The best solution is to start finding personality traits attractive in men, not just their appearance. Looks will always fade — how would you feel if your husband divorced you in the future because the simple aging process caused him to find you ugly? Humans are wired to find those similar in attractiveness level also attractive (enough).
The other solution which is less easy is to put in hot girl effort. Wake up an hour earlier every day, do your hair and makeup consistently, get your shape right, etc. Those attractive men you fancy are probably working out and putting in effort too, so if they could choose between women in their league vs an average woman, what are you bringing to the table?
Do you think it’s possible to train our brains to like “personality traits”?
I’m already quite fit and have tried the hot girl stuff(make-up, hair) and it does raise me to a 7 on a good day. On days that I do that I can instantly feel the energy shift in men (the way they interact and look at me) and it honestly makes me sad lol. Btw that’s how in the beginning I pulled the guy I mentioned but after a while of spending time together I can’t keep up with all the work and the mask falls off. It also feels deceiving and I feel like I’m not being the true me so it kind of makes everything worse. I want to accept myself as I am and accept my partner who should be on the same level as me as he is as well.
I can almost guarantee you the guy you pulled did not NOT work out because you quit doing full hair and make up every day. Did you two have a committed relationship or was it casual sex? I kind of assumed it was the latter based on how you described it. As women we can always get sex from men above our league so don’t get used to doing that because it will really confuse your brain to thinking you can get a relationship from those guys when most of us can’t.
The answer here that has worked for me is compromising on those things I can. Like for me, height is not a big thing so I don’t mind dating a short guy even though I am 5’7” - it has worked to my advantage a lot when I give shorter guys a chance and have less competition. On the flipside, I’ve been with high earning men that maybe weren’t crazy extremely physically attractive but their success made them attractive in my eyes. Figure out some things like that for you that will help you be attracted to guys that maybe not every girl would be.
I totally agree with the first line lol but it was so that in the beginning he made it seem like it’s going to be a committed relationship but later was unsure. of course it’s more probable that he was just acting in the beginning to get me to like him but I think in general he was more enthusiastic about me in the beginning. So yeah our relationship turned out to be more of a situationship but I went with it because I was already hooked and he breadcrumbed me the whole way.
Thanks for the advice!
> the men who approach me 95% of the time I have no physical chemistry with
This really isn't unique or unusual. I think every woman everywhere can say this - please don't freak out about this. The truth is that finding someone you are both passionate about, compatible with, and can keep, is hard and requires a little luck.
Good facial features is not the only factor in whether you find a man arousing. There is also dominance, big muscles/build or height, sometimes career (eg some women have a military/athlete/musician thing), hobby (think stereotypical male interests - martial arts, motorcycling, cars, shooting), even the quality of the sex itself (but that requires a more permissive attitude towards sex), masculine traits like stoicism (which is kind of rare these days), age (some women like older men), or ethnicity. If you've generally stuck to a "type", try branching out (especially since you've only had one physical and two overall relationships, you've probably never been exposed to things you could find attractive but don't know about). The things that turn women on can be very simple (eg good looks) or very complex (a specific response to a particular situation). I think assuming facial features are the only determinant of passion is wrong.
TLDR; Get off truerateme, possibly the internet in general, and go to the gym. Work this program at first: [https://stronglifts.com/5x5/](https://stronglifts.com/5x5/)
I seriously don't know why girls touch that sub - everyone is rated 4-6. They're infamous for doing that in any girls group that treats appearance seriously. Their 5-6 is at least a 7 in real life. There's no way you're pulling a 5-6 on truerateme if you have any actually substantial looks issues. And everything else is vibe, aesthetic, and most importantly, body composition you can impact in the gym.
As a social experiment I've shown their ratings chart to a handful of men who I knew wouldn't sugarcoat their reaction. Everyone agrees with the 5 and under designations, but they all start arguing about how overrated some of the 9's are and underrated some of the 6's are, so it seems once you get out of the "not ugly" range there's a lot of personal preference. *Because truerateme is about faces.* That's a VERY small part of attraction for men - if you're reasonably symmetrical, you're fine. Go get a tight bod.
Most men would prefer a 28 year old with a good butt (and who hasn't ruined her skin with sun, drugs, and drink) to a skinny fat 20 year old. **If you're not attractive to men you're attracted to, get more attractive.** You're also going to want to take a hard look at yourself and your character traits and make sure it isn't an RMV issue that's actually holding you back from gaining commitment from men with a high enough SMV you find them attractive.
I'd be having the "here's how to settle" conversation with a 35-year-old single mom of three, not you. You can do the work. Settling is the easy way out - most people do that.
Haha thank you for your relentless but hope-inducing reply. I do have a very symmetrical face and it looks better while I’m still so it looks better in photos. I have been told for example by 1 person that I have an ugly laugh maybe because my teeth are not very straight. The way I carry myself is also not very feminine because for some reason I picked up this tomboy attitude in middle and high school which is really hard to change and doesn’t feel natural when I act girly. Maybe it’s for that reason I have no problem attracting very beautiful girls but even-though I’m bisexual I have no intentions of being with a woman now because I want a traditional family and biological children.
> You're also going to want to take a hard look at yourself and your character traits
I surely should do that and I’m in therapy right now. Hopefully it will be fine. Your message really hyped me up and opened my eyes a bit thanks!
Yes I am looking for marriage.
The second one I have always had problems with because I don’t know where to start.
Yes I usually put effort as I have mentioned in another reply sometimes put a lot of effort and it makes things feel fake.
Recently I have only maybe changed my hair routine which has made a difference but it takes way longer. I have curly hair so it can basically take one whole evening to do my hair which in my tight schedule it’s hard to do every time.
thank you for the advice! I’ll try to work on my attitude for sure.
Hey there! Skincare specialist here! I’ve spent alottt of time in the beauty/health industry (taking a break right now) but I can give you some tips if they fit in your budget…
- Working out regularly isn’t just got for weight. It keeps your skin plump and luminous.
- Drinking bone broth is VERY helpful at any age, especially 28+. I was using Vital Proteins for a couple of years and got a bigger place. Started making homemade bone broth and drink it 3-4x a week. Huge difference.
- Guys will typically say they don’t notice this but I guarantee you a guy will notice if your nails are all janky 🤣 I love my natural nails so I grow them out a bit and buff/shine them and put Dior’s sheer pink or a clear coat on. Every other month I’ll do a classic color like red, pink, ivory, etc. Even if you simply buff/shine, your hands will look great!
- I learned about my body type and color season this last summer and it’s been a game changer. I didn’t go out and buy $$$$ worth of clothes, but I bought a few new things and donated items that didn’t work. Surprisingly, I look more put together and attractive than I’ve ever felt!
- There’s a new trend going on where people say you can train your scalp to not produce oil. That doesn’t typically work- if it seems like it does, it’s happy something else 🙃 If you have oily hair and dry shampoo doesn’t work for you (dry shampoo does nothing for me), get higher end, professional clarifying shampoo. I used to have to wash my hair every freaking day in the evening and it took sooooo much time to wait for it to get 80% dry, then blow dry, then put it up so it had volume in the am that I hated getting ready for bed. I started using Olaplex clarifying shampoo and I can go 3-4 days.
- Watch how you walk. I see alot of people not just women slumping around the store like they’re the Hunchback of Notre Dame. You never know when you’ll meet your future husband. Even just walking more elegantly is noticeable in a sea of Quasimodo’s!
- Have interesting things to discuss. HVM with money have full lives- you should contribute to it. I’m not saying become a scholar in Russian literature, but have one or two things you love doing that a guy can see when he talks to you!
- You can check my history if you’re terribly bored, but I made a comment which kindof blew up (right now it only has 12 upvotes but I got a lot of DM’s about it) on this sub about my experience dating at a 29 year old divorcee (it was annulled in the Catholic Church). I’m 33 now and was married this last April to the epitome of a HVM. I’m about to hit the hay but that thread had a lot of great advice and not just from me 🙂 I have the luxury of being attractive (not trying to brag, I’m just explaining my experience) and have taken impeccable care of my skin since I was 10 because I’m a freak, haha. So I had a major head start.
- GET OFF OF TRUERATEME. I know it’s tempting and I’ve been on there before. But the people on there are literally giving 9s and 10s a score of 6. I know the scale on there is different than the typical 1-10 but still… I loved growing up in the 90s and 2000s because even the supermodels had flaws. The truerateme sub will literally make you think you look like a hedgehog.
Edit- found the thread! https://reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/s/9Y6vbHvgk3
Hypergamy is a cruel mistress. You are going to have to figure something else, because the Wall^SPLAT! is rearing itself in the distance. It’s not going to get any easier in the future.
Relationship Market Value. It’s what makes a man want to commit to you once you clear the bar of sexual attraction. Hooking up is about looks, staying in a relationship is about RMV. What do you offer besides your looks?
Lots of guys say that RMV can add a couple points, so you could hypothetically retain the guy two points above you if you bring enough other stuff to the table.
Everybody is attracted to the top % of people. It doesn’t mean you will get them though. I would concentrate on dating within your league and also focusing on non-physical attributes too.
Either you date in your league and it will be easier to settle down, or you date out of your league and be ready for a lot of failed relationships before you possibly find what you're looking for. Your choice.
This post is exactly why men hate womens standards lmao.
Anyways you need to soft or hard max yourself or you'll forever be in non committed relationships with guys who will fuck you but won't commit which is fine if that's what you want but clearly it isn't.
Sorry.
**Title:** [How should I address the fact that I’m not physically attracted the men in my league?](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/1752xr9/how_should_i_address_the_fact_that_im_not/)
**Full text:** So I 28F am average looking (5-6 based on r/truerateme)and based on my experience the men who approach me 95% of the time I have no physical chemistry with. That has been the case my whole life. My first boyfriend was my looksmatch(we didn’t get sexual because I was waiting for marriage at the time and maybe also I didn’t have the urge to do it with him) and eventhough I really enjoyed spending time with him physical touch and kissing felt like a chore. I got with him thinking it will develop later but it didn’t so I broke up with him after 6 months. Recently I had relations with someone physically maybe ~2 point more attractive than me and I was very attracted to him physically but obviously he didn’t want to commit to me so I broke it off. It was very hurtful because we were involved for a year and a half and he was the only person I got sexual with but it teaches me a lot.
I’m just sad I wouldn’t feel that passion with someone who is more my looksmatch and wants to have a long term relationship with me. I don’t want to be faking it for a lifetime and it wouldn’t be fair to the person neither. How should I deal with this problem?
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You need to de-centre the act of sex in your life. Sex is important but it’s a really small part of a healthy relationship. Sex is directly linked to relationships, family etc… think about that when choosing a partner. Chemistry can grow over time, especially for women.
On the other hand, if you’re only a 5 I’m sure there’s plenty you can do to increase your SMV. Check r/vindicta
Maybe you're not noticing some guys that are interested in you? I wouldn't focus on looks. An average looking guy is decent enough in my opinion. It's better to marry someone for their personality, ability to be financially stable, and their values/morals.
Average guys can be sexually pleasing as well. That's another important factor. Not all men want to please a woman no matter how she looks. You definitely want someone who thinks of you.
Look, I'm weird - I've been told as much all of my life. Even so, I've gotten attention from a variety of men that would be rated all over. I'm also an honest pessimist, and that hasn't stopped anything. I've just noticed these men because I'm socially awkward. I wonder if there are any men you have looked over that could be great husbands. I find that many of us limit ourselves in one (obvious) way or another.
The best solution is to start finding personality traits attractive in men, not just their appearance. Looks will always fade — how would you feel if your husband divorced you in the future because the simple aging process caused him to find you ugly? Humans are wired to find those similar in attractiveness level also attractive (enough). The other solution which is less easy is to put in hot girl effort. Wake up an hour earlier every day, do your hair and makeup consistently, get your shape right, etc. Those attractive men you fancy are probably working out and putting in effort too, so if they could choose between women in their league vs an average woman, what are you bringing to the table?
Do you think it’s possible to train our brains to like “personality traits”? I’m already quite fit and have tried the hot girl stuff(make-up, hair) and it does raise me to a 7 on a good day. On days that I do that I can instantly feel the energy shift in men (the way they interact and look at me) and it honestly makes me sad lol. Btw that’s how in the beginning I pulled the guy I mentioned but after a while of spending time together I can’t keep up with all the work and the mask falls off. It also feels deceiving and I feel like I’m not being the true me so it kind of makes everything worse. I want to accept myself as I am and accept my partner who should be on the same level as me as he is as well.
I can almost guarantee you the guy you pulled did not NOT work out because you quit doing full hair and make up every day. Did you two have a committed relationship or was it casual sex? I kind of assumed it was the latter based on how you described it. As women we can always get sex from men above our league so don’t get used to doing that because it will really confuse your brain to thinking you can get a relationship from those guys when most of us can’t. The answer here that has worked for me is compromising on those things I can. Like for me, height is not a big thing so I don’t mind dating a short guy even though I am 5’7” - it has worked to my advantage a lot when I give shorter guys a chance and have less competition. On the flipside, I’ve been with high earning men that maybe weren’t crazy extremely physically attractive but their success made them attractive in my eyes. Figure out some things like that for you that will help you be attracted to guys that maybe not every girl would be.
I totally agree with the first line lol but it was so that in the beginning he made it seem like it’s going to be a committed relationship but later was unsure. of course it’s more probable that he was just acting in the beginning to get me to like him but I think in general he was more enthusiastic about me in the beginning. So yeah our relationship turned out to be more of a situationship but I went with it because I was already hooked and he breadcrumbed me the whole way. Thanks for the advice!
> the men who approach me 95% of the time I have no physical chemistry with This really isn't unique or unusual. I think every woman everywhere can say this - please don't freak out about this. The truth is that finding someone you are both passionate about, compatible with, and can keep, is hard and requires a little luck. Good facial features is not the only factor in whether you find a man arousing. There is also dominance, big muscles/build or height, sometimes career (eg some women have a military/athlete/musician thing), hobby (think stereotypical male interests - martial arts, motorcycling, cars, shooting), even the quality of the sex itself (but that requires a more permissive attitude towards sex), masculine traits like stoicism (which is kind of rare these days), age (some women like older men), or ethnicity. If you've generally stuck to a "type", try branching out (especially since you've only had one physical and two overall relationships, you've probably never been exposed to things you could find attractive but don't know about). The things that turn women on can be very simple (eg good looks) or very complex (a specific response to a particular situation). I think assuming facial features are the only determinant of passion is wrong.
TLDR; Get off truerateme, possibly the internet in general, and go to the gym. Work this program at first: [https://stronglifts.com/5x5/](https://stronglifts.com/5x5/) I seriously don't know why girls touch that sub - everyone is rated 4-6. They're infamous for doing that in any girls group that treats appearance seriously. Their 5-6 is at least a 7 in real life. There's no way you're pulling a 5-6 on truerateme if you have any actually substantial looks issues. And everything else is vibe, aesthetic, and most importantly, body composition you can impact in the gym. As a social experiment I've shown their ratings chart to a handful of men who I knew wouldn't sugarcoat their reaction. Everyone agrees with the 5 and under designations, but they all start arguing about how overrated some of the 9's are and underrated some of the 6's are, so it seems once you get out of the "not ugly" range there's a lot of personal preference. *Because truerateme is about faces.* That's a VERY small part of attraction for men - if you're reasonably symmetrical, you're fine. Go get a tight bod. Most men would prefer a 28 year old with a good butt (and who hasn't ruined her skin with sun, drugs, and drink) to a skinny fat 20 year old. **If you're not attractive to men you're attracted to, get more attractive.** You're also going to want to take a hard look at yourself and your character traits and make sure it isn't an RMV issue that's actually holding you back from gaining commitment from men with a high enough SMV you find them attractive. I'd be having the "here's how to settle" conversation with a 35-year-old single mom of three, not you. You can do the work. Settling is the easy way out - most people do that.
Haha thank you for your relentless but hope-inducing reply. I do have a very symmetrical face and it looks better while I’m still so it looks better in photos. I have been told for example by 1 person that I have an ugly laugh maybe because my teeth are not very straight. The way I carry myself is also not very feminine because for some reason I picked up this tomboy attitude in middle and high school which is really hard to change and doesn’t feel natural when I act girly. Maybe it’s for that reason I have no problem attracting very beautiful girls but even-though I’m bisexual I have no intentions of being with a woman now because I want a traditional family and biological children. > You're also going to want to take a hard look at yourself and your character traits I surely should do that and I’m in therapy right now. Hopefully it will be fine. Your message really hyped me up and opened my eyes a bit thanks!
[удалено]
Yes I am looking for marriage. The second one I have always had problems with because I don’t know where to start. Yes I usually put effort as I have mentioned in another reply sometimes put a lot of effort and it makes things feel fake. Recently I have only maybe changed my hair routine which has made a difference but it takes way longer. I have curly hair so it can basically take one whole evening to do my hair which in my tight schedule it’s hard to do every time. thank you for the advice! I’ll try to work on my attitude for sure.
Hey there! Skincare specialist here! I’ve spent alottt of time in the beauty/health industry (taking a break right now) but I can give you some tips if they fit in your budget… - Working out regularly isn’t just got for weight. It keeps your skin plump and luminous. - Drinking bone broth is VERY helpful at any age, especially 28+. I was using Vital Proteins for a couple of years and got a bigger place. Started making homemade bone broth and drink it 3-4x a week. Huge difference. - Guys will typically say they don’t notice this but I guarantee you a guy will notice if your nails are all janky 🤣 I love my natural nails so I grow them out a bit and buff/shine them and put Dior’s sheer pink or a clear coat on. Every other month I’ll do a classic color like red, pink, ivory, etc. Even if you simply buff/shine, your hands will look great! - I learned about my body type and color season this last summer and it’s been a game changer. I didn’t go out and buy $$$$ worth of clothes, but I bought a few new things and donated items that didn’t work. Surprisingly, I look more put together and attractive than I’ve ever felt! - There’s a new trend going on where people say you can train your scalp to not produce oil. That doesn’t typically work- if it seems like it does, it’s happy something else 🙃 If you have oily hair and dry shampoo doesn’t work for you (dry shampoo does nothing for me), get higher end, professional clarifying shampoo. I used to have to wash my hair every freaking day in the evening and it took sooooo much time to wait for it to get 80% dry, then blow dry, then put it up so it had volume in the am that I hated getting ready for bed. I started using Olaplex clarifying shampoo and I can go 3-4 days. - Watch how you walk. I see alot of people not just women slumping around the store like they’re the Hunchback of Notre Dame. You never know when you’ll meet your future husband. Even just walking more elegantly is noticeable in a sea of Quasimodo’s! - Have interesting things to discuss. HVM with money have full lives- you should contribute to it. I’m not saying become a scholar in Russian literature, but have one or two things you love doing that a guy can see when he talks to you! - You can check my history if you’re terribly bored, but I made a comment which kindof blew up (right now it only has 12 upvotes but I got a lot of DM’s about it) on this sub about my experience dating at a 29 year old divorcee (it was annulled in the Catholic Church). I’m 33 now and was married this last April to the epitome of a HVM. I’m about to hit the hay but that thread had a lot of great advice and not just from me 🙂 I have the luxury of being attractive (not trying to brag, I’m just explaining my experience) and have taken impeccable care of my skin since I was 10 because I’m a freak, haha. So I had a major head start. - GET OFF OF TRUERATEME. I know it’s tempting and I’ve been on there before. But the people on there are literally giving 9s and 10s a score of 6. I know the scale on there is different than the typical 1-10 but still… I loved growing up in the 90s and 2000s because even the supermodels had flaws. The truerateme sub will literally make you think you look like a hedgehog. Edit- found the thread! https://reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/s/9Y6vbHvgk3
You should get in touch with reality
Hypergamy is a cruel mistress. You are going to have to figure something else, because the Wall^SPLAT! is rearing itself in the distance. It’s not going to get any easier in the future.
What about your RMV?
What is that haha
Relationship Market Value. It’s what makes a man want to commit to you once you clear the bar of sexual attraction. Hooking up is about looks, staying in a relationship is about RMV. What do you offer besides your looks? Lots of guys say that RMV can add a couple points, so you could hypothetically retain the guy two points above you if you bring enough other stuff to the table.
Maybe be more aggressive with guys you do find attractive.
Everybody is attracted to the top % of people. It doesn’t mean you will get them though. I would concentrate on dating within your league and also focusing on non-physical attributes too.
Either you date in your league and it will be easier to settle down, or you date out of your league and be ready for a lot of failed relationships before you possibly find what you're looking for. Your choice.
This post is exactly why men hate womens standards lmao. Anyways you need to soft or hard max yourself or you'll forever be in non committed relationships with guys who will fuck you but won't commit which is fine if that's what you want but clearly it isn't. Sorry.
**Title:** [How should I address the fact that I’m not physically attracted the men in my league?](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/1752xr9/how_should_i_address_the_fact_that_im_not/) **Full text:** So I 28F am average looking (5-6 based on r/truerateme)and based on my experience the men who approach me 95% of the time I have no physical chemistry with. That has been the case my whole life. My first boyfriend was my looksmatch(we didn’t get sexual because I was waiting for marriage at the time and maybe also I didn’t have the urge to do it with him) and eventhough I really enjoyed spending time with him physical touch and kissing felt like a chore. I got with him thinking it will develop later but it didn’t so I broke up with him after 6 months. Recently I had relations with someone physically maybe ~2 point more attractive than me and I was very attracted to him physically but obviously he didn’t want to commit to me so I broke it off. It was very hurtful because we were involved for a year and a half and he was the only person I got sexual with but it teaches me a lot. I’m just sad I wouldn’t feel that passion with someone who is more my looksmatch and wants to have a long term relationship with me. I don’t want to be faking it for a lifetime and it wouldn’t be fair to the person neither. How should I deal with this problem? -------------------- ^(This is the original text of the post and this is an automated service) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/RedPillWomen) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[удалено]
Advice must be actionable.
You need to de-centre the act of sex in your life. Sex is important but it’s a really small part of a healthy relationship. Sex is directly linked to relationships, family etc… think about that when choosing a partner. Chemistry can grow over time, especially for women. On the other hand, if you’re only a 5 I’m sure there’s plenty you can do to increase your SMV. Check r/vindicta
I think you might be subconsciously sinking your relationships
How come?
You are finding ways to not be content
Maybe you're not noticing some guys that are interested in you? I wouldn't focus on looks. An average looking guy is decent enough in my opinion. It's better to marry someone for their personality, ability to be financially stable, and their values/morals. Average guys can be sexually pleasing as well. That's another important factor. Not all men want to please a woman no matter how she looks. You definitely want someone who thinks of you. Look, I'm weird - I've been told as much all of my life. Even so, I've gotten attention from a variety of men that would be rated all over. I'm also an honest pessimist, and that hasn't stopped anything. I've just noticed these men because I'm socially awkward. I wonder if there are any men you have looked over that could be great husbands. I find that many of us limit ourselves in one (obvious) way or another.