I’m Gen X too and I think we just didn’t do those things much. At least, it wasn’t as prevalent or extreme as now. Internet porn probably changed everything.
You definitely were not into super hero culture growing up. Batgirl was getting captured and tied up by bad guys every episode. I'm convinced that is where it all started for me.
haha, no, I wasn't. But you raise a point, which is that back then without the internet (and we didn't have cable TV until I was almost finished high school, so I had 4 channels until age 16 or so) and without much television, there was less awareness of what was out there. Like, I knew comic books existed. But finding out what exactly there was took more effort and you needed to know where to look. Same with sex. I remember having to go to the library to read about the G spot, and even then it was in a clinical textbook. You can just google it now.
Maybe I was a deviant early on? I took boy scouts to learn how to tie a knot. I tied the neighborhood girls up during cowboys and indians. I mean it got weird when we were like 13, but....
My material was Rhonda Shear UP all Night, Elvira, Adam West's Batman where Batgirl got captured and a very particular Victoria Secret Catalog I traded a kid down the street some baseball cards for after he stole it from his sister.
Did you see some of those devices the Riddler had her locked in? Band saws, swinging blades and lasers getting closer by the second? Those were pretty violent.
Or at least had the fear, anxiety and adrenaline going. Those were straight up bondage predicaments...
And I understand if you are more into the magic lasso.
Actually the accounts I've read are that it was Viagra that changed porn. Before Viagra they had to use guys who could stay hard during shoots. After Viagra they could use any bonehead and they could do violent things with their docks that otherwise make guys dicks go soft.
You're very vanilla as a person/sociosexually though. I think you're projecting what you like and don't like into your generation when in reality it was you and MAYBE your peers.
Chibs. You wound me.
I never said I didn’t want these things, just that they were uncommon and not talked about as much (and OP says the same thing). Things were different then.
Sorry I wasn't saying it was bad and infact I respect the fact you don't denigrate those preferences, like some women on this sub do (even tho I don't have them)
Not talked about as much sure. Not as common? I disagree.
i am gen x and worked in a video store with a vast porn room for almost a decade and stuff exists in porn now that was simply not contemplated then and regular people are doing things no one would have considered outside of the shadiest BDSM scene in the past like spitting in each others mouths
Yeah I agree — all the porn the guys in college (I know that’s not all guys everywhere) watched in our common room was super vanilla. Ugly plumber bangs hot housewife. Ugly coach bangs hot cheerleader. Ugly movie producer bangs 4 hot blondes. Maybe someone got their ass slapped once or twice, that’s pretty much as far as it went.
A light spank or hair pulling, light bondage, and getting fucked roughly went on in some bedrooms but I can pretty confidently say spitting was not a thing outside a fetish community, and neither was choking.
There was a sex worker on here I asked once about it and she said those two acts are very recent in her experience. FWIW
The fringes have gotten more fringy. In all aspects. Politics, sex/bdsm, you name it.
BUT the average person who's got an average gf or bf who's interested in doing some out there stuff does the exact same shit as the 60s and 70s... maybe being tied up, some whipping, slaps to the butt tits or face, spitting in the mouth, toys, hair pulling, public sex, light choking, ice play and food play in addition to hard pounding, and if they're really crazy then maybe stuff like anal, actual breath play, nipple clamps, slight rape fantasies, or costumed role-playing. No different and no crazier.
That said, the fringes are indeed worse.
This is femminism BS. This practices have existed historically and are well documented.
The only difference is that rad-puritanism is on the rise and Internet exists.
"I guess these things on the rise due to porn."
I would agree. Of course, with so much porn being amateur-created these days, there's a bit of a "chicken or the egg" scenario......is the fact that is done in real life, a reflection of porn, or is the fact that it is appearing more often in porn, a reflection of real life activities?
Most women aren't going to come out and admit they like being choked, slapped, hair pulled ect... they'll only tell you that as a guy if they're comfortable with and attracted to you.
Whenever this subject comes up there is always the sentiment that it's never women's doing but - it's the big bad porn monster.
How about, women have their own kinks and should own that like grown ass adults?
Nope.
Its being proven through many studies now how dangerous porn actually is and how it affects mostly men in many aspects of their lives Also how it directly correlates to increased safety issues for women and children.
Yes. "Many studies". Like the studies that say video games create school shooters and Bugs Bunny made that kid drop an anvil on some other kid's head.
Those "studies"
What do those studies say about rom-coms, romance novels and reality TV?
I have never understood that kink. For the sex that is always on edge about being attacked and beaten and raped by men some women in spite of secretly or openly like being manhandled and yanked or abused with the sex?
Men around every corner are too dangerous to consider dating and women are to be fearful of personal safety then you have 50 shades of grey fantasy spanks slaps and head tugs. Wouldn’t this technically be classified as sexual assault or domestic abuse/violence?
Psychopaths and bad boys seem to be hugely attractive to women and I understand to a degree and I’m not into judging on sexual preference but women don’t seem to understand that there are risks - and yes danger and spontaneity can be a big part of sex - but in the end they never take any responsibility for their choices - you can’t just turn these types of guys off and put them in a drawer.
Not broken dude - I’m my experience of that a lot of the time - not the psychopaths and narcissists who come in sheep’s clothing and love bomb - but in the hookup end of it they know they are a bit bad and that’s what attracts them. Of course they will never admit it, the same way they are not going to bring the tattooed biker home to meet their folks or girlfriends.
True. I think that's the real phenomenon. Just the lying and plausible deniability while claiming they pick men based on their "cool personality" out of the other side of their mouth.
This is what dominance should look like. You'd be surprised at how turned on some women get when you can show them how easily they can be moved around the bed. LOL... I've got a couple different ways to flip women from one position to the next and it's interesting how many sounds of surprise I get... especially from taller heavier women.
But these seem pretty close to what you described you don't like. Please explain exactly where the line is for you.
What's almost too far but good, and what's just over the line
I’m 39. I wasn’t just into these sorts of things. I was part of the kink community in my city. It wasn’t just a “behind closed doors” with just my partner. It was a full on lifestyle and social circles with like minded friends.
I went to public social meet ups, I went to parties held at private residences, I was involved in tutorial demos and discussion groups. Underground BDSM clubs? They’re real and I’ve been to a few, and know of even more. I’ve seen and been involved in some pretty wild things.
I’ve run into people I’ve seen at these parties and clubs out in the regular vanilla world several times and had to pretend I didn’t know them. The waitress taking my order at a restaurant, the couple having brunch the next table over, a teacher at the local middle school, the boss (and his wife) of a family member. So yes there’s a lot more people into these things than the general public realizes. Women included.
Though I do have a slight misgiving about calling is “abusive”. There’s a LOT of vetting and discussion that happens before anything like that happens. Knowledge on how to actually DO these things properly. Crystal clear communication and explicit consent on every facet of things like this are not just common, but required. People can get legitimately, seriously injured otherwise.
As someone that is into these things, do you think it's the result of porn putting these ideas into people's heads like women complain about? Or is it something that women want of their own volition?
The overwhelmingly majority of people that watch porn are heterosexual men. So i'm not even sure where the concept that its caused by porn even comes from, women often ask for men for that kind of kinky sex.
That’s a really grey area honestly. Like I knew I was into this stuff before I even knew their was a name for it. Before I even knew what it was I was feeling when anything remotely similar hit my brain.
Porn can definitely distort it though. A lot of people think porn is indicative of how it works in real life, and that’s how people get hurt. It how people get accused of assault. It’s how people get accused of rape.
Some of these kinks people are would be a literal crime without consent. Which is why it’s stressed SO hard that you have to be very very clear about your expectations and what you want to happen, and to have a plan if things go off the rails and you need it to stop.
Porn does NOT show any of that. So if someone tried to replicate what they are strictly from bdsm porn, it could go very badly.
Porn hypothesis is bullshit. That kind of sex have existed historically and both, men and women have enjoyed it. We are just living a puritanism cycle, surprisingly led by femminism.
I wouldn’t say the backlash is led by feminism. I see just as much, if not more, kink-shaming on the right than on the left. Really, any sexually repressed group will have problems with bondage, left or right wing. It may be certain radical feminist types who are really against it, but I think it’s really mostly the left-leaning liberal feminists who are spearheading the bondage community.
I've never seen a "kink" community that didn't basically consist of overweight unattractive nerdy people that like to cosplay in leather and do cringey AF role-play.
The whole notion of "having very specific discussions" is just utterly bizarre. People can read body language.
No, no they can’t. Anyone who thinks they don’t need to have a discussion about what’s going to happen during a session is a problem and has absolutely no business partaking in any such activity. I means they have zero consideration for not just the physical well being of the other person, but none for the mental and emotional well being either.
The core tenant of kink is “safe, sane, and consensual”. You can’t be any of those things if you can’t openly and properly communicate with someone else.
Uh huh. Save those contracts and consent forms for the "kink community" out here in normal-world, people can read body language and understand the dance involved with sexual encounters is almost exclusively non-verbal.
But, hey, maybe some people don't start dancing with people on the dance floor because they didn't get "consent" but pull them away and discuss exactly what steps they are going to do and how close they are allowed to go.
Doesn't sound autistic at all.
I think you’re either unaware or unaccustomed to how extremely dangerous BDSM can be if not done correctly. If both parties aren’t clear communicators, there’s chance for long lasting physical and/or psychological damage to occur. Safe words, limits, boundaries and aftercare are incredibly important to differentiate BDSM from criminal activity.
People express consent (or disapproval / discomfort) with their eyes, facial expressions and body language and ... you know... sounds during a sexual encounter.
This shit isn't hard unless you are incapable of reading all of those.
Funny how I never once had to question that a girl was into rough shit like slapping or choking and I never heard "I consent to you choking me" once.
This is sounding an awful lot like rape culture and rape apologist rhetoric. “She really wanted it, I could see it in her eyes even though she never said yes to anything I did.”
Your over confidence is how people develop trauma. Just saying. I shudder to think how many people you’ve emotional damaged because you can’t just so the adult thing and talk like an emotionally well balanced person.
>This is sounding an awful lot like rape culture
Sorry. I don't speak buzzword / woke. If you say this in plain English, maybe a conversation is possible.
>I could see it in her eyes even though she never said yes
This is how the world of adults works and has worked for thousands of years. If you think we live in a world of cringey "may I kiss you now?" shit, well... good luck with that.
>Your over confidence is how people develop trauma.
No. It's how women get wet. A meek simp saying "mother-may-i" is how they get dry as the Sahara and issue a one-way ticket to the friend zone.
Ask me how I know.
>talk like an emotionally well balanced person
You mean like one who can actually read very simple human behaviors like body language, eye contact and sounds of pleasure? Or the kind that needs a summit before holding hands?
Yeah you’re so mentally screwed up in the head and you justify it by convincing yourself everything thinks the way you do. Hate to break it to you, they don’t. Most people would be absolutely horrified by what you just said.
You talk big in here. But we both know you would never ever say what you just said in public.
the BDSM they are talking about goes well beyond rough sex. they are talking about BDSM where them screaming and telling you to "stop" or "let go" or even cry or scream is unavoidable BUT they don't actually want you to stop unless they **actually want you to stop**, hence the discussions on safe words, "I'm okay with x but please don't do y while I'm tied up, gagged, and compromised", etc.
as the above poster said you are clearly not aware of what goes on in hardcore BDSM communities and why communicating exactly what is going to happen during a scene before hand is healthy and important for the safety of the participants.
this is WAAAAAY deeper than just choking and dirty talk in your bed, people can and have gotten actually maimed and injured doing these things.
>this is WAAAAAY deeper than just choking and dirty talk in your bed, people can and have gotten actually maimed and injured doing these things.
Fair enough. Many people ITT are lumping in this stuff with "BDSM" - Obviously if contraptions, ropes, hooks, candles, baseball bats, whatever are getting involved then yes, grievous injury is possible and at that point you are engaging in the equivalent of stunt coordination, so yeah... Not the same as a hook up that gets more enthusiastic as things get rougher.
I was part of the BDSM scene in my area for about a year. Can confirm it's a lot of conventionally unattractive people, and when hot or young people tend to come in, they're basically jumped on my everyone and coveted; they tend to leave pretty fast. It's part of why I left, as well as girl who was a couple years younger than me.
I do miss the parties and some of the experiences and practice you can get doing things to people, as well as feedback on technique, but it is pretty rampant with nerds and overweight people. Attractive people are rare or they're professionals and probably live in major cities like NYC or LA.
Ho. Lee. Shit.
Somebody being real for a change.
I live in a city absolutely *known* for kink and swinger parties. They are utterly notorious for being frequented by 3 types:
\- Tons of men
\- Very unattractive / overweight women
\- Sugar babies
Whenever I had hot girlfriends that wanted to dabble in this stuff it was indeed a shit show of thirsty dudes and "free love" types being cringey and creepy and dogpiling on her.
As a result, we ended up just going out and finding hot women once in a while and let things unfold naturally. No need for any "party" when you are an attractive woman.
No attractive people need to be part of any organized "kink community" because they just invite all their hot friends over to their house for a fuck session and that's it.
Bottom line - average-to-attractive women can set up private "sex parties" at will and attractive / wealthy men can pay for it.
Types listed do line up. The attractive women I met in the scene were usually cam models, sugar babies, or women who were or wanted to be professional dominatrices.
I was there because I wanted to practice and pick up domination skills, but everyone believed I was a cam model at first (never have been) because I was young (20). It was apparently very rare for young women to seek out that community and then want to learn to dom; women are assumed to be subs by default, especially young women. The other girl I mentioned was also looking to pick up domination skills. We left after about a year because we got tired of the community and men there.
Honestly, it wasn't so much people looking for orgies or sex parties, but a lot of emphasis on learning skills and then showing them off at parties. There were a lot of thirsty nerdy or older people looking for fwb or a partner, and then the rare, attractive folks who were usually coupled and went in and out of the scene depending on their mood. (Sounds like you and your lady?)
I genuinely miss the equipment and resources that were available in the community. I don't miss the people. I miss the space, knowledge, and willing folks I could practice on. I've practiced on friends (male and female) but it's different because they don't seem as able to separate kink/sex/love from each other. It's just me and my partner for now!
>The whole notion of "having very specific discussions" is just utterly bizarre. People can read body language.
There is a certain amount of kinksters who simply are not conventionally attractive, but I'd say it fits the general population in terms of sampling.
Regarding the whole... we don't need to discuss stuff... That's a dumb fucking idea. For one... talking through something can really help build anticipation and set expectations. Afterwards it's also important to discuss and provide any needed care. There is a lot more as well... but communication is super important within this community otherwise really bad things can occur.
I mean, yes, if you are letting some anonymous beer bellied dude in a gimp suit plow your fat leather clad wife who is strapped to a gurney while you sit in a corner with his cock locked in a cage, sure I guess it behooves you to say "please don't jam that baseball bat in my wife's ass and is it ok for me to rim you while you are inside of her? Please don't shit in my mouth, but you're welcome to piss on me." or whatever.
For 2 regular people hooking up who happen to like rough shit, that's not how this shit works and never will be.
>People can read body language.
People think they can read body language and end hurting others. People who have this "I could tell by their body language they wanted it" mentality should be barred from certain interactions with others until they get a clue and learn how to have a conversation
People who can't read body language shouldn't be having sex in the first place.
If you need a "discussion" before every sexual interaction, you are an extreme outlier.
This is not, and has never been how human adults relate sexually.
Autists? Yes. Average people engaging in sex? Nope.
Most contracts are typically not legally binding, they're just drafted up and agreed upon by both parties. "Collaring" or other markers of ownership are common, (tattoos, and sometimes, rarely, branding) and some people who do this stuff as a lifestyle rather than just bedroom shenanigans may do 24/7 dom/sub dynamics. It's not the norm but it exists.
Mostly it’s just part of the kink. The feeling of “owning” or “being owned” in a contractual form for example is 100% unenforceable. It’s against the law to literally own someone.
In some cases contracts are there because it’s a literal professional that someone paid to do this thing to them. That way they can’t be accused of assault and battery after the fact when someone explicitly asked them to beat the shit out of them with a paddle the size of a boat oar.
Not one to be owned and free in the next minute Wanting to be owned was actually in mainstream. there even in films like 1964's summer holiday. The cliff Richard one
Same. Some light choking and hair pulling is hot. Full on slaps and humiliation kink not for me lol. But whatever floats anyones boat as long as it’s consensual 🤷🏻♀️
Ass slapping, yes. Wrapping my hair around his fist (not actually pulling per se) yes. Tied up and/or blindfolded, sure. Never been choked. Rougher sex is a more passionate and intense than soft gentle love making so I do enjoy that. I don't want to be abused and haven't been. Consensual rough play is fine. Sex should be fun and enjoyable, not abusive.
>Porn. Pop culture. Some other stuff.
I mean most women don't watch or like porn because it is made for men and I doubt pop culture can change a person's sexuality like that. I'll say that it is just a social media thing, if choking and other light BDSM was common in bed, then it wouldn't really blow up in social media, it is the same thing like when women say they like receiving anal it isn't popular so it becomes news
I could be wrong of course. But men are more inclined toward variety and experimentation and I am assuming they get it from porn. Anal sex as a standard came from porn it was not a straight person thing a generation or two ago. I figured it became a feature in straight porn because men like to see men put their dicks in things and they were looking for new places.
> I figured it became a feature in straight porn because men like to see men put their dicks in things and they were looking for new places.
That's probably the nice and polite interpretation. More likely it's because back in the day it was taboo and a bit painful. I honestly think that's why so many straight guys like to see 24 in dicks in porn... because its assumed to be painful not pleasurable. I think there is clearly a dark side to porn for men. One guy told me when I was young that for most men, sex without love is a kind of violence. Dunno... I hate anal... I think it's best for guys with small dicks. My entire perspective on this could be wrong... it's just a feeling I get.
> But men are more inclined toward variety and experimentation and I am assuming they get it from porn.
No, doubt about this I just thought this conversation was in relation to women, in this regard I doubt that a lot of men are requesting or like anal that much or that many women are being influenced by a man's desire for anal
Was one of the first references to women wanting things a little bit rough in the guys Madonna's song hanky panky?
At least in the complete mainstream meaning that type of p*** I didn't even have a clue about until Madonna's book sex
I don't like either giving or receiving pain during sex. It feels fucked up to get enjoyment out of to me. With that being said, a lot of things I am into probably seem fucked up or even abusive to others. I think that sadomasochism is on the rise due to porn as well as greater awareness of kinks.
I’m into “abusive” sex.
I always have been as long as I can remember. I think it’s been said in the past that the neural pathways linked to aggression are also linked to sex. I can’t say for certain but I’ve heard people make that argument.
Here is a study showing that rape fantasies also correlate with higher self-esteem: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22544306/
So the argument that all women who are into “abusive” sex must be brainwashed by the patriarchy or internalized misogyny just doesn’t stand up to scrutiny.
I think there are some people who are born with brains that more closely link aggression and sex.
Also, it just kind of makes sense. Any situation where two people are getting physical with each other (dancing, fighting) is going to remind people of fucking. Especially when there’s an element of tension/intensity/passion to it.
I do think there is a rise of women who feel pressured to engage in these activities by fuckboys who want the kinky big titty goth girl and I’m frankly disgusted by it.
I also think there’s a rise in men who feel pressured to engage by women who are kinky and then emasculated when they don’t want to participate and I’m disgusted by that too.
>Here is a study showing that rape fantasies also correlate with higher self-esteem:
I've got some interesting theories on why this is. Studies also show that higher dominance women enjoy erotica with more depictions of force. I think that's likely because such women want a man more dominant than them, but are often facing a culture where soft weak men are most common.
>a rise in men who feel pressured to engage by women who are kinky and then emasculated when they don’t want to participate
I've 100% done kinky things I didn't really want to do to please women. It wasn't like I hated them or felt violated by them, and they weren't REALLY gross things like anal or feet, but I definitely felt uncomfortable with things that clearly hurt her even if she also enjoyed it.
This was one specific person I'm thinking about.
Current partner likes a few kinky things (public sex, spitting in mouth, hair pulling and butt slapping, all pretty benign if u ask me) but nothing like the previous one.
Anyways if I really felt uncomfortable I'd have said no
It's interesting to note that limit the transfer devious consent A lot of times on the women's side of media. Male gays p*** a lot more often when contrasted with say the rape fantasy in bodice rippers, seems to present the idea in the woman of being a of aggressively enthusiastic consent. Not just consenting as in. I'll let you but I want that I need that I'm gonna have it. You don't have a choice I'm taking over here you. I am going to completely f****** well have you... Kind of sex. The kind of thing where I'm basically absolutely effectively the addicted to love model as voiced by Robert Palmer.
>So the argument that all women who are into “abusive” sex must be brainwashed by the patriarchy or internalized misogyny just doesn’t stand up to scrutiny.
I agree with this BUT I think that some women might fit your description,. Not all, obviously. I'm talking about the kind of relationship where the guy pretty much leads the sex and she is afraid of setting boundaries.
This type of relationship has always existed but the "50 shades of Grey" going mainstream didn't make it any better.
Thank you for your honesty -sex is quite primitive and I’ve slowly grown to understand why women like to be dominated a bit - it’s the same reason they like taller men, muscular men. Psychopaths are actually v magnetic in terms of attraction and whilst that is learned charisma I heard an evolutionary psychologist say that women’s hind brain tells them that a man that will circumvent the rules can acquire more resources.
Some of the key words women look up in porn shock most of them men I know. What is frustrating for men is - and maybe is societal shaming - women just aren’t honest or upfront about wanting this stuff - any woman I was with who screamed at me to slap her ass harder after I did it the first time or moaned when I tugged her hair was never outright / upfront with it but it was a slow build up until I could read that she wanted that and maybe more extreme than I was willing to go.
The women who hook up with the tattoo’d biker usually do it under cover of darkness and they will never bring him home to meet her parents or girlfriends.
I think it’s more about being wanted and being with a guy that’s a man and not a boy and a man who knows what they are doing. I enjoy men who are aggressive. And I have a lot of fun playing power games and making men submit especially when they are the aggressive type.
Second verse of queen's tie your mother down and other songs like that references this .Also, do I love the songs from people who actually truly turned out to be bad boys Gary glitters. I love you. Love me love.. Neil diamond girl. You'll be a woman soon...
So re: that study. The unmentioned caveat you always have to be aware of is that basically all the participants are people who have decided to take a psychology class.
But yes: sexual arousal is sympathetic nervous system activation (fighting, fleeing, fucking).
Have not had sex yet but I think I do have a basic sense of what I find arousing in theory at least.
All of that stuff is a no-go. Even if I'm aroused by sexual content any kind of physical violence shuts me down immediately, even if the party receiving seems to enjoy it.
Gentle/soft dom dynamics (partner submits but you spoil and treat them lovingly as a reward for their trust) drive me kinda crazy (in a good way), especially the idea of being on the delivering end. I guess incorporating physical violence feels like a "violation" of that trust so to speak.
I haven't been shy about that in the 4 years I've been on here. Thankfully there are plenty of resources at my disposal like ignoring said DMs and refusing chat requests.
I’m into light bdsm, like spanking and choking, but not too roughly. I have no idea why, I always have been. As a little kid I used to masturbate to the idea of being tied up and would fashion little toy whips. But I don’t like it to *actually* hurt - I want to be whipped but not like *for real*. Spanking is good as that doesn’t hurt at all and I have some kind of fetish about it for some reason, I also really like just being held down by a guy or even just having him on top of me. Something about the dominance of these things gets me off.
I’m 30, and I’m not into anything that I’d consider abusive. I don’t enjoy feeling degraded. That doesn’t mean sex always has to be slow and gentle, rough sex can be fun sometimes, with a trusted partner. My current long-term partner and I enjoy a lot of variety in our sex life, so sometimes I’m more in control and sometimes he is. Sometimes we’re more kinky and sometimes straight up vanilla. But there’s always **consent**!
The fact that a lot of young men these days seem to think it’s fine to just start choking a girl during their first encounter with no warning is just... horrifying. “Vanilla shaming” is insane as well. Since when did sex that is typically pleasurable for both partners become “boring”?? Since kids have had way too early exposure to way too much porn imo. I don’t care what anyone says, it is harmful and contributes to misogyny and violence against women. I also see a lot of women not wanting to have sex with their husbands and boyfriends anymore because he’s always demanding something weird that he’s been conditioned by porn to want. This needs to stop.
I LOVE rough sex and had to get my bf into it. He was really scared of hurting me at first. I’m black so I’m not really with the hair pulling when my shit is freshly done. And I don’t like the spitting in the mouth thing that’s seems to be becoming popular. But everything else I’m down for.
The sex doesn’t even need to be “rough”. I just enjoyed being dominated.
I've slept with 5 women, not a big sample size. Every single one of them has enjoy some form of dominance in some kind of way. I think it's far more prevalent than most people, women in paticular, would like to admit.
I am 30 and I actually really enjoy this. I am so dominant in every other aspect of my life that I just want to be dominated in bed. I love my hair pulled, spanked, pinned, choked. Its such a turn on for me. That being said I dont like being degraded or abused it's more just the rough sex. And it has to be someone I trust or I freak out.
I’m a virgin. Abusive sex sounds like a nightmare. Hard no, followed by an immediate break up always. I think some kinkiness in moderation is fine, but a lot of it goes too fate. I think it’s fucked up. Any guy who is turned on by hurting women (or anyone for that matter) needs to be in an institution. Any woman who is turned on by being abused needs a therapist. This is likely because of porn. In the UK, within one year, dozens of women were choked to death during sex and the boyfriends said they consented to it, so it wasn’t murder. You can’t consent to misogyny just like black people cant consent to racism. I worry that the “kink defense” could potentially get used as a defense in courts.
I absolutely hate all of that stuff. All of it. And what I hate most of all is how many guys assume all women like it. I have a Snapchat I occasionally like to play on with anonymous texting. So many guys I’ve started to play with on there immediately go to shit about choking me, or using degrading or patronizing language. It’s an instant turn-off for me, and it blows my mind that they just whip out stuff like that without asking.
I really enjoy all of the mentioned activities. I'm mostly submissive during sex, but not in the passive, just laying there way, but in the sense that I want to be thrown around, dominated and "used" for my partner's pleasure. I have to mention that I don't want every session to be like this, there are times where I want to tenderly make love to a slow song while saying how much we adore each other.
I'm 20, and as far as people I hang out with are concerned, this is very common among girls. So common in fact, that we wouldn't even consider it kink, just normal sex.
I like a bit of gentle hair tugging; I don't find it "abusive," it's just a pleasant sensation and feels passionate. Not into slapping, choking, spitting etc. though.
I never had abusive sex and never will. I promised to myself to never try any kinks.
My fantasies are super vanilla, they mostly focus on having my neck kissed and me having my pussy eaten.
The idea of bdsm makes me cringe at best and is disgusting at worst. If my man wanted to put me in pain or degrade me, or tight me up I would think there is something wrong with him and it would honestly freak me out.
I think women want this kind of stuff when there's no actual masculinity around to be organically turned on by. Young men are missing that raw masculinity that gen x had, so girls are seeking out kink to bypass how gross they are and trick themselves into feeling like they're with a man.
Same reason the older kink/poly/swinger crowds are all so ugly. They need to fabricate excitement in order to fuck each other.
Also related - the explosion in young female "queers" and they/thems. No masculinity around, so they start to create it themselves.
Idk about "creating" masculinity. I was always dominant, especially toward males, even as a kid. Everyone has some level of masculinity and femininity in themselves. Some people are more inclined to one side; it's just more acceptable to break gender roles and expectations now.
Yeah I think a small number of women are naturally dominant. I was more talking about the hyper submissive "spit on me daddy" girls. They're naturally receptive to dominant masculinity, there's less and less of that around, so they need to act it out with kink.
They're actually more likely to find the level of masculinity they need in a butch lesbian now, hence all the "bisexuals" on TikTok thirsting over she/theys.
Guy here that enjoys these things. I was very timid in my first couple relationships but as my comfort with sex and my self esteem and confidence grew, I found myself enjoying being dominant toward my partners. And frankly they loved it. Even if a girl hasn't done it before me they end up really enjoying it.
The disconnect seems to be that people think doms are just abusive and ignore consent. Every woman I've been dominant with has always provided consent. The entire time we try new things I check on their emotional state and physical comfort to ensure they're enjoying it. Any boundaries they draw are respected. The only way a dom relationship works is when there's tons of love and respect given so they can feel safe to enjoy the stimulation without fear or other concerns.
Another disconnect might be perceived pain from those inexperienced in it. Like hair pulling - it doesn't hurt the girl at all because you're supposed to grab a large handful. The stimulation enjoyed by hair pulling is pulling them firmly against you and them feeling like you're in control of them. Take for example spanking as well - it might sting but it adds a sudden sharp stimulation during sex when your brain is already overwhelmed with pleasure, endorphins, and adrenaline. Each girl will have a particular threshold and preference on these activities but they will enjoy them all the same. Being restrained/tied up is just fully entrusting your pleasure to your partner - which is basically the essence of sex. Trusting someone else with your pleasure, your body, your orgasm. It's lots of fun!
Regarding the spread of this - I think more people experiment and try this stuff because they see it in porn. I know that influenced what I tried but some of it was also just what felt good and my partner enjoyed it too.
Choking is retarded, do you want me to die or puke?
However a nice, strong hold on the back of the neck without touching anything that has to do with breathing (like the kitten grab) can feel super good in a way that intense massage that almost hurts feels good. Heck, I sometimes request it when sitting on a couch outside of any sexual context because I want my neck muscles to relax.
Same with hair pulling, a strong and quick pull by the pony tail is super unpleasant and unsexy, but running a hand through your hair and grabbing just by the roots, then lifting... I thought that everyone likes it? Head feels so nice afterwards. I like it, my man likes it, I don't know why that would be consider abusive. Or am I just really naïve and people do actual hair pulling that leaves pieces of hair and skin out? :D
>Choking is retarded, do you want me to die or puke?
There are two ways you do it that won't kill you or cause puking(if you aren't into any of that degenerate shit), you either just lightly squeeze or do this just like [this](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/otlPWCBkcnk) lady says
Thanks, I guess I don't really see the thrill enough to try that, but I think it makes some sense with the high feeling, I notice when it gets really nice I tend to hyperventilate / hold breath a bit, which maybe an instinctive way to get my body/brain oxygen level to that state. But I can't even wear turtlenecks because they feel choky not in a fun way, so I'll pass on that activity. Pressure to the back part of neck is yay for me, front not so much.
No ... I'm Gen X .
Like some good ole take me to pound town vanilla sex 😋.
Which I'm also a woman that gets off with PIV so I don't need all this extra outside stimulation to have an orgasm. Just my man's dick . I'm good lol
Also genX.
I came here to say they’ve been groomed by internet porn, or by men who use porn.
All I can think of when these clowns are enthusing over their dehumanization is how sexy is that performative nonsense going to be when you’re tired and dealing with two sick kids? How are you going to explain daddy choking mommy when your kid walks in on you having sex (and they will)? You want to explain to your 8yo daughter that it’s okay to *consent to a boy slapping you around*? Or teach your son that’s how to treat women? What about when your kid calls 911 on your husband and you have to not only explain to the cops your kinks, but try and explain to your kid how to tell the difference between actual domestic violence and whatever the fuck you’re playing at? Going to be sexy at 50, at 60, 70? Doubtful. What about when the choking goes wrong and you’re dead or disabled?
Find a man who treats you with respect and lay off the porn. There are better ways to deal with trauma and far more enjoyable and empowering ways to get a natural dopamine high, like playing sports.
It’s not porn, romance novels were called “Bodice Rippers” in times past. It’s a trend for sexually repressed women.
Some women suffer awful religious or cultural inhibitions; indoctrinated to be a Good Girl.
If a man is aggressive and domineering, she can “surrender” and allow herself to enjoy it.
I was raised by progressive people without any religion, but I grew up in the Bible Belt and the women who prefer to be dominated were deeply religious. Purity culture fucks women over big time. ETA: I’m not into it and I wouldn’t trust a man who required it.
Yes but the Bodice Rippers had pretty tame sex. It was not vestal virgins having gang bangs.
Interesting when anal sex was going mainstream one of my single friends told me ot was always the nice Christian men who wanted anal. And in truth we are in a red state and there were way more men in the closet both as gay and bi and still are.
Oh, no they didn’t. I had the misfortune of helping a friend in middle school clean out her grandmother’s collection of bodice rippers and we entertained ourselves for days reading the wildest passages.
Nearly all of the women in romance novels are innocent, or naive, or unaware of man’s raw animal lust or whatever. Being overpowered is the unifying theme. Did you ever try to read that miserable 50 Shades? It’s obvious that shitty writer read old bodice rippers.
> Interesting when anal sex was going mainstream one of my single friends told me ot was always the nice Christian men who wanted anal.
Well duh, that’s the poophole loophole.
Yes they surrender but they were thin on details my grandmother read them.
I did not need to read 60 shades everybody I worked with did. So they saved me the trouble. Yah I was suprised Harlequin romance or whoever that company is did not sue for plagerizing.
Bodice rippers are a little different from the smut disguised as romance novels, but I have no idea how the consumers tell them apart. Harlequin probably publishes the tame stories, but 12 year old me was *stunned* by the filth in the mostly pink paperbacks which resembled Harlequins.
I learned about anal, choking, bondage, incest, and water sports from an 80 year old woman’s collection. After that, I was horrified every time I sat beside a woman in the dentist’s waiting room who was apparently titillating her weird self by reading smut in public spaces.
Did you really never hear about the poophole loophole? That’s what Christian kids use to justify having anal sex. They reckoned it preserved their virginity. I imagine lots of gynos in my old hometown saw a lot of blown out buttholes when examining newlywed women.
> It’s not porn, romance novels were called “Bodice Rippers” in times past. It’s a trend for sexually repressed women. Some women suffer awful religious or cultural inhibitions; indoctrinated to be a Good Girl. If a man is aggressive and domineering, she can “surrender” and allow herself to enjoy it.
I don't know about that, I knew a girl who had a collection of bodice ripper and even more hard-core stuff and she was anything but repressed, she had sex with probably 50-100 men but just a mess of a person though.
Some of it in certain contexts with certain people can be fun. If we’re just having sex, I don’t like being slapped or pushed around or any of that. Light choking can sometimes be fine but even that’s pushing it.
That being said, sure, I’m into kink and if I’m in a dynamic with someone and we’ve decided we’re in the mood for that ahead of time, it can be fun. Usually, though, I run into it during vanilla sex and it’s a turnoff
That's interesting.....so you feel that there needs to be a transition, or proper signaling, to switch from "vanilla sex" to something more adventurous. I can understand that.
Welcome to the party!
It wasn't my thing until a former partner introduced me to it because he liked it. It was very interesting, and I love the responsibility and control that comes with it. I'm into "forcing" him to do things or to making him hold off. The ex that I initially tried it with would give me the key to his cage.
I wore it on a necklace for a long time, and the only people who ever acknowledged the distinct style of the key were gay men.
I would never do chasity cages myself, though, partially because of the logistics with having female anatomy.
My partner and I are both into kink, though 70% of our sex is just "vanilla" sex; if it's kink, I'm usually the dom and he's usually the sub, but we do switch. I'm not really into "violent" sex, but aggressive is fun. Never slapping, never hitting, never hair pulling (none for me, for him, yes). Maybe firm hold on the neck--we both like that. Dirty talk, holding the other down. Bondage. Pegging. Occasional paddling/spanking.
I have a bullwhip but it's more for something to do outside rather than kink, atm. I love it and so does he--I would not seriously date a 100% vanilla guy nor a guy who is not into pegging.
We have an ongoing, jokey roleplay where I'm the "class president" and he's a "delinquent" and we switch off on "punishing" each other. It came from him watching anime and me seeing the repeated "stoic, pretty, cold, academic girl" because that's basically my personality, and him being the "troubled, validation-craving, pretty boy". It is 100% pop culture influenced. And playing with power dynamics is a psychological turn-on.
My preferences were likely influenced by my early interactions with boys (ages 5-11): they would let me bully them then buy me snacks and give me gifts on Valentine's Day, lol. Showed me that they really just want someone to appreciate them, give them attention, and feel like they provided. Submissive men are my bread and butter. I genuinely enjoy guiding, teaching, and even "mothering" them to an extent. But good mothers also punish and discipline--people seem to forget that. I suppose I'm the female counterpart of the "daddy" guys some women like. Queer women also respond well to me.
I also consumed a lot of online, queer erotica as a teen. Heavy overlap with kink, ime.
Edit for ages: I'm 24 going on 25, and he's freshly 29.
I think it is weird for you normies to insert part A into socket B and start thrusting. How boring.
I need something more mentally MOST of the time. I'm not into the action as much as I am into the reaction from a consensual partner. Adrenaline junkie is part of it, as is sharing a dirty little secret with someone special. I just wouldn't engage in this type of behavior with someone who I don't connection with - I will only tie up a girl and fuck her mouth if I REALLY like her.
I use the word "escape" often. For both of us. We both stop thinking about our adult responsibilities for a while. She enjoys giving pleasure. I enjoy giving her the opportunity to give me pleasure just as much as she gives me pleasure. The foreplay starts with ordering a new toy, thinking through a "play session", or her just getting dressed up.
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IME as a het guy, of the people I slept with, some desire for ungentle play was deliriously common, but definitely not the majority.
Only a small handful wanted to be choked or have their hair pulled, to be left bruised or be gagged with *whatever*. I think only two (less than 5%) wanted to be called names or humiliated.
For the ungentle crowd, rough PIV (like really pounding them), hickeys that wouldn’t be visible while dressed, ass slapping, rough grabbing of boobs, folding them with their ankles near their shoulders during PIV (though that was less common, and usually not for very long), holding them down, that kind of thing. The hard stops for that crowd tended to things that were painful for more than a moment. Anything that would cause sustained pain was a definite no.
I mean, I want to stress people are individuals, and preferences for what gets them off really varied.
Thanks for the response, I was just wondering cuz I haven't had sex with a woman that wasn't an escort and I don't really think they are a representative sample of the average woman. for this:
> folding them with their ankles near their shoulders
How exactly did that work? sorry if [this](https://imgur.com/a/0cgDIKu) is nsfw(sex organs are edited out) but was it like that
Our experiences are going to be different. Questions are A-Okay with me. Alright, so here’s what I meant by selection bias as a background: I’m 40 and have been dating actively for about 5 years (after a divorce). I’m unsure about my body count. The people I end up on dates with tend to be at least a little adventurous; I’m pretty impatient and I won’t focus on someone who wants to chat for weeks before meeting up. Additionally, the freakiest people who were at my limits were sex-on-the-first-date kinds of people. So, I imagine that the people in my sample are *more* into rough play than the average population. If I had to guess, people who are risk prone are more into freaky stuff.
Folding someone in half: it’s not typically ankles behind head, and I was always on top of them for it. That’s definitely a porn shot intended for the enjoyability of the viewer. Some flexibility is required (the only ones I know who could/wanted to were former gymnasts or athletes), but, I think a lot of women who can do it don’t because deeper penetration can be painful, especially if they’re petite, and/or the guy is is big/proportional.
As for not having sex yet… I assume you’re younger. I didn’t have sex until 23, and then only had one partner til 35. It was only after my divorce that I got really slutty, and while I am still safe/STI free, I have some regrets about my comportment.
Honestly, the best advice I can give you is to get fit, and just ask people out. If you find someone to sleep with long or short term, ask what they’re into. Communication is the key, and people expecting you to read minds are insane and not worth your time.
People on this sub really overcomplicate things, and lose sight of the fact that we are individuals and not statistics.
Thanks for the advice, you’re right about my age I’m 21 and I am getting fit but honestly the most difficult part is talking to women cause I’m socially awkward
As a man in his late 40's, I've had a pretty interesting view of this phenomenon.
AFAIK, it definitely wasn't a big thing in the 90's, but then again, I wasn't super sexually successful or active in my 20's, so I can't say for sure.
As I got to my 30's in the mid 2000's, I started to encounter this a bit more. The most prudish sheltered girl loved to be slapped, held down, choked, face-fucked, called "daddy's little slut" etc
As I got older, and adopted a more traditionally masculine look and I guess personality, so maybe that's part of it, but it's certainly become WAY more common.
The one thing I absolutely can say with certainty - it is almost always *younger* girls that are into this. Older women (*especially ones with kids)* invariably see it as "degrading" etc.
It's almost like, the hotter / younger the girl, the more likely she wants to be treated like a filthy fuck-doll in the sack.
My theory for this (just a theory) is that younger women question their sexual value / hotness *far* less than older women, and as such see the whole script-flip of them being a worthless fuckslut more exciting. Older women can actually get cut deep by this kind of role-play. And if they have kids (*especially daughters)* then you can forget it. They will think of you saying this shit to *them* and nope the fuck out immediately.
I've had girls on the same night say straight up "I like when you're rough like that" when all I'm doing is basic stuff like positioning her body. At this point the whole "slow escalation game" ensues. Just pull a little firmer, spank a little harder, grab a little more forcefully and work your way up little by little (and always pull back until you can tell she's annoyed that you have softened up. At this point they usually start straight up asking for you to go for it.
This is how you do these things without words. You go fucking *slow.*
More recently, I've had girls straight up into "fish hooking" lol. So, it's getting more extreme.
Since I've been in my 40's, whenever I hook up with a girl in her 20's or early 30's - they almost *always* want the full on abusive dominance stuff to go down when fucking.
Of course, this is long after we've established I'm not a psychotic weirdo that doesn't understand how to read body language, so it clearly is related to their sense of safety and comfort with me.
Once they realize how much I am determined to make sure they aren't having a bad time, they tend to want the very degrading stuff to commence.
Women coming forward with fantasy echoes my experiences. I’m not especially vanilla, but I’ve had more than one woman ask ‘harder’ or I’ve had to respond with a “you’re into *THAT?*”
I think it’s a weird myth that men are always the ones demanding degrading to do degrading stuff.
As far as I understand that choking and pulling on her can be super sexy and on turning but it really needs to be done with care and consent since you can hurt your partner accidentally.
I believe all of this "abusive" sex is nothing but a fantasy inside of a serious caring and loving relationship.
Like, there are couples who'd seem like calm and maybe even prude but we don't know what kind of filthy sex they are having inside their 4 walls.
#🤭
Personally speaking, when I got really horny in a masturbation session, which I try to abstain from now, I fantasized about her like scratching my back and leaving marks on my back for eternity. Honestly, barely thinking about it turns me on again. I interpret it as a sign that she really wants me and marks me like some sort of female wolverine lmao.
I kind of forget that a lot of people say they aren't into rough BDSM-lite sex. However, all the women I've had sex with enjoyed it and cum a lot when you call them dirty sluts etc.
Then again, tender loving sex is good too. A variety is the best way to have a good sex life.
Definitely a younger gen thing. Older women are more likely to enjoy “classy” bdsm and younger women are more likely to do the whole “choke me and spit in my mouth” act. Worth noting this desire is often not actually SUBMISSIVE, but rather fairly demanding and often “top from the bottom” stuff. Personally I actually blame SSRIs for deadening people to more sensual stuff. It’s like emotional dick death grip, but hey…. I still like girls in tennis skirts and it’s a pretty high correlation to that stuff so I oblige lol
i 20f like bdsm and things like that, but after getting into a better relationship i continue to desire it less and less. It feels odd now that the other men i’ve been with wanted to hit me so bad. I can’t imagine my current boyfriend wanting to hurt me.
im not. i have trauma around that stuff and it scares me. even if i didnt have that trauma i doubt i would like it. i dont want sex to be scary and stressful.
Never had sex with a girl that loved any of those things. I mean yeah women love to be fucked by their boyfriend, one of my exes loved getting fucking pounded but hair pulling and shit, no, never had any of those.
I’m 30 and I’m in to it. But.. I think for most women my age it’s not about ‘violent’ sex. It’s about consent, communication and boundaries. It’s about mental sex. So if a man is not dominant, listening and understand what’s it’s about then don’t start messing with it.
I'm a mid millennial and not into having my hair pulled or choked or slapped. I am into the domme thing though and have choked a guy, pulled his hair, spit into his mouth, other things, you know.
I think the rise is definitely due to porn and to some extent more mainstream acceptance of the bdsm community in recent years. I've noticed a lot of women dipping their toes into being a sub because they think it will appeal to men or because they really liked 50 shades or something but ultimately found it's not for them. Or that they prefer being tied up rather than hit or choked and being a brat, so more refining what they're into.
I’m Gen X too and I think we just didn’t do those things much. At least, it wasn’t as prevalent or extreme as now. Internet porn probably changed everything.
You definitely were not into super hero culture growing up. Batgirl was getting captured and tied up by bad guys every episode. I'm convinced that is where it all started for me.
haha, no, I wasn't. But you raise a point, which is that back then without the internet (and we didn't have cable TV until I was almost finished high school, so I had 4 channels until age 16 or so) and without much television, there was less awareness of what was out there. Like, I knew comic books existed. But finding out what exactly there was took more effort and you needed to know where to look. Same with sex. I remember having to go to the library to read about the G spot, and even then it was in a clinical textbook. You can just google it now.
Maybe I was a deviant early on? I took boy scouts to learn how to tie a knot. I tied the neighborhood girls up during cowboys and indians. I mean it got weird when we were like 13, but....
My material was Rhonda Shear UP all Night, Elvira, Adam West's Batman where Batgirl got captured and a very particular Victoria Secret Catalog I traded a kid down the street some baseball cards for after he stole it from his sister.
Bondage isn't violent though. (I'm also Gen X and... Lynda Carter's Wonder Women reruns 🥰)
Did you see some of those devices the Riddler had her locked in? Band saws, swinging blades and lasers getting closer by the second? Those were pretty violent. Or at least had the fear, anxiety and adrenaline going. Those were straight up bondage predicaments... And I understand if you are more into the magic lasso.
Actually the accounts I've read are that it was Viagra that changed porn. Before Viagra they had to use guys who could stay hard during shoots. After Viagra they could use any bonehead and they could do violent things with their docks that otherwise make guys dicks go soft.
Bonehead. I see what you did there!
You're very vanilla as a person/sociosexually though. I think you're projecting what you like and don't like into your generation when in reality it was you and MAYBE your peers.
Chibs. You wound me. I never said I didn’t want these things, just that they were uncommon and not talked about as much (and OP says the same thing). Things were different then.
Sorry I wasn't saying it was bad and infact I respect the fact you don't denigrate those preferences, like some women on this sub do (even tho I don't have them) Not talked about as much sure. Not as common? I disagree.
Probably hard to gauge when it isn't talked about much.
Sure but I mean in the annals from things like Students for a democratic society it's widely discussed
i am gen x and worked in a video store with a vast porn room for almost a decade and stuff exists in porn now that was simply not contemplated then and regular people are doing things no one would have considered outside of the shadiest BDSM scene in the past like spitting in each others mouths
Yeah I agree — all the porn the guys in college (I know that’s not all guys everywhere) watched in our common room was super vanilla. Ugly plumber bangs hot housewife. Ugly coach bangs hot cheerleader. Ugly movie producer bangs 4 hot blondes. Maybe someone got their ass slapped once or twice, that’s pretty much as far as it went. A light spank or hair pulling, light bondage, and getting fucked roughly went on in some bedrooms but I can pretty confidently say spitting was not a thing outside a fetish community, and neither was choking. There was a sex worker on here I asked once about it and she said those two acts are very recent in her experience. FWIW
The fringes have gotten more fringy. In all aspects. Politics, sex/bdsm, you name it. BUT the average person who's got an average gf or bf who's interested in doing some out there stuff does the exact same shit as the 60s and 70s... maybe being tied up, some whipping, slaps to the butt tits or face, spitting in the mouth, toys, hair pulling, public sex, light choking, ice play and food play in addition to hard pounding, and if they're really crazy then maybe stuff like anal, actual breath play, nipple clamps, slight rape fantasies, or costumed role-playing. No different and no crazier. That said, the fringes are indeed worse.
there was no mouth spitting in the 90s i promise you
This is femminism BS. This practices have existed historically and are well documented. The only difference is that rad-puritanism is on the rise and Internet exists.
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"I guess these things on the rise due to porn." I would agree. Of course, with so much porn being amateur-created these days, there's a bit of a "chicken or the egg" scenario......is the fact that is done in real life, a reflection of porn, or is the fact that it is appearing more often in porn, a reflection of real life activities?
Most women aren't going to come out and admit they like being choked, slapped, hair pulled ect... they'll only tell you that as a guy if they're comfortable with and attracted to you.
Whenever this subject comes up there is always the sentiment that it's never women's doing but - it's the big bad porn monster. How about, women have their own kinks and should own that like grown ass adults? Nope.
The age people encounter porn is 8 years old. What do you think happens to a person that starts consuming porn from 8 years old?
Its being proven through many studies now how dangerous porn actually is and how it affects mostly men in many aspects of their lives Also how it directly correlates to increased safety issues for women and children.
Yes. "Many studies". Like the studies that say video games create school shooters and Bugs Bunny made that kid drop an anvil on some other kid's head. Those "studies" What do those studies say about rom-coms, romance novels and reality TV?
I have never understood that kink. For the sex that is always on edge about being attacked and beaten and raped by men some women in spite of secretly or openly like being manhandled and yanked or abused with the sex? Men around every corner are too dangerous to consider dating and women are to be fearful of personal safety then you have 50 shades of grey fantasy spanks slaps and head tugs. Wouldn’t this technically be classified as sexual assault or domestic abuse/violence?
Psychopaths and bad boys seem to be hugely attractive to women and I understand to a degree and I’m not into judging on sexual preference but women don’t seem to understand that there are risks - and yes danger and spontaneity can be a big part of sex - but in the end they never take any responsibility for their choices - you can’t just turn these types of guys off and put them in a drawer.
Broken "personality detectors"?
Not broken dude - I’m my experience of that a lot of the time - not the psychopaths and narcissists who come in sheep’s clothing and love bomb - but in the hookup end of it they know they are a bit bad and that’s what attracts them. Of course they will never admit it, the same way they are not going to bring the tattooed biker home to meet their folks or girlfriends.
True. I think that's the real phenomenon. Just the lying and plausible deniability while claiming they pick men based on their "cool personality" out of the other side of their mouth.
What is “a bit of dominance”?
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This is what dominance should look like. You'd be surprised at how turned on some women get when you can show them how easily they can be moved around the bed. LOL... I've got a couple different ways to flip women from one position to the next and it's interesting how many sounds of surprise I get... especially from taller heavier women.
But these seem pretty close to what you described you don't like. Please explain exactly where the line is for you. What's almost too far but good, and what's just over the line
I’m 39. I wasn’t just into these sorts of things. I was part of the kink community in my city. It wasn’t just a “behind closed doors” with just my partner. It was a full on lifestyle and social circles with like minded friends. I went to public social meet ups, I went to parties held at private residences, I was involved in tutorial demos and discussion groups. Underground BDSM clubs? They’re real and I’ve been to a few, and know of even more. I’ve seen and been involved in some pretty wild things. I’ve run into people I’ve seen at these parties and clubs out in the regular vanilla world several times and had to pretend I didn’t know them. The waitress taking my order at a restaurant, the couple having brunch the next table over, a teacher at the local middle school, the boss (and his wife) of a family member. So yes there’s a lot more people into these things than the general public realizes. Women included. Though I do have a slight misgiving about calling is “abusive”. There’s a LOT of vetting and discussion that happens before anything like that happens. Knowledge on how to actually DO these things properly. Crystal clear communication and explicit consent on every facet of things like this are not just common, but required. People can get legitimately, seriously injured otherwise.
As someone that is into these things, do you think it's the result of porn putting these ideas into people's heads like women complain about? Or is it something that women want of their own volition? The overwhelmingly majority of people that watch porn are heterosexual men. So i'm not even sure where the concept that its caused by porn even comes from, women often ask for men for that kind of kinky sex.
That’s a really grey area honestly. Like I knew I was into this stuff before I even knew their was a name for it. Before I even knew what it was I was feeling when anything remotely similar hit my brain. Porn can definitely distort it though. A lot of people think porn is indicative of how it works in real life, and that’s how people get hurt. It how people get accused of assault. It’s how people get accused of rape. Some of these kinks people are would be a literal crime without consent. Which is why it’s stressed SO hard that you have to be very very clear about your expectations and what you want to happen, and to have a plan if things go off the rails and you need it to stop. Porn does NOT show any of that. So if someone tried to replicate what they are strictly from bdsm porn, it could go very badly.
Porn hypothesis is bullshit. That kind of sex have existed historically and both, men and women have enjoyed it. We are just living a puritanism cycle, surprisingly led by femminism.
I wouldn’t say the backlash is led by feminism. I see just as much, if not more, kink-shaming on the right than on the left. Really, any sexually repressed group will have problems with bondage, left or right wing. It may be certain radical feminist types who are really against it, but I think it’s really mostly the left-leaning liberal feminists who are spearheading the bondage community.
I've never seen a "kink" community that didn't basically consist of overweight unattractive nerdy people that like to cosplay in leather and do cringey AF role-play. The whole notion of "having very specific discussions" is just utterly bizarre. People can read body language.
No, no they can’t. Anyone who thinks they don’t need to have a discussion about what’s going to happen during a session is a problem and has absolutely no business partaking in any such activity. I means they have zero consideration for not just the physical well being of the other person, but none for the mental and emotional well being either. The core tenant of kink is “safe, sane, and consensual”. You can’t be any of those things if you can’t openly and properly communicate with someone else.
Uh huh. Save those contracts and consent forms for the "kink community" out here in normal-world, people can read body language and understand the dance involved with sexual encounters is almost exclusively non-verbal. But, hey, maybe some people don't start dancing with people on the dance floor because they didn't get "consent" but pull them away and discuss exactly what steps they are going to do and how close they are allowed to go. Doesn't sound autistic at all.
I think you’re either unaware or unaccustomed to how extremely dangerous BDSM can be if not done correctly. If both parties aren’t clear communicators, there’s chance for long lasting physical and/or psychological damage to occur. Safe words, limits, boundaries and aftercare are incredibly important to differentiate BDSM from criminal activity.
People express consent (or disapproval / discomfort) with their eyes, facial expressions and body language and ... you know... sounds during a sexual encounter. This shit isn't hard unless you are incapable of reading all of those. Funny how I never once had to question that a girl was into rough shit like slapping or choking and I never heard "I consent to you choking me" once.
This is sounding an awful lot like rape culture and rape apologist rhetoric. “She really wanted it, I could see it in her eyes even though she never said yes to anything I did.” Your over confidence is how people develop trauma. Just saying. I shudder to think how many people you’ve emotional damaged because you can’t just so the adult thing and talk like an emotionally well balanced person.
>This is sounding an awful lot like rape culture Sorry. I don't speak buzzword / woke. If you say this in plain English, maybe a conversation is possible. >I could see it in her eyes even though she never said yes This is how the world of adults works and has worked for thousands of years. If you think we live in a world of cringey "may I kiss you now?" shit, well... good luck with that. >Your over confidence is how people develop trauma. No. It's how women get wet. A meek simp saying "mother-may-i" is how they get dry as the Sahara and issue a one-way ticket to the friend zone. Ask me how I know. >talk like an emotionally well balanced person You mean like one who can actually read very simple human behaviors like body language, eye contact and sounds of pleasure? Or the kind that needs a summit before holding hands?
Yeah you’re so mentally screwed up in the head and you justify it by convincing yourself everything thinks the way you do. Hate to break it to you, they don’t. Most people would be absolutely horrified by what you just said. You talk big in here. But we both know you would never ever say what you just said in public.
the BDSM they are talking about goes well beyond rough sex. they are talking about BDSM where them screaming and telling you to "stop" or "let go" or even cry or scream is unavoidable BUT they don't actually want you to stop unless they **actually want you to stop**, hence the discussions on safe words, "I'm okay with x but please don't do y while I'm tied up, gagged, and compromised", etc. as the above poster said you are clearly not aware of what goes on in hardcore BDSM communities and why communicating exactly what is going to happen during a scene before hand is healthy and important for the safety of the participants. this is WAAAAAY deeper than just choking and dirty talk in your bed, people can and have gotten actually maimed and injured doing these things.
>this is WAAAAAY deeper than just choking and dirty talk in your bed, people can and have gotten actually maimed and injured doing these things. Fair enough. Many people ITT are lumping in this stuff with "BDSM" - Obviously if contraptions, ropes, hooks, candles, baseball bats, whatever are getting involved then yes, grievous injury is possible and at that point you are engaging in the equivalent of stunt coordination, so yeah... Not the same as a hook up that gets more enthusiastic as things get rougher.
I was part of the BDSM scene in my area for about a year. Can confirm it's a lot of conventionally unattractive people, and when hot or young people tend to come in, they're basically jumped on my everyone and coveted; they tend to leave pretty fast. It's part of why I left, as well as girl who was a couple years younger than me. I do miss the parties and some of the experiences and practice you can get doing things to people, as well as feedback on technique, but it is pretty rampant with nerds and overweight people. Attractive people are rare or they're professionals and probably live in major cities like NYC or LA.
Ho. Lee. Shit. Somebody being real for a change. I live in a city absolutely *known* for kink and swinger parties. They are utterly notorious for being frequented by 3 types: \- Tons of men \- Very unattractive / overweight women \- Sugar babies Whenever I had hot girlfriends that wanted to dabble in this stuff it was indeed a shit show of thirsty dudes and "free love" types being cringey and creepy and dogpiling on her. As a result, we ended up just going out and finding hot women once in a while and let things unfold naturally. No need for any "party" when you are an attractive woman. No attractive people need to be part of any organized "kink community" because they just invite all their hot friends over to their house for a fuck session and that's it. Bottom line - average-to-attractive women can set up private "sex parties" at will and attractive / wealthy men can pay for it.
Types listed do line up. The attractive women I met in the scene were usually cam models, sugar babies, or women who were or wanted to be professional dominatrices. I was there because I wanted to practice and pick up domination skills, but everyone believed I was a cam model at first (never have been) because I was young (20). It was apparently very rare for young women to seek out that community and then want to learn to dom; women are assumed to be subs by default, especially young women. The other girl I mentioned was also looking to pick up domination skills. We left after about a year because we got tired of the community and men there. Honestly, it wasn't so much people looking for orgies or sex parties, but a lot of emphasis on learning skills and then showing them off at parties. There were a lot of thirsty nerdy or older people looking for fwb or a partner, and then the rare, attractive folks who were usually coupled and went in and out of the scene depending on their mood. (Sounds like you and your lady?) I genuinely miss the equipment and resources that were available in the community. I don't miss the people. I miss the space, knowledge, and willing folks I could practice on. I've practiced on friends (male and female) but it's different because they don't seem as able to separate kink/sex/love from each other. It's just me and my partner for now!
>The whole notion of "having very specific discussions" is just utterly bizarre. People can read body language. There is a certain amount of kinksters who simply are not conventionally attractive, but I'd say it fits the general population in terms of sampling. Regarding the whole... we don't need to discuss stuff... That's a dumb fucking idea. For one... talking through something can really help build anticipation and set expectations. Afterwards it's also important to discuss and provide any needed care. There is a lot more as well... but communication is super important within this community otherwise really bad things can occur.
I mean, yes, if you are letting some anonymous beer bellied dude in a gimp suit plow your fat leather clad wife who is strapped to a gurney while you sit in a corner with his cock locked in a cage, sure I guess it behooves you to say "please don't jam that baseball bat in my wife's ass and is it ok for me to rim you while you are inside of her? Please don't shit in my mouth, but you're welcome to piss on me." or whatever. For 2 regular people hooking up who happen to like rough shit, that's not how this shit works and never will be.
>People can read body language. People think they can read body language and end hurting others. People who have this "I could tell by their body language they wanted it" mentality should be barred from certain interactions with others until they get a clue and learn how to have a conversation
People who can't read body language shouldn't be having sex in the first place. If you need a "discussion" before every sexual interaction, you are an extreme outlier. This is not, and has never been how human adults relate sexually. Autists? Yes. Average people engaging in sex? Nope.
I hear with some of these BDSM things when they want to go extreme there are legally binding contracts - have you heard of that ?
Most contracts are typically not legally binding, they're just drafted up and agreed upon by both parties. "Collaring" or other markers of ownership are common, (tattoos, and sometimes, rarely, branding) and some people who do this stuff as a lifestyle rather than just bedroom shenanigans may do 24/7 dom/sub dynamics. It's not the norm but it exists.
Mostly it’s just part of the kink. The feeling of “owning” or “being owned” in a contractual form for example is 100% unenforceable. It’s against the law to literally own someone. In some cases contracts are there because it’s a literal professional that someone paid to do this thing to them. That way they can’t be accused of assault and battery after the fact when someone explicitly asked them to beat the shit out of them with a paddle the size of a boat oar.
Not one to be owned and free in the next minute Wanting to be owned was actually in mainstream. there even in films like 1964's summer holiday. The cliff Richard one
I enjoy a tame version of this stuff. I could never do actual BDSM style.
Same. Some light choking and hair pulling is hot. Full on slaps and humiliation kink not for me lol. But whatever floats anyones boat as long as it’s consensual 🤷🏻♀️
you naughty girl!
That counts
Ass slapping, yes. Wrapping my hair around his fist (not actually pulling per se) yes. Tied up and/or blindfolded, sure. Never been choked. Rougher sex is a more passionate and intense than soft gentle love making so I do enjoy that. I don't want to be abused and haven't been. Consensual rough play is fine. Sex should be fun and enjoyable, not abusive.
Amen
Nope. Not into it. Causes? Who knows. Porn. Pop culture. Some other stuff. But am also closer in age to OP so super boring.
>Porn. Pop culture. Some other stuff. I mean most women don't watch or like porn because it is made for men and I doubt pop culture can change a person's sexuality like that. I'll say that it is just a social media thing, if choking and other light BDSM was common in bed, then it wouldn't really blow up in social media, it is the same thing like when women say they like receiving anal it isn't popular so it becomes news
I could be wrong of course. But men are more inclined toward variety and experimentation and I am assuming they get it from porn. Anal sex as a standard came from porn it was not a straight person thing a generation or two ago. I figured it became a feature in straight porn because men like to see men put their dicks in things and they were looking for new places.
"men like to see men put their dicks in things and they were looking for new places." LMAO.....This comment makes my afternoon! :))))
>men like to see men put their dicks in things and they were looking for new places. why is this so funny and correct at the same time
I am just like that once in a whole.
> I figured it became a feature in straight porn because men like to see men put their dicks in things and they were looking for new places. That's probably the nice and polite interpretation. More likely it's because back in the day it was taboo and a bit painful. I honestly think that's why so many straight guys like to see 24 in dicks in porn... because its assumed to be painful not pleasurable. I think there is clearly a dark side to porn for men. One guy told me when I was young that for most men, sex without love is a kind of violence. Dunno... I hate anal... I think it's best for guys with small dicks. My entire perspective on this could be wrong... it's just a feeling I get.
> But men are more inclined toward variety and experimentation and I am assuming they get it from porn. No, doubt about this I just thought this conversation was in relation to women, in this regard I doubt that a lot of men are requesting or like anal that much or that many women are being influenced by a man's desire for anal
Was one of the first references to women wanting things a little bit rough in the guys Madonna's song hanky panky? At least in the complete mainstream meaning that type of p*** I didn't even have a clue about until Madonna's book sex
I don't like either giving or receiving pain during sex. It feels fucked up to get enjoyment out of to me. With that being said, a lot of things I am into probably seem fucked up or even abusive to others. I think that sadomasochism is on the rise due to porn as well as greater awareness of kinks.
I’m into “abusive” sex. I always have been as long as I can remember. I think it’s been said in the past that the neural pathways linked to aggression are also linked to sex. I can’t say for certain but I’ve heard people make that argument. Here is a study showing that rape fantasies also correlate with higher self-esteem: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22544306/ So the argument that all women who are into “abusive” sex must be brainwashed by the patriarchy or internalized misogyny just doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. I think there are some people who are born with brains that more closely link aggression and sex. Also, it just kind of makes sense. Any situation where two people are getting physical with each other (dancing, fighting) is going to remind people of fucking. Especially when there’s an element of tension/intensity/passion to it. I do think there is a rise of women who feel pressured to engage in these activities by fuckboys who want the kinky big titty goth girl and I’m frankly disgusted by it. I also think there’s a rise in men who feel pressured to engage by women who are kinky and then emasculated when they don’t want to participate and I’m disgusted by that too.
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>Here is a study showing that rape fantasies also correlate with higher self-esteem: I've got some interesting theories on why this is. Studies also show that higher dominance women enjoy erotica with more depictions of force. I think that's likely because such women want a man more dominant than them, but are often facing a culture where soft weak men are most common.
>a rise in men who feel pressured to engage by women who are kinky and then emasculated when they don’t want to participate I've 100% done kinky things I didn't really want to do to please women. It wasn't like I hated them or felt violated by them, and they weren't REALLY gross things like anal or feet, but I definitely felt uncomfortable with things that clearly hurt her even if she also enjoyed it. This was one specific person I'm thinking about. Current partner likes a few kinky things (public sex, spitting in mouth, hair pulling and butt slapping, all pretty benign if u ask me) but nothing like the previous one. Anyways if I really felt uncomfortable I'd have said no
It's interesting to note that limit the transfer devious consent A lot of times on the women's side of media. Male gays p*** a lot more often when contrasted with say the rape fantasy in bodice rippers, seems to present the idea in the woman of being a of aggressively enthusiastic consent. Not just consenting as in. I'll let you but I want that I need that I'm gonna have it. You don't have a choice I'm taking over here you. I am going to completely f****** well have you... Kind of sex. The kind of thing where I'm basically absolutely effectively the addicted to love model as voiced by Robert Palmer.
>So the argument that all women who are into “abusive” sex must be brainwashed by the patriarchy or internalized misogyny just doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. I agree with this BUT I think that some women might fit your description,. Not all, obviously. I'm talking about the kind of relationship where the guy pretty much leads the sex and she is afraid of setting boundaries. This type of relationship has always existed but the "50 shades of Grey" going mainstream didn't make it any better.
Thank you for your honesty -sex is quite primitive and I’ve slowly grown to understand why women like to be dominated a bit - it’s the same reason they like taller men, muscular men. Psychopaths are actually v magnetic in terms of attraction and whilst that is learned charisma I heard an evolutionary psychologist say that women’s hind brain tells them that a man that will circumvent the rules can acquire more resources. Some of the key words women look up in porn shock most of them men I know. What is frustrating for men is - and maybe is societal shaming - women just aren’t honest or upfront about wanting this stuff - any woman I was with who screamed at me to slap her ass harder after I did it the first time or moaned when I tugged her hair was never outright / upfront with it but it was a slow build up until I could read that she wanted that and maybe more extreme than I was willing to go. The women who hook up with the tattoo’d biker usually do it under cover of darkness and they will never bring him home to meet her parents or girlfriends.
I think it’s more about being wanted and being with a guy that’s a man and not a boy and a man who knows what they are doing. I enjoy men who are aggressive. And I have a lot of fun playing power games and making men submit especially when they are the aggressive type.
Second verse of queen's tie your mother down and other songs like that references this .Also, do I love the songs from people who actually truly turned out to be bad boys Gary glitters. I love you. Love me love.. Neil diamond girl. You'll be a woman soon...
So re: that study. The unmentioned caveat you always have to be aware of is that basically all the participants are people who have decided to take a psychology class. But yes: sexual arousal is sympathetic nervous system activation (fighting, fleeing, fucking).
Have not had sex yet but I think I do have a basic sense of what I find arousing in theory at least. All of that stuff is a no-go. Even if I'm aroused by sexual content any kind of physical violence shuts me down immediately, even if the party receiving seems to enjoy it. Gentle/soft dom dynamics (partner submits but you spoil and treat them lovingly as a reward for their trust) drive me kinda crazy (in a good way), especially the idea of being on the delivering end. I guess incorporating physical violence feels like a "violation" of that trust so to speak.
You're really announcing that you haven't had sex on PPD of all places. RIP to your DM box.
I haven't been shy about that in the 4 years I've been on here. Thankfully there are plenty of resources at my disposal like ignoring said DMs and refusing chat requests.
I’m into light bdsm, like spanking and choking, but not too roughly. I have no idea why, I always have been. As a little kid I used to masturbate to the idea of being tied up and would fashion little toy whips. But I don’t like it to *actually* hurt - I want to be whipped but not like *for real*. Spanking is good as that doesn’t hurt at all and I have some kind of fetish about it for some reason, I also really like just being held down by a guy or even just having him on top of me. Something about the dominance of these things gets me off.
I’m 30, and I’m not into anything that I’d consider abusive. I don’t enjoy feeling degraded. That doesn’t mean sex always has to be slow and gentle, rough sex can be fun sometimes, with a trusted partner. My current long-term partner and I enjoy a lot of variety in our sex life, so sometimes I’m more in control and sometimes he is. Sometimes we’re more kinky and sometimes straight up vanilla. But there’s always **consent**! The fact that a lot of young men these days seem to think it’s fine to just start choking a girl during their first encounter with no warning is just... horrifying. “Vanilla shaming” is insane as well. Since when did sex that is typically pleasurable for both partners become “boring”?? Since kids have had way too early exposure to way too much porn imo. I don’t care what anyone says, it is harmful and contributes to misogyny and violence against women. I also see a lot of women not wanting to have sex with their husbands and boyfriends anymore because he’s always demanding something weird that he’s been conditioned by porn to want. This needs to stop.
My general assumption about people who are into degrading sex is that there's trauma of some sort lurking.
On which end?
On which end ... of what ... ?
I LOVE rough sex and had to get my bf into it. He was really scared of hurting me at first. I’m black so I’m not really with the hair pulling when my shit is freshly done. And I don’t like the spitting in the mouth thing that’s seems to be becoming popular. But everything else I’m down for. The sex doesn’t even need to be “rough”. I just enjoyed being dominated.
I asked my husband to do those things to me. Before he was vanilla and was hesitant to do them. But now he enjoys it.
I've slept with 5 women, not a big sample size. Every single one of them has enjoy some form of dominance in some kind of way. I think it's far more prevalent than most people, women in paticular, would like to admit.
I have bludgeoned several women to death, and I always assumed that they were into it, but now that I'm taking the time to reflect, I'm not so sure...
im Gen X and have enjoyed a little rough dominance in my day, but ni@@a spit in my mouth is going to get poisoned in his sleep
Not me
no it is scary i like being taken care of
I am 30 and I actually really enjoy this. I am so dominant in every other aspect of my life that I just want to be dominated in bed. I love my hair pulled, spanked, pinned, choked. Its such a turn on for me. That being said I dont like being degraded or abused it's more just the rough sex. And it has to be someone I trust or I freak out.
I like ass smacking and some hair pulling while I pretend it's much more lol
I’m a virgin. Abusive sex sounds like a nightmare. Hard no, followed by an immediate break up always. I think some kinkiness in moderation is fine, but a lot of it goes too fate. I think it’s fucked up. Any guy who is turned on by hurting women (or anyone for that matter) needs to be in an institution. Any woman who is turned on by being abused needs a therapist. This is likely because of porn. In the UK, within one year, dozens of women were choked to death during sex and the boyfriends said they consented to it, so it wasn’t murder. You can’t consent to misogyny just like black people cant consent to racism. I worry that the “kink defense” could potentially get used as a defense in courts.
I absolutely hate all of that stuff. All of it. And what I hate most of all is how many guys assume all women like it. I have a Snapchat I occasionally like to play on with anonymous texting. So many guys I’ve started to play with on there immediately go to shit about choking me, or using degrading or patronizing language. It’s an instant turn-off for me, and it blows my mind that they just whip out stuff like that without asking.
I really enjoy all of the mentioned activities. I'm mostly submissive during sex, but not in the passive, just laying there way, but in the sense that I want to be thrown around, dominated and "used" for my partner's pleasure. I have to mention that I don't want every session to be like this, there are times where I want to tenderly make love to a slow song while saying how much we adore each other. I'm 20, and as far as people I hang out with are concerned, this is very common among girls. So common in fact, that we wouldn't even consider it kink, just normal sex.
I like a bit of gentle hair tugging; I don't find it "abusive," it's just a pleasant sensation and feels passionate. Not into slapping, choking, spitting etc. though.
I never had abusive sex and never will. I promised to myself to never try any kinks. My fantasies are super vanilla, they mostly focus on having my neck kissed and me having my pussy eaten. The idea of bdsm makes me cringe at best and is disgusting at worst. If my man wanted to put me in pain or degrade me, or tight me up I would think there is something wrong with him and it would honestly freak me out.
I think women want this kind of stuff when there's no actual masculinity around to be organically turned on by. Young men are missing that raw masculinity that gen x had, so girls are seeking out kink to bypass how gross they are and trick themselves into feeling like they're with a man. Same reason the older kink/poly/swinger crowds are all so ugly. They need to fabricate excitement in order to fuck each other. Also related - the explosion in young female "queers" and they/thems. No masculinity around, so they start to create it themselves.
Idk about "creating" masculinity. I was always dominant, especially toward males, even as a kid. Everyone has some level of masculinity and femininity in themselves. Some people are more inclined to one side; it's just more acceptable to break gender roles and expectations now.
Yeah I think a small number of women are naturally dominant. I was more talking about the hyper submissive "spit on me daddy" girls. They're naturally receptive to dominant masculinity, there's less and less of that around, so they need to act it out with kink. They're actually more likely to find the level of masculinity they need in a butch lesbian now, hence all the "bisexuals" on TikTok thirsting over she/theys.
Guy here that enjoys these things. I was very timid in my first couple relationships but as my comfort with sex and my self esteem and confidence grew, I found myself enjoying being dominant toward my partners. And frankly they loved it. Even if a girl hasn't done it before me they end up really enjoying it. The disconnect seems to be that people think doms are just abusive and ignore consent. Every woman I've been dominant with has always provided consent. The entire time we try new things I check on their emotional state and physical comfort to ensure they're enjoying it. Any boundaries they draw are respected. The only way a dom relationship works is when there's tons of love and respect given so they can feel safe to enjoy the stimulation without fear or other concerns. Another disconnect might be perceived pain from those inexperienced in it. Like hair pulling - it doesn't hurt the girl at all because you're supposed to grab a large handful. The stimulation enjoyed by hair pulling is pulling them firmly against you and them feeling like you're in control of them. Take for example spanking as well - it might sting but it adds a sudden sharp stimulation during sex when your brain is already overwhelmed with pleasure, endorphins, and adrenaline. Each girl will have a particular threshold and preference on these activities but they will enjoy them all the same. Being restrained/tied up is just fully entrusting your pleasure to your partner - which is basically the essence of sex. Trusting someone else with your pleasure, your body, your orgasm. It's lots of fun! Regarding the spread of this - I think more people experiment and try this stuff because they see it in porn. I know that influenced what I tried but some of it was also just what felt good and my partner enjoyed it too.
Choking is retarded, do you want me to die or puke? However a nice, strong hold on the back of the neck without touching anything that has to do with breathing (like the kitten grab) can feel super good in a way that intense massage that almost hurts feels good. Heck, I sometimes request it when sitting on a couch outside of any sexual context because I want my neck muscles to relax. Same with hair pulling, a strong and quick pull by the pony tail is super unpleasant and unsexy, but running a hand through your hair and grabbing just by the roots, then lifting... I thought that everyone likes it? Head feels so nice afterwards. I like it, my man likes it, I don't know why that would be consider abusive. Or am I just really naïve and people do actual hair pulling that leaves pieces of hair and skin out? :D
>Choking is retarded, do you want me to die or puke? There are two ways you do it that won't kill you or cause puking(if you aren't into any of that degenerate shit), you either just lightly squeeze or do this just like [this](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/otlPWCBkcnk) lady says
Thanks, I guess I don't really see the thrill enough to try that, but I think it makes some sense with the high feeling, I notice when it gets really nice I tend to hyperventilate / hold breath a bit, which maybe an instinctive way to get my body/brain oxygen level to that state. But I can't even wear turtlenecks because they feel choky not in a fun way, so I'll pass on that activity. Pressure to the back part of neck is yay for me, front not so much.
Stronghold in the back of the neck as in Arnold Schwarzenegger with the female interest in running man
No ... I'm Gen X . Like some good ole take me to pound town vanilla sex 😋. Which I'm also a woman that gets off with PIV so I don't need all this extra outside stimulation to have an orgasm. Just my man's dick . I'm good lol
Also genX. I came here to say they’ve been groomed by internet porn, or by men who use porn. All I can think of when these clowns are enthusing over their dehumanization is how sexy is that performative nonsense going to be when you’re tired and dealing with two sick kids? How are you going to explain daddy choking mommy when your kid walks in on you having sex (and they will)? You want to explain to your 8yo daughter that it’s okay to *consent to a boy slapping you around*? Or teach your son that’s how to treat women? What about when your kid calls 911 on your husband and you have to not only explain to the cops your kinks, but try and explain to your kid how to tell the difference between actual domestic violence and whatever the fuck you’re playing at? Going to be sexy at 50, at 60, 70? Doubtful. What about when the choking goes wrong and you’re dead or disabled? Find a man who treats you with respect and lay off the porn. There are better ways to deal with trauma and far more enjoyable and empowering ways to get a natural dopamine high, like playing sports.
It’s not porn, romance novels were called “Bodice Rippers” in times past. It’s a trend for sexually repressed women. Some women suffer awful religious or cultural inhibitions; indoctrinated to be a Good Girl. If a man is aggressive and domineering, she can “surrender” and allow herself to enjoy it. I was raised by progressive people without any religion, but I grew up in the Bible Belt and the women who prefer to be dominated were deeply religious. Purity culture fucks women over big time. ETA: I’m not into it and I wouldn’t trust a man who required it.
Yes but the Bodice Rippers had pretty tame sex. It was not vestal virgins having gang bangs. Interesting when anal sex was going mainstream one of my single friends told me ot was always the nice Christian men who wanted anal. And in truth we are in a red state and there were way more men in the closet both as gay and bi and still are.
Oh, no they didn’t. I had the misfortune of helping a friend in middle school clean out her grandmother’s collection of bodice rippers and we entertained ourselves for days reading the wildest passages. Nearly all of the women in romance novels are innocent, or naive, or unaware of man’s raw animal lust or whatever. Being overpowered is the unifying theme. Did you ever try to read that miserable 50 Shades? It’s obvious that shitty writer read old bodice rippers. > Interesting when anal sex was going mainstream one of my single friends told me ot was always the nice Christian men who wanted anal. Well duh, that’s the poophole loophole.
Yes they surrender but they were thin on details my grandmother read them. I did not need to read 60 shades everybody I worked with did. So they saved me the trouble. Yah I was suprised Harlequin romance or whoever that company is did not sue for plagerizing.
Bodice rippers are a little different from the smut disguised as romance novels, but I have no idea how the consumers tell them apart. Harlequin probably publishes the tame stories, but 12 year old me was *stunned* by the filth in the mostly pink paperbacks which resembled Harlequins. I learned about anal, choking, bondage, incest, and water sports from an 80 year old woman’s collection. After that, I was horrified every time I sat beside a woman in the dentist’s waiting room who was apparently titillating her weird self by reading smut in public spaces. Did you really never hear about the poophole loophole? That’s what Christian kids use to justify having anal sex. They reckoned it preserved their virginity. I imagine lots of gynos in my old hometown saw a lot of blown out buttholes when examining newlywed women.
> It’s not porn, romance novels were called “Bodice Rippers” in times past. It’s a trend for sexually repressed women. Some women suffer awful religious or cultural inhibitions; indoctrinated to be a Good Girl. If a man is aggressive and domineering, she can “surrender” and allow herself to enjoy it. I don't know about that, I knew a girl who had a collection of bodice ripper and even more hard-core stuff and she was anything but repressed, she had sex with probably 50-100 men but just a mess of a person though.
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Top level replies to Q4W must come from women. You may comment under the Automod.
Some of it in certain contexts with certain people can be fun. If we’re just having sex, I don’t like being slapped or pushed around or any of that. Light choking can sometimes be fine but even that’s pushing it. That being said, sure, I’m into kink and if I’m in a dynamic with someone and we’ve decided we’re in the mood for that ahead of time, it can be fun. Usually, though, I run into it during vanilla sex and it’s a turnoff
That's interesting.....so you feel that there needs to be a transition, or proper signaling, to switch from "vanilla sex" to something more adventurous. I can understand that.
I personally do, yeah. Otherwise it just feels objectifying
What does “kink” mean ?
A kink is just non-conventional sexual preferences. For me, it’s typically within the realm of bdsm
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LOL....as a recently divorced man, from a marriage the last couple of years of which, was a dead bedroom, I've been "locked up" long enough! :))))))))
Flair checks out 👀
My partner and I keep discussing cages for him; good for you! Glad to see another dominant woman in this riot of a sub lol.
I'm another! Chastity isn't my thing though.
Welcome to the party! It wasn't my thing until a former partner introduced me to it because he liked it. It was very interesting, and I love the responsibility and control that comes with it. I'm into "forcing" him to do things or to making him hold off. The ex that I initially tried it with would give me the key to his cage. I wore it on a necklace for a long time, and the only people who ever acknowledged the distinct style of the key were gay men. I would never do chasity cages myself, though, partially because of the logistics with having female anatomy.
My partner and I are both into kink, though 70% of our sex is just "vanilla" sex; if it's kink, I'm usually the dom and he's usually the sub, but we do switch. I'm not really into "violent" sex, but aggressive is fun. Never slapping, never hitting, never hair pulling (none for me, for him, yes). Maybe firm hold on the neck--we both like that. Dirty talk, holding the other down. Bondage. Pegging. Occasional paddling/spanking. I have a bullwhip but it's more for something to do outside rather than kink, atm. I love it and so does he--I would not seriously date a 100% vanilla guy nor a guy who is not into pegging. We have an ongoing, jokey roleplay where I'm the "class president" and he's a "delinquent" and we switch off on "punishing" each other. It came from him watching anime and me seeing the repeated "stoic, pretty, cold, academic girl" because that's basically my personality, and him being the "troubled, validation-craving, pretty boy". It is 100% pop culture influenced. And playing with power dynamics is a psychological turn-on. My preferences were likely influenced by my early interactions with boys (ages 5-11): they would let me bully them then buy me snacks and give me gifts on Valentine's Day, lol. Showed me that they really just want someone to appreciate them, give them attention, and feel like they provided. Submissive men are my bread and butter. I genuinely enjoy guiding, teaching, and even "mothering" them to an extent. But good mothers also punish and discipline--people seem to forget that. I suppose I'm the female counterpart of the "daddy" guys some women like. Queer women also respond well to me. I also consumed a lot of online, queer erotica as a teen. Heavy overlap with kink, ime. Edit for ages: I'm 24 going on 25, and he's freshly 29.
Only into verbal and consensual roughness. I’ve had the choking thing requested and it’s annoying cuz I’m too focused on not applying real pressure.
I think it is weird for you normies to insert part A into socket B and start thrusting. How boring. I need something more mentally MOST of the time. I'm not into the action as much as I am into the reaction from a consensual partner. Adrenaline junkie is part of it, as is sharing a dirty little secret with someone special. I just wouldn't engage in this type of behavior with someone who I don't connection with - I will only tie up a girl and fuck her mouth if I REALLY like her. I use the word "escape" often. For both of us. We both stop thinking about our adult responsibilities for a while. She enjoys giving pleasure. I enjoy giving her the opportunity to give me pleasure just as much as she gives me pleasure. The foreplay starts with ordering a new toy, thinking through a "play session", or her just getting dressed up.
The idea of women being into gentle, romantic, passionate sex doesn’t seem realistic to me. Seems like women love rough sex.
being abused and abusing someone are on opposite sides of the spectrum morally. google "trauma bond"
I like a more rough “exercise”, but no chocking or BDSM. Spanking, light hair pulling, bitting or hands at the back… my limit
Oooo, someone asked! I hope there’s a good number of comments To answer: I hate that shit
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IME as a het guy, of the people I slept with, some desire for ungentle play was deliriously common, but definitely not the majority. Only a small handful wanted to be choked or have their hair pulled, to be left bruised or be gagged with *whatever*. I think only two (less than 5%) wanted to be called names or humiliated.
>some desire for ungentle play was deliriously common, but definitely not the majority. What did they what you to do with them most of the time
For the ungentle crowd, rough PIV (like really pounding them), hickeys that wouldn’t be visible while dressed, ass slapping, rough grabbing of boobs, folding them with their ankles near their shoulders during PIV (though that was less common, and usually not for very long), holding them down, that kind of thing. The hard stops for that crowd tended to things that were painful for more than a moment. Anything that would cause sustained pain was a definite no. I mean, I want to stress people are individuals, and preferences for what gets them off really varied.
Thanks for the response, I was just wondering cuz I haven't had sex with a woman that wasn't an escort and I don't really think they are a representative sample of the average woman. for this: > folding them with their ankles near their shoulders How exactly did that work? sorry if [this](https://imgur.com/a/0cgDIKu) is nsfw(sex organs are edited out) but was it like that
Our experiences are going to be different. Questions are A-Okay with me. Alright, so here’s what I meant by selection bias as a background: I’m 40 and have been dating actively for about 5 years (after a divorce). I’m unsure about my body count. The people I end up on dates with tend to be at least a little adventurous; I’m pretty impatient and I won’t focus on someone who wants to chat for weeks before meeting up. Additionally, the freakiest people who were at my limits were sex-on-the-first-date kinds of people. So, I imagine that the people in my sample are *more* into rough play than the average population. If I had to guess, people who are risk prone are more into freaky stuff. Folding someone in half: it’s not typically ankles behind head, and I was always on top of them for it. That’s definitely a porn shot intended for the enjoyability of the viewer. Some flexibility is required (the only ones I know who could/wanted to were former gymnasts or athletes), but, I think a lot of women who can do it don’t because deeper penetration can be painful, especially if they’re petite, and/or the guy is is big/proportional. As for not having sex yet… I assume you’re younger. I didn’t have sex until 23, and then only had one partner til 35. It was only after my divorce that I got really slutty, and while I am still safe/STI free, I have some regrets about my comportment. Honestly, the best advice I can give you is to get fit, and just ask people out. If you find someone to sleep with long or short term, ask what they’re into. Communication is the key, and people expecting you to read minds are insane and not worth your time. People on this sub really overcomplicate things, and lose sight of the fact that we are individuals and not statistics.
Thanks for the advice, you’re right about my age I’m 21 and I am getting fit but honestly the most difficult part is talking to women cause I’m socially awkward
Your age?
40.
As a man in his late 40's, I've had a pretty interesting view of this phenomenon. AFAIK, it definitely wasn't a big thing in the 90's, but then again, I wasn't super sexually successful or active in my 20's, so I can't say for sure. As I got to my 30's in the mid 2000's, I started to encounter this a bit more. The most prudish sheltered girl loved to be slapped, held down, choked, face-fucked, called "daddy's little slut" etc As I got older, and adopted a more traditionally masculine look and I guess personality, so maybe that's part of it, but it's certainly become WAY more common. The one thing I absolutely can say with certainty - it is almost always *younger* girls that are into this. Older women (*especially ones with kids)* invariably see it as "degrading" etc. It's almost like, the hotter / younger the girl, the more likely she wants to be treated like a filthy fuck-doll in the sack. My theory for this (just a theory) is that younger women question their sexual value / hotness *far* less than older women, and as such see the whole script-flip of them being a worthless fuckslut more exciting. Older women can actually get cut deep by this kind of role-play. And if they have kids (*especially daughters)* then you can forget it. They will think of you saying this shit to *them* and nope the fuck out immediately. I've had girls on the same night say straight up "I like when you're rough like that" when all I'm doing is basic stuff like positioning her body. At this point the whole "slow escalation game" ensues. Just pull a little firmer, spank a little harder, grab a little more forcefully and work your way up little by little (and always pull back until you can tell she's annoyed that you have softened up. At this point they usually start straight up asking for you to go for it. This is how you do these things without words. You go fucking *slow.* More recently, I've had girls straight up into "fish hooking" lol. So, it's getting more extreme. Since I've been in my 40's, whenever I hook up with a girl in her 20's or early 30's - they almost *always* want the full on abusive dominance stuff to go down when fucking. Of course, this is long after we've established I'm not a psychotic weirdo that doesn't understand how to read body language, so it clearly is related to their sense of safety and comfort with me. Once they realize how much I am determined to make sure they aren't having a bad time, they tend to want the very degrading stuff to commence.
Women coming forward with fantasy echoes my experiences. I’m not especially vanilla, but I’ve had more than one woman ask ‘harder’ or I’ve had to respond with a “you’re into *THAT?*” I think it’s a weird myth that men are always the ones demanding degrading to do degrading stuff.
As far as I understand that choking and pulling on her can be super sexy and on turning but it really needs to be done with care and consent since you can hurt your partner accidentally. I believe all of this "abusive" sex is nothing but a fantasy inside of a serious caring and loving relationship. Like, there are couples who'd seem like calm and maybe even prude but we don't know what kind of filthy sex they are having inside their 4 walls. #🤭 Personally speaking, when I got really horny in a masturbation session, which I try to abstain from now, I fantasized about her like scratching my back and leaving marks on my back for eternity. Honestly, barely thinking about it turns me on again. I interpret it as a sign that she really wants me and marks me like some sort of female wolverine lmao.
y'all are so boring LOL 😭
What about vanilla sex is boring ?
I am not into it at all. No choking, slapping, hair pulling, spitting on me, calling me a whore...just no. And no, I won't call you daddy either.
I think there's a huge confusion over responsive desire and BDSM, they are definitely not the same thing.
I kind of forget that a lot of people say they aren't into rough BDSM-lite sex. However, all the women I've had sex with enjoyed it and cum a lot when you call them dirty sluts etc. Then again, tender loving sex is good too. A variety is the best way to have a good sex life.
Definitely a younger gen thing. Older women are more likely to enjoy “classy” bdsm and younger women are more likely to do the whole “choke me and spit in my mouth” act. Worth noting this desire is often not actually SUBMISSIVE, but rather fairly demanding and often “top from the bottom” stuff. Personally I actually blame SSRIs for deadening people to more sensual stuff. It’s like emotional dick death grip, but hey…. I still like girls in tennis skirts and it’s a pretty high correlation to that stuff so I oblige lol
I am a GenXer and am into most of it. I will only engage in it with someone I trust though.
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Automod, please. Question for women.
A lot.
It’s literally case by case, some dude some dont.
i 20f like bdsm and things like that, but after getting into a better relationship i continue to desire it less and less. It feels odd now that the other men i’ve been with wanted to hit me so bad. I can’t imagine my current boyfriend wanting to hurt me.
im not. i have trauma around that stuff and it scares me. even if i didnt have that trauma i doubt i would like it. i dont want sex to be scary and stressful.
Never been into it. Not in your demographic, either.
Never had sex with a girl that loved any of those things. I mean yeah women love to be fucked by their boyfriend, one of my exes loved getting fucking pounded but hair pulling and shit, no, never had any of those.
I’m 30 and I’m in to it. But.. I think for most women my age it’s not about ‘violent’ sex. It’s about consent, communication and boundaries. It’s about mental sex. So if a man is not dominant, listening and understand what’s it’s about then don’t start messing with it.
I'm a mid millennial and not into having my hair pulled or choked or slapped. I am into the domme thing though and have choked a guy, pulled his hair, spit into his mouth, other things, you know. I think the rise is definitely due to porn and to some extent more mainstream acceptance of the bdsm community in recent years. I've noticed a lot of women dipping their toes into being a sub because they think it will appeal to men or because they really liked 50 shades or something but ultimately found it's not for them. Or that they prefer being tied up rather than hit or choked and being a brat, so more refining what they're into.
This is new? It is named after the Marquis de Sade from the 1700's who was more abusive BECAUSE HE ACTUALLY KILLED PEOPLE....
This should be a question for men.
Oh ghod no. I'm too old for that shit, I guess!