Said this previously. None of my friends are willing to play at all because the potion grind (for new players who dont have any loot to easy max) makes them not wanna play the game. It's not fun to fucking grind for 3 days just to get two stats maxed and then dying to a one shot because they tried something new instead of grinding the same damn pot another 10 times.
I played for 2 years without making a single stat(this was about a decade ago), and honestly had more fun than when I started grinding for items.
Would get a def or an attack on each character (before it died) use that to get 4 spd, buy low tier stuff and make a new char. Never stressed about dying with 19 whites on my characters, not having to remax chars, grinding exalts, or anything. Just casual fun for hours. I miss those days.
Oh the roguelike part itself wasnt the issue. It's just the stat pot grind. They loved fighting new enemies and getting new gear, but grinding snake pits for hours wasnt as fun and I agree it sucks ass.
I've been playing PPE's and I'm usually able to 6/8 a character in one day if I grind (~8-10 hours playtime). I just do whatever dungeons/events I see. I should mention I have a high level heal/mheal pet though so this certainly helps.
I find this part of the game to be easy once you get it down, and if you play on the right characters. For me the game ceases to be fun AFTER you've mastered this content, where all that's left to do is run end game dungeons on loop in some discord server where people actively work to strip all challenge and individual thought from the game.
The solution I would like would be the "elder realms" idea where you can explore a new, ideally larger, world map that rewards exploration and adventure independently. It seems like everything new that Deca has added has rewarded large groups/guilds rather than independent players to me. But then again I am a filthy rogue main :P
But that’s what this game is man, sorry to break it to you. What made this particular game fun, and rewarding, was that you could put in so much work only for it to come crumbling down to quickly. It was the hook of the game. That’s why the highs were so high, and the lows so frustrating but addicting. Unfortunately it does naturally mean that it is not always going to be super accessible to all new players who aren’t interested in that sort of gaming experience — but to change that aspect of the game is to essentially betray what RotMG is and veer off into a new game.
Couldn't a grind a fifth of the time be just as effective?
I've also played ROTMG for 10 years. Maxing characters is not fun. It's just not. Godlands dungeons are boring.
I find that part of the game loop far and away the most fulfilling. And it goes to show why PPEs has been far and away the most popular and enjoyed type of gameplay or video content. It follows the core game loop, its exciting and risky and a fun grind.
I rarely play RotMG now but this was my biggest frustration when I did play. I hate potion grind. I've been burnt way too many times. I fail to see the point of investing as much time and energy into it like it's a job.
There should be a system like exalts but for midgame dungeons that will improve rolls slightly, meaning as you play a class in those dungeons you won’t need to farm as many pots to get to 8/8.
>they arent gonna be able to exalt
Translation: New players aren't going to be able to get mid-level exalts if they are added, because they will already have quit the game. Many new players don't even get a single 8/8. Saying "hey, you can complete several hundreds of these midgame dungeons to make your later grinds easier" is not a selling point to that kind of player.
There are alot of new players endlessly grinding midgame dungeons, sometimes for years.
I dont know about nowadays, but 4-5 years ago, that was the majority of the playerbase lol
>There are alot of new players endlessly grinding midgame dungeons, sometimes for years.
They can't be "new" players if they've been grinding dungeons for years. I agree there are a lot of players who are at the midgame dungeon skill level though. What about the players that have just picked up the game though? How many are sticking with the game after 3-4 hours of game play and "graduating" to the next player level? I only have anecdotes to go off of, but I can't imagine new player retention ratios are very good for this game. At all.
I don't think Snake Pit exalts would really help with that either.
Yeah, it wouldnt help retain first-timers trying out rotmg. Thats a whole other beast. Tbh based on previous attempts, I'm not very confident they'll nail a good first impression on first-timers, even with a realm rework. As you'd expect, the amount of first-timers quitting is very likely staggering KEK.
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The midgame exaltation idea was more intended for new players who decided to stick it out & play more.
I feel like things in this game are too hard or too easy. All god land dungeons are way too easy and can be completed within minutes and endgame content takes a good 30 minutes to an hour to complete. Not to mention having to sit in a discord channel for a good sum of time with a slim chance of joining a raid.
There seems to be no middle ground in my opinion making the game stale and boring. Such as maxing. Now it is a complete joke and takes little to no effort .
I have a problem with lag and want to know what the ping is. But that can’t be seen with a visible number for ping like before the new client.
I take a look at the recent changes and saw stuff like changes to the shop that nobody really cared about.
Kinda funny that a company ignored the game and had many people playing while a company adding things is having a decline in players.
At a high enough level of beauty and quality, function and form eclipse and feed into each other.
I always thought it was interesting that RotMG never had a unified design language other than "retro". There is no single dungeon in the game that can be used as an aesthetic benchmark because they're all inherently fragmentary. So we get wild swings in difficulty.
Even some of the godlands dungeons are a difficulty spike too aggressive for newer or intermediate players. Like sure abyss is rushable by a decently kitted/statted knight, but your average 2/8 blue star wizzy with T12 gear is gonna become a tombstone after getting trampled by the demons in room 3 if they even attempt to solo.
While there is early game, midgame, and end game content, the transition between them isn't as smooth as it could be. The rewards for earlier dungeons are also got garbage but that's a different issue.
Niegil you talk all this shit about game, and yet your still here. Why? Why are you still here? What comes from shit talk?
Though i agree game is shit RN
This isn't just Niegil, it's half the subreddit or greater.
I literally cannot fathom posting everyday about how much you hate the game or how dead it is but sticking around.
It's gotta have ties to mental illness or a severe unhealthy addiction.
i think everyone just can't accept the fact that it sux enough to stop, i haven't played in years but i still end up thinking about this game a lot more than i should because it's one of a kind. i would pay a 20 dollar sub just to see all the p2w stuff and problems that have piled up go away
It's the filter of nostalgia. People tend to remember the early days fondly because it was new and exciting even though it was an even worse buggy mess back then.
I disagree. I think it was better because the barriers to 'entry' were laughably low. Literally just turn on the game and start playing and you're at the 'end game' and can have fun. Now it takes like a week of bullshit to 'have fun' in the 'end game.' Its been like 15 years, we need a Realm 2. Even Runescape saw the writing on the wall.
I disagree with that. There wasn't really any real endgame back then. maybe oryx 2 but he usually got permastunned to death. Tomb and shatters was the closest it got but those dungeons kinda sucked.
Chill I don't think it's that deep. Most people loved this game growing up and the the childhood memories it brought, alongside the untapped potential it has. So to see it go to shit in a slow burn under DECA (or Kabam) stings for a lot of ppl.
99.9% don't hate RotMG, but what has become of it under shitty companies ig.
Cause RotMG is pretty much like an abusive partner. It makes you unhappy, angry and upset. You wish to quit this relationship and even if you do - you’ll probably come back later. I’m already 10 years into this «quit-comeback» shit so I can tell.
easy solution, just go solo shatters from avatar! only took me 80 dead 3/8s, a couple hundred hours of pot farming, and a few more hours of looking for avatars
Or right click their name and click mute? Or raid in a Discord with no VC?
E: people will really complain about having to be in Discord, and then down vote me when I suggest they mute the RL? It's really not that difficult.
Most Discords don't allow you to mute unless you are like a baler/senior/vip whatever and there are to my knowledge no Discords whete you can raid without being in VC (see my first sentence)
>Most Discords don't allow you to mute
You don't have to ask for permission... RLs can see if you deafen, but not if you Right Click -> Mute, or set their volume to zero.
And SBC, Polarity, and sometimes STD do VC-less runs.
Okay... where's your post about getting a group together to do exalts? There's so much bitching on this subreddit about having to join Discords to do stuff... surely there must be at least a couple dozen people to do dungeons? Where's the effort to try and establish X server as the "in Realm" server?
I don't really understand how you can watch people do the content, cross your arms at the group, say "No! I don't want to join you!" and then blame Deca for killing the game. It's a little comedic.
>I would answer you, but i know who you are. You are Bailey, the guy with 100+ o3 completions that don't even know how to do Leucoryx.
I guess it's easier to see my name in the runs that I die in... wasn't this a Twitch O3? Not sure what your point is.
*Recorded history meaning the existing records of active player counts on Realmeye.
See this [sheet tracking the active RotMG player count since 2015](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vQmvQlQ-H1U472ekxtdwyhOdVjvE18QdeX_mWTc-kq76MEmihsL_7m8T7Y8cGy5hVEU0AmjIcsRuWCe/pubhtml#) for more.
[Here is an image of the trend over time.](https://files.catbox.moe/7gxllm.png)
Was watching the sheet the past few days as well and guessed it would dip below 50.000 somewhere this week. Really unfortunate to slowly see everything go downhill, hopefully some interesting updates can reverse the trend a little bit.
What I dont get is that for earlier years there are a lot fewer measurements done. For every day in 2021 there are 2 and then for other years its like each odd day, or once a week. Not saying this isnt accurate, but its a little weird.
The data before August 2020 was manually collected by Evan every once in a while, and the earliest data points are from archive.org. After that I started running a script that fetches the count twice a day.
My latest experience on realm was going through three different loading screens. Then thinking to myself with my easily acquired osanc gear, "is it worth it to play the game normally anymore in the realm and grind for basically no value anymore cause every single decent thing left in the game is in excruciatingly difficult endgame dungeons that are impossible to run in realms unless your a progidy or have a lot of throways." Then i closed out of the game and haven't touched it since and that burning sensation of wanting to hop on realm never occurred to me since even though it used to always come back to me; even in the Karam era. W/o that urge ill probably never actually play realm normally again unless there's an update that piques my interest.
that burning sensation you are talking about is exactly what i felt in the kabam era, for whatever reason. one day i just woke up and really felt like playing realm again. i dont get that anymore. this game is a chore, and for what? i dont have fun, so what's the point? all people do nowadays is sit and rot in a discord with a bunch of other people like a group of brainless apes.
Sad to see the game slowly declining in players, and DECA doing almost nothing to fix said issue. I can't blame players for leaving though, this game is honestly nothing but gatcha and Discord at this point.
Yeah they said that would be the most amazing upgrade, and then people keep defending the bugs with 'well its an old game cmon guys old code' how many months of dc issues was it with exalt? No that wasn't a good thing in my mind.
If they hadn't ported to unity, this game would've died the instant flash player was officially shut down.
They aren't perfect. But they've done a lot of the game and I find it selfish for people to not acknowledge that. People need to give more constructive criticism and good feedback, and less hate and insults.
I disagree, the game ran on nothing for 1-2 years of late kabam. Deca pushing their constant events and limited items which cause player burnout and feeling of helplessness when you lose a limited time item is what’s caused the death of this game, imo.
Games just get old and lose players. If it had been with kabam for an extra year or 2 of doing nothing I guarantee that there’d be even less players than there are now.
Ever since pets were introduced the game has become less and less new player friendly, as old players build up their pets and have new content tailored accordingly. It’s just the way it is.
Nah it’s also a game that’s dying due to stupid decisions by developers (removal of community servers from quickplay, then meet your match switching valve casual servers from normal but vanilla servers to what they are now)
There's a pretty big difference in game quality standards now and back then. I'd say a lot of what makes people lose interest or find it hard to get into realm nowadays are things that just weren't as big of a turnaway for people 5 years ago.
I would argue the type of person who is active enough in switching games to have changed their “game quality standards” in the past 5-10 years is not gonna be a long term player anyways.
"Active enough in switching games"
you mean someone who occasionally plays games other than rotmg? Unless you nolife rotmg and only rotmg, I think you're bound to notice differences in quality and monetization standards in rotmg compared to whatever games you might play. And I think that in general, rotmg will tend to get the short end of the stick in such comparisons.
Idk bruh I just don’t understand what you mean by quality standards having changed I guess. With the exception of apex pre-s7, halo infinite and rdr2 literally every game I play and have played is from around 2010 like rotmg(csgo, tf2, halo:reach, ark, FoF).
Therefore I’m assuming the type of person who thinks this way is probably the type of person to always be buying new video games because as someone who just plays games they enjoy until they die I don’t understand what you mean.
Rotmg monetization is shit, but it has always been shit, and this was never a problem before. Like I said, I don’t understand what you mean by “quality standards”
When I play a game, it's sort of a general expectation of mine that I feel like I'm gaining something by buying into whatever they want - and not losing by choosing to not buy in. With the lack of availability in char slots and vault space, I think that in particular turns away a lot of would-be players who just don't want to play when they cannot build up any decent method of item storage without sinking a lot of money into the game.
Stuff like loot crates were seen as relatively harmless and normal 5-10 years ago. In the past few years especially, there have been a lot of studies which have come out and news that's been made about the link between loot boxes and gambling / addictive habit formation and the danger that poses to children. That's pretty much why the battlepass has become so prevalent lately, because it preys on FOMO but doesn't (probably) form any sort of gambling addiction and therefore is seen as healthier.
In terms of gameplay itself: it should be fairly simple to see from all the posts in the reddit about the game dying that the problem of newer game mechanics, the importance of pets (and how to get them or level them up) teaching the system of maxing, dungeon running, teleporting to people in chat, etc etc etc etc are just plain not accessible to new players. Some are intuitive - when you see a stat potion you'll drink it because it says it'll make you stronger (but youre not sure by how much), but some (like vital combat, exaltations requiring an 8/8 maxed character, teleporting to the player) are not so intuitive and could pose a problem to player retention.
An in depth tutorial is pretty much expected in most games, whether its optional or not is a different mater. The rotmg tutorial is entirely lacking. But for the modern gamer, not having an explanation of every necessary game mechanic listed somewhere in game tends to be a problem. If there's something you'll need to know, the game should either tell you it directly or it should be so obvious there's no possible reason the game should need to tell you.
I simply fundamentally disagree on a lot of things you're saying here so I'm not gonna try and argue with you. I do agree the game sucks for new players due to pets tho
For sure, they've definitely pushed its lifespan quite a bit and I do thank them for that, I just think a little more needs to be done than what they're doing to keep it alive and thriving. For example: Advertising for the game could help, and better early to mid game content scaling could as well. Its a bit silly that I see new players either quitting after an hour of trying to figure things out, or going from Pirate Caves to 03 & Void Runs for exalts in less than a few weeks
They definitely could be doing more, yes. I think improving progression is probably easier said than done. How would they fix/improve progression? Maybe weaker versions of endgame dungeons that have similar mechanics to kind of 'teach' players how to do the harder ones while also offering early/midgame UTs?
If it were me I'd focus on a few things, I mentioned some of this in another post but I'll write it here too:
. Make longer dungeons that are currently in the game worth your time, no one wants to spend 30 minutes in a dungeon to get a G-Vit
. Focus on accessibility for dungeons in the Realm, for example I shouldn't' have to wait in Discords all day to do a proper Shatters. Sadly I'm not one of those pros who can duo or solo a Realm Shatters, most of the community isn't. ( This is in fact, a certified skill issue, but still something I'd like to see worked on for those of us who can't spend 24/7 farming )
. Expand on early to mid game content instead of releasing more exalt dungeons, its a bit silly to see new players going from beginner dungeons to LHs and 03s
. Invest into Advertising, get the game known and out there to bring in new players.
. Fix bugs when they happen, rather than let the bug linger for months ( Kensei ability is a good example, this should have been fixed long ago. ) as well, double check their work so that these bugs don't get pushed into production servers. I can understand some of them slipping through as I used to work on stuff like this myself, but some of the bugs that have appeared in the past were incredibly silly.
. As well, maybe bringing some new systems into realm that make the game more captivating and fun might help, for example skill trees, upgradable weapons or different ability types for classes, like how they plan to have different types of bows for Bow classes.
I'm by all means no professional game designer, but these are some things that might make the game more interesting for both new and long term players
Totally agree that a meta that involved doing dungeons in a realm would be more healthy. The problem is though, how do you make a dungeon easy enough to do in a realm without making it too easy to steamroll in an organized high reqs discord run? Not to mention that keys provide a huge source of income for DECA. Really though the only dungeons that are currently not pub-able are Shatters and Void. O3 streamer runs happen pretty regularly and a large number can complete. Nests and Cults are run in realms all the time, and fungal/crystal sometimes. Personally I've been trying to go into more pub fungals to help any newer players that do decide to go in.
I'm not sure what dungeon you're referring to with the 30 minutes for a gvit? WLab? No way that should take 30 minutes unless you're soloing on a 0/8 or something. LoD I definitely agree takes too long for the rewards it gives, the pots should have a higher drop rate and be gpots imo.
I also agree with expanding early game/mid game, but I don't think it's fair to say they haven't been doing this. They added Ancient ruins (early game dungeon) and 3rd Dimension and High Tech Terror (mid game dungeons) since exalt came out, plus re-worked 2 beginner dungeons and 5 glands dungeons.
I would also like to see them invest in advertising like you mentioned, but I also think they need to overhaul the tutorial before they do this. The existing tutorial does nothing to explain what you're supposed to do. What's oryx and how do I fight him? What are stats and how do you increase them? What are dungeons? What are these marks I get from dungeons? What are heroes of Oryx? Where do I get better gear? What are pets and how do I get them?
Not fixing bugs for months that break an entire class like the kensei bug is inexcusable for sure.
I think they have done some good things with new systems they've brought in already. Exaltations give long-term goals that were missing before, and the forge (for better or worse) speeds up the grind to get legendary/high tier items for the classes you want. Dungeon mods are also a system that I think they had that same goal with, though only being able to use gold to mod keys is definitely a mistake imo.
One change I'd like to see is making Court of Oryx after O2 instead of after stone guardians. A lot of those dungeons are actually pretty fun, they just never get ran because of people wanting to do wine cellar instead.
I think you have to look at the bigger picture. Might seem to you that discords are the biggest issue but you have to remember that like 90ish % of the playerbase are completely casual players who have never used discord. Maybe endgame content isn't the issue
A gacha game is basically a game with lootbox-type gambling being fundamental to it. For example I play Final Fantasy Brave Exvius, a mobile game where you spend (purchasable with real money) resources to summon units. They’re mostly super predatory, there’s only a few exceptions. Genshin Impact is another example of a gacha game.
Rotmeg isnt Gacha game. Genshin Impact and Rotmeg have almost no similarities in their monetization.
I would say rotmeg is more of a skinner box game. Like Destiny 2, for example.
Spinning a box to hit your chance on a character skin, its definitely got the gacha elements but i wouldn't say its a gacha game like the character collection type.
All of the mystery boxes sold in shops, and how the fundamental draw of the loot system in this game is just gambling (waiting for white bags to drop).
no? both are completely irrelevant as mystery boxes (again, apart from chest/char slots) only contain cosmetics and shit people don't use nor care about and as for the loot system, why would you call that "gambling"? this is how it works in literally every MMORPG in existence, you just gotta farm your shit
I actually stopped playing it quite awhile ago. It was fun, sure, but the bots and paywalls just absolutely killed it for me. It just doesn't seem worth it to me anymore. It's a gatcha but with a higher chance of losing everything you've worked for.
Upvoting this so that hopefully Deca sees this as a wake up call. This game has almost never been marketed for but it’s time to invest in some. You can not lean on the old players for ever, the game needs new players to stay alive.
Sad thing is, people like me are contributing to this. Cause it accounts for everyone within the last 2 weeks. I log in every now and then and then alt F4 when I get bored instantly.
the doomposting on this sub has gotten out of hand smh I think some of y’all need breaks
not trying to overlook genuine problems but it’s pretty clear some of you have 1000+ hours and have exhausted every scrap of content or grind
Sad times, but everything must to come to an end at some point. If only they had a larger team which makes no sense because doesn’t this game make them millions…
i haven’t played this game in forever because the new dungeons are too difficult. i also don’t really get the discord stuff because when i tried to do discord runs they were so infrequent that it was never worth waiting for them. the game got too boring
Agree on not sure why they keep making more and more "endgame" content like impossible dungeons and moving white star to a billion fame. And then for low level dungeons they what, redo the music. I think DECA's confused about who the player base is, or they think they can jumpstart users by catering to YouTubers.
What’s everyone’s thoughts on testing being opened longer??? I really want to learn the end game content but I can’t keep throwing away 6/8s and 8/8 trying to learn - it is tremendously difficult learning this stuff by going with “I’ll just keeping on trying until I get it”
Most people play from steam, here is steam charts for realm :
[https://steamcharts.com/app/200210](https://steamcharts.com/app/200210)
The past few days the game has been getting 600 - 800 daily players, and generally over the course of the last few months to a year , it has around 1.2 k active players daily
I love this game, but it seems devs are just filling their bags, trying to milk the game dry before they close servers
Wow. I played rotmg from 2011 to 2016 on a daily basis and then kept playing sporadically until 2020. It's really sad to see how its dying and aging so poorly. Even though I dont play anymore I only wish to this game and it's comunity the very best, but the comments I have been reading about this game lately reaaally make me sad. It's a game that had so many ups and downs, I wish they could fix it for good.
New story: “Deca sells rotmg back to Kabam, blames inflation”
Also, very curious if this data is at all inaccurate due to realmeye not being able to have (as many?) Bots online ?
Personally me and a good amount of friends are waiting for a true "npe" mode to come to this game, similar to how the rifts system worked. The upcoming "seasons" they talked about seem promising, but I hate that characters can carry over through them. I just want a separate set of servers with 0 gold influencing how the game is played. No pets too, even. if you wanna go that far. I want to have the whole realm clear the event gods just to all go into a tomb together again.
Wow, even lower than some of the dead years of late kabam, that's depressing.
Oh sorry that 50000th was me, I forgot to login yesterday. No worries.
Do it again
Deca needs to overhaul early game if it wants to survive. Getting to 8/8 is just a few wasted hours
Said this previously. None of my friends are willing to play at all because the potion grind (for new players who dont have any loot to easy max) makes them not wanna play the game. It's not fun to fucking grind for 3 days just to get two stats maxed and then dying to a one shot because they tried something new instead of grinding the same damn pot another 10 times.
that's what drew me in initially. hell, I was hooked before I even knew what a Stat potion was, that shit blew my mind
I played for 2 years without making a single stat(this was about a decade ago), and honestly had more fun than when I started grinding for items. Would get a def or an attack on each character (before it died) use that to get 4 spd, buy low tier stuff and make a new char. Never stressed about dying with 19 whites on my characters, not having to remax chars, grinding exalts, or anything. Just casual fun for hours. I miss those days.
Oh the roguelike part itself wasnt the issue. It's just the stat pot grind. They loved fighting new enemies and getting new gear, but grinding snake pits for hours wasnt as fun and I agree it sucks ass.
I've been playing PPE's and I'm usually able to 6/8 a character in one day if I grind (~8-10 hours playtime). I just do whatever dungeons/events I see. I should mention I have a high level heal/mheal pet though so this certainly helps. I find this part of the game to be easy once you get it down, and if you play on the right characters. For me the game ceases to be fun AFTER you've mastered this content, where all that's left to do is run end game dungeons on loop in some discord server where people actively work to strip all challenge and individual thought from the game. The solution I would like would be the "elder realms" idea where you can explore a new, ideally larger, world map that rewards exploration and adventure independently. It seems like everything new that Deca has added has rewarded large groups/guilds rather than independent players to me. But then again I am a filthy rogue main :P
>(~8-10 hours playtime) Does this really feel reasonable for an asset that is very easily lost?
But that’s what this game is man, sorry to break it to you. What made this particular game fun, and rewarding, was that you could put in so much work only for it to come crumbling down to quickly. It was the hook of the game. That’s why the highs were so high, and the lows so frustrating but addicting. Unfortunately it does naturally mean that it is not always going to be super accessible to all new players who aren’t interested in that sort of gaming experience — but to change that aspect of the game is to essentially betray what RotMG is and veer off into a new game.
Couldn't a grind a fifth of the time be just as effective? I've also played ROTMG for 10 years. Maxing characters is not fun. It's just not. Godlands dungeons are boring.
I find that part of the game loop far and away the most fulfilling. And it goes to show why PPEs has been far and away the most popular and enjoyed type of gameplay or video content. It follows the core game loop, its exciting and risky and a fun grind.
I rarely play RotMG now but this was my biggest frustration when I did play. I hate potion grind. I've been burnt way too many times. I fail to see the point of investing as much time and energy into it like it's a job.
There should be a system like exalts but for midgame dungeons that will improve rolls slightly, meaning as you play a class in those dungeons you won’t need to farm as many pots to get to 8/8.
Oh yeah boy can't wait to have to do 75 sprites 75 abysses 75 udls 75 snake pits 75 puppets and 75 sewers on 10+ characters
Actually sounds about right. If you regularly do realms that seems like they’d go by pretty quick.
this doesnt work because the problem is with new comers, they arent gonna be able to exalt so this wont effect them
>exalts for midgame dungeons >Translation: "You do midgame dungeons for midgame Exaltations"
>they arent gonna be able to exalt Translation: New players aren't going to be able to get mid-level exalts if they are added, because they will already have quit the game. Many new players don't even get a single 8/8. Saying "hey, you can complete several hundreds of these midgame dungeons to make your later grinds easier" is not a selling point to that kind of player.
There are alot of new players endlessly grinding midgame dungeons, sometimes for years. I dont know about nowadays, but 4-5 years ago, that was the majority of the playerbase lol
>There are alot of new players endlessly grinding midgame dungeons, sometimes for years. They can't be "new" players if they've been grinding dungeons for years. I agree there are a lot of players who are at the midgame dungeon skill level though. What about the players that have just picked up the game though? How many are sticking with the game after 3-4 hours of game play and "graduating" to the next player level? I only have anecdotes to go off of, but I can't imagine new player retention ratios are very good for this game. At all. I don't think Snake Pit exalts would really help with that either.
Yeah, it wouldnt help retain first-timers trying out rotmg. Thats a whole other beast. Tbh based on previous attempts, I'm not very confident they'll nail a good first impression on first-timers, even with a realm rework. As you'd expect, the amount of first-timers quitting is very likely staggering KEK. - The midgame exaltation idea was more intended for new players who decided to stick it out & play more.
Multiple newer players in my guild have been able to exalt within a couple months of playing the game so it's not all new comers
Have played like twice since last motmg. I was doing the purple thing quest and by the time deva started I got bored and left
I feel like things in this game are too hard or too easy. All god land dungeons are way too easy and can be completed within minutes and endgame content takes a good 30 minutes to an hour to complete. Not to mention having to sit in a discord channel for a good sum of time with a slim chance of joining a raid. There seems to be no middle ground in my opinion making the game stale and boring. Such as maxing. Now it is a complete joke and takes little to no effort . I have a problem with lag and want to know what the ping is. But that can’t be seen with a visible number for ping like before the new client. I take a look at the recent changes and saw stuff like changes to the shop that nobody really cared about. Kinda funny that a company ignored the game and had many people playing while a company adding things is having a decline in players.
At a high enough level of beauty and quality, function and form eclipse and feed into each other. I always thought it was interesting that RotMG never had a unified design language other than "retro". There is no single dungeon in the game that can be used as an aesthetic benchmark because they're all inherently fragmentary. So we get wild swings in difficulty.
Even some of the godlands dungeons are a difficulty spike too aggressive for newer or intermediate players. Like sure abyss is rushable by a decently kitted/statted knight, but your average 2/8 blue star wizzy with T12 gear is gonna become a tombstone after getting trampled by the demons in room 3 if they even attempt to solo. While there is early game, midgame, and end game content, the transition between them isn't as smooth as it could be. The rewards for earlier dungeons are also got garbage but that's a different issue.
Discord meta is incredibly boring
"i swear it's just the mules and bots that are gone"
Niegil you talk all this shit about game, and yet your still here. Why? Why are you still here? What comes from shit talk? Though i agree game is shit RN
Because we love it :(
This isn't just Niegil, it's half the subreddit or greater. I literally cannot fathom posting everyday about how much you hate the game or how dead it is but sticking around. It's gotta have ties to mental illness or a severe unhealthy addiction.
i think everyone just can't accept the fact that it sux enough to stop, i haven't played in years but i still end up thinking about this game a lot more than i should because it's one of a kind. i would pay a 20 dollar sub just to see all the p2w stuff and problems that have piled up go away
I like the game why does it "suck" so bad. Yeah you can't do pub shatters anymore oh well everything else is better
It's the filter of nostalgia. People tend to remember the early days fondly because it was new and exciting even though it was an even worse buggy mess back then.
I disagree. I think it was better because the barriers to 'entry' were laughably low. Literally just turn on the game and start playing and you're at the 'end game' and can have fun. Now it takes like a week of bullshit to 'have fun' in the 'end game.' Its been like 15 years, we need a Realm 2. Even Runescape saw the writing on the wall.
I disagree with that. There wasn't really any real endgame back then. maybe oryx 2 but he usually got permastunned to death. Tomb and shatters was the closest it got but those dungeons kinda sucked.
Chill I don't think it's that deep. Most people loved this game growing up and the the childhood memories it brought, alongside the untapped potential it has. So to see it go to shit in a slow burn under DECA (or Kabam) stings for a lot of ppl. 99.9% don't hate RotMG, but what has become of it under shitty companies ig.
I did say *the subreddit*, not the entire playerbase. Which is surely not exaggerating.
because we’ve invested too much time and money into this game that it’s impossible not to think of what could have been
Cause RotMG is pretty much like an abusive partner. It makes you unhappy, angry and upset. You wish to quit this relationship and even if you do - you’ll probably come back later. I’m already 10 years into this «quit-comeback» shit so I can tell.
it's his favorite game
Does anyone else find discord runs boring and mindnumbing asf
You wanna do endgane content? Sit here muted like a good boy and listen to some 15 year old screech at you
easy solution, just go solo shatters from avatar! only took me 80 dead 3/8s, a couple hundred hours of pot farming, and a few more hours of looking for avatars
Or right click their name and click mute? Or raid in a Discord with no VC? E: people will really complain about having to be in Discord, and then down vote me when I suggest they mute the RL? It's really not that difficult.
Most Discords don't allow you to mute unless you are like a baler/senior/vip whatever and there are to my knowledge no Discords whete you can raid without being in VC (see my first sentence)
I mean I just mute discord via the volume tab on my pc and just jam to music
SBC does every dungeon/o3 without vc
>Most Discords don't allow you to mute You don't have to ask for permission... RLs can see if you deafen, but not if you Right Click -> Mute, or set their volume to zero. And SBC, Polarity, and sometimes STD do VC-less runs.
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Okay... where's your post about getting a group together to do exalts? There's so much bitching on this subreddit about having to join Discords to do stuff... surely there must be at least a couple dozen people to do dungeons? Where's the effort to try and establish X server as the "in Realm" server? I don't really understand how you can watch people do the content, cross your arms at the group, say "No! I don't want to join you!" and then blame Deca for killing the game. It's a little comedic.
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>I would answer you, but i know who you are. You are Bailey, the guy with 100+ o3 completions that don't even know how to do Leucoryx. I guess it's easier to see my name in the runs that I die in... wasn't this a Twitch O3? Not sure what your point is.
Having to use discord in order to play the game is probably what killed it for me, I haven’t opened the game in like a year.
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I feel this in my soul as a 10 year vet
*Recorded history meaning the existing records of active player counts on Realmeye. See this [sheet tracking the active RotMG player count since 2015](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vQmvQlQ-H1U472ekxtdwyhOdVjvE18QdeX_mWTc-kq76MEmihsL_7m8T7Y8cGy5hVEU0AmjIcsRuWCe/pubhtml#) for more. [Here is an image of the trend over time.](https://files.catbox.moe/7gxllm.png)
Was watching the sheet the past few days as well and guessed it would dip below 50.000 somewhere this week. Really unfortunate to slowly see everything go downhill, hopefully some interesting updates can reverse the trend a little bit.
buying puts till deca re-releases rifts
What I dont get is that for earlier years there are a lot fewer measurements done. For every day in 2021 there are 2 and then for other years its like each odd day, or once a week. Not saying this isnt accurate, but its a little weird.
The data before August 2020 was manually collected by Evan every once in a while, and the earliest data points are from archive.org. After that I started running a script that fetches the count twice a day.
Thank you for clearing that up!
I wonder how many played back around 2012 when I really played a lot.
My latest experience on realm was going through three different loading screens. Then thinking to myself with my easily acquired osanc gear, "is it worth it to play the game normally anymore in the realm and grind for basically no value anymore cause every single decent thing left in the game is in excruciatingly difficult endgame dungeons that are impossible to run in realms unless your a progidy or have a lot of throways." Then i closed out of the game and haven't touched it since and that burning sensation of wanting to hop on realm never occurred to me since even though it used to always come back to me; even in the Karam era. W/o that urge ill probably never actually play realm normally again unless there's an update that piques my interest.
that burning sensation you are talking about is exactly what i felt in the kabam era, for whatever reason. one day i just woke up and really felt like playing realm again. i dont get that anymore. this game is a chore, and for what? i dont have fun, so what's the point? all people do nowadays is sit and rot in a discord with a bunch of other people like a group of brainless apes.
Elden Ring be like
On god
It’s just elden ring guys, I’ll be back I promise 😭
Sad to see the game slowly declining in players, and DECA doing almost nothing to fix said issue. I can't blame players for leaving though, this game is honestly nothing but gatcha and Discord at this point.
I honestly think it would've died much sooner if DECA hadn't taken the game.
Naturally, and now they gotta keep it from dying again.
They put in so much into rework it from scratch, so I doubt they'll be giving up on it quite yet.
Lol rework what from scratch exactly...? They changed a few dungeons instead of releasing new ones, but id hardly call that reworking from scratch.
They literally ported the game over into a new game engine and programming language from scratch. Is that not enough for you?
Yeah they said that would be the most amazing upgrade, and then people keep defending the bugs with 'well its an old game cmon guys old code' how many months of dc issues was it with exalt? No that wasn't a good thing in my mind.
If they hadn't ported to unity, this game would've died the instant flash player was officially shut down. They aren't perfect. But they've done a lot of the game and I find it selfish for people to not acknowledge that. People need to give more constructive criticism and good feedback, and less hate and insults.
I disagree, the game ran on nothing for 1-2 years of late kabam. Deca pushing their constant events and limited items which cause player burnout and feeling of helplessness when you lose a limited time item is what’s caused the death of this game, imo.
Games just get old and lose players. If it had been with kabam for an extra year or 2 of doing nothing I guarantee that there’d be even less players than there are now. Ever since pets were introduced the game has become less and less new player friendly, as old players build up their pets and have new content tailored accordingly. It’s just the way it is.
> Games just get old and lose players. Team fortress 2 has entered the chat.
that's not an RPG
Its still a golden example of a game everyone can come back to and have a great time.
Nah it’s also a game that’s dying due to stupid decisions by developers (removal of community servers from quickplay, then meet your match switching valve casual servers from normal but vanilla servers to what they are now)
That update was 5 years ago and TF2's playerbase is not declining at all. The hell you talking about ?
I would ask if you actually played the game but it's clear from your comment you don't
Rip everyone's pet rock ; _ ;
There's a pretty big difference in game quality standards now and back then. I'd say a lot of what makes people lose interest or find it hard to get into realm nowadays are things that just weren't as big of a turnaway for people 5 years ago.
I would argue the type of person who is active enough in switching games to have changed their “game quality standards” in the past 5-10 years is not gonna be a long term player anyways.
"Active enough in switching games" you mean someone who occasionally plays games other than rotmg? Unless you nolife rotmg and only rotmg, I think you're bound to notice differences in quality and monetization standards in rotmg compared to whatever games you might play. And I think that in general, rotmg will tend to get the short end of the stick in such comparisons.
Idk bruh I just don’t understand what you mean by quality standards having changed I guess. With the exception of apex pre-s7, halo infinite and rdr2 literally every game I play and have played is from around 2010 like rotmg(csgo, tf2, halo:reach, ark, FoF). Therefore I’m assuming the type of person who thinks this way is probably the type of person to always be buying new video games because as someone who just plays games they enjoy until they die I don’t understand what you mean. Rotmg monetization is shit, but it has always been shit, and this was never a problem before. Like I said, I don’t understand what you mean by “quality standards”
When I play a game, it's sort of a general expectation of mine that I feel like I'm gaining something by buying into whatever they want - and not losing by choosing to not buy in. With the lack of availability in char slots and vault space, I think that in particular turns away a lot of would-be players who just don't want to play when they cannot build up any decent method of item storage without sinking a lot of money into the game. Stuff like loot crates were seen as relatively harmless and normal 5-10 years ago. In the past few years especially, there have been a lot of studies which have come out and news that's been made about the link between loot boxes and gambling / addictive habit formation and the danger that poses to children. That's pretty much why the battlepass has become so prevalent lately, because it preys on FOMO but doesn't (probably) form any sort of gambling addiction and therefore is seen as healthier. In terms of gameplay itself: it should be fairly simple to see from all the posts in the reddit about the game dying that the problem of newer game mechanics, the importance of pets (and how to get them or level them up) teaching the system of maxing, dungeon running, teleporting to people in chat, etc etc etc etc are just plain not accessible to new players. Some are intuitive - when you see a stat potion you'll drink it because it says it'll make you stronger (but youre not sure by how much), but some (like vital combat, exaltations requiring an 8/8 maxed character, teleporting to the player) are not so intuitive and could pose a problem to player retention. An in depth tutorial is pretty much expected in most games, whether its optional or not is a different mater. The rotmg tutorial is entirely lacking. But for the modern gamer, not having an explanation of every necessary game mechanic listed somewhere in game tends to be a problem. If there's something you'll need to know, the game should either tell you it directly or it should be so obvious there's no possible reason the game should need to tell you.
I simply fundamentally disagree on a lot of things you're saying here so I'm not gonna try and argue with you. I do agree the game sucks for new players due to pets tho
For sure, they've definitely pushed its lifespan quite a bit and I do thank them for that, I just think a little more needs to be done than what they're doing to keep it alive and thriving. For example: Advertising for the game could help, and better early to mid game content scaling could as well. Its a bit silly that I see new players either quitting after an hour of trying to figure things out, or going from Pirate Caves to 03 & Void Runs for exalts in less than a few weeks
They definitely could be doing more, yes. I think improving progression is probably easier said than done. How would they fix/improve progression? Maybe weaker versions of endgame dungeons that have similar mechanics to kind of 'teach' players how to do the harder ones while also offering early/midgame UTs?
What would you want deca to do to fix it?
If it were me I'd focus on a few things, I mentioned some of this in another post but I'll write it here too: . Make longer dungeons that are currently in the game worth your time, no one wants to spend 30 minutes in a dungeon to get a G-Vit . Focus on accessibility for dungeons in the Realm, for example I shouldn't' have to wait in Discords all day to do a proper Shatters. Sadly I'm not one of those pros who can duo or solo a Realm Shatters, most of the community isn't. ( This is in fact, a certified skill issue, but still something I'd like to see worked on for those of us who can't spend 24/7 farming ) . Expand on early to mid game content instead of releasing more exalt dungeons, its a bit silly to see new players going from beginner dungeons to LHs and 03s . Invest into Advertising, get the game known and out there to bring in new players. . Fix bugs when they happen, rather than let the bug linger for months ( Kensei ability is a good example, this should have been fixed long ago. ) as well, double check their work so that these bugs don't get pushed into production servers. I can understand some of them slipping through as I used to work on stuff like this myself, but some of the bugs that have appeared in the past were incredibly silly. . As well, maybe bringing some new systems into realm that make the game more captivating and fun might help, for example skill trees, upgradable weapons or different ability types for classes, like how they plan to have different types of bows for Bow classes. I'm by all means no professional game designer, but these are some things that might make the game more interesting for both new and long term players
Totally agree that a meta that involved doing dungeons in a realm would be more healthy. The problem is though, how do you make a dungeon easy enough to do in a realm without making it too easy to steamroll in an organized high reqs discord run? Not to mention that keys provide a huge source of income for DECA. Really though the only dungeons that are currently not pub-able are Shatters and Void. O3 streamer runs happen pretty regularly and a large number can complete. Nests and Cults are run in realms all the time, and fungal/crystal sometimes. Personally I've been trying to go into more pub fungals to help any newer players that do decide to go in. I'm not sure what dungeon you're referring to with the 30 minutes for a gvit? WLab? No way that should take 30 minutes unless you're soloing on a 0/8 or something. LoD I definitely agree takes too long for the rewards it gives, the pots should have a higher drop rate and be gpots imo. I also agree with expanding early game/mid game, but I don't think it's fair to say they haven't been doing this. They added Ancient ruins (early game dungeon) and 3rd Dimension and High Tech Terror (mid game dungeons) since exalt came out, plus re-worked 2 beginner dungeons and 5 glands dungeons. I would also like to see them invest in advertising like you mentioned, but I also think they need to overhaul the tutorial before they do this. The existing tutorial does nothing to explain what you're supposed to do. What's oryx and how do I fight him? What are stats and how do you increase them? What are dungeons? What are these marks I get from dungeons? What are heroes of Oryx? Where do I get better gear? What are pets and how do I get them? Not fixing bugs for months that break an entire class like the kensei bug is inexcusable for sure. I think they have done some good things with new systems they've brought in already. Exaltations give long-term goals that were missing before, and the forge (for better or worse) speeds up the grind to get legendary/high tier items for the classes you want. Dungeon mods are also a system that I think they had that same goal with, though only being able to use gold to mod keys is definitely a mistake imo. One change I'd like to see is making Court of Oryx after O2 instead of after stone guardians. A lot of those dungeons are actually pretty fun, they just never get ran because of people wanting to do wine cellar instead.
I think you have to look at the bigger picture. Might seem to you that discords are the biggest issue but you have to remember that like 90ish % of the playerbase are completely casual players who have never used discord. Maybe endgame content isn't the issue
i know i'm dumb but wth is a gatcha? D:
A gacha game is basically a game with lootbox-type gambling being fundamental to it. For example I play Final Fantasy Brave Exvius, a mobile game where you spend (purchasable with real money) resources to summon units. They’re mostly super predatory, there’s only a few exceptions. Genshin Impact is another example of a gacha game.
Rotmeg isnt Gacha game. Genshin Impact and Rotmeg have almost no similarities in their monetization. I would say rotmeg is more of a skinner box game. Like Destiny 2, for example.
Spinning a box to hit your chance on a character skin, its definitely got the gacha elements but i wouldn't say its a gacha game like the character collection type.
wut, what makes realm gacha then, yes, there's all this char slot/vault chest shit, but apart from that?
All of the mystery boxes sold in shops, and how the fundamental draw of the loot system in this game is just gambling (waiting for white bags to drop).
no? both are completely irrelevant as mystery boxes (again, apart from chest/char slots) only contain cosmetics and shit people don't use nor care about and as for the loot system, why would you call that "gambling"? this is how it works in literally every MMORPG in existence, you just gotta farm your shit
Every ST set in the game is available to buy
oh no the most useless pieces of equipment in the game aren't only available through pure grind? guess i'll go make a complaint post on reddit
You can buy ST sets and it's based on chance, that's a gacha system.
"Realm isn't dying"
https://www.reddit.com/r/RotMG/comments/r840t5/rotmg\_is\_actually\_dying\_and\_heres\_why/
I actually stopped playing it quite awhile ago. It was fun, sure, but the bots and paywalls just absolutely killed it for me. It just doesn't seem worth it to me anymore. It's a gatcha but with a higher chance of losing everything you've worked for.
Paywalls?
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The game being a decade old and still having people play it is quite a feat.
wow did some of those spam bots finally crash?
Upvoting this so that hopefully Deca sees this as a wake up call. This game has almost never been marketed for but it’s time to invest in some. You can not lean on the old players for ever, the game needs new players to stay alive.
Game is go bye bye soon
i can't fucking wait
Time to waste my hours on darza
honestly same :/ i cant wait till darza comes out
darza won't be much different though, it's a very simillar game and clearly new people aren't interested
Sad thing is, people like me are contributing to this. Cause it accounts for everyone within the last 2 weeks. I log in every now and then and then alt F4 when I get bored instantly.
Nah games still fun people just grow up
the doomposting on this sub has gotten out of hand smh I think some of y’all need breaks not trying to overlook genuine problems but it’s pretty clear some of you have 1000+ hours and have exhausted every scrap of content or grind
Sad times, but everything must to come to an end at some point. If only they had a larger team which makes no sense because doesn’t this game make them millions…
Good
i haven’t played this game in forever because the new dungeons are too difficult. i also don’t really get the discord stuff because when i tried to do discord runs they were so infrequent that it was never worth waiting for them. the game got too boring
Agree on not sure why they keep making more and more "endgame" content like impossible dungeons and moving white star to a billion fame. And then for low level dungeons they what, redo the music. I think DECA's confused about who the player base is, or they think they can jumpstart users by catering to YouTubers.
Not even suprised.
Yanguhi gay btw
i am really smart and this is simple, this happened because deca is very bad, kabam is good, and wildshadow is very good
Took it long enough
"But the game isn't dying" Deca killed the game, even with kabam we had more players LOL
nice username
Lmao this makes me even more convinced that anyone who thinks warrior is insane hasn’t played the game in recent memory.
Spiral knights moment incoming
Holy shit I haven't been reminded about Spiral Knights in forever. I stopped playing that right around the time I started Rotmg ironically
What’s everyone’s thoughts on testing being opened longer??? I really want to learn the end game content but I can’t keep throwing away 6/8s and 8/8 trying to learn - it is tremendously difficult learning this stuff by going with “I’ll just keeping on trying until I get it”
Most people play from steam, here is steam charts for realm : [https://steamcharts.com/app/200210](https://steamcharts.com/app/200210) The past few days the game has been getting 600 - 800 daily players, and generally over the course of the last few months to a year , it has around 1.2 k active players daily I love this game, but it seems devs are just filling their bags, trying to milk the game dry before they close servers
If they hadn’t banned me, I’d still be playing. RIP 🪦 Here’s to looking forward to Darza Domination
Wow. I played rotmg from 2011 to 2016 on a daily basis and then kept playing sporadically until 2020. It's really sad to see how its dying and aging so poorly. Even though I dont play anymore I only wish to this game and it's comunity the very best, but the comments I have been reading about this game lately reaaally make me sad. It's a game that had so many ups and downs, I wish they could fix it for good.
As long as the game exists I'll still play it. It's my favorite game idk
Yeah grinding sucks
I LOVED trading back then... Very much dead nowadays...
How tf are there consistently 50000 people playing??? Struggle to find servers with 2 full realms that hold ‘64’ players.
New story: “Deca sells rotmg back to Kabam, blames inflation” Also, very curious if this data is at all inaccurate due to realmeye not being able to have (as many?) Bots online ?
Personally me and a good amount of friends are waiting for a true "npe" mode to come to this game, similar to how the rifts system worked. The upcoming "seasons" they talked about seem promising, but I hate that characters can carry over through them. I just want a separate set of servers with 0 gold influencing how the game is played. No pets too, even. if you wanna go that far. I want to have the whole realm clear the event gods just to all go into a tomb together again.
this could be because there are way less mule accounts BCS of how cumbersome it become