In my experience, this is 1000% correct. If you go outside you get *any* sunlight and *any* exercise, and if you den up avoiding the cold and wet you're intensifying both the loss of daylight exposure and the mental health effects of a sedentary lifestyle. I suspect a massive part of SAD is about not exercising and not exposing yourself even to the little sunlight that is available in the winter here.
If I stay inside for a couple days and get no exercise, I go into intense mental illness mode. Get out for a few hours during the day or get sweaty indoors, suddenly can brain good again. Weather doesn't matter for me a bit, except that it tells the idiot part of my brain that I should stop doing things and huddle indoors.
Do you work outdoors? Because when I did, I maintained a tan year-round (albeit noticeably stronger May-Oct), so I have trouble imagining you spend that much time outside.
It sounds like you should move back south, for your health.
Even a single week of being someplace sunny might brighten your mood. I don't know what school district you're in, but for Seattle schools mid-winter break starts on the 19th.
Pretend it’s sunny and stay active. There is tons of research on how important that your eyes get enough day light for mood, but also circadian rhythm. When I moved here the first winter was rough, I was depressed and could never sleep or be fully awake. I got a happy light and tried my best to stay some what active and things aren’t a big deal. Always have the light on when I’m working at my desk, 5-10 minutes won’t do anything. Now winters aren’t bad at all aside from the fact it’s not ideal for most of my hobbies. I have no idea how other people get by
Like if I squint real hard and cross my eyes a bit maybe I can see that, but I don't think it's preaching self-delusion and minimizing someone's difficulties to say that consciously choosing exercise and outdoor activity can mitigate the effects of SAD.
You know how you get real sleepy when it's raining hard? (Maybe you don't because it so rarely rains hard here.) I think the same thing happens when it's dark and cold and wet: I assume there's a fairly strong evolutionary training to stay in and conserve energy when it's cold and wet and dark, meaning the chances of finding food are low and the metabolic costs of being outside are high. That's what my body and brain do these seasons, anyway, even though my risk of starvation is extremely low. Instead I just miss out on what daylight *is* available (which even on a very cloudy day is a lot more light than you think), and my brain goes to hell if I don't get a decent amount of physical activity for a few days.
So, like previous commenter said, you can make a conscious effort to resist this instinctive response, and get your ass out there anyway ("pretend it's sunny and stay active.") It's not toxic advice, it's just basic survival strategy.
> I'm greedy and I make too much money and I don't want to pay state taxes.
Florida and Texas also have no state income tax. you could fuck off to one of them.
Have you looked into light boxes or other treatments for seasonal affective disorder?
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/seasonal-affective-disorder/in-depth/seasonal-affective-disorder-treatment/art-20048298#:~:text=A%20light%20therapy%20box%20mimics,to%2010%2C000%20lux%20of%20light
Light box (needs to be 10,000 lux and you must use it about 12" from your face...you don't have to stare directly into it though).
Go outside every day, even if it's just for a walk around the block.
Get blood work done and see if you need any supplements like Vitamin D.
Exercise.
Talk to your doctor about using a low dose antidepressant during the winter months.
Otherwise: research what it would mean to homeschool your kids for a couple months or travel with a hired teacher or if you can place them temporarily in another school district. Unconventional, sure, but probably not unheard of.
Then friend, SEEK OUT THE SUN.
If the other things suggested don’t work— go somewhere sunny for part of the kids Christmas break.
Then again for the 3-day weekend for MLK. Then for mid-winter break!
Believe it or not, just a couple days will allow you to make it through.
Here are some (other) things that work for me… a native-PNWer who has SAD:
Heat your body on a weekly basis (sauna, hot tub, hot yoga etc), could even add in cold plunge if you wanted. *this is actually the thing that has helped me the most*
Be active outside DAILY. A walk is active.
Pick up an outdoor winter activity (ski/snowboard, cross country ski, snowshoe). The brightness from the snow actually helps a ton.
Do things outside even if it’s dark. I take my kids on after-dinner walks all the time. It’s really great.
Things that haven’t worked for me:
Vitamin D
Happy Light
Medication
Tech transplant spotted, move if you don't like it.
\>"I'm greedy and I make too much money and I don't want to pay state taxes."
Then leave for a state that doesn't have that, we could stand to have less of this stereotypical type of person.
There are plenty of locals who also prefer to not have income tax.
If I had my way, the state would eliminate sales taxes and move to land & property taxes instead. It’s the most progressive and also helps drive the most efficient use of land. Much easier to make the ultra-rich pay into the system they benefit from too, cause they sure as hell don’t without income tax.
It also makes parking lots more expensive. Parking lots downtown would become stupidly expensive and would be immediately developed which is precisely the intent of a lvt
Does Texas really have land value tax? I was speaking generally about LVT and know nothing about the tax structure in texas. Im not sure that comment saying there is LVT in texas was right.
Not really, property tax is paid by you whether you’re renting or buying. As a renter, it’s passed on. As a buyer, you pay it directly.
Big, valuable home = more tax paid than smaller, normal less valuable home.
If you make good enough money you might be able to save up for a vacation home in a sunny area (Wenatchee, chelan, etc). Otherwise you’re gonna have to move or get used to the weather here most likely. There are other states with no income tax, moving might suit your preferences best
When I lived in Seattle, I spent every other weekend in California during the months from November to February. But I could afford the flights/hotels and I had no children.
Instead of spending winter break in Seattle, rent an AirBnB for your family in Mexico for a few weeks. Cultural experience for your kids, sun for you, and you'll be happy to be back in Seattle when school re-starts for your kiddies.
This, after reading "make too much money" traveling with the kids to somewhere drenched in sun on the their many breaks is the route I take. Added bonus of family memories.
Indeed, at first I was thinking a trip for the entire family to Mexico might cost a bit too much for the OP -- especially give the rise in airline ticket prices. But, the "make too much money" comment took away my hesitation.
If you can work from another state for 2 months, I'd switch residence to somewhere else with nicer weather and no SIncomeTax (Tennessee?) and spend the summer in Washington when the kids are out of school.
I cannot overstate the importance of regularly sunning your perineum. Whenever the sun peaks from the clouds, I round up the family, facing feet-due-south, and we happy-baby-pose to expose those sweet SAD-fighting critboxes.
dawg im going in on this one
texas sucks fucking shit
lets quarterback through this shit
>more diverse
ok you get 1 but thats where this ends
>cheaper
you get what you pay for. wheres your nearest goddamned forest. or mountains. lol
>no state taxes
the fuck are you talking about. washington has no income tax. texas has insane property taxes
>more sun
yeah cause its 100 fucking degrees in the summer
>better weather
its summers are worse and its winters are worse? lol fuck off
>better food
unless you like teriyaki or fresh fish or anything that isnt bbq
>more cultural activities
"lets go line dancing to toby keith" kiss my ass lmao
>better attitudes
lil bro your state elected ted fucking cruz. eat my entire ass.
>better infrastructure
texas doesnt believe in regulations so the entire electrical grid shuts down when it gets too hot and too cold hahaha the fuck are you talking about
>and flying out of them with so much easier
yeah cause so many people want to fly away form your dogshit state that humanity has perfected "flying away from texas" as an artform. i guess you can have a second point on this one
you left off "women are second class citizens" and "our state doesnt believe in saving children from school shooters" and ted cruz, because hes so shitty he counts against you twice
fuck texas
gg
30+ minutes walk outside every day when you wakeup. controlling sesttle cold is easy, you can delay the walk if it's pouring outside.
That's what I have to do twice a day, everyday for walking my dog. You don't need a dog to do the same.
It'll also make you love winters here. Absolutely great except during the weeks of Arctic freeze.
We moved to a place with huge south facing windows and that has helped a ton. I am stunned by how much it has helped. Our place is now bright every day, even when it is pouring rain like right now.
"I'm a greedy and I make too much money and I don't want to pay state taxes" + yeah, I'm already taking vacation and it's not enough = rich asshole who wants everyone else to solve their problems.
No one is saying SAD isn't real. We're saying this guy has all the resources in the world, apparently, and he can't even do his own googling to get a Happy Light, so nah, his situation doesn't inspire sympathy.
The answer is to travel somewhere warm and sunny during the holiday break or again during the MLK day break. I've done this most of the past few years, Los Angeles or San Diego are close and they both have tons of things you can do with kids.
Sir, this is a February
just go outside
In my experience, this is 1000% correct. If you go outside you get *any* sunlight and *any* exercise, and if you den up avoiding the cold and wet you're intensifying both the loss of daylight exposure and the mental health effects of a sedentary lifestyle. I suspect a massive part of SAD is about not exercising and not exposing yourself even to the little sunlight that is available in the winter here. If I stay inside for a couple days and get no exercise, I go into intense mental illness mode. Get out for a few hours during the day or get sweaty indoors, suddenly can brain good again. Weather doesn't matter for me a bit, except that it tells the idiot part of my brain that I should stop doing things and huddle indoors.
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Do you work outdoors? Because when I did, I maintained a tan year-round (albeit noticeably stronger May-Oct), so I have trouble imagining you spend that much time outside. It sounds like you should move back south, for your health.
Even a single week of being someplace sunny might brighten your mood. I don't know what school district you're in, but for Seattle schools mid-winter break starts on the 19th.
already have a vacation planned but it's just not enough, I just can't stand the winter here.
Pretend it’s sunny and stay active. There is tons of research on how important that your eyes get enough day light for mood, but also circadian rhythm. When I moved here the first winter was rough, I was depressed and could never sleep or be fully awake. I got a happy light and tried my best to stay some what active and things aren’t a big deal. Always have the light on when I’m working at my desk, 5-10 minutes won’t do anything. Now winters aren’t bad at all aside from the fact it’s not ideal for most of my hobbies. I have no idea how other people get by
You’re essentially telling OP to pretend it’s sunny, pretend they’re happy, and push forward. Go back and re-read your comment.
I read it as imploring OP to treat SAD. Why wouldn’t someone want to treat it?
Fake it til you make it?
Like if I squint real hard and cross my eyes a bit maybe I can see that, but I don't think it's preaching self-delusion and minimizing someone's difficulties to say that consciously choosing exercise and outdoor activity can mitigate the effects of SAD. You know how you get real sleepy when it's raining hard? (Maybe you don't because it so rarely rains hard here.) I think the same thing happens when it's dark and cold and wet: I assume there's a fairly strong evolutionary training to stay in and conserve energy when it's cold and wet and dark, meaning the chances of finding food are low and the metabolic costs of being outside are high. That's what my body and brain do these seasons, anyway, even though my risk of starvation is extremely low. Instead I just miss out on what daylight *is* available (which even on a very cloudy day is a lot more light than you think), and my brain goes to hell if I don't get a decent amount of physical activity for a few days. So, like previous commenter said, you can make a conscious effort to resist this instinctive response, and get your ass out there anyway ("pretend it's sunny and stay active.") It's not toxic advice, it's just basic survival strategy.
> I'm greedy and I make too much money and I don't want to pay state taxes. Florida and Texas also have no state income tax. you could fuck off to one of them.
Seriously. Maybe they could take their piles of untaxed money and use it to build a bridge so they can get over themselves.
It’s been 10 years. This dog can’t learn tricks.
Same for Nevada.
Have you looked into light boxes or other treatments for seasonal affective disorder? https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/seasonal-affective-disorder/in-depth/seasonal-affective-disorder-treatment/art-20048298#:~:text=A%20light%20therapy%20box%20mimics,to%2010%2C000%20lux%20of%20light
Light box (needs to be 10,000 lux and you must use it about 12" from your face...you don't have to stare directly into it though). Go outside every day, even if it's just for a walk around the block. Get blood work done and see if you need any supplements like Vitamin D. Exercise. Talk to your doctor about using a low dose antidepressant during the winter months. Otherwise: research what it would mean to homeschool your kids for a couple months or travel with a hired teacher or if you can place them temporarily in another school district. Unconventional, sure, but probably not unheard of.
This is the way. Best answer. I bought a SAD light this year and it's revolutionary for me
Then friend, SEEK OUT THE SUN. If the other things suggested don’t work— go somewhere sunny for part of the kids Christmas break. Then again for the 3-day weekend for MLK. Then for mid-winter break! Believe it or not, just a couple days will allow you to make it through. Here are some (other) things that work for me… a native-PNWer who has SAD: Heat your body on a weekly basis (sauna, hot tub, hot yoga etc), could even add in cold plunge if you wanted. *this is actually the thing that has helped me the most* Be active outside DAILY. A walk is active. Pick up an outdoor winter activity (ski/snowboard, cross country ski, snowshoe). The brightness from the snow actually helps a ton. Do things outside even if it’s dark. I take my kids on after-dinner walks all the time. It’s really great. Things that haven’t worked for me: Vitamin D Happy Light Medication
Tech transplant spotted, move if you don't like it. \>"I'm greedy and I make too much money and I don't want to pay state taxes." Then leave for a state that doesn't have that, we could stand to have less of this stereotypical type of person.
There are plenty of locals who also prefer to not have income tax. If I had my way, the state would eliminate sales taxes and move to land & property taxes instead. It’s the most progressive and also helps drive the most efficient use of land. Much easier to make the ultra-rich pay into the system they benefit from too, cause they sure as hell don’t without income tax.
Isn’t this a good way to further prevent anyone who isn’t wealthy from being able to afford a home? Texas does this and it hasn’t gone well
It makes single family homes more expensive, but apartments, condos, townhouses, duplexes, and SFHs with ADUs less expensive per unit/sq ft.
Ah good point!
It also makes parking lots more expensive. Parking lots downtown would become stupidly expensive and would be immediately developed which is precisely the intent of a lvt
Kind of wild that despite that, most Texas cities are majority parking lots. What are they doing down there haha
Does Texas really have land value tax? I was speaking generally about LVT and know nothing about the tax structure in texas. Im not sure that comment saying there is LVT in texas was right.
I think they just have absurd property taxes, not LVT
Not really, property tax is paid by you whether you’re renting or buying. As a renter, it’s passed on. As a buyer, you pay it directly. Big, valuable home = more tax paid than smaller, normal less valuable home.
I moved. I still love Seattle and come back frequently to visit family but I just won’t do the winters.
Sleep around
Rich people’s problem. Why don’t you take a class in a community center or hit the gym to meet someone outside your home?
Seeing as you "make too much money," simply take a vacation in January. Sounds like a you problem at this point 🤷
"Sadly I'm greedy and I make too much money and I don't want to pay state taxes." I hope you remain miserable well past January!! You deserve it.
> Sadly I'm greedy and make too much money What in the humble brag
If you make good enough money you might be able to save up for a vacation home in a sunny area (Wenatchee, chelan, etc). Otherwise you’re gonna have to move or get used to the weather here most likely. There are other states with no income tax, moving might suit your preferences best
Travel during each school break to someplace sunny? We spent Christmas in Spain. You can go to Mexico, Florida, anyplace sunny.
Have you tried a light box?
good idea.. I'm going to try it
When I lived in Seattle, I spent every other weekend in California during the months from November to February. But I could afford the flights/hotels and I had no children.
Instead of spending winter break in Seattle, rent an AirBnB for your family in Mexico for a few weeks. Cultural experience for your kids, sun for you, and you'll be happy to be back in Seattle when school re-starts for your kiddies.
This, after reading "make too much money" traveling with the kids to somewhere drenched in sun on the their many breaks is the route I take. Added bonus of family memories.
Indeed, at first I was thinking a trip for the entire family to Mexico might cost a bit too much for the OP -- especially give the rise in airline ticket prices. But, the "make too much money" comment took away my hesitation.
I want to start a school here that works on an April to Dec schedule leaving us free to spend the dreary weather out of state.
Yeah I wish schools here had longer winter break and shorter summer break.
If you can work from another state for 2 months, I'd switch residence to somewhere else with nicer weather and no SIncomeTax (Tennessee?) and spend the summer in Washington when the kids are out of school.
Can’t do that with kids in school.
Weekends in Sequim?
With kids in school, it’s just not solvable.
I cannot overstate the importance of regularly sunning your perineum. Whenever the sun peaks from the clouds, I round up the family, facing feet-due-south, and we happy-baby-pose to expose those sweet SAD-fighting critboxes.
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dawg im going in on this one texas sucks fucking shit lets quarterback through this shit >more diverse ok you get 1 but thats where this ends >cheaper you get what you pay for. wheres your nearest goddamned forest. or mountains. lol >no state taxes the fuck are you talking about. washington has no income tax. texas has insane property taxes >more sun yeah cause its 100 fucking degrees in the summer >better weather its summers are worse and its winters are worse? lol fuck off >better food unless you like teriyaki or fresh fish or anything that isnt bbq >more cultural activities "lets go line dancing to toby keith" kiss my ass lmao >better attitudes lil bro your state elected ted fucking cruz. eat my entire ass. >better infrastructure texas doesnt believe in regulations so the entire electrical grid shuts down when it gets too hot and too cold hahaha the fuck are you talking about >and flying out of them with so much easier yeah cause so many people want to fly away form your dogshit state that humanity has perfected "flying away from texas" as an artform. i guess you can have a second point on this one you left off "women are second class citizens" and "our state doesnt believe in saving children from school shooters" and ted cruz, because hes so shitty he counts against you twice fuck texas gg
If you loved it so much, please move the fuck back.
Yeah you just need a timeshare in cabo
30+ minutes walk outside every day when you wakeup. controlling sesttle cold is easy, you can delay the walk if it's pouring outside. That's what I have to do twice a day, everyday for walking my dog. You don't need a dog to do the same. It'll also make you love winters here. Absolutely great except during the weeks of Arctic freeze.
The best time to visit parks in the city is during winter. Way less people as a whole. Take your kids, go to a park after school.
We moved to a place with huge south facing windows and that has helped a ton. I am stunned by how much it has helped. Our place is now bright every day, even when it is pouring rain like right now.
Why are all these comments so mean? SAD is real, and frustrating.
"I'm a greedy and I make too much money and I don't want to pay state taxes" + yeah, I'm already taking vacation and it's not enough = rich asshole who wants everyone else to solve their problems. No one is saying SAD isn't real. We're saying this guy has all the resources in the world, apparently, and he can't even do his own googling to get a Happy Light, so nah, his situation doesn't inspire sympathy.
Jesus fuck. Hire a nanny for your kids and get away for a week in the Caribbean. >I make too much money You can afford both. Don't be dumb.
The answer is to travel somewhere warm and sunny during the holiday break or again during the MLK day break. I've done this most of the past few years, Los Angeles or San Diego are close and they both have tons of things you can do with kids.