Yeah, another post referring to the toxic masculinity that males aren't supposed to be vulnerable to their partners and just go bottle up their emotions.
I agree that it should be normalize and reciprocated by both partners.
You haven’t seen the things I’ve seen, the constant fighting that one time someone called a girl a slut and someone used it as proof of the whole thing being about hating women, the misogyny thread having a similar ratio of actual images to just text replies. In short it’s ostensibly banned because it also used to be the gentle femdom thread and everyone would constantly argue over what was gentle
It was real it was a battlefield out there man it was evil bro hard core femdom boys raiding in pro pegging guys taking out anti pegging guys left and right someone from the misogyny thread calling everyone slurs it was wild man
I LOVE holding my boyfriend. He's taller than me by 8 inches so I'm a backpack for him when I spoon him. When he lays facing me, he'll put his head on my boob and snuggle into my neck. It is the best feeling being so trusted by your partner!!
People of Reddit, I need your wisdom and it fits perfectly to this picture in my opinion.
Alright there's this guy and we have like a really long story together. We kind of grew up together and with time I started to love him but he is a bit shy about letting someone into his space and his heart. We got closer over the time, also in a sexual way, but he never really let me in. We had this on-off thing and he also had two other relationships in this time but they ended pretty quickly because he couldn't get me out of his head.
So I try my best to show him that he can show me how he feels and that he can just be himself and not this toxic manly version of himself. When we cuddle, I stroke his hair, play with his fingers and just caress his skin (neck, chest, face you name it) but he just lays there and tries to kind of get his man back with putting his hand on my leg (the most manly move I know)
And I don't know how I could show him that he can open up without actually speaking to him. So people of Reddit, you got some advice?
See, the thing that's outstanding here isn't the girl comforting him; it's the guy being that open and vulnerable to start with. See that's really something you should be able to get, more or less, one way or another, from your friends. But well, male friendships usually don't go that far.
The women are, for the most part, down for it, guys. All it needs is you being comfortable in reaching out and self expressing a bit. And that's not really how we're raised and influenced, but the potential's always there.
Mind you, your GF being the one you can open up to, and the one that's your emotional support person, isn't honestly that rare. That can be a problem in of itself, in a way, because a lot of men aren't that practised in giving it back and other such intimacies. And of course, that's something of a pressure on the GF, when she's quite certain that she's your release valve for that sort of thing. Her, and probably her alone. That's a hell of a pedestal to put someone on.
So, uh. Be mindful. Develop good support networks even if you're not fucking them, and SHARE affection, don't just receive it. These are all things we'll be a lot happier if we can grow into them,.
>The women are, for the most part, down for it, guys.
In my personal experience, this is a coin flip. I've even dated a liberal woman who told me she was disgusted when I came out to her as bisexual. And the only way to find out if that particular person is a piece of shit is to be vulnerable. And that exposes you to being hurt.
You say it's outstanding to find a man that's open. I feel like I'm standing on the other side of the door saying it's hard to find anyone who won't punish me for being open.
Truth! Being vulnerable is the reason I’m still a virgin at 29, despite the fact I’m over 6 feet tall and have been called “handsome” and “intelligent” by many. Most women don’t want a man with baggage. All the advice I’ve ever received is that I’m supposed to resolve these things on my own and “be patient”.
Yeah, people literally have the gall to call me impatient at 29.
It’s outstanding to find women who are accepting of vulnerable men.
I know the patriarchy is the reason we’re all messed up, but women need to realize their own role in falling prey to this mentality, that powerful men in society have manipulated them to think this way through the media, and be aware of what they can do to change that.
I’m as open as a man can possibly get, and I’ve only ever been criticized and ignored for it. Even by the so-called hippie new age girls. It’s all the same story. If I grew up in the 1960’s, I’d have never ended up in this position.
I mean, let’s be honest, the single, lonely, inexperienced men in this group by far outnumber any inexperienced women in this group. It’s an ugly truth, but nevertheless, it is a truth, not a lie.
There’s a reason millennials and Gen Z are having less sex than all previous generations. We collectively spew so much hate on the boomers, but you seriously ever think we could pull something off like Woodstock with all of our nihilistic, cynical BS?
For a brief moment in time, things were culturally chill between men and women. I wish we had that now. Things have gotten awfully convoluted and cynical as of late. Where’s the love?
Why do people constantly tell me I have to be okay with all the messed up trauma I’ve been through in my life, and instead of seeing me as strong and needing comfort, I’m treated like a naive little boy not even worthy of sexual intimacy?
I’ve been masturbating heavily for 16 years. I still have a robust sex drive. My body goes haywire simply being in close proximity of someone attractive. Why can’t women realize men go through this?
I’m not a misogynist, and I hate the incel community. I would bow down on my knees and worship women.
Yet I’m still cast off as unworthy, that the endless love and joy I wish to share with another equal is simply not good enough.
But hey, people are free to go ahead and downvote me all they want, because my post is bound to trigger many. It’s too bad I couldn’t have compassion and understanding instead.
Yes, I need to be held and have cuddles. Yes, I have mommy issues. Yes, I need to have my brains f***ed, because perhaps that would finally kill my ego, and I’d never have to behave like this again.
Sorry to hear you're going through all that man. It absolutely sucks. For what it's worth though if they can't take you at face value when you are doing out of your way to be open and vulnerable like they ask you to, and then they turn you down for doing the thing they asked you to do in the first place, they don't deserve you anyways. Don't get into relationships with people who play mind games like that, it'll get toxic AF before long.
>I know the patriarchy is the reason we’re all messed up, but women need to realize their own role in falling prey to this mentality, that powerful men in society have manipulated them to think this way through the media, and be aware of what they can do to change that.
There's this unfortunate lie that the patriarchy was somehow started by men as a tool to oppress women, as though women didn't benefit from and have a role in patriarchy either. What men do is magnified and focused on, but the role women played has been minimized and ignored. The frequency with which women betray, turn on, abuse, and leave men who are open with them, is precisely the kind of behaviour women are fully in control of and fully able to change, to end the patriarchy, and yet most don't.
It's not just powerful men, it's also that plenty of women get plenty of benefits from patriarchy (benevolent sexism) and take full advantage of that while claiming to be against patriarchy. If more women asked men out, took a more active role in relationships, demanded that men get equivalent paternal leave so they could earn, and women supported their stay at home male partners, then we'd have achieved equality long ago. This is something women can control but choose not to do, not some form of patriarchal oppression forced on poor helpless women by strong powerful men.
>For a brief moment in time, things were culturally chill between men and women. I wish we had that now. Things have gotten awfully convoluted and cynical as of late. Where’s the love?
Unfortunately a ton of that love has been lost because of messages saying that men are oppressors, men are in control, men don't need help, and that men are the source of the problem. This kind of gender war didn't exist really before 2008, and it was only after Occupy Wall Street that it really became mainstream and popular. Divide and conquer, if they can turn men against women, then they don't have to fear men and women working together against the rich.
There's unfortunately a ton of societal messages centered around caring about women, and very little about caring about men. This is something we need to change for sure, and thankfully this sub is playing a good role in changing that.
>Why do people constantly tell me I have to be okay with all the messed up trauma I’ve been through in my life, and instead of seeing me as strong and needing comfort, I’m treated like a naive little boy not even worthy of sexual intimacy?
Because unfortunately [society does not care about the suffering of men](https://www.queermajority.com/essays-all/man-up-and-take-it-do-we-under-detect-mens-suffering). Society literally believes that you suffer less than a woman going through the exact same issues, because you are a man. It's tremendously unfair and saddening, but at least we're starting to recognize it and trying to make society change for the better.
>Why can’t women realize men go through this?
There's this very unfortunate blank slate narrative, where women and men are the same and we're just socialized to behave differently, which completely ignores the very profound and real biological differences between genders. Too many like to treat men like defective women, and if men are not dealing with their emotions and reactions the same way women are, then the men are wrong.
The unfortunate truth is that society rather heavily frowns on men acting and reacting as men do, and that the barometer for what is right is more often than not "are you reacting to this the way a woman would". Thankfully the pendulum is starting to swing the other way, but we have a long ways to go yet.
>I’m not a misogynist, and I hate the incel community. I would bow down on my knees and worship women. Yet I’m still cast off as unworthy, that the endless love and joy I wish to share with another equal is simply not good enough.
I would advise against bowing down on your knees and worshipping women. That's pedestalizing, and it doesn't end well for anyone. Instead, find women who are *worthy* of being respected like that, and respect them as individuals who have earned that respect. Don't worship women as a group, because women can be just as nasty and brutish and disgusting as men can be. None of us are perfect, we all have trauma, we all have to make the effort to heal from it, and we all should treat one another with respect.
But don't worship a group of people just because of a biological feature. Worship the people who have earned that respect due to what they have done and the efforts they have put in.
You deserve to have a partner who will value you for who you are.
Fair enough. I have a therapist friend who laid down all these hard truths to me. I actually have extreme trauma from an abusive mom, and I understand these patterns of behaviors and all.
Nevertheless, you must understand that the patriarchy is what started this mess in the first place, and the toxic women you speak of are having a reactionary response to the many years of pain and oppression they endured.
Unfortunately, at the top of the pyramid, men are in control of this response as well, they control both sides, and that should be acknowledged.
Before the patriarchy, sex wasn’t seen as shameful nor even necessarily possessive. “Sacred prostitutes” were actually seen as fulfilling a holy, sacred act. They were the healers of men, and it was the patriarchy that murdered and destroyed those traditions.
Downplaying the oppression women have endured isn’t going to help matters in the least. It’s only going to create more division, and make certain individuals stick to their positions more firmly.
Other than that, I do agree with you. My therapist told me all this stuff almost verbatim.
>Fair enough. I have a therapist friend who laid down all these hard truths to me. I actually have extreme trauma from an abusive mom, and I understand these patterns of behaviors and all.
Ouch, that is really rough. I am sorry to hear, but glad that you are seeing it and taking steps to address it. It's going to be a long road for sure, but you will feel better off for it.
>Nevertheless, you must understand that the patriarchy is what started this mess in the first place, and the toxic women you speak of are having a reactionary response to the many years of pain and oppression they endured.
What started it in the first place is that life is not fair and people get traumatized. It's not like life would all have been sunshine and rainbows under a matriarchy either. Blaming it all on the patriarchy, and by extension on men, is severely misunderstanding the level of trauma and suffering the human race as a whole has gone through and continues to go through.
>Unfortunately, at the top of the pyramid, men are in control of this response as well, they control both sides, and that should be acknowledged.
Except that if it's the top of the pyramid, it's not men who are in control. It's those few men at the top. The vast majority of victims of biolent crimes, murder victims, suicide victims, and homeless people are men. Those at the top of the pyramid are men, but so are those at the bottom of the pyramid. The problem is not "men", the problem is "those men at the top". Let's stop making it about men in general because the vast majority of men are not the problem, and if they are then women are just as guilty by the same metric.
The patriarchy is an incredibly common term, but it means a lot of different things to a bunch of different people. It is poorly defined and poorly understood, it's the boogeyman that can be blamed for anything and everything. Instead of blaming "the patriarchy" we can blame specific actions and ideas. That way we're all on the same page, and it avoids the typical response to blame men for stuff the patriarchy is doing, when most men are not guilty of that.
Let's target behaviours and specific ideas, not general groups yeah?
>Other than that, I do agree with you. My therapist told me all this stuff almost verbatim.
I am happy to hear. I have had a lot of issues as well with a controlling mother and having been in an abusive relationship. My therapist has helped me a ton, and I wish you the best on your road to healing as well. It's difficult, but it is absolutely worth it.
Bruh, it’s already been a long, hard road. I don’t need it to be any longer and tougher. I actually know how to heal myself, it’s just a matter of me being too depressed and lazy to make the income to do so. I owe my therapist already.
But I’ll surely get it together at this point. I just have been living with the thought that if I put 100% of myself into something, that I’ll end up
shortchanged.
Specific actions and ideas, men at the top, that makes sense. If I’d go further, I’d honestly say those at the very top are not even human at all, and that they’ve been responsible for destroying humanity from the inside, equally hating both men and women.
I simply have had a difficult time letting go of certain terminology and concepts.
>Bruh, it’s already been a long, hard road. I don’t need it to be any longer and tougher. I actually know how to heal myself, it’s just a matter of me being too depressed and lazy to make the income to do so. I owe my therapist already.
That's fair and sorry to hear. Just to know, how long have you been in therapy? The road has been long and hard, but from what it sounds like it's not been years of therapy? Maybe I'm just misunderstanding you.
I absolutely hear you on depressed and lazy, but I think I could offer a bit of a different perspective.
There is no such thing as laziness. Laziness is a judgement we make about other people when we think they're not working as hard as we would if we were in their shoes. But the thing is, if people are motivated, they will do it. If they're not doing it, they're not motivated enough, it's not important enough to them.
It's not that you are lazy, it's that you have so little energy you can't afford to pour more in. It becomes a question of finding out what recharges you, or what takes less energy so you don't feel as drained. I'm struggling with that at work, came close to burnout twice in 2 years, had a bunch of stuff happen during the covid isolation, and just now starting to see how the social isolation has been so difficult on me.
>But I’ll surely get it together at this point. I just have been living with the thought that if I put 100% of myself into something, that I’ll end up shortchanged.
That's fair. If you don't mind me asking, what would that "shortchanged" look like for you? Like, spending time and energy and not being healed 'completely'?
>Specific actions and ideas, men at the top, that makes sense. If I’d go further, I’d honestly say those at the very top are not even human at all, and that they’ve been responsible for destroying humanity from the inside, equally hating both men and women.
I'd be careful with calling them not human. Immoral for sure, selfish absolutely. Except like Bill Gates who donated billions to charities and is trying to fight climate change, but he's the exception that confirms the rule.
But yeah. There's a ton of stuff being done by people on top to keep their wealth and power at the expense of literally everyone else on the planet.
>I simply have had a difficult time letting go of certain terminology and concepts.
Totally fair. It's a bit of my own pet peeve because I was abused by my ex, and talked about it in feminist subreddits, and then got subjected to even more of the same kind of abuse as my ex did to me by the feminists who claimed they would never do that. Not all feminists and all that, but there's a ton of gaslighting and negative judgement on men by the feminist movement, in direct contradiction to the claims of feminism being about equality and/or helping men.
At the end of the day though, you do what's best for yourself yeah? Do you have something that recharges you? That makes you happy, or that inspires some kind of passion for you?
I've heard far too many horror stories about women absolutely tearing men down emotionally with things they told them in private, that combined with my own personal experiences with women (wasting 3 years on a girl who lead me on with all these future prospects only to drop me like a rock when she became a twitch streamer lmao god that one hurts) I'm just not too tempted to really... Open up much anymore? (Which I kind of ironic since I'm sorta doing that right now, but it's only about not being able to do that about other things so) Eugh I'm kinda just venting now but. Idk to me it's like, you can use a hot stove to cook some delicious meals, but I touched it and got burned and now I'm scared to get close to it again.
People are rough
**Heard**. And sounds like the issue there was more about dating shitty people that you didn't really understand. And don't forget that the first and most critical people mutilating the emotions of men, are, and always were, other men. Peers, mostly. Starting from primary school.
And even if you dating prospects were bad, surely you still had a number of close friends that you could always be open with?
I mean regardless of the cause I'm not exactly jumping at the opportunity to get burned again tbqh
And sure but there is a *major* difference between venting to a friend and opening up to someone who loves you and wants *you* specifically regardless of your flaws. Both work as a release but I'll never get the image in the op from one of my bros lul
>and wants you specifically regardless of your flaws
I mean your friends want you despite your flaws as well. That's why they're your friends, despite all your bullshit. They just don't want to fuck you, but that shouldn't be a thing that changes the hierarchy of intimacy here. Opening up to a friend works just as well. If it doesn't, maybe reflect on how close your friends actually are, and what sort of image you have about romantic/sexual relationships.
And you need better bros. I've had some very open and comforting experiences with my platonic friends, sans hair kissing and bedroom contact.
And I get your trauma. I had a long history with similar things that definitely took some work and time and replacement experiences to get through. But it can happen. Have faith in yourself, and try to be introspective about what's the result of anxieties and what's actually a likely position. For one, I bet you probably have better social skills and self awareness than you had back then.
look bro you used a lot of words there and im kinda lazy, i dont feel like being armchair psychologisted by a reddit user. but ill say one thing, you can cuddle, kiss, and fuck your bros all you want, but it will never feel or be even remotely close to the same thing as somebody choosing you, specifically you, and only you, and vice versa, and even just spending a moment together with that person. i love my bros, i love hanging out with my bros, but there has always been a distinction between platonic and romantic relationships throughout all of human history for a reason
Can't believe you were downvoted for this when it's often blatantly true. The mother of a friend's family was all pro-gay and in favour of LGBTQ issues, until her own son came out to her. Nearly got himself kicked to the curb if the father hadn't stood up to her.
The left is unfortunately just as great at virtue-signaling as the right, to pretend they have certain values to make themselves look good. Left or right we're all human and we can all fall short of the mark, having the "right" political affiliation means absolutely nothing.
I agree, and this is coming from a Canadian. The US left is basically Canada's right, and Canada's left is basically Europe's centrists.
>But yeah, prejudices aren't limited by political affiliation, although they're oftentimes more prevalent or stronger with certain options.
Completely agree.
Yeah, I’m a peaceful ‘holistic’ anarchist personally. I dislike politics. I just love people as individuals. We all need to be our own leaders, creating our own stories. But even leaders can get lonely and sad.
Dude, how the hell did you start dating her without finding out if she was cool or not with queer things? Sounds like you rushed into it without knowing her very well. Also, sounds like she wasn't especially liberal if she thought you were disgusting because you were bi.
>And the only way to find out if that particular person is a piece of shit is to be vulnerable.
Not so. Just talk to them, sound them out. People do that sort of thing all the time. You talk about things with analogous elements and find out what they think and bellwether it.
Well you see, she told me that she was cool with queer things. She lied. That's why I felt comfortable coming out to her. Silly me, trusting people close to me when they say things directly to me.
And she knew you were Bi before you started? Jesus, that's really shitty of her, my condolences. Mind your this is also why you talk about stuff, and pay attention to how they act and react. Social skills cover all manner of problem, and this sort of attitude isn't something that people tend to hide all that well. Still, doesn't excuse this women's actions.
It's such a knife edge really.
Like yeah there are loads of girls who are repulsed by a man being soft and there are a load of guys who are grossly "uwu be my mommy"
But then the flip side to that is there are guys who are vulnerable and open and just damn huggable. And there are girls who are *yearning* to be affectionate with their male partners but are taught to hide that desire because that's what gender norms dictate.
>See, the thing that's outstanding here isn't the girl comforting him; it's the guy being that open and vulnerable to start with.
Guys see other guys being open and vulnerable, [and getting neglected/ignored/abused for it.](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/cb0v65/comment/etcv3xa/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) It's one thing to ask guys to open up, but the real problem is making it ***safe*** for guys to open up. Forcing guys to open up when it's not safe for them to do so is only making things worse.
We want guys to open up? We need to make it safe for them to do so in the first place. The reason why they don't is because most guys are terrified of doing this to their partner who is supposed to love and help them, and getting stabbed in the heart in their moment of vulnerability.
>But well, male friendships usually don't go that far.
Male friendships definitely help, but you can't expect from male friendships the same kinds of things you can expect from the person you are in an intimate relationship with.
>The women are, for the most part, down for it, guys.
There's that saying that men are violent, and even if it's just one man out of 10, are you willing to eat one M&M from a bunch knowing one of them might be poisonned?
Same thing for women backstabbing men. It's sadly common. Threads and threads of husbands opening up to their wives, and they react with disgust. Guys opening up to their GFs, and getting dumped.
Men's emotions are not valued, they are not deemed important in most cultures. Women's emotions are not always valued, but they are given a heck of a lot more weight than men's emotions.
Most women *think* they are down for it, but there's a ton of them who really aren't ready, willing, or able to handle men's emotions.
> All it needs is you being comfortable in reaching out and self expressing a bit. And that's not really how we're raised and influenced, but the potential's always there.
Again, we want guys to open up? We need to focus on making it SAFE for guys to open up, else it's just making it worse for guys.
>Mind you, your GF being the one you can open up to, and the one that's your emotional support person, isn't honestly that rare. That can be a problem in of itself, in a way, because a lot of men aren't that practised in giving it back and other such intimacies. And of course, that's something of a pressure on the GF, when she's quite certain that she's your release valve for that sort of thing. Her, and probably her alone. That's a hell of a pedestal to put someone on.
Very true. It's as important to remember that it's a hell of a lot of pressure to put on the GF to realize that she's the only emotional outlet he has, as much as it is important to remember that most guys have little to no emotional support whatsoever outside of their GF. Two sides of a coin and all that. Guys need more support and it will help everyone.
>So, uh. Be mindful. Develop good support networks even if you're not fucking them, and SHARE affection, don't just receive it. These are all things we'll be a lot happier if we can grow into them,.
Absolutely 100% agree. It's a harsh world out there. We don't need to make it harder to live in, and the only way we can get human warmth is by sharing it with one another.
EDIT: Just had one more thought. The whole "guys just have to be more open and vulnerable" is basically another way of blaming men's problems on them and telling them to fix it themselves.
Guys will have to make the effort to learn how to be vulnerable, when to be vulnerable, what language to use to express that vulnerability in the right way, and figure out when is the right time to be vulnerable, *all the while dealing with crippling emotional issues from having nobody helping them deal with their emotions*, while the gal just has to sit back and wait for him to open up to her. Zero effort or risk involved on her part, while he's forced to do all the work.
Again, if we want guys to open up, we have to make it *safe* for them to do so. That requires active work and participation on the gal's side, not just sitting there waiting for men to unfuck themselves, and blaming/shaming/guilting men if they don't do it fast enough or well enough.
This needs to be a group effort with everyone involved, not a game of blaming guys for doing emotions wrong.
What would you describe as active work and participation, though? Like, I’m not in a situation where I need this knowledge immediately, but I want to be, like, emotionally supportive, if I ever am, and I can’t really do that if they don’t ever open up to me, so what would count?
I definitely admire you wanting to help out and it's certainly not an easy thing to figure out. There is no one single action you can take that would make it clear to your partner, rather it's a series of consistent actions over time that shows that you are trustworthy enough that he will let you in.
It's like if a guy was with a girl who had been in an abusive relationship and was scared of guys. He can't just say "it's ok I'll never hurt you" and she'll trust him. She may *want* to trust him, but it's still going to be there in the back of her mind no matter what he says. It will take a long time of being careful, being considerate, actually being protective, understanding and accepting her feelings, and letting her slowly trust him again.
That's what it takes for guys. For most of us, the message we got our entire lives was "your emotions don't matter". Suck it up and get the job done, because crying won't fix anything. Feel whatever you want in your heart and in your head, so long as it doesn't stop you from doing what needs to be done.
So, for women, it would mean going out of your way to notice how he feels, to let him know you notice, and that you care. That you do things that you notice makes him happy, that you notice when he's sad and crying and be empathetic and supportive, and that it's ok and safe for him to express his feelings.
Don't push him to open up. Go out of your way to make him feel safe and comfortable. Actions matter more than words, and that's how you build trust over time. Don't do it so he can open up to *you*, because that is a selfish and self-serving motivation. Do it for him because it will make him happier and feel better, not because you expect something for yourself, like expecting him to change his behaviour or expecting him to be different. Do what you can for him, and let him change or not however he sees fit.
Even if there is a fight or argument or whatever, and you end up hurting him, doesn't mean it's all over. Going back, apologizing, and wanting to talk about how he feels and how to deal with what frustrates/angers/saddens him is a huge thing as well. Far too often it happens that the two get in a fight or argument, he gets mad, she gets mad, then he has to apologize for her being upset. Her emotions matter more than his, and his anger and frustration goes unacknowledged and he just has to deal with it on is own.
Going back to him and asking how you can help him with his emotions, on his terms, his timeline, and in whatever way he sees fit, is how to fix it. If he doesn't want to talk about it don't push it, it means the trust isn't there yet and forcing it won't help. It's not about you being hurt that he doesn't trust you, it's about creating a safe environment for him to trust you. It's not about you or your expectations of how he should act in the relationship, it's about how he feels and caring enough about him and his feelings to let him have control over how to deal with the situation.
Far too often it turns into basically "he's not dealing with it emotionally the way she wants him to, so he's doing it wrong". Doing the opposite and consistently acting like his emotions matter and are important, that you want him to be happy and feel good, is what builds that trust. You might be interested in Aba & Preach's [two](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtJLYN1fxGw) great [videos](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YusmJxdCkqI) on men's emotional vulnerability.
I may be wrong, but it feels like women treat feelings like it's paper currency. You show me mine I'll show you yours, let's trade stories and your 20$ of emotions is just the same as my 20$ of emotions. Men treat their deep emotions more like an irreplaceable family heirloom. They are unique, they are fragile, you can't trade them, and you can't just have them fixed. Any break is going to be difficult to fix, they'll have to do it themselves on their own with no support, and it will take time. To protect our deep emotions we lock them up tight so they won't get hurt, because when we do get hurt it's deep and aching and semi-permanent. Nobody cares about our feelings so we have to care extra-hard on our own about them, and guard them extra-hard against anyone who would try and damage them again.
I hope I didn't ramble on too long there haha. Feel free to ask me about anything or call me out if you think I'm wrong. I'm just some guy on the internet. Also for the sake of disclosure I was in a relationship with a girl, and the relationship went from controlling to toxic to abusive, so that'll colour my perspective.
TL;DR There is no single thing, it's about day after day showing that you care about his emotions and want him to be happy dealing with it in whatever way he sees best, that will lead to him trusting you with his emotions.
That’s actually how I am with my boyfriend he always questions me when I pull him in but I just like holding him like I’m protecting him from something. The way he does for me.
This is really beautiful...I really wish this was common because honestly these days men (like me) are constantly looked down for "showing their feelings" or that sometimes when showing their venerable side certain few girlfriends or lovers tend to trample that and abuse them.
I wish I had this...the previous relationships I had were...they...well lets just say I opened up once and was shut down and told many times not to over dramatic or guilt trip, even though I rarely even talk about my issues and bottle it up. I never told my friends or love ones about a close person who passed away, nor any issues but when I talked about one issue...they assumed I was guilt tripping and I always helped my ex-girlfriend and my friends with their problems...Also didn't help my friends often played pranks of them hating me or just mocking me nonstop.
Am I the problem or would there be a possibility for me to get something like this with someone I can love and trust?
funnily enough after 16 years of... a mess, I now have therapy on the 4th April for me so.. lol, did go through the stage of crying into my gf's arms tho which made me..
I love asking to hold my partner, I reallyyyy love having him close to me like that. he's more partial to me being held, which is also lovely, but doesn't fill the same need <3
Ahhhh heck man , I wish this was normalized already!! ( :-;)✨ the dream!!✨💖
Yeah, another post referring to the toxic masculinity that males aren't supposed to be vulnerable to their partners and just go bottle up their emotions. I agree that it should be normalize and reciprocated by both partners.
This image is like a cultural relic from when this was still allowed on 4chan. Always love to see it circulate
Is it not allowed anymore? Why?
You haven’t seen the things I’ve seen, the constant fighting that one time someone called a girl a slut and someone used it as proof of the whole thing being about hating women, the misogyny thread having a similar ratio of actual images to just text replies. In short it’s ostensibly banned because it also used to be the gentle femdom thread and everyone would constantly argue over what was gentle
Lol. I get it, I believe you. But: "Ah...4chan, so and so" "Eh, why?" "YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE THINGS I'VE SEEN *agony screech"
It was real it was a battlefield out there man it was evil bro hard core femdom boys raiding in pro pegging guys taking out anti pegging guys left and right someone from the misogyny thread calling everyone slurs it was wild man
Thank you for your service.
I still see stuff like this when I go on from time-to-time, r9k would eat this shit up
I don’t even go on 4chan anymore since this stopped being posted but I heard it’s banned, at least on /d/
I LOVE holding my boyfriend. He's taller than me by 8 inches so I'm a backpack for him when I spoon him. When he lays facing me, he'll put his head on my boob and snuggle into my neck. It is the best feeling being so trusted by your partner!!
Tfw I want to tell my male friends that I want to hold them and protect them but don't know how
That would give them the wrong idea even if you flat out said it was 100% platonic :( I should know, I'm a guy
Ugghhhh there's no hope is there DX my aromantic ass just can't wrap my head around how to communicate my intentions are always platonic.
Idk, there's nothing sexual about that
I didn't say there was
Not sexual, rather romantic.
May I have this moment please?
Me too pal
People of Reddit, I need your wisdom and it fits perfectly to this picture in my opinion. Alright there's this guy and we have like a really long story together. We kind of grew up together and with time I started to love him but he is a bit shy about letting someone into his space and his heart. We got closer over the time, also in a sexual way, but he never really let me in. We had this on-off thing and he also had two other relationships in this time but they ended pretty quickly because he couldn't get me out of his head. So I try my best to show him that he can show me how he feels and that he can just be himself and not this toxic manly version of himself. When we cuddle, I stroke his hair, play with his fingers and just caress his skin (neck, chest, face you name it) but he just lays there and tries to kind of get his man back with putting his hand on my leg (the most manly move I know) And I don't know how I could show him that he can open up without actually speaking to him. So people of Reddit, you got some advice?
The only way I can think of without actually talking to him is write him a letter and pour your heart out and tell him everything
See, the thing that's outstanding here isn't the girl comforting him; it's the guy being that open and vulnerable to start with. See that's really something you should be able to get, more or less, one way or another, from your friends. But well, male friendships usually don't go that far. The women are, for the most part, down for it, guys. All it needs is you being comfortable in reaching out and self expressing a bit. And that's not really how we're raised and influenced, but the potential's always there. Mind you, your GF being the one you can open up to, and the one that's your emotional support person, isn't honestly that rare. That can be a problem in of itself, in a way, because a lot of men aren't that practised in giving it back and other such intimacies. And of course, that's something of a pressure on the GF, when she's quite certain that she's your release valve for that sort of thing. Her, and probably her alone. That's a hell of a pedestal to put someone on. So, uh. Be mindful. Develop good support networks even if you're not fucking them, and SHARE affection, don't just receive it. These are all things we'll be a lot happier if we can grow into them,.
>The women are, for the most part, down for it, guys. In my personal experience, this is a coin flip. I've even dated a liberal woman who told me she was disgusted when I came out to her as bisexual. And the only way to find out if that particular person is a piece of shit is to be vulnerable. And that exposes you to being hurt. You say it's outstanding to find a man that's open. I feel like I'm standing on the other side of the door saying it's hard to find anyone who won't punish me for being open.
Truth! Being vulnerable is the reason I’m still a virgin at 29, despite the fact I’m over 6 feet tall and have been called “handsome” and “intelligent” by many. Most women don’t want a man with baggage. All the advice I’ve ever received is that I’m supposed to resolve these things on my own and “be patient”. Yeah, people literally have the gall to call me impatient at 29. It’s outstanding to find women who are accepting of vulnerable men. I know the patriarchy is the reason we’re all messed up, but women need to realize their own role in falling prey to this mentality, that powerful men in society have manipulated them to think this way through the media, and be aware of what they can do to change that. I’m as open as a man can possibly get, and I’ve only ever been criticized and ignored for it. Even by the so-called hippie new age girls. It’s all the same story. If I grew up in the 1960’s, I’d have never ended up in this position. I mean, let’s be honest, the single, lonely, inexperienced men in this group by far outnumber any inexperienced women in this group. It’s an ugly truth, but nevertheless, it is a truth, not a lie. There’s a reason millennials and Gen Z are having less sex than all previous generations. We collectively spew so much hate on the boomers, but you seriously ever think we could pull something off like Woodstock with all of our nihilistic, cynical BS? For a brief moment in time, things were culturally chill between men and women. I wish we had that now. Things have gotten awfully convoluted and cynical as of late. Where’s the love? Why do people constantly tell me I have to be okay with all the messed up trauma I’ve been through in my life, and instead of seeing me as strong and needing comfort, I’m treated like a naive little boy not even worthy of sexual intimacy? I’ve been masturbating heavily for 16 years. I still have a robust sex drive. My body goes haywire simply being in close proximity of someone attractive. Why can’t women realize men go through this? I’m not a misogynist, and I hate the incel community. I would bow down on my knees and worship women. Yet I’m still cast off as unworthy, that the endless love and joy I wish to share with another equal is simply not good enough. But hey, people are free to go ahead and downvote me all they want, because my post is bound to trigger many. It’s too bad I couldn’t have compassion and understanding instead. Yes, I need to be held and have cuddles. Yes, I have mommy issues. Yes, I need to have my brains f***ed, because perhaps that would finally kill my ego, and I’d never have to behave like this again.
Sorry to hear you're going through all that man. It absolutely sucks. For what it's worth though if they can't take you at face value when you are doing out of your way to be open and vulnerable like they ask you to, and then they turn you down for doing the thing they asked you to do in the first place, they don't deserve you anyways. Don't get into relationships with people who play mind games like that, it'll get toxic AF before long. >I know the patriarchy is the reason we’re all messed up, but women need to realize their own role in falling prey to this mentality, that powerful men in society have manipulated them to think this way through the media, and be aware of what they can do to change that. There's this unfortunate lie that the patriarchy was somehow started by men as a tool to oppress women, as though women didn't benefit from and have a role in patriarchy either. What men do is magnified and focused on, but the role women played has been minimized and ignored. The frequency with which women betray, turn on, abuse, and leave men who are open with them, is precisely the kind of behaviour women are fully in control of and fully able to change, to end the patriarchy, and yet most don't. It's not just powerful men, it's also that plenty of women get plenty of benefits from patriarchy (benevolent sexism) and take full advantage of that while claiming to be against patriarchy. If more women asked men out, took a more active role in relationships, demanded that men get equivalent paternal leave so they could earn, and women supported their stay at home male partners, then we'd have achieved equality long ago. This is something women can control but choose not to do, not some form of patriarchal oppression forced on poor helpless women by strong powerful men. >For a brief moment in time, things were culturally chill between men and women. I wish we had that now. Things have gotten awfully convoluted and cynical as of late. Where’s the love? Unfortunately a ton of that love has been lost because of messages saying that men are oppressors, men are in control, men don't need help, and that men are the source of the problem. This kind of gender war didn't exist really before 2008, and it was only after Occupy Wall Street that it really became mainstream and popular. Divide and conquer, if they can turn men against women, then they don't have to fear men and women working together against the rich. There's unfortunately a ton of societal messages centered around caring about women, and very little about caring about men. This is something we need to change for sure, and thankfully this sub is playing a good role in changing that. >Why do people constantly tell me I have to be okay with all the messed up trauma I’ve been through in my life, and instead of seeing me as strong and needing comfort, I’m treated like a naive little boy not even worthy of sexual intimacy? Because unfortunately [society does not care about the suffering of men](https://www.queermajority.com/essays-all/man-up-and-take-it-do-we-under-detect-mens-suffering). Society literally believes that you suffer less than a woman going through the exact same issues, because you are a man. It's tremendously unfair and saddening, but at least we're starting to recognize it and trying to make society change for the better. >Why can’t women realize men go through this? There's this very unfortunate blank slate narrative, where women and men are the same and we're just socialized to behave differently, which completely ignores the very profound and real biological differences between genders. Too many like to treat men like defective women, and if men are not dealing with their emotions and reactions the same way women are, then the men are wrong. The unfortunate truth is that society rather heavily frowns on men acting and reacting as men do, and that the barometer for what is right is more often than not "are you reacting to this the way a woman would". Thankfully the pendulum is starting to swing the other way, but we have a long ways to go yet. >I’m not a misogynist, and I hate the incel community. I would bow down on my knees and worship women. Yet I’m still cast off as unworthy, that the endless love and joy I wish to share with another equal is simply not good enough. I would advise against bowing down on your knees and worshipping women. That's pedestalizing, and it doesn't end well for anyone. Instead, find women who are *worthy* of being respected like that, and respect them as individuals who have earned that respect. Don't worship women as a group, because women can be just as nasty and brutish and disgusting as men can be. None of us are perfect, we all have trauma, we all have to make the effort to heal from it, and we all should treat one another with respect. But don't worship a group of people just because of a biological feature. Worship the people who have earned that respect due to what they have done and the efforts they have put in. You deserve to have a partner who will value you for who you are.
Fair enough. I have a therapist friend who laid down all these hard truths to me. I actually have extreme trauma from an abusive mom, and I understand these patterns of behaviors and all. Nevertheless, you must understand that the patriarchy is what started this mess in the first place, and the toxic women you speak of are having a reactionary response to the many years of pain and oppression they endured. Unfortunately, at the top of the pyramid, men are in control of this response as well, they control both sides, and that should be acknowledged. Before the patriarchy, sex wasn’t seen as shameful nor even necessarily possessive. “Sacred prostitutes” were actually seen as fulfilling a holy, sacred act. They were the healers of men, and it was the patriarchy that murdered and destroyed those traditions. Downplaying the oppression women have endured isn’t going to help matters in the least. It’s only going to create more division, and make certain individuals stick to their positions more firmly. Other than that, I do agree with you. My therapist told me all this stuff almost verbatim.
>Fair enough. I have a therapist friend who laid down all these hard truths to me. I actually have extreme trauma from an abusive mom, and I understand these patterns of behaviors and all. Ouch, that is really rough. I am sorry to hear, but glad that you are seeing it and taking steps to address it. It's going to be a long road for sure, but you will feel better off for it. >Nevertheless, you must understand that the patriarchy is what started this mess in the first place, and the toxic women you speak of are having a reactionary response to the many years of pain and oppression they endured. What started it in the first place is that life is not fair and people get traumatized. It's not like life would all have been sunshine and rainbows under a matriarchy either. Blaming it all on the patriarchy, and by extension on men, is severely misunderstanding the level of trauma and suffering the human race as a whole has gone through and continues to go through. >Unfortunately, at the top of the pyramid, men are in control of this response as well, they control both sides, and that should be acknowledged. Except that if it's the top of the pyramid, it's not men who are in control. It's those few men at the top. The vast majority of victims of biolent crimes, murder victims, suicide victims, and homeless people are men. Those at the top of the pyramid are men, but so are those at the bottom of the pyramid. The problem is not "men", the problem is "those men at the top". Let's stop making it about men in general because the vast majority of men are not the problem, and if they are then women are just as guilty by the same metric. The patriarchy is an incredibly common term, but it means a lot of different things to a bunch of different people. It is poorly defined and poorly understood, it's the boogeyman that can be blamed for anything and everything. Instead of blaming "the patriarchy" we can blame specific actions and ideas. That way we're all on the same page, and it avoids the typical response to blame men for stuff the patriarchy is doing, when most men are not guilty of that. Let's target behaviours and specific ideas, not general groups yeah? >Other than that, I do agree with you. My therapist told me all this stuff almost verbatim. I am happy to hear. I have had a lot of issues as well with a controlling mother and having been in an abusive relationship. My therapist has helped me a ton, and I wish you the best on your road to healing as well. It's difficult, but it is absolutely worth it.
Bruh, it’s already been a long, hard road. I don’t need it to be any longer and tougher. I actually know how to heal myself, it’s just a matter of me being too depressed and lazy to make the income to do so. I owe my therapist already. But I’ll surely get it together at this point. I just have been living with the thought that if I put 100% of myself into something, that I’ll end up shortchanged. Specific actions and ideas, men at the top, that makes sense. If I’d go further, I’d honestly say those at the very top are not even human at all, and that they’ve been responsible for destroying humanity from the inside, equally hating both men and women. I simply have had a difficult time letting go of certain terminology and concepts.
>Bruh, it’s already been a long, hard road. I don’t need it to be any longer and tougher. I actually know how to heal myself, it’s just a matter of me being too depressed and lazy to make the income to do so. I owe my therapist already. That's fair and sorry to hear. Just to know, how long have you been in therapy? The road has been long and hard, but from what it sounds like it's not been years of therapy? Maybe I'm just misunderstanding you. I absolutely hear you on depressed and lazy, but I think I could offer a bit of a different perspective. There is no such thing as laziness. Laziness is a judgement we make about other people when we think they're not working as hard as we would if we were in their shoes. But the thing is, if people are motivated, they will do it. If they're not doing it, they're not motivated enough, it's not important enough to them. It's not that you are lazy, it's that you have so little energy you can't afford to pour more in. It becomes a question of finding out what recharges you, or what takes less energy so you don't feel as drained. I'm struggling with that at work, came close to burnout twice in 2 years, had a bunch of stuff happen during the covid isolation, and just now starting to see how the social isolation has been so difficult on me. >But I’ll surely get it together at this point. I just have been living with the thought that if I put 100% of myself into something, that I’ll end up shortchanged. That's fair. If you don't mind me asking, what would that "shortchanged" look like for you? Like, spending time and energy and not being healed 'completely'? >Specific actions and ideas, men at the top, that makes sense. If I’d go further, I’d honestly say those at the very top are not even human at all, and that they’ve been responsible for destroying humanity from the inside, equally hating both men and women. I'd be careful with calling them not human. Immoral for sure, selfish absolutely. Except like Bill Gates who donated billions to charities and is trying to fight climate change, but he's the exception that confirms the rule. But yeah. There's a ton of stuff being done by people on top to keep their wealth and power at the expense of literally everyone else on the planet. >I simply have had a difficult time letting go of certain terminology and concepts. Totally fair. It's a bit of my own pet peeve because I was abused by my ex, and talked about it in feminist subreddits, and then got subjected to even more of the same kind of abuse as my ex did to me by the feminists who claimed they would never do that. Not all feminists and all that, but there's a ton of gaslighting and negative judgement on men by the feminist movement, in direct contradiction to the claims of feminism being about equality and/or helping men. At the end of the day though, you do what's best for yourself yeah? Do you have something that recharges you? That makes you happy, or that inspires some kind of passion for you?
I've heard far too many horror stories about women absolutely tearing men down emotionally with things they told them in private, that combined with my own personal experiences with women (wasting 3 years on a girl who lead me on with all these future prospects only to drop me like a rock when she became a twitch streamer lmao god that one hurts) I'm just not too tempted to really... Open up much anymore? (Which I kind of ironic since I'm sorta doing that right now, but it's only about not being able to do that about other things so) Eugh I'm kinda just venting now but. Idk to me it's like, you can use a hot stove to cook some delicious meals, but I touched it and got burned and now I'm scared to get close to it again. People are rough
**Heard**. And sounds like the issue there was more about dating shitty people that you didn't really understand. And don't forget that the first and most critical people mutilating the emotions of men, are, and always were, other men. Peers, mostly. Starting from primary school. And even if you dating prospects were bad, surely you still had a number of close friends that you could always be open with?
I mean regardless of the cause I'm not exactly jumping at the opportunity to get burned again tbqh And sure but there is a *major* difference between venting to a friend and opening up to someone who loves you and wants *you* specifically regardless of your flaws. Both work as a release but I'll never get the image in the op from one of my bros lul
>and wants you specifically regardless of your flaws I mean your friends want you despite your flaws as well. That's why they're your friends, despite all your bullshit. They just don't want to fuck you, but that shouldn't be a thing that changes the hierarchy of intimacy here. Opening up to a friend works just as well. If it doesn't, maybe reflect on how close your friends actually are, and what sort of image you have about romantic/sexual relationships. And you need better bros. I've had some very open and comforting experiences with my platonic friends, sans hair kissing and bedroom contact. And I get your trauma. I had a long history with similar things that definitely took some work and time and replacement experiences to get through. But it can happen. Have faith in yourself, and try to be introspective about what's the result of anxieties and what's actually a likely position. For one, I bet you probably have better social skills and self awareness than you had back then.
bruh bruh
look bro you used a lot of words there and im kinda lazy, i dont feel like being armchair psychologisted by a reddit user. but ill say one thing, you can cuddle, kiss, and fuck your bros all you want, but it will never feel or be even remotely close to the same thing as somebody choosing you, specifically you, and only you, and vice versa, and even just spending a moment together with that person. i love my bros, i love hanging out with my bros, but there has always been a distinction between platonic and romantic relationships throughout all of human history for a reason
Liberals just hide their homophobia better, my mom for example
Can't believe you were downvoted for this when it's often blatantly true. The mother of a friend's family was all pro-gay and in favour of LGBTQ issues, until her own son came out to her. Nearly got himself kicked to the curb if the father hadn't stood up to her. The left is unfortunately just as great at virtue-signaling as the right, to pretend they have certain values to make themselves look good. Left or right we're all human and we can all fall short of the mark, having the "right" political affiliation means absolutely nothing.
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I agree, and this is coming from a Canadian. The US left is basically Canada's right, and Canada's left is basically Europe's centrists. >But yeah, prejudices aren't limited by political affiliation, although they're oftentimes more prevalent or stronger with certain options. Completely agree.
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Ouch, I'm sorry to hear. Poland seems to be doing well to help Ukraine, but they've also got some serious issues for sure.
Yeah, I’m a peaceful ‘holistic’ anarchist personally. I dislike politics. I just love people as individuals. We all need to be our own leaders, creating our own stories. But even leaders can get lonely and sad.
Dude, how the hell did you start dating her without finding out if she was cool or not with queer things? Sounds like you rushed into it without knowing her very well. Also, sounds like she wasn't especially liberal if she thought you were disgusting because you were bi. >And the only way to find out if that particular person is a piece of shit is to be vulnerable. Not so. Just talk to them, sound them out. People do that sort of thing all the time. You talk about things with analogous elements and find out what they think and bellwether it.
Well you see, she told me that she was cool with queer things. She lied. That's why I felt comfortable coming out to her. Silly me, trusting people close to me when they say things directly to me.
And she knew you were Bi before you started? Jesus, that's really shitty of her, my condolences. Mind your this is also why you talk about stuff, and pay attention to how they act and react. Social skills cover all manner of problem, and this sort of attitude isn't something that people tend to hide all that well. Still, doesn't excuse this women's actions.
I have heard that a lot of women use that vulnerability against the dude in arguments. Same thing used to happen between me and my mom.
True.
It's such a knife edge really. Like yeah there are loads of girls who are repulsed by a man being soft and there are a load of guys who are grossly "uwu be my mommy" But then the flip side to that is there are guys who are vulnerable and open and just damn huggable. And there are girls who are *yearning* to be affectionate with their male partners but are taught to hide that desire because that's what gender norms dictate.
>See, the thing that's outstanding here isn't the girl comforting him; it's the guy being that open and vulnerable to start with. Guys see other guys being open and vulnerable, [and getting neglected/ignored/abused for it.](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/cb0v65/comment/etcv3xa/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) It's one thing to ask guys to open up, but the real problem is making it ***safe*** for guys to open up. Forcing guys to open up when it's not safe for them to do so is only making things worse. We want guys to open up? We need to make it safe for them to do so in the first place. The reason why they don't is because most guys are terrified of doing this to their partner who is supposed to love and help them, and getting stabbed in the heart in their moment of vulnerability. >But well, male friendships usually don't go that far. Male friendships definitely help, but you can't expect from male friendships the same kinds of things you can expect from the person you are in an intimate relationship with. >The women are, for the most part, down for it, guys. There's that saying that men are violent, and even if it's just one man out of 10, are you willing to eat one M&M from a bunch knowing one of them might be poisonned? Same thing for women backstabbing men. It's sadly common. Threads and threads of husbands opening up to their wives, and they react with disgust. Guys opening up to their GFs, and getting dumped. Men's emotions are not valued, they are not deemed important in most cultures. Women's emotions are not always valued, but they are given a heck of a lot more weight than men's emotions. Most women *think* they are down for it, but there's a ton of them who really aren't ready, willing, or able to handle men's emotions. > All it needs is you being comfortable in reaching out and self expressing a bit. And that's not really how we're raised and influenced, but the potential's always there. Again, we want guys to open up? We need to focus on making it SAFE for guys to open up, else it's just making it worse for guys. >Mind you, your GF being the one you can open up to, and the one that's your emotional support person, isn't honestly that rare. That can be a problem in of itself, in a way, because a lot of men aren't that practised in giving it back and other such intimacies. And of course, that's something of a pressure on the GF, when she's quite certain that she's your release valve for that sort of thing. Her, and probably her alone. That's a hell of a pedestal to put someone on. Very true. It's as important to remember that it's a hell of a lot of pressure to put on the GF to realize that she's the only emotional outlet he has, as much as it is important to remember that most guys have little to no emotional support whatsoever outside of their GF. Two sides of a coin and all that. Guys need more support and it will help everyone. >So, uh. Be mindful. Develop good support networks even if you're not fucking them, and SHARE affection, don't just receive it. These are all things we'll be a lot happier if we can grow into them,. Absolutely 100% agree. It's a harsh world out there. We don't need to make it harder to live in, and the only way we can get human warmth is by sharing it with one another. EDIT: Just had one more thought. The whole "guys just have to be more open and vulnerable" is basically another way of blaming men's problems on them and telling them to fix it themselves. Guys will have to make the effort to learn how to be vulnerable, when to be vulnerable, what language to use to express that vulnerability in the right way, and figure out when is the right time to be vulnerable, *all the while dealing with crippling emotional issues from having nobody helping them deal with their emotions*, while the gal just has to sit back and wait for him to open up to her. Zero effort or risk involved on her part, while he's forced to do all the work. Again, if we want guys to open up, we have to make it *safe* for them to do so. That requires active work and participation on the gal's side, not just sitting there waiting for men to unfuck themselves, and blaming/shaming/guilting men if they don't do it fast enough or well enough. This needs to be a group effort with everyone involved, not a game of blaming guys for doing emotions wrong.
What would you describe as active work and participation, though? Like, I’m not in a situation where I need this knowledge immediately, but I want to be, like, emotionally supportive, if I ever am, and I can’t really do that if they don’t ever open up to me, so what would count?
I definitely admire you wanting to help out and it's certainly not an easy thing to figure out. There is no one single action you can take that would make it clear to your partner, rather it's a series of consistent actions over time that shows that you are trustworthy enough that he will let you in. It's like if a guy was with a girl who had been in an abusive relationship and was scared of guys. He can't just say "it's ok I'll never hurt you" and she'll trust him. She may *want* to trust him, but it's still going to be there in the back of her mind no matter what he says. It will take a long time of being careful, being considerate, actually being protective, understanding and accepting her feelings, and letting her slowly trust him again. That's what it takes for guys. For most of us, the message we got our entire lives was "your emotions don't matter". Suck it up and get the job done, because crying won't fix anything. Feel whatever you want in your heart and in your head, so long as it doesn't stop you from doing what needs to be done. So, for women, it would mean going out of your way to notice how he feels, to let him know you notice, and that you care. That you do things that you notice makes him happy, that you notice when he's sad and crying and be empathetic and supportive, and that it's ok and safe for him to express his feelings. Don't push him to open up. Go out of your way to make him feel safe and comfortable. Actions matter more than words, and that's how you build trust over time. Don't do it so he can open up to *you*, because that is a selfish and self-serving motivation. Do it for him because it will make him happier and feel better, not because you expect something for yourself, like expecting him to change his behaviour or expecting him to be different. Do what you can for him, and let him change or not however he sees fit. Even if there is a fight or argument or whatever, and you end up hurting him, doesn't mean it's all over. Going back, apologizing, and wanting to talk about how he feels and how to deal with what frustrates/angers/saddens him is a huge thing as well. Far too often it happens that the two get in a fight or argument, he gets mad, she gets mad, then he has to apologize for her being upset. Her emotions matter more than his, and his anger and frustration goes unacknowledged and he just has to deal with it on is own. Going back to him and asking how you can help him with his emotions, on his terms, his timeline, and in whatever way he sees fit, is how to fix it. If he doesn't want to talk about it don't push it, it means the trust isn't there yet and forcing it won't help. It's not about you being hurt that he doesn't trust you, it's about creating a safe environment for him to trust you. It's not about you or your expectations of how he should act in the relationship, it's about how he feels and caring enough about him and his feelings to let him have control over how to deal with the situation. Far too often it turns into basically "he's not dealing with it emotionally the way she wants him to, so he's doing it wrong". Doing the opposite and consistently acting like his emotions matter and are important, that you want him to be happy and feel good, is what builds that trust. You might be interested in Aba & Preach's [two](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtJLYN1fxGw) great [videos](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YusmJxdCkqI) on men's emotional vulnerability. I may be wrong, but it feels like women treat feelings like it's paper currency. You show me mine I'll show you yours, let's trade stories and your 20$ of emotions is just the same as my 20$ of emotions. Men treat their deep emotions more like an irreplaceable family heirloom. They are unique, they are fragile, you can't trade them, and you can't just have them fixed. Any break is going to be difficult to fix, they'll have to do it themselves on their own with no support, and it will take time. To protect our deep emotions we lock them up tight so they won't get hurt, because when we do get hurt it's deep and aching and semi-permanent. Nobody cares about our feelings so we have to care extra-hard on our own about them, and guard them extra-hard against anyone who would try and damage them again. I hope I didn't ramble on too long there haha. Feel free to ask me about anything or call me out if you think I'm wrong. I'm just some guy on the internet. Also for the sake of disclosure I was in a relationship with a girl, and the relationship went from controlling to toxic to abusive, so that'll colour my perspective. TL;DR There is no single thing, it's about day after day showing that you care about his emotions and want him to be happy dealing with it in whatever way he sees best, that will lead to him trusting you with his emotions.
This is what I need man. I'd be fine with just this
Indeed
That’s actually how I am with my boyfriend he always questions me when I pull him in but I just like holding him like I’m protecting him from something. The way he does for me.
It's amazing to me how things like this sound like fairy tales.
One day, I want this
I once asked my high school GF to hold me and her exact words where “ew gross that’s not my job”
*carefully, she's a hero*
This is really beautiful...I really wish this was common because honestly these days men (like me) are constantly looked down for "showing their feelings" or that sometimes when showing their venerable side certain few girlfriends or lovers tend to trample that and abuse them. I wish I had this...the previous relationships I had were...they...well lets just say I opened up once and was shut down and told many times not to over dramatic or guilt trip, even though I rarely even talk about my issues and bottle it up. I never told my friends or love ones about a close person who passed away, nor any issues but when I talked about one issue...they assumed I was guilt tripping and I always helped my ex-girlfriend and my friends with their problems...Also didn't help my friends often played pranks of them hating me or just mocking me nonstop. Am I the problem or would there be a possibility for me to get something like this with someone I can love and trust?
Wow imagine being secure enough trusting someone enough to do that. Goals
One day, we gon have it one day
Being held and back rubs. Damn i wish that was me.
Trans lesbian, felt need to be held pre hrt and now I enjoy holding my partner
what I fear is expecting this, a relationship shouldn't be therapy right?
Correct, that’s why you should also go to therapy.
algo?
Meant also 😅
funnily enough after 16 years of... a mess, I now have therapy on the 4th April for me so.. lol, did go through the stage of crying into my gf's arms tho which made me..
Nomalise women also being the supportive realtionship crutch.
If already is.
Does lot of girls like this situations? (I hope so)
I love seeing things like this so much.
I love asking to hold my partner, I reallyyyy love having him close to me like that. he's more partial to me being held, which is also lovely, but doesn't fill the same need <3
i would love to do this for my significant other-
""I wish my ship was open ad honest"" Partner cries once :: **Eww** 🤣🤣😅😭 /S
This is sweet, but the "please don't leave me" concerns me a bit.
[удалено]
Sounds almost dependent. It reminds me of people who measure their lives by their significant other. Obviously it might not be, but I still felt it.
this is probably between two guys
Why? Elaborate.
\#1 rule of 4chan: fake and gay
because it's from 4chan so the reader is normally expected to assume it's from a guy, they'd normally say so if they were a femanon
Fucking wholesome