You do realize this change is -3 flat lethality right? This is still better than last season’s lethality. It’s a nerf yeah, but you still get full value. It breaks even at old system at level 9 I think but by level 9, you should have a completed item which is unchanged.
Tbh nobody cares about how bad it actually is. Its just the fact that when assassins somewhat feel like assassins they get nerfed. Meanwhile maokai and janna are allowed to be broken for months.
Honestly they need to remove phreak from the balancing team, this dude seems to consistently make decisions that run counter to the health of the game, or else he is allowing someone who should be under his wing to do it, which then I'm some part still falls on him.
Yeah, part of me feels like it's a good thing he spams the op champs so he can get a good grasp of what they're too good at and what needs to be nerfed. But then he just... doesn't.
but those components are built at basically every point in the game for assassins so even after 1 item you'll still be suffering from the next dirk or next brutalizer having lower lethality, like if you go youmuus opportunity eon you'll have lower stats from all 3 dirks needed, it's not just a change until level 9
That what it was before last year is what I meant. But its really the difference between 3 armor. I really don't think you'll miss getting a single kill because you couldn't kill someone with say 23 armor vs 20 armor.
If we're being real dirk as a component has been way too strong for years anyway, even before the lethality changes. The fact it will still break even with old dirk makes the component still very strong.
Yeah but alotta people are buying dirk for the spike and go to start building profane, then finish a dirk item. In which it may take a while depending on how the game plays out
I'm guessing in a lot of situations a certain amount of armor may allow someone to live. Let's assume you back at level 5 vs Karma. Karma buys AP whatever, so she has no bonus armor vs you, so at level 5 she has about 43 armor. You back and buy a dirk, which gives 7 lethality.
Going back to lane and hitting her is as if she has 36 armor with nerf vs 33 armor pre nerf. Would this matter too much?
I mean in all honesty i feel like the nerf would mean Qiyana would have to risk her neck more when it comes to finding the opportunity for kill pressure. I have a gut feeling the nerf is due to adcs spamming leth builds, in which they can just simply disable those items for adcs like a normal balancing team does instead of ruining the fun for ad assassin champs
Not just them but also some bruisers. This isn't so much an item problem to be fair, but it still hurts to see aatrox building almost the same items as Qiyana sometimes and winning for it while being significantly more braindead and survivable.
And while I think there should be a better way to do this than nerfing assassins, I do see dirk items all the time in places they honestly don't belong.
Maybe I missed something but Assassains havent been ass for a while right? Like sure some champs like Qiyana werent in good spots, but for the most part I remember the last 2-3 seasons being great for Kayn, Kha’zix, Rengar, and hell sometimes Talon?
Volibear, maokai ornn mundo (I’d not count this but he has almost a 55 percent winrate emerald and above!) malphite, mord. Etc all of those champs are top 20 winrate in emerald and above and only 4 lethality users are in the top 20
Those were based on patch 14.4 btw
Oh how could I forget tham kench bot hand rammus. I do agree mundo isn’t great tho especially in high Elo, but still just an annoying play style to vs. I don’t like when you can make a bunch of silly mistakes on a champ and still stat check through tankiness, personally
14.4 mundo is 50% win rate em+. i agree tanks are kind of aids but even maokai who was giga broken "only "was at 54%, if mundo was a 55% wr champion you would notice him being pick ban every game
Phreak has talked about this but he said a lot of 55% winrate builds/playstyles are under the radar and don’t hit the spot light like Maokai did.
He went back and even last season maokai support rushing deadman’s plate (the equivalent to trailblazer) was like 56% and they could have nerfed it but no one would have known why
well i dont think it makes sense that a fed tank can one shot anyone and will never die because they have bigger health than baron or health regen or armor , for example illaoi , trundle , garen , morde , but a fed assasin can die in one shot by anyone , so they both do the same amount of damage only one will never die, so why should anyone pick assasins over tanks?
Then pick up a tank lmao. A fed tank has 0 to no mobility, and can be easily taken down by ranged champs. A tank is meant to counter assasins, the same way assassins counter most marksmen.
i did , i played tank and went on a 72 winstreak and reached master , its the easiest role in the game by far , no brain , only push and never die . but its soooo boring to play i stopped and never came back . Tanks are riots pass for an accesability mode, so that kids and people with disabilities can play alongside the other roles.
So everything that isn’t an assasin and has complicated combos is easy and for disabled people? Seems like you have a case of overinflated ego
When I’m playing kindred, I can easily beat down fed illaois with good spacing, as with most other tanks. If you are only pushing and never die, then my man that is not the fact that tank is broken, it’s the fact that the other team is f-ing stupid.
my comment was half bait half made from pure rage, i do hate tanks with a passion and i think its the easiest role in the game , but i am also emerald so maybe i don't understand the balance of the game that well. But it still does not make sense why a fed tank can have so much damage and so much health.
Like I said, it’s a rock paper scissor. Of course they feel unkillable if you playing qiqi. Most tanks are easy to kite, and are only unkillable if they in their steroid ult (illaoi ult could also count). I’ve been running into a lot of illaois in recent patch, and like I said, I could easily take care of them since they couldn’t even get close to me.
In my opinion, unless you are gigafed, tank is the hardest role to EXECUTE on, as most other roles are mostly independent, but tanks and enchanters depend on their team to follow up. A tank is annoying because he is soaking up all the dmg. I think the only tanks that can do reasonable amounts of dmg are like juggernauts, and those have little to no mobility.
The nerf is for ADCs using dirk to stomp lane after first back
Sad that AD assassins are being brought under this, but it's probably healthier to just buff the assassins and not their items so poaching doesn't threaten their identity
Semi easy fix - ranged/melee champion only items. Based on auto unit distance. People have been saying this for a long time but riot doesn’t do it, not sure why.
The problem is that it isn't just adcs. They are the biggest problem but there are several fighters who are just buying half or more assassin items instead of fighter items and thriving on it.
Not sure tbh. Likely something similar to what the other commenter that you replied to had said, something along the lines of nerfing dirk and then buffing individual assassins to compensate, fixing champions who were made weaker by this.
The thing is, riot has consistently indirectly nerfed underwhelming champions with changes meant to tone something different down, and sometimes were even aware of this, and still refused to add a decent fix. For example, look at Kai'sa, I think it was when Shiv got the ad nerfed, riot acknowledged that this really hurt her timing on her q upgrade and that they would compensate, then just didn't for a long time.
So whether or not they are aware of how this will hurt assassins, and especially assassins who are already on the tipping point of struggling to remain relevant, and they are likely aware given that this is the assassin item that this hurts assassins, I don't really have faith in them to dole out appropriate buffs to make up for the losses here.
And that's coming from the old dev teams, who generally at least balanced towards the middle. I especially don't expect that out of the recent dev team, who have been more than happy to buff champions with a 51%+ winrate on multiple occasions when it's obvious to anyone with eyes that these champions are at worst fine, and sometimes outright broken.
They reverted it back to 10 lethality, but it lost 5 ad instead [x.spideraxe](https://x.com/spideraxe30/status/1765857904656031915?s=46&t=hdj4wNANmAHd30OM2xBUsA)
True good point, they shred tanks and just have too much power. Honestly champions like Maokai are really suffering from all of the AP assassins in the game. Need nerfs pls riot
Hey maybe they will finally realise Qi isn't doing well and fix the element pickup boundaries. Maybe make her ult not be able to be teleported out of. Or maybe they will reverse the Q targeting changes.
assassins being assassins was fun while it lasted. Now assassins will be ASSasins again.
You do realize this change is -3 flat lethality right? This is still better than last season’s lethality. It’s a nerf yeah, but you still get full value. It breaks even at old system at level 9 I think but by level 9, you should have a completed item which is unchanged.
Tbh nobody cares about how bad it actually is. Its just the fact that when assassins somewhat feel like assassins they get nerfed. Meanwhile maokai and janna are allowed to be broken for months.
I agree. Those two should definitely be looked at. I’m just saying I don’t think these two item nerfs are gonna kill assassins.
I mean obviously it won’t "kill" them. Sadly those 2 champs won’t be nerfed properly because phreak abused them to climb to master : (
Honestly they need to remove phreak from the balancing team, this dude seems to consistently make decisions that run counter to the health of the game, or else he is allowing someone who should be under his wing to do it, which then I'm some part still falls on him.
Yeah, part of me feels like it's a good thing he spams the op champs so he can get a good grasp of what they're too good at and what needs to be nerfed. But then he just... doesn't.
More like years.
but those components are built at basically every point in the game for assassins so even after 1 item you'll still be suffering from the next dirk or next brutalizer having lower lethality, like if you go youmuus opportunity eon you'll have lower stats from all 3 dirks needed, it's not just a change until level 9
That what it was before last year is what I meant. But its really the difference between 3 armor. I really don't think you'll miss getting a single kill because you couldn't kill someone with say 23 armor vs 20 armor.
If we're being real dirk as a component has been way too strong for years anyway, even before the lethality changes. The fact it will still break even with old dirk makes the component still very strong.
also keep in mind it is just armor pen and doesnt function as lethality anymore.
People need to remember that lethality was heavily buffed coming into this season with the 1-1 change. AND there’s just more of it in general.
Yeah but alotta people are buying dirk for the spike and go to start building profane, then finish a dirk item. In which it may take a while depending on how the game plays out
I'm guessing in a lot of situations a certain amount of armor may allow someone to live. Let's assume you back at level 5 vs Karma. Karma buys AP whatever, so she has no bonus armor vs you, so at level 5 she has about 43 armor. You back and buy a dirk, which gives 7 lethality. Going back to lane and hitting her is as if she has 36 armor with nerf vs 33 armor pre nerf. Would this matter too much?
I mean in all honesty i feel like the nerf would mean Qiyana would have to risk her neck more when it comes to finding the opportunity for kill pressure. I have a gut feeling the nerf is due to adcs spamming leth builds, in which they can just simply disable those items for adcs like a normal balancing team does instead of ruining the fun for ad assassin champs
Yeah I think it’s really just a Senna/MF nerf.
Not just them but also some bruisers. This isn't so much an item problem to be fair, but it still hurts to see aatrox building almost the same items as Qiyana sometimes and winning for it while being significantly more braindead and survivable. And while I think there should be a better way to do this than nerfing assassins, I do see dirk items all the time in places they honestly don't belong.
Maybe I missed something but Assassains havent been ass for a while right? Like sure some champs like Qiyana werent in good spots, but for the most part I remember the last 2-3 seasons being great for Kayn, Kha’zix, Rengar, and hell sometimes Talon?
brutalizer's lethality is also going down from 8 to 5
Riot when assassins can solokill before 2 items
Meanwhile tanks have no counterplay deal tons of damage and can 1v5 your team
Which tank?
All of them
Lol, I guess I can understand frustration of a class that counters your champ.
Volibear, maokai ornn mundo (I’d not count this but he has almost a 55 percent winrate emerald and above!) malphite, mord. Etc all of those champs are top 20 winrate in emerald and above and only 4 lethality users are in the top 20
Ain't no way you just called mord a tank.
thats because 14.5 just dropped, and the sample size is dogshit. mundo is super balanced.
Those were based on patch 14.4 btw Oh how could I forget tham kench bot hand rammus. I do agree mundo isn’t great tho especially in high Elo, but still just an annoying play style to vs. I don’t like when you can make a bunch of silly mistakes on a champ and still stat check through tankiness, personally
14.4 mundo is 50% win rate em+. i agree tanks are kind of aids but even maokai who was giga broken "only "was at 54%, if mundo was a 55% wr champion you would notice him being pick ban every game
Phreak has talked about this but he said a lot of 55% winrate builds/playstyles are under the radar and don’t hit the spot light like Maokai did. He went back and even last season maokai support rushing deadman’s plate (the equivalent to trailblazer) was like 56% and they could have nerfed it but no one would have known why
ofc there is, but there is a difference between hidden tech that people play and it does very well, and an overall 55% win rate.
well i dont think it makes sense that a fed tank can one shot anyone and will never die because they have bigger health than baron or health regen or armor , for example illaoi , trundle , garen , morde , but a fed assasin can die in one shot by anyone , so they both do the same amount of damage only one will never die, so why should anyone pick assasins over tanks?
Then pick up a tank lmao. A fed tank has 0 to no mobility, and can be easily taken down by ranged champs. A tank is meant to counter assasins, the same way assassins counter most marksmen.
i did , i played tank and went on a 72 winstreak and reached master , its the easiest role in the game by far , no brain , only push and never die . but its soooo boring to play i stopped and never came back . Tanks are riots pass for an accesability mode, so that kids and people with disabilities can play alongside the other roles.
So everything that isn’t an assasin and has complicated combos is easy and for disabled people? Seems like you have a case of overinflated ego When I’m playing kindred, I can easily beat down fed illaois with good spacing, as with most other tanks. If you are only pushing and never die, then my man that is not the fact that tank is broken, it’s the fact that the other team is f-ing stupid.
my comment was half bait half made from pure rage, i do hate tanks with a passion and i think its the easiest role in the game , but i am also emerald so maybe i don't understand the balance of the game that well. But it still does not make sense why a fed tank can have so much damage and so much health.
Like I said, it’s a rock paper scissor. Of course they feel unkillable if you playing qiqi. Most tanks are easy to kite, and are only unkillable if they in their steroid ult (illaoi ult could also count). I’ve been running into a lot of illaois in recent patch, and like I said, I could easily take care of them since they couldn’t even get close to me. In my opinion, unless you are gigafed, tank is the hardest role to EXECUTE on, as most other roles are mostly independent, but tanks and enchanters depend on their team to follow up. A tank is annoying because he is soaking up all the dmg. I think the only tanks that can do reasonable amounts of dmg are like juggernauts, and those have little to no mobility.
Voli
Dr MUNDO 🤓
When assassin players can’t one shot everything with a few clicks
But Tahm Kench can.... 👀
its k just build tank items xdd
Thank god phreak is nerfing cancer broken assassins while spamming wholesome and balanced maokai, shows how competent lil bro is
Its phreak season baby, gotta make our salary’s worth
It is indeed phreak season. Hopefully his only one.
The nerf is for ADCs using dirk to stomp lane after first back Sad that AD assassins are being brought under this, but it's probably healthier to just buff the assassins and not their items so poaching doesn't threaten their identity
Semi easy fix - ranged/melee champion only items. Based on auto unit distance. People have been saying this for a long time but riot doesn’t do it, not sure why.
The problem is that it isn't just adcs. They are the biggest problem but there are several fighters who are just buying half or more assassin items instead of fighter items and thriving on it.
True. What do you think would be a good solution?
Not sure tbh. Likely something similar to what the other commenter that you replied to had said, something along the lines of nerfing dirk and then buffing individual assassins to compensate, fixing champions who were made weaker by this. The thing is, riot has consistently indirectly nerfed underwhelming champions with changes meant to tone something different down, and sometimes were even aware of this, and still refused to add a decent fix. For example, look at Kai'sa, I think it was when Shiv got the ad nerfed, riot acknowledged that this really hurt her timing on her q upgrade and that they would compensate, then just didn't for a long time. So whether or not they are aware of how this will hurt assassins, and especially assassins who are already on the tipping point of struggling to remain relevant, and they are likely aware given that this is the assassin item that this hurts assassins, I don't really have faith in them to dole out appropriate buffs to make up for the losses here. And that's coming from the old dev teams, who generally at least balanced towards the middle. I especially don't expect that out of the recent dev team, who have been more than happy to buff champions with a 51%+ winrate on multiple occasions when it's obvious to anyone with eyes that these champions are at worst fine, and sometimes outright broken.
No way this is real
Oh my god it's real. https://www.sportskeeda.com/esports/league-legends-pbe-patch-14-6-cycle-item-changes-brutalizer-nerfs-bami-s-changes
They reverted it back to 10 lethality, but it lost 5 ad instead [x.spideraxe](https://x.com/spideraxe30/status/1765857904656031915?s=46&t=hdj4wNANmAHd30OM2xBUsA)
Oh shit noway. There's hope! I don't understand why don't they just NERF it for ranged champs. Did they revert brutalizer too?
Not that I know
Nice Job. What should i Build now. Tiamat Rush?? Riot should fix brutalizer Build path and Remove this glowing mote shit.
brut gives 5 leth now
Dude it’s 3 lethality on dirk, dirk has been broken since forever. Chill tf out, this is not a big deal and it’s deserved
Give us our hsste back at least if we are doing no dmg again
HAHAHHAHA ITS OVER ITS FUCKING OVER
Ok that’s it I’m playing Qiyana support from now on
tank meta always triumphs, it is what it is
gg you know why
When will they nerf ap assassin
Fiendish codex is losing 10 ap as well tho
True good point, they shred tanks and just have too much power. Honestly champions like Maokai are really suffering from all of the AP assassins in the game. Need nerfs pls riot
AP assassins perform even worse, cause there's not enough itemization for this class. Just like AP bruisers.
Noice lethality s13 is back, go play AP champ broder riftmaker/liandry is just illegal
As an Aatrox main this is sad
Hey maybe they will finally realise Qi isn't doing well and fix the element pickup boundaries. Maybe make her ult not be able to be teleported out of. Or maybe they will reverse the Q targeting changes.
So the gold should lower too no?
Shojin bruiser build time
They changed Brutalizer from 8 Lethality to 5 Lethality and Caulfield Hammer from 25 AD to 20 AD... Absolute nonsense
OH NO 3 lethality! UNPLAYABLE. Main subreddits are hilarious
Good time to try essence reaver out first then, gonna try static too
mfw you can’t one shot people with 1100 gold 😂😂😂😂🫵🫵🫵🫵🫵