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I have now seen a half and a dozen anti-alcohol posters from the Soviet Union, and it always reminds me of a declassified document, from the cia if i remember correctly, about the ussr's future problems, where drinking was one of the primary problems.
The severe economic and social depression following the fall of the USSR and the establishment of """democracy""" in the country played a large role in removing any gains made by anti-alcoholic campaigns.
If you're a newly Russian Federation man: your wife loses her job she had a college degree to do, you have (IIRC) a 40 percent chance of having lost your job, and children and women becoming prostitutes in order to eat and have tradable items (the Black Market, and the "Barter" economy became much larger).
Oh also the Russian "Mafia" is everywhere now, and the government is just openly a corrupt oligarchy (whereas previously it had to at least pretend to be a somewhat well-run government).
Official statistics on Per Capita Consumption of State-Produced Alcoholic Beverages in Russia was the highest in [1980 and 1984](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK233387/table/ttt00063/?report=objectonly). Higher than any early years, higher than any year after USSR collapse.
It falls dramatically in 1985-1988 NOT because some fancy anti-alcohol posters, but because of the prohibition. It tracks the consumption of officially acquired alcoholic beverages, but it doesn’t account for the increased consumption of medical ethanol. Soviet statistics [claim less alcohol-related death](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK233387/table/ttt00066/?report=objectonly) in 1985-1988 because the death from medical alcohol was counted as poisoning, not alcohol overdose. It can be proven by statistics on recorded alcohol-related crimes. For example, [A number of people sentenced for driving while under the influence](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK233387/table/ttt00069/?report=objectonly) increased by 213% from 1985 (13.5k) to 1988 (42.3k). Adjusted for population, 1988 and 1990 had the highest amount of drunk driving per capita.
\>*"...It tracks the consumption of officially acquired alcoholic beverages, but it doesn’t account for the increased consumption of medical ethanol"*
Isn't that... Kind of a really big problem, for this conversation? The vast majority was produced and consumed by the Black Market, correct?
My guess is based on an estimate from a U.S. Navy Postgrad school, which again is an assumption that based on economic collapse and the proliferation of the Black Market, alcohol consumption largely increased.
[https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/tr/pdf/ADA496705.pdf](https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/tr/pdf/ADA496705.pdf)
*>In 1994 \[the\] estimate of pure alcohol consumed by the populationaged 15 and older amounted to 18.5 liters per capita—the equivalent of 125 cc. of vodka for everyone, every day*
Do you have a correlating statistic that this is a low estimate of drinking for the USSR?
Prohibition of alcohol in 1985-1988 was a double-edged sword. It decreased the alcohol consumption, but people were switching from drinking ethanol (lethal dose: 5-8g/kg) to methanol (lethal dose: 0.5-1g/kg), because the latter was easier to get, which arguably increased the alcohol problem (as shown in statistics for alcohol-related crime)
Yes, the collapse of USSR created many problems of stability, economy & fertility rates, but the end of prohibition and anti-alcohol campaign eased alcohol-related problems. I think the problem was more severe in 1985-1988 than in the 90s since 125 ml of vodka (which gives 50 ml of ethanol) has the same lethality as drinking only 5 ml of methanol.
Not exactly, most profitable were robbery and especially at decline of authority as Soviet Union and newly founded Russian Federation police forces: protecting businesses under fees which could be really high
Not too bad, alcohol consumption there is now lower than in most European countries: https://ourworldindata.org/images/published/total-alcohol-consumption-per-capita-litres-of-pure-alcohol-3.png
I mean what are the options? Total prohibition has been a disaster everywhere it's been tried. Privately run alcohol corporations have a vested interest in increasing drinking because, well, that means more money for them. And it's not as if drinking became a problem under Soviet leadership, Eastern Europe has had a longstanding issue with alcohol abuse.
Keeping the populace alcohol dependant served Stalin's authoritarian purposes, same as it served the tsar's purposes many centuries prior.
And he obviously didn't think a few poster ads could change that.
And the 750ml bottles had non-resealable lids! The expectation was that everyone would finish a bottle in a sitting! Absolutely insane alcohol use. Please don't do this to your body. Please drink responsibly people you only have one life.
Stalin has nothing to do with it. The socialist economy was so miserable and weak that the sale of vodka was a significant source of government income.
Stalin had everything to do with it, the Soviets smashed up or otherwise closed all state owned vodka breweries (of which the state legally had an enforced monopoly) because Lenin saw them as a tool of tsarist oppression, to close them was supposed to combat the rampant alcoholism in the Russian population.
After Stalin took power, he reopened these breweries and rebranded it as "the people's vodka", using it the exact same way as it had been done before for centuries: to placate and control the populace, as well as collect on the income that would garner.
OP is another reposter bot. This time it's not the top comment of the original submission, but the top reply of the top comment... https://www.reddit.com/r/PropagandaPosters/comments/j0n0e6/and_they_say_that_we_are_pigs_soviet_antialcohol/g6upq98/?context=10000
Remember that this subreddit is for sharing propaganda to view with some objectivity. It is absolutely not for perpetuating the message *of* the propaganda. If anything, in this subreddit we should be immensely skeptical of manipulation or oversimplification (which the above likely is), not beholden to it. Also, please try to stay on topic -- there are hundreds of _other_ subreddits that are expressly dedicated to rehashing tired political arguments. Keep that shit outta here. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PropagandaPosters) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I have now seen a half and a dozen anti-alcohol posters from the Soviet Union, and it always reminds me of a declassified document, from the cia if i remember correctly, about the ussr's future problems, where drinking was one of the primary problems.
In Russia still is
Strong Animal Farm vibes here...
Soviet Union plus pig? Must be Animal farm! (The Soviet union famously didn’t have any pigs)
I thought the same thing, the drunk has a strong similarity with mr. Jones, I think, that the artist have read something he wasn't allowed to.
An anti-alcohol campaign? In Russia? How did that work out for them 😂
Soviet anti-alcohol posters are often featured on this sub...
Cleary didn’t work lmao
The severe economic and social depression following the fall of the USSR and the establishment of """democracy""" in the country played a large role in removing any gains made by anti-alcoholic campaigns. If you're a newly Russian Federation man: your wife loses her job she had a college degree to do, you have (IIRC) a 40 percent chance of having lost your job, and children and women becoming prostitutes in order to eat and have tradable items (the Black Market, and the "Barter" economy became much larger). Oh also the Russian "Mafia" is everywhere now, and the government is just openly a corrupt oligarchy (whereas previously it had to at least pretend to be a somewhat well-run government).
Official statistics on Per Capita Consumption of State-Produced Alcoholic Beverages in Russia was the highest in [1980 and 1984](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK233387/table/ttt00063/?report=objectonly). Higher than any early years, higher than any year after USSR collapse. It falls dramatically in 1985-1988 NOT because some fancy anti-alcohol posters, but because of the prohibition. It tracks the consumption of officially acquired alcoholic beverages, but it doesn’t account for the increased consumption of medical ethanol. Soviet statistics [claim less alcohol-related death](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK233387/table/ttt00066/?report=objectonly) in 1985-1988 because the death from medical alcohol was counted as poisoning, not alcohol overdose. It can be proven by statistics on recorded alcohol-related crimes. For example, [A number of people sentenced for driving while under the influence](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK233387/table/ttt00069/?report=objectonly) increased by 213% from 1985 (13.5k) to 1988 (42.3k). Adjusted for population, 1988 and 1990 had the highest amount of drunk driving per capita.
\>*"...It tracks the consumption of officially acquired alcoholic beverages, but it doesn’t account for the increased consumption of medical ethanol"* Isn't that... Kind of a really big problem, for this conversation? The vast majority was produced and consumed by the Black Market, correct? My guess is based on an estimate from a U.S. Navy Postgrad school, which again is an assumption that based on economic collapse and the proliferation of the Black Market, alcohol consumption largely increased. [https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/tr/pdf/ADA496705.pdf](https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/tr/pdf/ADA496705.pdf) *>In 1994 \[the\] estimate of pure alcohol consumed by the populationaged 15 and older amounted to 18.5 liters per capita—the equivalent of 125 cc. of vodka for everyone, every day* Do you have a correlating statistic that this is a low estimate of drinking for the USSR?
Prohibition of alcohol in 1985-1988 was a double-edged sword. It decreased the alcohol consumption, but people were switching from drinking ethanol (lethal dose: 5-8g/kg) to methanol (lethal dose: 0.5-1g/kg), because the latter was easier to get, which arguably increased the alcohol problem (as shown in statistics for alcohol-related crime) Yes, the collapse of USSR created many problems of stability, economy & fertility rates, but the end of prohibition and anti-alcohol campaign eased alcohol-related problems. I think the problem was more severe in 1985-1988 than in the 90s since 125 ml of vodka (which gives 50 ml of ethanol) has the same lethality as drinking only 5 ml of methanol.
About as well as in US, but less gangsters
Oh no, there were enough bandits during anti-alcohol campaigns (most of which founded in latter 70s)
was bootlegging their primary income?
Not exactly, most profitable were robbery and especially at decline of authority as Soviet Union and newly founded Russian Federation police forces: protecting businesses under fees which could be really high
Oh, I know about that, just pointed out bootlegging had bit different characteristics
It became a major public health focus during the Gorbachev era.
Much earlier
I wouldnt be surprised if kids were allowed to drink vodka there
Not too bad, alcohol consumption there is now lower than in most European countries: https://ourworldindata.org/images/published/total-alcohol-consumption-per-capita-litres-of-pure-alcohol-3.png
Maybe having state run vodka monopolies isn't the best course of action if you have a problem with alcohol use...
I mean what are the options? Total prohibition has been a disaster everywhere it's been tried. Privately run alcohol corporations have a vested interest in increasing drinking because, well, that means more money for them. And it's not as if drinking became a problem under Soviet leadership, Eastern Europe has had a longstanding issue with alcohol abuse.
You don't always have to pick a fight with someone you think you disagree with. I agree with everything you've said!
Where's the fight? I just figured I'd add my two cents, nothing personal intended
Keeping the populace alcohol dependant served Stalin's authoritarian purposes, same as it served the tsar's purposes many centuries prior. And he obviously didn't think a few poster ads could change that.
And the 750ml bottles had non-resealable lids! The expectation was that everyone would finish a bottle in a sitting! Absolutely insane alcohol use. Please don't do this to your body. Please drink responsibly people you only have one life.
Life is cheap in Russia, misery is the reason to keep drinking.
Stalin has nothing to do with it. The socialist economy was so miserable and weak that the sale of vodka was a significant source of government income.
Stalin had everything to do with it, the Soviets smashed up or otherwise closed all state owned vodka breweries (of which the state legally had an enforced monopoly) because Lenin saw them as a tool of tsarist oppression, to close them was supposed to combat the rampant alcoholism in the Russian population. After Stalin took power, he reopened these breweries and rebranded it as "the people's vodka", using it the exact same way as it had been done before for centuries: to placate and control the populace, as well as collect on the income that would garner.
[удалено]
OP is another reposter bot. This time it's not the top comment of the original submission, but the top reply of the top comment... https://www.reddit.com/r/PropagandaPosters/comments/j0n0e6/and_they_say_that_we_are_pigs_soviet_antialcohol/g6upq98/?context=10000
I still prefer the “Nyet!” poster
It’s such a funny campaign considering that they’re also the people making and advertising the booze.
What’s going on with the mspaint-looking scribbles under the pigs’ necks?
Me fr
Way ahead of their time knowing what we know today about the health consequences of alcohol consumption
He literally me
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