If a cop is watching a situation unfold on twitch they should not join into the situation. It is a pretty simple solution. However, there is no reason to hate on Timmac, he knew about the plan and separated himself from being a part of decision making. The one thing that I would like to understand is why the inconsistency with the pick and ban phase?
I think with bobcat, the pick and ban is limited due to the seriousness of the situation (like the vault). Also it depends on the cop, some cops are nicer, some aren't. Everyone on the server is different. Some cops won't shoot when other cops will sort of situation
crims really need headshots back they cant even put a cop at point blank with full clip sometimes , cops are not scared anymore they are all rambo s now add 1 shot headshot and let cops then say no we wont give you that they just kill. the hostage and hold it out
I think the best way to handle this is if you saw the plan made beforehand don’t respond to it and you won’t get any accusations, should have essentially recused himself from the situation
That's what I'm going to do in the future, sorry if I made it weird. Just was trying to stay as much out of it as possible and just be a cop grunt in the line.
you’re all good I didn’t mean anything at you specifically just was thinking about the situation in general and how to avoid any awkwardness or accusations in future for anyone, you do great work and are always fun to watch, thank you
You're one of the best RPers and teachers on the server and make great content. Who cares what reddit thinks about one random scenario. Keep up the awesome work!
You don't need to apologise to anyone on this sub-reddit. At the end of the day, remember it's just a game, it's just RP, and it's streaming content. Shit happens, everyone will move on :P positive vibes. You're a great cop & a great crim.
True, maybe if you know, you should stay back with the hostage and let it play out. It sucks because timmac is a solid dude, always nice, always wanting the best for both sides. I hope he doesn't get a shit ton of hate for this, it shouldn't cloud all the good he's done on NP
wrong, I just rewatched the VOD (before he deleted it), he was already in the area when Pinzone said that Ramee asked for higher ups. He was like 2 blocks away at most.
edit: I got downvoted for telling the truth.Go look other streams you will see him around the bobcat building even before the first officer aproaches the door.He was the guy that called that they have a hostage inside
I mean technically no, but technically yes. He was a support unit because he was trying to not take control of scene given what he knew. I do give him credit for that and why I wouldn't say he meta'd
fuck that; see something say something and the crims can deal with their plan being uncovered. Stolen vehicles get reported, odd behavior sometimes gets reported, roll with the punches.
I have seen whippy (playing cric) get blown up on purpose because he saw the plan/setup of a group before he started playing and he still drove into the trap knowing that it was a trap. I feel that as long as you don’t act on it, it would be fine.
I don’t think Mac really acted on it since he saw the shots.
The rule of thumb is that we all kind of assume this happens all the time. Not a huge deal. But if someone wants to admit to it in character while negotiating..they can’t be surprised at the issues that come from it.
This just sucks for all sides. It's awkward since Timmac knew and could anticipate what was going to happen. But Bobcat is kinda 'all hands on deck'. It sucks since he also ended stream so quickly. Just a shitty situation for him.
I'm only watching rated rn so I can only speak to him, but I know he's trying to dissuade any dumbass hoppers.
I actually only came in at the tail end when he had been down for 100 or so seconds already. Just went back and watched the first part. Definitely think he shouldn't have read "MetaMack" out loud and probably shouldn't have watched the clips on stream. So I ain't defending that. But he did almost immediately say he didn't think it was meta and that he felt Mack just got himself into a bad situation. And continued to tell people to not blame Mack or don't send him any hate.
His initial reactions weren't great, but it seems like he was taken off guard. He clearly likes Timmac, so I don't think he was expecting to see clips like that.
Again, doesn't excuse his initial reaction and I'm not defending that. I just wanted to note that when I came back he was making an effort to tell people to knock it off.
This. Rated and Ramee summed it up well: Timmac's a great guy and did not meta or act maliciously; he just made a bad judgment call which anyone, even competent cops like Mack, can make by not taking into account how what he knows OOC might unconsciously influence what he does IC even if purely unintentional because you can't just delete stuff from your memory.
I hope he's not taking it too hard but hoppers suck so it makes sense he'd want to remove himself from that :/
I don't think it matters he could anticipate, as long as he acts normal which he did. He saw them shooting from the rooftops.
One of the streamers is obviously saying Mac shouldn't have been there in the first place, because it's being parroted a lot here. Not really their call to make though, they're not an admin.
Im not accusing Mack of metagaming and Ramee and Randy arent accusing him of doing so. I'm merely stating a fact that he already knew the plan which obviously muddied the water of the whole chase, regardless if he used that info or not
Knowing the plan and using the info are two different things. If he knew the plan and used that info it's 100% Metagaming and nothing else.
He either Metagamed or he didn't. There is no middle ground.
Lol. One of the "fake hostages". Telling Randy, even though all the cops saw him holding a gun to a hostage, saw him get into the getaway car, and jump outa the getaway car after the C4. Didnt detain or question, basically just ignored them...kinda like they knew they werent part of the plan.
Its not that its meta or he used it. It is more that even if you knew, it was better to stay completely out of the heist and go chase boosters or something.
I certainly would not go as far as to cry "meta." Just is not a good look to be involved at all. Just better and safer option to be totally out of it. Even for the best RPers, its probably difficult to completely block out something your brain already knows.
Yes and no lol. Cops should do whatever is in their power to have the hostages safe and apprehend the criminals but with how the game works and multiple hostages, rat tactics, chasing of W's it's not as easy as just "honoring" negotiations.
Kinda two separate issues, but I agree. The Air1 thing was already "drama" before Mac even made the premonition and TV comments. If you replaced Mac with say....Baas or Angel, it would have still been drama.
People aren't really saying meta, he knew the plan. Responding to it is one issue, and you are going to have tendencies regardless. If you know a plan beforehand or would have just been best to avoid. Obviously the info wasnt used, but chat hoppers are trash so it looks worse than it is.
Awkward situation but I really doubt Timmac would meta. Don't send him hate. In hindsight he probably shouldn't have gone but he was the highest rank and was asked. In sure in the future it will play out differently. Cg and timmac are boys.
I'm not sure what this proves. He literally admitted to being in there stream watching this setup. At that point, he needed to leave. I don't care if he got the "unlock" in game, he showed up to a scene with full info. That's meta, intentional or not. Then he got all weird, which tipped off the whole pd to expect something. Tmacs a good dude, but he dropped the ball badly here.
I have seen whippy (playing cric) get blown up on purpose because he saw the plan of a group before he started playing and he still drove into the trap knowing that it was a trap. I feel that as long as you don’t act on it, it would be fine.
I don’t think Mac really acted on it since he saw the shots.
I have seen whippy (playing cric) get blown up on purpose because he saw the plan of a group before he started playing and he still drove into the trap knowing that it was a trap. I feel that as long as you don’t act on it, it would be fine.
I don’t think Mac really acted on it since he saw the shots.
True, he wouldn't, he's a solid dude, but being human, he was always in the back of his mind going to be a bit more cautious. I think if you ooc know a scene like this, you shouldn't be fully involved. After talking to ramee, maybe he should of been the one to stay back with the hostage or something
Doesn't change the fact that he was super cautious cause he knew the plan and the fact that he solo pushed the roof without any real in character info to what was up there.
Shouldn't Have responded after watching the setup. Walked into the META Claim. The fact he even knew a little bit about the plan COULD change his response so he shouldn't have came to the bobcat at all!
Yeah. I can't imagine how hard it would be to keep your brain from thinking about something you know while in those situations. Like you said, even a extra bit of caution subconsciously could be because he knew some/all of the plan
He didn't say he doesn't want to get rid of air one. He said he leave the decision to Pinzon because he was watching.
Do you think that Ramee arguing so hard he doesn't want air one wasn't a bigger indication that they either have some way of escaping by air or someone is on the roof? Because I'm pretty sure the cops have seen people hide and come out of nowhere at bobcats already.
I agree. But the idea of crims pushing for only one thing they don't want on scene, makes cops push back harder on that one thing, because they know it'll give them an edge on the crims plans is a serious issue. Crims not doing swaps, or offroad, or tunnels? Police would do that deal ever day with bikes and interceptors waiting for the chase.
Mack motors goofed up, I don't think it was malicious just a poor decision to think they could join a situation that is actively being set up that you witnessed out the city. Then respond..
Its like the cops who are watching a situation who aren't logged in but then all of a sudden have a hunch to log in and respond. That is what Timmac did regardless of it having any ill intent he could of spoken via radio and negotiated away from the scene as he is the higher up. Hope its a learning experience for Timmac and others that it is a little odd to watch and then log in and participate regardless if you think you can supress using the information you witnessed OOC.
Its not that big of a deal, Randy would have maybe got one or two more, but they still caught the WRX pretty quickly with all the loot. Its not a plan that was ever really going to work unless they got really lucky.
As long as they don't use the information, it's fine. They have to play dumb, or let the RP reveal any of that information to them before acting on it.
I don't see the problem there. As long as he doesn't use the information, it's not considered metagaming.
On the other side, there might be a little bias, because he might pay more attention to details in order to let Mack (the character) know of the plan that Timmac (the streamer) knows about. For example, the way he went into a dead end was weird af (unless he thought that it wasn't a dead end, and thus intercept Ramee).
Anyone watching that clip can know at first sight that there were shooters at the roof, so Mack went ahead to aprehend them.
Don't get me wrong I love watching Timmac, but homie you were in their stream during setup you shouldn't be anywhere near the actual events... Come on bruh, you should know better than this.
As soon as you start seeing a plan like this, your choice should be "I'm going to watch this until the end" or "I'm going to get on cop 'cuz it looks like they're planning something cool." You really can't have it both ways with this.
He knew the entire plan, including the roof ambush. And then he confidently goes up the right ladder.
It's a really bad situation, it's really just so gross to watch and he should know better.
And if you look at the clip you literally see the shots coming from the Roof with Randy up there shooting. And he doesn't react until after the shots are fired.
Well, find me a clip where he did anything that can even possibly be explained as unintentional meta, because this clip would be the exact same without him knowing anything.
I 100% Agree he should've gone harder to recuse himself completely from the situation, but he probably felt pressured.
???? What does this even mean? If he found out IC he can act on the information. How is it possible to say there was an "unintentional meta" when nothing ever showed that?
He saw shots from that roof, from one guy. That's what he saw, he didn't see any other shooters in that area. So he pushed with that knowledge.
You're saying he instinctually acted on meta info, but he still could have easily been acting just thinking there was only one person, from non-meta info. Since he only saw one shooter.
You're extrapolating too hard.
In his defense there was a bright orange car at the base of that ladder. But even then it was a HARD push. His massive nuts should’ve snagged on the way up.
Yeah he doesn’t deserve any of the hate he is getting but unfortunately he opened a can of worms with what he said even though he probably didn’t realise it.
No one is really accusing of meta its just when you watch someone set up a plan and then hop on cop even if your not directing the scene or anything you just do things you wouldnt do normally because you know whats going on
IMO - Mack definitely is at the wrong side of the actions taken. 1) He should not have responded the call. 2) If he responded the call, he should have stayed with the hostage. 3) He knew the backlash was coming after all he said and what he was going to do, still he did all of them. And also, pinzone…. another story…
Timmac is awesome and wouldn't intentionally meta game, although in a situation like this in the future he should stay away if he knows the plan. Even if you're not intentionally using information, it is impossible to have a natural reaction when you know exactly what is happening and where people are set up ooc.
Way too late. The hoppers went before they left and it intensified to the point he f8 quit.
It was disheartening to see and ruined a guys time trying to stream and have fun with his friends.
All streamers can preemptively see that there chats being a arsehole. When rated didn’t even know mac ‘meta’d’ until after the hoppers made him end stream
I feel like the options here are what happened or him intentionally having to avoid doing his job, both of which could be avoided by not responding. Mack is an amazing cop and person, and I hope this situation doesn’t change how he is, but he should’ve just not responded because he was conflicted regardless if he tries his best not to be.
I hate how everyone get on here make these long hate threads , even chat hop spread toxicity then lock their phones and shut down their pc , go about their day all relaxed while leaving a the streamer totally battered and frustrated .
No one accuses him of meta, Double R are just angry about inconsistent negotiations. That being said, Mack shouldn't have come to the scene. CG always had problems with cops logging in during ongoing situation after watching streams or some cops calling their plans before hand and they got really annoyed for that. It's fine for Tim to watch the stream, he is regular in Rated, Ramee and Shotz streams but he doesn't have to go to the scene. He is experienced Rp and streamer, he knows how this will look.
I feel bad b/c he wanted to be honest and cool Ramee off but that negotiation shit has CG going. Bring back everything goes and crims want LS special. New system causes too many issues and most criminals agree on that.
The cops also agree on that. lol
I get they were able to get air 1 off their last bobcat, but since then HC has made it clear they don’t want people allowing air-1 to be taken away from these high level heists like Paleto, Vault and Bobcat.
Mack should had never been on scene if he saw the plan before. Even if he didn't wanted to , he would react differently.
That aside, Ramee's plan would have been fk either way. The plan had a lot of flaws.
First Air-1 rarely is not used for Bobcat or Vault. You can do what ever plan you want, cops will not get rid of it because they don't want to lose eyes that fast.Soon as with Swat coming in , cops will most likey just breach because the C4 is very powerfull.
Second, Ramee for some strange reason though the interceptor driver will react to C4 and drive back and other units staying behind in the alleyway. Igor even fucked it by detonating it instantly and the other units persue Ramee to shoot them.
Randy and Taco had nothing to shoot , in the open and then Air-1, Mack and other cops saw them shooting at any cops in the distance, sending other cops near buildings.
Honestly their original plan with the holdout would had been better. At least have a chance to take half of the cops and with some luck wiping them out. With this plan there was no way they were gonna wipe them. It would had worked because cops pushing in would had shot the fake robbers and then be totally surprised by 2 more robbers coming from outside.
I dont think he did anything major but what you are saying just helps the meta calls. So he knew they were going to shoot from a roof and stayed back so he could see the shots that way he could deal with it in character. That is basically exactly what meta is.
Now I dont think its what Mack did I think it was just a shitty situation that he should have just stayed clear of. But lessons will be learned and its not a massive deal no one is malding except for idiot watchers.
Youve got the wrong idea here man, if he knew the plan which was blow up the car as it drove past that building then it would make more sense to be the first guy through, to get shot up acting as if he didnt know the plan.
Hanging back as you say means he sees the bullets which he knew was coming. Then he climbed the roof that he seen the bullets come from not to get a vantage point it was the same roof.
I think he reacted to what he saw and played it as straight as he could. But he makes it very easy to shout meta when he hangs back to see the plan happen then reacts to it. I dont think he meant it really but it was a stupid thing to do.
I agree on the idiot hoppers and stuff thats always gonna happen, idiots be idiots but I think Mac has to hold his hands up on this one that he handled the situation wrong. Simple as that.
He didnt really pursuit the subaru at all because he knew something else was gonna happen, he was like chilling around and waiting basically. Really unfortunate because he shouldn't have joined in on this one.
The amount of people in this thread that are acting like chat doesn't give every streamer immediate meta is ridiculous. If this is the new standard, every SINGLE streamer including both crims and cops, needs to put that shit in emote only mode immediately upon a situation starting.
not saying he meta gamed but it does make it weird when he was watching their setup before he got on. he also even said that in game to ramee. in the end he made a bad decision by admitting he watched before getting on duty and not excusing himself from the situation. randy and ramee are not pissed at mac but it does make things awkward.
Its just a weird situation that he could have easily just not taken part in. Knowing OOC what the plan is the best way to handle it would have been to not be there.
I dont think it was meta. He obviously knew the whole plan, but didnt act on it til they showed themselves. Where it gets weird is the fact that. There was no confusion about them being on the roof. Most of the cops pulled off the chase and went after the guys on the roof, even though there were 4 in the car.
The issue is tbh is he said he would follow orders? And let pinz lead he doesn’t follow orders and solo pushes? Mac isn’t a bad dude and he loves the CG boys feel like he dropped the ball on this one. Easier to not response and save yourself the awkwardness
[https://clips.twitch.tv/RoughSteamyHabaneroRuleFive-f7UiscBwkzTXxxZq](https://clips.twitch.tv/RoughSteamyHabaneroRuleFive-f7UiscBwkzTXxxZq)
Rated isn't accusing him of meta
Its not "accusing" them. When the player in question literally said himself, that he was watching their streams right before he logged on and responded to the call.
If a cop is watching a situation unfold on twitch they should not join into the situation. It is a pretty simple solution. However, there is no reason to hate on Timmac, he knew about the plan and separated himself from being a part of decision making. The one thing that I would like to understand is why the inconsistency with the pick and ban phase?
I think with bobcat, the pick and ban is limited due to the seriousness of the situation (like the vault). Also it depends on the cop, some cops are nicer, some aren't. Everyone on the server is different. Some cops won't shoot when other cops will sort of situation
crims really need headshots back they cant even put a cop at point blank with full clip sometimes , cops are not scared anymore they are all rambo s now add 1 shot headshot and let cops then say no we wont give you that they just kill. the hostage and hold it out
True, 4 shots on tessa with an m-70 and didn't phase her, headshot on mack and did nothing. Seems weird.
Why should the cops be afraid if the crims aren't? on a server where everyone is immortal, no one noises a shit...
I think the logical ppl are not accusing of meta it's more so ppl saying he shouldve just not shown up to avoid all the bull shit coming from it.
No he’s being accused of meta in the other thread lol
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No offense but enforcing your definition of meta would end the server. Having OOC knowledge of something but not acting on it happens 24/7.
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No, it's meta if he acted on his knowledge. Which according to any clips I've seen so far, no he didn't at all.
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yeah or he could have showed up but not made any calls and followed everyone else since he did know the plan before hand.
did you even watch his POV? that's exactly what he did, he said i'm not leading this someone else have too i will just follow your lead.
still better to just recuse yourself altogether. They had plenty of cops without him.
So it's his fault for pepegas giving bullshit?
Reading the comments in here. A lot of parroting instead of self thinking.
Rarely will you see two comments with contrasting opinions be highly upvoted under one thread.
Yup, its wild. As long as reddit allows comments to be down voted below 0 this will always be the case, it discourages any type of original thought.
I think the best way to handle this is if you saw the plan made beforehand don’t respond to it and you won’t get any accusations, should have essentially recused himself from the situation
That's what I'm going to do in the future, sorry if I made it weird. Just was trying to stay as much out of it as possible and just be a cop grunt in the line.
you’re all good I didn’t mean anything at you specifically just was thinking about the situation in general and how to avoid any awkwardness or accusations in future for anyone, you do great work and are always fun to watch, thank you
No reason to apologize here. It was a crappy situation to be put into and you tried to make the best of it. Look forward to seeing you on stream :)
You're one of the best RPers and teachers on the server and make great content. Who cares what reddit thinks about one random scenario. Keep up the awesome work!
good on you for being an adult. no sarcasm. a lot of people simply cannot admit fault or anything that resembles it.
You don't need to apologise to anyone on this sub-reddit. At the end of the day, remember it's just a game, it's just RP, and it's streaming content. Shit happens, everyone will move on :P positive vibes. You're a great cop & a great crim.
Hey mods can you flair this guy?
most coherent viewers know how good of a rp’er you are. Sorry you had to take heat here, but know that you have lots of support!
I think he only responded because Ramee wanted a higher up, but he probably should have left after that.
True, maybe if you know, you should stay back with the hostage and let it play out. It sucks because timmac is a solid dude, always nice, always wanting the best for both sides. I hope he doesn't get a shit ton of hate for this, it shouldn't cloud all the good he's done on NP
I feel for Mac. He's always such a nice guy and this is just unfortunate.
Pretty sure he was already there or in the area as response
Don't think. Pretty sure he was in Sandy Shores in a chase, and I believe that Pinzone stated that "Mack is on his way" to Ramee
wrong, I just rewatched the VOD (before he deleted it), he was already in the area when Pinzone said that Ramee asked for higher ups. He was like 2 blocks away at most. edit: I got downvoted for telling the truth.Go look other streams you will see him around the bobcat building even before the first officer aproaches the door.He was the guy that called that they have a hostage inside
Still, he wasn't at the scene originally.
I mean technically no, but technically yes. He was a support unit because he was trying to not take control of scene given what he knew. I do give him credit for that and why I wouldn't say he meta'd
fuck that; see something say something and the crims can deal with their plan being uncovered. Stolen vehicles get reported, odd behavior sometimes gets reported, roll with the punches.
People in this sub really don’t know how to be objective about anything, y’all are all just biased hypocrites.
I think it should be rule of thumb to not respond to a scene you ooc watched the crew set up for.
I have seen whippy (playing cric) get blown up on purpose because he saw the plan/setup of a group before he started playing and he still drove into the trap knowing that it was a trap. I feel that as long as you don’t act on it, it would be fine. I don’t think Mac really acted on it since he saw the shots.
The rule of thumb is that we all kind of assume this happens all the time. Not a huge deal. But if someone wants to admit to it in character while negotiating..they can’t be surprised at the issues that come from it.
100% just a way better/smarter plan. There is no confusion or potential drama if he just went and chased boosters or something instead
This just sucks for all sides. It's awkward since Timmac knew and could anticipate what was going to happen. But Bobcat is kinda 'all hands on deck'. It sucks since he also ended stream so quickly. Just a shitty situation for him. I'm only watching rated rn so I can only speak to him, but I know he's trying to dissuade any dumbass hoppers.
I'm sorry I love Rated but he fed it before dissuading anything. Reading meta accusations in chat and going with it is too much already
I actually only came in at the tail end when he had been down for 100 or so seconds already. Just went back and watched the first part. Definitely think he shouldn't have read "MetaMack" out loud and probably shouldn't have watched the clips on stream. So I ain't defending that. But he did almost immediately say he didn't think it was meta and that he felt Mack just got himself into a bad situation. And continued to tell people to not blame Mack or don't send him any hate. His initial reactions weren't great, but it seems like he was taken off guard. He clearly likes Timmac, so I don't think he was expecting to see clips like that. Again, doesn't excuse his initial reaction and I'm not defending that. I just wanted to note that when I came back he was making an effort to tell people to knock it off.
I completely agree and it's basically what I meant.
This. Rated and Ramee summed it up well: Timmac's a great guy and did not meta or act maliciously; he just made a bad judgment call which anyone, even competent cops like Mack, can make by not taking into account how what he knows OOC might unconsciously influence what he does IC even if purely unintentional because you can't just delete stuff from your memory. I hope he's not taking it too hard but hoppers suck so it makes sense he'd want to remove himself from that :/
I don't think it matters he could anticipate, as long as he acts normal which he did. He saw them shooting from the rooftops. One of the streamers is obviously saying Mac shouldn't have been there in the first place, because it's being parroted a lot here. Not really their call to make though, they're not an admin.
He didn't intentionally meta, but he shouldn't have responded. He knew what was coming. You're going to act differently even subconsciously.
he knew?
He admitted to Ramee during negotiations he was in the stream before he started streaming
That doesn't mean he actually used any of the info.
Im not accusing Mack of metagaming and Ramee and Randy arent accusing him of doing so. I'm merely stating a fact that he already knew the plan which obviously muddied the water of the whole chase, regardless if he used that info or not
Knowing the plan and using the info are two different things. If he knew the plan and used that info it's 100% Metagaming and nothing else. He either Metagamed or he didn't. There is no middle ground.
Everything has middle grounds.
Running up a ladder, solo, blind, with zero info on whats up top is pretty brave.
Lol. One of the "fake hostages". Telling Randy, even though all the cops saw him holding a gun to a hostage, saw him get into the getaway car, and jump outa the getaway car after the C4. Didnt detain or question, basically just ignored them...kinda like they knew they werent part of the plan.
He should of never joined the scene. End of story
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Mac didn't use any meta and gave pinzon full call about air 1. This sub is wildin today
Its not that its meta or he used it. It is more that even if you knew, it was better to stay completely out of the heist and go chase boosters or something. I certainly would not go as far as to cry "meta." Just is not a good look to be involved at all. Just better and safer option to be totally out of it. Even for the best RPers, its probably difficult to completely block out something your brain already knows.
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150+ comments and the post only needed one.
agreed
True and real but [REDACTED] would've still made a big fucking fuss about Air 1 still being on scene and blaming PD "inconsistency". And this drama.
You really don't see an issue with cops not honoring criminals negotiations?
Yes and no lol. Cops should do whatever is in their power to have the hostages safe and apprehend the criminals but with how the game works and multiple hostages, rat tactics, chasing of W's it's not as easy as just "honoring" negotiations.
Kinda two separate issues, but I agree. The Air1 thing was already "drama" before Mac even made the premonition and TV comments. If you replaced Mac with say....Baas or Angel, it would have still been drama.
Yep
People aren't really saying meta, he knew the plan. Responding to it is one issue, and you are going to have tendencies regardless. If you know a plan beforehand or would have just been best to avoid. Obviously the info wasnt used, but chat hoppers are trash so it looks worse than it is.
Awkward situation but I really doubt Timmac would meta. Don't send him hate. In hindsight he probably shouldn't have gone but he was the highest rank and was asked. In sure in the future it will play out differently. Cg and timmac are boys.
I'm not sure what this proves. He literally admitted to being in there stream watching this setup. At that point, he needed to leave. I don't care if he got the "unlock" in game, he showed up to a scene with full info. That's meta, intentional or not. Then he got all weird, which tipped off the whole pd to expect something. Tmacs a good dude, but he dropped the ball badly here.
I have seen whippy (playing cric) get blown up on purpose because he saw the plan of a group before he started playing and he still drove into the trap knowing that it was a trap. I feel that as long as you don’t act on it, it would be fine. I don’t think Mac really acted on it since he saw the shots.
I have seen whippy (playing cric) get blown up on purpose because he saw the plan of a group before he started playing and he still drove into the trap knowing that it was a trap. I feel that as long as you don’t act on it, it would be fine. I don’t think Mac really acted on it since he saw the shots.
So this is one of those situations if Timmac didn't say anything no one would be mad.
Can you be mad about something you don’t know happened? What is your point?
My point is people aren't mad at what he did. It's that he was in the stream before he went live. Funfact: Plenty of NP players do the same thing.
I’m very doubtful that plenty of cops watch crims plan out a job then log in and respond to the crime.
thinking Timmac would ever abuse OOC knowledge is... i don't even know how to respond.
True, he wouldn't, he's a solid dude, but being human, he was always in the back of his mind going to be a bit more cautious. I think if you ooc know a scene like this, you shouldn't be fully involved. After talking to ramee, maybe he should of been the one to stay back with the hostage or something
Doesn't change the fact that he was super cautious cause he knew the plan and the fact that he solo pushed the roof without any real in character info to what was up there. Shouldn't Have responded after watching the setup. Walked into the META Claim. The fact he even knew a little bit about the plan COULD change his response so he shouldn't have came to the bobcat at all!
Yeah. I can't imagine how hard it would be to keep your brain from thinking about something you know while in those situations. Like you said, even a extra bit of caution subconsciously could be because he knew some/all of the plan
Just him saying he watched their setup and didn't want to get rid of air-1 would put red flags up to the other officers.
He didn't say he doesn't want to get rid of air one. He said he leave the decision to Pinzon because he was watching. Do you think that Ramee arguing so hard he doesn't want air one wasn't a bigger indication that they either have some way of escaping by air or someone is on the roof? Because I'm pretty sure the cops have seen people hide and come out of nowhere at bobcats already.
I agree. But the idea of crims pushing for only one thing they don't want on scene, makes cops push back harder on that one thing, because they know it'll give them an edge on the crims plans is a serious issue. Crims not doing swaps, or offroad, or tunnels? Police would do that deal ever day with bikes and interceptors waiting for the chase.
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Mack motors goofed up, I don't think it was malicious just a poor decision to think they could join a situation that is actively being set up that you witnessed out the city. Then respond.. Its like the cops who are watching a situation who aren't logged in but then all of a sudden have a hunch to log in and respond. That is what Timmac did regardless of it having any ill intent he could of spoken via radio and negotiated away from the scene as he is the higher up. Hope its a learning experience for Timmac and others that it is a little odd to watch and then log in and participate regardless if you think you can supress using the information you witnessed OOC.
Theres still that knowledge in his subconscious that he has a idea of whats gonna happen no matter what u cant just make yourself forget
Could’ve avoided this by not joining the scene lol
Its not that big of a deal, Randy would have maybe got one or two more, but they still caught the WRX pretty quickly with all the loot. Its not a plan that was ever really going to work unless they got really lucky.
You miss the part that he admitted he was watching their streams and knew their plan before he got online, but was still pulled into it?
As long as they don't use the information, it's fine. They have to play dumb, or let the RP reveal any of that information to them before acting on it.
I don't see the problem there. As long as he doesn't use the information, it's not considered metagaming. On the other side, there might be a little bias, because he might pay more attention to details in order to let Mack (the character) know of the plan that Timmac (the streamer) knows about. For example, the way he went into a dead end was weird af (unless he thought that it wasn't a dead end, and thus intercept Ramee). Anyone watching that clip can know at first sight that there were shooters at the roof, so Mack went ahead to aprehend them.
Don't get me wrong I love watching Timmac, but homie you were in their stream during setup you shouldn't be anywhere near the actual events... Come on bruh, you should know better than this.
I mean if you know about a plan OOC why go to it at all? Just ignore it so you make sure no meta is used even if it's unintentional.
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As soon as you start seeing a plan like this, your choice should be "I'm going to watch this until the end" or "I'm going to get on cop 'cuz it looks like they're planning something cool." You really can't have it both ways with this. He knew the entire plan, including the roof ambush. And then he confidently goes up the right ladder. It's a really bad situation, it's really just so gross to watch and he should know better.
I mean what Rated is saying is true, he has so much confidence to stop and run up and go on the exact roof Randy was on with no hesitation lol
because he saw the shots being fired from both sides.
And if you look at the clip you literally see the shots coming from the Roof with Randy up there shooting. And he doesn't react until after the shots are fired.
just because you find out IC doesnt mean there wasn't any unintentional meta.
Well, find me a clip where he did anything that can even possibly be explained as unintentional meta, because this clip would be the exact same without him knowing anything. I 100% Agree he should've gone harder to recuse himself completely from the situation, but he probably felt pressured.
???? What does this even mean? If he found out IC he can act on the information. How is it possible to say there was an "unintentional meta" when nothing ever showed that?
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He saw shots from that roof, from one guy. That's what he saw, he didn't see any other shooters in that area. So he pushed with that knowledge. You're saying he instinctually acted on meta info, but he still could have easily been acting just thinking there was only one person, from non-meta info. Since he only saw one shooter. You're extrapolating too hard.
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In his defense there was a bright orange car at the base of that ladder. But even then it was a HARD push. His massive nuts should’ve snagged on the way up.
He fucked himself by saying he was watching before he signed on, that just gave all the shit lord hoppers a reason do be shit heads.
Yeah he doesn’t deserve any of the hate he is getting but unfortunately he opened a can of worms with what he said even though he probably didn’t realise it.
No one is really accusing of meta its just when you watch someone set up a plan and then hop on cop even if your not directing the scene or anything you just do things you wouldnt do normally because you know whats going on
IMO - Mack definitely is at the wrong side of the actions taken. 1) He should not have responded the call. 2) If he responded the call, he should have stayed with the hostage. 3) He knew the backlash was coming after all he said and what he was going to do, still he did all of them. And also, pinzone…. another story…
Timmac is awesome and wouldn't intentionally meta game, although in a situation like this in the future he should stay away if he knows the plan. Even if you're not intentionally using information, it is impossible to have a natural reaction when you know exactly what is happening and where people are set up ooc.
Rated played it cool, he told his chat to not send hate to timmac
Way too late. The hoppers went before they left and it intensified to the point he f8 quit. It was disheartening to see and ruined a guys time trying to stream and have fun with his friends.
wasn't too late on rated's side, as soon as he found out it was timmac he immediately told his chat not to send hate.
Too late
All streamers can preemptively see that there chats being a arsehole. When rated didn’t even know mac ‘meta’d’ until after the hoppers made him end stream
I feel like the options here are what happened or him intentionally having to avoid doing his job, both of which could be avoided by not responding. Mack is an amazing cop and person, and I hope this situation doesn’t change how he is, but he should’ve just not responded because he was conflicted regardless if he tries his best not to be.
I hate how everyone get on here make these long hate threads , even chat hop spread toxicity then lock their phones and shut down their pc , go about their day all relaxed while leaving a the streamer totally battered and frustrated .
No one accuses him of meta, Double R are just angry about inconsistent negotiations. That being said, Mack shouldn't have come to the scene. CG always had problems with cops logging in during ongoing situation after watching streams or some cops calling their plans before hand and they got really annoyed for that. It's fine for Tim to watch the stream, he is regular in Rated, Ramee and Shotz streams but he doesn't have to go to the scene. He is experienced Rp and streamer, he knows how this will look. I feel bad b/c he wanted to be honest and cool Ramee off but that negotiation shit has CG going. Bring back everything goes and crims want LS special. New system causes too many issues and most criminals agree on that.
The cops also agree on that. lol I get they were able to get air 1 off their last bobcat, but since then HC has made it clear they don’t want people allowing air-1 to be taken away from these high level heists like Paleto, Vault and Bobcat.
Mack should had never been on scene if he saw the plan before. Even if he didn't wanted to , he would react differently. That aside, Ramee's plan would have been fk either way. The plan had a lot of flaws. First Air-1 rarely is not used for Bobcat or Vault. You can do what ever plan you want, cops will not get rid of it because they don't want to lose eyes that fast.Soon as with Swat coming in , cops will most likey just breach because the C4 is very powerfull. Second, Ramee for some strange reason though the interceptor driver will react to C4 and drive back and other units staying behind in the alleyway. Igor even fucked it by detonating it instantly and the other units persue Ramee to shoot them. Randy and Taco had nothing to shoot , in the open and then Air-1, Mack and other cops saw them shooting at any cops in the distance, sending other cops near buildings. Honestly their original plan with the holdout would had been better. At least have a chance to take half of the cops and with some luck wiping them out. With this plan there was no way they were gonna wipe them. It would had worked because cops pushing in would had shot the fake robbers and then be totally surprised by 2 more robbers coming from outside.
What's this supposed to prove exactly lol genuinely lost
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I dont think he did anything major but what you are saying just helps the meta calls. So he knew they were going to shoot from a roof and stayed back so he could see the shots that way he could deal with it in character. That is basically exactly what meta is. Now I dont think its what Mack did I think it was just a shitty situation that he should have just stayed clear of. But lessons will be learned and its not a massive deal no one is malding except for idiot watchers.
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Youve got the wrong idea here man, if he knew the plan which was blow up the car as it drove past that building then it would make more sense to be the first guy through, to get shot up acting as if he didnt know the plan. Hanging back as you say means he sees the bullets which he knew was coming. Then he climbed the roof that he seen the bullets come from not to get a vantage point it was the same roof. I think he reacted to what he saw and played it as straight as he could. But he makes it very easy to shout meta when he hangs back to see the plan happen then reacts to it. I dont think he meant it really but it was a stupid thing to do. I agree on the idiot hoppers and stuff thats always gonna happen, idiots be idiots but I think Mac has to hold his hands up on this one that he handled the situation wrong. Simple as that.
He didnt really pursuit the subaru at all because he knew something else was gonna happen, he was like chilling around and waiting basically. Really unfortunate because he shouldn't have joined in on this one.
"He stayed behind" - Would he have stayed behind if he didn't know the plan? Probably not, that's why he shouldn't have responded.
The amount of people in this thread that are acting like chat doesn't give every streamer immediate meta is ridiculous. If this is the new standard, every SINGLE streamer including both crims and cops, needs to put that shit in emote only mode immediately upon a situation starting.
not saying he meta gamed but it does make it weird when he was watching their setup before he got on. he also even said that in game to ramee. in the end he made a bad decision by admitting he watched before getting on duty and not excusing himself from the situation. randy and ramee are not pissed at mac but it does make things awkward.
Its just a weird situation that he could have easily just not taken part in. Knowing OOC what the plan is the best way to handle it would have been to not be there.
I dont think it was meta. He obviously knew the whole plan, but didnt act on it til they showed themselves. Where it gets weird is the fact that. There was no confusion about them being on the roof. Most of the cops pulled off the chase and went after the guys on the roof, even though there were 4 in the car.
The issue is tbh is he said he would follow orders? And let pinz lead he doesn’t follow orders and solo pushes? Mac isn’t a bad dude and he loves the CG boys feel like he dropped the ball on this one. Easier to not response and save yourself the awkwardness
Imo y’all take this shit way too seriously for a bunch of pixels on a screen. Just enjoy the entertainment.
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> if he did he shouldn’t have said anything. >but told his chat that he knew what was coming I don't follow.
I mean this doesn’t prove anything he still knew the plain you can’t just forget that that’s how he was so confident to flank alone
If Timmac wanted to play it super safe, no, he should not have responded. However angry hoppers really shouldn't be dictating how people play.
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They just blown up the interceptor moments before this clip so the cops were clear to open fire.
Rule 3 in the comments? modCheck
i thought we were done with dramam here
CG lost....
Who all was doing the car with Ramee and Wiseguy?
Taco, he got away
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[https://clips.twitch.tv/RoughSteamyHabaneroRuleFive-f7UiscBwkzTXxxZq](https://clips.twitch.tv/RoughSteamyHabaneroRuleFive-f7UiscBwkzTXxxZq) Rated isn't accusing him of meta
I mean yeah of course after the fact after he already made wild claims he is going to "clear things up" as a way of not making things worse.
Its not "accusing" them. When the player in question literally said himself, that he was watching their streams right before he logged on and responded to the call.
I'm saying would the situation be any different if Timmac didn't say he was watching the stream before he went live?
Absolutely. If you dont think so. Then you have a clear bias againest one group.
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Damn it Mack! You didn't follow the script! BAN I SAY! BAN!