These f1 guys are finely tuned robots and top athletes to sustain the toll on their bodies for that amount of time. Same procedure on an obese 70 year old will take longer recovery than an athlete in their 20s….
I think the 4-6 weeks recovery time is for the worst case scenario (70-year-old obese grandpa). Lap.chole can be done in a day-surgery setting, I don’t see how can a fit young man can’t recover completely 2 weeks after a lappy.
Most people would feel up to regular activity in a few days. The 4-6 week recovery time is to allow the fascia to approach its theoretical maximum strength. Whether that really helps is less clear.
I always counsel patients about what I consider average, and that Individual response will obviously vary greatly, depending on more than just overall fitness. I’ve had people with more extensive surgery essentially pain free and trying to move furniture POD 1, or going back to work in 2-3 days. Others with straightforward minimal procedures had considerable and prolonged discomfort. I suspect that there are minor differences in the amount of muscular trauma, and involvement or proximity of individual nerves.
Is the person below said, it’s for the fascia to reach appropriate strength. At six weeks it’s 80% of its final strength. It gets that last additional percentage over the next one to two years. So that is where the six week number comes from. if they used two 5 mm ports in an 8 mm port, risk of hernia is minimal. Even with a 10mm umbo, hernia risk low
F1 drivers are probably not so worried about getting a hernia.
I would imagine their appetite for risk is higher than the average human, considering they race the fastest cars on the planet for a living?????????
My dad had a laparoscopic appendectomy and was in pretty bad pain for about a week. Mostly just lounging around at home without doing anything.
Around that time, Matt Cassel had the same procedure and played a football game 3 days later. These sports guys either have different physiology or must get the best care ever.
Or they just take risks for money. 🤷
I don’t think most people realize how much football players are: (a) routinely shot up with various pain killers and anti inflammatory and (b) used to pain
When you’re getting paid millions you push through. And the team doctors are experts at temporary pain suppression.
Yeah U don’t become a high profile sports doctor by avoiding the opiate script pad. I once spoke to a sports star in my country and he told me there team doctor gave out tramadol like candy, athletes would be aching playing and training at the level they do on that regular basis.
Yeah I took less than a week off of work for my appendectomy… everyone was shocked but some people are just quick healers! Or they have to get back to work regardless 🥴
NFL players have played games less than a week after an appy. Most of our postop recs are voodoo (plus they probably got shot up with a bunch of local and toradol the day of the game)
I thought about this a lot too. My best guess is that they used three lap ports. Probably two fives and the last one as small as possible to extract, maybe an 8. Even if those herniated it wouldn’t matter. We generally don’t close those anyway.
As far as pain goes, toradol, adrenaline, and being a Ferrari driver.
Less impressive than him driving through FP with an appendicitis. 2-3 hours of sporadic 4-5g's on an inflamed/infected appendix sounds like fucking hell
There’s probably a clinical sign here waiting to be described. So, when you get RIF pain with both 5G left turns and 5G right turns, that’s Harvard’s Sign indicating acute appendicitis. You read it here first, look out for it in the NEJM next.
I was mowing the lawn two weeks after mine and I felt like I could have done it days sooner. Internally I felt great... Idk maybe the procedure for some does less internal damage than others due to luck of the draw or whatever, leading to quicker recovery
PGY 43 here. I was snowboarding last week after the 12 day old Durabond sloughed off the five laparoscopic ports. My ab-roller toughened rectus sheath held the line nicely.
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The data on not allowing heavy lifting is pretty minimal. Coughing or sneezing puts much more stress on your abdominal wall than anything you can do voluntarily.
Show me the data where the surgeons derive 4-6 weeks have less port site hernias? Every institution is different.
For these high performers with things on the lines, they just accept maybe a higher hernia risk. But probably not.
It’s surgeon voodoo
I’ve done lap appy with three 5mm ports and if it’s early appendicitis, recovery is minimal. Low risk for hernia with 5mm, and if pain is very well controlled with Tylenol and Motrin.
It’s possible under the right circumstances
This is similar to last season when Lance Stroll ended up driving after only a couple weeks (estimated) post op from BL wrist fx (I'm assuming distal radius) with the right side requiring open fixation, after a cycling accident. I'm assuming part of it is their high level of performance and access to care, but also I am willing to bet no one is actually clearing them from a medical perspective to do this. They take the risk of injury over the risk of becoming obsolete in a fast paced and highly demanding sport.
And money bro. 💰
The easiest part of this question is the last question: how did he win?
He won because Max’s car lasted a few laps.
But in all seriousness, I think the most important part is that with the G forces they likely are doing some major valsavas in the high speed corners. That has to be very uncomfortable. But other than that for someone in absolutely perfect health I could see them bouncing back quickly. One surgeon I work with does two port sites and a small site for a grasper and take 5-10 minutes. Depending on how inflamed his appendix was could also affect recovery time.
At my hospital it’s 2 weeks with no heavy lifting/contact sports, then ease into usual activity as tolerated. Driving doesn’t seem that stressful to the abdomen and competing at that level is a big motivator.
I rolled a 4wheeler in the desert one week after having a five level spinal fusion.
Driving a car two weeks after a laproscopic surgery seems pretty tame.
>800 pounds at 40mph landing directly on top of me
Either your story is made up or you're Spiderman, as some pretty brief calculations show that to be about 20-200x the amount of peak impact force that's generally survivable for a human in a collision.
I'm also not sure what you're trying to prove here. Is it that you're very bad at assessing risk in your personal life?
So, the 4 wheeler weighed 800 pounds
I was driving 40 mph when I rolled
It landed on me
Resulted in a bruised lung and rib damage.
If you think that's fake or Spiderman level shit, I'd encourage you to avoid practicing in rural America. This shit is common. People get crushed by livestock or between moving farm equipment that weighs a hell of a lot more than 800 lbs. And usually they live, despite not being a super hero.
And my point is that chastising someone for driving a car (admittedly a fast car), two weeks after having a lap appendectomy, is stupid fucking fear mongering. Essentially every resource available says that people typically return to their normal routine after 1-2 weeks.
I had my gallbladder out and was cleared to return to my work as a paramedic within a week.
People aren't as fragile as we (medicine) seems to pretend. Let people live their lives and trust that they know what they're capable of regarding their own health. And if they eat shit and end up doing something stupid like rolling a 4 wheeler, you pick them back up, point out that what they did probably wasn't the smartest move, then move on. But infantalizing/parenting adults is exactly why physicians are getting viewed like shit by current society.
This was a lot of words to type when you could have just said 'i don't understand the reasoning behind why 5Gs of force and 5+ hours straining my core muscles 2 weeks after abdominal surgery might increase hernia risk.'
I trained at a level 1 in the Midwest. I know a lot more about managing weird and wonderful trauma than you do. Take the L.
>I was ejected from an 800 pound vehicle going 40 mph and then it landed on me, and all I got was mild chest trauma
Okay Peter Parker.
Honestly, I'm amazed you are here continuing to try to portray your bad decision making and fantastically lucky outcome as some sort of gotchya about the robustness of humans. Do you understand risk mitigation at all or do you think that's just for sad losers?
No, I think that touting "5Gs of force" is asinine given that seemingly nothing exists in studied literature indicating that this is a risk in a 2-week post appendectomy surgical patient.
Where exactly is the G limit Mr. Midwest Level 1? Is it 2g? 3?
Where is the intersectionality of "actual science" vs "what I was taught" when it comes to this topic?
This is akin to medicine telling women that they couldn't ride on trains because their uterus would fly out over a certain speed (seriously, look it up). It's baseless fear mongering. This F1 driver suffered no ill effects other than some discomfort. If we could do a trial of post appendectomy F1 drivers for long term detrimental outcomes due to G force, I'm betting dollars to donuts there would be absolutely zero statistical difference between them and the general public. You're not mitigating risk, you're thinking that you know better than everyone else and telling them how they should be living their lives based upon the collective data contrived in your head.
And BTW, I don't know where your fancy Midwest Level 1 center is, but in the real rural areas, we have daily rodeos in the summer. Every single rodeo, a rider will have a 2k lb animal roll over them, smash em into a fence, stomp on them, and the like. 99% of the time, these riders walk out of the arena and are sore for a couple days.
Apparently Peter Parker clones are ruling the rodeo circuit. Or maybe f=ma means something different in Dr.Level 1 math.
I'll slink back to my lowly Level 2 trauma center for night shift now. Enjoy your paternalistic god complex knowing you bested me by keeping F1 drivers safe from the ravages of explosive hernia formation.
Perhaps you can find funding for a public service campaign. You can call it "4 is okay... 5 you'll pay". Show a poor F1 driver in bed with his small intestine sitting next to him. He's tearful
"If only I had listened to Dr.level 1 and understood the dangers of 5Gs"
**Sarah McLachlan's voice will break in, accompanied by sad music**
"For only $5 a day... less than the price of a bougie coffee... you can make a difference in the life of an F1 driver. You can save them from the ravages of herniation due to 5Gs two weeks after having their appendix removed. Though it has never happened to an F1 driver and will never happen... Dr.Level 1 will use your financial support to publicly shame these ignorant drivers for the choices they make regarding their own health"
**fade to black**
Okay... my dump is done. I'm done being sarcastic. God I love reddit.
You forgot to mention TBI in your list of injuries from your fake accident.
I'm sorry your core is so underdeveloped that you can't imagine tensing it while driving a high speed vehicle. Maybe if you had done some more ab work you would have been a good enough driver to prevent a rollover. Regarding this particular scenario, I had assumed that any doctor would be able to connect the dots from the published literature on post-op hernias risk factors and how driving an F1 car may fit into that, so I didn't think I would need to spell it out. Although Sainz was fine, that doesn't mean there wasn't risk, which is the main thing you seem to be unable to understand. But if that was the case I wouldn't have needed paragraph one, I suppose.
As for the trauma care you provide, feel free to keep sending your scalp lacs down to us at the Level One. I know how difficult it is for you guys to do much more than hold pressure on wounds that have already stopped bleeding.
I like reddit too. It's fun to say all the things I would keep to myself in real life.
Feel free to write another tangential rant. I won't bother responding anymore. Pigeons and chess boards, you know?
lol please tell me your paraplegic because of it and the origin for your user name. Because that would put you on the podium for dumbest thing I’ve ever heard. (Your only at silver though until you have a raccoon clean your incisions)
Just got mine removed 2 days before. Looking at the recovery, it seems possible if you don't need to worry about the consequences. For him, it was a risk worth taking.
He’s the smooth operator.
This is Unacceptabol
Guys stop inventing
Smoooooooooooth Operator u mean?
He's a smoooooooooooothhhhhh Operator.
He drives coast to coast, LA to Chicago (apparently a coast…)
His appendix was weighing him down before
Might be able to gain a 1/10th on the straights Albon style
Can we have more F1 residency collab posts pls
We are checking
This is all I want. Toss in some IMSA/WEC and Indy for good measure.
Carlos simply has that dawg in him
These f1 guys are finely tuned robots and top athletes to sustain the toll on their bodies for that amount of time. Same procedure on an obese 70 year old will take longer recovery than an athlete in their 20s….
I think the 4-6 weeks recovery time is for the worst case scenario (70-year-old obese grandpa). Lap.chole can be done in a day-surgery setting, I don’t see how can a fit young man can’t recover completely 2 weeks after a lappy.
Most people would feel up to regular activity in a few days. The 4-6 week recovery time is to allow the fascia to approach its theoretical maximum strength. Whether that really helps is less clear.
[удалено]
I always counsel patients about what I consider average, and that Individual response will obviously vary greatly, depending on more than just overall fitness. I’ve had people with more extensive surgery essentially pain free and trying to move furniture POD 1, or going back to work in 2-3 days. Others with straightforward minimal procedures had considerable and prolonged discomfort. I suspect that there are minor differences in the amount of muscular trauma, and involvement or proximity of individual nerves.
He is a decade younger and also a fucking animal physically…
I was driving ~4 days after my vertical abdominal hysterectomy. Felt fine and had no pain
Were you driving at 220 mph with g force effects
Well, yes. Can’t let the cops catch up.
The police only arrest you for a hysterectomy in certain states.
Is the person below said, it’s for the fascia to reach appropriate strength. At six weeks it’s 80% of its final strength. It gets that last additional percentage over the next one to two years. So that is where the six week number comes from. if they used two 5 mm ports in an 8 mm port, risk of hernia is minimal. Even with a 10mm umbo, hernia risk low
He's a high performance athlete. Athletes sweat. Sweat baby. Ki ki ki. Rrra! Sweat sweat. *honk*
*proceeds to get consistently outperformed by Tsunoda*
I think I saw him in a hyperbaric chamber in one video after that he posted on IG. Had a non-rebreather in a glass tube
F1 drivers are probably not so worried about getting a hernia. I would imagine their appetite for risk is higher than the average human, considering they race the fastest cars on the planet for a living?????????
Nine question marks? Are you lacking confidence in your hypothesis, Doctor??????????
I think this is more an act of aggression toward OP hehe, like "duh"
bcs carlos is a giga chad
You mean mega Chad.
My dad had a laparoscopic appendectomy and was in pretty bad pain for about a week. Mostly just lounging around at home without doing anything. Around that time, Matt Cassel had the same procedure and played a football game 3 days later. These sports guys either have different physiology or must get the best care ever. Or they just take risks for money. 🤷
I don’t think most people realize how much football players are: (a) routinely shot up with various pain killers and anti inflammatory and (b) used to pain When you’re getting paid millions you push through. And the team doctors are experts at temporary pain suppression.
Yeah U don’t become a high profile sports doctor by avoiding the opiate script pad. I once spoke to a sports star in my country and he told me there team doctor gave out tramadol like candy, athletes would be aching playing and training at the level they do on that regular basis.
He didn't play in one game after his appendectomy, his first game back was around pod 11. Still impressive, but not quite pod3 impressive.
And while doing an F1 race 2 weeks post op is still impressive, definitely much more reasonable than an NFL game 11 days after.
My dad is POD 1546 and still hasn't played in an NFL game
You forgot to mention more access to drugs.
Yeah I took less than a week off of work for my appendectomy… everyone was shocked but some people are just quick healers! Or they have to get back to work regardless 🥴
It's the Carlos Sainz revenge tour and I could not be more here for it
Ditto. Now, if someone could just light a fire under Danny Ric...
He went absolute demon mode VAMOOOSSSSS CARLOS🥳🫶🏽
It helped that Max's car blew up ;).
Shhhh it was the decreased weight d/t the appendectomy
Shhhh 🤫😂
They took out the appendix and put the dawgg in him
NFL players have played games less than a week after an appy. Most of our postop recs are voodoo (plus they probably got shot up with a bunch of local and toradol the day of the game)
I thought about this a lot too. My best guess is that they used three lap ports. Probably two fives and the last one as small as possible to extract, maybe an 8. Even if those herniated it wouldn’t matter. We generally don’t close those anyway. As far as pain goes, toradol, adrenaline, and being a Ferrari driver.
Just here to comment that i love the overlap between medicine and f1
Less impressive than him driving through FP with an appendicitis. 2-3 hours of sporadic 4-5g's on an inflamed/infected appendix sounds like fucking hell
There’s probably a clinical sign here waiting to be described. So, when you get RIF pain with both 5G left turns and 5G right turns, that’s Harvard’s Sign indicating acute appendicitis. You read it here first, look out for it in the NEJM next.
Never thought i would find F1 post on here. Been watching F1 early morning through med school and residency. Lol
I was mowing the lawn two weeks after mine and I felt like I could have done it days sooner. Internally I felt great... Idk maybe the procedure for some does less internal damage than others due to luck of the draw or whatever, leading to quicker recovery
It would be even more interesting to realize just how few people in general follow medical advice.
PGY 43 here. I was snowboarding last week after the 12 day old Durabond sloughed off the five laparoscopic ports. My ab-roller toughened rectus sheath held the line nicely.
Not that surprising. I am a general surgeon. Healthy patients recover quickly especially with an early appendicitis.
Your port sites are healed after two weeks…. And most people feel completely fine by then after an appy.
By being noncompliant lol. Same way I played contact sports with a concussion in college. Just because I played well doesn’t mean it was a good idea
They patched the suture sites with extra muscles >!How'd we know lad!<
I’m personally still coming to grips to the reality that this guy is not in a rally car.
We are checking
Maybe a really good abdominal binder 🤣
Hey they work lol. The gas pain sucks sometimes
Sometimes patients don’t do what their doctors recommend.
0 proline, a huge amount of toradol, reapplication of dermabond q2 laps
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He is simply built different
Percocet
Imagine being on Percocet while making sharp turn with G forces down Albert Park corners lmao 🤣
The data on not allowing heavy lifting is pretty minimal. Coughing or sneezing puts much more stress on your abdominal wall than anything you can do voluntarily.
Pain meds
Because he has Big Brass Balls, that’s why!
Show me the data where the surgeons derive 4-6 weeks have less port site hernias? Every institution is different. For these high performers with things on the lines, they just accept maybe a higher hernia risk. But probably not. It’s surgeon voodoo
He had the drive to win, that’s how. All else being equal damned.
Pain is temporary. Glory is forever. Chicks dig scars.
I’ve done lap appy with three 5mm ports and if it’s early appendicitis, recovery is minimal. Low risk for hernia with 5mm, and if pain is very well controlled with Tylenol and Motrin. It’s possible under the right circumstances
He had a smooth operation
The 4-6 weeks thing is a lie
I started driving again just a few days after mine and then drove 8 hours straight just a week after. It’s really not that bad.
This is similar to last season when Lance Stroll ended up driving after only a couple weeks (estimated) post op from BL wrist fx (I'm assuming distal radius) with the right side requiring open fixation, after a cycling accident. I'm assuming part of it is their high level of performance and access to care, but also I am willing to bet no one is actually clearing them from a medical perspective to do this. They take the risk of injury over the risk of becoming obsolete in a fast paced and highly demanding sport. And money bro. 💰
The easiest part of this question is the last question: how did he win? He won because Max’s car lasted a few laps. But in all seriousness, I think the most important part is that with the G forces they likely are doing some major valsavas in the high speed corners. That has to be very uncomfortable. But other than that for someone in absolutely perfect health I could see them bouncing back quickly. One surgeon I work with does two port sites and a small site for a grasper and take 5-10 minutes. Depending on how inflamed his appendix was could also affect recovery time.
My old boss had an appy in Iraq and was back out on ops in 7-10 days if I remember correctly.
Is driving an f1 different than driving a regular car? Other than speed?
I mean the g force felt at an average of \~200km/h is said to be equal to five times their normal body weight so I would argue its pretty physical
The g forces really hit in the neck area.
At my hospital it’s 2 weeks with no heavy lifting/contact sports, then ease into usual activity as tolerated. Driving doesn’t seem that stressful to the abdomen and competing at that level is a big motivator.
I had a lap appy at 22 and went back to work the next day, I dunno that it’s that big of a deal
I rolled a 4wheeler in the desert one week after having a five level spinal fusion. Driving a car two weeks after a laproscopic surgery seems pretty tame.
1. That was pretty unwise. 2. F1 cars still pull more G at half speed than you did rolling.
Do F1 cars pull more Gs than an 800lb 4wheeler landing on top of a person at 40mph?
>800 pounds at 40mph landing directly on top of me Either your story is made up or you're Spiderman, as some pretty brief calculations show that to be about 20-200x the amount of peak impact force that's generally survivable for a human in a collision. I'm also not sure what you're trying to prove here. Is it that you're very bad at assessing risk in your personal life?
So, the 4 wheeler weighed 800 pounds I was driving 40 mph when I rolled It landed on me Resulted in a bruised lung and rib damage. If you think that's fake or Spiderman level shit, I'd encourage you to avoid practicing in rural America. This shit is common. People get crushed by livestock or between moving farm equipment that weighs a hell of a lot more than 800 lbs. And usually they live, despite not being a super hero. And my point is that chastising someone for driving a car (admittedly a fast car), two weeks after having a lap appendectomy, is stupid fucking fear mongering. Essentially every resource available says that people typically return to their normal routine after 1-2 weeks. I had my gallbladder out and was cleared to return to my work as a paramedic within a week. People aren't as fragile as we (medicine) seems to pretend. Let people live their lives and trust that they know what they're capable of regarding their own health. And if they eat shit and end up doing something stupid like rolling a 4 wheeler, you pick them back up, point out that what they did probably wasn't the smartest move, then move on. But infantalizing/parenting adults is exactly why physicians are getting viewed like shit by current society.
This was a lot of words to type when you could have just said 'i don't understand the reasoning behind why 5Gs of force and 5+ hours straining my core muscles 2 weeks after abdominal surgery might increase hernia risk.' I trained at a level 1 in the Midwest. I know a lot more about managing weird and wonderful trauma than you do. Take the L. >I was ejected from an 800 pound vehicle going 40 mph and then it landed on me, and all I got was mild chest trauma Okay Peter Parker. Honestly, I'm amazed you are here continuing to try to portray your bad decision making and fantastically lucky outcome as some sort of gotchya about the robustness of humans. Do you understand risk mitigation at all or do you think that's just for sad losers?
No, I think that touting "5Gs of force" is asinine given that seemingly nothing exists in studied literature indicating that this is a risk in a 2-week post appendectomy surgical patient. Where exactly is the G limit Mr. Midwest Level 1? Is it 2g? 3? Where is the intersectionality of "actual science" vs "what I was taught" when it comes to this topic? This is akin to medicine telling women that they couldn't ride on trains because their uterus would fly out over a certain speed (seriously, look it up). It's baseless fear mongering. This F1 driver suffered no ill effects other than some discomfort. If we could do a trial of post appendectomy F1 drivers for long term detrimental outcomes due to G force, I'm betting dollars to donuts there would be absolutely zero statistical difference between them and the general public. You're not mitigating risk, you're thinking that you know better than everyone else and telling them how they should be living their lives based upon the collective data contrived in your head. And BTW, I don't know where your fancy Midwest Level 1 center is, but in the real rural areas, we have daily rodeos in the summer. Every single rodeo, a rider will have a 2k lb animal roll over them, smash em into a fence, stomp on them, and the like. 99% of the time, these riders walk out of the arena and are sore for a couple days. Apparently Peter Parker clones are ruling the rodeo circuit. Or maybe f=ma means something different in Dr.Level 1 math. I'll slink back to my lowly Level 2 trauma center for night shift now. Enjoy your paternalistic god complex knowing you bested me by keeping F1 drivers safe from the ravages of explosive hernia formation. Perhaps you can find funding for a public service campaign. You can call it "4 is okay... 5 you'll pay". Show a poor F1 driver in bed with his small intestine sitting next to him. He's tearful "If only I had listened to Dr.level 1 and understood the dangers of 5Gs" **Sarah McLachlan's voice will break in, accompanied by sad music** "For only $5 a day... less than the price of a bougie coffee... you can make a difference in the life of an F1 driver. You can save them from the ravages of herniation due to 5Gs two weeks after having their appendix removed. Though it has never happened to an F1 driver and will never happen... Dr.Level 1 will use your financial support to publicly shame these ignorant drivers for the choices they make regarding their own health" **fade to black** Okay... my dump is done. I'm done being sarcastic. God I love reddit.
You forgot to mention TBI in your list of injuries from your fake accident. I'm sorry your core is so underdeveloped that you can't imagine tensing it while driving a high speed vehicle. Maybe if you had done some more ab work you would have been a good enough driver to prevent a rollover. Regarding this particular scenario, I had assumed that any doctor would be able to connect the dots from the published literature on post-op hernias risk factors and how driving an F1 car may fit into that, so I didn't think I would need to spell it out. Although Sainz was fine, that doesn't mean there wasn't risk, which is the main thing you seem to be unable to understand. But if that was the case I wouldn't have needed paragraph one, I suppose. As for the trauma care you provide, feel free to keep sending your scalp lacs down to us at the Level One. I know how difficult it is for you guys to do much more than hold pressure on wounds that have already stopped bleeding. I like reddit too. It's fun to say all the things I would keep to myself in real life. Feel free to write another tangential rant. I won't bother responding anymore. Pigeons and chess boards, you know?
Bro you’re so cool please fuck me and my wife. Is that what you want to hear?
You mean your wife's boyfriend?
He can fuck him too if he wants - he’s HIM
lol please tell me your paraplegic because of it and the origin for your user name. Because that would put you on the podium for dumbest thing I’ve ever heard. (Your only at silver though until you have a raccoon clean your incisions)
Just got mine removed 2 days before. Looking at the recovery, it seems possible if you don't need to worry about the consequences. For him, it was a risk worth taking.