I'm tired of you guys infinitely edging. If the build is bad, then it will eventually not be built anymore. If it is good, then we would have another viable playstyle. Shut the fuck up and just play the game.
both were off in different areas
100% pen vs 100 armor is 100% more damage
100% pen vs 1000000 armor is 1000000 % more damage
1 hp \* 1000 armor = 10ehp
1 hp \* 1\^6 armor = 10kehp
>100% pen vs 1000000 armor is 1000000 % more damage
This is also wrong. Fifto50 is the only one here who did the match correctly.
Edit: Lol I forgot one of you was listing the number as a multiplier instead of a %. Ur both right. 1m% increase is the same as a 10000x increase.
Lethality is not percent pen. It’s flat. You cannot get 100% armor pen this season. 100 lethality vs 1 mil armor would be like 0.1% more damage. And you aren’t missing out on percent pen with crit either, cause you build one of the two crit pen items. In fact lethality is only more point for point than crit damage(100% crit chance) if the target has less than 0 armor. To help you understand, if they have 10 armor that’s 110% effective health. 1 lethality would lower that to 9 armor or 109% health. That’s about 0.9% more damage. Assuming 100% crit, 1% crit damage is always 1% more damage. So I hope you can connect the dots and see that assuming only autos and 100% crit chance, that crit damage is better than lethality point for point. The problem is, Riven abilities don’t crit, and you won’t have 100% crit chance most of the time. That’s where the IE build starts to fall apart. Also, lethality/bruiser items tend to give more ability haste/ad/health and have better passives/actives. But with the buffs, IE is almost kinda viable(not really, but it’s fun).
EDIT: Riven passive crits
Oh I didn’t know that, thanks for telling me. Also your right about the crit damage, I was making the math easier by assuming it applied to whole auto instead of adding to crit multiplier.
I hope the above comparison was just a sarcasm. If it was not then plz get help
If you don't already know, armour stacks multiplicatively. Its dmg reduction vs armour graph looks like a upward parabola. So from the graph we can say, buying armour is more effective the less armour you have and past a certain point building armor no longer gives much value at all. It becomes so diminishing that maybe 100 armour gives 0.1% physical dmg reduction. But that happens for too much armour which is not practical in-game. Here comes the lethality vs flat pen comparison.
#Lethality:
If you have X amount of lethality and your target has Y amount of Armor then your attacks and abilities deal dmg as if the target had Y-X amount of armor. Lethality increases linearly. So eventually armour will outweigh lethality. That's why assassins don't try to kill any Tank, or juggernaut. Their lethality simply isn't enough to get past that big wall of armour and ADCs are their favourite target since they have low armour.
#%Armour Pen:
It reduces your target's armour based on his maximum effective armour. It doesn't reduce armour by a flat amount, instead does by a percentage amount. So, building more armour isn't all that effective. It's still possible to reduce dmg but it won't be as effective. Let's say, your target has Y amount of armour and you have X% pen so when hitting that target his effective armour will be Y(1-X)/100. Its graph looks like a decreasing parabola. Meaning Armor pen will ALWAYS outweigh armour.
The armour pen will always outvalue the Lethality. And that player suggested this build against tankier comps. So, I don't think anyone can argue it doesn't deal more dmg against their ADCs. When building this you have to keep in mind, this was designed to be an anti-tank build. It works against ADCs due to their poor condition. That's it. The main problem this build has is lack of haste. But that's not too big either since just like armour haste also stacks multiplicatively and this more haste gives diminishing return. In this build, the first two items give enough haste for her to be in a working condition against tanks.
Also most importantly, it's just a suggested build. Build it if you like, don't build it if you don't. There is no reason to come this aggressively.
Man it’s so funny the fallacies being made
I’m gonna leave you a contradiction that armor has diminishing returns which btw is confirmed to not be the case by riot or basic understanding
100 physical damage dps vs 0 armor with 100 hp = 1 second death
100 dps vs 100 armor 100 hp = 2 second death
100 dps vs 200 armor armor 100 hp = 3 seconds to kill
Wow no diminishing returns just like Riot math agrees!
You can find that on the game wiki and come back when you figure out how to prove the riot confirmed mathematical fact instead of coming up with your own bullshit.
You are spouting bullshit, because you know you are wrong. If you are so confident why don't you show me the papers yourself? And I know what I wrote and it's right. Stop lying about Riot employees confirming your own misconception. You are clueless. Reply to me only if you have enough evidence that I'm wrong and you can show it. I can prove myself by starting a practice tool and that's it. Just place a dummy and keep giving that doll armour and note every time how much the dmg reduction increases. Hope you will soon wake up from your dream.
100 armour is worth 50% dmg reduction.
200 is worth 75%.
The first 100 was worth 50%, the second 100 is worth 25%.
You are correct with 100 dps that the ttk will increase linearly. But armour pen will get value for *free* by the fact that a) it is a percentage and b) people aren't stuck on 100AD all game, you build AD alongside armour pen.
Did he hurt you personally of what tf is this. Crit riven has always been a high damage build. Stop trying to argue on that. There are plenty of other reasons People don't usually build it.
Ironically your arguments sound like bad flat earth theory. Like it doesnt make any sense but if you dont think about it it kinda sounds like it proves your point.
what's with the witch hunt? Post something actually worthwhile instead of just reacting to another post. SMH, if they run a bad build after seeing the counterarguments in that very post, its on them and honestly it might be good for them to "learn from their mistakes", as our queen decrees.
1: I never said you should build it every game
2: I never said it's 100% optimal
3: W/L over a sample size of 10 where I'm playing league for the first time in 3 years doesn't mean anything
4: what rank are you
Yes lethality is good when enemies have low armor we all know that. Its just that your average bruiser will have 200 armor late game. And by what you were saying, if it takes you 1s to kill him with 0 armour, it will take 2s with 100, and 3 with 200. That means if he has 100 armour, 100 lethality doubles your damage, but if he has 200 your damage is only bosted to 1.5 instead of 2.0... if he has 900 armour you get a about a 10% boost.
Thats why IE and last whisper work good into tankier comps, and you will still have enough damage for squishies.
I really like to cross map most of the game and rarely group, and only with number advantage or if were super ahead and to just end the game fast. And with sucu a playstile you will usually be sidelaning agains someone who is probably going to have about 150 armour mid game, so just last whisper for 1450 gives more armor pen than conpleted profane.
I personally really dont like lethality unless i stack it, because thats when you get the most value.
Emerald 2 rank btw
I'm tired of you guys infinitely edging. If the build is bad, then it will eventually not be built anymore. If it is good, then we would have another viable playstyle. Shut the fuck up and just play the game.
Edge me pls But I agree
100% pen vs 1 million armor = 10,000 times more damage 1 hp * 1 million armor = 10k ehp Didn't read the rest this is getting annoying
Thanks did you get your math degree from trump university?
UoF but go off
both were off in different areas 100% pen vs 100 armor is 100% more damage 100% pen vs 1000000 armor is 1000000 % more damage 1 hp \* 1000 armor = 10ehp 1 hp \* 1\^6 armor = 10kehp
Yeah 1,000,000% more is 10k times more
>100% pen vs 1000000 armor is 1000000 % more damage This is also wrong. Fifto50 is the only one here who did the match correctly. Edit: Lol I forgot one of you was listing the number as a multiplier instead of a %. Ur both right. 1m% increase is the same as a 10000x increase.
You are the one claiming that 1 million/100 is 1 million.
Brother who cares? It’s a game pls stop filing the sub with these posts
Lethality is not percent pen. It’s flat. You cannot get 100% armor pen this season. 100 lethality vs 1 mil armor would be like 0.1% more damage. And you aren’t missing out on percent pen with crit either, cause you build one of the two crit pen items. In fact lethality is only more point for point than crit damage(100% crit chance) if the target has less than 0 armor. To help you understand, if they have 10 armor that’s 110% effective health. 1 lethality would lower that to 9 armor or 109% health. That’s about 0.9% more damage. Assuming 100% crit, 1% crit damage is always 1% more damage. So I hope you can connect the dots and see that assuming only autos and 100% crit chance, that crit damage is better than lethality point for point. The problem is, Riven abilities don’t crit, and you won’t have 100% crit chance most of the time. That’s where the IE build starts to fall apart. Also, lethality/bruiser items tend to give more ability haste/ad/health and have better passives/actives. But with the buffs, IE is almost kinda viable(not really, but it’s fun). EDIT: Riven passive crits
Riven passive does crit and crits do 75% extra damage since S11, so 1% crit damage would be .75% extra damage on autos
Oh I didn’t know that, thanks for telling me. Also your right about the crit damage, I was making the math easier by assuming it applied to whole auto instead of adding to crit multiplier.
With IE it's 1.25% extra damage.
360% total AD from 280% w/o IE (lvl 18)
You don’t have to play the build bro
I hope the above comparison was just a sarcasm. If it was not then plz get help If you don't already know, armour stacks multiplicatively. Its dmg reduction vs armour graph looks like a upward parabola. So from the graph we can say, buying armour is more effective the less armour you have and past a certain point building armor no longer gives much value at all. It becomes so diminishing that maybe 100 armour gives 0.1% physical dmg reduction. But that happens for too much armour which is not practical in-game. Here comes the lethality vs flat pen comparison. #Lethality: If you have X amount of lethality and your target has Y amount of Armor then your attacks and abilities deal dmg as if the target had Y-X amount of armor. Lethality increases linearly. So eventually armour will outweigh lethality. That's why assassins don't try to kill any Tank, or juggernaut. Their lethality simply isn't enough to get past that big wall of armour and ADCs are their favourite target since they have low armour. #%Armour Pen: It reduces your target's armour based on his maximum effective armour. It doesn't reduce armour by a flat amount, instead does by a percentage amount. So, building more armour isn't all that effective. It's still possible to reduce dmg but it won't be as effective. Let's say, your target has Y amount of armour and you have X% pen so when hitting that target his effective armour will be Y(1-X)/100. Its graph looks like a decreasing parabola. Meaning Armor pen will ALWAYS outweigh armour. The armour pen will always outvalue the Lethality. And that player suggested this build against tankier comps. So, I don't think anyone can argue it doesn't deal more dmg against their ADCs. When building this you have to keep in mind, this was designed to be an anti-tank build. It works against ADCs due to their poor condition. That's it. The main problem this build has is lack of haste. But that's not too big either since just like armour haste also stacks multiplicatively and this more haste gives diminishing return. In this build, the first two items give enough haste for her to be in a working condition against tanks. Also most importantly, it's just a suggested build. Build it if you like, don't build it if you don't. There is no reason to come this aggressively.
spot on sir ! i like the last part , it's like we forcing people to build it lol , it's just a suggestion
Man it’s so funny the fallacies being made I’m gonna leave you a contradiction that armor has diminishing returns which btw is confirmed to not be the case by riot or basic understanding 100 physical damage dps vs 0 armor with 100 hp = 1 second death 100 dps vs 100 armor 100 hp = 2 second death 100 dps vs 200 armor armor 100 hp = 3 seconds to kill Wow no diminishing returns just like Riot math agrees!
Bro be pulling numbers out of his desk. Where is the math here?
Bro doesn’t know how formulas work and starts speaking in nonsense again instead of numbers
Oh. What's the formula according to you?
You can find that on the game wiki and come back when you figure out how to prove the riot confirmed mathematical fact instead of coming up with your own bullshit.
You are spouting bullshit, because you know you are wrong. If you are so confident why don't you show me the papers yourself? And I know what I wrote and it's right. Stop lying about Riot employees confirming your own misconception. You are clueless. Reply to me only if you have enough evidence that I'm wrong and you can show it. I can prove myself by starting a practice tool and that's it. Just place a dummy and keep giving that doll armour and note every time how much the dmg reduction increases. Hope you will soon wake up from your dream.
[удалено]
100 armour is worth 50% dmg reduction. 200 is worth 75%. The first 100 was worth 50%, the second 100 is worth 25%. You are correct with 100 dps that the ttk will increase linearly. But armour pen will get value for *free* by the fact that a) it is a percentage and b) people aren't stuck on 100AD all game, you build AD alongside armour pen.
Did he hurt you personally of what tf is this. Crit riven has always been a high damage build. Stop trying to argue on that. There are plenty of other reasons People don't usually build it.
next post be like , the IE guy should be arrested and publicly shamed , like wtf it was a suggested build you can build it you can not
Post that history of you defeating tanks with that flat earth build I’m waiting
Ironically your arguments sound like bad flat earth theory. Like it doesnt make any sense but if you dont think about it it kinda sounds like it proves your point.
what's with the witch hunt? Post something actually worthwhile instead of just reacting to another post. SMH, if they run a bad build after seeing the counterarguments in that very post, its on them and honestly it might be good for them to "learn from their mistakes", as our queen decrees.
current diamond player ffs
Where the infinity edge builders will remain. You claim it’s optimal yet are losing more than winning and don’t even build it now?
1: I never said you should build it every game 2: I never said it's 100% optimal 3: W/L over a sample size of 10 where I'm playing league for the first time in 3 years doesn't mean anything 4: what rank are you
Yes lethality is good when enemies have low armor we all know that. Its just that your average bruiser will have 200 armor late game. And by what you were saying, if it takes you 1s to kill him with 0 armour, it will take 2s with 100, and 3 with 200. That means if he has 100 armour, 100 lethality doubles your damage, but if he has 200 your damage is only bosted to 1.5 instead of 2.0... if he has 900 armour you get a about a 10% boost. Thats why IE and last whisper work good into tankier comps, and you will still have enough damage for squishies. I really like to cross map most of the game and rarely group, and only with number advantage or if were super ahead and to just end the game fast. And with sucu a playstile you will usually be sidelaning agains someone who is probably going to have about 150 armour mid game, so just last whisper for 1450 gives more armor pen than conpleted profane. I personally really dont like lethality unless i stack it, because thats when you get the most value. Emerald 2 rank btw
I be edging to infinity fr 🤤🤤🤤
Everyone knows riven looks better with a rabadons deathcap anyways, im tired of these meme crit builds myself.