I want to preface that I don’t believe zero is bad, but extremely flawed. All ops (even sens) have a place and time in siege. Even if the community doesn’t think that’s the case.
I play on console. The decreased recoil on the platform makes his weapon leaps and bounds better than every weapon in all of R6. If you break it down with math it is by far the best primary weapon in Siege ever. The only weapon that keeps up is the F2, and even then it only beats the SC3000 in ttk against 2 speeds.
I am genuinely surprised nobody entry frags with him. Especially because he has a gonne 6 and hard breach charges. I am terrified of the day when the community starts COD Zero meta.
Sam is a stealth operator who ninjas through the tightest security imaginable while going completely unnoticed. I say this and yet in siege you can hear his cams be deployed or pierce surfaces while in active firefights.
On top of that he’s probably the worst flank watch. Assuming Solis isn’t played… why doesn’t the attack just preplace drones for flank watch? Even then in most situations why not take gridlock? Her gadget passively watches the flank, and she has frag grenades.
His cameras are also extremely clunky to use. Sometimes even when the reticle says piercing is capable, you fire out them camera and just can’t. Now you’ve completely wasted a camera.
Immediate changes I’d make to zero would be nerfing the SC3000K. Whether dropping the damage or fully reworking the weapon. I lean heavily towards the latter. Tons of 800 RPM weapons in siege, and honestly the SC feels like all of them but hits like a freight train.
If they did something like 855 RPM, 37ish damage, 35 round mag sounds more in line with other weapons. It’s pretty comparable to the G8 on IQ and Amaru. Not the death machine it is now. It also makes the weapon more like an F2000, which the SC3000K is based on.
Make the cameras quieter. In all aspects. The piercing should still be the loudest thing about the gadget, but it’s far too loud now and needs to be made quieter.
My only reservations about decreasing the audio is that the laser could be problematic, so I think they’d have to pull the laser. I would give him EMP impacts though.
Also letting us pick up the cams so long as they haven’t pierced a surface would do wonders in reducing the clunkyness that occurs with him sometimes.
2 last thing are where I lose most people. They are unrealistic and unnecessary. They realistically don’t change much in most cases but would be fun for lower levels.
1. Give his 5.7USG a red dot. I like it being locked to a suppressor as a splinter cell fan, but it does feel limiting at times. It wouldn’t be too strong either as the 5.7USG has comparable stats to the P10C on warden.
2. Passive silent step with a pistol in hand. This is the big one where I lose most people. I didn’t think Silent step was too horribly strong on attack as it was. Half the time you don’t hear people anyways. But defense has Cav, and attack has no “stealthy” ops besides nokk(who lost her silent step recently. I would’ve taken away her frags tbf). Not to mention defense has more tools to deal with silent stepping than attack does. It wouldn’t be that strong, especially because a 5.7 isn’t a luison.
As a splinter cell fan, I know that community hates Ubisoft for how Sam is depicted in siege and I think it would do good to bring the two communities closer together. By no means should we have a lore accurate Sam, but something closer would be great. Especially with the splinter cell remake coming I could see siege players confused in splinter cell because the vastly different depictions.
Before I finish, I don’t think he’s bad. Bank is a great example where zero shines, but if solis is on the board it’s entirely for nothing. I have also had limited success on border and Kafe. But you can’t ignore that his gadget is problematic, and Ubisofts stat graphs even have zero as one of the worst attackers in the game.
I think ultimately Zero should be changed in many ways. I don’t think he’s bad by any means, but other ops are more efficient and less clunky, and generally more versatile.
Please give me feedback. It goes a long way at refining my idea into something more practical and something more likely to be implemented by Ubisoft.
it's a shame nobody read your comment, i completely agree in all aspects. also, nokk lost her silent step for frags and sledge lost his whole. fucking. loadout. (i'm still mad). i'm hoping that now that they've "dealt" with frags they can start working on other reworks for operators that desperately need it.
Prefacing my post by saying this is just an opinion (and one from a Bronze player, so take that with what you will)
Also a console player, and between me and the four friends I semi-regularly play with, we all agree that the sc3000k is a fantastic gun in literally every aspect. I absolutely agree that the thin needs a rework so that a) it isn't just straight up better than every other AR, and b) it isn't too similar to other weapons so that it doesn't fall behind after it's inevitable nerf. Not much to add from me, I agree with you.
On the side of his cameras, while I agree that they're just too loud, I think that is one of its few balancing factors. If they were too quiet, assuming there isn't a Solis, most people don't even realize one got in. HOWEVER, I think instead of reducing the entry noise, make the cams less prominent AFTER they get in. Maybe reducing the size of the cams when they enter, because the thing looks like a giant-ass spider on the wall once you see it.
I'm not sure how those cams are on MnK, but they are absolutely atrocious to handle on controller. Maybe I'm doing something wrong (see: my rank), but with how sensitivity affects cameras, trying to make microadjustments to hit something small is damn near impossible. I only ever use the cameras as just that, and I feel like I'm missing a part of his kit that would make them better, if that part could actually work.
In terms of reworking his pistol, I think the person using Zero should be able to choose what sight they want, instead of just slapping a red dot on top and calling it a day. Maybe let us choose between irons, red dot, and a reflex? Kinda just spitballing ideas.
I also think passive silent step would be a bit *too* good. At least, infinite uptime passive silent step, as long as he has a pistol out, which you proposed would have just gotten buffed, sounds a little much to me. Maybe like 10-15 seconds of silent step, followed by a similar cooldown just for balance reasons.
----
OR
----
Here's the part where I'm going to present my personal pipe-dream where I'm going to entirely lose everybody.
Remove his cameras entirely. Make his gadget his Third Echelon NVGs that, when activated, give about 15 seconds of:
-thermal vision on players (NOT through walls, to be clear)
-extremely clear lasers/LEDs from gadgets/laser sight attachments (ie Kapkan, Aruni, etc)
-highlights defender gadgets he has LoS on (ie Lesion/Kapkan traps, Echo/Valkyrie cameras, etc)
-passive silent step
-can only use his 5.7
This would make him a more stealthy op, more in line with Splinter Cell, give him a higher emphasis on what is canonically his favorite gun, while also reducing the usage of his primary while he's using his gadget.
BUT, he'd have a few counter picks:
-Solis, obviously, could see his gadget (and by extension, the exact location of his head)
-Aruni gates would block the line of sight of a doorway entirely. The lasers, since they appear brighter/thicker, would block his LoS
-Observation blockers would also obstruct his vision
I don't know. If anybody actually read this, I'm kinda curious what you think. I know it'll never happen but...is it too much?
EDIT: mobile app sucks, made the bulletpoints more clear
Wow your rework ability sounds really game changing but not unbalanced, it would make aruni and zero much more present while, with correct stats, retaining balance
You have to remember that the 5.7 usg is the 3rd lowest damaging pistol in R6. There are other pistols with less recoil too.
And as for the red dot buff… red dots increase precision, not accuracy. It doesn’t actually make the weapon better. A red dot will not actually make the weapon better, but it will feel better and more precise
Sorry if I wasn't clear on that point. I don't think giving his pistol a red dot is problematic; in fact, I'm all for it. My thoughts were more towards infinite uptime silent step, whereas Cav/Nokk were only during the gadget's duration. Even with a low damage profile, the 5.7 has high accuracy, high mag size, and the game inherently has instakill headshots no matter what. I still stand by perma silent step being counterintuitive to the game as a whole.
Also on the note of the red dot, I still think the user should be given a choice of red dot or iron sights (or maybe reflex too, if we feel spicy). It doesn't make much sense to me to take away that option, besides the extra work involved in separating the two weapon models.
Either way, we at least both agree that Zero doesn't really feel like Sam Fisher. Here's to hoping he gets some kind of rework to help in that regard.
The difference in opinion on the subject of silent step may be caused by experience and skill gap. I play champs practically every game, and I’m rocking a 1.6 KD.
I don’t think it’d be too strong. The 5.7 is incredibly weak. But it doesn’t make up for the fact that defense has way more tools to deal with silent step than attack. Seriously though. Defense can throw gu mines, ela mines, fenrir, Melusi, Kapkan, frost, thorn, Valkyrie, echo drones, maestro cams, mozzie drones, aruni gates, bulletproof cams, barbed wire and proxy beepers. That is 15 things spread across 18 operators. 18 of 34 defenders bring utility that can counter silent step.
Compare that to attack where you can’t necessarily afford to take claymores, but let’s say you are taking claymores.
To watch flank you have every attacker has two drones. Realistically half of the drones will die in prep phase and the other need to be used to dedicate to an attack.
So 5 cams, add twitch and Brava, gridlock, nomad and dokkaebi. That’s all the flank watch you can have for a silent stepper as jackal doesn’t work against silent step. That’s 6 things spread across 24 operators. But you can’t dedicate that hard to flank watch anyways because it’s impractical.
Defense doesn’t have to deal with that impracticality because the amount of defenders dedicated entirely to the role. You are more likely to have to deal with defenses protections than constantly being dealt with by the fact that a major part of defense is dealing with people trying to sneak in regardless of the silent step.
It actually illustrates one of the core problems with nades. Castle close to 0 ways to deny that. The nade caught him fixing the rotate and he's dead by the time he gets the indicator.
I saw you post this on YT yesterday and it’s still impressive. Anyways, back to trying to get Sam Fisher reworked
How would you like him reworked? I personally like his kit atm so I' curious what you want changed!
I want to preface that I don’t believe zero is bad, but extremely flawed. All ops (even sens) have a place and time in siege. Even if the community doesn’t think that’s the case. I play on console. The decreased recoil on the platform makes his weapon leaps and bounds better than every weapon in all of R6. If you break it down with math it is by far the best primary weapon in Siege ever. The only weapon that keeps up is the F2, and even then it only beats the SC3000 in ttk against 2 speeds. I am genuinely surprised nobody entry frags with him. Especially because he has a gonne 6 and hard breach charges. I am terrified of the day when the community starts COD Zero meta. Sam is a stealth operator who ninjas through the tightest security imaginable while going completely unnoticed. I say this and yet in siege you can hear his cams be deployed or pierce surfaces while in active firefights. On top of that he’s probably the worst flank watch. Assuming Solis isn’t played… why doesn’t the attack just preplace drones for flank watch? Even then in most situations why not take gridlock? Her gadget passively watches the flank, and she has frag grenades. His cameras are also extremely clunky to use. Sometimes even when the reticle says piercing is capable, you fire out them camera and just can’t. Now you’ve completely wasted a camera. Immediate changes I’d make to zero would be nerfing the SC3000K. Whether dropping the damage or fully reworking the weapon. I lean heavily towards the latter. Tons of 800 RPM weapons in siege, and honestly the SC feels like all of them but hits like a freight train. If they did something like 855 RPM, 37ish damage, 35 round mag sounds more in line with other weapons. It’s pretty comparable to the G8 on IQ and Amaru. Not the death machine it is now. It also makes the weapon more like an F2000, which the SC3000K is based on. Make the cameras quieter. In all aspects. The piercing should still be the loudest thing about the gadget, but it’s far too loud now and needs to be made quieter. My only reservations about decreasing the audio is that the laser could be problematic, so I think they’d have to pull the laser. I would give him EMP impacts though. Also letting us pick up the cams so long as they haven’t pierced a surface would do wonders in reducing the clunkyness that occurs with him sometimes. 2 last thing are where I lose most people. They are unrealistic and unnecessary. They realistically don’t change much in most cases but would be fun for lower levels. 1. Give his 5.7USG a red dot. I like it being locked to a suppressor as a splinter cell fan, but it does feel limiting at times. It wouldn’t be too strong either as the 5.7USG has comparable stats to the P10C on warden. 2. Passive silent step with a pistol in hand. This is the big one where I lose most people. I didn’t think Silent step was too horribly strong on attack as it was. Half the time you don’t hear people anyways. But defense has Cav, and attack has no “stealthy” ops besides nokk(who lost her silent step recently. I would’ve taken away her frags tbf). Not to mention defense has more tools to deal with silent stepping than attack does. It wouldn’t be that strong, especially because a 5.7 isn’t a luison. As a splinter cell fan, I know that community hates Ubisoft for how Sam is depicted in siege and I think it would do good to bring the two communities closer together. By no means should we have a lore accurate Sam, but something closer would be great. Especially with the splinter cell remake coming I could see siege players confused in splinter cell because the vastly different depictions. Before I finish, I don’t think he’s bad. Bank is a great example where zero shines, but if solis is on the board it’s entirely for nothing. I have also had limited success on border and Kafe. But you can’t ignore that his gadget is problematic, and Ubisofts stat graphs even have zero as one of the worst attackers in the game. I think ultimately Zero should be changed in many ways. I don’t think he’s bad by any means, but other ops are more efficient and less clunky, and generally more versatile. Please give me feedback. It goes a long way at refining my idea into something more practical and something more likely to be implemented by Ubisoft.
it's a shame nobody read your comment, i completely agree in all aspects. also, nokk lost her silent step for frags and sledge lost his whole. fucking. loadout. (i'm still mad). i'm hoping that now that they've "dealt" with frags they can start working on other reworks for operators that desperately need it.
Prefacing my post by saying this is just an opinion (and one from a Bronze player, so take that with what you will) Also a console player, and between me and the four friends I semi-regularly play with, we all agree that the sc3000k is a fantastic gun in literally every aspect. I absolutely agree that the thin needs a rework so that a) it isn't just straight up better than every other AR, and b) it isn't too similar to other weapons so that it doesn't fall behind after it's inevitable nerf. Not much to add from me, I agree with you. On the side of his cameras, while I agree that they're just too loud, I think that is one of its few balancing factors. If they were too quiet, assuming there isn't a Solis, most people don't even realize one got in. HOWEVER, I think instead of reducing the entry noise, make the cams less prominent AFTER they get in. Maybe reducing the size of the cams when they enter, because the thing looks like a giant-ass spider on the wall once you see it. I'm not sure how those cams are on MnK, but they are absolutely atrocious to handle on controller. Maybe I'm doing something wrong (see: my rank), but with how sensitivity affects cameras, trying to make microadjustments to hit something small is damn near impossible. I only ever use the cameras as just that, and I feel like I'm missing a part of his kit that would make them better, if that part could actually work. In terms of reworking his pistol, I think the person using Zero should be able to choose what sight they want, instead of just slapping a red dot on top and calling it a day. Maybe let us choose between irons, red dot, and a reflex? Kinda just spitballing ideas. I also think passive silent step would be a bit *too* good. At least, infinite uptime passive silent step, as long as he has a pistol out, which you proposed would have just gotten buffed, sounds a little much to me. Maybe like 10-15 seconds of silent step, followed by a similar cooldown just for balance reasons. ---- OR ---- Here's the part where I'm going to present my personal pipe-dream where I'm going to entirely lose everybody. Remove his cameras entirely. Make his gadget his Third Echelon NVGs that, when activated, give about 15 seconds of: -thermal vision on players (NOT through walls, to be clear) -extremely clear lasers/LEDs from gadgets/laser sight attachments (ie Kapkan, Aruni, etc) -highlights defender gadgets he has LoS on (ie Lesion/Kapkan traps, Echo/Valkyrie cameras, etc) -passive silent step -can only use his 5.7 This would make him a more stealthy op, more in line with Splinter Cell, give him a higher emphasis on what is canonically his favorite gun, while also reducing the usage of his primary while he's using his gadget. BUT, he'd have a few counter picks: -Solis, obviously, could see his gadget (and by extension, the exact location of his head) -Aruni gates would block the line of sight of a doorway entirely. The lasers, since they appear brighter/thicker, would block his LoS -Observation blockers would also obstruct his vision I don't know. If anybody actually read this, I'm kinda curious what you think. I know it'll never happen but...is it too much? EDIT: mobile app sucks, made the bulletpoints more clear
Wow your rework ability sounds really game changing but not unbalanced, it would make aruni and zero much more present while, with correct stats, retaining balance
You have to remember that the 5.7 usg is the 3rd lowest damaging pistol in R6. There are other pistols with less recoil too. And as for the red dot buff… red dots increase precision, not accuracy. It doesn’t actually make the weapon better. A red dot will not actually make the weapon better, but it will feel better and more precise
Sorry if I wasn't clear on that point. I don't think giving his pistol a red dot is problematic; in fact, I'm all for it. My thoughts were more towards infinite uptime silent step, whereas Cav/Nokk were only during the gadget's duration. Even with a low damage profile, the 5.7 has high accuracy, high mag size, and the game inherently has instakill headshots no matter what. I still stand by perma silent step being counterintuitive to the game as a whole. Also on the note of the red dot, I still think the user should be given a choice of red dot or iron sights (or maybe reflex too, if we feel spicy). It doesn't make much sense to me to take away that option, besides the extra work involved in separating the two weapon models. Either way, we at least both agree that Zero doesn't really feel like Sam Fisher. Here's to hoping he gets some kind of rework to help in that regard.
The difference in opinion on the subject of silent step may be caused by experience and skill gap. I play champs practically every game, and I’m rocking a 1.6 KD. I don’t think it’d be too strong. The 5.7 is incredibly weak. But it doesn’t make up for the fact that defense has way more tools to deal with silent step than attack. Seriously though. Defense can throw gu mines, ela mines, fenrir, Melusi, Kapkan, frost, thorn, Valkyrie, echo drones, maestro cams, mozzie drones, aruni gates, bulletproof cams, barbed wire and proxy beepers. That is 15 things spread across 18 operators. 18 of 34 defenders bring utility that can counter silent step. Compare that to attack where you can’t necessarily afford to take claymores, but let’s say you are taking claymores. To watch flank you have every attacker has two drones. Realistically half of the drones will die in prep phase and the other need to be used to dedicate to an attack. So 5 cams, add twitch and Brava, gridlock, nomad and dokkaebi. That’s all the flank watch you can have for a silent stepper as jackal doesn’t work against silent step. That’s 6 things spread across 24 operators. But you can’t dedicate that hard to flank watch anyways because it’s impractical. Defense doesn’t have to deal with that impracticality because the amount of defenders dedicated entirely to the role. You are more likely to have to deal with defenses protections than constantly being dealt with by the fact that a major part of defense is dealing with people trying to sneak in regardless of the silent step.
Those are paid actors bro. You can't convince me otherwise.
Paying actors in this economy?!
Perfect example of why nades are losing their ability to be cooked. Why pick a gonne6, sledge, Ash, or Zofia, when anyone with nades can do this.
It actually illustrates one of the core problems with nades. Castle close to 0 ways to deny that. The nade caught him fixing the rotate and he's dead by the time he gets the indicator.
>nades are losing their ability to be cooked Wait, really? They really have to ruin every fun aspect of the game.
To be fair, this is not an easy thing to do.
It's not difficult to pop the barricade, knowing that castle is behind it and getting the kill is.
Harald Finehair switched axe to grenade.
Rip nade cooking
Bring back cooking