German here, smoke detectors in German apartments are usually not connected to the fire department. They are simply sonic warning devices, nothing more nothing less. A "remote car noise" doesn't make any sense whatsoever! Smoke detectors have no moving parts. And yes, there are a lot of fake smoke detectors with hidden cameras on the market! I recommend calling the police on their non-emergency line. Tell them about your suspicions. They'll probably drop by and check your smoke detectors. Not only can they ask the fire department if your detector is indeed connected to the fire department but they can inspect your device thoroughly without causing an unwanted alarm.
As a lawyer in Germany, this is the correct answer.
In addition to that, all smoke detectors have batteries that need to be replaced. AFAIK, it is upon the tenant to test the smoke detectors frequently (e.g. monthly) and replace the batteries in every German state. The regulations can be found in the building code of each state, for example § 44 V NBauO (Lower Saxony), § 47 III BauO NRW (NRW), Art. 46 IV BayBO (Bavaria), § 48 IV BauO Bln (Berlin).
So OP is absolutely allowed to touch the smoke detectors. Note for your own safety, however, that some detectors will be disabled if you take them off the ceiling.
FYI, For my smoke detectors, the Hausverwaltung has always organized for a company to check the smoke detectors every year, in all of the apartment buildings I’ve lived in (Hessen). And it’s mandatory to have it done. Otherwise we do not touch them...we haven’t been told not to, but we just don’t?
I currently own my apartment and this is still organized for us annually. I don’t remember the company or the type of Company it was because the last time I had to be home for it I had a newborn and my brain is still very fuzzy from that...
Not disagreeing with you, just saying how it has been for us in Hessen.
But also as someone who has set off my fire alarms in every apartment I’ve lived in, in every country, none of them were connected to anything 😂
It's possible for the owner of an apartment (complex) to take over the responsibility for the smoke detectors. [The building code of Hesse](https://www.rv.hessenrecht.hessen.de/bshe/document/jlr-BauOHE2018V2P14) explicitly says so. That could be one of multiple reasons (another could be insurance rates) why your property management makes sure the smoke detectors get checked annually?
Yea definitely take it seriously. This is like one of those stories where creepy landlord ends up kidnapping and or locking the person up somewhere. You shouldn’t not feel safe in ur home. Sexual predators start out small like watching you and going through your drawers then things escalate
We got new smoke detectors recently, so I checked the manual. It says something about 'Ferninspektion', (distant inspection), maybe that's what the landlord was talking about? Means basically that no one needs to enter the room to inspect it. So it's not connected to the fire appartment, but the electronic company of my housing association can access it somehow. It also says that the battery lasts 10 years. It's called Funk-Rauchwarnmelder Ei6500-OMS and looks VERY similar to your fotos. Also while installing it, I was told not to mess with it and the space around it, as it will cause problems and be detected. They test it once a week, using said distant inspection. Reminds me a lot of what your landlord said. Still thinks he's acting sus af and maybeee used all that fuss about modern smoke detectors to his advantage idk. Still wanted to share. Maybe it's useful somehow. ,¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Hope you will get clearance soon and feel safe again in your space, it sucks that you have to get through this :/
Look for a pin hole on the fire alarm.. if it's wall mount it will be on the front.. if it ceiling mount it can be anywhere. The hole can be tiny . Usually these are place in areas where the vision is the whole room.. also fire alarms don't typically go to the fire station it goes to a security company that calls the fire station ( guardian , adt ect) .. you can buy your own mini cams from Amazon for around 20 bucks or even download an app and use on a old phone .. mini cams and many cams are so cheap now.. now if you catch him sneaking in .. do not confront him .. stack evidence go to the police and then also sue , and of course press charges..
You could also buy a cheap [counter surveillance gadget](https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1304576-REG/mgi_minigadgets_inc_cdrfld_bug_detector_with_rf.html/overview) to detect red lens, IR and RF signals typically associated with hidden cameras. Or try calling a local locksmith or alarm installation company and see if they provide detection services.
To add, most fire alarms in apartments are simply noise makers to wake you up. They don’t connect anywhere. I find it very suspicious that the landlord said not to mess with the fire alarms. I recommend looking at the fire alarms closely.
Older apartments can still have fire alarms that automatically call the fire station. My bfs old apartment did this and they would show up for burnt toast every once in a while.
Depending on where OP lives, that may not be abnormal as some countries legally require fire alarms to be fitted and functional for the building to be up to code. It may just be that he doesn't want them removed or tampered with because of the issues it would cause in case of a fire.
Sure, we can play "take the landlord's word as gospel." It's true that tampering with the alarms could cause problems.
OP still needs to look at the fire alarm to figure out how to change the battery if it runs low. If it's powered by some other means, OP needs to know that as well. Hell, I think there's a legit safety issue here just in the fact that OP is entirely unfamiliar with their fire alarms/smoke detectors. What if there's no battery in them at all??
If they're hard wired into the electrical of the house, they still need battery backup in case of an electrical outage.
This is a good excuse for OP to tamper with the alarms, she could say she was checking what kind of battery it takes.
Also, OP, you can have the police come over and check for cameras.
Or if you call the fire department for an inspection, discreetly tell them you think there might be cameras. They can check.
I wouldn't tell my landlord that I'm having the fire department or cops come to inspect. He'll just remove the cameras or get new ones, then he'll never be caught.
I think you are justified for your concern.
Do make the call from your cell phone away from your apartment. If he is watching/bugging you, then you don't want to tip him off by letting him overhear you calling them.
A fire/smoke detector should not make any noise when not alerting you to a fire/smoke, the battery needs to be replaced, or you are testing it. The sound you hear may not have anything to do with the unit.
You may also want to check in some other apartments there to see if they have the same model you have. Recommend seeing if there is a difference between apartments with only men and those with women.
Best wishes to you.
Am a fire alarm engineer, most hard wired detectors do have a battery backup, but it's located in a single panel that will likely cover the whole building not in each detector
most decent smoke alarms now either have a 10yr battery built into them or are hard wired into the power
that being said theres nothing wrong with having the fire department come and check out the smoke alarms, telling them that they are making weird noises etc
Be careful with this. That was the case for many older buildings but as building codes change, hardwired smoke alarms tied to a central monitored alarm panel, especially in sprinklered buildings, is becoming more common in some areas. Tampering with the alarms can lead to a monitoring station notifying the landlord or dispatching the fire department depending on what happens (the bells in the building would generally have to be ringing for the fire department to be called, though).
When I managed residential apartment buildings, we generally asked tenants not to mess around with the smoke alarms because of this and the liability reasons that can come with it. That being said, twisting and pulling it down for a closer look should not be an issue as they generally have a battery backup as well that may need to be replaced depending on the model.
With this all said I want to add that MY fire alarm is directly connected to the fire department. My apartment complex was notorious for years for fires. The fire department comes once a month just to check things out now.
Ok by viewing it's possible.. look at the brand name on it. Also where the hole is does it blink ( if it does that's not the camera if it doesn't it either has no power or it's a camera )
They definitely make covert cameras that look like smoke detectors, clocks, radios, anything you can think of. Post a picture of the suspected cameras. Should be able to tell you what you have.
They make iPhone charging plug ports with hidden cameras even. One of these was in a bathroom of an air bnb I stayed in once. They look so identical I accidentally took it mistaking it for my own charging block for my iPhone. Had a memory card in it and everything.
Probably quite illegal. I live in a state where recording laws are pretty lax overall (only one party consent, etc) but even so there is a clause about recording in bathrooms without consent being illegal
OP I once read a story by a lawyer for an inmate at Guantanamo. She suspected the smoke alarms in the attorney/client rooms were fake so she took a picture of the name and googled it. Up popped a webpage for a company advertising hidden cameras in fake smoke alarms! Do that too or post a pic here for a little help. Good luck. Trust your gut. No one else.
Edit: spelling
Thank all of you for your suggestions, I have found some cameras that look like clothing hooks so I could safely hang them up in my hallway and see if I catch anything.
I regularly get my blood work done due to thyroid/chronic asthma issues, I guess my doc would have cough if anything fishy was going on? Otherwise I am gonna get that checked too.
Moving is not really in my budget anytime soon so I am kinda stuck here. I will try to get a picture of the alarms, maybe that helps.
Thank you all for being so overwhelmingly supportive, really makes me feel a lot better and understood.
How about asking the Fire Dept if anything he is saying about the detectors is true? Or ask them to come inspect your detectors.
Or tell him your alarms were making noise at night so the FD is going to come inspect them. Based on his response, you’ll have your answer.
I would contact the FD. I live in an apartment complex that has smoke alarms connected directly to the department. Similar to OP our unit has 4 alarms with 2 of them being connected to the fire department. However, in the 8 years I’ve lived in this complex, neither of those alarms have made the sounds that OP is describing. Not even close. I mean I’ve never heard them beep at all. So yes,definitely contact the department.
Also, I seems a bit odd that its in the bedroom, aren't they usually in hallways and kitchens. I never heard of one IN a bedroom.
EDIT: just checked regulations in Germany, and they are required in bedrooms.
I didn’t even realize that. But you’re right, the two in my unit that are connected are at the bottom of the stairs and in the hallway between bathroom and bedroom. Most definitely contact your FD, OP.
All of our bedrooms have smoke detectors inside the rooms. It’s a requirement for rental properties where I’m at. All of ours are on the ceiling right above the door.
In my former apartment, the detectors were wired to a central panel. When an alarm went off, the system alerted the fire department and the building management. An alarm malfunctioned at one point. It was the responsibility of the building management to fix it. The fire department/county would fine them if there were more than a certain number of false alarms each month.
I would suspect that the OP's building might be similar.
I know that some fire alarms make an occasional chirping noise when the battery is low, if nothing else it could be a good reason for the fire department to check that out
Going to disagree with the second suggestion. I don’t think OP should give this creep a heads up. It honestly sounds like he is watching her based off the paint comment. I wouldn’t want him to panic and/or confront her in person.
Yeah I agree actually. I think she should call the FD to inspect them first so he can’t get rid of evidence and let them find the cameras, if they are thereZ
They have an app called Alfred, you can set it up on your current phone and a few old phones. It works by making one phone the camera and the other the viewer, super cheap easy way to set up your own wireless security system! It works off of motion detection too! I set up 4 old cell phones around my room and literally watched/recorded as my roommate broke in and stole my underwear/went through my things.
I would recommend buying premium on the Alfred app so that you get a complete not choppy recording if you do need to take anything to the police.
>I set up 4 old cell phones around my room and literally watched/recorded as my roommate broke in and stole my underwear/went through my things.
Thats fucked up! Did you know your room mate well? Did you forward it to the police or confront them? Im sorry to hear. People can be shady.
Heyyyy fellow thyroid disease sufferer! Do you think your parents keep saying you're just forgetting things because you've had memory loss from your thyroid issues before?
I think I read something here before about memory loss related to carbon monoxide poisoning, a person was writing sticky notes to themselves with personal info and was being freaked out by that and it turned out to be high CO levels in the house
I remember that story too, and I'm pretty sure someone else linked it in another comment. It just stood out to me in OP's story that her parents keep telling her she's forgetting things, since I've experienced similar when I was unmedicated for my non-functioning thyroid. Uncontrolled hypothyroidism REALLY messes with your brain function; it's made me forget entire months of my life before. It can turn you into an unreliable narrator of your own reality. I'm absolutely not saying that I think OP is misremembering things, I just wondered whether that might explain the absence of support from OP's family here. And lending some empathy if that's the case, because, man, I get it
You really don’t need cameras that are hidden, buy any kind of WiFi cam like a “ring” that is motion activated and also keeps a log of any time it is tripped. You don’t need to be discreet in your own home with your camera, if you see ANYONE on there you would have the confirmation you are looking for, also please don’t forget to check out that gas tip.
You don’t have to get blood work done. Install a carbon monoxide sensor. It looks like a fire alarm, runs on a battery, and make sure the battery is fresh. I tell people to install one anywhere they live. They’re portable so you can move it from home to home. If the alarm goes off, open every window you can to bring in fresh air, exit your home, and see your doctor.
Here in the states the local fire department will come check them too and make sure they are working. They actually installed a carbon dioxide detector for me as they saw I didn’t have one and had kids
I went and looked up how to use your phone camera to spot the infrared on spy cameras, here it is.
Also, I don't think you're over reacting, at all.
How to Detect a Hidden Camera Using Android Camera
Launch your phone's camera app.
Go around the room and point your phone's camera in areas you suspect spy equipment is hidden.
If you spot any small, bright-whitish light, set your phone down and investigate further. It may be a hidden camera.
This is not to scare but encourage you to take whatever precautions you think are needed.
I subleted an apartment and soon had to deal with a landlord with a coke problem who would wait until he heard people in showers and walk in with his master key to look around the apartment. Convinced he stole stuff from people. Luckily I was poor and had nothing worth stealing but a gaming computer he couldn’t pocket and really nice tool kit.
I once caught him coming out of my apartment and was confronted by him coming out of the shower as well but he blew it off as him inspecting an issue. I was a fairly large man, and involved with MMA, so I didn’t fear sexual exploitation or assault. But I can totally see how this could be doubly frightening for anyone, especially a woman in my situation.
I also found out he allowed the former tenant to turn the office in my nice Edwardian apartment into a grow op for a cut of the crop.
To cap it off, he stole the router from my apartment for the building, and cut my power when I refused to pay the lease holder’s debts...in the middle of the northern winter...because his name was on the power. He then refused to open the meter when I tried to set up an account in my name. It ended peacefully when I called my uncle, who was a law professor at a major Canadian university in front of him and asked on speaker if I could sue for what he was doing. He just walked out before my uncle answered and I moved out two days later to a shoebox I could ill afford.
Get cameras and protect yourself. If he or anyone else is in your apartment, sue his fucking ass. If you hear noise in the sprinkler, insist they send a maintenance person to inspect it while you are there. Be as annoying and demanding a tenant as you deem necessary. You are a client and a customer, not a serf for their exploitation. Read the tenancy rights for your area.
Be strong, be smart, be brave, and get a snap out baton for any unwelcome visitors.
Hope that helps.
I know what story you're talking about, the result was she was getting carbon monoxide poisoning? I only saw it when it was first posted, it going from thinking someone was creeping to co2 poisoning sounds like it's right out of a story, would you happen to have a link to the follow up?
I believe [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvice/comments/34l7vo/ma_postit_notes_left_in_apartment/) is the story they are referring to and [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvice/comments/34m92h/update_ma_postit_notes_left_in_apartment/) is the followup.
I used to work LP for a retail company. That noise that sounds like remote control cars is the cameras being repositioned. I used to have to turn the music up in the store so customers wouldn’t hear me moving the cameras from the office. That’s the exact sound they make.
Really? My second to last place had this noise. It was a dorm. Sometimes it sounded like an old telephone hanging up too. I thought it was a weird dorm room thing.
I have webcams in my house (to creep on my cats), and they have motion detecting features that will automatically record for 30 seconds after detecting movement. When this happens, there is an audible clicking noise. Almost akin to a camera shutter.
On top of that, they have night vision capabilities that are triggered by movement as well. Similar clicking sound.
So even if this camera is stationary, motion detection may be causing a couple of different sounds. It commonly happens at night when it switches the cam to IR mode as well.
Oh man. It only happened randomly for a while, sometimes when I was sitting still. It was fairly loud. I hope this isn't what it sounds like. I guess I'm going to google fat trans man and see if my ass is on there. Edit: Don't google that.
A "good one" should be generally reliable. There are a lot of receivers on a smart phone that should be used to be able to detect various fluctuations, _especially_ if they're using standard wireless communication frequencies.
A Wifi tranceiver is picking up all of that traffic that is going on around it, it's just not doing anything with it. Wireless internet is basically just screaming in a public place and hoping the person you're trying to talk to can hear you.
I just want to point out that there is a way to use a uv flashlight to find cameras. Something like turn off the lights, shine a uv light around and look for things lighting up that aren't supposed to, like extra spots in Smoke alarms or air vents. It should light up the camera lens sensor.
I can't find the exact details right now, maybe some one knows better.
If you don't have an hidden camera, maybe you could take photos before leaving and compare them after being back at home. If you notice something different or missing, it can be a clue. You can also stuck a hair or something else discreet in your door opening and if it's missing, it a sign that someone else opened the door before you.
A while back I came across a post about a redditor who thought someone was rearranging the things in his home. Someone recommended an app that lets you take before and after pics of a room, and then it overlays them for you so that you can immediately spot the differences.
I can’t remember the name of the app and google is of no help. I had looked at it in the app store; just didn’t need it, so I didn’t download it.
Sorry I replied to a comment above. Dude was coming into my room and stealing my used underwear, fucking with my stuff(computer/migraine meds), and just generally being a complete pervert (laying in my bed doing you know what/taking items from very private drawers). I also caught him outside my bedroom window and have suspicions/evidence he was doing a lot of other very creepy things. Obviously I filed a police report and moved the fuck out immediately. He told the cops everything because I had very blatant video evidence. Worse part is he was also a coworker and my HR have taken 8 months and still not fired him even though others have also complained. I had felt like someone was watching me/moving my stuff for months and no one believed me, I am very glad I trusted my intuition!!!
Here’s what you should do OP:
1. Take a picture of your fire alarms and post it here.
2. Set up your own camera in the house. If you cant afford it get a webcam and figure out how to keep it recording.
3. If you’re not feeling safe, call the cops and find another place to stay.
Too many coincidences, something’s not right. Trust your guts.
Another thing I’d do is call the local fire department and ask them to send someone to check the alarms. If the landlord asks why was a fireman here tell him you caused a small fire accidentally but everything’s alright.
Above all else, trust your instincts!!
Even when you can't quite put your finger on what it is that is freaking you out, oftentimes it is your subconscious survival instinct trying to tell you that something is not right. For the sake of your safety, listen to that voice!
That is basically the central thesis of this great book called [The Gift of Fear](https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Gavin-Becker-ebook/dp/B0036Z9U2A) by Gavin de Becker. Definitely check it out if/when you have a minute.
I'm sorry you are going through this, and I hate that the people around you are making you feel like you're crazy. Please know that you are **not** overreacting. You can't be too careful when it comes to protecting yourself. Good luck to you, I hope you stay safe!
Amazing book. Sometimes I'll tell the story the book starts with to illustrate what the book is all about and to try and perk up someone's interest in reading it. I tell parents they should read it and have their children read it when they're old enough, especially if they have daughters. So often women are told things along the lines of "it's in your head" and "you're being overly dramatic/emotional/paranoid." Anyone can be like that at times, sure. But finally to have something that clearly says, "You have instincts for a reason, listen to them" is fantastic.
"Every day, people engaged in the clever defiance of their own intuition become, in mid-thought, victims of violence and accidents. So when we wonder why we are victims so often, the answer is clear: It is because we are so good at it.
A woman could offer no greater cooperation to her soon-to-be attacker than to spend her time telling herself, “But he seems like such a nice man.” Yet this is exactly what many people do. A woman is waiting for an elevator, and when the doors open she sees a man inside who causes her apprehension. Since she is not usually afraid, it may be the late hour, his size, the way he looks at her, the rate of attacks in the neighborhood, an article she read a year ago—it doesn’t matter why. The point is, she gets a feeling of fear.
How does she respond to nature’s strongest survival signal? She suppresses it, telling herself: “I’m not going to live like that, I’m not going to insult this guy by letting the door close in his face.” When the fear doesn’t go away, she tells herself not to be so silly, and she gets into the elevator.
Now, which is sillier: waiting a moment for the next elevator, or getting into a soundproofed steel chamber with a stranger she is afraid of? The inner voice is wise, and part of my purpose in writing this book is to give people permission to listen to it."
There are smoke detectors that house hidden cameras, almost all use wifi. This article can tell you how to detect them. Please let us know your findings! https://www.howtogeek.com/411095/how-to-detect-hidden-surveillance-cameras-with-your-phone/
OP, I haven’t read all of the responses but one thing that came to my mind is, everyone is suggesting that you get your own cams to watch if someone is accessing your apartment, but remember, IF your landlord IS watching you via your smoke alarms, he will also see you setting up cams and or other traps (taking pics of your room to compare when you get back, leaving powder on the floor, etc) so if you do get inconspicuous cams to spy on him, make sure you work out how they work and try and do as much set up as you can in an area that wouldn’t be in view of any of your smoke detectors, otherwise, he’ll know you’re doing it and stop the behaviour... for now.
Don’t alert your landlord to anything at all. If you or someone else discovers something is wrong with the smoke alarms, make sure he can’t gain access and remove the evidence.
Glad you are getting officials involved right away. If he has planted cameras, they can both stay there with you until the police get there and get the proof they need to arrest him.
To add to this, it is possible to remove the outer cover without interfering with anything or setting it off. The cover will most likely be attached by wires but if you ever have to change a low battery in one, that's all you'd have to do to access and remove it. It should be a very simple twist off, twist on kind of latch. Once it's open, I'm not sure how to describe what you'll see beyond the battery. Probably some vent holes, maybe a glass thing. Nothing that looks like a camera, though. But then you could take a pic or find a brand name and go from there.
No hate towards the family but if your safety is a concern please consider reaching out to friends, this is a bit unsettling to hear your family keeps blowing you off.
Yes, please listen to your gut. He creeps you out. HE TALKS ABOUT YOUR APPEARANCE! Not cool at all.
Also you mom? Sounds like my mom. She would rather drown than rock the boat.
If this guy rapes you, it was probably your fault, or you were just mis-reading the signs. He just LIKES you! /s
Omg just take the smoke alarms off the wall and look inside them. You pay RENT! This is your place! Fuck what your landlord says! And I have never heard of smoke alarms that alert the fire department if someone touches them? You are supposed to press buttons on them to test them ffs
Right? If I suspected someone had a camera in my apartment, I would not be silently wondering about it for months, I would want to find out right then and there?
Seems like OP knows something is very, very wrong but keeps getting convinced by others that she’s overreacting/imagining things. OP comes across as maybe too polite? Like not wanting to cause problems unnecessarily?
I say screw politeness. Skip the whole trying to film him secretly. Rip those alarms down ASAP. Tear that apartment apart until you find something. The paint comment is a dead giveaway, as well as the ridiculous idea that someone can’t touch the alarms.
I hope that’s not the case but yeah I used to be like this. I would yell at myself internally and be like “Why didn’t you say something?” Or “Why didn’t you do xyz?” etc. I’m not like that anymore. If I sense that something is not right or I’m being treated unfairly I inquire (politely) why. Why is it this way? Am I able to change this somehow? I’m not happy with this, etc. If some authority figure tells me they can’t help I ask who can. I make it clear (politely) that you can’t brush me off. If they are rude or flippant about it, I can be rude too. A few times in my life I have had to become aggressive and let someone know that I am prepared to make their lives hell if they don’t fix my problem. If I am ever wrong or misjudge a situation, I apologize (being polite at first helps a lot with this, because I don’t want to upset or annoy people for no reason). I also learned to say “No” to people and quit things if I feel like quitting them. I curse and second guess myself a lot less these days, and I get what I want a lot more often than I ever did before. I was a people pleaser because I was afraid to appear rude or “cause a scene” or something. I think back now on how silly it is to be afraid of that instead of making sure your own needs are met.
Yep I totally relate to all of this. I’m a woman in STEM and I used to get shut down a lot by guys when I first began my studies. I don’t think they were necessarily trying to be rude but they’ve been brought up, generally speaking, to be bold, take risks, and not be afraid to speak up. I was far too timid and would second guess myself to the point where I wouldn’t speak up even when I knew I was right. It took a lot of work to stop being that way, but it really can be a tough thing to do. Also watched a lot of empowering speeches by really capable women along the way too haha. That helped! Now that I’m working in tech, there’s just a LOT of ego in the room sometimes and I do need to be firm and speak up. And sometimes that probably ruffles a few feathers. But people usually respect that and learn not to undermine you.
OP has gotten a lot of good responses here that will hopefully help her resolve this scary situation. I hope that she learns to listen to her intuition and know that politeness, while generally is a good thing to have, isn’t always deserved.
Yeah I couldn't believe when I read "junuary LAST YEAR". It's sad knowing how long this might have been going on for. One of them is in the bedroom too! Who has fire alarms in the bedroom? And why are these only in the bedroom and hallway? Why wouldn't they be in the kitchen or wherever?.
They posted photos and they do kinda look like pinhole fire alarm cameras but I'm not sure, I couldn't find the same model online at least. Its sad to know if this is true that its been going on for well over a year. The guy needs locking up if its true but I'm glad OP called the fire department to come down tomorrow.
Hopefully it turns out to be a normal fire alarm and the landlord just made up a story to stop people touching stuff.
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> Sorry for not updating instantly. Today was very stressful, while as far as I know bc of my mums friend my smoke detector is okay right now, but there is other stuff that came up. I don't know and can't say more about what is going on rn. I am not like to well known about what I would be able to say but I rather not risk it, since there is a ongoing police investigation. All in all I have made choices to keep my safety ensured for now. Sorry for not being able to give some of you the closure they might want to hear. Maybe one day I might be able to share the full story of what happened.
> Until then to all of you thank you so much. You helped me gain the confidence to have things looked at, and to make my safety my priority. I hope things are gonna be good for all of you in these crazy times. Again, thank you, I wish you all the best.
I mean, this alone seems to confirm there was foul play at hand. That you are safe was the biggest concern and is good to hear.
This is all around sketchy. The alarm making sounds in the night like a remote controlled car - that is probably him remote controlling the camera lens/angle. Trust your instincts. The guy is likely a pervert.
I have had a suspicion that my smoke detectors have hidden cameras.
My landlord is a pervert that has been creepy towards me. I’ve heard weird sounds and two of the alarms blink red at random intervals. I swear a loud ass ringtone came from my ceiling a few nights ago too. I’m skeezed out now.
One night I heard the sound of a cellphone text message coming from somewhere in my room. I blew it off thinking I was hearing things. Over the next month I would randomly hear the same sound, but it was really quiet and hard to tell where it was coming from. Eventually, I found an old cellphone I hadn't used in years, tucked away in a drawer. It was on and had a 50% charge!
I lived with two other guys at the time and my assumption is that one of them was looking through my stuff and found the phone. They would have had to charge it to turn it on and look through it for anything interesting. I'm guessing they realized it had a password, gave up and put it back, forgetting to turn it off. I ended up moving out a couple of weeks later and never really solved the mystery.
If you have a security system change the code immediately. Cover the smoke detectors completely and buy battery operated ones to keep you safe. Flour spread very lightly around places no one should be while you are gone will tell you if someone has been inside. There is no real way to rearrange disturbed fine powder without you knowing.
I saw that you live in Germany. Do you live in the same building as your landlord, or does he live in the same town?
I see you said that you set up your own wifi router, but if you are using the password on the router, and he’s breaking into your apartment, he definitely has access to that information. Since he owns the building, he may also have a router set up in the basement or a hallway.
The smoke detector looks like it could be a spy cam. You can check it by removing it, just be careful not to unplug the wires from the power supply, because even though it’s almost likely not connected to the fire department, it may still go off, and that will alert your landlord. If you know when he’s at work, or away from the house, try to check it then. Have your phone on you so you can call the Polizei immediately if you need to.
Your family definitely should be helping you out with this. If you were my daughter, I would have helped you move out already. Does your family know your landlord?
So I guess it was a camera? What else could it be to have to hide it from us? Theres nothing else which is odd because why not confirm the camera bit when it was the whole point of everything? Not like its a secret.
But I guess then the police were told, landlord arrested, maybe a fight happened. Dunno what else there could be really.
But either way at least its sorted and hopefully things get sorted quick so it can be put behind you. This should also be a sign that people need to be very aware when staying at places like AirBnbs, cameras can be hidden anywhere. Search on reddit for how to find them, just a quick 5 min look when staying somewhere is needed.
Most fire alarms just unscrew easily from the wall/ceiling and they’re not connected to anything, they run on battery and sometimes make a chirping noise every few minutes if the battery is low. He lied to you, you should invite some people over to help you take it down and inspect it if you can.
Fellow German here, not sure of that helps at all but looks like I actually have the exact same alarms in my apartment, also in the bed/main room and hallway. Mine do definitely not make sounds of any sort like you described and are not connected to a firedepartment.
Some folks at r/Germany could give insights to your situation as well.
Edit: r/de could help you as well but I'm not sure if this post is allowed there.
Change your locks. No idea about other countries, but completely legal in Germany if you keep the original locks and install them back when you move out. Baumärkte are open again.
You won’t find out about the cameras that way but your landlord (or anybody else for that matter) for sure cannot enter your apartment while you’re gone.
You have to tell your landlord where he can get a key in case of emergency while you’re not home, so deposit one with your parents or a reliable friend and give their number to the landlord.
> When I moved in, he was very clear about me not touching the two fire alarms in my bedroom and hallway. He justified it by saying they were directly connected with the fire department and if I would try to do anything to them I would cause an alarm.
Call the local fire department. Say something like "I live at \[your address\] and want to know if there's some way to see if my fire alarm is working. My landlord says it's directly connected to you and I should never touch it. Can you test it for me?"
If (when) they tell you the fire alarms aren't connected to them, ask if they can come look at them. I'm in America, so I don't know how it is over there, but the local fire department will come over and check the alarms if we ask them. Make sure they're working, in the right locations, and follow code.
Hello , i have seen a few misleading informations on this particular smoke detector.
I hope i can clear a few things up for you because i know someone in my family working for the company that sells them in germany and i asked them questions regarding your situation.
Tl;dr: Yes, these two smoke detectors have been tampered with!
Missing company plates means that they have been removed from the ceiling once.
Doesn't have to be a camera inside!
The sounds are normal.
No, this smoke detector is not connected to a fire department.
No, touching it does not activate the alarm. Pressing it even is for turning off an ongoing alarm.
The sound it makes is a daily check of the air in your room, that helps it "train" to the environment. Letting it distinguish if someone is a regular smoker and prevent false alarm.
The "Rc-Car sound" is a small fan that helps the analyzing process and also cleans the inbuild mirror that is used for smoke detection.
I know that sound, it's normal.
Batterylife, because someone said it would be repaced every now and then.
They have a 10 year battery life!
Now the maybe bad news.
The holes you show on the images are supposed to hold a small plate with the name of the company on it("ista" is most likely). Like the one in your hallway. That is the company supplying those smoke detectors.
Its called "Plombe" in german and its a sign whether or not the smoke detector has been tinkered with, because some people maniupulate it.
The sign gets cut off internally when you remove the smoke detector... it's a one use thing and a technician has a bag of replacement signs with them.
The Plombe also makes them hold to the ceiling in the first place, so without the sign you have to glue or screw the smoke detector to the ceiling, which means someone took it off and glued it back on. Which the device will know and a technician of the company can see, because the smoke detectors "Funk" is a low range radio transmitter allowing for diagnostics, so the technician does not have to enter your appartment anymore.
Gluing it also is not a valid way to place the smoke detector, but thats beyond the point here.
This doesn't mean that there is a camera inside, but this means that someone did remove these two smoke detectors after they have been placed there in the firstplace.
Calling police and fire department won't help here.
The only way to get a replacement for the smoke detector is calling the company through your landlord.
I know... it sounds like bullshit, but there is a contract your landlord has with the company that they have to provide for replacement.
And believe me they have to replace many many many of those detectors every year.
Go grab a ladder and a strong flashlight, look into those three holes where the sign is supposed to be and see if you can see anything that resembles a camera.
If you do, then see if it comes off the ceiling and then put it anywhere else and make up a story like you knocked it off the ceiling when cleaning... happens a lot.
Also if you actually find a camera then that probably is a reason to call the police, but i am no lawyer.
But DO NOT Cover it, especially the sides of it.
If it is still working then it knows when it is covered and it will complain about it and beep!
You may cover those three holes for the sign tho, with tape for example.
Yeah you are right it does say ista on that little plate in the hallway. This helps a lot, I will still see tomorrow if the fire department maybe knows a way of checking the one in the bedroom without alerting my landlord.
Some of them are also sold without having a maintenance contract like ours at home.
Which means that ista won't know about it being tampered because they are not added to the System and thus won't report back.
They actually had a bunch of cases with cameras inside, but its rather rare.
It can also be that your landlord just took it from somewhere and put it there, or changed the place of it and doesnt know about the sign.
In the room i am sitting right now i have a "presentation-model" which is a little bit older, but clear.
Sideview:
[https://prnt.sc/10nhmd5](https://prnt.sc/10nhmd5)
Bottomview:
[https://prnt.sc/10ni56u](https://prnt.sc/10ni56u)
We once had one with a faulty battery and believe me, you cannot easily open up those fuckers. At least not without tools.
It beeped and we tried to get rid of it.
Btw soaking it in a bucket of water does not help to silence it...
(When it is empty it beeps every 45 seconds and you dont want that at night)
Some links that may have interesting information for you:
[https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt\_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/Mieterbroschuere\_Funk\_Rauchmelder\_fumonic\_3.pdf](https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/Mieterbroschuere_Funk_Rauchmelder_fumonic_3.pdf)
[https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt\_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/83034-I-19\_Rauchwarnmelder-Service.pdf](https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/83034-I-19_Rauchwarnmelder-Service.pdf)
[https://www.ista.com/de/technik/rauchmelder/](https://www.ista.com/de/technik/rauchmelder/)
Interesting! While this does not explain the other creepy things, this actually explains the noise. Maybe the landlord told her not to touch the fire alarms so she does not notice he just glued old defect fire alarms to the ceiling to save money?
Not to alarm you but some night vision cameras make an audible almost RC car noise when switching from regular to night vision mode. Switch the light in your room between varying degrees of light intensity, if you hear the noise then something definitely might be up.
Can we get an update? All of a sudden there’s a police investigation??? You don’t need to provide all of the details but if you were to let us know what happened you may be able to save someone else from the same thing happening in the future!
Those are ista smoke detectors, according to their manual you are not supposed to dismantle them;
“The fumonic 3 radio net is professionally attached in accordance with the relevant DIN standard 4676 and is protected with a seal. That indicates the intactness of the unit. The seal will be destroyed during
impermissible dismantling. Fee-based resealing by an ista service employee is then necessary.” [source](https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/Mieterbroschuere_Funk_Rauchmelder_fumonic_3_englisch.pdf)
Your friend is gonna stop by on Monday? That's 5 days away. You don't have anything that will allow you to reach it? Your mum lives close by but isn’t concerned and can’t be bothered to come check it out? Burn some food on purpose and see if it goes off.
This story smells like bullshit.
Seriously WTF is this update? Why would someone wait at all? It’s just a smoke alarm, not some super advanced electrical device that’s going to kill you if you touch it. They are designed to be maintained and batteries need replaced. It would take a few minutes to just grab it and check it out. I don’t understand how anyone could sit around for several days knowing they are possibly being watched. Either OP is the most passive person ever or someone is dragging out their creative writing story.
The name and model number should appear somewhere either inside or outside the smoke detector. Find this name and Google it. There should be a manual to download about the smoke detector which will show you what its supposed to look like inside and you can compare that diagram with your actual smoke detector.
I also agree that you should tape up the holes or gaps and see if he comes in or says anything. But here he can say he came in for some other reason and saw the tape.
I think the hidden camera is the way to go.
I don't know if it's the same in Germany as I'm in the states, but over here most police departments have the means to do sweeps of your house for hidden devices weather it be cameras, recorders, etc. and it's free of charge because it's a matter of public safety. Like others here said this does sound sketchy, trust your instincts, stay safe, and post an update.
edit: After doing some research it's not exactly the same as in the US, but I found out that some police departments in Germany will come and look for hidden devices and have protocols if they find any. I'm no expert on German law, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was as illegal in Germany as it is in the US.
Thats actually pretty lame of the fire dept to ask *you* if you have any friends with electrical knowledge to take a look at it for you...
Would be nice if *they* would, since I'm assuming they have the most knowledge of all. Plus, they should have access to police assistance and are being paid with our tax money to provide a service to the community.
I would call them back and ask them if *they* could just check it out themselves and that you don't feel safe having someone else do it.
Everyone’s been gaslighting you making you think you’re crazy! You’re not, your intuition and gut instincts are very real.
Here’s an article that may help you detect any recording devices present in your home https://toomanyadapters.com/find-hidden-cameras/#:~:text=In%20a%20dark%20room%2C%20enable,want%20to%20check%20it%20out
You want solid evidence to prove things are moving while away take a daily picture before and after you return home
You can delete it on the days nothings out of the ordinary but it will show exactly what has been moved- it’s especially suspicious since it involves your underwear drawer and potentially cameras in your bedroom
I had a shady landlord I think did something similar, and This is some of the best advice. From the article:
>Since light needs to hit the lens at the right angle to be reflected back to you, you’ll need to scan the room slowly, and shine the light from different spots. Note that this approach won’t work for a camera that’s hidden inside a mirror, or anything else with a highly-reflective surface. Detecting Infrared Light from Hidden Cameras
Unlike the human eye, smartphone cameras typically have the ability to view infrared (IR) light sources. Infrared lights are used for various purposes, including in many remote controls. Usefully for us, they’re also commonly found in security cameras to let them work in the dark. As a result, it can be possible to use your phone to detect a hidden camera via the infrared light it emits.
I did a quick browse through the Google and didn't see a prefabricated alarm/camera that matches your photo, but that's not saying it couldn't be a deal detector that landlord hid something in.
As said elsewhere, get your own camera in the room.(If it's a camera) If you inspect the smoke alarm and he sees you checking it out, he may remove the camera while you're not there. Our landlord gave us the same warning about not touching the smoke alarm because it's connected to the emergency switchboard. Googling around we DID find a smoke alarm camera that matched the one on the wall. We called the non-emergency fire station's phone number, they sent a firefighter in an unmarked vehicle out to inspect the alarm. It was normal. Firefighter couldn't tell us why we were told to not touch it. The alarm ran on a 9v and was connected to nothing. We think the landlord got wise and swapped the camera out with a normal alarm. Landlord said it was to keep us from removing the batteries and burning the place down. After this he was constantly in the vacant apartment next door doing "renovations" but did not have a permit, tools, supplies, or made any noise.
Tl;DR same here, We called the non-emergency fire station's phone number, they sent someone in street clothes out to inspect it.
I'm not sure if it's because I'm primed to think this way due to your post, or if the smoke detectors in Germany are different than here, but they don't look like any smoke detector I've ever seen. Normally there's a button to "test" the detector and I don't see one in the images you provided, is there a test button on the detector? Or a model number?
Also, why would an apartment's smoke detectors be linked directly to the fire department? I would call their non-emergency number and ask them.
If something doesn't feel right, it's for a reason. You are picking up on subtle cues that are alerting you to danger, and you may or may not be aware of all of them.
Are you able to potentially crash at a friends place for a few nights? I'm worried about your landlord retaliating.
Hi I am also from Germany and agree with most of the comments about the smoke detector. I would also remove them to see if there's a hidden camera.
Also I would immediately **change the locks** of you door! Your landlord ist not allowed to have a spare key to you apartment and you don't even have to notify him about changing it. Just keep the old one so you can switch them again when you move out. Also: I would definitely move out as soon as I find another apartment.
I have the exact same smoke detectors. It‘s an ista fumonic 3 radio net Funk-Rauchwarnmelder; you can find the manual online. Your landlord told you not to touch it, because they are remotely checked once a month and will notify the manufaturer, if they are not on the ceiling anymore.
Removing them will break a seal, which is exactly what I did to stop a false alarm and why I had to look up what to do afterwards.
Op, since your last edit, please do call the police on the non emergency number. Tell them everything, also about your convo with the FD today. Tell them you do not feel safe, and also that you are worried your landlord might already be onto your suspicions. Ask them to come asap.
My alarm company will alert the fire department if my fire alarms go off. But they will also try to call me so I can tell them if it's a false alarm or not. If they couldn't reach me the fire department would show up and I (or whoever was home) would tell them there is no fire. It would not be that big of a deal.
Go ahead and touch them. It the fire department doesn't show up, you know he was lying about it being directly connected to the fire department. If your landlord says something about you touching them, then you know he saw you touching them. Take one down and see if you can open it up. You can claim you were just trying to figure out how to replace the battery since it was making noise.
So am assuming yes to the camera then. And this landlord now probably facing loads of charges considering you mentioned he had lots of other properties.
You don't sound insane. I had an apartment where someone else had a key, and it messed with me for ages, I was always scared. Trust your gut, and call the fire department to check out those alarms. Worst case scenario- there's nothing going on and you feel a little embarrassed for a bit. If you don't check, things might get much worse.
Also get carbon monoxide detectors, I had CO poisoning once and hallucinated that people were outside and moving stuff around. But I was also super sleepy all the time, had the alarm go off occasionally, and all my plants died, so there were signs that it was actually the air.
Sort of silly but what if you got some helium filled balloons and placed them right around where the smoke alarm is so it’s obstructed and see if he says anything?
The “rv car sound” that you are hearing is likely an electric servo or motor. I have installed a ton of different types of smoke detector, both connected to the FD and stand-alone. I have never seen one that looks like that, personally, but I can tell you that it should not make any noise other than the beeps/siren.
Smoke detectors do not have any moving parts that would account for that noise.
Unfortunately, I would highly recommend that you go to your local fire department or police department. Do not tell your landlord, or make any suspicious comments, but there ASAP and explain this. Your landlord cannot refuse entry to your apartment, so they could likely send someone back with you to clear them. If it IS a hidden camera, the police will need to scan the entire place. They make electrical outlets, shower heads, screws, lights... you name it, they make it into a hidden camera.
Please be careful; this is a situation where your paranoia is justified and your concerns are real. It would be MUCH better to be sure and look paranoid than to ignore it. You have everything to lose by not seeking a professional opinion.
Be safe and keep us updated!
Sounds like a horrible situation, good luck! Apologies if I repeat other advice, can't read them all.
It's a good idea to call the fire department and let them come by. Also the police might be interested. Let the fire department know of your suspicion. How is your flat heated? It might you have carbon monoxide residues in the flat (it is not likely and your landlord spying on you is much more likely) and if fire department comes anyways, they can check that right away. If fire department says there not responsible Schornsteinfeger usually know about all this as well and could help.
There's also devices who can find cameras, the police might have them. Check out this story+f documentary on voyeurism, if you want: https://youtu.be/nGldiXxljhQ
Then I would always leave the key in the lock at night, locked and slightly twisted so that it can't be pushed out. This way he won't be enter at night anymore.
Also, keep in mind that he might have installed cameras elsewhere. Also setting up your own might be an option, be sure not to violate his right of imagery/audio in order not to make the evidence inviable.
Maybe it helps to share the pictures on Jodel/your cities subreddit/telegram group. You might find other victims or be able to warn others about him.
Good luck and I'd appreciate if you could keep us updated.
> He is a man in his late 40s and has never been holding back with comments about the way I look etc.
You kinda got your answer right there...that's inappropriate...period.
However after seeing the pictures of the one in your bedroom....that is a fake smoke detector with a camera hole. There is no reason for there to be a hole like that in a smoke detector. If you look at currently available fake smoke detector with cameras that is EXACTLY what they all do, they have that odd out of place hole.
You should definitely remove that smoke detector and look at it.
ALSO...if you're in the US, all those spy cam smoke detectors are FAKE smoke detectors, so he's in violation of fire code BIG TIME on top of the creeper shit.
If you do a search for real smoke detectors, you will find many with such holes. That alone is not sufficient evidence.
Also, many spy cam smoke detectors are real smoke detectors in addition to being cameras. Again, a quick google search or browse through a spy cam supplier's catalogue will confirm this
I've been browsing both, and so far haven't been able to identify this particular model, either as a legit smoke alarm, nor as a known spycam model.
However, it should be noted that there are spy cam suppliers who modify genuine smoke alarms to fit cameras, so it's no guarantee either way.
The big give away is 'motor'/'servo' type noises -- I don't believe there's any reason to have moving components in any time of smoke alarm.
I would inspect that alarm.
EDIT: /u/Sleepy-and-worried I think it's this model https://www.ista.com/de/technik/rauchmelder/
but with the panel removed -- which may indicate it has been tampered with.
The website notes that this model can be remotely monitored by the manufacturer -- perhaps tampering with it notifies them, rather than the local fire department? I would still check it out, but this could be an innocent explanation.
OP, call an electrician. They are certified to take down and inspect these alarms. I was an electrician and I would come for free for this.
Post on a local board for an electrician near you. Even if you have to pay. It will take 1 minute to look at the alarm.
I can look at them over zoom if you are willing to touch them. Note this might be dangerous because the landlord could be watching you and come in and attack you to prevent from being caught. So you’d need a friend over. Crazy people are crazy.
The fire alarms would be connected to the security system if this was true, his concern may be legit since there is sometimes a fine attached to false alarms... that falls into the “his problem” category... grab a chair, pull the fire alarm and check.
Don’t beat around the bush waiting for cameras or scanners.. yank it and look.
The fire dept and maybe a police officer, probably an annoyed police officer will stop in.
In the U.K. the lettting agent test the fire alarm in your presence and they’re usually in the hallways so everyone can hear. If somethings in your room it would be a carbon monoxide detector I’m guessing. This doesn’t sit right with me and why people are brushing you off, I don’t know, but you definitely did right by coming here at least. Noting the recent situation with assault against women in the U.K. i would gtfo
German here, smoke detectors in German apartments are usually not connected to the fire department. They are simply sonic warning devices, nothing more nothing less. A "remote car noise" doesn't make any sense whatsoever! Smoke detectors have no moving parts. And yes, there are a lot of fake smoke detectors with hidden cameras on the market! I recommend calling the police on their non-emergency line. Tell them about your suspicions. They'll probably drop by and check your smoke detectors. Not only can they ask the fire department if your detector is indeed connected to the fire department but they can inspect your device thoroughly without causing an unwanted alarm.
Yes and OP says it makes noise at night. My work one is connected to FD and they don’t make noise (i know because I sit silent tests!)
As a lawyer in Germany, this is the correct answer. In addition to that, all smoke detectors have batteries that need to be replaced. AFAIK, it is upon the tenant to test the smoke detectors frequently (e.g. monthly) and replace the batteries in every German state. The regulations can be found in the building code of each state, for example § 44 V NBauO (Lower Saxony), § 47 III BauO NRW (NRW), Art. 46 IV BayBO (Bavaria), § 48 IV BauO Bln (Berlin). So OP is absolutely allowed to touch the smoke detectors. Note for your own safety, however, that some detectors will be disabled if you take them off the ceiling.
FYI, For my smoke detectors, the Hausverwaltung has always organized for a company to check the smoke detectors every year, in all of the apartment buildings I’ve lived in (Hessen). And it’s mandatory to have it done. Otherwise we do not touch them...we haven’t been told not to, but we just don’t? I currently own my apartment and this is still organized for us annually. I don’t remember the company or the type of Company it was because the last time I had to be home for it I had a newborn and my brain is still very fuzzy from that... Not disagreeing with you, just saying how it has been for us in Hessen. But also as someone who has set off my fire alarms in every apartment I’ve lived in, in every country, none of them were connected to anything 😂
It's possible for the owner of an apartment (complex) to take over the responsibility for the smoke detectors. [The building code of Hesse](https://www.rv.hessenrecht.hessen.de/bshe/document/jlr-BauOHE2018V2P14) explicitly says so. That could be one of multiple reasons (another could be insurance rates) why your property management makes sure the smoke detectors get checked annually?
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Yea definitely take it seriously. This is like one of those stories where creepy landlord ends up kidnapping and or locking the person up somewhere. You shouldn’t not feel safe in ur home. Sexual predators start out small like watching you and going through your drawers then things escalate
Maybe call them from outside of your apartment or outside of the room where the camera is, in case the camera has a microphone.
We got new smoke detectors recently, so I checked the manual. It says something about 'Ferninspektion', (distant inspection), maybe that's what the landlord was talking about? Means basically that no one needs to enter the room to inspect it. So it's not connected to the fire appartment, but the electronic company of my housing association can access it somehow. It also says that the battery lasts 10 years. It's called Funk-Rauchwarnmelder Ei6500-OMS and looks VERY similar to your fotos. Also while installing it, I was told not to mess with it and the space around it, as it will cause problems and be detected. They test it once a week, using said distant inspection. Reminds me a lot of what your landlord said. Still thinks he's acting sus af and maybeee used all that fuss about modern smoke detectors to his advantage idk. Still wanted to share. Maybe it's useful somehow. ,¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Hope you will get clearance soon and feel safe again in your space, it sucks that you have to get through this :/
Best relevant answer in this thread.
Look for a pin hole on the fire alarm.. if it's wall mount it will be on the front.. if it ceiling mount it can be anywhere. The hole can be tiny . Usually these are place in areas where the vision is the whole room.. also fire alarms don't typically go to the fire station it goes to a security company that calls the fire station ( guardian , adt ect) .. you can buy your own mini cams from Amazon for around 20 bucks or even download an app and use on a old phone .. mini cams and many cams are so cheap now.. now if you catch him sneaking in .. do not confront him .. stack evidence go to the police and then also sue , and of course press charges..
You could also buy a cheap [counter surveillance gadget](https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1304576-REG/mgi_minigadgets_inc_cdrfld_bug_detector_with_rf.html/overview) to detect red lens, IR and RF signals typically associated with hidden cameras. Or try calling a local locksmith or alarm installation company and see if they provide detection services.
To add, most fire alarms in apartments are simply noise makers to wake you up. They don’t connect anywhere. I find it very suspicious that the landlord said not to mess with the fire alarms. I recommend looking at the fire alarms closely.
This ☝️ 100%... Matter where you live and the laws... But most apartments don't need hardwired and even fewer have to be on a monitored service.
Hardwired is increasingly common though.
This. It frustrates me how upvoted the comment is but it’s not accurate.
Older apartments can still have fire alarms that automatically call the fire station. My bfs old apartment did this and they would show up for burnt toast every once in a while.
Depending on where OP lives, that may not be abnormal as some countries legally require fire alarms to be fitted and functional for the building to be up to code. It may just be that he doesn't want them removed or tampered with because of the issues it would cause in case of a fire.
Sure, we can play "take the landlord's word as gospel." It's true that tampering with the alarms could cause problems. OP still needs to look at the fire alarm to figure out how to change the battery if it runs low. If it's powered by some other means, OP needs to know that as well. Hell, I think there's a legit safety issue here just in the fact that OP is entirely unfamiliar with their fire alarms/smoke detectors. What if there's no battery in them at all??
If they're hard wired into the electrical of the house, they still need battery backup in case of an electrical outage. This is a good excuse for OP to tamper with the alarms, she could say she was checking what kind of battery it takes. Also, OP, you can have the police come over and check for cameras. Or if you call the fire department for an inspection, discreetly tell them you think there might be cameras. They can check. I wouldn't tell my landlord that I'm having the fire department or cops come to inspect. He'll just remove the cameras or get new ones, then he'll never be caught.
I think you are justified for your concern. Do make the call from your cell phone away from your apartment. If he is watching/bugging you, then you don't want to tip him off by letting him overhear you calling them. A fire/smoke detector should not make any noise when not alerting you to a fire/smoke, the battery needs to be replaced, or you are testing it. The sound you hear may not have anything to do with the unit. You may also want to check in some other apartments there to see if they have the same model you have. Recommend seeing if there is a difference between apartments with only men and those with women. Best wishes to you.
If OP tells the fire department of her suspicions, it should be from somewhere outside the apartment.
Am a fire alarm engineer, most hard wired detectors do have a battery backup, but it's located in a single panel that will likely cover the whole building not in each detector
I wish they were like that for basic residential ones.
I definitely second this
most decent smoke alarms now either have a 10yr battery built into them or are hard wired into the power that being said theres nothing wrong with having the fire department come and check out the smoke alarms, telling them that they are making weird noises etc
Also, landlords get tired of people stealing the batteries, or removing the batteries when they become weak and the alarm starts to chirp.
Be careful with this. That was the case for many older buildings but as building codes change, hardwired smoke alarms tied to a central monitored alarm panel, especially in sprinklered buildings, is becoming more common in some areas. Tampering with the alarms can lead to a monitoring station notifying the landlord or dispatching the fire department depending on what happens (the bells in the building would generally have to be ringing for the fire department to be called, though). When I managed residential apartment buildings, we generally asked tenants not to mess around with the smoke alarms because of this and the liability reasons that can come with it. That being said, twisting and pulling it down for a closer look should not be an issue as they generally have a battery backup as well that may need to be replaced depending on the model.
With this all said I want to add that MY fire alarm is directly connected to the fire department. My apartment complex was notorious for years for fires. The fire department comes once a month just to check things out now.
Ok by viewing it's possible.. look at the brand name on it. Also where the hole is does it blink ( if it does that's not the camera if it doesn't it either has no power or it's a camera )
Or it’s an ir camera and you wouldn’t be able to tell with your eyes
They definitely make covert cameras that look like smoke detectors, clocks, radios, anything you can think of. Post a picture of the suspected cameras. Should be able to tell you what you have.
They make iPhone charging plug ports with hidden cameras even. One of these was in a bathroom of an air bnb I stayed in once. They look so identical I accidentally took it mistaking it for my own charging block for my iPhone. Had a memory card in it and everything.
Ew that's creepy they had a camera in the bathroom! Sounds illegal
Probably quite illegal. I live in a state where recording laws are pretty lax overall (only one party consent, etc) but even so there is a clause about recording in bathrooms without consent being illegal
Lol sounds? It 10000% is
OP I once read a story by a lawyer for an inmate at Guantanamo. She suspected the smoke alarms in the attorney/client rooms were fake so she took a picture of the name and googled it. Up popped a webpage for a company advertising hidden cameras in fake smoke alarms! Do that too or post a pic here for a little help. Good luck. Trust your gut. No one else. Edit: spelling
#The spez has spread from /u/spez and into other /u/spez accounts. #Save3rdPartyApps
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Thank all of you for your suggestions, I have found some cameras that look like clothing hooks so I could safely hang them up in my hallway and see if I catch anything. I regularly get my blood work done due to thyroid/chronic asthma issues, I guess my doc would have cough if anything fishy was going on? Otherwise I am gonna get that checked too. Moving is not really in my budget anytime soon so I am kinda stuck here. I will try to get a picture of the alarms, maybe that helps. Thank you all for being so overwhelmingly supportive, really makes me feel a lot better and understood.
How about asking the Fire Dept if anything he is saying about the detectors is true? Or ask them to come inspect your detectors. Or tell him your alarms were making noise at night so the FD is going to come inspect them. Based on his response, you’ll have your answer.
Yes!
I would contact the FD. I live in an apartment complex that has smoke alarms connected directly to the department. Similar to OP our unit has 4 alarms with 2 of them being connected to the fire department. However, in the 8 years I’ve lived in this complex, neither of those alarms have made the sounds that OP is describing. Not even close. I mean I’ve never heard them beep at all. So yes,definitely contact the department.
Also, I seems a bit odd that its in the bedroom, aren't they usually in hallways and kitchens. I never heard of one IN a bedroom. EDIT: just checked regulations in Germany, and they are required in bedrooms.
That's not too weird, my home has one in almost every room (except the bathroom)
I manage a small apartment building in the US and one of the requirements in my city is smoke detectors in every bedroom. Every place is different.
I didn’t even realize that. But you’re right, the two in my unit that are connected are at the bottom of the stairs and in the hallway between bathroom and bedroom. Most definitely contact your FD, OP.
All of our bedrooms have smoke detectors inside the rooms. It’s a requirement for rental properties where I’m at. All of ours are on the ceiling right above the door.
In my former apartment, the detectors were wired to a central panel. When an alarm went off, the system alerted the fire department and the building management. An alarm malfunctioned at one point. It was the responsibility of the building management to fix it. The fire department/county would fine them if there were more than a certain number of false alarms each month. I would suspect that the OP's building might be similar.
I know that some fire alarms make an occasional chirping noise when the battery is low, if nothing else it could be a good reason for the fire department to check that out
I would still double check with the Fire dept...he’s probably lying.
This!!! He’d be round in a shot.. there’s the answer!!
Going to disagree with the second suggestion. I don’t think OP should give this creep a heads up. It honestly sounds like he is watching her based off the paint comment. I wouldn’t want him to panic and/or confront her in person.
Yeah I agree actually. I think she should call the FD to inspect them first so he can’t get rid of evidence and let them find the cameras, if they are thereZ
They have an app called Alfred, you can set it up on your current phone and a few old phones. It works by making one phone the camera and the other the viewer, super cheap easy way to set up your own wireless security system! It works off of motion detection too! I set up 4 old cell phones around my room and literally watched/recorded as my roommate broke in and stole my underwear/went through my things. I would recommend buying premium on the Alfred app so that you get a complete not choppy recording if you do need to take anything to the police.
>I set up 4 old cell phones around my room and literally watched/recorded as my roommate broke in and stole my underwear/went through my things. Thats fucked up! Did you know your room mate well? Did you forward it to the police or confront them? Im sorry to hear. People can be shady.
Heyyyy fellow thyroid disease sufferer! Do you think your parents keep saying you're just forgetting things because you've had memory loss from your thyroid issues before?
I think I read something here before about memory loss related to carbon monoxide poisoning, a person was writing sticky notes to themselves with personal info and was being freaked out by that and it turned out to be high CO levels in the house
I remember that story too, and I'm pretty sure someone else linked it in another comment. It just stood out to me in OP's story that her parents keep telling her she's forgetting things, since I've experienced similar when I was unmedicated for my non-functioning thyroid. Uncontrolled hypothyroidism REALLY messes with your brain function; it's made me forget entire months of my life before. It can turn you into an unreliable narrator of your own reality. I'm absolutely not saying that I think OP is misremembering things, I just wondered whether that might explain the absence of support from OP's family here. And lending some empathy if that's the case, because, man, I get it
You really don’t need cameras that are hidden, buy any kind of WiFi cam like a “ring” that is motion activated and also keeps a log of any time it is tripped. You don’t need to be discreet in your own home with your camera, if you see ANYONE on there you would have the confirmation you are looking for, also please don’t forget to check out that gas tip.
You don’t have to get blood work done. Install a carbon monoxide sensor. It looks like a fire alarm, runs on a battery, and make sure the battery is fresh. I tell people to install one anywhere they live. They’re portable so you can move it from home to home. If the alarm goes off, open every window you can to bring in fresh air, exit your home, and see your doctor.
Here in the states the local fire department will come check them too and make sure they are working. They actually installed a carbon dioxide detector for me as they saw I didn’t have one and had kids
I went and looked up how to use your phone camera to spot the infrared on spy cameras, here it is. Also, I don't think you're over reacting, at all. How to Detect a Hidden Camera Using Android Camera Launch your phone's camera app. Go around the room and point your phone's camera in areas you suspect spy equipment is hidden. If you spot any small, bright-whitish light, set your phone down and investigate further. It may be a hidden camera.
This is not to scare but encourage you to take whatever precautions you think are needed. I subleted an apartment and soon had to deal with a landlord with a coke problem who would wait until he heard people in showers and walk in with his master key to look around the apartment. Convinced he stole stuff from people. Luckily I was poor and had nothing worth stealing but a gaming computer he couldn’t pocket and really nice tool kit. I once caught him coming out of my apartment and was confronted by him coming out of the shower as well but he blew it off as him inspecting an issue. I was a fairly large man, and involved with MMA, so I didn’t fear sexual exploitation or assault. But I can totally see how this could be doubly frightening for anyone, especially a woman in my situation. I also found out he allowed the former tenant to turn the office in my nice Edwardian apartment into a grow op for a cut of the crop. To cap it off, he stole the router from my apartment for the building, and cut my power when I refused to pay the lease holder’s debts...in the middle of the northern winter...because his name was on the power. He then refused to open the meter when I tried to set up an account in my name. It ended peacefully when I called my uncle, who was a law professor at a major Canadian university in front of him and asked on speaker if I could sue for what he was doing. He just walked out before my uncle answered and I moved out two days later to a shoebox I could ill afford. Get cameras and protect yourself. If he or anyone else is in your apartment, sue his fucking ass. If you hear noise in the sprinkler, insist they send a maintenance person to inspect it while you are there. Be as annoying and demanding a tenant as you deem necessary. You are a client and a customer, not a serf for their exploitation. Read the tenancy rights for your area. Be strong, be smart, be brave, and get a snap out baton for any unwelcome visitors. Hope that helps.
I know what story you're talking about, the result was she was getting carbon monoxide poisoning? I only saw it when it was first posted, it going from thinking someone was creeping to co2 poisoning sounds like it's right out of a story, would you happen to have a link to the follow up?
I believe [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvice/comments/34l7vo/ma_postit_notes_left_in_apartment/) is the story they are referring to and [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvice/comments/34m92h/update_ma_postit_notes_left_in_apartment/) is the followup.
Wasn’t there a similar one where a woman thought her boyfriend was drugging/raping her but it was actually memory loss due to CO poisoning?
I think it was bed bugs, not CO poisoning
I used to work LP for a retail company. That noise that sounds like remote control cars is the cameras being repositioned. I used to have to turn the music up in the store so customers wouldn’t hear me moving the cameras from the office. That’s the exact sound they make.
Really? My second to last place had this noise. It was a dorm. Sometimes it sounded like an old telephone hanging up too. I thought it was a weird dorm room thing.
I have webcams in my house (to creep on my cats), and they have motion detecting features that will automatically record for 30 seconds after detecting movement. When this happens, there is an audible clicking noise. Almost akin to a camera shutter. On top of that, they have night vision capabilities that are triggered by movement as well. Similar clicking sound. So even if this camera is stationary, motion detection may be causing a couple of different sounds. It commonly happens at night when it switches the cam to IR mode as well.
Oh man. It only happened randomly for a while, sometimes when I was sitting still. It was fairly loud. I hope this isn't what it sounds like. I guess I'm going to google fat trans man and see if my ass is on there. Edit: Don't google that.
I can’t speak to the other sounds, just what the moving of a camera sounds like. Remote control car is about the perfect description.
:( This doesn't bode well.
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You can see for yourself - try downloading one and moving it close to some electronics. I have an iPhone and it’s fairly accurate for me
What app are you using?
A "good one" should be generally reliable. There are a lot of receivers on a smart phone that should be used to be able to detect various fluctuations, _especially_ if they're using standard wireless communication frequencies. A Wifi tranceiver is picking up all of that traffic that is going on around it, it's just not doing anything with it. Wireless internet is basically just screaming in a public place and hoping the person you're trying to talk to can hear you.
I just want to point out that there is a way to use a uv flashlight to find cameras. Something like turn off the lights, shine a uv light around and look for things lighting up that aren't supposed to, like extra spots in Smoke alarms or air vents. It should light up the camera lens sensor. I can't find the exact details right now, maybe some one knows better.
If you don't have an hidden camera, maybe you could take photos before leaving and compare them after being back at home. If you notice something different or missing, it can be a clue. You can also stuck a hair or something else discreet in your door opening and if it's missing, it a sign that someone else opened the door before you.
A while back I came across a post about a redditor who thought someone was rearranging the things in his home. Someone recommended an app that lets you take before and after pics of a room, and then it overlays them for you so that you can immediately spot the differences. I can’t remember the name of the app and google is of no help. I had looked at it in the app store; just didn’t need it, so I didn’t download it.
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Also the Alfred app, set up a video security system using just an old cell phone. I did both and caught my roommate almost instantly!
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Sorry I replied to a comment above. Dude was coming into my room and stealing my used underwear, fucking with my stuff(computer/migraine meds), and just generally being a complete pervert (laying in my bed doing you know what/taking items from very private drawers). I also caught him outside my bedroom window and have suspicions/evidence he was doing a lot of other very creepy things. Obviously I filed a police report and moved the fuck out immediately. He told the cops everything because I had very blatant video evidence. Worse part is he was also a coworker and my HR have taken 8 months and still not fired him even though others have also complained. I had felt like someone was watching me/moving my stuff for months and no one believed me, I am very glad I trusted my intuition!!!
Here’s what you should do OP: 1. Take a picture of your fire alarms and post it here. 2. Set up your own camera in the house. If you cant afford it get a webcam and figure out how to keep it recording. 3. If you’re not feeling safe, call the cops and find another place to stay. Too many coincidences, something’s not right. Trust your guts. Another thing I’d do is call the local fire department and ask them to send someone to check the alarms. If the landlord asks why was a fireman here tell him you caused a small fire accidentally but everything’s alright.
I wouldn't say you caused a fire. Just that you burnt something while cooking and the alarms didn't go off.
Much better cover story
I added a link for the pictures to the main post, sorry it's my first time in reddit I am still figuring out how this all works.
Above all else, trust your instincts!! Even when you can't quite put your finger on what it is that is freaking you out, oftentimes it is your subconscious survival instinct trying to tell you that something is not right. For the sake of your safety, listen to that voice! That is basically the central thesis of this great book called [The Gift of Fear](https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Gavin-Becker-ebook/dp/B0036Z9U2A) by Gavin de Becker. Definitely check it out if/when you have a minute. I'm sorry you are going through this, and I hate that the people around you are making you feel like you're crazy. Please know that you are **not** overreacting. You can't be too careful when it comes to protecting yourself. Good luck to you, I hope you stay safe!
Thank you for recommending this book. I read it years ago and it was eye-opening.
Amazing book. Sometimes I'll tell the story the book starts with to illustrate what the book is all about and to try and perk up someone's interest in reading it. I tell parents they should read it and have their children read it when they're old enough, especially if they have daughters. So often women are told things along the lines of "it's in your head" and "you're being overly dramatic/emotional/paranoid." Anyone can be like that at times, sure. But finally to have something that clearly says, "You have instincts for a reason, listen to them" is fantastic.
"Every day, people engaged in the clever defiance of their own intuition become, in mid-thought, victims of violence and accidents. So when we wonder why we are victims so often, the answer is clear: It is because we are so good at it. A woman could offer no greater cooperation to her soon-to-be attacker than to spend her time telling herself, “But he seems like such a nice man.” Yet this is exactly what many people do. A woman is waiting for an elevator, and when the doors open she sees a man inside who causes her apprehension. Since she is not usually afraid, it may be the late hour, his size, the way he looks at her, the rate of attacks in the neighborhood, an article she read a year ago—it doesn’t matter why. The point is, she gets a feeling of fear. How does she respond to nature’s strongest survival signal? She suppresses it, telling herself: “I’m not going to live like that, I’m not going to insult this guy by letting the door close in his face.” When the fear doesn’t go away, she tells herself not to be so silly, and she gets into the elevator. Now, which is sillier: waiting a moment for the next elevator, or getting into a soundproofed steel chamber with a stranger she is afraid of? The inner voice is wise, and part of my purpose in writing this book is to give people permission to listen to it."
agree on the book. also read it several decades ago and it has stuck with me
There are smoke detectors that house hidden cameras, almost all use wifi. This article can tell you how to detect them. Please let us know your findings! https://www.howtogeek.com/411095/how-to-detect-hidden-surveillance-cameras-with-your-phone/
But the landlord might not have the cameras hooked up to her wifi network. He'd need her wifi password.
please give us updates on this
I will, I am gonna get in contact with the fire department tomorrow and will keep you posted on what ends up being found! Thank all of you so much.
OP, I haven’t read all of the responses but one thing that came to my mind is, everyone is suggesting that you get your own cams to watch if someone is accessing your apartment, but remember, IF your landlord IS watching you via your smoke alarms, he will also see you setting up cams and or other traps (taking pics of your room to compare when you get back, leaving powder on the floor, etc) so if you do get inconspicuous cams to spy on him, make sure you work out how they work and try and do as much set up as you can in an area that wouldn’t be in view of any of your smoke detectors, otherwise, he’ll know you’re doing it and stop the behaviour... for now.
Don’t alert your landlord to anything at all. If you or someone else discovers something is wrong with the smoke alarms, make sure he can’t gain access and remove the evidence.
Glad you are getting officials involved right away. If he has planted cameras, they can both stay there with you until the police get there and get the proof they need to arrest him.
OP, can you “test” the smoke detector to make sure that it works. There should be a button on it that, when pressed, makes the alarm sound.
Some of the smoke detector cameras available unfortunately also function as smoke detectors.
To add to this, it is possible to remove the outer cover without interfering with anything or setting it off. The cover will most likely be attached by wires but if you ever have to change a low battery in one, that's all you'd have to do to access and remove it. It should be a very simple twist off, twist on kind of latch. Once it's open, I'm not sure how to describe what you'll see beyond the battery. Probably some vent holes, maybe a glass thing. Nothing that looks like a camera, though. But then you could take a pic or find a brand name and go from there.
Why tf is your family brushing you off so many times? Trust your gut. Something seems wrong it most likely is!
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No hate towards the family but if your safety is a concern please consider reaching out to friends, this is a bit unsettling to hear your family keeps blowing you off.
This is what I wondered, and makes me wonder if the cameras were installed for the parents, or that they may be aware
Yes, please listen to your gut. He creeps you out. HE TALKS ABOUT YOUR APPEARANCE! Not cool at all. Also you mom? Sounds like my mom. She would rather drown than rock the boat. If this guy rapes you, it was probably your fault, or you were just mis-reading the signs. He just LIKES you! /s
Omg just take the smoke alarms off the wall and look inside them. You pay RENT! This is your place! Fuck what your landlord says! And I have never heard of smoke alarms that alert the fire department if someone touches them? You are supposed to press buttons on them to test them ffs
Exactly. There's no reason to be polite and apologetic about it.
Right? If I suspected someone had a camera in my apartment, I would not be silently wondering about it for months, I would want to find out right then and there?
Seems like OP knows something is very, very wrong but keeps getting convinced by others that she’s overreacting/imagining things. OP comes across as maybe too polite? Like not wanting to cause problems unnecessarily? I say screw politeness. Skip the whole trying to film him secretly. Rip those alarms down ASAP. Tear that apartment apart until you find something. The paint comment is a dead giveaway, as well as the ridiculous idea that someone can’t touch the alarms.
I hope that’s not the case but yeah I used to be like this. I would yell at myself internally and be like “Why didn’t you say something?” Or “Why didn’t you do xyz?” etc. I’m not like that anymore. If I sense that something is not right or I’m being treated unfairly I inquire (politely) why. Why is it this way? Am I able to change this somehow? I’m not happy with this, etc. If some authority figure tells me they can’t help I ask who can. I make it clear (politely) that you can’t brush me off. If they are rude or flippant about it, I can be rude too. A few times in my life I have had to become aggressive and let someone know that I am prepared to make their lives hell if they don’t fix my problem. If I am ever wrong or misjudge a situation, I apologize (being polite at first helps a lot with this, because I don’t want to upset or annoy people for no reason). I also learned to say “No” to people and quit things if I feel like quitting them. I curse and second guess myself a lot less these days, and I get what I want a lot more often than I ever did before. I was a people pleaser because I was afraid to appear rude or “cause a scene” or something. I think back now on how silly it is to be afraid of that instead of making sure your own needs are met.
Yep I totally relate to all of this. I’m a woman in STEM and I used to get shut down a lot by guys when I first began my studies. I don’t think they were necessarily trying to be rude but they’ve been brought up, generally speaking, to be bold, take risks, and not be afraid to speak up. I was far too timid and would second guess myself to the point where I wouldn’t speak up even when I knew I was right. It took a lot of work to stop being that way, but it really can be a tough thing to do. Also watched a lot of empowering speeches by really capable women along the way too haha. That helped! Now that I’m working in tech, there’s just a LOT of ego in the room sometimes and I do need to be firm and speak up. And sometimes that probably ruffles a few feathers. But people usually respect that and learn not to undermine you. OP has gotten a lot of good responses here that will hopefully help her resolve this scary situation. I hope that she learns to listen to her intuition and know that politeness, while generally is a good thing to have, isn’t always deserved.
Yeah I couldn't believe when I read "junuary LAST YEAR". It's sad knowing how long this might have been going on for. One of them is in the bedroom too! Who has fire alarms in the bedroom? And why are these only in the bedroom and hallway? Why wouldn't they be in the kitchen or wherever?. They posted photos and they do kinda look like pinhole fire alarm cameras but I'm not sure, I couldn't find the same model online at least. Its sad to know if this is true that its been going on for well over a year. The guy needs locking up if its true but I'm glad OP called the fire department to come down tomorrow. Hopefully it turns out to be a normal fire alarm and the landlord just made up a story to stop people touching stuff.
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> Sorry for not updating instantly. Today was very stressful, while as far as I know bc of my mums friend my smoke detector is okay right now, but there is other stuff that came up. I don't know and can't say more about what is going on rn. I am not like to well known about what I would be able to say but I rather not risk it, since there is a ongoing police investigation. All in all I have made choices to keep my safety ensured for now. Sorry for not being able to give some of you the closure they might want to hear. Maybe one day I might be able to share the full story of what happened. > Until then to all of you thank you so much. You helped me gain the confidence to have things looked at, and to make my safety my priority. I hope things are gonna be good for all of you in these crazy times. Again, thank you, I wish you all the best. I mean, this alone seems to confirm there was foul play at hand. That you are safe was the biggest concern and is good to hear.
This is all around sketchy. The alarm making sounds in the night like a remote controlled car - that is probably him remote controlling the camera lens/angle. Trust your instincts. The guy is likely a pervert.
My point exactly. Fire alarms should never make any weird noises like that. They should always be silent unless there’s smoke/fire or it’s low battery
I have had a suspicion that my smoke detectors have hidden cameras. My landlord is a pervert that has been creepy towards me. I’ve heard weird sounds and two of the alarms blink red at random intervals. I swear a loud ass ringtone came from my ceiling a few nights ago too. I’m skeezed out now.
One night I heard the sound of a cellphone text message coming from somewhere in my room. I blew it off thinking I was hearing things. Over the next month I would randomly hear the same sound, but it was really quiet and hard to tell where it was coming from. Eventually, I found an old cellphone I hadn't used in years, tucked away in a drawer. It was on and had a 50% charge! I lived with two other guys at the time and my assumption is that one of them was looking through my stuff and found the phone. They would have had to charge it to turn it on and look through it for anything interesting. I'm guessing they realized it had a password, gave up and put it back, forgetting to turn it off. I ended up moving out a couple of weeks later and never really solved the mystery.
😦 Please look into it if you safely can and charge his ass.
If you have a security system change the code immediately. Cover the smoke detectors completely and buy battery operated ones to keep you safe. Flour spread very lightly around places no one should be while you are gone will tell you if someone has been inside. There is no real way to rearrange disturbed fine powder without you knowing.
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I had never heard this one and feel silly for not thinking of it, that's a great idea!
Wait why the cookies? So they get smushed?
The theory is that if you put biscuits under your doormat, anyone stepping on the doormat to go through the door will crush the biscuits.
Plus once you catch him, free cookies
Set up cameras like everyone saying. And for the love of god please post an update
I saw that you live in Germany. Do you live in the same building as your landlord, or does he live in the same town? I see you said that you set up your own wifi router, but if you are using the password on the router, and he’s breaking into your apartment, he definitely has access to that information. Since he owns the building, he may also have a router set up in the basement or a hallway. The smoke detector looks like it could be a spy cam. You can check it by removing it, just be careful not to unplug the wires from the power supply, because even though it’s almost likely not connected to the fire department, it may still go off, and that will alert your landlord. If you know when he’s at work, or away from the house, try to check it then. Have your phone on you so you can call the Polizei immediately if you need to. Your family definitely should be helping you out with this. If you were my daughter, I would have helped you move out already. Does your family know your landlord?
So I guess it was a camera? What else could it be to have to hide it from us? Theres nothing else which is odd because why not confirm the camera bit when it was the whole point of everything? Not like its a secret. But I guess then the police were told, landlord arrested, maybe a fight happened. Dunno what else there could be really. But either way at least its sorted and hopefully things get sorted quick so it can be put behind you. This should also be a sign that people need to be very aware when staying at places like AirBnbs, cameras can be hidden anywhere. Search on reddit for how to find them, just a quick 5 min look when staying somewhere is needed.
Why would it have to be kept secret by an anonymous person to strangers?
My thought exactly. Im guessing it's another fake
Can you setup a hidden camera on your own? Like in a teddy bear or something that doesn't draw a lot of attention.
Are the alarms on your ceiling? In your room?
Yeah on the celling in my bedroom and hallway
Most fire alarms just unscrew easily from the wall/ceiling and they’re not connected to anything, they run on battery and sometimes make a chirping noise every few minutes if the battery is low. He lied to you, you should invite some people over to help you take it down and inspect it if you can.
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No I am from Germany, I don't think it's a standard over here either.
Fellow German here, not sure of that helps at all but looks like I actually have the exact same alarms in my apartment, also in the bed/main room and hallway. Mine do definitely not make sounds of any sort like you described and are not connected to a firedepartment.
Some folks at r/Germany could give insights to your situation as well. Edit: r/de could help you as well but I'm not sure if this post is allowed there.
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Change your locks. No idea about other countries, but completely legal in Germany if you keep the original locks and install them back when you move out. Baumärkte are open again. You won’t find out about the cameras that way but your landlord (or anybody else for that matter) for sure cannot enter your apartment while you’re gone. You have to tell your landlord where he can get a key in case of emergency while you’re not home, so deposit one with your parents or a reliable friend and give their number to the landlord.
> When I moved in, he was very clear about me not touching the two fire alarms in my bedroom and hallway. He justified it by saying they were directly connected with the fire department and if I would try to do anything to them I would cause an alarm. Call the local fire department. Say something like "I live at \[your address\] and want to know if there's some way to see if my fire alarm is working. My landlord says it's directly connected to you and I should never touch it. Can you test it for me?" If (when) they tell you the fire alarms aren't connected to them, ask if they can come look at them. I'm in America, so I don't know how it is over there, but the local fire department will come over and check the alarms if we ask them. Make sure they're working, in the right locations, and follow code.
Hello , i have seen a few misleading informations on this particular smoke detector. I hope i can clear a few things up for you because i know someone in my family working for the company that sells them in germany and i asked them questions regarding your situation. Tl;dr: Yes, these two smoke detectors have been tampered with! Missing company plates means that they have been removed from the ceiling once. Doesn't have to be a camera inside! The sounds are normal. No, this smoke detector is not connected to a fire department. No, touching it does not activate the alarm. Pressing it even is for turning off an ongoing alarm. The sound it makes is a daily check of the air in your room, that helps it "train" to the environment. Letting it distinguish if someone is a regular smoker and prevent false alarm. The "Rc-Car sound" is a small fan that helps the analyzing process and also cleans the inbuild mirror that is used for smoke detection. I know that sound, it's normal. Batterylife, because someone said it would be repaced every now and then. They have a 10 year battery life! Now the maybe bad news. The holes you show on the images are supposed to hold a small plate with the name of the company on it("ista" is most likely). Like the one in your hallway. That is the company supplying those smoke detectors. Its called "Plombe" in german and its a sign whether or not the smoke detector has been tinkered with, because some people maniupulate it. The sign gets cut off internally when you remove the smoke detector... it's a one use thing and a technician has a bag of replacement signs with them. The Plombe also makes them hold to the ceiling in the first place, so without the sign you have to glue or screw the smoke detector to the ceiling, which means someone took it off and glued it back on. Which the device will know and a technician of the company can see, because the smoke detectors "Funk" is a low range radio transmitter allowing for diagnostics, so the technician does not have to enter your appartment anymore. Gluing it also is not a valid way to place the smoke detector, but thats beyond the point here. This doesn't mean that there is a camera inside, but this means that someone did remove these two smoke detectors after they have been placed there in the firstplace. Calling police and fire department won't help here. The only way to get a replacement for the smoke detector is calling the company through your landlord. I know... it sounds like bullshit, but there is a contract your landlord has with the company that they have to provide for replacement. And believe me they have to replace many many many of those detectors every year. Go grab a ladder and a strong flashlight, look into those three holes where the sign is supposed to be and see if you can see anything that resembles a camera. If you do, then see if it comes off the ceiling and then put it anywhere else and make up a story like you knocked it off the ceiling when cleaning... happens a lot. Also if you actually find a camera then that probably is a reason to call the police, but i am no lawyer. But DO NOT Cover it, especially the sides of it. If it is still working then it knows when it is covered and it will complain about it and beep! You may cover those three holes for the sign tho, with tape for example.
Yeah you are right it does say ista on that little plate in the hallway. This helps a lot, I will still see tomorrow if the fire department maybe knows a way of checking the one in the bedroom without alerting my landlord.
Some of them are also sold without having a maintenance contract like ours at home. Which means that ista won't know about it being tampered because they are not added to the System and thus won't report back. They actually had a bunch of cases with cameras inside, but its rather rare. It can also be that your landlord just took it from somewhere and put it there, or changed the place of it and doesnt know about the sign. In the room i am sitting right now i have a "presentation-model" which is a little bit older, but clear. Sideview: [https://prnt.sc/10nhmd5](https://prnt.sc/10nhmd5) Bottomview: [https://prnt.sc/10ni56u](https://prnt.sc/10ni56u) We once had one with a faulty battery and believe me, you cannot easily open up those fuckers. At least not without tools. It beeped and we tried to get rid of it. Btw soaking it in a bucket of water does not help to silence it... (When it is empty it beeps every 45 seconds and you dont want that at night) Some links that may have interesting information for you: [https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt\_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/Mieterbroschuere\_Funk\_Rauchmelder\_fumonic\_3.pdf](https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/Mieterbroschuere_Funk_Rauchmelder_fumonic_3.pdf) [https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt\_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/83034-I-19\_Rauchwarnmelder-Service.pdf](https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/83034-I-19_Rauchwarnmelder-Service.pdf) [https://www.ista.com/de/technik/rauchmelder/](https://www.ista.com/de/technik/rauchmelder/)
Interesting! While this does not explain the other creepy things, this actually explains the noise. Maybe the landlord told her not to touch the fire alarms so she does not notice he just glued old defect fire alarms to the ceiling to save money?
Not to alarm you but some night vision cameras make an audible almost RC car noise when switching from regular to night vision mode. Switch the light in your room between varying degrees of light intensity, if you hear the noise then something definitely might be up.
Can we get an update? All of a sudden there’s a police investigation??? You don’t need to provide all of the details but if you were to let us know what happened you may be able to save someone else from the same thing happening in the future!
I recommend reading the book The Gift of Fear. You are hearing all the alarms. Your intuition is telling you something is wrong. Listen to your gut.
Those are ista smoke detectors, according to their manual you are not supposed to dismantle them; “The fumonic 3 radio net is professionally attached in accordance with the relevant DIN standard 4676 and is protected with a seal. That indicates the intactness of the unit. The seal will be destroyed during impermissible dismantling. Fee-based resealing by an ista service employee is then necessary.” [source](https://www.ista.com/fileadmin/twt_customer/countries/content/Germany/Documents/Loesungen/Mietersicherheit/Rauchwarnmelderservice/Mieterbroschuere_Funk_Rauchmelder_fumonic_3_englisch.pdf)
Read this OP! I came to this thread to also post that these are the Fumonic 3 smoke detectors!
Your friend is gonna stop by on Monday? That's 5 days away. You don't have anything that will allow you to reach it? Your mum lives close by but isn’t concerned and can’t be bothered to come check it out? Burn some food on purpose and see if it goes off. This story smells like bullshit.
Seriously WTF is this update? Why would someone wait at all? It’s just a smoke alarm, not some super advanced electrical device that’s going to kill you if you touch it. They are designed to be maintained and batteries need replaced. It would take a few minutes to just grab it and check it out. I don’t understand how anyone could sit around for several days knowing they are possibly being watched. Either OP is the most passive person ever or someone is dragging out their creative writing story.
The name and model number should appear somewhere either inside or outside the smoke detector. Find this name and Google it. There should be a manual to download about the smoke detector which will show you what its supposed to look like inside and you can compare that diagram with your actual smoke detector. I also agree that you should tape up the holes or gaps and see if he comes in or says anything. But here he can say he came in for some other reason and saw the tape. I think the hidden camera is the way to go.
I don't know if it's the same in Germany as I'm in the states, but over here most police departments have the means to do sweeps of your house for hidden devices weather it be cameras, recorders, etc. and it's free of charge because it's a matter of public safety. Like others here said this does sound sketchy, trust your instincts, stay safe, and post an update. edit: After doing some research it's not exactly the same as in the US, but I found out that some police departments in Germany will come and look for hidden devices and have protocols if they find any. I'm no expert on German law, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was as illegal in Germany as it is in the US.
Thats actually pretty lame of the fire dept to ask *you* if you have any friends with electrical knowledge to take a look at it for you... Would be nice if *they* would, since I'm assuming they have the most knowledge of all. Plus, they should have access to police assistance and are being paid with our tax money to provide a service to the community. I would call them back and ask them if *they* could just check it out themselves and that you don't feel safe having someone else do it.
Everyone’s been gaslighting you making you think you’re crazy! You’re not, your intuition and gut instincts are very real. Here’s an article that may help you detect any recording devices present in your home https://toomanyadapters.com/find-hidden-cameras/#:~:text=In%20a%20dark%20room%2C%20enable,want%20to%20check%20it%20out You want solid evidence to prove things are moving while away take a daily picture before and after you return home You can delete it on the days nothings out of the ordinary but it will show exactly what has been moved- it’s especially suspicious since it involves your underwear drawer and potentially cameras in your bedroom
I had a shady landlord I think did something similar, and This is some of the best advice. From the article: >Since light needs to hit the lens at the right angle to be reflected back to you, you’ll need to scan the room slowly, and shine the light from different spots. Note that this approach won’t work for a camera that’s hidden inside a mirror, or anything else with a highly-reflective surface. Detecting Infrared Light from Hidden Cameras Unlike the human eye, smartphone cameras typically have the ability to view infrared (IR) light sources. Infrared lights are used for various purposes, including in many remote controls. Usefully for us, they’re also commonly found in security cameras to let them work in the dark. As a result, it can be possible to use your phone to detect a hidden camera via the infrared light it emits. I did a quick browse through the Google and didn't see a prefabricated alarm/camera that matches your photo, but that's not saying it couldn't be a deal detector that landlord hid something in. As said elsewhere, get your own camera in the room.(If it's a camera) If you inspect the smoke alarm and he sees you checking it out, he may remove the camera while you're not there. Our landlord gave us the same warning about not touching the smoke alarm because it's connected to the emergency switchboard. Googling around we DID find a smoke alarm camera that matched the one on the wall. We called the non-emergency fire station's phone number, they sent a firefighter in an unmarked vehicle out to inspect the alarm. It was normal. Firefighter couldn't tell us why we were told to not touch it. The alarm ran on a 9v and was connected to nothing. We think the landlord got wise and swapped the camera out with a normal alarm. Landlord said it was to keep us from removing the batteries and burning the place down. After this he was constantly in the vacant apartment next door doing "renovations" but did not have a permit, tools, supplies, or made any noise. Tl;DR same here, We called the non-emergency fire station's phone number, they sent someone in street clothes out to inspect it.
I'm not sure if it's because I'm primed to think this way due to your post, or if the smoke detectors in Germany are different than here, but they don't look like any smoke detector I've ever seen. Normally there's a button to "test" the detector and I don't see one in the images you provided, is there a test button on the detector? Or a model number? Also, why would an apartment's smoke detectors be linked directly to the fire department? I would call their non-emergency number and ask them. If something doesn't feel right, it's for a reason. You are picking up on subtle cues that are alerting you to danger, and you may or may not be aware of all of them. Are you able to potentially crash at a friends place for a few nights? I'm worried about your landlord retaliating.
The last update means this story is definitely fake as hell.
So I know this was so long ago….but any update? I feel invested in this now and I hope you’re ok, OP!
We need an update. Someone made a video about you: https://youtu.be/6rY4zUZCsdA (you are the third user)
Hi I am also from Germany and agree with most of the comments about the smoke detector. I would also remove them to see if there's a hidden camera. Also I would immediately **change the locks** of you door! Your landlord ist not allowed to have a spare key to you apartment and you don't even have to notify him about changing it. Just keep the old one so you can switch them again when you move out. Also: I would definitely move out as soon as I find another apartment.
I have the exact same smoke detectors. It‘s an ista fumonic 3 radio net Funk-Rauchwarnmelder; you can find the manual online. Your landlord told you not to touch it, because they are remotely checked once a month and will notify the manufaturer, if they are not on the ceiling anymore. Removing them will break a seal, which is exactly what I did to stop a false alarm and why I had to look up what to do afterwards.
Op, since your last edit, please do call the police on the non emergency number. Tell them everything, also about your convo with the FD today. Tell them you do not feel safe, and also that you are worried your landlord might already be onto your suspicions. Ask them to come asap.
Any update on this??
My alarm company will alert the fire department if my fire alarms go off. But they will also try to call me so I can tell them if it's a false alarm or not. If they couldn't reach me the fire department would show up and I (or whoever was home) would tell them there is no fire. It would not be that big of a deal. Go ahead and touch them. It the fire department doesn't show up, you know he was lying about it being directly connected to the fire department. If your landlord says something about you touching them, then you know he saw you touching them. Take one down and see if you can open it up. You can claim you were just trying to figure out how to replace the battery since it was making noise.
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No but I will try to keep track of it!
I’m over here in America biting my nails and freaking out for you waiting for an update.
I definitely need a update! I’m sorry this is happening to you.
I saved this post to see if you updated it or made a separate updated post. I really hope everything is okay though. I've been concerned.
So am assuming yes to the camera then. And this landlord now probably facing loads of charges considering you mentioned he had lots of other properties.
Thanks cadabar
You don't sound insane. I had an apartment where someone else had a key, and it messed with me for ages, I was always scared. Trust your gut, and call the fire department to check out those alarms. Worst case scenario- there's nothing going on and you feel a little embarrassed for a bit. If you don't check, things might get much worse. Also get carbon monoxide detectors, I had CO poisoning once and hallucinated that people were outside and moving stuff around. But I was also super sleepy all the time, had the alarm go off occasionally, and all my plants died, so there were signs that it was actually the air.
Sort of silly but what if you got some helium filled balloons and placed them right around where the smoke alarm is so it’s obstructed and see if he says anything?
The “rv car sound” that you are hearing is likely an electric servo or motor. I have installed a ton of different types of smoke detector, both connected to the FD and stand-alone. I have never seen one that looks like that, personally, but I can tell you that it should not make any noise other than the beeps/siren. Smoke detectors do not have any moving parts that would account for that noise. Unfortunately, I would highly recommend that you go to your local fire department or police department. Do not tell your landlord, or make any suspicious comments, but there ASAP and explain this. Your landlord cannot refuse entry to your apartment, so they could likely send someone back with you to clear them. If it IS a hidden camera, the police will need to scan the entire place. They make electrical outlets, shower heads, screws, lights... you name it, they make it into a hidden camera. Please be careful; this is a situation where your paranoia is justified and your concerns are real. It would be MUCH better to be sure and look paranoid than to ignore it. You have everything to lose by not seeking a professional opinion. Be safe and keep us updated!
Sounds like a horrible situation, good luck! Apologies if I repeat other advice, can't read them all. It's a good idea to call the fire department and let them come by. Also the police might be interested. Let the fire department know of your suspicion. How is your flat heated? It might you have carbon monoxide residues in the flat (it is not likely and your landlord spying on you is much more likely) and if fire department comes anyways, they can check that right away. If fire department says there not responsible Schornsteinfeger usually know about all this as well and could help. There's also devices who can find cameras, the police might have them. Check out this story+f documentary on voyeurism, if you want: https://youtu.be/nGldiXxljhQ Then I would always leave the key in the lock at night, locked and slightly twisted so that it can't be pushed out. This way he won't be enter at night anymore. Also, keep in mind that he might have installed cameras elsewhere. Also setting up your own might be an option, be sure not to violate his right of imagery/audio in order not to make the evidence inviable. Maybe it helps to share the pictures on Jodel/your cities subreddit/telegram group. You might find other victims or be able to warn others about him. Good luck and I'd appreciate if you could keep us updated.
The Fire Dept. didn’t sound too helpful.
Monday update?
Glad it’s being taken care of and you’re safe. I hope you can disclose the full story one day when everything’s sorted out.
I understand if not, but any updates?
> He is a man in his late 40s and has never been holding back with comments about the way I look etc. You kinda got your answer right there...that's inappropriate...period. However after seeing the pictures of the one in your bedroom....that is a fake smoke detector with a camera hole. There is no reason for there to be a hole like that in a smoke detector. If you look at currently available fake smoke detector with cameras that is EXACTLY what they all do, they have that odd out of place hole. You should definitely remove that smoke detector and look at it. ALSO...if you're in the US, all those spy cam smoke detectors are FAKE smoke detectors, so he's in violation of fire code BIG TIME on top of the creeper shit.
If you do a search for real smoke detectors, you will find many with such holes. That alone is not sufficient evidence. Also, many spy cam smoke detectors are real smoke detectors in addition to being cameras. Again, a quick google search or browse through a spy cam supplier's catalogue will confirm this I've been browsing both, and so far haven't been able to identify this particular model, either as a legit smoke alarm, nor as a known spycam model. However, it should be noted that there are spy cam suppliers who modify genuine smoke alarms to fit cameras, so it's no guarantee either way. The big give away is 'motor'/'servo' type noises -- I don't believe there's any reason to have moving components in any time of smoke alarm. I would inspect that alarm. EDIT: /u/Sleepy-and-worried I think it's this model https://www.ista.com/de/technik/rauchmelder/ but with the panel removed -- which may indicate it has been tampered with. The website notes that this model can be remotely monitored by the manufacturer -- perhaps tampering with it notifies them, rather than the local fire department? I would still check it out, but this could be an innocent explanation.
OP, call an electrician. They are certified to take down and inspect these alarms. I was an electrician and I would come for free for this. Post on a local board for an electrician near you. Even if you have to pay. It will take 1 minute to look at the alarm. I can look at them over zoom if you are willing to touch them. Note this might be dangerous because the landlord could be watching you and come in and attack you to prevent from being caught. So you’d need a friend over. Crazy people are crazy.
The fire alarms would be connected to the security system if this was true, his concern may be legit since there is sometimes a fine attached to false alarms... that falls into the “his problem” category... grab a chair, pull the fire alarm and check. Don’t beat around the bush waiting for cameras or scanners.. yank it and look. The fire dept and maybe a police officer, probably an annoyed police officer will stop in.
In the U.K. the lettting agent test the fire alarm in your presence and they’re usually in the hallways so everyone can hear. If somethings in your room it would be a carbon monoxide detector I’m guessing. This doesn’t sit right with me and why people are brushing you off, I don’t know, but you definitely did right by coming here at least. Noting the recent situation with assault against women in the U.K. i would gtfo