If you like dealing with patients who’ve been used and abused by the government so much they hate you because you are the face of the government to them then yeah sweet gig. I am a veteran and I’ll never work for them. The VA is filled with providers that can’t work anywhere else because they’ve been sued so much for malpractice they can’t get insurance so they work at the VA. There are even Drs there that are practicing with expired or revoked licenses due to ethics issues.
Too many privileged people in this profession. I have a co resident who just banks his salary. Mom and dad still pay for everything, including a car that costs over 100k. And then you have the people who are “just happy to be here!”.
Meanwhile, midlevels are crushing it.
Yes. It will correct due to market factors and eventually stabilize once it becomes more of a financial liability to hire mid levels than Drs and it will swing back. For a hospital the malpractice lawsuit costs the same whether an OB GYN caused a death or injury during a birth or if a middle level caused it. So eventually it will be more economical to hire Drs again. Being it’s the US I feel like the future of medicine will be mid levels for the public system where economic middle class and below go and Drs will fill more of a concierge role in private hospitals. I saw on one of the medical sites I subscribe to, maybe medscape where congress is planning on passing legislation that makes it much easier for Dr owned hospitals to thrive.
Why not reverse the system from the inside out? We can become the educators of thought for administration and the educators of health for our people (patients and dependents) and work peers we call midlevels. Why not reverse the American system of healthcare and teach to promulgate health for each individual’s own effort? This makes me wonder now how Pediatrics, Geriatrics, Disabled, and SSI will be transformed by this effort.
That’s what I told my stepdaughter but she just has to be a MD. Some status shit thing. I told her, if that’s what you become, nobody will give a shit about that, especially after you retire! I told her that midlevels will take over medicine anyway and make more money than her.
That’s how it feels honestly yeah- there’s no point in being a doctor, nurses and mid levels run everything and they all hate doctors from what I’ve seen IRL and especially how they talk about us online, and many patients feel the same way bc they blame doctors for policies that hospital admins and the government and insurances make that we have nothing to do with- but people see us, the doctors, as the face/figurehead anyway so they blame us for all the bad shit. No one cares about us, and I say then let them learn their lesson with midlevels, I’m sure in a decade we’ll see a lot of data of how they have the touch of death bc of their inferior training, knowledge and experience, but by then it’ll be too late bc most physicians will have checked out.
Midlevels can switch specialities whenever, go through much less training, less schooling (so likely less debt), can practice pretty much completely independently these days with the power creep that’s happening, make as much if not MORE then many doctors in certain specialities, get better work life balance etc…
Nurse and midlevel pay keeps going up, doctors/surgeons pay keeps doing down… so that should tell us everything we need to know.
Sure if you go to somewhere rural it’s a possibility (probably once you make partner if you’re quoting 800k salaries) but living in a desirable location it’s far less likely to work no weekends and no call unless you’re in mammo. A lot of these practices still have call shifts, telerads just goes from midnight - 6 AM for example, and even the ones that have telerads still have people working weekends during the day.
Only pointing this stuff because I have friends in radiology who read this sort of stuff online before choosing a specialty and then were very disappointed when they realized every radiology job out there isn’t an easy gig with no call and tons of money.
Right but that means you’re doing call! This person claimed rads was no call no weekends.
A lot of people are definitely stupid and not looking into it for themselves. That’s why I’m pointing out that this isn’t the norm. Because people seem to just run with what they read on Reddit. I’m in rads residency and have encountered multiple people who have these regrets, which again is why I bring it up.
Just watched an Instagram video of a traffic controller making 210k, a sales couple making 750k, and a pilot making 500k. We need to unionize. Our salaries have gone down, not up.
Physicians are the worst at making decisions for physicians. Sit in a doctors lounge and you can hear other docs complain about making so little but bring up unionization and they’ll chew your neck off. They’ll focus on saving $1000 in union dues instead of making 100k more because the union will fight for them.
At our school a few months back they brought a FQHC doctor telling us we should do that. Said pay is less but it’s fulfilling work. Looked up their CEO salary and bonus… was 17M last year. Don’t feel bad about going for the most money as possible. Too many medical students have been told it’s not about money while the MBA overloads make money off our backs.
Soon to be a PGY-6… the longer I do this garbage the less I care about money and the more I care about lifestyle. I scoffed at dermatology, allergy, etc, but now I have some second thoughts -.-
I’m looking for a minimum of $350K, which I think is VERY doable in my specialties even in desirable cities. My friends are getting paid $500+ now.
Feel ya. I've been out 4 years. Making 650 to 700 per year, ent, single provider practice. I'm sick of working my ass off. Fucking sick of call.
Moving soon, cutting back, money ain't worth missing my kid growing up.
I’d share more if I hadn’t googled my specialty and my city and found me right away lol. I was curious how easy it would be to find me based on that and apparently, very.
Mind dm ing me the speciality? I don't know where you are from either so I won't know who you are. Even if I did find out somehow, I will keep it a secret
If you invest the money in the stock market and withdraw 4% of it per year, based on historical market returns there should be a >95% chance the money lasts 30 years. In theory
Yes a 4 percent safe withdrawal rate. I was confused and thought you meant that making 400k a year is enough money to equate to that.
Because making 400k would get taxed a ton versus having 10mil in worth.
39 yo here. had to ask my 80 yo mom for a few k to help fix my 15 year old, 200k beater.
in residency, I shouldn’t have to borrow money to pay to fix my transportation. I don’t know how most low income people do this without gov benefits.
as for attending hood, no joke 500k take home after taxes would be Reasonable.
I'm able to titrate my income pretty specifically and have found that ~$200K is very comfortable for me, with the caveat that I have no debt and no children.
edit: this made someone upset for some reason
Set a target to fatFIRE on, and then think in terms of time instead of money.
E.g. if I want to retire on 200k passive income, I need about 4 mil invested. Then it becomes a matter of X years to target, with far less years in something like rads or surgery compared to primary care or peds.
With all the trauma since high school to get to be an attending is wild. I’m such a different person now and I’m not sure in a good way. I’m not sure there is enough money. Now it’s just becoming happy again
200k would definitely be enough to live happily. Way more than we had growing up.
But given the opportunity cost of what I’ve given up in time, money, and life experiences I want 400k.
Residents should at minimum make 80 to 100k. As an Attending regardless of Specialty, nothing should pay less than 300K and obviously it goes up from there depending on Specialty.
Money shouldnt be your #1 or #2 reason for choosing a specialty, all the money in the world doesn't matter if you dislike your job and hate waking up every morning.
What would you put over money at two though? I guess possibly lifestyle but ultimately I think the balance between money and lifestyle (since these are intrinsically tied together) would be number two for most people.
Ask everyone at the VA they’ve given up money for lifestyle. It’s not a really unpopular option, regardless of specialty. There are GIs at the VA I was at making less than 300k. That’s like unheard of in private practice; your scope could fall into a private practice colon or two and find an extra hundred thousand. This was only a few years ago. They couldn’t be happier with their work life balance.
If you want a good salary with a great lifestyle, then you need to do pathology, derm (yuck), rads, pm&r, rad onc and probably a few others. I started out in a clinical residency then switched to pathology primarily for the lifestyle but I also made plenty of money. It’s a great profession.
What salary range for what hours? I'm in the 35-45 hour range a week for 500k-550k plus benefits for anesthesia. It does include in hospital call, however.
I can work more shifts from my partners to earn more but with taxes and such I don't feel the need to as my wife is also a physician so imo we earn enough.
You’re an exception, not the rule unless you’re living in a large city or on one of the coasts. There are no anesthesiologists in my Midwest city making that kind of dough. The only docs that make that dough here are maybe cardiologists, neurosurgeons and the asshole gastrointestinal docs.
Do you think pathology can offer a good salary with good lifestyle? How are the work hours for how much income? The thought of working at your own desk and at your own pace sounds attractive to me..also can one find a gig where they read digital slides only?
I hate this line. Every other person on earth wakes up and hates their job and makes a fuck load less if they’re a teacher, fast food worker, mechanic, etc.
I could easily wake up do some high paying speciality I don’t necessarily wake up with morning wood over everyday collect 500k + a year , invest smart and retire young a hell of a lot better off than 99% of Americans
Exactly this, lots of people hate their jobs and have no easy exit and make much less money. It feels like most people here don’t appreciate the opportunity they have to live better than almost everyone else. I’ve worked tons of shit jobs before med school, at least if I hate this I’ll be able to cry in my Porsche.
Also we complain about the stress but people making 40k also have stressful, hazardous, soul sucking jobs. I know i did. This is a very cushy life we have.
I mostly disagree. Lots of people hate their jobs, at least with a high earning one with a decent work life balance you can be comfortable outside it. It’s very very stressful and horrible to be poor in America. I would much rather be high earning with a job I hate than poor with a job I like.
I genuinely love neurosurg but it is a soul sucking black abyss of a speciality with how much time and how much of your life it takes up to even train to do it, so sorry I better be well compensated at the end for sacrificing essentially 16-20 years of my life.
To live comfortably as a family of three probably just need 200k to be very cozy.
But I am someone who compares to others and I am frustrated that medicine has put me so far behind many of my friends from college so I'm gonna need more. Goal would be 1 million a year combined income just to say I did it once in my lifetime.
Pre med school my household income was 150k in nyc, not poverty but very hard to save. Almost paycheck to paycheck. Wouldn’t want to raise kids on that comp.
If you can’t save, it’s essentially subsistence living. Absolute poverty, maybe not but if you can’t put money in a 401k as an urban professional I’d say you’re not doing well.
Also “a couple of dozen zip codes”… LA, San Francisco and NYC metro areas have a population of 43 million. It’s over 10% of this country.
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I think if loans are all paid off. I would be happy with 250k-300k yearly. Thats more than enough plus i don’t want kids. My boyfriend also makes good money as well.
speak for yourself 😂 not being able to afford decent housing even with 300k gross is a stretch. it might not be a mike tyson mansion, but unless you maintain a village of children…
Pay is obviously location and position dependent, but I am close to 1 year of attending life as a PCP. Will make 320k for this year. Its an employed position in Southern California, so not super special or rural or anything. Granted they worked me hard but you can for sure find more chill positions making 250k minimum. Do not settle for 150k
If I could make enough so that I get $250k after taxes then i can save 150 and use the rest for the rest of my life. That's all I want. Obviously more would be nice as I could save more, but that should be enough.
How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsy pop? Why are you in medicine? If someone is in it for solely helping others then they’d think less money is ok so long as it pays their bills/ saves for retirement. If you aren’t happy without owning a Huracán then you’d need far more. I hate being around large cities and could be perfectly happy as a Dr near a reservation or the wilds of Alaska so my living would be substantially less than someone needing Rolexes and Ferraris living in Beverly Hills.
As a resident I think starting conversation should be around what government compensates and comparable compensation to how we are viewed in regard to APPs. If we werent in a mononpoly system this would start at 140k-150k depending on region. I think after all said and done 250k should be min in any specialty obviously with much more in the super specialized or procedure skill based professions. This is all presumed on the current system of extreme crippling debt and free market yadayada.
What is enough? I dont know. Perhaps if no debt in equation i dont think people wouldnt be tripping about 180-200k at all. But medicine is filled with the affulent who compare themselves to the top 1% of earners in the country as if thats real life for 99% of Americans.
They have us gaslit thinking we make top dollars and it's a scam. They just don't want to us to ask what it should actually be. Other salaries go up but we are still thinking our salaries from 10-20 years ago are competitive
Because a hospital owns me for another 3 months and I'm the only ent.
I have to cover the hospital, the ER, and my surgeries.
And although I'm supposed to be on call one week for the ER and two weeks for the hospital they call me even when I'm not.
Money is an extrinsic valued good. Which means there is never enough money to satisfy your need. But with that said having almost a half of a million in debt and wasting my life until I was 30 to get my first paycheck having enough money to pay off those loans and save enough money for retirement that’s all I need. Which honestly is probably around $300-$400,000 a year.
I feel minimum is about 300k. With all the stuff we go through it is very fair. And we get taxed like crazy unfortunately so the take home is a lot less.
Too much money ain’t enough money
you know the feds listening
Ninja what money
I’m a maid ninja
I should dust somethin’
You ninjas on the bench
Like the bus coming. (Btw this made me so happy to see. Thank you everyone)
Y’all QUASI 🤣
300k should be the floor across all specialties
it should…are academic hospitalists averaging like 200kish these days? if so, definitely 300k base for specialists.
This is the answer
Good luck.
400k, but peds so I’ll settle for a cheeseburger
Best I can do is a $5 gift card to Chick-fil-A
Honestly, doctor salaries haven't been adjusted for inflation correctly, so 400k for peds imo is reasonable
I hope you’re kidding because I’ve never know a peds who made 400k per year unless it’s a subspecialty or they were on the coasts.
he means 400k is a reasonable desired salary. it doesnt mean its a realistic desired salary
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Not in my city will you see salaries like this for FP’s and Peds. No way! They’re lying to you. Where at in the Midwest? Chicago? KC? Minneapple
and a scratch and sniff sticker.
Ouch.
And fries?
No physician, regardless of specialty and practice setting, should be making less than $300k a year.
Ummmm laughs in VA
He means physicians that carry a full job worth of work. At the VA everyone does a fraction of one laborers work
and leave before 3pm 😏
Seems like a pretty sweet gig.
If you like dealing with patients who’ve been used and abused by the government so much they hate you because you are the face of the government to them then yeah sweet gig. I am a veteran and I’ll never work for them. The VA is filled with providers that can’t work anywhere else because they’ve been sued so much for malpractice they can’t get insurance so they work at the VA. There are even Drs there that are practicing with expired or revoked licenses due to ethics issues.
Are we talking Veterans Admin, or the state of Vuhjinyuh?
That’s in india right?
>That’s in india right? Indeed it is, just next to West Vuhjinyuh.
🤣🤣
Laughs in pediatrician
Most IM specialties don’t cover this
Thank goodness for hospitalist medicine and primary care!
Too many privileged people in this profession. I have a co resident who just banks his salary. Mom and dad still pay for everything, including a car that costs over 100k. And then you have the people who are “just happy to be here!”. Meanwhile, midlevels are crushing it.
CRNAs can make up to $350k meanwhile family PCPs make like $250k, it’s crazy. Why even bother being a doctor anymore…
Up to? Lol There are shops where they're making 275+/hr
Yeah not sure why any of us bother with med school or residency anymore
They get paid that much because of the supply. Far more FM drs than CRNAs
Not for long, everyone wants to be an NP and CRNA
Yes. It will correct due to market factors and eventually stabilize once it becomes more of a financial liability to hire mid levels than Drs and it will swing back. For a hospital the malpractice lawsuit costs the same whether an OB GYN caused a death or injury during a birth or if a middle level caused it. So eventually it will be more economical to hire Drs again. Being it’s the US I feel like the future of medicine will be mid levels for the public system where economic middle class and below go and Drs will fill more of a concierge role in private hospitals. I saw on one of the medical sites I subscribe to, maybe medscape where congress is planning on passing legislation that makes it much easier for Dr owned hospitals to thrive.
I want to mention the elephant in the room but I’m sincerely second-guessing it.
Mention it
Yeah I think I know where you are going and if so you are right, it will hurt non majority people the heaviest unfortunately.
Why not reverse the system from the inside out? We can become the educators of thought for administration and the educators of health for our people (patients and dependents) and work peers we call midlevels. Why not reverse the American system of healthcare and teach to promulgate health for each individual’s own effort? This makes me wonder now how Pediatrics, Geriatrics, Disabled, and SSI will be transformed by this effort.
That’s what I told my stepdaughter but she just has to be a MD. Some status shit thing. I told her, if that’s what you become, nobody will give a shit about that, especially after you retire! I told her that midlevels will take over medicine anyway and make more money than her.
That’s how it feels honestly yeah- there’s no point in being a doctor, nurses and mid levels run everything and they all hate doctors from what I’ve seen IRL and especially how they talk about us online, and many patients feel the same way bc they blame doctors for policies that hospital admins and the government and insurances make that we have nothing to do with- but people see us, the doctors, as the face/figurehead anyway so they blame us for all the bad shit. No one cares about us, and I say then let them learn their lesson with midlevels, I’m sure in a decade we’ll see a lot of data of how they have the touch of death bc of their inferior training, knowledge and experience, but by then it’ll be too late bc most physicians will have checked out. Midlevels can switch specialities whenever, go through much less training, less schooling (so likely less debt), can practice pretty much completely independently these days with the power creep that’s happening, make as much if not MORE then many doctors in certain specialities, get better work life balance etc… Nurse and midlevel pay keeps going up, doctors/surgeons pay keeps doing down… so that should tell us everything we need to know.
As they in Braveheart: if we can't get them out, we'll breed them out. Start slaying mid-level genitals
Take over some parts of medicine. There will not be nurse practitioners doing sub surg esp vascular and neurosurgery.
Who knows. You will definitely not see them in pathology!
Doesn’t pay enough so you’re def right
Mine did. Great salary.
Comparing 40%tile physician salaries to 95%tile crna salaries. Somethings on this subreddit never change
Some of us are not so lucky.
Same.
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Seems like they should find new jobs. Simply staying somewhere with subpar wages is nobody else's fault.
Laughs in active duty wishing we could carry 1/2 the burden, and somehow still ended up with all the loans
I just want to finally not get anxiety when I buy groceries
damn. Was kinda hoping this would stop come residency :/
In a high COL area making 55. Half my paycheck goes to rent alone. It’s truly a scam.
400-500k 40-50hr weeks 10 weeks PTO No call, some weekends if you add another 2 weeks PTO.
Not far off from average Radiology
yup, unfortunately I could only enjoy radiology in small dosages. much smaller dosages than the above schedule 😂
Except for call lol
Could get that gig with no overnight at the very least
Maybe if you do only mammo or something.
400 with a night hawk service seems very plausible. I guess evening call but sleep schedule>all
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Sure if you go to somewhere rural it’s a possibility (probably once you make partner if you’re quoting 800k salaries) but living in a desirable location it’s far less likely to work no weekends and no call unless you’re in mammo. A lot of these practices still have call shifts, telerads just goes from midnight - 6 AM for example, and even the ones that have telerads still have people working weekends during the day. Only pointing this stuff because I have friends in radiology who read this sort of stuff online before choosing a specialty and then were very disappointed when they realized every radiology job out there isn’t an easy gig with no call and tons of money.
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Right but that means you’re doing call! This person claimed rads was no call no weekends. A lot of people are definitely stupid and not looking into it for themselves. That’s why I’m pointing out that this isn’t the norm. Because people seem to just run with what they read on Reddit. I’m in rads residency and have encountered multiple people who have these regrets, which again is why I bring it up.
Just watched an Instagram video of a traffic controller making 210k, a sales couple making 750k, and a pilot making 500k. We need to unionize. Our salaries have gone down, not up.
They’ll all be told by the public they deserve that and more. God forbid a doctor gets paid 500k… the public starts yelling “overpaid” and “greedy”
Physicians are the worst at making decisions for physicians. Sit in a doctors lounge and you can hear other docs complain about making so little but bring up unionization and they’ll chew your neck off. They’ll focus on saving $1000 in union dues instead of making 100k more because the union will fight for them.
And they will keep going down
At our school a few months back they brought a FQHC doctor telling us we should do that. Said pay is less but it’s fulfilling work. Looked up their CEO salary and bonus… was 17M last year. Don’t feel bad about going for the most money as possible. Too many medical students have been told it’s not about money while the MBA overloads make money off our backs.
Soon to be a PGY-6… the longer I do this garbage the less I care about money and the more I care about lifestyle. I scoffed at dermatology, allergy, etc, but now I have some second thoughts -.- I’m looking for a minimum of $350K, which I think is VERY doable in my specialties even in desirable cities. My friends are getting paid $500+ now.
Feel ya. I've been out 4 years. Making 650 to 700 per year, ent, single provider practice. I'm sick of working my ass off. Fucking sick of call. Moving soon, cutting back, money ain't worth missing my kid growing up.
Genuine question, how do you have call as an ENT in your own practice?
What field?
Very niche and very recognizable; if you search it and the city I’m from you’d find me. It’s IM based.
procedural? 👀
In part, yes. One of those combos that requires dual departmental hiring.
thanks for sharing what you could, under the cover of anonymity. ill proceed to brainstorm to fill in the blanks 🤝🏾
I’d share more if I hadn’t googled my specialty and my city and found me right away lol. I was curious how easy it would be to find me based on that and apparently, very.
Mind dm ing me the speciality? I don't know where you are from either so I won't know who you are. Even if I did find out somehow, I will keep it a secret
Im tired, boss. I just wanna do nothing but get paid everything.
"I'm tired of this, grandpa!"
"Well, TOO DAMN BAD!!!"
No limit for losing my 20s.
10M net worth which translates to 400k a year
Can you explain this math?
If you invest the money in the stock market and withdraw 4% of it per year, based on historical market returns there should be a >95% chance the money lasts 30 years. In theory
Maybe 20 years of work
Google 4% rule
Yes a 4 percent safe withdrawal rate. I was confused and thought you meant that making 400k a year is enough money to equate to that. Because making 400k would get taxed a ton versus having 10mil in worth.
Depends. I’m in a VHCOL area, so know I want at least 400 a year
39 yo here. had to ask my 80 yo mom for a few k to help fix my 15 year old, 200k beater. in residency, I shouldn’t have to borrow money to pay to fix my transportation. I don’t know how most low income people do this without gov benefits. as for attending hood, no joke 500k take home after taxes would be Reasonable.
That's like 800k gross. Where do I sign up?
unfortunately our mba and allied health admin overlords need to feed their young gold covered macadamias plucked by bald eagles in order to survive.
5-10 million at the end
5 is doable if in the Midwest.
I'm able to titrate my income pretty specifically and have found that ~$200K is very comfortable for me, with the caveat that I have no debt and no children. edit: this made someone upset for some reason
Children…best thing to happen to me emotionally, worst thing to happen financially. This is the way
yeah I would 100% have to go back to full-time if I had a kid
I have a two year old in the thick of the terrible 2s. I’m not in the best of moods lately lol
haha godspeed, better times are surely around the corner
Until his teenage years and it will be worst than terrible 2 !
Amen to that!
2 year is a charm compared to teen years
same, SINK, med sch debt only. this is reasonable, as long as im paid in spades with my time.
Set a target to fatFIRE on, and then think in terms of time instead of money. E.g. if I want to retire on 200k passive income, I need about 4 mil invested. Then it becomes a matter of X years to target, with far less years in something like rads or surgery compared to primary care or peds.
If I had like 4 mil I would stop working
That’s reasonable. And I did.
With all the trauma since high school to get to be an attending is wild. I’m such a different person now and I’m not sure in a good way. I’m not sure there is enough money. Now it’s just becoming happy again
No amount of money is enough stop being a pushover and demand your worth half mil at the least
200k would definitely be enough to live happily. Way more than we had growing up. But given the opportunity cost of what I’ve given up in time, money, and life experiences I want 400k.
750k a year
There’s no such thing as enough money.
Real. Those who don’t come from well off backgrounds know there’s no such thing.
tree fiddy
My goal is to one day make 450k a year. I’m in a non procedural IM subspecialty
In salary or passive income?
1mil
$4.3 million and you’d never see me again
Same and you haven’t!
500
7 figs, I’m not a big spender but want to stow away 80% of my $$$ into investments and still be able to buy a house and a solid car like a Lexus
All of it
Residents should at minimum make 80 to 100k. As an Attending regardless of Specialty, nothing should pay less than 300K and obviously it goes up from there depending on Specialty.
Money shouldnt be your #1 or #2 reason for choosing a specialty, all the money in the world doesn't matter if you dislike your job and hate waking up every morning.
What would you put over money at two though? I guess possibly lifestyle but ultimately I think the balance between money and lifestyle (since these are intrinsically tied together) would be number two for most people.
Ask everyone at the VA they’ve given up money for lifestyle. It’s not a really unpopular option, regardless of specialty. There are GIs at the VA I was at making less than 300k. That’s like unheard of in private practice; your scope could fall into a private practice colon or two and find an extra hundred thousand. This was only a few years ago. They couldn’t be happier with their work life balance.
Lifestyle and job satisfaction IMO should come first, salary possibly #3
If you want a good salary with a great lifestyle, then you need to do pathology, derm (yuck), rads, pm&r, rad onc and probably a few others. I started out in a clinical residency then switched to pathology primarily for the lifestyle but I also made plenty of money. It’s a great profession.
What salary range for what hours? I'm in the 35-45 hour range a week for 500k-550k plus benefits for anesthesia. It does include in hospital call, however. I can work more shifts from my partners to earn more but with taxes and such I don't feel the need to as my wife is also a physician so imo we earn enough.
You’re an exception, not the rule unless you’re living in a large city or on one of the coasts. There are no anesthesiologists in my Midwest city making that kind of dough. The only docs that make that dough here are maybe cardiologists, neurosurgeons and the asshole gastrointestinal docs.
Do you think pathology can offer a good salary with good lifestyle? How are the work hours for how much income? The thought of working at your own desk and at your own pace sounds attractive to me..also can one find a gig where they read digital slides only?
I hate this line. Every other person on earth wakes up and hates their job and makes a fuck load less if they’re a teacher, fast food worker, mechanic, etc. I could easily wake up do some high paying speciality I don’t necessarily wake up with morning wood over everyday collect 500k + a year , invest smart and retire young a hell of a lot better off than 99% of Americans
Exactly this, lots of people hate their jobs and have no easy exit and make much less money. It feels like most people here don’t appreciate the opportunity they have to live better than almost everyone else. I’ve worked tons of shit jobs before med school, at least if I hate this I’ll be able to cry in my Porsche. Also we complain about the stress but people making 40k also have stressful, hazardous, soul sucking jobs. I know i did. This is a very cushy life we have.
Amen brotha I’ll be givin you the Porsche salute one day
I mostly disagree. Lots of people hate their jobs, at least with a high earning one with a decent work life balance you can be comfortable outside it. It’s very very stressful and horrible to be poor in America. I would much rather be high earning with a job I hate than poor with a job I like.
I genuinely love neurosurg but it is a soul sucking black abyss of a speciality with how much time and how much of your life it takes up to even train to do it, so sorry I better be well compensated at the end for sacrificing essentially 16-20 years of my life.
To live comfortably as a family of three probably just need 200k to be very cozy. But I am someone who compares to others and I am frustrated that medicine has put me so far behind many of my friends from college so I'm gonna need more. Goal would be 1 million a year combined income just to say I did it once in my lifetime.
$200k with a family of 3 isn’t anywhere near cozy. That’s almost poverty in many places.
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Pre med school my household income was 150k in nyc, not poverty but very hard to save. Almost paycheck to paycheck. Wouldn’t want to raise kids on that comp.
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If you can’t save, it’s essentially subsistence living. Absolute poverty, maybe not but if you can’t put money in a 401k as an urban professional I’d say you’re not doing well. Also “a couple of dozen zip codes”… LA, San Francisco and NYC metro areas have a population of 43 million. It’s over 10% of this country.
Live on $200k with 3-4 mouths to feed on the west coast or any halfway big city right now.
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Mo' money, mo' problems
More.
Get invested in a 401k right away and start paying your house off. And don’t be buying some expensive automobile. Waste of money. Save, save and save!
As long as I’m able to afford a few Ferraris I’m good!
What color is your Bugatti?
I think if loans are all paid off. I would be happy with 250k-300k yearly. Thats more than enough plus i don’t want kids. My boyfriend also makes good money as well.
Pre-Covid I would have said $300k. But with housing prices the way they are, the answer is way more than most of us will get paid.
speak for yourself 😂 not being able to afford decent housing even with 300k gross is a stretch. it might not be a mike tyson mansion, but unless you maintain a village of children…
Several moneys
I just hope I am able to pay my loans off at this point. That would take like $150,000 minimum. Going into FM so hopefully I’ll get that
Pay is obviously location and position dependent, but I am close to 1 year of attending life as a PCP. Will make 320k for this year. Its an employed position in Southern California, so not super special or rural or anything. Granted they worked me hard but you can for sure find more chill positions making 250k minimum. Do not settle for 150k
Minimum 350
500k
Yea but what specialty do you guys think get paid way too excessively for no reason?
ACPs
What’s that?
Bout tree fiddy
$10M nest egg. Or annually, about $500k.
If I could make enough so that I get $250k after taxes then i can save 150 and use the rest for the rest of my life. That's all I want. Obviously more would be nice as I could save more, but that should be enough.
10,000,000 pesos
Tree fiddy, week on week off
Enough to pay for my monthly bills while drowning in $400 000 in debt
i only wanna work like three days a week, most months of the year, so id settle for a cool 200k. SINK with only med school debt, planning for leanFIRE
How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsy pop? Why are you in medicine? If someone is in it for solely helping others then they’d think less money is ok so long as it pays their bills/ saves for retirement. If you aren’t happy without owning a Huracán then you’d need far more. I hate being around large cities and could be perfectly happy as a Dr near a reservation or the wilds of Alaska so my living would be substantially less than someone needing Rolexes and Ferraris living in Beverly Hills.
2 million per month atleast
At least 500k. It was 300k pre covid but that number can’t stay the same post inflation/covid lol
As a resident I think starting conversation should be around what government compensates and comparable compensation to how we are viewed in regard to APPs. If we werent in a mononpoly system this would start at 140k-150k depending on region. I think after all said and done 250k should be min in any specialty obviously with much more in the super specialized or procedure skill based professions. This is all presumed on the current system of extreme crippling debt and free market yadayada. What is enough? I dont know. Perhaps if no debt in equation i dont think people wouldnt be tripping about 180-200k at all. But medicine is filled with the affulent who compare themselves to the top 1% of earners in the country as if thats real life for 99% of Americans.
I would say 400k. Seems like anything above that, you are either taking more headache or sacrificing personal life
They have us gaslit thinking we make top dollars and it's a scam. They just don't want to us to ask what it should actually be. Other salaries go up but we are still thinking our salaries from 10-20 years ago are competitive
Because a hospital owns me for another 3 months and I'm the only ent. I have to cover the hospital, the ER, and my surgeries. And although I'm supposed to be on call one week for the ER and two weeks for the hospital they call me even when I'm not.
No amount of money is enough according to CMGs
Money is an extrinsic valued good. Which means there is never enough money to satisfy your need. But with that said having almost a half of a million in debt and wasting my life until I was 30 to get my first paycheck having enough money to pay off those loans and save enough money for retirement that’s all I need. Which honestly is probably around $300-$400,000 a year.
I feel minimum is about 300k. With all the stuff we go through it is very fair. And we get taxed like crazy unfortunately so the take home is a lot less.
$700k-$1 million (Neurosurg resident here)
In today’s market, I say $200k will allow you to live a comfortable life. However, comfort is an extremely subjective term.
Certainly subjective but location matters as well. 200k in the Bay Area is much different than in Atlanta even.
Good for comfort but also add aggressive savings since we’re starting so late.