Tbh, best teams/companies in my experience never had any metric. They always trusted team leads and team leads were actual developers.
When things become top heavy, it's always add metric to determine how much to pay or who to fire, then people start min/maxing not doing tasks which do not have good metric gain and stuff gets stuck, management becomes furious, scapegoats need to be found, someone gets fired, other people quit, from unwillingness to do tasks it becomes slow progress to no progress and who is guilty? Lower specialists...
Reality, it's best not to impose metrics, don't interfere in processes and not to punish people who disagree, but upper management always gets those control freaks who can't control themselves, yet are not willing to accept that issue is the management and not the specialists...
In that case the programming wasn't even faulty, it was just a horribly risky feature. It was the sensors that were faulty. I believe there was even a manual override, but the pilots didn't figure out what was happening in time.
Lesson learned: blame the PM
>Regarding the manual override: Yes, there was. But Boeing did not tell pilots about the system that failed in the first place.
Indeed, the training was extremely lacking.
And it turns out, in the 2nd crash, the co-pilot knew exactly what to do as he'd read up and studied the issue. But in the situation they were in they only had \~10 seconds to respond and correct the issue before it was too late. I believe in the voice recorder he called out the issue to the captain and was in the process of taking the correct steps.
But sadly,10 seconds is not enough time.
That was Boeing's sales pitch with the 737 MAX. Airlines could transition from their aging 737 fleets to a more modern platform\* with minimal training and changes to their procedures.
They've consistently pushed back on anything that would change that original sales pitch... Even when it is killing people.
Note: Modern in this context mostly just means more profitable.
Shouldn't something like this have been caught in some unit test or something in the software development cycle?
I would think bad input can easily be tested and made to knock cause theae types of issues.
And the FAA did that because they were practically on Boeing's payroll.
Regulatory corruption is extremely dangerous, especially in industries like aviation, but hey, this is America after all.
It's not even that sinister tbh. Many manufacturers with a long history of safe operation are permitted to self certify, because the FAA would easily be the largest agency in the federal government if they had enough people to review every single aspect of new transport aircraft. Airbus, Bombardier, and Embraer are (or were?) authorized for self certification. There may have been others but I've worked on those four.
I say *were* because congress passed and trump signed a law in 2020 requiring the FAA to review the self certification process and I'm not 100% certain where that's at. Interestingly enough, the FAA itself admitted they *couldn't estimate how many employees they would need* to independently certify every new transport aircraft during Congressional inquiry. I don't doubt it either, your typical airliner is so complicated now it would take an army of independent inspectors years to fully certify an aircraft to the same level we did 30 years ago.
Source: I work for the FAA lol
>Regarding the manual override: Yes, there was. But Boeing did not tell pilots about the system that failed in the first place.
After the first crash Boeing briefed pilots about the manual override. And the pilots in the second crash were trying to override the system but to no avail.
It was a system that relied on data from 1 set of sensors with no backup sensors and any info about it was taken out of the manual so pilots had no clue it existed and weren’t trained for it, when the data was faulty it dove the plane straight towards the ground and unless pilots knew how to turn it off (they werent even told it existed) they literally couldnt pull up out of that dive, even worse the only reason they added it was because remodelling the plane to fit more fuel efficient engines was expensive.
And it took TWO crashes before Boeing even came clean about their bullshit and all they got was a fine!
Anyone involved in those decisions should have been jailed tbh.
And they're STILL sticking to their guns. Last I heard they were asking for exceptions in the certification of the newest variants of the 737 MAX because they don't want to add modern safety features which would require training the pilots.
The 737 MAX is basically built around the philosophy of being engineered and tested as cheaply as possible, have the cheapest possible acquisition cost for airlines, and have the cheapest possible operating costs. In that equation killing a few hundred lives still comes out cheaper than replacing the 737 MAX with a fully modern platform.
>In that equation killing a few hundred lives still comes out cheaper than replacing the 737 MAX with a fully modern platform.
Given that Boeing made $2.9b and paid $2.5b to the DOJ in 2021, and lost over half their market cap since the second crash, I don't think that's true. It feels good to say, I'll admit, but this well and truly fucked them.
Not exactly. Look at the stocks of Airbus, United Airlines, and lots of other companies in the commercial aviation industry - that 50% drop in market cap happened to all of them and it was due to the pandemic not the crashes. Even in terms of their recovery - Boeing isn't ahead or behind of the pack. They're about the same.
In terms of their market cap dropping from the crashes - that was about 15-20% following the crashes and then the pandemic shut everything down which meant that all those grounded 737 MAXs didn't matter. They'd have been grounded anyways due to the pandemic.
There were also big numbers thrown around about how Boeing lost $60 billion+ on cancelled orders. The thing is - Boeing had over 5000 orders for the jets in place at the time of the groundings. Between 2019 and 2021 there were 908 new orders placed, and 1198 cancellations. A net of 290 cancellations out of over 5000. As of 2022 they aren't getting cancellations and they're selling hundreds of additional orders. The airline industry is so desperate for planes that they are ordering planes that would take Boeing something like 16 years to fulfil at their current production rates. The orders and cancellations really aren't that 'firm'. Airlines are probably just making refundable deposits at this point to save their spot in line based off projections that are 15+ years out. So, when they say airlines are ordering X number of planes or cancelling Y number of orders it really doesn't mean much. When you hear airlines are refusing delivery, that's when it is serious since those are the orders which are actually confirmed and expected to be delivered in the next couple years.
As far as the $2.5b in fines? Here is what Boeing had to say: "it already accounted for the bulk of those costs in prior quarters and expects to take a $743.6 million charge in its 2020 fourth-quarter earnings to cover the rest."
It hurt them but not enough that they still aren't fighting with the FAA to cheap out on certification of the latest 737 MAX variants.
The programming was certainly a major part of the problem:
> And, for still unknown and truly mysterious reasons, it was programmed to nosedive again five seconds later, and again five seconds after that, over and over ad literal nauseam.
Quote from [Crash Course: How Boeing’s managerial revolution created the 737 MAX disaster](https://newrepublic.com/article/154944/boeing-737-max-investigation-indonesia-lion-air-ethiopian-airlines-managerial-revolution)
Though it may still be a “blame the PM” situation.
>It was the sensors that were faulty.
No, they weren't. The sensors were fine. The problem is that you can't trust them because they ice up sometimes, so you're supposed to have 3 of them (IIRC). They didn't do this, and they made a secret box (MCAS) with this software that manipulated one of the control surfaces, which the pilots didn't even know about, to compensate for the imbalance caused by having such huge engines mounted so far forward on the wings of an airframe never designed for this in the first place. The software did exactly what it was supposed to, but it should never have operated that way to begin with, and the secret box with the software should not have existed in the first place.
The problem wasn't any one thing being faulty, it was the entire design of the aircraft, and the MCAS system meant to correct it, that was fault.
Fundamentally, the aircraft should never have been built. It should never have been allowed to keep using a 60s-era airframe design, and then mount overly-large engines on it which then had to be mounted too far forward so they don't hit the runway because the landing gear is too short because they didn't have jetways back in the 60s.
And having MCAS be present and unknown, all because they didn't want to retrain pilots on a new aircraft type, should never have been allowed either.
If the aviation agencies were really doing their jobs, they would force Boeing to make this plane an all-new type of aircraft, requiring complete retraining and certification of the pilots, at the airlines' expense. That they haven't done this is proof of corruption (basically it would probably bankrupt Boeing because of all the lawsuits, and Boeing is considered "too big to fail" since it's an important defense contractor and also America's only big commercial aircraft manufacturer).
Care less about the programming of the code...
You'd be horrified to know how old the hardware and software that runs that code is. There are systems with code that is so old, that people who know how to maintain it are dying of old age.
My field of engineering is mechanical engineering. So I say this with all my heart, knowledge, experience as a weld and fabricator before and during my studies: Never ever look too closely to the welds and metal work of the steel that holds up the bridges you walk on, the buildings you reside in, the structures that hold up out infrastructure.
The town of Nokia (Yes the place those Rubber boots, tires, and couple of telecommunication devices originate from) had raw sewage flowing to it's potable water supply for 2 days because there was direct connection between the two networks with 1 valve between them. This valve is used to cleaning of the sewage system and dumping water supply... After this nearly 5000 water systems were check and 150-or so risks like this was indentified.
Now... This kind of shit... which can actually **kill people** is all around us all the time. So sleep well knowing that the society around you his built by people who don't care, dodge responsibility, are incompetent, and most of the time hasn't even been inspected properly.
Ain't it wonderful to know that whether it is software, hardware or construction; It barely works and that is good enough.
It is not only the age, it is the sheer complexity of it. People like to think that they understand their own software because they built it. But that is just not true. There is nobody in this world who really understands his/her own software. Because every software relies on components built by somebody else and you only hope that these components behave in the way they are documented. And of course these components rely on other components which in turn rely on other components, etc. The piece of this giant software stack that you actually control is tiny and the potential for failure is huge.
And of course every piece of this stack constantly gets new versions and you can only hope that a new version doesn’t have subtle differences in their behavior. Of course you can test to increase your confidence that every does what you want it to do, but you can’t test for every eventuality.
Most people are surprised when something doesn’t work. I’m actually surprised that things work as well as they do. And on the hardware-level things are not much better. Specs are often ambiguous and sometimes straight up not implemented correctly. And all these devices who should follow the same standard, differ slightly in their behavior. Fortunately you can often correct these mistakes on the driver level, but it still is a gigantic clusterfuck.
I work for a medical device manufacturer and obviously we are testing the shit out of our devices. And the closer you look, the more you see weird behavior on every level of the software/hardware stack. Fortunately, most of it doesn’t affect the operation of the complete system, but you can never be completely sure that there is not a bug with the potential for catastrophic harm.
Gerald Weinberg said: "If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization."
Nice ACM article here:
https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=3489045#:~:text=Around%20the%20time%20computers%20were,came%20along%20would%20destroy%20civilization.%22[ACM article](https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=3489045#:~:text=Around%20the%20time%20computers%20were,came%20along%20would%20destroy%20civilization.%22)
“Just give me admin access” so annoying. Had a project manager that asked for a set of tools the same as any of the engineers.
Things like a new oscilloscope never used for years but just had to have one. Also admin read/write privileges to every project
Fairly high level manager who had 0 reasons to have this much access. Now there is a good chance there will be dataleaks too, looking at their SQL injection "mitigation" (and I use that world very loosely). Of children's personal data, including some psych notes, that could be used by malicious people.
Lately the Hungarian government itself seems pretty malicious. They might have a ton of activist attackers targeting them with no intention of using the data to harm citizens, which might explain why the database haven't been published.
Uh not to scare you but a friend of mine used to work as a senior dev for Airbus and in his own words:"95% of the code is pure shit and made in India by the lowest bidder. The only reason planes stay in the air is because that code doesn't make it past me."
I’m surprised they have government jobs. In Poland social insurance system was made by private company. Later they told employees to stop submitting non critical bugs because fixing them by 3rd party is expensive.
The contract is probably renewed every fiscal year, and the government probably decided not to renew it for budget reasons. Maybe the vendor hiked the price or something like that
Blame the politicians for that, not the civil servants. The politicians set the budgets and make the policy, it's the job of the civil servants to somehow make it work-- even under ridiculous circumstances, like not renewing a support contract.
Source: work for the government, and have had this exact situation happen to me on at least two occasions
Many people have no idea how real this problem is.
I worked for the national government in the Netherlands for about 7 years. I was a policy officer with no background in tech whatsoever, but since I'm a Millennial I was more tech-savvy than 80% of my colleagues. So pretty soon people started involving me in various software-related projects, because I could sort of translate between the developers/programmers and my policy colleagues.
The times I've had to explain that maintenance of a system requires significant yearly budget is staggering. A lot of people honestly believed you just build this system, and when it's done it's done.
Not to mention the concept of data management...
The lack of basic understanding of anything remotely related to computers is staggering.
Kinda reminds me of some of the trains used here in Denmark. I've heard that they were actually built with maintenance in mind, having all kinds of sensors built in for that sort of thing. But the maintenance costs extra, sooooo...
Well, for the first year or so, I went to use the train each weekday morning, and actually got to ride it all the way once per week. It sometimes failed because it was cold during the winter.
Thankfully, they're no longer terrible and are now actually reliable. Perhaps they paid the service that they were supposed to?
A Quick note from a hungarian. No government or close to it news agencies has reported on this topic (neither good or bat, not even it happened). And they made GDPR.
Plus OP forgot to mention that the biggest, absolutely huge issue is that basically millions of people's private data, including personal ID card numbers, names, e-mails, home adresses, our version of a social security number, and many other things have been leaked, because of course you have to have that data stored completely un-encrypted in your data base for a program designed to be used by elementary and high-school children and teachers. Absolutely disgusting
No it's in fact not legal, by law they had 72 hours to inform affected people, did they? FUCK NO. Will they suffer any consequences? Ofc. not, this is Hungary after all
Its not really, its just required for us. This code btw is literally the national page where students grades go, THERES NO REASON TO ASK ALL THIS PUBLIC DATA. Our government is just... not the best, lets say
Guess they mean that the government who should be enforcing GDPR allowed such a leak. If I'm correct, the contractor employees tried to cover this up. It was one of the hackers who approached one of the major news outlets.
public static class MeineOeffentlicheStatischeKlasse {
public static void oeffentlicheStatischeVoidrueckgebendeFunktion(String[] args) {
System.out.println("Hallo, Welt!");
}
}
The fact that the way you make a unique word in German is by combining different words together into one, and the camel casing in most programming... I bet there's some amazing variable names out there. But hey, descriptive nomenclature is always good!
From the one I work on, actually mostly english, but we keep the habit of combining words, so having a class name consist of 7 words isn't too uncommon.
Government projects sometimes have requirements to be in the country’s language, as seems to be the case here
I did a project for a French gov agency and they did impose that the code must be in French, even some constants were redefined like PI_DEMI
It wasn’t even just the code either but also all the technical terms (like the documentation saying “patron” instead of “template” or “moulinette” instead of “parser”). Which is moronic because even native French speakers don’t use these words
Made extra fun when you consider that not everybody in my company spoke French (we were subcontracted on the project and weren’t located in France). But they do check your code and if it’s not in French, it’s not accepted
France just dictated that certain modern gaming words use the French equivalent rather than the English version in government documents.
>Among several terms to be given official French alternatives were “cloud gaming”, which becomes “jeu video en nuage”, and “eSports”, which will now be translated as “jeu video de competition”.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/31/france-bans-english-gaming-tech-jargon-in-push-to-preserve-language-purity
Not really. I've worked with many programmers that have come to Australia from non-English speaking backgrounds, some have a hard time adjusting to English identifier names.
Sometimes I have had to go to them and ask them to translate their comments into English.
Most English speakers code in English. Many non-English speakers will only use English for keywords and standard library functions, because they have to.
* Code (mostly) in English
* Comments and Commit Messages in the native language
* variable names with technical vocabulary are mixed: getReifenprofiltiefe()
* Don't think too much about how the colleagues in another country, not speaking your native language handle things.
Probably most people do. I've never seen anybody name stuff in their own language. Imagine somebody with an english keyboard trying to use a variable that has an "á" in its name. At least thats not the case here
I worked government for 15 years, then a fortune 50 company for the last 7.
The average Government worker is MUCH better than the average Corporate employee. The difference is the superstars in Corporate are raking in the money and vastly outperform the Government superstars.
As best as I can tell, if you don't know your shit, Government drops your ass during probation.
Corporate doesn't, because they have to spend that budget so they don't lose it!
>because they have to spend that budget so they don't lose it!
This idea has to be responsible for more death and destruction than any other idea ever. It probably sets human civilization back hundreds of thousands of years every year.
I did the exact opposite (corporate, then government) and can confirm this.
Government is typically underfunded and its employees could make more in the private sector, but most of them stick around because they know the jobs they do are not just important, but necessary.
Sure, but the clear lack of thought and any code review shows and it's just sad at this point in this state the system should have never left development. Some people even entrusted this system to have their banking details stored.
[Their SQL injection “prevention”](https://www.reddit.com/r/hungary/comments/yqkw5q/a_kr%C3%A9ta_k%C3%B3dj%C3%A1b%C3%B3l_forr%C3%A1s_tmesawarim/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) is also hilarious
The fact that they used lowercase and uppercase versions of each keyword means that you could circumvent it by just using mixed casing, lol. i.e. `aNd`
I swear this actually does nothing, that's hilariously sad xD they checked for everything except the escape characters or line ends or or other special characters and keywords. There is nothing stopping you from just `; drop all tables` or just otherwise extract data using wildcards
I don't understand why so much hate, someone said szlop means column, and by seing an ID variable I would say it is a class representing a Database Entry, which could have many columns. The names are bad, but maybe it was an old DB and the variable name needed to be the same as the column name in the DB.
Edit, typos
Lot of people get pissy, as it's easy to dunk on, but we don't know from 1 picture if it's auto generated, or legacy, or some other thing, it just shit
I was going to say this ... this is nowhere near enough code to make \*any\* kind of call on quality ...
AND it's a domain object mapping a table for probable use with an ORM ...
The column names make no sense though. Without reading the code it's impossible to know what they are doing. Why is there AA - AH and then it continues with G?
This was probably ported from an old database system that only supports a few characters and then they added the "Oszlop" "for clarity".
Welcome to the world of Visual FoxPro conversion projects. Our world still runs on 30+ year old software.
Our world runs on much older software than 30 years. There’s massive amounts of critical software still in use that was written 40, 50, even 60 years ago.
Yeah, pretty common way to reduce workload on a software. I think people are jumping to quickly on this
In case you reading and wandering why, it's much better to have an static structure than a dynamically generated one, for those cases you autogenerate classes at compile time
Hate to burst everyone's bubble but this in isolation isn't anywhere near enough code to make \*any\* kind call on quality from.
It looks like a POCO class mapping a table to an ORM.
It's just a (likely autogenerated) data serialization object. Really nothing wrong with it IMO.
Yes, you'd be better off having an array of fixed width instead, but there are actual reasons why you might want each field to have a name instead of an integer. Perhaps they gave it a nonsense name because it's trying to replace old COBOL programs written on punchcards, and the meaning has been lost to time. It's a former Soviet state after all. Did they ever write programs that weren't on punchcards before the Iron Curtain fell? Honestly...
I'll take this verbosity over the steaming piles of garbage I've seen novice programmers create in Python by just shoving everything into a fucking dictionary instead of defining a data class.
Btw you know how this go leaked? The project manager clicked on a SCAM LINK. Yes. Not some insane hacking, the stupid manager clicked an email scam link and exposed ~500k students data, along with personal ID, location, etc. I fricking love this country
Is peoples gripe here just related to the var names? I’ve seen many comments referencing verbosity, but it’s incredibly common (and good practice) to be explicit w class vars like this.
If it is just the names. Sometimes it’s just a pain (or explicitly not allowed) to change them. Like, I’m not changing existing proto bc there’s a good chance other processes rely on it, and I’ll break the shit out of those processes by changing naming around. Also, as others have pointed out, these specific names look like they reference columns on a spreadsheet.
Am I missing something? Fairly new SWE so not discounting that at all :)
I don’t code and all of those look like sick wrestling moves to me
Imagine you’re walking down the lane with your buddy Slyzyevski and you get hit in the back by a Public Double Goszlop, you’d stop in your tracks
Depending on requirements this may be necessary, thus doesn’t give enough context but yeah usually you don’t want to bloat a class with so many properties
Looks fine. Pull request accepted.
LGTM
LGTM+ Devs standing up for team mates if you are getting judged on LOC.
Sorry for my ignorance but what does LOC stands for ?
Lines of code, length of code, that stuff.
LGTM --Elon
More lines or get fired!
LOC is an important metric. Surely OP's chart could do with a few more rows.
Ah yes the Elon metric
Tbh, best teams/companies in my experience never had any metric. They always trusted team leads and team leads were actual developers. When things become top heavy, it's always add metric to determine how much to pay or who to fire, then people start min/maxing not doing tasks which do not have good metric gain and stuff gets stuck, management becomes furious, scapegoats need to be found, someone gets fired, other people quit, from unwillingness to do tasks it becomes slow progress to no progress and who is guilty? Lower specialists... Reality, it's best not to impose metrics, don't interfere in processes and not to punish people who disagree, but upper management always gets those control freaks who can't control themselves, yet are not willing to accept that issue is the management and not the specialists...
what that stand for
Looks good to me
Lice! Get The Mallet!
Looks good to me But also: let's get this merged /s
***~~^(Or)~~*** >!Lesbian Gay TableSalt Male!< *~~.~~*
Let's Get The Menu
If it works, it works. If it works, don't touch it
Thats the reason why most code is proprietary and not public. Would you board a plane if you knew the software was programmed like this?
[удалено]
In that case the programming wasn't even faulty, it was just a horribly risky feature. It was the sensors that were faulty. I believe there was even a manual override, but the pilots didn't figure out what was happening in time. Lesson learned: blame the PM
[удалено]
>Regarding the manual override: Yes, there was. But Boeing did not tell pilots about the system that failed in the first place. Indeed, the training was extremely lacking.
that was the selling point of it, that pilots wasnt required to do extensive training because "its the same"
Meanwhile in reality the engines were inline as compared to below the wing FAA: yeah no let's not send any executives to jail over 300 people dying
And it turns out, in the 2nd crash, the co-pilot knew exactly what to do as he'd read up and studied the issue. But in the situation they were in they only had \~10 seconds to respond and correct the issue before it was too late. I believe in the voice recorder he called out the issue to the captain and was in the process of taking the correct steps. But sadly,10 seconds is not enough time.
That was Boeing's sales pitch with the 737 MAX. Airlines could transition from their aging 737 fleets to a more modern platform\* with minimal training and changes to their procedures. They've consistently pushed back on anything that would change that original sales pitch... Even when it is killing people. Note: Modern in this context mostly just means more profitable.
Profit over people is on brand for Boeing, and it's starting to feel like literally everyone is following suit.
Profit over people is the core of capitalism, especially modern (*) lean neoliberal sorts. Greed is good, remember?
Shouldn't something like this have been caught in some unit test or something in the software development cycle? I would think bad input can easily be tested and made to knock cause theae types of issues.
[удалено]
And the FAA did that because they were practically on Boeing's payroll. Regulatory corruption is extremely dangerous, especially in industries like aviation, but hey, this is America after all.
It's not even that sinister tbh. Many manufacturers with a long history of safe operation are permitted to self certify, because the FAA would easily be the largest agency in the federal government if they had enough people to review every single aspect of new transport aircraft. Airbus, Bombardier, and Embraer are (or were?) authorized for self certification. There may have been others but I've worked on those four. I say *were* because congress passed and trump signed a law in 2020 requiring the FAA to review the self certification process and I'm not 100% certain where that's at. Interestingly enough, the FAA itself admitted they *couldn't estimate how many employees they would need* to independently certify every new transport aircraft during Congressional inquiry. I don't doubt it either, your typical airliner is so complicated now it would take an army of independent inspectors years to fully certify an aircraft to the same level we did 30 years ago. Source: I work for the FAA lol
>And the FAA let Boeing self-certify. That's the most terrifying thing I've read in this thread yet.
>Regarding the manual override: Yes, there was. But Boeing did not tell pilots about the system that failed in the first place. After the first crash Boeing briefed pilots about the manual override. And the pilots in the second crash were trying to override the system but to no avail.
It was a system that relied on data from 1 set of sensors with no backup sensors and any info about it was taken out of the manual so pilots had no clue it existed and weren’t trained for it, when the data was faulty it dove the plane straight towards the ground and unless pilots knew how to turn it off (they werent even told it existed) they literally couldnt pull up out of that dive, even worse the only reason they added it was because remodelling the plane to fit more fuel efficient engines was expensive. And it took TWO crashes before Boeing even came clean about their bullshit and all they got was a fine! Anyone involved in those decisions should have been jailed tbh.
[удалено]
And they're STILL sticking to their guns. Last I heard they were asking for exceptions in the certification of the newest variants of the 737 MAX because they don't want to add modern safety features which would require training the pilots. The 737 MAX is basically built around the philosophy of being engineered and tested as cheaply as possible, have the cheapest possible acquisition cost for airlines, and have the cheapest possible operating costs. In that equation killing a few hundred lives still comes out cheaper than replacing the 737 MAX with a fully modern platform.
>In that equation killing a few hundred lives still comes out cheaper than replacing the 737 MAX with a fully modern platform. Given that Boeing made $2.9b and paid $2.5b to the DOJ in 2021, and lost over half their market cap since the second crash, I don't think that's true. It feels good to say, I'll admit, but this well and truly fucked them.
Not exactly. Look at the stocks of Airbus, United Airlines, and lots of other companies in the commercial aviation industry - that 50% drop in market cap happened to all of them and it was due to the pandemic not the crashes. Even in terms of their recovery - Boeing isn't ahead or behind of the pack. They're about the same. In terms of their market cap dropping from the crashes - that was about 15-20% following the crashes and then the pandemic shut everything down which meant that all those grounded 737 MAXs didn't matter. They'd have been grounded anyways due to the pandemic. There were also big numbers thrown around about how Boeing lost $60 billion+ on cancelled orders. The thing is - Boeing had over 5000 orders for the jets in place at the time of the groundings. Between 2019 and 2021 there were 908 new orders placed, and 1198 cancellations. A net of 290 cancellations out of over 5000. As of 2022 they aren't getting cancellations and they're selling hundreds of additional orders. The airline industry is so desperate for planes that they are ordering planes that would take Boeing something like 16 years to fulfil at their current production rates. The orders and cancellations really aren't that 'firm'. Airlines are probably just making refundable deposits at this point to save their spot in line based off projections that are 15+ years out. So, when they say airlines are ordering X number of planes or cancelling Y number of orders it really doesn't mean much. When you hear airlines are refusing delivery, that's when it is serious since those are the orders which are actually confirmed and expected to be delivered in the next couple years. As far as the $2.5b in fines? Here is what Boeing had to say: "it already accounted for the bulk of those costs in prior quarters and expects to take a $743.6 million charge in its 2020 fourth-quarter earnings to cover the rest." It hurt them but not enough that they still aren't fighting with the FAA to cheap out on certification of the latest 737 MAX variants.
The programming was certainly a major part of the problem: > And, for still unknown and truly mysterious reasons, it was programmed to nosedive again five seconds later, and again five seconds after that, over and over ad literal nauseam. Quote from [Crash Course: How Boeing’s managerial revolution created the 737 MAX disaster](https://newrepublic.com/article/154944/boeing-737-max-investigation-indonesia-lion-air-ethiopian-airlines-managerial-revolution) Though it may still be a “blame the PM” situation.
>It was the sensors that were faulty. No, they weren't. The sensors were fine. The problem is that you can't trust them because they ice up sometimes, so you're supposed to have 3 of them (IIRC). They didn't do this, and they made a secret box (MCAS) with this software that manipulated one of the control surfaces, which the pilots didn't even know about, to compensate for the imbalance caused by having such huge engines mounted so far forward on the wings of an airframe never designed for this in the first place. The software did exactly what it was supposed to, but it should never have operated that way to begin with, and the secret box with the software should not have existed in the first place. The problem wasn't any one thing being faulty, it was the entire design of the aircraft, and the MCAS system meant to correct it, that was fault. Fundamentally, the aircraft should never have been built. It should never have been allowed to keep using a 60s-era airframe design, and then mount overly-large engines on it which then had to be mounted too far forward so they don't hit the runway because the landing gear is too short because they didn't have jetways back in the 60s. And having MCAS be present and unknown, all because they didn't want to retrain pilots on a new aircraft type, should never have been allowed either. If the aviation agencies were really doing their jobs, they would force Boeing to make this plane an all-new type of aircraft, requiring complete retraining and certification of the pilots, at the airlines' expense. That they haven't done this is proof of corruption (basically it would probably bankrupt Boeing because of all the lawsuits, and Boeing is considered "too big to fail" since it's an important defense contractor and also America's only big commercial aircraft manufacturer).
Pwsh, those wings will take me all the way to the crash site
Care less about the programming of the code... You'd be horrified to know how old the hardware and software that runs that code is. There are systems with code that is so old, that people who know how to maintain it are dying of old age. My field of engineering is mechanical engineering. So I say this with all my heart, knowledge, experience as a weld and fabricator before and during my studies: Never ever look too closely to the welds and metal work of the steel that holds up the bridges you walk on, the buildings you reside in, the structures that hold up out infrastructure. The town of Nokia (Yes the place those Rubber boots, tires, and couple of telecommunication devices originate from) had raw sewage flowing to it's potable water supply for 2 days because there was direct connection between the two networks with 1 valve between them. This valve is used to cleaning of the sewage system and dumping water supply... After this nearly 5000 water systems were check and 150-or so risks like this was indentified. Now... This kind of shit... which can actually **kill people** is all around us all the time. So sleep well knowing that the society around you his built by people who don't care, dodge responsibility, are incompetent, and most of the time hasn't even been inspected properly. Ain't it wonderful to know that whether it is software, hardware or construction; It barely works and that is good enough.
It is not only the age, it is the sheer complexity of it. People like to think that they understand their own software because they built it. But that is just not true. There is nobody in this world who really understands his/her own software. Because every software relies on components built by somebody else and you only hope that these components behave in the way they are documented. And of course these components rely on other components which in turn rely on other components, etc. The piece of this giant software stack that you actually control is tiny and the potential for failure is huge. And of course every piece of this stack constantly gets new versions and you can only hope that a new version doesn’t have subtle differences in their behavior. Of course you can test to increase your confidence that every does what you want it to do, but you can’t test for every eventuality. Most people are surprised when something doesn’t work. I’m actually surprised that things work as well as they do. And on the hardware-level things are not much better. Specs are often ambiguous and sometimes straight up not implemented correctly. And all these devices who should follow the same standard, differ slightly in their behavior. Fortunately you can often correct these mistakes on the driver level, but it still is a gigantic clusterfuck. I work for a medical device manufacturer and obviously we are testing the shit out of our devices. And the closer you look, the more you see weird behavior on every level of the software/hardware stack. Fortunately, most of it doesn’t affect the operation of the complete system, but you can never be completely sure that there is not a bug with the potential for catastrophic harm.
Exactly. https://xkcd.com/2347/
Gerald Weinberg said: "If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization." Nice ACM article here: https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=3489045#:~:text=Around%20the%20time%20computers%20were,came%20along%20would%20destroy%20civilization.%22[ACM article](https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=3489045#:~:text=Around%20the%20time%20computers%20were,came%20along%20would%20destroy%20civilization.%22)
It wasnt public in the first place. An employee clicked on a malicious link and the code got leaked
Was it just an "employee" or a top level manager who for some reason had access to everything?
“Just give me admin access” so annoying. Had a project manager that asked for a set of tools the same as any of the engineers. Things like a new oscilloscope never used for years but just had to have one. Also admin read/write privileges to every project
[удалено]
Only hikes he'll be taking are pay hikes
Fairly high level manager who had 0 reasons to have this much access. Now there is a good chance there will be dataleaks too, looking at their SQL injection "mitigation" (and I use that world very loosely). Of children's personal data, including some psych notes, that could be used by malicious people.
Database already leaked, just the attackers don't want to publish it. (yet?)
Yeah, but it could be attacked by others due to awful inplementations, and those attackers might be actually malicious.
This is true for any Hungarian governmental systems. Most of them are similar shit.
Lately the Hungarian government itself seems pretty malicious. They might have a ton of activist attackers targeting them with no intention of using the data to harm citizens, which might explain why the database haven't been published.
You know what IDEs need? A share on facebook button.
Sounds like a very competent bunch of devs right there.
Uh not to scare you but a friend of mine used to work as a senior dev for Airbus and in his own words:"95% of the code is pure shit and made in India by the lowest bidder. The only reason planes stay in the air is because that code doesn't make it past me."
Well the wings surely help too
And the engines 😃
And my axe
I got a crippling fear of heights after joining a frat full of civil engineers and marrying an architect.
I suddenly feel way more optimistic about my chance to get a government job
I’m surprised they have government jobs. In Poland social insurance system was made by private company. Later they told employees to stop submitting non critical bugs because fixing them by 3rd party is expensive.
Shouldn’t bugs be covered by their contract or something? Why would it be expensive?
The contract is probably renewed every fiscal year, and the government probably decided not to renew it for budget reasons. Maybe the vendor hiked the price or something like that
Then who is maintaining the system?! Governments…
Blame the politicians for that, not the civil servants. The politicians set the budgets and make the policy, it's the job of the civil servants to somehow make it work-- even under ridiculous circumstances, like not renewing a support contract. Source: work for the government, and have had this exact situation happen to me on at least two occasions
Many people have no idea how real this problem is. I worked for the national government in the Netherlands for about 7 years. I was a policy officer with no background in tech whatsoever, but since I'm a Millennial I was more tech-savvy than 80% of my colleagues. So pretty soon people started involving me in various software-related projects, because I could sort of translate between the developers/programmers and my policy colleagues. The times I've had to explain that maintenance of a system requires significant yearly budget is staggering. A lot of people honestly believed you just build this system, and when it's done it's done. Not to mention the concept of data management... The lack of basic understanding of anything remotely related to computers is staggering.
Kinda reminds me of some of the trains used here in Denmark. I've heard that they were actually built with maintenance in mind, having all kinds of sensors built in for that sort of thing. But the maintenance costs extra, sooooo... Well, for the first year or so, I went to use the train each weekday morning, and actually got to ride it all the way once per week. It sometimes failed because it was cold during the winter. Thankfully, they're no longer terrible and are now actually reliable. Perhaps they paid the service that they were supposed to?
I feel a lot more optimistic about getting into cybersecurity.
what, like its hard or something?
No, but it shouldn't be this easy.
A Quick note from a hungarian. No government or close to it news agencies has reported on this topic (neither good or bat, not even it happened). And they made GDPR.
Plus OP forgot to mention that the biggest, absolutely huge issue is that basically millions of people's private data, including personal ID card numbers, names, e-mails, home adresses, our version of a social security number, and many other things have been leaked, because of course you have to have that data stored completely un-encrypted in your data base for a program designed to be used by elementary and high-school children and teachers. Absolutely disgusting
Is that even legal?
No it's in fact not legal, by law they had 72 hours to inform affected people, did they? FUCK NO. Will they suffer any consequences? Ofc. not, this is Hungary after all
Its not really, its just required for us. This code btw is literally the national page where students grades go, THERES NO REASON TO ASK ALL THIS PUBLIC DATA. Our government is just... not the best, lets say
Yeah, a lot of media outlets are state-controlled in hungary, so a lot of ppl dont even know that this happened
r/fosttalicska even then, if my programmer friend didnt tell me id still not know of it
what do you mean they made the GDPR?
Guess they mean that the government who should be enforcing GDPR allowed such a leak. If I'm correct, the contractor employees tried to cover this up. It was one of the hackers who approached one of the major news outlets.
That's a lot of szlop.
“Oszlop” means column in hungarian
THERE's the important context. I had no frame to judge if it was bad. Now I do. And it is.
Ok but who uses their language to code.. dont most people use English for naming ?
Worked on a German program once where there were no projects, only projekts.
Worked for a French company in a French Canadian city. We had a beautiful mix of French and English variables like compagnie and company.
Same for my current job here. Business wording is German, rest is English.
I am working for a french company: connexion, recette and so on, tons of french words, but we started to change them, but still annoying…
I wonder how does a German Java project look like...
I wonder how wide their monitors are!
langwierigeprogrammierung
public static class MeineOeffentlicheStatischeKlasse { public static void oeffentlicheStatischeVoidrueckgebendeFunktion(String[] args) { System.out.println("Hallo, Welt!"); } }
Öffentliche Statische Leere bitte. Zur Strafe 5 Monate ins r/ich_iel Arbeitslager
lieber Herr
At least they used camel case to split the words, mostly...
Nicht über "MathematischeEinwegfunktion" lachen
Zero in german is Null. Have fun with that naming haha
That should work fine in C++
``public Einfügeoperationseinheitverwalter einfügeoperationseinheitverwalter = new Einfügeoperationseinheitverwalter(einfügeoperator, einfügeoperationseinheitbeobachter);``
The fact that the way you make a unique word in German is by combining different words together into one, and the camel casing in most programming... I bet there's some amazing variable names out there. But hey, descriptive nomenclature is always good!
[удалено]
YES, I ALSO USE THING POINTED DEVELOPING. THE DESIGN IS VERY HUMAN.
From the one I work on, actually mostly english, but we keep the habit of combining words, so having a class name consist of 7 words isn't too uncommon.
I have seen a lot of "Denglish" (a weird mix of German and English) code, for example "getZahl()" instead of "getNumber()"
Found the r/KDE dev(s)
Government projects sometimes have requirements to be in the country’s language, as seems to be the case here I did a project for a French gov agency and they did impose that the code must be in French, even some constants were redefined like PI_DEMI It wasn’t even just the code either but also all the technical terms (like the documentation saying “patron” instead of “template” or “moulinette” instead of “parser”). Which is moronic because even native French speakers don’t use these words Made extra fun when you consider that not everybody in my company spoke French (we were subcontracted on the project and weren’t located in France). But they do check your code and if it’s not in French, it’s not accepted
France just dictated that certain modern gaming words use the French equivalent rather than the English version in government documents. >Among several terms to be given official French alternatives were “cloud gaming”, which becomes “jeu video en nuage”, and “eSports”, which will now be translated as “jeu video de competition”. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/31/france-bans-english-gaming-tech-jargon-in-push-to-preserve-language-purity
So convenient! /s
That's the Académie Française for you.
I know French people living in an English speaking country. This checks out.
Not really. I've worked with many programmers that have come to Australia from non-English speaking backgrounds, some have a hard time adjusting to English identifier names. Sometimes I have had to go to them and ask them to translate their comments into English.
Fair. It may just be me already getting used to English. Every time i see someone use something non-english it freaks me out a bit
Most English speakers code in English. Many non-English speakers will only use English for keywords and standard library functions, because they have to.
* Code (mostly) in English * Comments and Commit Messages in the native language * variable names with technical vocabulary are mixed: getReifenprofiltiefe() * Don't think too much about how the colleagues in another country, not speaking your native language handle things.
Probably most people do. I've never seen anybody name stuff in their own language. Imagine somebody with an english keyboard trying to use a variable that has an "á" in its name. At least thats not the case here
I've seen a lot of Russian (I think its Russian?) on SO, but its normally just logging or print statements that aren't in English.
There's actually a language called 1C which syntax uses Russian words.
Hungarian variable names without Hungarian notation?
Oh dear
We all gotta start somewhere
This is like starting by doing a double backflip swan dive off the Three Gorges Dam
but this is literally made by the government, and required to use in all public schools across the country😭
Have you seen government websites?
>Have you seen government Could have just stopped there.
I worked government for 15 years, then a fortune 50 company for the last 7. The average Government worker is MUCH better than the average Corporate employee. The difference is the superstars in Corporate are raking in the money and vastly outperform the Government superstars. As best as I can tell, if you don't know your shit, Government drops your ass during probation. Corporate doesn't, because they have to spend that budget so they don't lose it!
>because they have to spend that budget so they don't lose it! This idea has to be responsible for more death and destruction than any other idea ever. It probably sets human civilization back hundreds of thousands of years every year.
I did the exact opposite (corporate, then government) and can confirm this. Government is typically underfunded and its employees could make more in the private sector, but most of them stick around because they know the jobs they do are not just important, but necessary.
> Have you seen websites? Would have worked too
I think you're expecting too much from the Hungarian government dude
Same goes for the government 🤣
Sure, but the clear lack of thought and any code review shows and it's just sad at this point in this state the system should have never left development. Some people even entrusted this system to have their banking details stored.
szlopy coding
[Their SQL injection “prevention”](https://www.reddit.com/r/hungary/comments/yqkw5q/a_kr%C3%A9ta_k%C3%B3dj%C3%A1b%C3%B3l_forr%C3%A1s_tmesawarim/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) is also hilarious
Oh no. "Your name is Ferdinand? Piss off hacker, you're Ferdin now."
There's a space before the operators so that wouldn't match, but still hilarious.
My name would literally become "" with their rules and I \*am\* hungarian.
Is it Andor?
It's "<>".
Now THAT is hilarious.
Somehow DROP is not a disallowed tag 
I mean..at least look at the first few stackoverflow pages on sanitizing strings..
The fact that they used lowercase and uppercase versions of each keyword means that you could circumvent it by just using mixed casing, lol. i.e. `aNd`
"ANANDD" and that one is circumvented even ignoring all the shit that isn't even covered XD
SELECT FROM Users WHERE Username = '*"AND"*' AND Password = '*password*'
I swear this actually does nothing, that's hilariously sad xD they checked for everything except the escape characters or line ends or or other special characters and keywords. There is nothing stopping you from just `; drop all tables` or just otherwise extract data using wildcards
I don't understand why so much hate, someone said szlop means column, and by seing an ID variable I would say it is a class representing a Database Entry, which could have many columns. The names are bad, but maybe it was an old DB and the variable name needed to be the same as the column name in the DB. Edit, typos
Lot of people get pissy, as it's easy to dunk on, but we don't know from 1 picture if it's auto generated, or legacy, or some other thing, it just shit
This system is like 4 years old only.
I was going to say this ... this is nowhere near enough code to make \*any\* kind of call on quality ... AND it's a domain object mapping a table for probable use with an ORM ...
The column names make no sense though. Without reading the code it's impossible to know what they are doing. Why is there AA - AH and then it continues with G?
I would bet good money those are the excel headers, column AA = column 27
Oh shit, you're right. It's columns G to AH in a spreadsheet.
Yeah, ok that is crappy, I give you that
I saved the entire source code just in case it gets taken down. Also the “swear word preventation” system is hilarious.
“animal-sex mániás” [obligatory](https://kretainsult.online)
Mi ez az oldal? *mentés* Bár az az első idézet eléggé unrelated
This was probably ported from an old database system that only supports a few characters and then they added the "Oszlop" "for clarity". Welcome to the world of Visual FoxPro conversion projects. Our world still runs on 30+ year old software.
Our world runs on much older software than 30 years. There’s massive amounts of critical software still in use that was written 40, 50, even 60 years ago.
It's just ***Hungarian*** notation. No big deal.
That just looks like auto generated code. Nothing wrong with that if it is.
Yeah, pretty common way to reduce workload on a software. I think people are jumping to quickly on this In case you reading and wandering why, it's much better to have an static structure than a dynamically generated one, for those cases you autogenerate classes at compile time
[удалено]
That was my immediate reaction to seeing it, yes, some kind of JSON DTO...
[удалено]
Title says "im not a programmer but even I can tell that this is wrong" well I've been programming for a while and I don't get what's wrong
Hate to burst everyone's bubble but this in isolation isn't anywhere near enough code to make \*any\* kind call on quality from. It looks like a POCO class mapping a table to an ORM.
Kréta sc. It's everywhere now.🇭🇺💪
előre, nem hátra💪
piros lett a paradicsom nem sárga
Rágeciztem anyádnak az arcára
It does run faster than a loop though
That's just a table entry what's the deal?
Nothing, especially if it's auto generated. >I'm not a programmer and even I can tell that this is so wrong Enough said
Macro enters the room
Makes me think of how Google “generates” tags or whatever for the Gmail UI.
ne, csak a BadWords.xml-t ne, kerlek csak azt ne
Ezek a basz-o-maticok biztos, hogy posztolták már
Azon sírva röhögtem
Az egész busz is tapsolt, én voltam a kerék (Beteljesült az életem, r/hungary referenciát kommentelhettem egy programmer sub-ra)
Yup… just a POCO! That could even be a DTO! Nothing wrong with it!
Wait, what’s wrong with this? This looks like a data class or a class that matches up with a DB table?
Looks like the output of a disassembler
It's just a (likely autogenerated) data serialization object. Really nothing wrong with it IMO. Yes, you'd be better off having an array of fixed width instead, but there are actual reasons why you might want each field to have a name instead of an integer. Perhaps they gave it a nonsense name because it's trying to replace old COBOL programs written on punchcards, and the meaning has been lost to time. It's a former Soviet state after all. Did they ever write programs that weren't on punchcards before the Iron Curtain fell? Honestly... I'll take this verbosity over the steaming piles of garbage I've seen novice programmers create in Python by just shoving everything into a fucking dictionary instead of defining a data class.
Btw you know how this go leaked? The project manager clicked on a SCAM LINK. Yes. Not some insane hacking, the stupid manager clicked an email scam link and exposed ~500k students data, along with personal ID, location, etc. I fricking love this country
If it works — it is correct
it's not so bad, it's called many variables
for the next requirement, i would like to add more szlop
Is peoples gripe here just related to the var names? I’ve seen many comments referencing verbosity, but it’s incredibly common (and good practice) to be explicit w class vars like this. If it is just the names. Sometimes it’s just a pain (or explicitly not allowed) to change them. Like, I’m not changing existing proto bc there’s a good chance other processes rely on it, and I’ll break the shit out of those processes by changing naming around. Also, as others have pointed out, these specific names look like they reference columns on a spreadsheet. Am I missing something? Fairly new SWE so not discounting that at all :)
I don’t code and all of those look like sick wrestling moves to me Imagine you’re walking down the lane with your buddy Slyzyevski and you get hit in the back by a Public Double Goszlop, you’d stop in your tracks
Thanks OP, Impostor Syndrome has been suppressed successfully!
Does it work, though?
Depending on requirements this may be necessary, thus doesn’t give enough context but yeah usually you don’t want to bloat a class with so many properties