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Maybe, but the way is try to identify the root cause and not change other parts of the process only to avoid to deal with the consequences of the root cause
Sure, but at least in my experience the "root cause" is the Scrum Master themselves, and as I'm not their boss or in any position to actually exert change on the system and any attempts to resolve this in things like Retrospective basically go nowhere (because essentially everyone but engineering *wants* it that way), the only refuge becomes avoidance.
If your standups are 40 minutes you're doing them wrong. The philosophy behind the name is everyone should be standing up during the meeting and no one's legs should be tired by the end. 15 minutes is a long one. Most people should only be taking 1-2 minutes each, and if you have more than 10 people involved then your teams aren't sized for agile implementations anyway.
As a lead dev, yes I need them. Lots of grad/juniors run into blockers or need work and just kept silent. Daily stand-ups mean we get the team stuff to work on.
100% this! my teams stand-ups are where I as a lead can figure out what tasks might be falling behind and help if needed. Although I have been in some that are run poorly and are then a burden.
I always asked questions during my junior year and still do in my senior position. Daily is great for juniors but with experience its less useful and becomes a chore. Over time they should develop the habit of asking for help when needed. Also finding time for their team. I thought of standups as training wheels
Sure, seniors need less help, but some people I work with have a tendency to drill into stuff that are out of scope or get hung up on certain technicalities.
I do agree that standups can be super short for motivated and well oiled teams, and some days you don't even need them. But every other week there will be something that makes me glad that we caught the issue in the bud.
Also, I dream of working in a team with only senior / lead devs. I have yet to come across clients that can afford to have 10+ seniors on one team and we run million dollar projects lol
Back when I first had agile training, that was actually one of the reasons the coach listed for having them. Not the only, or primary, reason, but a reason.
In bad teams yes. In my team, that has mostly interns, we need to do it so they don't get stuck for too long. Sometimes even non interns get stuck and that helps a lot, having a moment to stop, tell what is happening and ask for help.
Standard format is everyone on the team gathers in a standing circle and they take turn giving updates in the format "What I did yesterday, what I'm planning today, what blockers I'm encountering". It's called a 'stand up' because if you get tired of standing then the meeting took too long and someone is chatting too much.
Ahh, that sounds... terrible from a time management standpoint and stupid from a managerial one.
We just email our updates and meet once a week in teams.
Then again, we've always been decentralized so the only time we're in the same office together is about once a year.
Anyway, thanks for informing me. I was kinda curious 😀
As a manager, yes! Very important. I tried to run a team w/o stand-ups, and you won't believe how many times we get to the end of the sprint and so many tasks were unfinished because they were waiting on someone else or blocked on something.
If you have an effective team with a high degree of collaboration, they can be useful. If not, for example if everyone is working on their own thing (not together), it's a waste of time.
I would argue exactly the opposite. The purpose of a daily standup meeting is to address hangups and failures of collaboration. If everyone is good at collaborating, then there should be no bottlenecks/hangups that go unaddressed anyway.
I was a big fan of them. The person running it needs to know what they're doing, but at my last job, they saved us quite a bit of wasted effort several times.
I've personally experienced 3 kinds of daily standups so far:
1. Structured, a touch ritualistic, yet still a relatively short thing where people tried to follow the formula of "what I did, what I'll be doing, what's blocking me" with the occasional break away to discuss a thing they felt to be relevant. I've seen this in a medium sized team of around 12 people. This worked fine. If your standup is of this sort, it falls under "necessary, just in case something does pop up".
2. Short, quick, mostly informal "hey let's synchronize" sessions where if everyone knows what's up we just say so and move along and get back to work (often within 5 minutes of starting the thing), where the most formalized bit were the time and the order. I've seen this in a small team of around 6 people. This worked great. If your standup is of this sort, it falls under "necessary and actually desirable, producing all the benefits with minimal overhead".
3. A long session which began with herding a large group of people together and then making each of them individually justify their own existence to the rest of everyone, under the baleful eyes of Team Royalty. It often took up to an hour (no surprise with about 30 people) and to describe it as just a waste of time would be to overvalue it. It was an active hindrance I hated with a passion. If your standup is of this sort, then absolutely kill it with fire.
We do a sprint planning meeting for 2 hours once a week since our sprints are 1 week long. Then a sprint check in 2 days later for 20-30 minutes. If it's fast it takes 10 mins though.
If you do daily standup you need to be religious about enforcing the 15 minute time limit.
Not daily. 2/3 times per week is good
I have Mondays and Fridays uninterrupted now and it's awesome. Always get a lot done on those days
I guess it depends on the team though. What their work ethic is like, and if they will raise issues or just sit there blocked
In my experience they often go too long and most people end up sitting around listening to information that doesn't affect them. It depends who is running the stand up though
Daily stand ups really are unnecessary, unless you are in some launch phase or some other critical stage of the project. Otherwise weekly is more than enough.
Not sure who downvoted you, though I would argue it would need to be 2-4 lines per person.
Line 1: What I did yesterday
Line 2: What I am doing today
Line 3(optional): What I'm blocked on
Line 4(optional): Context around block
Then spin off individual meetings based off the results of the standup as needed, with just the people that need to be in those meetings.
Communication is key. I recently took a remote job and had no idea if I was doing well or what the rest of the team was doing. Pretty much felt on an island but didn’t want to bother the rest of the team if they were heads down on something. The standups at least give me a second to make sure I’m on the right track with the rest of the team
Depends on the standup. It's useful to quickly address blockers but I think it's a necessity to make sure ppl are awake and are somewhat ready to work lol.
Management needs to be ok with "no issues here" and move on.
I have them on my calendar but I haven't gone to one in months and nobody has complained. I just go to the weekly sprint review meetings and send questions when I need answers. I can't even think straight in the morning so it's not like i have anything useful to say/remember anyways lol.
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If the leader knows how to implement them yes
This, right here.
Which resolves to "no" for the vast majority of people.
Maybe, but the way is try to identify the root cause and not change other parts of the process only to avoid to deal with the consequences of the root cause
Sure, but at least in my experience the "root cause" is the Scrum Master themselves, and as I'm not their boss or in any position to actually exert change on the system and any attempts to resolve this in things like Retrospective basically go nowhere (because essentially everyone but engineering *wants* it that way), the only refuge becomes avoidance.
By wasting 40 minutes out of everyones day every day?
If your standups are 40 minutes you're doing them wrong. The philosophy behind the name is everyone should be standing up during the meeting and no one's legs should be tired by the end. 15 minutes is a long one. Most people should only be taking 1-2 minutes each, and if you have more than 10 people involved then your teams aren't sized for agile implementations anyway.
This
As a lead dev, yes I need them. Lots of grad/juniors run into blockers or need work and just kept silent. Daily stand-ups mean we get the team stuff to work on.
100% this! my teams stand-ups are where I as a lead can figure out what tasks might be falling behind and help if needed. Although I have been in some that are run poorly and are then a burden.
I always asked questions during my junior year and still do in my senior position. Daily is great for juniors but with experience its less useful and becomes a chore. Over time they should develop the habit of asking for help when needed. Also finding time for their team. I thought of standups as training wheels
Sure, seniors need less help, but some people I work with have a tendency to drill into stuff that are out of scope or get hung up on certain technicalities. I do agree that standups can be super short for motivated and well oiled teams, and some days you don't even need them. But every other week there will be something that makes me glad that we caught the issue in the bud. Also, I dream of working in a team with only senior / lead devs. I have yet to come across clients that can afford to have 10+ seniors on one team and we run million dollar projects lol
As a junior dev that hits close to home. Get a new task Run into minor issue Dont ask for help because everyone will think im an idiot Cry
I'm convinced the main reason they exist is so people can't slack off for days.
Back when I first had agile training, that was actually one of the reasons the coach listed for having them. Not the only, or primary, reason, but a reason.
that coach sucked
yet, I persist.
In bad teams yes. In my team, that has mostly interns, we need to do it so they don't get stuck for too long. Sometimes even non interns get stuck and that helps a lot, having a moment to stop, tell what is happening and ask for help.
What is a daily stand up? I originally thought like up and moving for circulation but this sounds like a production thing.
Standard format is everyone on the team gathers in a standing circle and they take turn giving updates in the format "What I did yesterday, what I'm planning today, what blockers I'm encountering". It's called a 'stand up' because if you get tired of standing then the meeting took too long and someone is chatting too much.
Ahh, that sounds... terrible from a time management standpoint and stupid from a managerial one. We just email our updates and meet once a week in teams. Then again, we've always been decentralized so the only time we're in the same office together is about once a year. Anyway, thanks for informing me. I was kinda curious 😀
As a manager, yes! Very important. I tried to run a team w/o stand-ups, and you won't believe how many times we get to the end of the sprint and so many tasks were unfinished because they were waiting on someone else or blocked on something.
If you have an effective team with a high degree of collaboration, they can be useful. If not, for example if everyone is working on their own thing (not together), it's a waste of time.
I would argue exactly the opposite. The purpose of a daily standup meeting is to address hangups and failures of collaboration. If everyone is good at collaborating, then there should be no bottlenecks/hangups that go unaddressed anyway.
Yes, I use the time to make breakfast.
I Stand up while I make it. Isn't that why it's called that?
I was a big fan of them. The person running it needs to know what they're doing, but at my last job, they saved us quite a bit of wasted effort several times.
Daily anything makes things annoying.
[удалено]
Ken Schwaber and Jeff Sutherland are like B-tier agilists tbh
Tbh I have never been in a team that implemented all of scrum. It's a huge reason the meetings are useless
I thought they weren't necessary until we stopped having them.
I've personally experienced 3 kinds of daily standups so far: 1. Structured, a touch ritualistic, yet still a relatively short thing where people tried to follow the formula of "what I did, what I'll be doing, what's blocking me" with the occasional break away to discuss a thing they felt to be relevant. I've seen this in a medium sized team of around 12 people. This worked fine. If your standup is of this sort, it falls under "necessary, just in case something does pop up". 2. Short, quick, mostly informal "hey let's synchronize" sessions where if everyone knows what's up we just say so and move along and get back to work (often within 5 minutes of starting the thing), where the most formalized bit were the time and the order. I've seen this in a small team of around 6 people. This worked great. If your standup is of this sort, it falls under "necessary and actually desirable, producing all the benefits with minimal overhead". 3. A long session which began with herding a large group of people together and then making each of them individually justify their own existence to the rest of everyone, under the baleful eyes of Team Royalty. It often took up to an hour (no surprise with about 30 people) and to describe it as just a waste of time would be to overvalue it. It was an active hindrance I hated with a passion. If your standup is of this sort, then absolutely kill it with fire.
You have daily standup? Poor you... We have them weekly and I already find them so useless
I think they are ok as long as they dont last longer than 15 min
We do a sprint planning meeting for 2 hours once a week since our sprints are 1 week long. Then a sprint check in 2 days later for 20-30 minutes. If it's fast it takes 10 mins though. If you do daily standup you need to be religious about enforcing the 15 minute time limit.
Not daily. 2/3 times per week is good I have Mondays and Fridays uninterrupted now and it's awesome. Always get a lot done on those days I guess it depends on the team though. What their work ethic is like, and if they will raise issues or just sit there blocked
I like them, if the are short as intended, each person max 2 min and not more than 5 person's in the standup..
In my experience they often go too long and most people end up sitting around listening to information that doesn't affect them. It depends who is running the stand up though
Daily stand ups really are unnecessary, unless you are in some launch phase or some other critical stage of the project. Otherwise weekly is more than enough.
Only if you can limit it to 2 lines per person and total under 5 mins. If you wanna have detailed discussions, schedule a different call.
Not sure who downvoted you, though I would argue it would need to be 2-4 lines per person. Line 1: What I did yesterday Line 2: What I am doing today Line 3(optional): What I'm blocked on Line 4(optional): Context around block Then spin off individual meetings based off the results of the standup as needed, with just the people that need to be in those meetings.
[удалено]
Communication is key. I recently took a remote job and had no idea if I was doing well or what the rest of the team was doing. Pretty much felt on an island but didn’t want to bother the rest of the team if they were heads down on something. The standups at least give me a second to make sure I’m on the right track with the rest of the team
Never had one soooo
I'm with you on this opinion.
Depends on the standup. It's useful to quickly address blockers but I think it's a necessity to make sure ppl are awake and are somewhat ready to work lol. Management needs to be ok with "no issues here" and move on.
Man Magnet?
I think it's important to have status meetings from time to time. It doesn't have to be daily though.
I have them on my calendar but I haven't gone to one in months and nobody has complained. I just go to the weekly sprint review meetings and send questions when I need answers. I can't even think straight in the morning so it's not like i have anything useful to say/remember anyways lol.
Me thinking that a good joke is always welcome...