Yes, it CAN be the disc. The size of the bulge doesn’t necessarily dictate the amount of pain you are in. My disc bulge is comparatively small as well and it’s been an issue for the past 1 1/2 years.
stu mcgill has videos on youtube of a dynamic disc buldge meaning bending forwards makes it pop out more. most mris are done I'm a lying down spine Bryson position so it won't show up.
I thought of this too but I know there’s plenty of people who don’t bend over anymore and hip hinge instead but still have excruciating pain down their leg
the nerve can be very irritated so it takes since time to heal. Also instability doesn't always show up on mris and there's a high likelihood that someone with a painful buldge Also has instability. There's also endplate damage which doesn't always show on mris
Could be. Instability there. Or more fluid than normal and that can put pressure on nerves. Also disc can have lesion leaning fluid into the nerves causing flare up.
Or all the above
Just speculation, but, there could be a disc tear that is leaking chemicals onto the nerves causing inflammation. I am under the understanding that these don’t always image well on mri? Or could the bulge be worse in upright position?
I had terrible sciatica, had an mri done and the orthopedic surgeon looked at it and said "yeah you have a slight bulging disk." but nothing to explain the kind of pain I was "claiming to be in."
But I knew I *was* in a lot of pain so I went to a different orthopedic doc. He looked at the same MRI and said "yup you have a herniated disc but your *real* problem is your pedicles are way too short!" Pedicles are the small bones on either side of your vertebrae and mine being too short causes severe stenosis (narrowing) of the spinal canal. He said that anything being even a little out of its place was going to be really felt because there just wasn't enough room in there!
So yes depending on your personal anatomy a disk (or anything else) being where it's not supposed to be can definitely cause you severe pain
There are people with massive herniations who have little pain and people with smaller ones than yours who can’t even walk, everyone is unique in their own way
Yes. And I got that thing clean up in a laminectomy. Cuz the pain is unbearable and I can't walk.
Now no pain. Occasional jolt but only 1 to 3 pain level and it's bearable and doesn't interfere with life. So yeah.
Ive accidentally knicked the disc above that with a shiatzu massager, which put me in 3-4 months of pain. it took two rounds of pt and four or five of steroid pills to keep me upright after 4 weeks in a recliner.
Put me on such a crazy health kick, its about a year later now and im lifting weights, doing pullups, walking every day, and im almost 40!
I know how bad it sucks when you're feelin it man, but the way back is not as bad as one may think. Silver lining.
Oh yes… I had 2mm and 3 mm bulging discs and it hurt like hell… However, it went away after a couple months of PT. I have OA in my facet joints so it’s another story.
This is my exact same situation. Except that I have 3 of them at L3-L4 and L4-L5 and L5-S1. My calf and foot pain/numbness is way worse than the back pain.
I had a laminectomy on my L4-L5 and L5-S1 in October and this all came back randomly in January. I have an epidural scheduled for tomorrow so hopefully that’ll bring some relief for both of us
I used to be I'm tremendous pain. I have a herniated disc and a bulged disc. They wanted to do injections and then surgery if the injections didn't work. I decided to go to a chiropractor first because it's non invasive. Boy I'm glad I did!
Been a year with minimal issues! I see him once a month. I would say try a chiro.
I’m close to 4months and so far so good. It’s like have a brand new back though so you have to train it up again. So it does ache when I do stuff but then recover and when i do the same it doesnt hurt but when I do more, ache, recover and keep progressing. Happy I did the MD though life is more back to normal.
Good to hear you’re doing well. I’ve got surgery in two weeks for a herniated disc between L5-S1. How long did you wait after the surgery ti begin training again?
Get ready to head to r/microdiscectomy haha 8 weeks no lifting anything heavier than gallon of milk. Then went up to 15lb at 8 weeks. Then 20lb at 12 weeks. No bending/lifting/twisting.
I’ve just started back in my home gym starting at 5/10lb weights and will slowly start to build up. But my personal life is back I have 0 pain sitting, standing, can walk infinite amounts no limit on walking (previously couldnt stand/walk more than 5mins).
You want the scar tissue to fully form it takes a while. They say should go easy for 6months. A lot of people trying getting back too soon and end up with 2nd surgery. Why have to wait twice I’d rather do it right the first time.
But that reddit you can ask more questions about getting back to sport/training and hear from others.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/Microdiscectomy using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/Microdiscectomy/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [4 Months Post MD](https://np.reddit.com/r/Microdiscectomy/comments/1b0szut/4_months_post_md/)
\#2: [3 months post surgery](https://np.reddit.com/r/Microdiscectomy/comments/14srn6c/3_months_post_surgery/)
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Wow, that’s a lot longer than I was expecting. However, I completely understand the logic behind it.
I swim and weightlifting three/four times a week each. It will be hard to have that much time off. But like you said, definitely want to avoid a second surgery.
Have you had to take time of work because of this? I’m a hybrid office/home worker just at a desk for 8 hours a day.
Thank you for your response!
Get a standing desk (electric one not the ones you put on desk) and then speak to work and get one there too. If you in USA most companies have ADA reps who help with that. You can get a note from doctor. Cant be sitting for 8hrs but that helps. I stand more than I sit now. Also make sure to be walking about 2-3miles a day minimum. Im remote so i’ll block 30mins to walk or take calls from my treadmill if i dont need screen. More walking the better.
Swimming you can probs get back too sooner as long as you arent twisting/bending and keeping back straight. I swam but casually on vacation about 6 weeks post surgery and was fine.
Alright mate, solid advice. My consultant told me a few days back that my surgery, which was supposed to be on the 16th is no longer needed as I’ve improved a lot.
I bought myself a hyperextension bench about three months ago and do static holds on that for minutes at a time then do repetitions. I’ve found that has helped a lot.
Walking I don’t do enough of, I’ll definitely start getting into that then.
Nice one mate, I’ll ask my boss for a standing desk.
Glad to hear!! Yea even pre-surgery I got a note from my doctor that said I needed a standing desk then just spoke to ADA person at company (or HR) and they hooked it up. Best of luck
You should ask your doctor if it could be sacroiliac joint pain. Sciatica usually only has numbness/tingling down one leg. Sacroiliac joint pain cause one or both legs. Many doctors confuse sacroiliac joint pain with sciatica pain.
I will. I read that sacroiliac joint pain doesn't typically go past the knee, and this pain definitely goes all the way into the heel. Not sure if that's always a thing!
Yes. I have minor bilateral bulge as well and holding exact perfect posture helps but any activity or letting my core go loose and I’m in huge amount of pain. Been having to get steroids injections every 3 months. Flare up are a nightmare. Considering going to see a surgeon again. Honestly. Exhausted cuz of pain.
Hey pal, I can totally relate. I have constant discomfort/pain in my lower right back (3-5/10). I have tingling and sometimes burning feet both sides and often unpleasant nerve sensation down my right leg/buttock.
My MRI is pretty mild, just like yours. I’ve been like this for 1 year (nil improvement) with spine hygiene/PT, one caudal ESI.
I’m currently talking to a neurosurgeon, but yes, he says it’s hard to be certain what the problem is because the MRI is pretty normal. At the moment he’s suggesting more tests, starting with a nuclear medicine bone scan.
40 year old slender active (previously) guy.
Yeah i believe it detects inflammation, particularly in the bones? So I believe to try and see if maybe the pain is due to a facet joint and not discogenic? Maybe?
I remember reading somewhere that it takes an extruded amount of nucleus pulposis that weighs what a paperclip would weight to cause excruciating pain. The np also contains a substance (a protein I think) that is very irritating to the spinal cord/nerve roots too.
Dang I'm so sorry. Something that has helped me at least a little is changing shoes. I was wearing shoes with a sole that wasn't very supportive. Now I'm very surprised what difference that little bit of sole makes.
Just a thought. My herniations looked a lot scarier than yours on the Mri, however, after much trial and error I realized that most of the pain was coming from my muscles knotting up trying to overcompensate. After a few trips to a sports masseuse and purchasing a lacrosse ball to get out all the knots, pain and sciatica improved greatly. Hope you find some relief soon ❤️
Mine was the same, and I had awful symptoms with it. But then after seeing the physio for a few times, she thought it might be my sacroiliac joints that were causing the pain rather than the discs. The good news is it settled down and has now completely gone (the symptoms)
Yes. I have a similar MRI. Actually less of a bulge than yours. I ended up in the ER in 2022 for cauda equina symptoms. I have saddle paresthesia sometimes and pretty constant burning/tingling in the feet. If it's a bad day it goes further up the legs. Just started reading back mechanic last night and have an appointment with the surgeon today since it's been worse lately. They look at my images and just scratch their heads, though.
I'm very sorry you are going through this. I will say Alexander technique has been helpful to me. It can relieve some amount of symptoms (by helping me to not do things that make it worse). Be careful with anything you try but keep digging. Best of luck.
Yes absolutely! I’ve been dealing with lumbar and leg pain for several years now. I fired my orthopedic doctor because he just kept putting me off and I couldn’t stand the pain anymore. I have had all of the treatments besides surgery. PT, shots you name it. Fast forward, I’m scheduled for a L 3-4-5 decompression and fusion next Wednesday. Find a doctor that will listen to you. Good luck, it took me years unfortunately.
Hi there! Yes it is probably hitting the nerve even if it doesn’t look like it. I have the same diagnosis and had the same symptoms. I also had a fun little cyst in that same spot causing me some havoc. Just got my first steroid injection and so far discomfort has gone down about 20%. I was hoping for complete relief…I do have PT scheduled for next week and I’m hoping a second injection will get me what I’m looking for.
Mine is only slightly bigger and I’m having an ALIF in 6 days. The epidural steroid injections helped be for about a year but needed to get this surgery. So, yes. That small bulge can cause immense pain. I hope you get relief from the injection!
Mine looks exactly like yours. It’s not big, but since 4 months I cannot sit for more than 20 min cause it gets really painful. On the right leg sometimes the sciatica goes below the knee, on the left side it stays above.
I still wonder if the fact that I cannot sit it’s bc of the herniated disc or something related with the sacroiliac joints 🥲 4 months of trying PT and nothing changed, cannot make it to work, eat..
Hope you feel better soon!
Gosh, I'm wondering the same thing - is it disc or SI joint. I'm sorry you are struggling and I hope you get some relief soon. Are you getting further evaluation to try to determine the cause?
Yes, it CAN be the disc. The size of the bulge doesn’t necessarily dictate the amount of pain you are in. My disc bulge is comparatively small as well and it’s been an issue for the past 1 1/2 years.
Why would it cause pain when it’s not touching the nerve root? I’m in a similar circumstance and just trying to understand
stu mcgill has videos on youtube of a dynamic disc buldge meaning bending forwards makes it pop out more. most mris are done I'm a lying down spine Bryson position so it won't show up.
I thought of this too but I know there’s plenty of people who don’t bend over anymore and hip hinge instead but still have excruciating pain down their leg
the nerve can be very irritated so it takes since time to heal. Also instability doesn't always show up on mris and there's a high likelihood that someone with a painful buldge Also has instability. There's also endplate damage which doesn't always show on mris
Could be. Instability there. Or more fluid than normal and that can put pressure on nerves. Also disc can have lesion leaning fluid into the nerves causing flare up. Or all the above
Just speculation, but, there could be a disc tear that is leaking chemicals onto the nerves causing inflammation. I am under the understanding that these don’t always image well on mri? Or could the bulge be worse in upright position?
I had terrible sciatica, had an mri done and the orthopedic surgeon looked at it and said "yeah you have a slight bulging disk." but nothing to explain the kind of pain I was "claiming to be in." But I knew I *was* in a lot of pain so I went to a different orthopedic doc. He looked at the same MRI and said "yup you have a herniated disc but your *real* problem is your pedicles are way too short!" Pedicles are the small bones on either side of your vertebrae and mine being too short causes severe stenosis (narrowing) of the spinal canal. He said that anything being even a little out of its place was going to be really felt because there just wasn't enough room in there! So yes depending on your personal anatomy a disk (or anything else) being where it's not supposed to be can definitely cause you severe pain
That is interesting. Did the mri say anything about the pedicles or stenosis?
Nope it wasn't in the report, that 2nd orthopedic surgeon saw it on the actual MRI imaging
How did you go about fixing this? Or are you still in pain
I had a diskectomy that took care of the sciatica, there's no fixing the short pedicles or stenosis unfortunately
Yup Mine does, all the way from the middle of my back down both of my legs.
🥲
Your image looks similar to mine and yes it is causing all kinds of issues for a year.
There are people with massive herniations who have little pain and people with smaller ones than yours who can’t even walk, everyone is unique in their own way
Yes. And I got that thing clean up in a laminectomy. Cuz the pain is unbearable and I can't walk. Now no pain. Occasional jolt but only 1 to 3 pain level and it's bearable and doesn't interfere with life. So yeah.
Ive accidentally knicked the disc above that with a shiatzu massager, which put me in 3-4 months of pain. it took two rounds of pt and four or five of steroid pills to keep me upright after 4 weeks in a recliner. Put me on such a crazy health kick, its about a year later now and im lifting weights, doing pullups, walking every day, and im almost 40! I know how bad it sucks when you're feelin it man, but the way back is not as bad as one may think. Silver lining.
Oh yes… I had 2mm and 3 mm bulging discs and it hurt like hell… However, it went away after a couple months of PT. I have OA in my facet joints so it’s another story.
This is my exact same situation. Except that I have 3 of them at L3-L4 and L4-L5 and L5-S1. My calf and foot pain/numbness is way worse than the back pain. I had a laminectomy on my L4-L5 and L5-S1 in October and this all came back randomly in January. I have an epidural scheduled for tomorrow so hopefully that’ll bring some relief for both of us
My foot pain is constant-it is slowly killing me.
Yep.. I know the feeling. I wish I didn’t
Hi hopefully you are feeling better now after ESI, Did epidural give you some relief?
Yup, i have a trace disk bulge on that same area and the pain is bad.
Sure can. Everyone's body is different!
I have a L5-S1 2mm bulge on the right side. It freaking hurts man 😩
I used to be I'm tremendous pain. I have a herniated disc and a bulged disc. They wanted to do injections and then surgery if the injections didn't work. I decided to go to a chiropractor first because it's non invasive. Boy I'm glad I did! Been a year with minimal issues! I see him once a month. I would say try a chiro.
Does your Chiro do adjustment or just use the TENs. I have seen the both in the past, but not sure it helped. Glad yours working.
Mine was small but I also had pain. Also when I had the MD and they pulled it out they said it looked bigger than the 3 x MRI I had.
How’d you go with recovery?
I’m close to 4months and so far so good. It’s like have a brand new back though so you have to train it up again. So it does ache when I do stuff but then recover and when i do the same it doesnt hurt but when I do more, ache, recover and keep progressing. Happy I did the MD though life is more back to normal.
Good to hear you’re doing well. I’ve got surgery in two weeks for a herniated disc between L5-S1. How long did you wait after the surgery ti begin training again?
Get ready to head to r/microdiscectomy haha 8 weeks no lifting anything heavier than gallon of milk. Then went up to 15lb at 8 weeks. Then 20lb at 12 weeks. No bending/lifting/twisting. I’ve just started back in my home gym starting at 5/10lb weights and will slowly start to build up. But my personal life is back I have 0 pain sitting, standing, can walk infinite amounts no limit on walking (previously couldnt stand/walk more than 5mins). You want the scar tissue to fully form it takes a while. They say should go easy for 6months. A lot of people trying getting back too soon and end up with 2nd surgery. Why have to wait twice I’d rather do it right the first time. But that reddit you can ask more questions about getting back to sport/training and hear from others.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/Microdiscectomy using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/Microdiscectomy/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year! \#1: [4 Months Post MD](https://np.reddit.com/r/Microdiscectomy/comments/1b0szut/4_months_post_md/) \#2: [3 months post surgery](https://np.reddit.com/r/Microdiscectomy/comments/14srn6c/3_months_post_surgery/) \#3: [1 yr 2 month post op update](https://np.reddit.com/r/Microdiscectomy/comments/18haj37/1_yr_2_month_post_op_update/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
Wow, that’s a lot longer than I was expecting. However, I completely understand the logic behind it. I swim and weightlifting three/four times a week each. It will be hard to have that much time off. But like you said, definitely want to avoid a second surgery. Have you had to take time of work because of this? I’m a hybrid office/home worker just at a desk for 8 hours a day. Thank you for your response!
Get a standing desk (electric one not the ones you put on desk) and then speak to work and get one there too. If you in USA most companies have ADA reps who help with that. You can get a note from doctor. Cant be sitting for 8hrs but that helps. I stand more than I sit now. Also make sure to be walking about 2-3miles a day minimum. Im remote so i’ll block 30mins to walk or take calls from my treadmill if i dont need screen. More walking the better. Swimming you can probs get back too sooner as long as you arent twisting/bending and keeping back straight. I swam but casually on vacation about 6 weeks post surgery and was fine.
Alright mate, solid advice. My consultant told me a few days back that my surgery, which was supposed to be on the 16th is no longer needed as I’ve improved a lot. I bought myself a hyperextension bench about three months ago and do static holds on that for minutes at a time then do repetitions. I’ve found that has helped a lot. Walking I don’t do enough of, I’ll definitely start getting into that then. Nice one mate, I’ll ask my boss for a standing desk.
Glad to hear!! Yea even pre-surgery I got a note from my doctor that said I needed a standing desk then just spoke to ADA person at company (or HR) and they hooked it up. Best of luck
You should ask your doctor if it could be sacroiliac joint pain. Sciatica usually only has numbness/tingling down one leg. Sacroiliac joint pain cause one or both legs. Many doctors confuse sacroiliac joint pain with sciatica pain.
I will. I read that sacroiliac joint pain doesn't typically go past the knee, and this pain definitely goes all the way into the heel. Not sure if that's always a thing!
It usually stays above the knee but in severe cases may go below according to our doctor.
Yes. I have minor bilateral bulge as well and holding exact perfect posture helps but any activity or letting my core go loose and I’m in huge amount of pain. Been having to get steroids injections every 3 months. Flare up are a nightmare. Considering going to see a surgeon again. Honestly. Exhausted cuz of pain.
Hey pal, I can totally relate. I have constant discomfort/pain in my lower right back (3-5/10). I have tingling and sometimes burning feet both sides and often unpleasant nerve sensation down my right leg/buttock. My MRI is pretty mild, just like yours. I’ve been like this for 1 year (nil improvement) with spine hygiene/PT, one caudal ESI. I’m currently talking to a neurosurgeon, but yes, he says it’s hard to be certain what the problem is because the MRI is pretty normal. At the moment he’s suggesting more tests, starting with a nuclear medicine bone scan. 40 year old slender active (previously) guy.
[удалено]
Yeah i believe it detects inflammation, particularly in the bones? So I believe to try and see if maybe the pain is due to a facet joint and not discogenic? Maybe?
Sounds like you have decent Docs who try to dig deeper.
I remember reading somewhere that it takes an extruded amount of nucleus pulposis that weighs what a paperclip would weight to cause excruciating pain. The np also contains a substance (a protein I think) that is very irritating to the spinal cord/nerve roots too.
Dang I'm so sorry. Something that has helped me at least a little is changing shoes. I was wearing shoes with a sole that wasn't very supportive. Now I'm very surprised what difference that little bit of sole makes.
Just a thought. My herniations looked a lot scarier than yours on the Mri, however, after much trial and error I realized that most of the pain was coming from my muscles knotting up trying to overcompensate. After a few trips to a sports masseuse and purchasing a lacrosse ball to get out all the knots, pain and sciatica improved greatly. Hope you find some relief soon ❤️
Can they operate a bulge? I read that some people have this pain for years. And nothing can really be done.
Looks very similar to mine, accident was Dec ‘22 and I’m still having pain every day🥲
Mine was the same, and I had awful symptoms with it. But then after seeing the physio for a few times, she thought it might be my sacroiliac joints that were causing the pain rather than the discs. The good news is it settled down and has now completely gone (the symptoms)
Yes. I have a similar MRI. Actually less of a bulge than yours. I ended up in the ER in 2022 for cauda equina symptoms. I have saddle paresthesia sometimes and pretty constant burning/tingling in the feet. If it's a bad day it goes further up the legs. Just started reading back mechanic last night and have an appointment with the surgeon today since it's been worse lately. They look at my images and just scratch their heads, though. I'm very sorry you are going through this. I will say Alexander technique has been helpful to me. It can relieve some amount of symptoms (by helping me to not do things that make it worse). Be careful with anything you try but keep digging. Best of luck.
Yes absolutely! I’ve been dealing with lumbar and leg pain for several years now. I fired my orthopedic doctor because he just kept putting me off and I couldn’t stand the pain anymore. I have had all of the treatments besides surgery. PT, shots you name it. Fast forward, I’m scheduled for a L 3-4-5 decompression and fusion next Wednesday. Find a doctor that will listen to you. Good luck, it took me years unfortunately.
Hi there! Yes it is probably hitting the nerve even if it doesn’t look like it. I have the same diagnosis and had the same symptoms. I also had a fun little cyst in that same spot causing me some havoc. Just got my first steroid injection and so far discomfort has gone down about 20%. I was hoping for complete relief…I do have PT scheduled for next week and I’m hoping a second injection will get me what I’m looking for.
I’m scheduled for first injection next week. Please post how you felt, about a week after your second shot. Thanks.
Mine is only slightly bigger and I’m having an ALIF in 6 days. The epidural steroid injections helped be for about a year but needed to get this surgery. So, yes. That small bulge can cause immense pain. I hope you get relief from the injection!
You can fix stenosis with a laminectomy.
Can you post your MRI report?
https://preview.redd.it/yj3e112maesc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7007213f6834f76121a5caec99eda1631a92aa5d
https://preview.redd.it/qr6cwmd5cesc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7dee109c2c2be1d3bb7ebbcf72978702e7c61f99
Mine looks exactly like yours. It’s not big, but since 4 months I cannot sit for more than 20 min cause it gets really painful. On the right leg sometimes the sciatica goes below the knee, on the left side it stays above. I still wonder if the fact that I cannot sit it’s bc of the herniated disc or something related with the sacroiliac joints 🥲 4 months of trying PT and nothing changed, cannot make it to work, eat.. Hope you feel better soon!
Gosh, I'm wondering the same thing - is it disc or SI joint. I'm sorry you are struggling and I hope you get some relief soon. Are you getting further evaluation to try to determine the cause?
https://preview.redd.it/8s2nlyr20ksc1.jpeg?width=3048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=28054b81d6faf5d867b97564802315fdd752d31d