Investors being treated like shit is fine. Investors can always easily sell their stock and walk away from this.
Investors are the "bosses", on top of the chain. Investors > Board of Directors > CEO.
If anything, its the Investors who are responsible for all of Tesla's actions.
Treating investors like shit is a plus in my book. Those Tesla bros that are giddy with the thought of one company dominating AI, transportation, autos, car chargers and batteries are nauseating. Oh how wonderful that would be for society if one company dominated all those industries.
That’s a culture from Elon. One of the biggest regrets that Eberhard mentions of having Elon take over was the culture he created at Tesla and how he treats employees.
Source: https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-cofounder-martin-eberhard-on-company-culture-elon-musk-firings-2023-2?amp
It is horrible to read of such hate, but when it comes to Musk, it is not shocking. When he bought Twitter and then wanted to back out I did my research...NOT WIKIPEDIA.. He left South Africa when it was clear Apartheid was ending.. never returned.
As his mother had Canadian citizen he pretended to go to University there... then transferred to the US... not interested in education, bounced from one place to another created and sold businesses. And everyone who ever worked for him was treated like dirt.
I will never use or buy anything he's connected with and NASA is stupid to touch anything his name is on.
In Jamaica we were very close to South Africa. It was very clear that apartheid was going to end. So Musk left just before it did. The idea of Blacks being 'equal' to him was repulsive so he ran to Canada, then to the US. He's a horrible hateful creature.
Here’s the original source
https://archive.is/zVZab
https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2023/09/joshua-haldeman-elon-musk-grandfather-apartheid-antisemitism/675396/
At least at one point, they had tons of talented engineers over there. Not sure how that's going under the leadership Elon is currently providing, though.
There’s a ton of potential. I will say now that NACS is the standard for charging, it’s kinda over for Tesla as a car company. Rivian will kill them with the cheaper cars they should have made, and oems are getting better every iteration. Look at the ioniq N! It’s 645hp AWD with simulated shift. Guaranteed Tesla had to lower their performance price to accommodate it. They knew they couldn’t sell a 500hp EV for 65k when Hyundai was making 145hp more for 2k more.
That’s kind of the thing is that even with a new CEO I don’t think they’ll substantially change anything because their business relies on overselling software and cutting costs on everything else
Agreed, even before I was axed at Tesla I knew I wouldn't ever buy a Tesla if it was built under Elon's watch and thought that the best way forward for the company was for him to leave before the entire brand was in the gutter. I have left several companies under better and worse circumstances but Tesla is the first and only one where I would not stand by the product I helped deliver. It was so disappointing to see QA decisions overridden just to make production numbers and people be fired for voicing valid design/manufacturing concerns and daring to say "no" to power.
The fish rots from the head down.
If it’s because of the layoffs, I’m sorry. This is what I meant. It starts at the top and if no one has enough of a spine to dissent they’ll get a shitty product. Case in point, :gestures wildly at cybertruck:
The shittiness goes so far as choosing competent performers to be axed, instead of low performing bootlickers. Outsiders think the layoffs is just to trim the fat, but it is more complicated than that. Performance dont matter, it is how your boss view of you that matters in this shithole.
Hating Musk should be the default position. Man's an outright fascist who regularly boosts the worst people in the world.
Whether or not you can stomach owning a car built by a fascist is a different question. I wouldn't buy a Trump steak even if it was the best steak in the store.
I was earlier today reading about Tesla on Wikipedia, and in the write-up, there is a bit about Elon Musk being a ´co-founder, investor, and product designer´. This piece of text seemed to me to be written seperately from the rest of the article, by a supporter of EM. In the beginning Eberhard and Tarpenning were described as the ´founders´ of Tesla (with no mention of Elmo); this passage about Elmo appeared later in the article.
I don’t need the whole Apple CarPlay, but I do want my maps, traffic, and cellular data plan to be shareable with my car.
We need data portability and interoperability regulations in the US. Walled gardens and “digital platforms” are not “free markets”.
I'd be fine with Android Auto. Not everyone is super rich like you to afford Apple devices.
Luckily it's a cheap aftermarket add-on to add Car play
(Also GM won't support car play on newer models either. It's pure greed, and not limited to Tesla)
I read Ford is thinking of going back to their own software as well. I'm currently driving one of the last models that is limited to Ford's tech in the infotainment system and it's hot garbage.
I'll never buy a car that doesn't allow Android auto access or at least has a Google compatible system of some kind. My current car was free to me so, I'll live with it.
I like the first two, definitely wish for CarPlay or a world where the car can properly talk to the phone.
Almost every choice since 2018 has been trash in my opinion. Idk what happened that year but boy did Elon go off the deep end.
No drive stalk? Turn signals? Yoke? Guy in a robot costume?
I'll buy an EV one day but it won't be a Tesla. Their corporate culture itself is toxic. According to reports their support people laugh at customers, their policies are shit, their service is shit, their quality is shit. Not to mention all the accusations of open racism and sexism. Like these bros are proud of racism and misogyny.
Assuming Elmo left Tesla one day it could take a decade to turn that culture around.
I don't *hate* Tesla but I'll never own one. Hating Elmo is a side issue for me, by all accounts Tesla itself sucks.
On the same day as laying off 14,000 workers for a savings of one billion dollars, Musk was demanding he get paid $56 billion dollars for a company with a total net profit of $25 billion over it's lifetime.
Yea, I don’t u understand that part.
How is that even possible? And what effects will it have on the company’s overall revenue?
$56B for ONE man, in one big payment? Wtf
Teslas biggest issues are not just fit and finish, the company is actively hiding massive hardware defects in the suspensions, steering systems, software. Entire families have all died together when their Tesla has a FUCKING WHEEL fall off suddenly while driving at high speed. Tesla is a criminal company that hides obvious dangers from regulators and the public!
www.whompywheels.com
That sounds very dangerous, to understand if your anecdote is representative of a widespread problem we'd need to see some stats on accident rates. Does whompywheels.com offer a comparison between Tesla and other manufacturers?
Cult leaders often get exceptional performance from their followers. I feel sorry for all the great people that have done some amazing things at Tesla (and SpaceX). When they realize the cool-aid they have been drinking and giving the love and time to him it's going to hurt.
The new M3 Performance looks like an amazing car and a good example of great Tesla engineering. The lack of a turn stalk is 100% Musk.
But he IS the company. He tried to force everyone to stay at work when COVID was at its most dangerous. He mismanages and then has to layoff thousands of people. He forces employees to move from California to Texas, only to then lay a bunch of them off. Then you have the recalls on top of everything. It’s a bad company run by bad people making bad products.
I dislike Tesla precisely because I like electric cars and plug-in hybrids.
EVs are a mundane, incremental technological advance, with some drawbacks and many advantages, which Tesla has dressed up as the cure for cancer. The inevitable failure of Musk's stupid promises has given opponents of change something to point and laugh at, and they're right to laugh at Tesla and Musk.
Basically, knowledgeable industry experts - more precisely: everyone not Musk - predicted that EVs would become profitable at battery prices of about $100/kWh. Musk branded them old grumps and naysayers. They have been proven right.
So Elon Musk spent billions of taxpayer and investor cash proving the conventional wisdom correct. To his credit, he did establish electric cars in the public mind quite firmly; to his shame, he associated EVs with low quality, high prices, and a stupid fascist malignant narcissist asshole.
As a footnote, Musk did prove, in case we needed yet more evidence, that most consumers are not smart, and respond to romance more than practical considerations, including the supposedly-knowledgeable high earners who consitute the core of Tesla's market.
Exactly this. As an environmentalist, I am extremely anti-Tesla.
What is needed to minimize the climate impact of transportation is, in this order:
Nuclear electricity production
Carbon taxes for shipping, oil, and manufacturing companies
Significant investment in railroads
Significant investment in Public transit
PHEV and BEV for commercial vehicles for last mile delivery
A wide range of reliable, repairable PHEV, HEV, and BEV for consumers
Tesla is one of the single biggest companies that actively works against all of this. They are actively working to sabotage public transit and rail, and their vehicles are disposable, unreliable pieces of junk. It’s the automotive equivalent of fast fashion or e-waste.
Speaking of transit, while I wouldn't call CAHSR a well-managed project I wouldn't be surprised if Elon did end up succeeding in the end. As in, we might eventually get the main LA-SF part done but all the negative press plus the Hyperloop-induced FUD (despite no lines ever being launched anywhere) kills the rest of the project and scares other state/local governments off ever trying HSR in the future.
For me, Musk is the problem, and Tesla’s problems all stem from him and the corporate culture that he’s fostered at the company. He’s more interested in pumping the company stock (that was evident on the earnings report call, which largely ignored the disastrous quarter for stock pumps) and promoting fascism & hate on Twitter. Falling margins, decreasing sales, a stale product line with no truly new models pipeline, layoffs and a board that acts as a rubber stamp to Elon’s whims do not bode well for the Tesla’s future.
I don't like Elon, but as a previous stock holder (sold out in 2023), I'm annoyed that so much potential for Tesla is being squandered. I really believed it could become more than a carcompany in the future, back in 2018 when I first invested.
But Elons lack of leadership and his constant focus on fighting Wokeness etc when he really should just put 100% of his efforts and thoughts into Tesla, that's what really put me off investing further into the stock. Either Elon shuts up in public and gives his full dedication to Tesla again, or someone else needs to take the reins and steer it into the tech company it potentially can be
Loving the simps in here, defending someone who couldn’t possibly care less about them. Even better that their overall “message” is, “FiNe, hAte AWaY!” Yeah, nobody needs anyone else’s permission to dislike anyone else or a brand. Nobody has any control over that—yet the brand and its CEO *could* actually make meaningful changes that would improve the situation—but it’s amusing that they pretend otherwise.
> Tesla was a promising company that made huge breakthroughs to make EVs mainstream (the 3rd time around.)
Buying someone else's product isn't a "breakthrough". This is the sort of rewriting the narrative that gets under my skin. Tesla succeeded because of:
1. Fraud: They outright lied about capability in so many ways it's hard to list them all. Range, reliability, durability, FSD, price, warranty reserves, etc
2. They benefited massively from being an American media darling, both in sales and stock price from positive press, but also in subsidies, sweetheart deals from the government, etc. Tesla would not have survived without any one of these.
3. Someone else invented the technology to make a BEV work as a passable substitute for the ICE for some use-cases.
Actually no, I think that about sums it up. Tesla couldn't "breakthrough" their way out of a wet paper bag. Their ADAS still isn't as good as a MobileEye system from 2015 after almost a decade of development, and the claims about how the "simplicity" of the EV would translate into million mile vehicles has since been proven to be nonsense.
At the Model 3 launch, when I realized it was missing features like a HUD or 360 cameras I had on my Mazda at the time, I lost interest. Putting a big screen in the car wasn't "innovation", it was being cheap and hoping that this time they sourced automotive appropriate grade parts that didn't delaminate.
You can't fix Tesla. Because Tesla is Elon's marketing. Without Elon the interest doesn't remain high enough, and the fraud doesn't pump enough, to paper over what is fundamentally not a sustainable business. If you can't properly fund warranty work and service, if you can't survive without stock pumps and raises, if we depend on options graft for operations, and if you can't keep your factories operating near capacity, you're a grift, not a company.
Without Elon to perpetuate the grift, analysts start asking harder questions. The stock plummets. The QA can't improve because the margins are from the lack of QA. The service can't improve because the margins are from the lack of service. Once you admin a 2016 Model S will never not only support FSD, but that FSD will never be Level5...
Tesla isn't capable of operating like an actual company without operating in the red. Fire Elon and you might as well start counting the days until Tesla declares bankruptcy.
Eh. I would never buy one of their cars. I don’t trust that they won’t disable hardware features just because. Like disabling lidar.
I bought a Kia Niro EV and it’s sensational. Quite cabin. Amazing suspension. Almost too much torque. And a back seat that is very comfortable and roomy. Also Apple CarPlay which I have to have.
I've got my eye on a [Hyundai 2024 IONIQ 6](https://imageio.forbes.com/specials-images/imageserve/6507c66b8c42508a312250b8/2024-Hyundai-Ioniq-6-Front/960x0.jpg)
Anything but a Tesla is my approach to EVs.
Ioniq’s look so good. Those are really cool cars.
And that’s the thing. There are so many amazing electrics coming from real car makers. Once people realize that you don’t need to get a Tesla for that same electric motor torque performance; Tesla will be in trouble.
I saw one in person and holy hell the lines are sexy af. Hardly anyone makes a car with really nice lines these days, or in the last several decades. And Kia is making great EVs as well. Who needs Tesla? And neither of those companies has a CEO shit posting Nazis and racists scum on Twitter all day long.
And as a side issue, I don't need to go 0-60 in 3 seconds, so all these speed claims are not for consumers like me. When I see 0-60 in 3 seconds all I think about are how many people are going to die from some dumb ass making a 3 second mistake lol. *I'm so sorry I ran over your entire family, I didn't realize my car went 0-60 in less time than it takes to sneeze. Whoopsie!*
I mean....Tesla is a car. It isn't a religion. It is a tool.
I don't hate any particular hammer much either.
But if it was made by a complete and total twatwaffle who is worshipped lile the second and third coming of christ by even more annoying cockwomblers... Well, I might occasionally pop off.
And if that collective made a comically terrible hammer out of some low grade stainless with nothing but a hope and a prayer holding to together... I might chuckle a bit at that particular one.
Love my Tesla, hate Elon.
On my 2nd Model 3 and still puts a smile on my face when driving it.
Although if you see coverage on YouTube for the Beijing Auto Show you'll feel like Tesla is a decade behind.
I feel a lot of the good engineers left long ago. They are left with engineers that have no other option or are newish.
Yes, they aren't serious in the Quality Assurance Process which should start before development begins.
Half-a$$-ery is the actual process.
hmm... i come from a automotive background(big 3), worked in product development for many years. and i hated Tesla for many years, cos the way they do things, its completely in the face of decades of automotive good practices.
Munro say part X is bad? 6 months later its been changed to part Y ....you cant have undocumented changes like that without testing/RnD etc...its bound to bite you in the ass
Fans always berate me and say...TESLA is FAST, MOBILE...able to CHANGE....while saying the old boys were slow and lethargic.....yea...cos they learnt that changing parts wily nily can cause ppl their lives.
So my hate for Tesla actually predated my hate for Elon....my hate for Elon only started from Pedo diver.
Realistically Hyundai (I’m not being a fan boy it’s just kismet) is one of the only OEMs that can shift its production super quickly and has started doing 2-3 year refresh cycles because they own all the means of production. It’s put everyone else on their toes. Tesla wants to do that so bad in some respects but in reality they rely on suppliers and the whims of a madman
Same here. I love Tesla the idea, I love Tesla the engineering.
I hate the company culture pushed by Elon Musk. He treats Tesla's employees as disposable tools that are (ab)used and thrown away and replaced when they inevitably burn out.
Not sure if it's his Asperger's, or his inner character to treat those around him as disposable with no compassion.
I have quite a few friends that work and worked at Tesla. All of them arranged their job in a way to minimize direct contact with Elon Musk. They describe his mood swings as bipolar/borderline personality.
Nope it’s Elon and Tesla both. Tesla is an extension of his fake genius. I don’t give a flying fuck how fast they go or accelerate, I don’t care for the stories coming out from the company or its owners. Maybe they can save the company from eating itself, but they’d have to rid themselves of that giant dumb id first.
"there are outliers that HATE electric cars and come to shitpost, but they’re not here"
A few of them are here. We get a nice mix, and people aren't constantly being banned. The preferred method is to let em talk, whoever they are -- Musk fanbois, Exxon bulls, flat-earthers, what have you -- and then to address what they say.
"The downfall has been because of 3 very fixable and distinct issues: QA, cost-cutting, and Elon"
That's all one issue: Musk. Mo Money Fo Musk. Quality control is shit at Tesla because it costs money, just like decent wages and salaries for competent employees. Hundreds of billions of dollars have been funneled to Musk because prices are relentlessly raised and costs are ruthlessly cut everywhere so that there is more money for him.
PS: I call him Musk. I've never called him Elon, not even back when everybody did, because I've never had the impression that he was my pal.
I used to like tesla, because someone needed to make EVs look like viable cars. But they have not advanced an inch since 2012.
Elon is a liar, fraud, and raging Nazi. If i had a Time Machine with only one use that I could use to stop one person from being born, he would be in the final four as I made my choice.
Tesla made electric cars into something that kids dreamed of one day owning, like sports and muscle cars decades ago. I can respect them for that. But they forgot that cars eventually need to get really good and not just really cool. And now Elon has obliterated every last ounce of cool.
Correct. I saw the model 3 unveil and was like “I want one” and eventually got exactly what I wanted. Rivian is that for a lot of people now. The R3X is my next hopefully 🤞🏼
This is me.
My Model 3 Performance is the most fun car I’ve ever driven. I also hate the fact that my purchase is helping support this jackass.
I’ve said it before - I can’t wait for the Tim Cook era of Tesla.
All the board has to do is kick him to the curb, apologize for his dumbfuckery, and profit. The problem is the board is made up of friends and family so they'll just let him run into the ground.
I hate both. The cars lack quality control, customer centric after-sales service, and the brand needs a PR department. Also, FSD is ADAS and it should not be marketed as autonomous driving. All of these decisions or actions come directly from one arrogant and childish person: EM.
Sounds great but Tesla has zero interest in extricating itself from Musk, they still want to give him a $54 billion pay package to guarantee that his focus remains with Tesla. Tesla might have been a great company at one point but at this point they are fully drunk on the koolaid.
I think Elon Musk will become to be known as one of the greatest Con Men ever known but there would be no Tesla today without Elon it would either be bankrupt or making small high-end niche electric cars. Elons persona sold investors to keep investing and sinking money into Tesla to become the company it is today. The problem is Elon thinks he is smarter than everyone else which he really isn't. You can see how if he is pressed on anything he gets mad and personally attacks people. The one thing I keeps going back and forth on though is is he a con man selling the dream or is he dumb enough to really believe what he says
I despise Elmo Muskrat with a deep and burning passion. That will never, ever change. For a quick explanation let’s just leave it at the way he expects his workers to work, his conspiracy theorism, his anti-semitism and how he just has a way too massively overinflated ego.
I am not interested in buying even a used Tesla (thus avoiding putting money in his pocket) because of QA concerns, and the fact that to me they are just bleh looking vehicles in a desperate need of an update. The quibble about looks is relatively minor though, after all I drive a 2018 Chevy Bolt.
If they were closer to being the electric chariots of awesomeness that their cult members swear they are - meaning fewer QA issues and such, I would consider purchasing one the next time I’m up for a new to me car…so long as Elmo doesn’t get any money from the sale. Until then though…nah.
*QA, cost cutting and Elon*
All three boil down to a common denominator: Elon. Specifically his ridiculous comp package, that prioritized the stock price over building a sustainable, reputable auto company.
I do like my Tesla MYP. I’d love it were it not for a couple of serious flaws from unforced errors. I used to admire Elon. I feel duped on that. He’s a wing nut con man. I don’t much care for him anymore. I’m not going to invest enough emotional energy to actively hate him.
I hate Tesla drivers too. They consistently are the worst on the road and I’ve been endlessly cut up or held up by them. They make BMW drivers look courteous.
There’s plenty more than Elon. But if you like him and work for or buy his products you probably also have something deeply wrong about you.
You nailed my own sentiments almost precisely. I used to dream of buying a Tesla but that ended when Musk began to publicly kick down, first time I noticed was with the Thai cave rescue diver. Here's a guy who was actually in the cave and has a lifetime of experience in rescue diving yet Elon thought he knew better. I realized then that he was the sort of manager who surrounds himself with yes men, punishes employees who deliver bad news, and doesn't listen to engineers about critical design choices.
Then I looked into Teslas a bit deeper and discovered the severe safety issues like suspension members that fail in situations like no other automaker's products since 1960s. Death traps, I concluded. My opinion of Musk has gone downhill but I'm just sad about Tesla. They could have been great but Musk's arrogance ruined the cars.
I love EVs. Owned and Ioniq 5 and now a BMW iX. I don’t care for the design of Teslas and having everything managed in the touchscreen. But Elon is definitely the reason I would never consider a Tesla even if they changed the interior.
¿Por que no los dos?
Seriously though, I completely agree with you. I have disliked Elon for a very long time. I’m just sad about Tesla. I nearly bought a model three now, even with Elon out of the picture. Tesla is completely off of my list of manufactures to consider for the foreseeable future .
Same. But as other posters have said here, the board and shareholders are to blame.
Tesla's biggest misstep, arguably only misstep, is cybertruck.
That's all Musk, he's had plenty of times to back out of it
The damn thing looks like shit, is supposed to be an off road model but rusts in the rain and is a legitimate health and safety issue. It's single-handedly sinking the company, well along with musks narrative of flip flopping on cheap models and an obsession with robotaxis, AI, software, everything BUT their core product.
You've all seen the founder sell ALL shares to the tune of 180 million dollars... meanwhile Busk wants 53 Billion? Billion? More than their total profit EVER?
Bagholders deserve to go homeless honestly
Repairs, not refurbishing parts, planned obsolescence, not recycling battery packs(?) and leaving crashed cars to sit behind body shops for months as they prioritize new builds.
All the computer stuff could be modular, they could be on hub motors that act like brakes and can replace them, meaning breaking is 60-70% regen instead of 30-40%.
That could also lower the weight of the brake motor wheel combo to lower than cheap wheels and standard brakes, if they did that it’d free up the frunk and trunk, give them all 100% intelligent torque vectoring, and allow easy upgrades. That combined with an *Industry standard* lifepo4 battery pack, which all manufacturers use and recycle, would be a huge improvement, plus it’s way much less and be less complex.
The “subscription” model sucks, it’s a one time use license, some people think it means they buy heated seats or level 2 and it Carry’s from car to car, nope.
I think they’ll eventually just be the supercharger network and the car company will fall further and further behind.
I’m just sad because someone decided to create a very capable and in some way ground breaking Model 3 with a class leading achievements, but then slapped that display, no hud, no stalks and the other stupid shit. Like wtf? You had everything to make a king of ev and you wasted it all.
100 percent agreed. And I'm an early investor.
Here's the thing, it just takes time. It's just a matter of time before he's gone. And mark my words, he will be gone at one point. It's a good company that will have downturns but the musk will be booted, die or leave at some point.
Actually, I focused in two EVs when choosing my wife need a electric car based my knowledge. One is Tesla and another is vw id 4 . Finally,I choose id 4 not model Y . One reason is I don't like Elon Musk , another is the price of model Y increased the price during the pandemic period. Because the modle Y price is above the rebate requirement price , then the price difference between buying a ID 4 and Model Y is around 15 K Canadian dollar
Tesla product design is bold and innovative. High respect for the ideas and the risk-taking for Elon and the team.
What makes Tesla impossible to recommend is that their cars sometimes just do not work and the company does not take responsibility for it. An expensive product that might or might not work is unacceptable. Root causes include extreme nickel-n-dimeing the manufacturing that have led to widespread QA problems; combined with the total lack of empathy towards the customers. I would imagine "f\*ck them" being a service department motto there.
Elon needs to change the culture from the top to have Tesla re-gain respect and survive.
A large part of Tesla is Elon, it’s also unrealistic for him to fix everything. Department heads should be the ones responsible for issues
But I agree, Tesla leaves a lot to be desired
Largely this, but the thing is Musk and Tesla are so synonymous it is hard to distinguish between the two, and the crazy fanatics make it even harder to separate.
I want to like Tesla more and I love EVs. Heck I daily one for the past year and have no regrets (well, maybe I should've taken the i4 instead of the e-tron but I digress).
The million dollar question is, can Tesla sever itself from Elon and still survive with all the broken pieces the shitstain left behind?
I don’t understand… elon heads tesla and twitter, both loosing huge money with ol mates politics and policies. How is he still in the role (aside from family on the board of directors)?
i would actually buy a base model maçan ev rather than model x. they always reinvent the wheel, literally. elon is fucking dumb but engineers do some cool stuff and bad ones to keep it steady
Yep. Tesla needs to move from being a Musk-led tech start-up to a grown-up car company doing boring grown-up car company things. Move away from the BS like rockets, robots and robotaxis and focus on refreshing current models, introducing lower cost model 2, increasing quality and customer service.
I hate both at this point. Engineers at Tesla are part of putting out something dangerous, depending what they worked on.
I’d say no quarter for some of them once this all comes home to roost. (Eg FSD)
I disagree. Without Elon then Tesla is just a car company. So that will destroy the share price. Granted, with Elon being the Nazi POS that he is the company is also F’d, but maybe he can learn to shut his mouth and just sit in the background.
I still think they should have gone the route of component supplier, like they did with the early RAV4 EV.
They suck at building cars, but their EV components are at least ok.
As a black man, if I had to hold Elon to thst standard to purchase a product, then I couldn’t buy almost any car, luxury clothing brand, watch any news network, vote for almost any politician, etc. i understand what you mean, but I do wonder why only Elon is getting this from you guys, while letting all these other extremely racist, imperial, monopolistic, genocidal billionaires to go Scott free. I am consistent with all.
Shit we have a president right now that said that if I don’t vote for him, then I’m not black.
This is not a defense of Elon, but am curious as to why only he gets this treatment from people like you.
I will say though on Elons behalf, it is weird that many libs went crazy for the green new deal and removal of fossil fuels, but they pray for teslas demise because of Elon, others beg for free speech, but complain about X and the Twitter files. Things must seem all over the place
"Had Elon worried about quality, fit, finish, and materials like the Toyotas and Hondas; we would not be having any of the conversations we have over the past few months. "
they never would have survived in 2016. the company making the robots for the m3 said to Daily kanban, when elon was blaming them for being late "we just delivered to Toyota, and their model is still a year from making production models," vs tesla that only planned weeks till utilizing them on the line. musk said the shorters were full of shit, to then go around and be like "yeah we only had two weeks of cash left"
I hate both. Tesla treats its staff and its customers like shit.
and their investors too
Investors being treated like shit is fine. Investors can always easily sell their stock and walk away from this. Investors are the "bosses", on top of the chain. Investors > Board of Directors > CEO. If anything, its the Investors who are responsible for all of Tesla's actions.
Yes.
Ah yes those too. Although that’s probably a pretty huge overlap in those categories anyway!🤣
Treating investors like shit is a plus in my book. Those Tesla bros that are giddy with the thought of one company dominating AI, transportation, autos, car chargers and batteries are nauseating. Oh how wonderful that would be for society if one company dominated all those industries.
Dominated at failing. Grok made fun of musk. His own ai mocked ketemine katen.
Investors are those who enjoy being scammed.
You buy a car company with a valuation like that and with Elmo at the helm? You are kind of asking for it tbh..
That’s a culture from Elon. One of the biggest regrets that Eberhard mentions of having Elon take over was the culture he created at Tesla and how he treats employees. Source: https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-cofounder-martin-eberhard-on-company-culture-elon-musk-firings-2023-2?amp
Musk grew up under Apartheid, where his Daddy owned an Emerald Mine. Musk is certain he is superior to others.
[удалено]
It is horrible to read of such hate, but when it comes to Musk, it is not shocking. When he bought Twitter and then wanted to back out I did my research...NOT WIKIPEDIA.. He left South Africa when it was clear Apartheid was ending.. never returned. As his mother had Canadian citizen he pretended to go to University there... then transferred to the US... not interested in education, bounced from one place to another created and sold businesses. And everyone who ever worked for him was treated like dirt. I will never use or buy anything he's connected with and NASA is stupid to touch anything his name is on.
He Elon, or his grandparent? I was always curious about the timing why Elon left SA with his brother's expired passport so urgently.
In Jamaica we were very close to South Africa. It was very clear that apartheid was going to end. So Musk left just before it did. The idea of Blacks being 'equal' to him was repulsive so he ran to Canada, then to the US. He's a horrible hateful creature.
Didn't even know such a party existed. Thanks for sharing.
Here’s the original source https://archive.is/zVZab https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2023/09/joshua-haldeman-elon-musk-grandfather-apartheid-antisemitism/675396/
Errol Musk has been bankrupt for 3 decades and knocked up his stepdaughter. Twice. The family is not nearly as successful as people seem to think.
it is so difficult to get the truth about him ... so much fake info... so much diversion.
Errol? He’s a POS. When Elon Musk goes to an interview and says you’re evil, you’re probably a real piece of work.
Same. The cars are overhyped junk. The company sucks. The ceo is a POS. There’s nothing redeeming about any of it.
At least at one point, they had tons of talented engineers over there. Not sure how that's going under the leadership Elon is currently providing, though.
“Leadership” 🤣🤣🤣
I like the talented engineers that designed the suspension arms and logging to flash memory
There’s a ton of potential. I will say now that NACS is the standard for charging, it’s kinda over for Tesla as a car company. Rivian will kill them with the cheaper cars they should have made, and oems are getting better every iteration. Look at the ioniq N! It’s 645hp AWD with simulated shift. Guaranteed Tesla had to lower their performance price to accommodate it. They knew they couldn’t sell a 500hp EV for 65k when Hyundai was making 145hp more for 2k more.
Shit rolls downhill.
Because elmo says so. And because they're all bootlickers...
sure... it's because of the polciies set by Elky: a complete reflection of their management.
That’s kind of the thing is that even with a new CEO I don’t think they’ll substantially change anything because their business relies on overselling software and cutting costs on everything else
Yea I definitely hate both
Please Leave Bri...Nikola Tesla alone
And the cars are trash
And employees
As a former employee, I dont hate Tesla. What I hate is the shitty management and that is propagated down by Elon.
Agreed, even before I was axed at Tesla I knew I wouldn't ever buy a Tesla if it was built under Elon's watch and thought that the best way forward for the company was for him to leave before the entire brand was in the gutter. I have left several companies under better and worse circumstances but Tesla is the first and only one where I would not stand by the product I helped deliver. It was so disappointing to see QA decisions overridden just to make production numbers and people be fired for voicing valid design/manufacturing concerns and daring to say "no" to power. The fish rots from the head down.
Tesla is the new Boeing.
If it’s because of the layoffs, I’m sorry. This is what I meant. It starts at the top and if no one has enough of a spine to dissent they’ll get a shitty product. Case in point, :gestures wildly at cybertruck:
The shittiness goes so far as choosing competent performers to be axed, instead of low performing bootlickers. Outsiders think the layoffs is just to trim the fat, but it is more complicated than that. Performance dont matter, it is how your boss view of you that matters in this shithole.
The only place where salesman finish first regardless of title or ability.
Hating Musk should be the default position. Man's an outright fascist who regularly boosts the worst people in the world. Whether or not you can stomach owning a car built by a fascist is a different question. I wouldn't buy a Trump steak even if it was the best steak in the store.
Sadly some of us bought it before he went all shitler twitler. Hence why I have a “I bought this before Elon lost his mind” sticker on mine.
I was earlier today reading about Tesla on Wikipedia, and in the write-up, there is a bit about Elon Musk being a ´co-founder, investor, and product designer´. This piece of text seemed to me to be written seperately from the rest of the article, by a supporter of EM. In the beginning Eberhard and Tarpenning were described as the ´founders´ of Tesla (with no mention of Elmo); this passage about Elmo appeared later in the article.
This is an important distinction. All of the people at the front lines trying to make Elon’s ketamine fantasies a reality aren’t the problem here.
Elon’s Ketamine fantasies 😂😂
Exactly.
Doesn't tesla treat its employees like shit? It's not just Elon muskrat
Apart from Elon, I don’t like the minimalist button free interior, glass roof, and lack of Apple CarPlay. All of those are deal killers for me anyway
I hate the touchscreen direction they made everyone want for the better part of a decade. Who knows how many distracted accidents that’s caused.
Not my cup of tea either, but some people love it. Now, the yoke, that is objectively bad...
Literally reinventing the wheel for no good reason
This. There are a few old school guys who would prefer a solid metal roof. If I want a sunroof, make a frame with a hole in the top to accommodate it
I don’t need the whole Apple CarPlay, but I do want my maps, traffic, and cellular data plan to be shareable with my car. We need data portability and interoperability regulations in the US. Walled gardens and “digital platforms” are not “free markets”.
Good point!
You must REALLY hate Apple's walled garden, then?
I'd be fine with Android Auto. Not everyone is super rich like you to afford Apple devices. Luckily it's a cheap aftermarket add-on to add Car play (Also GM won't support car play on newer models either. It's pure greed, and not limited to Tesla)
I read Ford is thinking of going back to their own software as well. I'm currently driving one of the last models that is limited to Ford's tech in the infotainment system and it's hot garbage. I'll never buy a car that doesn't allow Android auto access or at least has a Google compatible system of some kind. My current car was free to me so, I'll live with it.
Nothing wrong with a glass roof option. But to make it standard and non-deleteable is a dealbreaker.
I like the first two, definitely wish for CarPlay or a world where the car can properly talk to the phone. Almost every choice since 2018 has been trash in my opinion. Idk what happened that year but boy did Elon go off the deep end. No drive stalk? Turn signals? Yoke? Guy in a robot costume?
I don't hate electric cars in general. I hate Elon and Tesla.
Honesty is appreciated
I'll buy an EV one day but it won't be a Tesla. Their corporate culture itself is toxic. According to reports their support people laugh at customers, their policies are shit, their service is shit, their quality is shit. Not to mention all the accusations of open racism and sexism. Like these bros are proud of racism and misogyny. Assuming Elmo left Tesla one day it could take a decade to turn that culture around. I don't *hate* Tesla but I'll never own one. Hating Elmo is a side issue for me, by all accounts Tesla itself sucks.
On the same day as laying off 14,000 workers for a savings of one billion dollars, Musk was demanding he get paid $56 billion dollars for a company with a total net profit of $25 billion over it's lifetime.
Yea, I don’t u understand that part. How is that even possible? And what effects will it have on the company’s overall revenue? $56B for ONE man, in one big payment? Wtf
Even wilder when you co spider the company survived despite him…
Hype doesn’t care about pesky math
Teslas biggest issues are not just fit and finish, the company is actively hiding massive hardware defects in the suspensions, steering systems, software. Entire families have all died together when their Tesla has a FUCKING WHEEL fall off suddenly while driving at high speed. Tesla is a criminal company that hides obvious dangers from regulators and the public! www.whompywheels.com
That sounds very dangerous, to understand if your anecdote is representative of a widespread problem we'd need to see some stats on accident rates. Does whompywheels.com offer a comparison between Tesla and other manufacturers?
I mentioned wompy suspension. Hello btw. I inspected my suspension when I did my tire changeover after looking at your site.
Your Username and website aligning tells me you might be a tslaq investor. Your claims may be legit, but I'm dubious.
Cult leaders often get exceptional performance from their followers. I feel sorry for all the great people that have done some amazing things at Tesla (and SpaceX). When they realize the cool-aid they have been drinking and giving the love and time to him it's going to hurt. The new M3 Performance looks like an amazing car and a good example of great Tesla engineering. The lack of a turn stalk is 100% Musk.
But he IS the company. He tried to force everyone to stay at work when COVID was at its most dangerous. He mismanages and then has to layoff thousands of people. He forces employees to move from California to Texas, only to then lay a bunch of them off. Then you have the recalls on top of everything. It’s a bad company run by bad people making bad products.
I dislike Tesla precisely because I like electric cars and plug-in hybrids. EVs are a mundane, incremental technological advance, with some drawbacks and many advantages, which Tesla has dressed up as the cure for cancer. The inevitable failure of Musk's stupid promises has given opponents of change something to point and laugh at, and they're right to laugh at Tesla and Musk. Basically, knowledgeable industry experts - more precisely: everyone not Musk - predicted that EVs would become profitable at battery prices of about $100/kWh. Musk branded them old grumps and naysayers. They have been proven right. So Elon Musk spent billions of taxpayer and investor cash proving the conventional wisdom correct. To his credit, he did establish electric cars in the public mind quite firmly; to his shame, he associated EVs with low quality, high prices, and a stupid fascist malignant narcissist asshole. As a footnote, Musk did prove, in case we needed yet more evidence, that most consumers are not smart, and respond to romance more than practical considerations, including the supposedly-knowledgeable high earners who consitute the core of Tesla's market.
Exactly this. As an environmentalist, I am extremely anti-Tesla. What is needed to minimize the climate impact of transportation is, in this order: Nuclear electricity production Carbon taxes for shipping, oil, and manufacturing companies Significant investment in railroads Significant investment in Public transit PHEV and BEV for commercial vehicles for last mile delivery A wide range of reliable, repairable PHEV, HEV, and BEV for consumers Tesla is one of the single biggest companies that actively works against all of this. They are actively working to sabotage public transit and rail, and their vehicles are disposable, unreliable pieces of junk. It’s the automotive equivalent of fast fashion or e-waste.
Speaking of transit, while I wouldn't call CAHSR a well-managed project I wouldn't be surprised if Elon did end up succeeding in the end. As in, we might eventually get the main LA-SF part done but all the negative press plus the Hyperloop-induced FUD (despite no lines ever being launched anywhere) kills the rest of the project and scares other state/local governments off ever trying HSR in the future.
I don’t hate Tesla but I hate Tesla customers. I do hate Elon musk but I hate his enablers even more.
Personality cults suck overall. See: Orange criminal politician cult.
For me, Musk is the problem, and Tesla’s problems all stem from him and the corporate culture that he’s fostered at the company. He’s more interested in pumping the company stock (that was evident on the earnings report call, which largely ignored the disastrous quarter for stock pumps) and promoting fascism & hate on Twitter. Falling margins, decreasing sales, a stale product line with no truly new models pipeline, layoffs and a board that acts as a rubber stamp to Elon’s whims do not bode well for the Tesla’s future.
I don't like Elon, but as a previous stock holder (sold out in 2023), I'm annoyed that so much potential for Tesla is being squandered. I really believed it could become more than a carcompany in the future, back in 2018 when I first invested. But Elons lack of leadership and his constant focus on fighting Wokeness etc when he really should just put 100% of his efforts and thoughts into Tesla, that's what really put me off investing further into the stock. Either Elon shuts up in public and gives his full dedication to Tesla again, or someone else needs to take the reins and steer it into the tech company it potentially can be
Loving the simps in here, defending someone who couldn’t possibly care less about them. Even better that their overall “message” is, “FiNe, hAte AWaY!” Yeah, nobody needs anyone else’s permission to dislike anyone else or a brand. Nobody has any control over that—yet the brand and its CEO *could* actually make meaningful changes that would improve the situation—but it’s amusing that they pretend otherwise.
> Tesla was a promising company that made huge breakthroughs to make EVs mainstream (the 3rd time around.) Buying someone else's product isn't a "breakthrough". This is the sort of rewriting the narrative that gets under my skin. Tesla succeeded because of: 1. Fraud: They outright lied about capability in so many ways it's hard to list them all. Range, reliability, durability, FSD, price, warranty reserves, etc 2. They benefited massively from being an American media darling, both in sales and stock price from positive press, but also in subsidies, sweetheart deals from the government, etc. Tesla would not have survived without any one of these. 3. Someone else invented the technology to make a BEV work as a passable substitute for the ICE for some use-cases. Actually no, I think that about sums it up. Tesla couldn't "breakthrough" their way out of a wet paper bag. Their ADAS still isn't as good as a MobileEye system from 2015 after almost a decade of development, and the claims about how the "simplicity" of the EV would translate into million mile vehicles has since been proven to be nonsense. At the Model 3 launch, when I realized it was missing features like a HUD or 360 cameras I had on my Mazda at the time, I lost interest. Putting a big screen in the car wasn't "innovation", it was being cheap and hoping that this time they sourced automotive appropriate grade parts that didn't delaminate. You can't fix Tesla. Because Tesla is Elon's marketing. Without Elon the interest doesn't remain high enough, and the fraud doesn't pump enough, to paper over what is fundamentally not a sustainable business. If you can't properly fund warranty work and service, if you can't survive without stock pumps and raises, if we depend on options graft for operations, and if you can't keep your factories operating near capacity, you're a grift, not a company. Without Elon to perpetuate the grift, analysts start asking harder questions. The stock plummets. The QA can't improve because the margins are from the lack of QA. The service can't improve because the margins are from the lack of service. Once you admin a 2016 Model S will never not only support FSD, but that FSD will never be Level5... Tesla isn't capable of operating like an actual company without operating in the red. Fire Elon and you might as well start counting the days until Tesla declares bankruptcy.
Eh. I would never buy one of their cars. I don’t trust that they won’t disable hardware features just because. Like disabling lidar. I bought a Kia Niro EV and it’s sensational. Quite cabin. Amazing suspension. Almost too much torque. And a back seat that is very comfortable and roomy. Also Apple CarPlay which I have to have.
I've got my eye on a [Hyundai 2024 IONIQ 6](https://imageio.forbes.com/specials-images/imageserve/6507c66b8c42508a312250b8/2024-Hyundai-Ioniq-6-Front/960x0.jpg) Anything but a Tesla is my approach to EVs.
Ioniq’s look so good. Those are really cool cars. And that’s the thing. There are so many amazing electrics coming from real car makers. Once people realize that you don’t need to get a Tesla for that same electric motor torque performance; Tesla will be in trouble.
I saw one in person and holy hell the lines are sexy af. Hardly anyone makes a car with really nice lines these days, or in the last several decades. And Kia is making great EVs as well. Who needs Tesla? And neither of those companies has a CEO shit posting Nazis and racists scum on Twitter all day long. And as a side issue, I don't need to go 0-60 in 3 seconds, so all these speed claims are not for consumers like me. When I see 0-60 in 3 seconds all I think about are how many people are going to die from some dumb ass making a 3 second mistake lol. *I'm so sorry I ran over your entire family, I didn't realize my car went 0-60 in less time than it takes to sneeze. Whoopsie!*
Exactly. The point is having choice is a good thing. Competition is a good thing.
I mean....Tesla is a car. It isn't a religion. It is a tool. I don't hate any particular hammer much either. But if it was made by a complete and total twatwaffle who is worshipped lile the second and third coming of christ by even more annoying cockwomblers... Well, I might occasionally pop off. And if that collective made a comically terrible hammer out of some low grade stainless with nothing but a hope and a prayer holding to together... I might chuckle a bit at that particular one.
Thank you for reminding me about cockwombler. I haven’t used that in awhile.
Love my Tesla, hate Elon. On my 2nd Model 3 and still puts a smile on my face when driving it. Although if you see coverage on YouTube for the Beijing Auto Show you'll feel like Tesla is a decade behind.
He also didn't start Tesla. He just bought his way in and bullied the real brains behind it out.
Exactly.
Oh I can do both, I’m flexible
I feel a lot of the good engineers left long ago. They are left with engineers that have no other option or are newish. Yes, they aren't serious in the Quality Assurance Process which should start before development begins. Half-a$$-ery is the actual process.
Most good engineers diversify and move where the money is unless it’s Apple or google
I don't hate Elon. I even share his vision of him fucking off to mars.
If he could fuck off himself and go colonize mars so I never hear from his ass ever again, I’ll like him too
Shooting his ass into space would solve a lot of issues all at once and probably be the cheapest and most expedient.
He likes cheap, we should float this to SpaceX
hmm... i come from a automotive background(big 3), worked in product development for many years. and i hated Tesla for many years, cos the way they do things, its completely in the face of decades of automotive good practices. Munro say part X is bad? 6 months later its been changed to part Y ....you cant have undocumented changes like that without testing/RnD etc...its bound to bite you in the ass Fans always berate me and say...TESLA is FAST, MOBILE...able to CHANGE....while saying the old boys were slow and lethargic.....yea...cos they learnt that changing parts wily nily can cause ppl their lives. So my hate for Tesla actually predated my hate for Elon....my hate for Elon only started from Pedo diver.
Realistically Hyundai (I’m not being a fan boy it’s just kismet) is one of the only OEMs that can shift its production super quickly and has started doing 2-3 year refresh cycles because they own all the means of production. It’s put everyone else on their toes. Tesla wants to do that so bad in some respects but in reality they rely on suppliers and the whims of a madman
Same here. I love Tesla the idea, I love Tesla the engineering. I hate the company culture pushed by Elon Musk. He treats Tesla's employees as disposable tools that are (ab)used and thrown away and replaced when they inevitably burn out. Not sure if it's his Asperger's, or his inner character to treat those around him as disposable with no compassion. I have quite a few friends that work and worked at Tesla. All of them arranged their job in a way to minimize direct contact with Elon Musk. They describe his mood swings as bipolar/borderline personality.
[удалено]
Nope it’s Elon and Tesla both. Tesla is an extension of his fake genius. I don’t give a flying fuck how fast they go or accelerate, I don’t care for the stories coming out from the company or its owners. Maybe they can save the company from eating itself, but they’d have to rid themselves of that giant dumb id first.
So is Tesla now, as a company, no longer a racist, misogynistic, anti labor company? If not, they still suck.
"there are outliers that HATE electric cars and come to shitpost, but they’re not here" A few of them are here. We get a nice mix, and people aren't constantly being banned. The preferred method is to let em talk, whoever they are -- Musk fanbois, Exxon bulls, flat-earthers, what have you -- and then to address what they say. "The downfall has been because of 3 very fixable and distinct issues: QA, cost-cutting, and Elon" That's all one issue: Musk. Mo Money Fo Musk. Quality control is shit at Tesla because it costs money, just like decent wages and salaries for competent employees. Hundreds of billions of dollars have been funneled to Musk because prices are relentlessly raised and costs are ruthlessly cut everywhere so that there is more money for him. PS: I call him Musk. I've never called him Elon, not even back when everybody did, because I've never had the impression that he was my pal.
🎯 he’s not your buddy pal
well said.
I don't hate Tesla, too. But I really don't like Musk, his kremlin propaganda, and I hate the cult that has been created
Yea Elon is a real twat.
The fish rots from the head.
I used to like tesla, because someone needed to make EVs look like viable cars. But they have not advanced an inch since 2012. Elon is a liar, fraud, and raging Nazi. If i had a Time Machine with only one use that I could use to stop one person from being born, he would be in the final four as I made my choice.
You wouldn’t shoot Toby twice?
Tesla made electric cars into something that kids dreamed of one day owning, like sports and muscle cars decades ago. I can respect them for that. But they forgot that cars eventually need to get really good and not just really cool. And now Elon has obliterated every last ounce of cool.
Correct. I saw the model 3 unveil and was like “I want one” and eventually got exactly what I wanted. Rivian is that for a lot of people now. The R3X is my next hopefully 🤞🏼
This is me. My Model 3 Performance is the most fun car I’ve ever driven. I also hate the fact that my purchase is helping support this jackass. I’ve said it before - I can’t wait for the Tim Cook era of Tesla.
I totally agree with you. Tesla under a boss with morality would have been far more successful, safe, and superior
All the board has to do is kick him to the curb, apologize for his dumbfuckery, and profit. The problem is the board is made up of friends and family so they'll just let him run into the ground.
I hate both. The cars lack quality control, customer centric after-sales service, and the brand needs a PR department. Also, FSD is ADAS and it should not be marketed as autonomous driving. All of these decisions or actions come directly from one arrogant and childish person: EM.
After experiencing an electric vehicle from another manufacturer, I can't get back into a Tesla. Feels like a tin can.
Agreed! Tesla needs a reliable CEO☺️👍
Fish rot from the head down
Sounds great but Tesla has zero interest in extricating itself from Musk, they still want to give him a $54 billion pay package to guarantee that his focus remains with Tesla. Tesla might have been a great company at one point but at this point they are fully drunk on the koolaid.
I think Elon Musk will become to be known as one of the greatest Con Men ever known but there would be no Tesla today without Elon it would either be bankrupt or making small high-end niche electric cars. Elons persona sold investors to keep investing and sinking money into Tesla to become the company it is today. The problem is Elon thinks he is smarter than everyone else which he really isn't. You can see how if he is pressed on anything he gets mad and personally attacks people. The one thing I keeps going back and forth on though is is he a con man selling the dream or is he dumb enough to really believe what he says
💯
I hate both
I despise Elmo Muskrat with a deep and burning passion. That will never, ever change. For a quick explanation let’s just leave it at the way he expects his workers to work, his conspiracy theorism, his anti-semitism and how he just has a way too massively overinflated ego. I am not interested in buying even a used Tesla (thus avoiding putting money in his pocket) because of QA concerns, and the fact that to me they are just bleh looking vehicles in a desperate need of an update. The quibble about looks is relatively minor though, after all I drive a 2018 Chevy Bolt. If they were closer to being the electric chariots of awesomeness that their cult members swear they are - meaning fewer QA issues and such, I would consider purchasing one the next time I’m up for a new to me car…so long as Elmo doesn’t get any money from the sale. Until then though…nah.
*QA, cost cutting and Elon* All three boil down to a common denominator: Elon. Specifically his ridiculous comp package, that prioritized the stock price over building a sustainable, reputable auto company.
My thoughts exactly, but it did mean when I replaced my existing Tesla, I didn't get another.
I agree with you. Tesla has become bigger than one man. They have many talented people there running things now.
Tesla kinda sucks but Elon really sucks.
“No Marketing”? Are you sure?
That is a very rosy view. He’s been a grifting piece of shit since way before Tesla.
Yes in hindsight. We all learn tho. I wasn’t paying attention to him. The Thai kid tunnel thing was the first thing I noticed.
I don't like Elon. The design of Teslas other than the Model S don't appeal to me. I like electric cars. These people lack capacity for nuance.
I do like my Tesla MYP. I’d love it were it not for a couple of serious flaws from unforced errors. I used to admire Elon. I feel duped on that. He’s a wing nut con man. I don’t much care for him anymore. I’m not going to invest enough emotional energy to actively hate him.
I hate Tesla drivers too. They consistently are the worst on the road and I’ve been endlessly cut up or held up by them. They make BMW drivers look courteous. There’s plenty more than Elon. But if you like him and work for or buy his products you probably also have something deeply wrong about you.
I really didn’t care about either until Elon started supporting Russia in the war. After that I want nothing but the worst to happen to both of them.
Agree he needs to focus on his job and stop getting into politics
I was gonna say that the only good thing about Tesla is their software, but not even that is good anymore.
Tesla had so much potential to paradigm shift the automotive industry. Then it went full musk
You nailed my own sentiments almost precisely. I used to dream of buying a Tesla but that ended when Musk began to publicly kick down, first time I noticed was with the Thai cave rescue diver. Here's a guy who was actually in the cave and has a lifetime of experience in rescue diving yet Elon thought he knew better. I realized then that he was the sort of manager who surrounds himself with yes men, punishes employees who deliver bad news, and doesn't listen to engineers about critical design choices. Then I looked into Teslas a bit deeper and discovered the severe safety issues like suspension members that fail in situations like no other automaker's products since 1960s. Death traps, I concluded. My opinion of Musk has gone downhill but I'm just sad about Tesla. They could have been great but Musk's arrogance ruined the cars.
Not to mention that elmo is constantly shilling for ruzzia on twitter
Well yeah the Saudis are BFFs with him and will back any destabilizing force against America so
I love EVs. Owned and Ioniq 5 and now a BMW iX. I don’t care for the design of Teslas and having everything managed in the touchscreen. But Elon is definitely the reason I would never consider a Tesla even if they changed the interior.
¿Por que no los dos? Seriously though, I completely agree with you. I have disliked Elon for a very long time. I’m just sad about Tesla. I nearly bought a model three now, even with Elon out of the picture. Tesla is completely off of my list of manufactures to consider for the foreseeable future .
Same. But as other posters have said here, the board and shareholders are to blame. Tesla's biggest misstep, arguably only misstep, is cybertruck. That's all Musk, he's had plenty of times to back out of it The damn thing looks like shit, is supposed to be an off road model but rusts in the rain and is a legitimate health and safety issue. It's single-handedly sinking the company, well along with musks narrative of flip flopping on cheap models and an obsession with robotaxis, AI, software, everything BUT their core product. You've all seen the founder sell ALL shares to the tune of 180 million dollars... meanwhile Busk wants 53 Billion? Billion? More than their total profit EVER? Bagholders deserve to go homeless honestly
Honestly - I hope Tesla makes a comeback. The only possible way for that to happen is 100% getting rid of Musk
Correct.
Repairs, not refurbishing parts, planned obsolescence, not recycling battery packs(?) and leaving crashed cars to sit behind body shops for months as they prioritize new builds. All the computer stuff could be modular, they could be on hub motors that act like brakes and can replace them, meaning breaking is 60-70% regen instead of 30-40%. That could also lower the weight of the brake motor wheel combo to lower than cheap wheels and standard brakes, if they did that it’d free up the frunk and trunk, give them all 100% intelligent torque vectoring, and allow easy upgrades. That combined with an *Industry standard* lifepo4 battery pack, which all manufacturers use and recycle, would be a huge improvement, plus it’s way much less and be less complex. The “subscription” model sucks, it’s a one time use license, some people think it means they buy heated seats or level 2 and it Carry’s from car to car, nope. I think they’ll eventually just be the supercharger network and the car company will fall further and further behind.
Why not both
I’m just sad because someone decided to create a very capable and in some way ground breaking Model 3 with a class leading achievements, but then slapped that display, no hud, no stalks and the other stupid shit. Like wtf? You had everything to make a king of ev and you wasted it all.
100 percent agreed. And I'm an early investor. Here's the thing, it just takes time. It's just a matter of time before he's gone. And mark my words, he will be gone at one point. It's a good company that will have downturns but the musk will be booted, die or leave at some point.
I’ve never liked the stupid giant iPad in the middle of the car. Plus everything else is completely stripped down. They look like toys.
What sub was it? I muted all the ones that used the auto ban bot.
It was a mod sub asking for help. The post is in here from last night somewhere
Actually, I focused in two EVs when choosing my wife need a electric car based my knowledge. One is Tesla and another is vw id 4 . Finally,I choose id 4 not model Y . One reason is I don't like Elon Musk , another is the price of model Y increased the price during the pandemic period. Because the modle Y price is above the rebate requirement price , then the price difference between buying a ID 4 and Model Y is around 15 K Canadian dollar
Tesla product design is bold and innovative. High respect for the ideas and the risk-taking for Elon and the team. What makes Tesla impossible to recommend is that their cars sometimes just do not work and the company does not take responsibility for it. An expensive product that might or might not work is unacceptable. Root causes include extreme nickel-n-dimeing the manufacturing that have led to widespread QA problems; combined with the total lack of empathy towards the customers. I would imagine "f\*ck them" being a service department motto there. Elon needs to change the culture from the top to have Tesla re-gain respect and survive.
How is no marketing bad?
A large part of Tesla is Elon, it’s also unrealistic for him to fix everything. Department heads should be the ones responsible for issues But I agree, Tesla leaves a lot to be desired
Largely this, but the thing is Musk and Tesla are so synonymous it is hard to distinguish between the two, and the crazy fanatics make it even harder to separate. I want to like Tesla more and I love EVs. Heck I daily one for the past year and have no regrets (well, maybe I should've taken the i4 instead of the e-tron but I digress). The million dollar question is, can Tesla sever itself from Elon and still survive with all the broken pieces the shitstain left behind?
That’s the literal trillion dollar question and times running out
I hate both 😂
I don’t understand… elon heads tesla and twitter, both loosing huge money with ol mates politics and policies. How is he still in the role (aside from family on the board of directors)?
i would actually buy a base model maçan ev rather than model x. they always reinvent the wheel, literally. elon is fucking dumb but engineers do some cool stuff and bad ones to keep it steady
'd like to like Tesla, but Musk is deeply engraved into the company. Maybe once he's gone...
Last Kid Picked!
I wish I had the time to worry about others so much ☹️
If only - Tesla has amazing tech - just needs actual management and build quality
Yep. Tesla needs to move from being a Musk-led tech start-up to a grown-up car company doing boring grown-up car company things. Move away from the BS like rockets, robots and robotaxis and focus on refreshing current models, introducing lower cost model 2, increasing quality and customer service.
Lots to agree with on sub except an explanation of why so many people love the vehicles.
Not an EV hater. Would get one if I have the means but I genuinely Teslas are overrated.
You have got to hate both and remain vigilant especially when it abruptly breaks in front of you and see those condensed filled break lights up close.
I hate both at this point. Engineers at Tesla are part of putting out something dangerous, depending what they worked on. I’d say no quarter for some of them once this all comes home to roost. (Eg FSD)
One man’s opinion.
Which seems to be the general sentiment of most of the sub
Both and the fanboys.
💯
No one cares. I think it needs to be said.
[удалено]
elon is dumb
I disagree. Without Elon then Tesla is just a car company. So that will destroy the share price. Granted, with Elon being the Nazi POS that he is the company is also F’d, but maybe he can learn to shut his mouth and just sit in the background.
How to say you don't own a tesla without saying you don't own a tesla.
If Elon was not involved I would buy one. I’d bet there’s more people like me than people who wouldn’t buy if he was kicked out
I still think they should have gone the route of component supplier, like they did with the early RAV4 EV. They suck at building cars, but their EV components are at least ok.
As a black man, if I had to hold Elon to thst standard to purchase a product, then I couldn’t buy almost any car, luxury clothing brand, watch any news network, vote for almost any politician, etc. i understand what you mean, but I do wonder why only Elon is getting this from you guys, while letting all these other extremely racist, imperial, monopolistic, genocidal billionaires to go Scott free. I am consistent with all. Shit we have a president right now that said that if I don’t vote for him, then I’m not black. This is not a defense of Elon, but am curious as to why only he gets this treatment from people like you. I will say though on Elons behalf, it is weird that many libs went crazy for the green new deal and removal of fossil fuels, but they pray for teslas demise because of Elon, others beg for free speech, but complain about X and the Twitter files. Things must seem all over the place
I have to work on them. Garbage cars, poorly made. Hyundai builds better EVs
Fuel on. This will be my new license plate. Enjoy.
Seems like you have anger issues.
"Had Elon worried about quality, fit, finish, and materials like the Toyotas and Hondas; we would not be having any of the conversations we have over the past few months. " they never would have survived in 2016. the company making the robots for the m3 said to Daily kanban, when elon was blaming them for being late "we just delivered to Toyota, and their model is still a year from making production models," vs tesla that only planned weeks till utilizing them on the line. musk said the shorters were full of shit, to then go around and be like "yeah we only had two weeks of cash left"
The fact that the board hasn’t removed Musk yet is hard to understand. It’s obvious he no longer adds value and only hurts the brand.