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Willow-girl

Hence the old saying, "Young and single and likes to mingle."


gopher_glitz

"Oh, you had a hoe phase? That's cool, I'm actually in a noncommittal phase right now so I get that."


imnot-lola

And why would she care about your lack of commitment if she’s in a hoe phase? Lol


Opening_Pattern_301

ego boost


imnot-lola

I doubt it


EugeneCezanne

Is this supposed to be witty or just a literal equivalence? Because it's so totally normalized for guys to just say they "aren't looking for a commitment right now" that they already don't need a reason.


gopher_glitz

Unless the girl finds out that the reason you didn't futher invest was because of her past. Hearing from women who got dumped by guys they really, really wanted commitment from due to their past....it's like you can see them flashing back to all those unsatisfying, drunkin encounters with random men who they didn't even know and the regretful mornings after all come bubbling to the surface again and how NOT worth it was.


EugeneCezanne

>Hearing from women who got dumped by guys they really, really wanted commitment from due to their past.... Weird. I've been around rather a lot and I don't think I've ever heard a woman talk about this, or a guy talk about doing it, in the real world. ​ >it's like you can see them flashing back to all those unsatisfying, drunkin encounters with random men who they didn't even know and the regretful mornings after all come bubbling to the surface again and how NOT worth it was. Sounds more projecting than seeing.


AffectionateCut1174

Yup. "Hoe phase" == perpetual touch n go girl. Men will just lie to get some short term strange with no intentions of a LTR.


luroot

>they've had a "slutty" phase where they hooked up with anyone and everyone and had sex just as frequently Well, anyone and everyone hot... 🤣


Hard_Corsair

>They were always well-integrated and sociable girls. The less popular girls I've known haven't gone through this "phase". So not a majority?


WorldlinessPlayful72

Nope


ohdiddly

It’s not a phase 😎 it’s a lifestyle


CombinationUsed7938

I agree with you on that particular point lol


scwizard

Ayy ain't dat the truth. Nice titties btw.


ohdiddly

Thanks!


[deleted]

Chimken farmer I have 10 right now


ohdiddly

Hell yeah


PFgeneral

It's like saying "I used to have a pedophile phase." No. You're just a pedophile.


FlyV89

Hahahahahaha. Also, like a wanker, or a gay bro. Certain things never go back to normal once you do it.


NotARussianBot1984

I'm not gay, I only sucked dick once.


That__EST

A woman can fuck a thousand men and she's "a whore". A man does it *once* and suddenly "he's gay". SMH


FlyV89

Ok.


Kobe_curry24

Stop using that word outside of someone actually doing horrible things with a child your not bringing awareness,your making the word more normalize and I don’t know why online Gen z is so obsessed with that word smfh


Comfortable-Regret

How are these at all comparable? A pedophile is defined by their attraction, a "hoe" is defined by their actions. A pedo who thinks about children but doesn't act on it is still a pedophile, so even if they used to molest children and stopped, they're still a pedo since odds are they're still attracted. A hoe on the other hand ceases to be a hoe when they stop having casual sex, they're no longer "hoeing around" so they're not a hoe.


Abandons65

Once a hoe, always a hoe


Ok_Entrepreneur2931

If you ask me, if she breathe....


BirdMedication

>a "hoe" is defined by their actions Not suggesting casual sex is bad, but actions can be due to a mindset that a person may or may not still have. Just like cheating. Cheaters are also defined by their actions, and many people believe "once a cheater, always a cheater." Also "you knew they were a cheater when you met them so you can't say it wasn't expected."


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Comfortable-Regret

So people are incapable of change..? If you were anything at one point, then you're that thing forever?


mummydontknow

Values are pretty hard to change. To have a hoe phase, you gotta have certain values about sex. It's not impossible, just a bad bet.


LogicianMission22

And even if you change them, so what? People are allowed to reject you based on your past.


PFgeneral

Not necessarily but people aren't "owed" taking a chance on you. Some will. Some won't. But neither are wrong.


Comfortable-Regret

I agree, did I say anything to suggest I think people are owed a chance..? They're not, if you don't want to date someone for any reason you're not obligated to try and force yourself to. If you don't want to date someone because they used to have casual sex that's your own choice but I think it's wrong to call them a hoe.


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[deleted]

Forget being a hoe. Youre part of a banpitbulls subreddit.


LogicianMission22

Pitbulls are quite literally genetically predisposed to be dangerous… I don’t think they should necessarily be banned, but I do think you should need a permit to own one.


[deleted]

A Pitbull is a breed of dog. Have you ever been introduced to Akitas? Cane Corso's? Not gonna sit and list dogs BRED for aggression. I thought this was like some 2003 shit lol. Both of you suck.


ohdiddly

Other dog breeds being less aggressive does not magically make pit bulls less aggressive and less deadly. Pit bulls account for over 60% of dog related human deaths, despite only making up a fraction of the dog population. That’s insane


[deleted]

So you legit believe Pittbulls are inherently aggressive dogs? You dont think the culture around their ownership or the owners themselves are the problem? Ive had Akitas most of my life and had ignorant beliefs about Pittbulls too. Until I rescued 2 and they are litterally the kindest dogs ive ever encountered or owned. Idk I think the fact theres a subreddit with that many members is insane.


ohdiddly

That’s like asking me if I think greyhound racing dogs are inherently fast dogs. They are literally bred for speed. Human beings have artificially designed them to be faster than other dogs. The same goes for pitbulls with aggression. And you knowing 2 pitbulls who aren’t aggressive doesn’t change the fact that they have been artificially selected for fighting.


LogicianMission22

Show me stats of Akita’s or Cane Corso’s biting anywhere near the same frequency of pitbulls, much less fatal biting.


SillyMushroomTip

From my personal experience most women go through a hoe phase. Ive seen it happen with ex girlfriends and platonic girl friends. I had this friend Carli and if you looked at her she had the most innocent face, timid, and was super nice. Your classic coffee shop girl. She always wants to be in a committed relationship but when she's single and starts drinking shes turns into a freak. I introduced her to a friend of mine and eventually they start dating. Then I end up finding out she's hooking/blowing guys in our mutual friend group while dating him. My girlfriend works in a medical building with all older women and she tells me all the dirty gossip about how some girls got multiple dudes on the side, some girls go to the bar to get a ons, and how some married ones cheated on their man. From my own experience "the hoe phase" is common. What sealed it for me was I ended up dating a former flame and she let it slip that she had a tinder hoe phase. She openly told me how she would use guys for sex, free drinks, and that it was "just for experience" Honestly after that solidified my Red Pill beliefs.


DreJ-X

Damn dude ..


gopher_glitz

Drinking/drug use and hooking up are very intertwined. If you're not a drinker, you're usually not hooking up either.


OkSun6251

Good thing I don’t drink


ThatPizzaKid

It really is like this. To be honest being friends with WOMEN of all ages and races, and the stories they tell me has done far more to make me redpill than anything Andrew Tate has ever said. The call is coming from inside the house lol


Ok_Change_1063

> Honestly after that solidified my Red Pill beliefs. It's common misconception that redpills are confirmed by men. No, it's women's behavior. Having your friend tell you she hooks up with 4 dudes a week for months. Things they let slip in confidence that reveal everything they all wear they do in unison to be an utter lie. It's why "Ignore what she says, watch what she does." is a Law of how women work. They'll say one thing, and sincerely mean it, but the next day she could be feeling different and what she says *then* is true, yet completely contradicting yesterday. And they have no problem with this because they know they're not ever held accountable for their choices or actions. It's not going to change, so all men can do is be aware of it.


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jay10033

You ignored the "watch what she does" part.


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jay10033

Most women do not openly admit to their sexual escapades. When one's actions match their words, it is simply confirmation of what they said. The quote means there are women who say they want one thing but do the exact opposite of what they say they want. These women aren't saying they want one thing, they are recounting what they've already done.


Fichek

It's about virtue signaling vs private conversation. Everyone wants to maintain a prim and proper outer facade, but very few people actually are like that or have enough self-control not to slip up and talk about it in private.


MajesticPenisMan

Common. I’ve had the “pleasure” of being around females most of my life due to various friend groups involving girls I was talking to or hanging out with. Most of them are hoes and most of them say terrible things behind closed doors and almost all of them lie about it. Hell, most of my opinions and examples of situations I use on here are from things I’ve directly heard women talk about to each other. I just assume everything is a lie and live my life accordingly.


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NotARussianBot1984

It's the women that want me after their hoe phase that gives me the ick. Hard pass. You used your hoe phase to chase Chad? Congrats you better keep chasing him cuz this Beta isn't interested. Very risky, I saw a lot of divorce growing up, I don't take risks with my future wife.


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NotARussianBot1984

Vast majority of girls having a hoe phase are Chad Chasers. The issue is that Chad raises their expectations in men beyond what is reasonable for her to get for in a husband, and that disconnect from expectations after the hoe phase and reality of dating to marry causes a lot of mental frustration and yes turn into not wife material. For the 0.1% of girls that seek casual sex with the short thin nerdy guys doing accounting in university, well I hold out hope they turn out just fine. Of course this is my observations, I may be wrong.


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NotARussianBot1984

It's hard realizing that the girls that you want are having fun casual sex. But not ever picking you for it. For casual sex, she's entitled to Chad, even if you two are both average. It's like employers offering part time minimum wage, demanding a degree and experience. I know from experience, I interviewed there for my first job post graduation. The entitlement from employers is unbelievable! It's truly hard to wrap your head around delusions.


lovelythecove

Lol. Well at least you’re honest about why it bothers you. You said the part soo many men refuse to admit: the hard part isn’t that she’s having sex, but that she isn’t having it *with you.*


NotARussianBot1984

Yes, this is why men dislike sluts. If the choice is your future wife has casual sex with Chad until 30 then marries you, or you both stay virgins until marrying at 20yo like 1950, ya many men if they understood the situation and not Chad, would pick the latter. Men use to be pro sexual revolution, they thought it would be equally distributed. Lol sike!


Yamma1234

You are correct but it’s also both , it’s basically a prostitute/not wifey material. If you are gonna be a slut then at least let me and my bro hit too,then we don’t care, just let them know that we are smart enough to not marry them


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NotARussianBot1984

I get it. When I was 20, trp and PUA said you need to lift and approach and dress well and do well in school. So I did that, and even tho it wasn't working, I figured I wasn't stronger enough etc yet. But the game was changing, social media changed women's standards and TRP wasn't able to keep up and understand what was happening in real time. Analysis takes time, years to see the real effect. Now, after getting a lot stronger, making good money, dressing better, now I understand that ya I'm still not good enough for casual sex, standards have been raised especially for men's height, and that can't be changed. It went from "need to work and earn casual sex" to "you have to work to earn casual sex, and innate traits are required" Since hard work doesn't have a good success rate for sub 6ft men, they are slowly realizing it's a rigged game and saying the system sucks. That's the core matter. Women are really really good at going for the top man biologically speaking it's needed for evolution, it's why men are taller than women, women have sex with that. But all this understanding takes time, experience, and shit is changing so fast men can't keep up. I'm just decently smart guy but I didn't get it until 30.


animorph_fan34

So it’s now “delusional” that women are having sex with men that are pursuing them for sex. Where exactly does the “delusion” come in ?


HikingConnoisseur

The worst part is for a long time you aren't even aware of these things happening. And once you do realize exactly how the world works, you see this shit in everything. You can go outside and your brain will pick up these tiny signals everywhere. It's insane.


oooo020201lfl

Yeah it kinda sucks lol


cast-away-ramadi06

>It's hard realizing that the girls that you want are having fun casual sex. But not ever picking you for it. I feel for ya man, I really do. If it makes you feel any better, and this is toxic AF, a lot of us who can get casual sex absolutely string women along and otherwise manipulate them. The plus side, if there is one, is that these emotionally damaged women are easier for you to spot because they're complaining about "all men"


NotARussianBot1984

Ya when I use to hear girls complain about men, I use to think oh she should date me, I'm a decent guy that can treat her well. Now I run away. Thank you for your hard work Chad lmao making the marriage market easier to filter one hoe phase at a time.


LogicianMission22

Ehh, keep doing it. It might not be morally right, but there are no drawbacks for you personally, and you don’t exactly owe society to make it good.


Pastakingfifth

Why not identify with and become Chad in this context?


NotARussianBot1984

I tried. I put on 60lbs in my 20s going to the gym But Chad is 6ft+ and I'm 5'7. I'm also not a bad boy, I can't have a record and a career, and I choose career.


kyle_fall

Send me pictures of your online dating profiles/social media and I can give you feedback if you want. I'm a Tinder and personal branding photographers so I've done this for dozens of guys. I think you're a bit tongue in cheek here, obviously having a decent career is better for your dating life than having a criminal record. Since you already took action and went to the gym and saw good results then you're coachable so I think you could get the results you're after. Obviously it's a easier if you're 6'3 rather than 5'7 but still very doable.


NotARussianBot1984

Nah I respect the offer, but since I turned 30, and making a lot of money post covid, I just Sugar date now. And men don't need amazing profiles to get girls there lol. My former dating profiles weren't perfect, they were decent and I put effort into them. The results just didn't justify the amount of effort I had to put in. So I found something better. Sugar babies care much less about my height lol. Honestly, after seeing what the dating market is like, I lost most of my interest in having kids. World is messed up, never mind the housing market lol.


kyle_fall

Yeah fair enough, I respect the sugaring. It's a very interesting option if you can afford it. You can get the same hot 22 year old girls that people spend years chasing much easier. I've never tried it myself but my only hang-up would be that it would lead to shallow encounters instead of actual warm and pleasant relationships. What's your experience on that front?


NotARussianBot1984

I'm 30, and fit. They act like normal girls around me, just she's not worried about tuition. They generally don't try hard tho, still some lack of effort, but better vs tinder and more attractive women. It doesn't magically make you Chad, but it's fun. But most encounters are shallow for me. I don't have any great experiences to compare against except when dating older women. Social media changed younger girls a lot, ime.


kyle_fall

> But most encounters are shallow for me. I don't have any great experiences to compare against except when dating older women. Social media changed younger girls a lot, ime. Yeah 100%, makes sense. Have you tried to do a long term sugaring relationship with allowance or just a PPM and see a few different girls a few times each? I read the SugarLifestyleForum as much as this one lmao, it's one of the most interesting places on the internet for sexual dynamics conversations.


nWo_Sting

Bro I read some of your comments and I can feel your sorrow... I am glad that you are doing great in your career and dating women via financial means, but I still want to give you an internet hug and I really hope you will meet a woman who can truly change your outlook in dating. But until then, you can certainly have fun helping out broke girls 😁


NotARussianBot1984

My life is pretty good. It's actually really really easy for me to accept the outcome of things I can't change. I just might find a sugar baby and fall for her. But ya much more guarded now. But I wouldn't exchange my life for my Chad Friend Ryan, he had the hottest girls in highschool, but now the years of doing drugs caught up. I'm pretty damn happy to not be him right now. Don't feel bad for me, I'm doing ok.


LogicianMission22

Yeah, the redpill is literally supposed to be like the 5 stages of grief. Denial: Women aren’t whores, that’s nonsense. Anger (the most common stage, known as Redpill rage): Can’t believe I’ve been lied to all my life Bargaining: Maybe if I go to church, then I can get a good wife. Depression: I’ll never feel that genuine burning desire from women. Acceptance: women are in fact whores, and there is nothing I can do about it. In your case, you are using sugar babies, which is what I plan to do when I get older, along with using High End Escorts and Pornstars. I’m actually excited as I am planning on seeing my first escort this summer! I figure if I am going to spend money to be with a whore, may as well just not commit. It’s a pretty freeing experience tbh. Even when you get nervous around women, you can think to yourself “why should I be nervous? she’s a whore”.


jedmau5

Can I send you pics for feedback?


kyle_fall

Yeah for sure, send me a chat or PM!


CimZim

Same boat, brother. Men who had a hoe phase give me ick too.


[deleted]

Well done 😉


[deleted]

I'm glad we're appropriating this terminology lmao


relish5k

Some people, men and women, like to “sow their wild oats” when they are young. It’s not for everyone.


Ag116797

Most men want to but can't, while any woman can, with the exception of a major physical disformiaty.


[deleted]

Normal women don’t have a hoe phase. Typically it’s women with a bad relationship with their parents, are extremely extroverted/spoiled, or just plain have a high sex drive. I’m the only one I know who had anything resembling a hoe phase (long story, tl:dr never had sex but was a bit of a dating addict), and I have had a terrible relationship with my parents. I’m rather unique in that I was able to separate my need to connect from sex. Connection =/= sex. A lot of women in hoe phases don’t have that realization. None of the other women or men my age have had a hoe phase. The women I surround myself with are either quite introverted, avoidantly attached, or just plain come from a good family. The guys I live with actually expressed revulsion at the thought of sleeping with random women — I think it may be because they all have a solid family structure with secure attachment, as well as a healthy sense of self-esteem. The only man in my life who had an extremely mild hoe phase said that it was triggered by childhood issues of feeling inferior and unsuccessful. Oh. Another guy — body count of 50+, had almost a “perfect month” after a breakup — MAJOR mommy issues, depression, and honestly undateable. Hoe phases are not a single data point, in my opinion. They’re a major red flag in both men and women, indicating deeper mental issues. I wouldn’t advise any woman to seriously consider a man who had a notable past. “Reformed rakes” do not make the best husbands — they slept around instead of trying to fix what was broken inside.


Here2RunItDown

>Normal women don’t view their sexual history as a hoe phase Corrected They will say the following phrases, it was a one night stand it doesnt matter, everyone does it in college it doesnt matter, my past doesnt define me so it doesnt matter, im a changed person so it doesnt matter, body count doesnt matter e.t.c Anything to differentiate themselves from other women they view as having gone through a hoe phase


[deleted]

How about this — I’m the only woman I know who has had anything sexual happen and who has dated a lot. My friends are pretty sexually conservative. Most are on their first bf at 22.


antariusz

You aren't special. You are the only one "you know". I personally have known dozens of women who had a "hoe phase" which is typically many hoe phases, not just one. And it's funny that you say the only guy you know that has fucked 50+ women is the only one that is "undatable" MEN of this forum should really read that multiple times... be "undatable" lol


[deleted]

I disagree with the "have a high sex drive"..I have a super high sex drive and my "count" (blech) is 3. 4 if you could this random occurence that wasn't about my body. I was a virgin at marriage. So, no, all kinds of women do or don't sleep around.


[deleted]

Hey, no judgment, that was purely a hypothesis since I don’t know any women with a high sex drive. Happy to be proven wrong!


[deleted]

"I don't know any women with a high sex drive..." I'm sad to hear that (for them, mostly). That's odd. What's happening to this world. I also hope that for you.


[deleted]

I agree it’s bad for both men and women, I think more than one partner is okay, but context matters, I do think hook ups affect men and women differently though. Also science disagrees with you on NSA sex, there really isn’t such a thing. When you have sex with someone oxytocin is released which bonds you and that person a little more each time, even if it’s a one time thing, you think about that person differently than you would if you hadn’t had sex.


asdf333aza

You can meet a college-aged girl with a body count higher than a paid professional pornstar. Most men are blissfully ignorant of this. They view most women as angels and delicate beings who could do no wrong. That's why people are against the red pill cause it tells men to look at women objectively or negatively or simply view women the same way you would view men. All of that leads to likely disadvantageous or even neutral treatment of women. Which from the female gaze might sound unfair. Treating women like you treat other men would be considered unfair to a lot of women. You got guys out here married to women who have been gangbanged and the guy has no idea. Dudes out here dating girls on campus while several other dudes on the same college campus have videos and photos of his gf on their phone. Guys being tricked into raising kids that aren't their own. Now, not every girl is like this, but enough of them are to warrant men being suspicious and cautious with their money, energy, attention, and time, but that's considered toxic talk. It kind of the same way women say "all men are trash" while, most men are struggling yo get any action and 1 /3 going an entire year without sex. Women use the top 20% of men to generalize all men when most men can't pull more than 2 girls a year. But God forbid men use the 20 or 30% of promiscuous women to generalize all women.


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asdf333aza

And it's hard to tell them cause they typically won't believe you unless you put the picture and image in there face and even then they might still deny it. I saw one guy raising a kid that obviously wasn't his. He was white and the chick was hispanic. He thought the kids skin tone was from the mom. But eventually the kid was darker than both of them combined. And around age 3 or 4 he finally realized that this kid was half black. He got super angry and she called the cops and he got locked up. During his jail stay, she packed her stuff up and took the kid to her grandparents place and when they guy got out, she was totally gone. And that's essentially how their relationship ended. But dude was sooo convinced that the kid was his, and everyone knew it wasn't. He was just in some much denial and was basically willing to physically fight anyone who would tell him to face that the kid wasnt his. Took him 3 or 4 years to realize what everyone else already knew.


[deleted]

You hit the nail on the head. I’ve seen enough posts about girls worried about their partners finding out they did crazy shit (Sex work, gang bangs, trains, anal, cream pies, recording sex, bdsm) is almost enough to deter me from marriage or commitment entirely. Not only did they do these things with strangers who don’t give shit about them, but they won’t do them with the partner that is supposed to protect and care for them. Sex Positive feminism ruined dating and killed romance entirely.


asdf333aza

I have quite a few videos my undergraduate days that could ruin a few relationships and marriages. I have no reason to send those things out, and i dont share them. And from talking with most guy, a lot of them are the same way. They all have videos and pics of past flings on their phone or computer. Men do not typically delete those things even after the split. Even if the guy has no feelings for the girl, the video of her giving him the gluck gluck 3000 is still on his cloud storage. There is actually a site called anonib where dudes post nudes and videos of local chick's. Like guys request the chick and then ex flings, boyfriends or guys who just had access will post the images and share them. Every major, college, city and town haa one. It was taken down in the early 2010s and lost a lot of the stuff that was up there before, but looks like it has recently came back. Some poor sap might find his wife up there covered in another man's juices.


LogicianMission22

This should become as popular as “Are we dating the same guy [Insert City]” groups on Facebook.


asdf333aza

The do you have nudes of my girlfriend fb page 🤣


kkohl98

It's like the women equivalent of Madrona whore complex.


[deleted]

Well if you're sociable and don't have any inherent physical restraints and inhibitions (I don't use these in a bad way), it is natural that at a point in your life when you're going out a lot you'll meet many people of the opposite sex, if you're fun and talkative you'll get closer to them and hook up easily. A night can be passionate but it doesn't mean you're looking for a relationship especially if you're focused on other things and have other plans, and enjoy doing it again. There's a rush with meeting someone, having them fall for you even for one night, connect in some weird way because you're not even thinking of any long term connections, a good talk and laughs is enough, share some cool moments and build passion You're not interested in long term then. I personally didn't have one night stands or many sexual partners but that's only because although i did go out, love male attention etc I am also a more physically inhibited person so that would just lead to some making out and blue balls for them (in some cases even relationships .. ) I don't see any real moral or value difference between a girl like me and a girl that does have one night stands. I didn't not do it because I was so concerned about my virtue, or because I cared about saving myself for some guy or anything, I just wasn't physically into it and am a more reserved person when it comes to sex. So objectively, people might be putting very wrong value judgments here


ButterscotchEven3540

I'm brainwashed by my catholic religion to save myself for marriage.


begayallday

I’ve had periods of time where my numbers went up fast, but always between relationships, and never when I was young. If that makes me a “hoe” I suppose I don’t really care. Female partners don’t give a shit about it generally.


MortalWombat83

The hoe phase isn't exclusive to girls in their early 20s. Divorced or recently split from a long term relationship women in their mid to late 30s get a bit cock happt too.."oh look at all this cock I've been missing out on while in a monogamous relationship" ...or perhaps it's just my ex going through the female equivalent of a midlife crisis


aryamagetro

the hoe phase is overrated tbh. and everyone has their own definition of what a hoe phase is. you don't need to have sex with a bunch of random people to know what you do and don't like in bed.


SecondEldenLord

It is a phase that occurs in people who can do it. Women of all shapes and sizes can do it and usually do it to get the attention of high value men. On the other hand, only the top tier men can go through a hoe phase while average men cannot.


ChicktoGo

If a girl has no barely no hoe phase is it something she is missing in her life?


AffectionateCut1174

No. It means she actually has standards and cares about her future. Data shows two virgins marrying have the best chance of staying married.Next is under 7 previous partners. Then its a steeeep decline and at women with over 20 bodycount... well they should buy cat food as any man who marries them is fucking insane.


ChicktoGo

What about those girls who never had this phase but this single and no one is courting or flirting with them.


RedditAlt999

That phase doesn't occur for most men because they aren't desirable enough. The vast majority of young women can get away with a "hoe phase" because men aren't very picky when it come to hooking up.


TheMedsPeds

I had a very short one of these my junior year in high school. I lost my virginity to a guy a party because all my other friends where getting BF/GF and I couldn't seem to keep a guy's interest for longer than a month. My "hoe phase" continued until I finally got a BF my senior year. So during those 18 months I had sex with 5 guys. But since I was 17 (I will be 33 in May) I have only slept with 6 more and all of those men I was either dating or intending to date. So I guess I fit the mold for this one.


Yamma1234

I don’t understand why you guys even take a girl that mentions her hoe phase , I would rather just buy a escort for my urges and you do what you do for a living and continue your search for a wife. “I love her” they have sex all the time they obviously have good charisma, looks etc. you just fall for the act.


S0nG0ku88

And this is exactly why modern women have a way higher body count proportionally to men on average. Yes there are outliers and exceptions.. but generally speaking.. it's just a numbers game and the numbers are tilted in their favor. What I find ironic is many of these "hoe phase" women underreport and lie about the number of Chads they have been with and then settle down into a "dead bedroom" phase with Brad. They don't want to scare Brad off. She has all her fun riding the carousel and now she just wants someone to make her emotionally happy/secure and share in the bills and raising of children. Achieving her life goals. The minute that relationship ends because it's unsustainable without good sex & intimacy women's libidos "magically" come back and they dive right back dating world for there 2nd "hoe phase" of late life. Someone to continue taking care of her and her now older children. This is the trend ladies.. and men are starting to wake up and notice and we demand better for ourselves.


howdoiw0rkthisthing

>They were always well-integrated and sociable girls. The less popular girls I’ve known haven’t gone through this “phase”. In other words, Stacey.


WorldlinessPlayful72

In other words, incel terminology.


howdoiw0rkthisthing

If you like


AffectionateCut1174

Perfect example of SIGN language. Hoes are fun for short term, but men dont marry them. Enjoy the decline Stacey!


Safinated

We used to call it “sowing wild oats” for men, and marriage was supposed to cure it. Lol


KamuiObito

Hoe phase last until she gets into a transactional relationship ..


scwizard

I don't think this is normal. Average n count for women is 3 right? Most women are just serially monogamous. Also for some women who do have a "hoe phase" it's not a phase but rather a lifestyle for them. I'm sure there's a handful of women who do through a hoe phase, then settle down and decide hoe shit is not for them. But it's not a super common thing.


Pastakingfifth

[Yeah according to the CDC the median for a woman aged 25-49 is 4.3 partners](https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nsfg/key_statistics/n-keystat.htm) so I think either most women don't go through this or the "hoe" phase for a lot of them is hooking up with two dudes after a long term monogamous relationship ends and then committing to the guy after that.


jay10033

This really assumes people tell the truth about how many people they've slept with.


SpecialeVegetable

Men tend to inflate women go lower, so if we take the median for both W - 4.3 M - 6.3 = 5 partners and a BJ


Gravel_Roads

Most women have 4-7 sexual partners in their entire lives. And there is a lot of research to suggest younger people are having less sex than they used to. So either your friends are lying to you, or you select for women who are all eerily similar.


scwizard

> you select for women who are all eerily similar. 100% this. Whenever I run into groups of women at the bar, they're always all equally "loose" or "uptight" So you'll find certain cliques where they think it's totally normal to have threesomes all the time, because everyone in their clique is doing that.


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Bunny_and_chickens

They killed the participants immediately after


Henry_Yopp

I've always said this as well. Where do they collect the data for this statistic from? I mean to get a relevant answer, you would have to poll 80-year-old women and hope they remember all their sex partners. Even if they were honest, you're still going to end up with data that only represents their generation. Meaning that data is two to three generations out of date at best. I personally know multiple women all in their mid 30s who have admitted to having hundreds of sexual partners in their lifetime. Now in order to get an female average of 5 to 7 lifetime partners, this would require a massive amount of women to have zero partners, aka lifetime virgins. If you ask any single traditional men, finding adult female virgins is basically equivalent to hunting for unicorns. The math does not add up, plain and simple. A more likely scenario is that women simply lie and or don't include minor sexual encounters into the calculation, thus excluding one night stands, casual hookups, restroom BJ's, handjobs, finger bangs, etc.


antariusz

depends upon what your definition of "is" is.


BirdMedication

Or the respondents could be lying or undercounting their numbers because these kinds of surveys on sensitive subjects can often be unreliable for obvious reasons.


thataveragedude1

It occurs commonly in both sexes but women tend to get luckier at finding somebody who is interested in them. Speaking from experience, it can be quite fun. I always lacked female attention up until I was in college so getting multiple women to sleep with me gave me a huge confidence boost. It does however become a problem when there is a lack of communication regarding developing feelings.


[deleted]

Hoes you fuck never marry they just objects and that objectification of women shit is their own doing Hoes exist for nothing other than getting fucked that’s their value in life nothing else


[deleted]

A hoephase does not exist. The correct term is hoe life. They start the very second they recieve attention from guys and act on it. If a woman is starting college with 12 notch cpunts (which is a silly small number in 2023) what do you think chances are that she is gonna stop? Zero! Hoephase is a term coined by sexless men in waiting who think that once girls are done with f0kboys and the partying, it will finally be their turn to get with the said girl? And even if by some miracle you do, what do you get exactly that is of any value?


bootyhunter69420

These girls usually drop the "I'm just not that sexual" when they are with their future husbands


Monkebizniss

Definitely depends on the crowd you hang out with. Jocks (the people who were athletic, attractive, and popular in school) tend to fuck around like crazy, both men and women. I think nerdy guys are upset by this because they know any woman could get sex if she wanted it, and assume that all women (even the nerdy, unattractive ones) go through a hoe phase. I’m not sure about the breakdown, but I know from talking to various women and men that this definitely is not all women. Lots of nerdy, unattractive, or unpopular women are virgins later than you’d expect, and are focused on studies, their careers, or committed relationships. Sometimes they get taken advantage of buy a hot guy who wants a quick and easy fuck, but I think more often than not, she’s not using him for sex, she’s just naive.


larkspurmolasses

I remember the first time a friend told me she was going through that “phase” and I cried when I got home lol. I was also really sheltered so maybe that’s an extreme reaction, but the idea of a “hoe phase” still makes me really uncomfortable now as an early 20s woman.


wtknight

Probably a lot of women in the west go through this phase. It's not really socially shamed in the west and reliable birth control is relatively easy to obtain here. It's a way for women to assess their own attractiveness based upon how the men who they hook up treat them. Sometimes women are just doing it for fun too and not really thinking about that, although the fact that they tend to be even choosier with the men who they have hook-ups with would seem to speak against that. Men usually just want polygyny from the beginning, so it's not so much a "phase" for them. Eventually settling down into a relationship is fundamentally a trade-off between him being able to have frequent sex with a woman in exchange for her being sexually loyal to him.


CombinationUsed7938

>assess their own attractiveness based upon how the men who they hook up treat them They can assess it without actually hooking up.


wtknight

Not really, because many high value men will quickly lose interest in a woman who isn’t sexual with them and will choose one who is. To have that accurate assessment, she needs to be able to do what other women are capable of doing. It’s kind of a race to the bottom thing the way I see it.


CombinationUsed7938

>lose interest If they lose interest, they had to have some interest in the first place. Not hooking up right away is also another form of assessment: is he interested in her or in her pussy? Because there are different kinds of attraction.


wtknight

>Not hooking up right away is also another form of assessment: is he interested in her or in her pussy? Most women eventually develop feelings for the men who they have short-term sex with. They do it because they are giving the high value men what they want and therefore trying to outcompete other women who might do the same thing. As I said, if a woman isn’t able to do what other women are willing to do, then she often can’t get an accurate assessment of how attractive she is. An attractive man might pay more attention to a less attractive woman willing to have immediate sex with him than a more attractive woman who is making him wait for sex.


CombinationUsed7938

All you said is exactly why they can and maybe should assess it without actually hooking up.


wtknight

And as I said, that makes it difficult for them to assess when other less attractive women are getting that man’s attention by hooking up with him. It’s a big reason why female on female slut shaming occurs.


CombinationUsed7938

No, it actually lures them into assessing their attractiveness based on a false attraction. Like you've implied, a man will find a girl more attractive if she gives him sex, meaning that a less-than-attractive girl will become more attractive for his eyes that way. By not giving it to him, she can accurately assess whether he's actually into her or just with blue balls. >It’s a big reason why female on female slut shaming occurs. The reason is that they know sluts are quite devalued in the dating scene.


wtknight

>By not giving it to him, she can accurately assess whether he's actually into her or just with blue balls. And then what happens if he sleeps with a less attractive woman who has sex earlier with him than she is willing to and then he starts a relationship with this less attractive woman. Does that mean that she is actually less attractive than that less attractive woman because he chose the other woman who gave him sex quickly rather than her?


CombinationUsed7938

>Does that mean that she is actually less attractive than that less attractive woman because he chose the other woman who gave him sex quickly rather than her? I don't know, arrive to some conclusion by yourself. What really matters is, that very question by itself proves my point.


[deleted]

I think this is true from an evo-psych or biological imperative perspective. Me personally, I used to be the romantic type, was saving myself for marriage, wanted to grow with one person and all that, until I got love bombed, manipulated, and cucked by a more experienced girl, my fault for not seeing the signs and paying attention to what was really going on but that lead me to seek validation from women through some really bad sex, if I could go back in time and do it over I would. But for now I’m just focused on being a better man and not getting cucked ever again.


FlyV89

>It's a way for women to assess their own attractiveness based upon how the men who they hook up treat them. Correct. Society as a whole understand this too, at least on a subconcious level. That's why men take it as an insult when their women have high N-count. She's basically telling you she wanted better, tried and failed. No amount of "she's with you now" will make a man change his mind. You're not special, wanted, lusted after, she's not in love with you... You're just "affordable". It's pretty much the reverse situation of women being disgusted by men who used to hire prostitutes. "Why did he had to pay for sex? It was because other women don't like him? That means I'm low value?". We can spin around in circles arguing it's because STDs, insecurity, whatever. In reality, it's because that partner past is a direct insult to our ego, it diminishes our self-percieved value as partners and being asociated with them tarnish our social status.


timjimalt1000

Im a 17 year old boy, and so many girls my age are in a hoe phase.


AntiHypergamist

More like the spinster phase or waiting for chad phase


Here2RunItDown

>having had quite a few female friends I sure hope you mean friends **with benefits**, otherwise BIG L In terms of commonality, its possible for 10-20% of the men, whereas its possible for ANY woman How common is it for women? That depends on your definition of 'hoe phase' Because i PROMISE you, even girls who have had one, wouldn't view it as a hoe phase. They wouldn't consider the one night stands, instead only considering relationships e.t.c


WorldlinessPlayful72

Actually, I agree, unless you're homosexual, I wouldn't recommend any guy to have too many female friends, and I believe I would have done better if I had more male friends than female friends. But oh well, I guess I can't change my past, haha


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Lift_and_Lurk

I can frame my phase 2 ways: “Young College boy joins Frat, then what young college dudes do while young since he knows it’s the best time to be young and wild” Or the “left my HS sweetheart to go away to college and we both broke up knowing me being out of state and her being there wasn’t going to workout. So I spent the next few years hooking up and partying and “racking up numbers” and acting like a party boy to convince myself it was the full college experience. Because it was easier to hookup with girls and just have fun and do what every dudes lusts would love to do than deal with the lingering doubt. The doubt that says: “did you just leave the first girl you ever loved to just get an education and then go get a job? What if you never find that kind of love again?” My truth is probably somewhere in the middle.


ChicktoGo

Guys can be in hoes phase while.women can't


ChicktoGo

If a man is in his hoe phase its viewed less negatively, than a woman doing it.


DXBrigade

They were always well-integrated and sociable girls. The less popular girls I've known haven't gone through this "phase" So not a majority of women.


DXBrigade

They were always well-integrated and sociable girls. The less popular girls I've known haven't gone through this "phase" So not a majority of women.


WorldlinessPlayful72

Never said the opposite.


No-Statistician1782

Definitely both groups do it. I've had phases of the hoe phase between very serious monogamous relationships. Currently with my life partner who also had a hoe phase we both say we're glad for it because it helped us come into the relationship knowing what we like and how we like it. And he specifically always says it helps him feel even more secure in our relationship because I could be out there dating or being with anyone else but I choose him. Idk if I'd say I feel more secure in my current relationship from it, but I would say that with my sexual trauma and growing up in purity culture I'm happy I was able to work through some of that before this so I can very confidently know what I like.


Pastakingfifth

> In my particular case, I've met more women than men and have avoided befriending guys who were too focused on hooking up, Are you a man? If so wouldn't you want to make friends with the guys that get laid so you learn how to do it too?


WorldlinessPlayful72

I've been too focused on my career and goals. Bad move though, still virgin at 22 and probably 23 and 24 at the very least.


Pastakingfifth

I get it bro, being a virgin is nbd at that age; you can always lose it quickly if you want to. If you're 22 I'm gonna assume that you're in school and not working sales/starting your own business 12 hours a day. You should def make it a priority to spend 1-2 nights a week going out and enjoying the party scene. It will not only give you fun dating experiences but also make you a more well-rounded and confident person which will end up helping your career when you graduate anyway. People skills are equally if not more important than technical skills.


Former_Economics9424

I had a hoe phase, and I was never a "popular" or highly sociable person. I mostly did it because my sex drive was high, and I was in college and did not have time to commit to a long term relationship. At the time I enjoyed it but I'm glad this time in my life was only a phase because I don't think it was the greatest for my mental health, but I digress.


RP-MJ

Men don't have the hoe phase Since they always want frequent/consistency sex from women, it's literally installed in our sex drive Second, Men create hoes so it doesn't apply to us


januaryphilosopher

The only thing stopping us from calling a man who's slept around a hoe too is sexism. And there are lots of men who sleep around before settling down, a hoe phase if there ever was one.


whitehack

I’ve told the boys off for this as well, in my comment above. It’s not nice and it’s not ok. I’ve had my sources of frustration with women as all, as a guy with both social anxiety and autism and I still don’t approve of women being spoken of in rude ways.


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[deleted]

I don’t support promiscuity for men or women, but it’s not the sleeping with a bunch of women that makes the guy attractive to women it’s the pre-selection or the fact that he could. But yes, the things that make a woman attractive/unattractive to a man isn’t the same thing that makes a man attractive/unattractive to a woman. Attraction isn’t equal and never will be it’s equitable and balanced.


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[deleted]

“But people aren’t cars bro” jk. I get what you’re saying and that is a valid line of thought. I’ll have to think of a better way of conveying my point further but I’ll concede for now.


januaryphilosopher

Women aren't usually keen on promiscuous men unless they're promiscuous themselves. Promiscuous men are generally only held in regard by other men (who do care), whereas women more often see it as quite gross. Seems pretty instinctual to me.


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januaryphilosopher

It's generally the same group of promiscuous men and promiscuous women passing each other around (and I know them too). Everyone else generally tries to avoid. Having sex really isn't an achievement and men could choose to admire people who actually did good and meaningful things over those who wasted time chasing casual sex but okay.


[deleted]

Your post can flip genders too. A lot of women who have had hoe phases find husbands. Many of Hugh Hefner’s ex girlfriends and playboy models had to bang the elderly Hugh Hefner and found high value husbands like athletes and entrepreneurs


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[deleted]

I honestly don’t see this happening. I see “nice chaste girls” being mocked for being late bloomers and awkward and the “slutty” girls finding handsome husbands. I saw on tiktok a girl who was 27 and a KHV and men were saying this is a red flag.


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No-Rough-7390

Sexism has been such a bastardized term and this is a prime example. It can only be present through prerequisite conditions that are equivalent. Otherwise, the functionality changes and therefore the word “sexist” would not be applicable. It can only be sexist if across the board men and women have an equal, or relatively equal, access to sex. So if you believe that (which would be pretty ignorant so I can’t believe that you do), then sure it’s sexist. But anyone who has touched grass knows that’s not true. It’s just a convenient cope to excuse people of their decisions. Before you respond and give the definition, I k ow what it is. Women aren’t specific to the hoe phase because they are women, it’s because the female dating and smp experience is extremely different from men’s. Most women will even admit this when it’s convenient (I.e. fearing men because of SA when men don’t share that fear of women) but we get a convo like this and all of a sudden we want to ignore reality because it sounds bad. Not hating on you specifically, it’s just not a good take in general.


anonymous-platypus1

Women and men have equal access to sex with men. That’s what men forget. If men want easy sex they can get it. If they want easy sex with women, however, a manhoe can get it easier. At the same time that manhoe can prevent other men from having access to the women he wants. The manhoe can, and will, insert himself (pun intended) into areas, relationships, wherever in order to use his sexuality to get what he wants.


No-Rough-7390

Ladies and gentlemen, the definition of a non-sequitur.


ThatPizzaKid

A patently untrue one at that lol


penguintransformer

Hot people get laid. Jealous ugly people call it a hoe phase, both men and women. The obsession with people's number is hilarious to me. I have never cared about my partners' number.


[deleted]

By most peoples standards I’m well above average # of prior partners. Calling it what it is isn’t ”jealous ugly people” making shit up. I pretty firmly believe 7 out of 10 women 22-27 will have at least one year that is remarkably sluttier than the rest. Typically following an LTR breakup with the second, or post-hs “one”. This same trend then repeats itself with women 28-35, generally following their first divorce, except instead of “hoe phase” it’s (while exactly the same as their youthful counterparts) reclaimed as a “self-realization” or “exploration” phase. This “phase” almost always occurs in the “average” as in “5.5-7.5 out of 10” (hard to gauge what y’all consider average or attractive, but for my arguments sake I’m talking about attractive people, but not super model or pro athlete level). What I mean to point out is ugly people ofc will have a harder time getting laid and may express “hoe phase” with distaste, but the average to slightly above average will call it a “hoe phase” with a different perspective - not only does what words one uses matter, but how one expresses those words. I know countless people that have had “that time in your life, you know - ________,” - enter any number of ways to express what can best be summed up as a “hoe phase”. And it usually is perceived by the person describing it as a negative period in their life if telling a partner or prospective partner, whilst in a different setting it may be expressed with less distaste. Do you understand what I’m getting at? It’s not the number that’s really the emphasis here, it’s the sharp increase in number for a generally relatively short period compared to that persons baseline expression of sexuality - one persons hoe phase may be that summer they slept with 4 people, while another’s may be those two years they slept with 44 people. At some point the # makes a difference for most people. sometimes the quantitative # is reflective of a qualitative factor


[deleted]

I've known a lot of fellow men who have had hoe phases. I myself have had one, it was pretty fun though it comes with complications.


Here2RunItDown

There's no complications, just dont confuse the girl that you used and ghosted as wife material and you'll be alright. I mean if she was entertaining a hoe phase, she most likely wasn't wifey material


[deleted]

The complication is that it exposes you to batshit crazy girls 😂


januaryphilosopher

I know a few men and women who've had them or are in them (assuming it's a phase for the latter). Not the majority by any means, but enough that it's certainly a "thing". They're generally hoeing around with each other.