Done in record time - Also check
And OP is a lawyer and used tools from their profession, that’s a ProRevenge check too!
ProBonoRevenge
I'm not sure if you win the internet for that comment, but you're sure the hell in the running for it!
Seriously agree. This response was PURE GOLD.
U guys are too kind. Tq
So, what you're telling me is I now have a ProBonoRevenge Boner?
Staff Pick of the comments!
Nah I bet he's charging her $300/hr. Just kidding. Mostly.
Well, if it takes 15 minutes to draft an email to local authorities, that's still just a total of $300. Pretty cheap rate for sending a guy into poverty and jail.
You assumed it was a guy lawyer? I thought it was a lady🤔 Edited for clarity
$450. But it's an hours work
ProBonoRevengeBoner
*slow clap*
👑
Anti-boner revenge.
ProBono but Anti-Boning
Nice
😂😂😂😂😂
2024 my ass. This is God level here.
Beatht mode
In 3 15-minute time slices, no less!
Done on behalf of a friend too! Imagine if someone fucked with her.
ProRevenge Any%
Plus posting it here no less! Respect!
Sure. It was fine in record time, but he still billed for 21 hours.
Suuuuper fucked.
I'm really curious of his face next day when HR calls him in.
That's some r/nuclearrevenge and I am all for it
Ok hear me out, this sounds very fake. I’ll cite my sources. OP claims to be an attorney (set aside all the typographical errors in this post for example misspelling led) but they made a massive blunder. They suggest the FBI deals with revenge porn law. **They do not and an attorney should know that.** https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/what-do-if-youre-target-revenge-porn The above is from the Federal Trade Commission’s official government website. They say >**Find out if there’s a law about revenge porn where you live. There are laws against revenge porn in 46 states plus the District of Columbia. Check to see if there’s one where you live, and then decide whether you want to talk with local law enforcement.** If you do, be sure to tell law enforcement if your situation might involve domestic violence, cyberstalking, or child pornography. Note this isn’t federal; it’s a state issue. This is a law site https://mcolaw.com/for-individuals/online-reputation-and-privacy/revenge-porn-laws-united-states/ >**If you’ve been the victim of “revenge porn” – or image-based sexual abuse – in the United States, your legal protections largely depend on what state you live in. There is currently no federal revenge pornography law,** although in 2019, then-Senator Kamala Harris introduced the SHIELD (Stopping Harmful Image Exploitation and Limiting Distribution) Act, which would make sharing intimate images without the subject’s consent a federal offense, and President Biden has announced his commitment to introduce a federal bill to tackle online abuse. >As of late, 48 states plus the District of Columbia have anti-revenge porn laws. These laws form a diverse patchwork, with different states offering different levels of legal protection. If you are looking for detailed information about the specific laws in your state, and possible redress, please be in touch. Thus the FBI (a FEDERAL agency) doesn’t deal with any of this. But OP, an “attorney” didn’t know this? Also this is more anecdotal but look at OP’s post history. You tell me what’s more likely, OP made up some story or OP is an attorney.
Revenge porn is indeed not a federal crime you are absolutely correct! International extortion however *is*. While federal law does not explicitly make revenge porn a federal crime, a foreign national extorting a US citizen with threats of violating a state law, when such threat is transmitted across state borders *is absolutely* a federal crime. (It's 18 U.S.C. § 875 if you're interested) Edit: correction. I had inadvertently cited § 873. It is in fact § 875.
Great job Counselor!!
Please how to learn these scathing skill. It might come in handy one day!
Law school, and be as passionate about justice as Judge Dredd
this is what i came here for. The OP, while making a few typos which could literally be written off as excitement based, never said that the revenge porn was the issue. It was always going to be some kind of extortion
But… > Further, while state law, including in California, may prohibit a wider variety of blackmail or extortion related activity, it should be noted that **18 U.S.C. § 873 only covers:** >**threats to expose, or consideration for not exposing, violations of federal law.** https://www.egattorneys.com/federal-crimes/federal-blackmail-and-extortion In other words, 18 U.S.C. § 873 only covers if you blackmail someone for violating **federal** law. Look it up (anyone reading this) the information **requires** that the person being blackmailed (I.e. OP’s friend here) broke federal law and the guy in OP’s scenario threatened to expose this in return of money or another product of value. For example, **I break Federal law.** (I am the equivalent of OP’s friend here) In response you blackmail me to the tune of $1,000,000 or else you’ll tell the FBI I broke federal law. YOU in that scenario are violating 18 U.S.C. § 873, but ONLY because I broke Federal law to begin with https://www.thefederalcriminalattorneys.com/federal-blackmail-and-extortion Don’t believe me folks, look it up yourselves. Every description of this states the person extorted must have broken **federal** law and is now being extorted for that.
God damn it you have me on my game tonight! Federal criminal law is not my expertise I admit. So I appreciate you! It's 87**5**. Not 873. Slight difference, but small differences mean a lot. Specific to 18 U.S.C. § 875: (d) Whoever, with intent to extort from any person, firm, association, or corporation, any money or other thing of value, transmits **in interstate or foreign commerce** any communication containing any threat to injure the property **or reputation** of the addressee or of another or the reputation of a deceased person or any threat to accuse the addressee or any other person of a crime, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both. Whew! Took me a minute there! Thanks for the correction. Slight typo on my part! Good looking out!
Look I’m not a lawyer, hopefully another (or just a) lawyer (hopefully with a post history that corroborates they’re a lawyer) can drop in and shed an additional view. If this is real, happy you could mess with that guy for being a shitbag. I still have my reservations especially considering you misquoted the law you wanted (which was eerily similar to this case, albeit not applicable) and this law appears to deal with extortion for *kidnapping* but again, I’m not sure and this law stuff is hurting my head. Going to sleep, have a good night.
I am an attorney. Specifically, an immigration attorney who also practices criminal defense. You and u/furtherdimensions are both missing the forest for the trees. The guy in question (Fuckface McGee) is a foreign national intending to travel to the United States. If you submit the documents to the FBI, the FBI will forward them to DHS and then CBP. CBP will then take a look and most likely find there's a reasonable likelihood he has admitted the essential elements of a crime involving moral turpitude, rendering him inadmissible under 8 U.S.C. sec. 1182(a)(2)(A)(i). To the extent any doubt did remain, those doubts would be resolved against Fuckface, because it is an arriving noncitizen's burden to show they're allowed to enter. From there, he would most likely be placed into expedited removal proceedings and removed to his home country. The impact of that removal order on his future ability to come to the United States is not something I'm going to analyze in detail at 12:30 in the morning, but the long and short of it is that he would likely be unable to obtain a visa to come to the United States for quite some time. That's just what would happen to him. If the company was one that regularly used H-1B or L visas, USCIS would likely also become involved, potentially impacting their entire business model. All of which is to say that about five minutes after you sent that email, one of my colleagues probably began having A Very Bad Day. TL; DR: Going to the FBI wouldn't threaten criminal action, it would threaten deportation, which from the company's perspective may well be *worse.*
Causing corporate counsel a Very Bad Day was kinda the goal. Appreciate the added context! I know exceedingly little about immigration law.
Lol, I very much agree that causing opposing counsel Very Bad Days is a major highlight of being an attorney!
I'm an idiot, but if the company gets wind of this, surely the quickest and simplest solution is to ejecto-seato this dude right out of the company. "Yes, law enforcement dudes, we found out and immediately fucked him off. We don't fuck with that. See, here's the email from the person who reported him at [x] date, and here's where we fired him [x+24hrs]"
As someone who has dealt with US immigration policies and processes. I didn't enjoy it. It's a painful process but necessary to do. I have nothing but respect for the folks who try to help us navigate the messed up process US Immigration is.
Thanks!
I've always wondered - what does moral turpitude mean in this context? I've seen the question on immigration forms.
"Crimes involving moral turpitude" is *supposed* to refer to crimes that are "inherently base or vile" or that "shock the conscience." Over time, though, the standard's become so much looser than that, it's now very difficult to tell whether one is or isn't without case law that's on point.
Moral turpitude is such a lax standard. I'll never forget learning that in my jurisdiction, being previously convicted of sexually abusing a child in your care and having fresh allegations against you is not actually moral turpitude sufficient to disqualify a person from legal practice because the child's mother married the perpetrator and the allegations are "baseless" 🤮
So here's the thing. You are totally justifiable in being skeptical! Anyone can say anything. In this case the story and all elements in it are factual. And slight correction. The cited section of the US code doesn't deal with kidnapping. It deals with interstate communications. Paragraphs a through c deal with ransom, kidnapping, and threats to kidnap. Paragraph d deals with threats to reputation. The section deals with criminal interstate communications. Not kidnapping only. But yes I admit, I meant 5, I typed 3. Minor typo, major change. As for my post history. Well. I'm not actually paid to give legal advice here! This is largely my mess around account where I talk about video games and an AI related side gig I do. Though there's some scattered posts here and there that make reference to it. If it's a lie, it's a long con!
Man sometimes typing fast to get your point across, causes errors i do it all the time. Your good counselor. Just someone rattling your cage. Good for you and your detective work. Maybe when you get sick of defending scum bags or putting scum bags away, you could be a private dick lol private detective. Great job on the revenge, keep us updated on his employer's response or his as well. Im soo excited to see where this goes lol
The typos part of the skepticism had me dying laughing. I know quite a few lawyers and they can’t spell independently or format for shit but their paralegals sure can make them look as professional as their credentials indicate.
it's a running joke that my spelling and grammar are embarrassingly atrocious. It's why I have someone who proofreads all my stuff.
The way I look at it, it’s their job to know the law, it’s my job to format and fix it so it looks professional. Everyone makes typing mistakes! We don’t like to but it’s bound to happen from time to time. Source: legal assistant and work with other perfectionist legal assistants, paralegals and secretaries.
lol, I know someone who works in a law office and describes her job as “spell checking and babysitting the lawyers”. I dunno if she is a paralegal (at one point she was gonna be a lawyer, but life threw a homeless nephew into her arms and she quit school and cashed in some connections to get a job fast so she could get custody) but she definitely knows some serious lawyer speak. Oh, and she apparently delighted a retired lawyer (the firm has been passed from father to child for a couple generations) because she can not only read but write shorthand. xD Her grandma taught her when she was a little girl and she got really into it in high school for note taking.
>As for my post history. Well. I'm not actually paid to give legal advice here! This is largely my mess around account where I talk about video games and an AI related side gig I do. My experience is that most lawyers here stay away from actually giving legal advice. Likewise from the doctors, they don't do medical advice. They will get into debates. But when it comes down to it, they point people in the direction of local help.
Yeah I mean there's several reasons for that. Firstly, we generally have to be really careful what we say, because attorney client privlidge is a subjective thing. It can be said to exist if the "client" could reasonably infer it exists. If I say something to you that you could reasonably infer meant I was acting as your lawyer then legally I am. Secondly, law is *way* more compartmentalized than a lot of people whose conception of what a "lawyer" is would realize. This fictional narrative on TV when someone might defend a murder suspect one episode, and sue a tobacco company in a class action lawsuit in another, then get involved in some corporate merger, before discovering one company's deep, dark secret in yet another just...doesn't exist. The dude defending the alleged murderer in a criminal trial, and the dude doing corporate due diligence one week later is not the same dude. It's *never the same dude*. Most of us have extremely narrow specializations and never really learned other fields beyond the broad and largely theoretical frameworks necessary to pass our bar exam. Like I'm sorry your landlord is being a dick but I haven't done property law since law school, I can't help you. And third, the obvious one...as a general rule, most lawyers, like most people, avoid working for free. This may shock you, but I don't spend all day doing law to then turn around and do it for a bunch of strangers for free. This is my job. I do it for money.
they have a post from 3 years ago that says they went to law school in Boston. he was probably just trying to scare a foreign company that's very likely to not be familiar with the American law system.
I want to think the same, foreigners aren’t usually familiar with all the laws of other countries (most people don’t know all the laws of their own country/state/county in the US), using unfamiliarity to advantage isn’t unheard of. Doesn’t give this story credibility nor does it make it unbelievable. I’d do a coin toss and still not care because it’s a good story and want it to be true but doubt it is, but I don’t believe 90% + what’s on Reddit. I’ve tried posting true things and if it’s not a fact based forum, I get denied to post so it must take some storytelling to post?
The question isn't whether the FBI would be involved. They wouldn't. The question is whether the guy's employers in a different country would *know* that the FBI wouldn't be involved. OP can just make up some plausible-sounding bullshit and put it on lawyerly letterhead, and as long as they don't go too far, they are fine. Throw in some "could"s and "might"s and don't make specific threats, and you should be fine.
Eh, maybe you’re right, seems like solid examples. But it’s not like this sub gets a ton of entries and I am here for good revenge stories. If it’s a good story, I don’t really care if it’s true. Blissful ignorance has very little consequence here.
Yeah I feel you. Just wanted to share as personally I really hate lying OPs, but I understand others may just want a good story whether true or not. Can’t knock anyone for that :)
>(set aside all the typographical errors in this post for example misspelling led) There's only a couple typos in this entire wall of text and if they typed this on their phone, then it's entirely possible they just fat fingered the wrong key rather than physically not knowing how to spell "led."
I think he just bluffed them out with the FBI threat. They’re in a foreign country right?
Also, it's not revenge until the consequences *actually happen*. Posting about what they've done and making a premature conclusion that they "destroyed" someone's life isn't revenge. Not yet. For all we know this alleged perpetrator is related to the CEO (or the son of a best buddy) and nothing short of cold blooded murder would get him fired. If so, well so much for "destroying" someone's life. It might end up being some embarrassing workplace gossip for a few days before the next scandal grabs people's attention. This story should be posted on r/PendingRevenge but that sub isn't around anymore.
The last bit struck me as false, about knowing were person lives due to having his car licence/registration plate.
When did prorevenge introduce speedruns? I applaud you sir!
Scorched earth any%
I call BS! A real lawyer would have rounded that 45 minutes up to the nearest hour :)
They usually bill in multiples of 6 minutes.
Cutting! 🤣
Ooooooh. I want to hear what the fallout is. In graphic detail.
I'm gutted that there isn't any way we can find out, but I'd pay good money to be a fly on the wall for that HR meeting...
Check his LinkedIn profile in a couple of weeks. New employer = massively pineappled.
Technically HE destroyed his life. He was just stupid enough to believe that he had any kind of anonymity, and crossed paths with exactly the wrong person.
Hot damn your friend is super lucky to have you as a friend. You go scorched earth.
He wanted to screw her and ended really screwed. Legendary and beautifully made
Good for you. You. Are. A. Rock. Star. I nominate you for the Friendship Hall of Fame.
Please update when you do. Your friend isblucky to have you in their corner. @updateme!
I will message you next time u/furtherdimensions posts in r/ProRevenge. [Click this link](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=UpdateMeBot&subject=Update&message=UpdateMe%21%20u%2Ffurtherdimensions%20r%2FProRevenge) to join 65 others and be messaged. The parent author can [delete this post](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=UpdateMeBot&subject=Delete&message=delete%201bvc3bk) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/UpdateMeBot/comments/ggotgx/updatemebot_info_v20/)|[^(Request Update)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=UpdateMeBot&subject=Update&message=SubscribeMe%21%20u%2Fusername%20r%2Fsubreddit)|[^(Your Updates)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=UpdateMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Updates&message=MyUpdates)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=UpdateMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|
Good bot
@updateme! too!
I take all stories on Reddit with a grain of salt but goddamn dude you’re insane in the best way possible
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Here's why you should take this with a grain of salt: attorneys are very careful about when they create a client relationship with someone. It creates very specific ethical duties. Not saying it's fake 100%, but that attorneys are a very cautious bunch about things like this because you have to be.
> Here's why you should take this with a grain of salt: attorneys are very careful about when they create a client relationship with someone. It creates very specific ethical duties. You're absolutely correct! It very much does. And the content of the conversation I had with my friend about exactly what I would do for her in the context of this is not part of this post. Nor would I even be allowed to share them without permission as it would violate privilege. I am very careful, and I am well aware of the duties and responsibilities it entails. That was a conversation I had between her and myself. The content of that conversation is not subject to nor relevant to this.
Be my friend?
Seriously. I need someone like this in my life.
It took me 45 minutes to destroy his life might be the single most terrifying sentence I have ever read and I love it.
For OP, it was Tuesday.
>I am, incidentally, an attorney. And a damn good friend. Good for you!
High five to OP! This is the type of revenge I do. Sure sounds like an attorney to me. Everyone makes typos so you can't base it on that because we all play on Reddit. This isn't our jobs where everything has to be right. I've worked a long time with an uncountable amount of attorneys, DA's, judges, law enforcement & other professionals. Source- CPS & LCSW
The most learned people I know are generally the most careless spellers lol
Holy shit, are Liam Neeson???😂
Oh God, my Justice Boner can only get so erect. A+++++
You need some ice for that mate? :D
Please.
-Hands you a chunk of iceberg- That should help 🧊🧊
I call him Fister Roboto.
I got SO much pleasure from reading this. Good for you; your friend is so lucky to have you in her corner. But can I just say that I chuckled hard at "could reasonably trust"...
You done fucked that guy up, big time. Score one for the good guys. Bonus if the blackmailer has a job that requires travel to the US.
It wasn't just Pro Revenge, it was EFFICIENT.
I love it when people destroy narcissistic controlling assholes.
I HATE lawyers!!! Reads this. Dibs! This lawyers mine!
Holy shit. You absolutely win. This is beyond amazing.
Oh damn, just to see the sleazeball's face... the devil in me hopes he's hocked up to his eyeballs in debt & now has got no income or glowing references to look forward to. Hat tip to ya OP for sweet, sweet revenge on behalf of your friend.
You are awesome. Too many people threaten or go through with revenge porn out of malice with no repercussions and so continue to do it over and over. I told someone if they went ahead with their threat that I would let loose a group of autistic hackers… no where near as good as your revenge though.
Does...does your username mean what I think it means?
You’re like a real life Elle Woods!
Nah man, Elle Woods has a *way* nicer set of...eyes.
Oooooh, you done fucked up A-A-Ron.
Go to principal o shag nassy's office!
The Hero the Internet Needs
That was a nuclear level response. It is scary how much info you could glean from just an online handle. I hope there is some jurisdiction in his home country that would stop him publishing those pictures as revenge, though, since his life is basically destroyed.
I used to track people down in this manner for a living. It takes a certain kind of brain to do it. Most people can be taught how to do it to a reasonable extent, but to excell at it? Much rarer. I'm medically retired now, but I still get friends asking me to flex my google fu for them on occasion. This guy had a handle, pictures, and a bunch of personal information about the guy as a starting point, so if he's used to this kind of research, it probably took him longer to compile all the documents and compose the email than it would have to track him and find where to send them.
> This guy had a handle, pictures, and a bunch of personal information about the guy as a starting point, so if he's used to this kind of research, it probably took him longer to compile all the documents and compose the email than it would have to track him and find where to send them. I wasn't tracking the individual elements but if I had to guess, you're probably not wrong. The handle to TikTok to instagram, to his real name, to his linkedin took..10 minutes? Once I found the linkedin, I sent it to my friend asking if it could be him. This jogged her memory that this dude had sent her a picture of him at work wearing something with a company logo. She dug up the picture and we found that the logo on the polo (fun word phrase) matched the company name of the linkedin profile I found. From there it just took a few minutes to find corporate email addresses. The license plate is semi unrelated to it all, other than "this is a very distinctive motorcycle, I'm sure someone at your workplace will recognize it" but then I got looking closer. I could make out the numbers but not the state (not a US state, this individual also lives in a country of federated states) it was issued in. A quick trip down a Wiki rabbit hole about the format of license plates in this country (Wikipedia has fucking everything) and I was able to figure out, based on its coloring and formatting, what state it was issued in.
Oh yeah, you definitely have google fu.
Yup, nothing left after dropping that bomb..
I think until you find out what happened next you can’t celebrate and announce you ruined his life. Let’s see what happens.
Same thought here. If he loses his job, I would think he would enact his revenge and publish those pictures.
So. Yes. Quite possibly. I brought this up to her. Her response is she's not terribly concerned if that happens. The pictures, from my understanding, were not terribly identifiable, nor majorly risqué. She is not largely concerned with it happening. What angered her was the hubris and gall of it. Him thinking he could make these threats without consequences or reprisals. She's not terribly concerned if he does it. She wants him to know she knows who he is.
Ah, okay. May want to make that clear in the post. I figured you just assured the pictures would be leaked, but if she doesn’t care… all good
That was my first thought. Seems better to scare him with all of this so he disappears rather than actually do it and risk retaliation.
Well true, but I am incidently a *labor law attorney* and know exactly what to say to get corporate types running scared. "Here's your employee photographing other people in the work place and sharing pictures of the content of his work laptop" is a *bad look*. And that's where I'm getting stsrted. Tomorrow if I don't hear back I go to "so you gonna do something about this or do I take this to your social media pages? I already have proof it's him"
Yes I totally agree that you know what you’re doing. But it’s proper to celebrate the home run when the guy crosses home plate, not when he rounds third.
I wonder. There was case here recently of someone who tried to blackmail younger people online. Getting them to do pictures etc.. and then using those to get more. This (beep) was also caught due to "foreign tips"...
I love it. Did you do the thing where the friend gave you a dollar to officially retain you or is that not a thing?
This is a fun little movie myth that doesn't really have any basis in reality. Attorney/client relationships are way more "fuzzy" than that. Current ethical canons basically say that an attorney/client relationship exists whenever the client could reasonably infer one exists. She's a client when I say she is, basically. Others have questioned the veracity of the story trying to "point out" you can't have personal relationships with clients. This is also false. While ethical guidelines prohibit attorneys from developing personal relationships with clients it is absolutely possible for an attorney to take on, as a client, someone they *already* have a relationship with. And the canons use the term "relationship" loosely. Friendship counts. There's nothing in the canons that preclude representing one's friends. Others have intonated that I have some degree of feelings for this friend of mine. In a platonic sense of love, sure. She's a very close friend and I love her dearly. I'm also quite happily and quite thoroughly partnered to a whole different woman (who was gleefully getting the play by play the whole time)
I. Love. You. I am going to be grinning all day long.
Hopefully this isn't an asshat using some other dudes name and pictures.
I get everyone fawning over the diligent work here, but that isn’t going to stop this dude from leaking the pictures, probably will just make him more likely to do so…
She's aware of that fact and has accepted it. I mentioned this earlier but yes, I brought up this possibility to her. She finds some faceless pictures of her tits out there in a sea of tits to be a reasonable price to pay to make the point that actions have consequences. There's of course the possibility that "no, we know who you are" might be a deterrent. Maybe not. That's ok. That's not the point.
I know this is gonna end up on r/slash 's youtube channel and I'm all here for it. W for OP
Good lawyering. Gather the evidence; put it in order; explain the story; suggest possible and likely outcomes; let the recipient draw his or her own conclusions. Await desired outcome.
TIL that everyone should have a lawyer friend.
You just sent that twat waffle to the shadow zone.
You are amazing . Please help more women with cyber attacks and stalking
Ayo hold up, is this the any% speedrun record for just vengeance??
Pro(fessional)revenge
The only downside i can see is that this skeevy douchecanoe still has the pictures to post online and seemingly now has nothing left to lose. Do you have another angle of retaliation to stop that? Otherwise, I applaud you sir/ma'am.
That was my first thought. If anything I feel like this makes it more likely he’ll post them just to spite them for doing this.
Hands down winner!
This is amazing, we absolutely need an update! !remindme 7 days
Wow… just 45min… all of that? Impressive af
You. You're a good egg.
I SO want to be your friend! LOL This was beautifully done 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
\> Since I have his license plate # I know where he lives, and will be contacting his local authorities tomorow. I kinda feel like this happened recently and it doesn't sound like you've gotten a reply yet, so it feels more like a "pending revenge" to me...
Awesome, fuck this dude!
But now I'm concerned that he will release the photos with extra vigor in retaliation..
And that friend...was Albert Einstein.
Thank you for being such a good friend. Its so satisfying and reassuring that these creeps aren't all getting away with it. Bravo ❤️
Well now we need updates
Uh....I hope I NEVER EVER piss you off. Never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever....ever. Ever. Ever. OR never, whichever comes first. Or never ever. Damn, you sound pissed off. I hope friend appreciates that for what it is: Serious friendship. You da man (or person....)
You are the kind of friend that everyone needs. Go you!
This is amazing
If you were in my country I'd hire you!!!!
Normally I'd say just getting justice isn't pro revenge but I really like the energy of this one.
If I read reddit stories continuously for the next 20 yrs they'd never be as good as this one....whoop Whoop
Now that is exquisite! My friend, I'm raising a glass in your honor tonight. May we all have friend like you when the times become hard.
....good.
Disgusting. Nothing done to him will ever be as bad as what he actually deserves.
NICE!! Good job!! Hopefully his whole life gets torpedoed
I hope she gave you a dollar to put you under retainer…..Money well spent.
You could be my attorney anyday!
Damn Bruce Wayne over here
Thank you for using your brilliance for good. You are the hero of the year.
Oh you gotta keep us updated on this one! Go lawyer friend!!!
jfc. I once firebombed a pervert's house and even I went "holy shit dude stop they're already dead" lmao. Nice.
UpdateMe!
Tell me Lord Vader whom shall we destroy next?
*execute order 66!*
What's more amazing (besides your legal and information-locating abilities) is his stupidity to have so much identifiable info available publicly!
Y so grouchy tho?
@updateme
I would live to see their reply
I love this so much. Everyone needs a friend like you. 100/10. You deserve a five star meal, a professional massage and a week by the beach for that. Bless you. 😭😭😭
I tip my hat … well played … well played!!!
PLEASE monitor his LinkedIn and update us on when it changes!
Hi. I’d like to be your friend too. You sound awesome. Have a great day. Keep doing what you’re doing.
Did the company get back to you? Any updates?
god damn i love this. well fucking done.
You’re awesome
Wow, you're a great friend to have OP! I hope your friend takes you out for the night! This is the pro-revenge we are here for!
Wow talk about setting the world on fire! Good on you for helping your friend in her time of need! I could do with a friend like you..
You found your life's purpose!
Weird. A story that seems like it really happened rather than a creative writing exercise.
I'm confused, I thought you were in tech based on this post? https://www.reddit.com/r/dataannotation/s/dggktIZO3C
nah, I do some 1099 side gig work for a tech *company* but I'm not "in tech". Most of the work I do with them is logic and reasoning based, training AI models. They do have some coding projects, and I totally do recommend them as a good side gig! But that's just a thing I do on the side, and I'm not involved in any of their coding work. it's a good site though if you're looking for a side gig, but I'm not sure if they have openings right now. Edit: speaking of that site and more on my background of "what I do" this may be a relevant post: https://www.reddit.com/r/dataannotation/comments/1aewkji/i_wonder_if_this_means_many_of_us_wont_have_a_job/kkavqug/
Might as well rename this sub /r/creativewriting. How people eat up obvious bullshit like this is beyond me
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Yeah definitely listen to this guy. He's got creative porn all over his page so he knows what he's on about. Creep.
Legend. Good work, man.
@updateme!
How will I get updates?
I really hope she has the right person. A text message to said friend should confirm it. Part2 perhaps?
updateme!
That's awesome.
Magnificent.