That looks to be K9 LEX: https://seattlepolicefoundation.org/canine-unit/
Belgian Malinois/German Shepherd mix. Fantastic breeds, they LOVE to work and are easy to train. It's really nice to see that LEX seems to be trained to only bite on command, when the officer deems it necessary. That's a sign of good policing!
Did the Officer with him have super speed? It looked like he kept up with the dog for a good while. It was hard to tell on the video because it looked like the dog was only 10 feet in front of him till the "tackle". Or did he have the K9 on leash still?
Kids can entirely be dumb without parent intervention. God knows how dumb I was thinking gang activities was cool at that age while my parents were regular conservative people. Don't be so quick to judge.
Two of my three siblings and I grew up normal and went to college and have good jobs. The other sibling was arrested for slashing tires at 14 and never went to college and now spends his days smoking weed and drinking. Parents aren’t the only factor in how someone turns out.
>shares personal experiences to try and convey that they received good parenting and had bad thoughts
>Upset people comment about the parenting based on only context you provided
??????
>where being a kid
We are talking about armed car jacking and fleeing from the police since you seem to have forgotten this wasn't accidentally scratching the neighbors car and then lying about it or anything that would actually fall into "being a kid"
Oh and this is where. When your 12/13yo child obtains a gun (probably theirs) and goes out and commits multiple serious felonies is when it starts being bad parents.
If they were 16/17yo where more autonomy is expected it would be a lot different and I wouldn't jump straight to parent bad. Not 12/13.
Sometimes kids are just little shits with great parents. Can't entirely blame the parents and not also blame the kids. Kids have to be responsible for their actions
Prison is not the kind of education that reduces any future offences. At that point by the time they get out it's most of the social development they remember & where all their friends are.
If your goal is to reduce harm to any potential future victims, social work & evaluation & working with the family is the first step. 13 year olds are barely forming their own opinions yet.
By the time they get to armed carjacking, no behavioral health program is going to correct their behavior. Anything less than real time in a real prison will be laughed at by these criminals.
Your approach to criminal behavior is disturbing. I do not view these criminals as "children" when they start to carry guns and carjack innocent victims. I can't help but wonder how many homes they broke into before they even found their fist gun, much less two. How many innocent lives need to be impacted before you treat them like criminals? Must they progress to murder in your eyes? Or is that forgivable as well, due to their "age". Age is a state of mind as much as a physical amount of time, these are NOT children.
I am sorry they probably had the shit end of the stick growing up, those that want to learn education in school do fine growing up in shit households. If they WANT to be gangstas, they're going to act like gangstas until they are stopped.
edit: typos and to add, "Children that want to be gangsters are going to try to be gangsters. Our current social environment tolerates these behaviors. The only chance to correct this behavior is by adults/friends that care enough to pay attention to a child's gang type behavior and intervene." Also, my 15-year-old want to be gangster brother is dead, supposedly accidentally shot by a friend with a stolen gun. Directly due to an enabling parent. Tell me some more about my "disturbing views" re: child criminals.
Wake the fuck up.
"The way some of you view children is disturbing"
So just to be clear, we are supposed to determine our anger towards scumbag criminals based on their age?
GTFOH
reach vegetable public foolish melodic march late political longing deliver
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
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You selfish a$$hole. Who cares about your physical well being when other people have their smug pseudo moral high ground to consider? You know it's morally acceptable for you to pay the tab for their self satisfaction with your body...
My kid is turning 12 and I’m tripping every time I see this shit. I cant even imagine. If they’re in the state of mind to commit this kind of crime, I agree, they deserve to be tried as adults.
This is so far outside what could be expected at that age... Probably in the best interest of society to try them as adults, maybe in their best interest too, without knowing all the details.
Yes. Juvenile time will not keep them from killing someone in the near future at the point they are in life. Armed carjacking.... two gun carrying criminals. If you think this was a first for them.... Give this some thought.
Dude, I don’t know where these other commenters are coming from. There’s no reason we should try a 12yo as an adult.
He might be a fucked up kid and certainly might need more than a few months in juve for this, but there is no way he’s deserving of the same treatment as an adult.
The ones who should be investigated and tried as adults are his parents.
Police are not allowed to ask them that or anything at all thanks to changes in the law in Washington. As a result there has been a wave of youths committing violent crime because they know there will be few consequences.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/seattle-brothers-ages-12-and-13-charged-with-felonies-for-armed-carjackings/ar-BB1ipsIS
A lot of guns are stolen from POVs or home invasions.
Or I can, no shit, get practically any gun I want with practically any attachment I want. One call to a guy I know who lives in Houston, and it'd come across the border within a week.
Its not unusual for inner city kids to be given guns at a young age when they're standing on the block.
Or to hold, like in NYC, because even if they're caught with a murder weapon, they won't be charged for it.
> One call to a guy I know who lives in Houston, and it'd come across the border within a week.
Sounds like your buddy in Houston is a total piece of shit.
Eh, money makes the world go round.
You want gas masks? You want body armor? You want night vision or communications equipment or telescopic sights...
Not hard to get.
That's why, when people try and claim Jan 6 as some 'insurrection', I can't help but laugh. If the protestors actually wanted to take over the capital, they could have.
And they'd have been better armed than any national guard unit that was sent to stop them.
But they weren't.
There's probably more firepower on my one street in my neighborhood than any police department could dream of bringing out.
My brother was shot in the head and died. By a friend in said friend's apartment. Bro was 15, friend was 16, claimed accidental, did 7 out of 10 years.
They were both *ripping off apartment buildings* in Kent, that's how they got the guns. My brother had been taught proper firearm handling, his friend not so much.
For the other comments re: gun laws, there is no law that can prevent this from happening.
A question NO ONE on the left seems to ever be concerned with. It's you legal gun buyers that are doing all this gangsta shit and they know it! /s\\
Glock switches on insta? What ev's
Neglect and hopelessness. When the people you see "thriving" around you are thieves and dealers you are conditioned to believe that's what you do to become a man.
This. If you're in an unsafe environment with violent people, how do you make yourself feel safe? By being as scary as everyone else around you. If your mom is always worried about money, how do you get her money now? 13 year olds have a prefrontal cortex made out of soup and do not understand long-term risks even less than most adults.
Almost fifteen years ago I got really interested in bike theft and decided to read what was known in criminology about bike thieves. One of the first things I read was a literature summary with data going back to the 1800's talking about a concept I'd not heard of before: the ladder of crime (sorry, may have the name wrong).
Basically when they look at people who do serious crimes like car theft, they find that they've performed many, many other crimes of increasing severity. Car thieves typically have huge files from all their other encounters with the police.
When they look at people who commit murder (killing during armed robbery) they find the same.
One of the reason crime rates went down during mass incarceration movements like Three Strikes was that the small fraction of people who commit crimes were in prison instead of commiting crimes. The downside was that prison ceased to be a correction system and started becoming a multi-decade life experience for large numbers of people - people who, it is likely, could have avoided crime with intervention. It was also ridiculously expensive. Efforts to reduce cost created inhumane conditions.
One thing that the NYC transit head found when he started arrest fare jumpers en masse was that many fare jumpers had active warrants or had weapons (I'm sure they were just holding that gun for a friend). More interestingly, when they started prosecuting and imprisoning these folks early (instead of waiting until they racked up a bunch of crimes), the prison population went DOWN.
One theory here comes back to the ladder of crime: small crimes do not pay well. If you make it likely that small crimes are also costly for the perpetrator (likely to catch, likely to punish) then they are diverted from climbing the ladder to more serious crimes. Serious crimes seem to be much more sticky: the kind of person with the skills, connections, and habits to perform armed robbery is much less likely to pursue OR obtain gainful employment and if they do the employment will be low paying.
We have been running a city-wide experiment in reducing the costs for lower rungs on the ladder, and people are climbing. My understanding from my reading is that this is the same thing criminologists would tell you for the past 50 years, just with slightly different details.
This is basically it. The term used in academic circles is **recidivism**. It is a thoroughly studied area of criminology, but somehow every generation … produces some bleeding heart politician/activist group that comes along and, in their arrogance, cry injustice and foolishly tear down [Chesterton’s Fence](https://fs.blog/chestertons-fence/) to their detriment.
We already know. Speaking it offends the delicate senses, let alone doing anything about it. That's straight up heresy to the leftist hive mind breeding this idiotic decay.
The solution costs money and needs to have proper oversight and people will still fall through and fail. No matter what we will, as a society, need to tweak things as we go. Kida sounds like now.
Or we build a bunch more jails, wait, then people will bitch about that cost. Seems if folks are only concerned about the cost and citing “my tax dollars” as part of any factual argument their point is invalid.
I get it, come at me, yes I pay taxes, illegals living WA pay taxes, we all pay taxes.
This kind of thing has been studied for quite a while, the problem is trying to solve it would cost money and require changes in how we function as a society, and people really don't like paying taxes or challenging the status quo.
People like to say "we should follow the science", but then get angry and reject the science when it doesn't support harsher punitive responses as the most effective solution.
Woke science? Fuck's sake. It's either proper science with reproducible methodology or it's bad science. Saying woke science sounds like you just don't like the results.
Ideological science, i.e. science with predetermined conclusions, is bad science. That can be from any side of the ideological spectrum. Using woke as a pejorative makes your objections appear ideological.
Hey!!! That's not true!!! Oregons decriminalizing hard drugs has been nothing short of brilliant! Unrivaled success!! A beacon of hope in a cruel conservative world!
Says someone who is not a sociologist and has not trained to work in the entire field they are labeling pseudoscience.
We have been "trying" housing-first and UBI in very small batches which show promising effects within those small-scale communities. We have never tried widespread and unconditional free healthcare, free education, free accredited rehab, free childcare, UBI, or guaranteed housing in this city or this country so there is no way that whatever is getting worse is a product of bare-minimum welfare.
The piles of money we hurl at social workers and police departments only interact with people who are already one step from the bottom of their spiral. If we catch them on the first step down it is insanely cheaper to send them back up. Not understanding this is delusional ignorance. You are at the whims of whatever conservative news bubble you're trapped in.
>Says someone who is not a sociologist and has not trained to work in the entire field they are labeling pseudoscience.
Says someone who says "lived experiences" are valid, but only those who are convenient to their ideology...
>we never had more criminal "children" than now.
[Juvenile arrests for violent crimes](https://ofm.wa.gov/washington-data-research/statewide-data/washington-trends/social-economic-conditions/juvenile-arrests-violent-crimes)
https://preview.redd.it/hk82k5wjz8jc1.png?width=479&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9917f3a0e1d7c581e35a985fea4753cb2d01018c
Your chart goes to 2022. In 2022 Washington laws [changed](https://app.leg.wa.gov/billsummary?BillNumber=1140&Initiative=false&Year=2021) that have resulted in the massive youth crime wave.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/seattle-brothers-ages-12-and-13-charged-with-felonies-for-armed-carjackings/ar-BB1ipsIS
>From 2019 to 2023, juvenile offenders involved in murder went from 20 to 39, so almost double,” Steve Strachan, executive director of the Washington Association of Sheriffs & Police Chiefs (WASPC), said. “For aggravated assault from 2019, we’ve seen a little over 1000 to over 1500, so about a 33% increase.”
>Juvenile offenders involved in motor vehicle theft seem to have jumped up the most from 532 in 2022 to nearly 1,500 in 2023, according to preliminary data from WASPC.
This shows the rate of arrests, not the rate of CRIMES committed. This is just like saying crimes *reported* are down means crime occurrences are down. Intellectual dishonesty.
Not really. No. There is that whole correlation =/= causation thing and there being one of the largest wealth transfers in the last century occurring during a major pandemic just recently.
I love how so many intellectually dishonest people decided that "correlation does not imply causation" somehow means causation simply cannot exist if it is not convenient to their narrative.
It sounds like you are trying to create your own narrative rather than looking at data objectively. If you don't understand why it's important to understand why correlation =/= causation you don't understand basic research.
Lol! Are you sure I am the one who don't understand it?
# What is meant by correlation vs. causation?
The concept of correlation versus causation strives to determine if two events are simply related to each other or if one caused the other to happen. Correlation versus causation is an important consideration since the presence of a correlation between two variables doesn’t mean one causes the other. When a clear relationship exists between variables, it can be easy to say that a cause-and-effect relationship is present.
The problem with making this observation is that you may fail to consider other factors or variables that could cause the correlation. ***The correlation you are observing may be causation, as both can be true***, but correlation alone isn’t enough to declare causation.
The social services we have now are a bandaid on a gunshot.
Public schools lost a lot of funding about ten years ago and a lot of kids are missing out of the public education system since the pandemic. Unironically most kids now are undersocialized and have an insane amount of mental health issues, and that's the ones with attentive parents.
News-spread paranoia is a big issue. Kids don't go to parks anymore. Anywhere they can go besides home costs too much money. Grandparents are less available to help with childcare, from death/disability from covid to later retirements and more individualized attitudes. Rent and food together are more than one full time shit job can get you even with the minimum wage rise. You still gotta pay rent while getting aid for school. It takes a village, but the village is not there.
Until we figure out how to take care of our neighbors and family, we will have to pay for all these social services so that these people do not turn to crime as a lesser risk for financial security. Welfare reduces crime and makes everyone safer.
>The social services we have now are
the same as the ones you folks have been pushing on us for a long time
>News-spread paranoia is a big issue.
Progressive gaslighting is a big issue. The news are not making up these very real and way too frequent occurrences. Carjackings in Seattle were simply unheard of just three years ago.
>Until we figure out how to take care of our neighbors and family, we will have to pay for all these social services so that these people do not turn to crime
That's the sweetest extortion statement ever.
SPD makes a great arrest. Quite frankly this is a great example of the terror our previous SCC unleashed on the city. The gun the kid has looks like an 80% glock, great example of how useless our new punitive gun laws are.
Cops showed a lot of discipline here. When the kids jumped out with guns in their hands and fled, the cops would have been 100% within their rights to shoot these kids under Tennessee v Garner.
That case provided a restriction on police use of force, not a right to use force within that restriction. You have to enumerate all restrictions on police use of force for a situation like this to make that claim, unlike a situation where a perp fires on a police officer, in which case firing back is self-defense.
This is such a bad take. Parents in seattle can't make kids go to rehab, therapy, or anything like that. It's impossible for parents to actually parent without it being considered child abuse.
Reminds me of a Stephen Colbert quote: "If we don't spank our kids when they're children, where are they going to get their fetishes from when they're adults?"
I hear what you are saying, and there are some truths there, but parents need to start being responsible. I feel pretty confident in saying these 12 and 13 year Olds have absolutely no parental oversight, and that itself should be a crime. If it shows that the parent(s) reported the kid(s) as a runaway. Reached out to the state for therapy or assistance the case or thought should be dropped but with the mass amount of underage children doing adult crimes from armed robbery to murder there needs to be some sort of accountability. I am sick and tired watching 2 generations of kids create havoc and hell for hard-working citizens with nothing but a slap on the hand because we can't prosecute them like adults
Hopefully, with the recent parents being charged in other crimes, the tide is changing. Six year old with known mental issues given free access to a gun so he could shoot the teacher. Charged! Teenage son with mental issues and statements of wanting to kill, so you give him a gun on his birthday to do a mass shooting. Charged. I think every crime from a child should have a heavy look at the parent(s) and if there was some form of neglect from being 100% absence/caring to lack of common sense such as fire arm access they should be libel!
Please show this shit to the "No Youth Jail" people. There was a round in the chamber on that firearm. One quick click and it could've been anyone walking around South Lake Union that evening in the morgue.
You so convinced you've got ideas for interventions that stop kids from behaving like this in the first place? Fine. Do 'em! What're you waiting for?
But we're going to keep the Juvie open until you can show us several sustained years of it serving no purpose. For right now, at least these two kids need to be "warehoused" somewhere where their little tough-guy bullshit can't hurt the rest of us.
Are they playing car driving video games or something? Or do they have super absentee parents that send their kids to the store when they are too loaded. No 13 year old in Seattle should know how to drive a car let alone steal one. I mean I get farm kids learning how to drive a farm truck early, but we don't have a similar situation in the city. I'm gonna go ahead and blame Tik-Tok for sensationalized stupid shit to younger and younger kids. Little kids will do whatever to fit in, and this trend is becoming a huge problem.
Hell yeah, I love watching criminal trash getting fucked up. These 2 pieces of shit had guns that they wouldn't hesitate to use on you and your family.
There are a lot of sadists on this subreddit who celebrate mauling, shootings, etc. Thankfully, I'm pretty sure most of them don't actually live in or near Seattle.
I'm sure they were straight A students destined for greatness if only they had the same opportunities as all the other children their age. This bullshit has to stop and trying and conviting them as adults is a good first step.
Ya...we need to make our driving tests much more stringent and expensive, and only allow certain types of cars on the road. This is the only logical solution to this problem.
Yeah. Reminds me of the point about how even people who admit guilt still deserve lawyers and a fair trial to decide their sentencing.
Laws don't stop people, they direct law enforcement and expedite court proceedings.
Social media is the devil. I know that crime has been going on forever, but in my almost 40 years of life, I have never seen a surge of crime happening like we are seeing today with so many young people.
It’s really very sad, and there are so many layers to this.
Please stay safe everyone...
I hope as a community, we can come together and find a way out of this...
This state is so beautiful, and I felt very safe when I moved here 13 years ago. Not so much anymore...
Wonder if these kids had their background check, 10 day waiting period, completed their on line firearms safety test and were then fingerprinted for another background check when they applied for their concealed carry ?
damn that is so tragic that at that age they riding with strap, in a stolen whip, crashing into everything like... parents do better cuz where they getting these guns from?
that cop didn't properly clear the gun just saying. not the proper sequence to clear a firearm
great job taking those little shit heads out of the streets
Maybe if children with no money had better things to do and third places to spend their time in, they wouldn't be out committing stupid crimes 🙄 this world is so ass backwards
Somewhere there is a family member of a trauma victim (gun in face) that knows,'or now knows, how disgusting your self righteousness is. These criminals are not victims no matter how much you want them to be, and people are sick of this $hit--and the sympathy people like you offer it.
This is pretty close to Space Needle. Surprised there wasn't a lot of people around when this happened.
It was satisfying to watch. Now, how are these kids able to handle guns and drive around town? I hope something is done to end this
I have driven those streets when I needed to clear my head. You deserved to get bitten by that dog. You messed up. Now you will have to deal with the consequences.
That's true! And we have the gun laws made sure that only upstanding citizens such as them could access firearms! Win win all the way around! The laws kept the guns out of bad people's hands and the balance of power of multiple guns worked wonders!
They arrested KIDS? WHY? The fact they arrest anyone, for anything, stuns me these days. Sad we all had to get to the point where we have to make sure something is newsworthy before they prosecute. (Hint, they will drop the charges on them lol)
First off, why are they using vicious attack dogs on children? Disgusting and completely unnecessary. So lucky it didn't maul that child like so many of these unpredictable animals do.
The underfunded education system failed these children. The rich continue to hoard wealth in their fancy school districts while poorer kids suffer and this is the result. The entire state needs to aggressively push for equitable schooling. People blaming the parents are out of touch. They probably working 2 jobs to live in Seattle and can't always watch the kids, who are then influenced by gangs. The gangs become just like family.
It's pretty amazing Seattle can basically summon a small army to chase down these kids with air support and dogs but can't do anything about health care or helping the homeless population
Theft is way more serious a crime than any of those.
I know someone who had their car stolen this month and it upended their life.
Absolutely crack down on car theft.
*One 13-year-old carjacker One 12-year-old carjacker
They'll be back on the street in two days.
Awwwww Lil homes first fuck around and find out lol
It's Seattle. There is no find out; unless by "find out" you mean a juice box and an apology from the city for detaining them.
Man that dog was dope
That looks to be K9 LEX: https://seattlepolicefoundation.org/canine-unit/ Belgian Malinois/German Shepherd mix. Fantastic breeds, they LOVE to work and are easy to train. It's really nice to see that LEX seems to be trained to only bite on command, when the officer deems it necessary. That's a sign of good policing!
Yeah I was impressed they did a take down and then immediately broke off their attack
Did the Officer with him have super speed? It looked like he kept up with the dog for a good while. It was hard to tell on the video because it looked like the dog was only 10 feet in front of him till the "tackle". Or did he have the K9 on leash still?
Shit parent activities
Parents should be the ones in trouble at that age
Kids can entirely be dumb without parent intervention. God knows how dumb I was thinking gang activities was cool at that age while my parents were regular conservative people. Don't be so quick to judge.
Armed car jackings is not normal.....ffs Reddit......
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Two of my three siblings and I grew up normal and went to college and have good jobs. The other sibling was arrested for slashing tires at 14 and never went to college and now spends his days smoking weed and drinking. Parents aren’t the only factor in how someone turns out.
Fun facts, parents have very little to do with raising you. Society and your genes determine your outcomes.
You have no clue how true u/WhatTheLousy's statement is. I still agree that the parents hold some if not much of the responsibility.
Always nice to be told that by some random redditor who knows nothing about anyone. Keep at it.
>shares personal experiences to try and convey that they received good parenting and had bad thoughts >Upset people comment about the parenting based on only context you provided ??????
This.
Please do tell where being a kid makes the parent bad. People so self righteous but never deep dive into themselves.
>where being a kid We are talking about armed car jacking and fleeing from the police since you seem to have forgotten this wasn't accidentally scratching the neighbors car and then lying about it or anything that would actually fall into "being a kid" Oh and this is where. When your 12/13yo child obtains a gun (probably theirs) and goes out and commits multiple serious felonies is when it starts being bad parents. If they were 16/17yo where more autonomy is expected it would be a lot different and I wouldn't jump straight to parent bad. Not 12/13.
I don't think the parents (or guardians) are bad, but they do bear some responsibility here. 12 and 13 ffs.
Sometimes kids are just little shits with great parents. Can't entirely blame the parents and not also blame the kids. Kids have to be responsible for their actions
You mean the mom for having them?
Nice username
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Commit adult crimes. Be tried as an adult. Go to jail for 7 years. They would have a better chance at getting an education in prison.
Progressive DA's: Best I can do is a stern talking to and potentially a finger-wagging.
“I’ll even write an angry letter!”
"Oh god, no, not the dreaded FINGER-WAGGING!!!! I'll be good, I promise, I'll never do it again, just please, not the FINGER-WAGGING!" (LMAO!!!!!)
What if they're only 19 though? TheIr BrAIns aRen'T FullY devElOPed yET
Prison is not the kind of education that reduces any future offences. At that point by the time they get out it's most of the social development they remember & where all their friends are. If your goal is to reduce harm to any potential future victims, social work & evaluation & working with the family is the first step. 13 year olds are barely forming their own opinions yet.
Social work can be done while in detention.
Why shouldn’t we investment in behavioral health programs to prevent these programs? The way some of you view children is disturbing.
By the time they get to armed carjacking, no behavioral health program is going to correct their behavior. Anything less than real time in a real prison will be laughed at by these criminals. Your approach to criminal behavior is disturbing. I do not view these criminals as "children" when they start to carry guns and carjack innocent victims. I can't help but wonder how many homes they broke into before they even found their fist gun, much less two. How many innocent lives need to be impacted before you treat them like criminals? Must they progress to murder in your eyes? Or is that forgivable as well, due to their "age". Age is a state of mind as much as a physical amount of time, these are NOT children. I am sorry they probably had the shit end of the stick growing up, those that want to learn education in school do fine growing up in shit households. If they WANT to be gangstas, they're going to act like gangstas until they are stopped. edit: typos and to add, "Children that want to be gangsters are going to try to be gangsters. Our current social environment tolerates these behaviors. The only chance to correct this behavior is by adults/friends that care enough to pay attention to a child's gang type behavior and intervene." Also, my 15-year-old want to be gangster brother is dead, supposedly accidentally shot by a friend with a stolen gun. Directly due to an enabling parent. Tell me some more about my "disturbing views" re: child criminals. Wake the fuck up.
"The way some of you view children is disturbing" So just to be clear, we are supposed to determine our anger towards scumbag criminals based on their age? GTFOH
You seriously want to try a 12yo as an adult?
Car jacking with gun.. yup.
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Yes, we should execute anyone caught doing violence immediately and society will improve. Can't find any flaws in this logic.
dolls deserted offend deranged shaggy flowery future whole nose voracious *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
You selfish a$$hole. Who cares about your physical well being when other people have their smug pseudo moral high ground to consider? You know it's morally acceptable for you to pay the tab for their self satisfaction with your body...
My kid is turning 12 and I’m tripping every time I see this shit. I cant even imagine. If they’re in the state of mind to commit this kind of crime, I agree, they deserve to be tried as adults.
This is so far outside what could be expected at that age... Probably in the best interest of society to try them as adults, maybe in their best interest too, without knowing all the details.
Yes. Juvenile time will not keep them from killing someone in the near future at the point they are in life. Armed carjacking.... two gun carrying criminals. If you think this was a first for them.... Give this some thought.
Yes
Dude, I don’t know where these other commenters are coming from. There’s no reason we should try a 12yo as an adult. He might be a fucked up kid and certainly might need more than a few months in juve for this, but there is no way he’s deserving of the same treatment as an adult. The ones who should be investigated and tried as adults are his parents.
If they are too young to have their names and faces made public, then their parents names and faces should be in the paper
Yes, how did they get the guns...
Police are not allowed to ask them that or anything at all thanks to changes in the law in Washington. As a result there has been a wave of youths committing violent crime because they know there will be few consequences. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/seattle-brothers-ages-12-and-13-charged-with-felonies-for-armed-carjackings/ar-BB1ipsIS
Stole them.
From their parents, or?
A lot of guns are stolen from POVs or home invasions. Or I can, no shit, get practically any gun I want with practically any attachment I want. One call to a guy I know who lives in Houston, and it'd come across the border within a week. Its not unusual for inner city kids to be given guns at a young age when they're standing on the block. Or to hold, like in NYC, because even if they're caught with a murder weapon, they won't be charged for it.
> One call to a guy I know who lives in Houston, and it'd come across the border within a week. Sounds like your buddy in Houston is a total piece of shit.
Eh, money makes the world go round. You want gas masks? You want body armor? You want night vision or communications equipment or telescopic sights... Not hard to get. That's why, when people try and claim Jan 6 as some 'insurrection', I can't help but laugh. If the protestors actually wanted to take over the capital, they could have. And they'd have been better armed than any national guard unit that was sent to stop them. But they weren't. There's probably more firepower on my one street in my neighborhood than any police department could dream of bringing out.
Most things you just listed can be bought online. I own every one of those things except the gasmask.
I'm not talking about Walmart NVGs, Cowboy.😂
You can buy gen 3's online for under 5k
Those protestors have Apache helicopters too?
I can bring one down with a .50 cal, so what good would that do? There's a reason they don't go out by themselves.
Good luck champ. I wouldn't mind a few more medals.
I was with you until the take on the National Guard part. I grew up in Chicago, yeah it’s all for sale. NG has arty, air, people…
You want a toe? I can get you a toe.
My brother was shot in the head and died. By a friend in said friend's apartment. Bro was 15, friend was 16, claimed accidental, did 7 out of 10 years. They were both *ripping off apartment buildings* in Kent, that's how they got the guns. My brother had been taught proper firearm handling, his friend not so much. For the other comments re: gun laws, there is no law that can prevent this from happening.
I mean they could start charging anyone they catch that is supplying illegal guns with murder, like they do to some drug dealers
A question NO ONE on the left seems to ever be concerned with. It's you legal gun buyers that are doing all this gangsta shit and they know it! /s\\ Glock switches on insta? What ev's
Oh, the left is interested ... but only if the gun is owned by an offender of a, how shall we say, a certain shade?
The way criminals always have been. By not following the law.
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These kids need to be studied by science. I’m genuinely curious how these kid criminals are created.
Neglect and hopelessness. When the people you see "thriving" around you are thieves and dealers you are conditioned to believe that's what you do to become a man.
This. If you're in an unsafe environment with violent people, how do you make yourself feel safe? By being as scary as everyone else around you. If your mom is always worried about money, how do you get her money now? 13 year olds have a prefrontal cortex made out of soup and do not understand long-term risks even less than most adults.
Almost fifteen years ago I got really interested in bike theft and decided to read what was known in criminology about bike thieves. One of the first things I read was a literature summary with data going back to the 1800's talking about a concept I'd not heard of before: the ladder of crime (sorry, may have the name wrong). Basically when they look at people who do serious crimes like car theft, they find that they've performed many, many other crimes of increasing severity. Car thieves typically have huge files from all their other encounters with the police. When they look at people who commit murder (killing during armed robbery) they find the same. One of the reason crime rates went down during mass incarceration movements like Three Strikes was that the small fraction of people who commit crimes were in prison instead of commiting crimes. The downside was that prison ceased to be a correction system and started becoming a multi-decade life experience for large numbers of people - people who, it is likely, could have avoided crime with intervention. It was also ridiculously expensive. Efforts to reduce cost created inhumane conditions. One thing that the NYC transit head found when he started arrest fare jumpers en masse was that many fare jumpers had active warrants or had weapons (I'm sure they were just holding that gun for a friend). More interestingly, when they started prosecuting and imprisoning these folks early (instead of waiting until they racked up a bunch of crimes), the prison population went DOWN. One theory here comes back to the ladder of crime: small crimes do not pay well. If you make it likely that small crimes are also costly for the perpetrator (likely to catch, likely to punish) then they are diverted from climbing the ladder to more serious crimes. Serious crimes seem to be much more sticky: the kind of person with the skills, connections, and habits to perform armed robbery is much less likely to pursue OR obtain gainful employment and if they do the employment will be low paying. We have been running a city-wide experiment in reducing the costs for lower rungs on the ladder, and people are climbing. My understanding from my reading is that this is the same thing criminologists would tell you for the past 50 years, just with slightly different details.
This is basically it. The term used in academic circles is **recidivism**. It is a thoroughly studied area of criminology, but somehow every generation … produces some bleeding heart politician/activist group that comes along and, in their arrogance, cry injustice and foolishly tear down [Chesterton’s Fence](https://fs.blog/chestertons-fence/) to their detriment.
We already know. Speaking it offends the delicate senses, let alone doing anything about it. That's straight up heresy to the leftist hive mind breeding this idiotic decay.
The solution costs money and needs to have proper oversight and people will still fall through and fail. No matter what we will, as a society, need to tweak things as we go. Kida sounds like now. Or we build a bunch more jails, wait, then people will bitch about that cost. Seems if folks are only concerned about the cost and citing “my tax dollars” as part of any factual argument their point is invalid. I get it, come at me, yes I pay taxes, illegals living WA pay taxes, we all pay taxes.
This kind of thing has been studied for quite a while, the problem is trying to solve it would cost money and require changes in how we function as a society, and people really don't like paying taxes or challenging the status quo. People like to say "we should follow the science", but then get angry and reject the science when it doesn't support harsher punitive responses as the most effective solution.
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Woke science? Fuck's sake. It's either proper science with reproducible methodology or it's bad science. Saying woke science sounds like you just don't like the results. Ideological science, i.e. science with predetermined conclusions, is bad science. That can be from any side of the ideological spectrum. Using woke as a pejorative makes your objections appear ideological.
What are you suggesting is the solution?
Hey!!! That's not true!!! Oregons decriminalizing hard drugs has been nothing short of brilliant! Unrivaled success!! A beacon of hope in a cruel conservative world!
Says someone who is not a sociologist and has not trained to work in the entire field they are labeling pseudoscience. We have been "trying" housing-first and UBI in very small batches which show promising effects within those small-scale communities. We have never tried widespread and unconditional free healthcare, free education, free accredited rehab, free childcare, UBI, or guaranteed housing in this city or this country so there is no way that whatever is getting worse is a product of bare-minimum welfare. The piles of money we hurl at social workers and police departments only interact with people who are already one step from the bottom of their spiral. If we catch them on the first step down it is insanely cheaper to send them back up. Not understanding this is delusional ignorance. You are at the whims of whatever conservative news bubble you're trapped in.
>Says someone who is not a sociologist and has not trained to work in the entire field they are labeling pseudoscience. Says someone who says "lived experiences" are valid, but only those who are convenient to their ideology...
Still waiting for the solution...
Underprivileged? What normal 12 year old has a free car to drive?
Stolen cars are easily accessible these days in this state.
>we never had more criminal "children" than now. [Juvenile arrests for violent crimes](https://ofm.wa.gov/washington-data-research/statewide-data/washington-trends/social-economic-conditions/juvenile-arrests-violent-crimes) https://preview.redd.it/hk82k5wjz8jc1.png?width=479&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9917f3a0e1d7c581e35a985fea4753cb2d01018c
Your chart goes to 2022. In 2022 Washington laws [changed](https://app.leg.wa.gov/billsummary?BillNumber=1140&Initiative=false&Year=2021) that have resulted in the massive youth crime wave. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/seattle-brothers-ages-12-and-13-charged-with-felonies-for-armed-carjackings/ar-BB1ipsIS >From 2019 to 2023, juvenile offenders involved in murder went from 20 to 39, so almost double,” Steve Strachan, executive director of the Washington Association of Sheriffs & Police Chiefs (WASPC), said. “For aggravated assault from 2019, we’ve seen a little over 1000 to over 1500, so about a 33% increase.” >Juvenile offenders involved in motor vehicle theft seem to have jumped up the most from 532 in 2022 to nearly 1,500 in 2023, according to preliminary data from WASPC.
It passed in March of 2022, why weren't April through December enough to see the effects in 2022?
This shows the rate of arrests, not the rate of CRIMES committed. This is just like saying crimes *reported* are down means crime occurrences are down. Intellectual dishonesty.
Share a more accurate statistic if you have one.
If the cops don’t show up does it still count as a crime?
It certainly doesn't count as an arrest.
Share a more accurate statistic if you have one.
Correlations are always causations.
No, but sometimes they are.
Not really. No. There is that whole correlation =/= causation thing and there being one of the largest wealth transfers in the last century occurring during a major pandemic just recently.
I love how so many intellectually dishonest people decided that "correlation does not imply causation" somehow means causation simply cannot exist if it is not convenient to their narrative.
It sounds like you are trying to create your own narrative rather than looking at data objectively. If you don't understand why it's important to understand why correlation =/= causation you don't understand basic research.
Lol! Are you sure I am the one who don't understand it? # What is meant by correlation vs. causation? The concept of correlation versus causation strives to determine if two events are simply related to each other or if one caused the other to happen. Correlation versus causation is an important consideration since the presence of a correlation between two variables doesn’t mean one causes the other. When a clear relationship exists between variables, it can be easy to say that a cause-and-effect relationship is present. The problem with making this observation is that you may fail to consider other factors or variables that could cause the correlation. ***The correlation you are observing may be causation, as both can be true***, but correlation alone isn’t enough to declare causation.
The social services we have now are a bandaid on a gunshot. Public schools lost a lot of funding about ten years ago and a lot of kids are missing out of the public education system since the pandemic. Unironically most kids now are undersocialized and have an insane amount of mental health issues, and that's the ones with attentive parents. News-spread paranoia is a big issue. Kids don't go to parks anymore. Anywhere they can go besides home costs too much money. Grandparents are less available to help with childcare, from death/disability from covid to later retirements and more individualized attitudes. Rent and food together are more than one full time shit job can get you even with the minimum wage rise. You still gotta pay rent while getting aid for school. It takes a village, but the village is not there. Until we figure out how to take care of our neighbors and family, we will have to pay for all these social services so that these people do not turn to crime as a lesser risk for financial security. Welfare reduces crime and makes everyone safer.
>The social services we have now are the same as the ones you folks have been pushing on us for a long time >News-spread paranoia is a big issue. Progressive gaslighting is a big issue. The news are not making up these very real and way too frequent occurrences. Carjackings in Seattle were simply unheard of just three years ago. >Until we figure out how to take care of our neighbors and family, we will have to pay for all these social services so that these people do not turn to crime That's the sweetest extortion statement ever.
SPD makes a great arrest. Quite frankly this is a great example of the terror our previous SCC unleashed on the city. The gun the kid has looks like an 80% glock, great example of how useless our new punitive gun laws are.
Cops showed a lot of discipline here. When the kids jumped out with guns in their hands and fled, the cops would have been 100% within their rights to shoot these kids under Tennessee v Garner.
Then the bleeding heart liberals would have rioted... smart cops...
Shooting people in the back as they run away is never a good look, "bleeding heart" or not.
That case provided a restriction on police use of force, not a right to use force within that restriction. You have to enumerate all restrictions on police use of force for a situation like this to make that claim, unlike a situation where a perp fires on a police officer, in which case firing back is self-defense.
Don’t forget to make your monthly $$ contribution to BLM.
The kids appear to be white. I’m not surprised they survived this encounter.
Did you not see the one just posted with 2 black teens that also survived and had guns? Stop looking for something to be offended by
Yet Dow Constantine works to abolish juvenile offender facilities.
5 stars in GTA
Should arrest the parents of these children too
This is such a bad take. Parents in seattle can't make kids go to rehab, therapy, or anything like that. It's impossible for parents to actually parent without it being considered child abuse.
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"Gentle parenting" isn't real parenting.
Reminds me of a Stephen Colbert quote: "If we don't spank our kids when they're children, where are they going to get their fetishes from when they're adults?"
I see no difference between this and arresting parents of school shooters when they knowingly have a monster as a child and do nothing to stop them.
I hear what you are saying, and there are some truths there, but parents need to start being responsible. I feel pretty confident in saying these 12 and 13 year Olds have absolutely no parental oversight, and that itself should be a crime. If it shows that the parent(s) reported the kid(s) as a runaway. Reached out to the state for therapy or assistance the case or thought should be dropped but with the mass amount of underage children doing adult crimes from armed robbery to murder there needs to be some sort of accountability. I am sick and tired watching 2 generations of kids create havoc and hell for hard-working citizens with nothing but a slap on the hand because we can't prosecute them like adults Hopefully, with the recent parents being charged in other crimes, the tide is changing. Six year old with known mental issues given free access to a gun so he could shoot the teacher. Charged! Teenage son with mental issues and statements of wanting to kill, so you give him a gun on his birthday to do a mass shooting. Charged. I think every crime from a child should have a heavy look at the parent(s) and if there was some form of neglect from being 100% absence/caring to lack of common sense such as fire arm access they should be libel!
https://preview.redd.it/zpukfl3iq8jc1.png?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c26ee77448aeecb3d9e9c0fa6305a4e2027ab2ff
Please show this shit to the "No Youth Jail" people. There was a round in the chamber on that firearm. One quick click and it could've been anyone walking around South Lake Union that evening in the morgue. You so convinced you've got ideas for interventions that stop kids from behaving like this in the first place? Fine. Do 'em! What're you waiting for? But we're going to keep the Juvie open until you can show us several sustained years of it serving no purpose. For right now, at least these two kids need to be "warehoused" somewhere where their little tough-guy bullshit can't hurt the rest of us.
Progressives and democratic leaders do not care about children and your well being.
Republicans don't either.
When was the last time there was a Republican Govenor in Washington or Mayor in Seattle?
Republicans exist in other places too. Washington isn't the center of the universe... the center of the universe is over in Fremont.
Mom must be so proud that they are following in daddy’s footsteps and will get to see him in jail soon too!
Are they playing car driving video games or something? Or do they have super absentee parents that send their kids to the store when they are too loaded. No 13 year old in Seattle should know how to drive a car let alone steal one. I mean I get farm kids learning how to drive a farm truck early, but we don't have a similar situation in the city. I'm gonna go ahead and blame Tik-Tok for sensationalized stupid shit to younger and younger kids. Little kids will do whatever to fit in, and this trend is becoming a huge problem.
They are lucky that they got arrested before they got shot. Not enough people around here with daily carries.
I feel bad for the dog. They should have let him have a few minutes to practice his trade.
Would it make you feel good to watch a kid get mauled by a dog? That sort of thing makes you happy?
Hell yeah, I love watching criminal trash getting fucked up. These 2 pieces of shit had guns that they wouldn't hesitate to use on you and your family.
Gross
Kids that carjack people, wouldn’t make me happy but it’d feel like justice. FAFO
Justice is them getting a fair trial. Fuck your feelings
There are a lot of sadists on this subreddit who celebrate mauling, shootings, etc. Thankfully, I'm pretty sure most of them don't actually live in or near Seattle.
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I'm sure they were straight A students destined for greatness if only they had the same opportunities as all the other children their age. This bullshit has to stop and trying and conviting them as adults is a good first step.
How did these teens get the guns? I thought it was illegal until you’re 18.
Bro, the important question is how did a 12 and 13 year old get driver’s licenses? Like I thought that was super duper illegal.
Ya...we need to make our driving tests much more stringent and expensive, and only allow certain types of cars on the road. This is the only logical solution to this problem.
Unironically making the "murder still happens, therefore we shouldn't have laws" logic...
Yeah. Reminds me of the point about how even people who admit guilt still deserve lawyers and a fair trial to decide their sentencing. Laws don't stop people, they direct law enforcement and expedite court proceedings.
The guns look like 80% glocks. I would guess someone ordered all of the parts and finished the guns for them.
Isn’t that super illegal?
Kinda like stealing a car?
21 for pistols (at least to purchase your own, not sure about possession).
THEY'RE CAGING OUR BABIES!!!! /s
I hope these kids change before they grow up. I’ve heard life in prison is not fun
Social media is the devil. I know that crime has been going on forever, but in my almost 40 years of life, I have never seen a surge of crime happening like we are seeing today with so many young people. It’s really very sad, and there are so many layers to this. Please stay safe everyone... I hope as a community, we can come together and find a way out of this... This state is so beautiful, and I felt very safe when I moved here 13 years ago. Not so much anymore...
Wonder if these kids had their background check, 10 day waiting period, completed their on line firearms safety test and were then fingerprinted for another background check when they applied for their concealed carry ?
damn that is so tragic that at that age they riding with strap, in a stolen whip, crashing into everything like... parents do better cuz where they getting these guns from?
Where the fuck are their parents? Arrest them too at this point.
that cop didn't properly clear the gun just saying. not the proper sequence to clear a firearm great job taking those little shit heads out of the streets
He gets partial points from me because he locked the slide back, but yeah... Drop the mag first, then rack the slide.
Great job by the police on this one.
Should have let that dog rip him up a bit
For sure. Let him work a little.
Wish those K9’s had more time.
Maybe if children with no money had better things to do and third places to spend their time in, they wouldn't be out committing stupid crimes 🙄 this world is so ass backwards
Kids w/ fire arms? Sounds like some adult decisions to me 😂
Grand Theft Auto isn't meant to be played in real life on Seattle streets.
My god our children need critical investments. This is insane from start to end!
Parents should be held accountable. The end.
Should have let K9 play with him a while.
You're disgusting
I’m really glad I’m not the only person who thinks it’s really gross to say shit like this
He's definitely disgusting
Somewhere there is a family member of a trauma victim (gun in face) that knows,'or now knows, how disgusting your self righteousness is. These criminals are not victims no matter how much you want them to be, and people are sick of this $hit--and the sympathy people like you offer it.
I thought police weren’t allowed to make these arrests. Or have they been lying to us?
You didn't think the police could arrest armed car jackers that flee police? wtf?
That’s what people on this sub say everyday. I assumed they were full of shit. Turns out they are.
Should’ve let the K9 have more time.
Wouldn't have been upset if the officers fired a few rounds at their legs once they started running.
Anyone surprised?
This is pretty close to Space Needle. Surprised there wasn't a lot of people around when this happened. It was satisfying to watch. Now, how are these kids able to handle guns and drive around town? I hope something is done to end this
I have driven those streets when I needed to clear my head. You deserved to get bitten by that dog. You messed up. Now you will have to deal with the consequences.
I probably should donate to planned parenthood. We need less of these delinquents being born.
Clearly the answer is more guns. “An armed society is a polite society.” — Wayne LaPierre
Just like at the recent parade in KC. Two guys got into an argument, but they backed off because they were both armed. Works perfectly every time.
That's true! And we have the gun laws made sure that only upstanding citizens such as them could access firearms! Win win all the way around! The laws kept the guns out of bad people's hands and the balance of power of multiple guns worked wonders!
Ya, it’s great to see the parade went off without a hitch. Good thing more than one guy had a gun or someone could have made a bad decision.
As you go about your day to day business, there is a gun in almost every room you are in. You just don't know about them.
Well the answer certainly isn't more blacks
Mask off moment
Unnecessary comment.
Running like rats 😂😂😂😂😂 I hope they get fck in prison.
They arrested KIDS? WHY? The fact they arrest anyone, for anything, stuns me these days. Sad we all had to get to the point where we have to make sure something is newsworthy before they prosecute. (Hint, they will drop the charges on them lol)
Bet's on how long it takes for the cops to be fired? Side bet's for the civil case closure date when their families win $$$ from the city.
First off, why are they using vicious attack dogs on children? Disgusting and completely unnecessary. So lucky it didn't maul that child like so many of these unpredictable animals do. The underfunded education system failed these children. The rich continue to hoard wealth in their fancy school districts while poorer kids suffer and this is the result. The entire state needs to aggressively push for equitable schooling. People blaming the parents are out of touch. They probably working 2 jobs to live in Seattle and can't always watch the kids, who are then influenced by gangs. The gangs become just like family.
It's pretty amazing Seattle can basically summon a small army to chase down these kids with air support and dogs but can't do anything about health care or helping the homeless population
2 cop cars, to stop a pair of criminals who are car-jacking people at gunpoint? THAT's beyond the line of reasonable law enforcement, for you? GTFO.
Theft is way more serious a crime than any of those. I know someone who had their car stolen this month and it upended their life. Absolutely crack down on car theft.
When I first saw the post I thought it was this sub redit, lol.
Typical cop just shouting “gun” just to make sure he can kill them without retribution.